Long Distance Pumping: Setup, Why It Works, Poppys Maintenance, Troubleshooting
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- Опубліковано 13 сер 2016
- Learn why classic LDP setups should go the way of the Dodo Bird, why dedicated trucks such as Poppys by Don't Trip are better and how to maintain them. Have more fun, go more places with a better setup.
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I felt bad for still longboarding at 25 because I didnt want to waste money but this video made me feel way better xD
Excellent!
thanks for drawing the lines for the trucks that is really helpfull sir
You are very welcome. Glad that it was helpful.
UFFF. Amazing. Thanks for this MASTERCLASS GENIUOS!!!!
Thanks! Appreciated. Glad to be of service.
thank you I got the ideas after watching few times
Super! Many happy miles to you.
awesome video. very helpful
Thanks! And thanks also for the subscription.
I didn't know what LDP was before this video (i just got my first board last month). You just blew my mind. I already abhor pushing up hill and to see you pump up the hill so effortlessly (i'm sure you're very skilled because you make it look easy) is a game changer. Going to read everything i can and watch all your videos. Subscribed!
Thanks for the subscription! Hang in there. Equipment setup makes a big difference. If you want it (the skill), you'll find it.
Thank you so much for your video. It has helped me understand the geometry behind LDP much better. I wish I could have seen your rear truck set up though. To see how stiff the play is as compared to the front. I think I should feel some energy flow out of the board through the rear wheels, but a lot of the time for me everything is front truck dominate. I don't get hop, but I also feel like I don't get full efficiency, which could have to do with the fact that I am using a very stiff board that was not meant for this application. Rather than buying a full perfect setup, I just bought a pair of Poppies and modified a discarded longboard I had sitting around the house.
Glad to help! Sad but true, that a more flexible board will help as well as adequate wheel base. It should feel springy without feeling like you will bottom out or like you are riding a rubber band. The board I have is inexpensive, no need to spring for a high priced deck. To me, the rear set up is all about the bushings, which is highly individualized. The wedging is pretty much static in front and back. No need to play with different angles. If you have no hop, than perhaps it's technique adjustment. To me, the sensation is slight weight shift to rear at the end of the turn. Sort of like a little scoot forward of the board as if it will shoot out from under you, VERY tiny, followed by an up-unweight. That's where the flex helps. If you downhill ski and carve your turns instead of windshield wiping, you'll know the sensation. Flex in the skis performs the same function (depending on your style of course). But, this is only one way to approach it. You will develop many different techniques to handle the demands of changing terrain. Once you are happy with your total set up, it's all about technique. Hang in there.
Outstanding video. To simplify my life I’m going with your recommended setup. About the deck. I have an Original 43” pintail I don’t really use. Any thoughts on using it to create my pumper? Thanks in advance
The Original should work just fine. It is similar to the flex of Karen's deck in the video example. It's stiffer than mine (I prefer some bounce, Karen doesn't). The only personal variables will be the bushings and the wheels. Since Gumballs are sometimes hard to find, Big Zigs are pretty close. My Gumballs seem to just keep rolling forever. Let me know of your progress and good luck.
I was watching this video several times. My attempt to go cheaper on trucks is not going well. Within a week I pushed out the spherical bearing from Randal truck. Glue doesn't held it in under my weight. :)
Yup. Unfortunately, you can't go cheap, at least, not for long. That's how I convinced myself to use the Poppys and why I put this video together. I know they will work to 180 lbs. I have seen 200 lb. guys use them. I'm reasonably aggressive on those trucks and they have held up. The biggest wear problems are the urethane parts (bushings and pivot tube). I hope you find your personal solution. Hang in there and thanks for watching.
Awesome video! Thank you for your knowledge. I saw your answer to the question on choosing a wider front truck the back truck. Makes sense that it would reduce any slipping or skipping of the wheels in the back. I have a question, I see some guys go wider in the back truck. Would you know some advantages for that set up? I read that it is better for pumping up steep hills, and slalom guys sometimes do this? Any thoughts on the wider back truck would be awesome.
Honestly, I can't see an advantage to wide in the back. If there is no change up front, that's the same as an off the shelf set up. Given how one must drive the front to gain ground, wide in the back seems counter-productive. If it's narrow up front and wide in the back, there is a stability problem. Downhills would not have the flow of ski/snowboard short turns for speed control because it would be more difficult to weight/unweight and drive into the turn. For what I like to do and demand of my equipment. The current set up is the way to go IMHO. Further thoughts. My set up is a do it all collection of details aimed at efficient distance on rolling terrain with steeper grades now and then. Slalom is out my area of expertise. However, in theory, if on want a specialized machine just to climb hills, smaller up front MIGHT work. Sort of like down shifting. The engine (you) would be making a lot of tiny radius turns gaining little with each turn, but with less effort (theoretically) to ratchet your way up hill. HOWEVER, heaven help you on the downhill. Just a thought. Never tried it.
@@Turboganz awesome! Thanks for the quick reply 🙏
@@KevinBene You're welcome.
Nice job pumping up that 4% grade. My G|Bomb Push/Pump is too low to get that kind of leverage. I could pump up a 4% for about 100 feet with a running start and no headwind. Soon as I would lose momentum it's all over.
Thanks! That's what I try to explain to people about a combo set up. It doesn't do either end very well. My rig is push-able, but only for short distances. Your balance has to be precise, very much like skate technique in xc skiing. To be efficient in that style the skier must learn to ride a very narrow "board" for 15-20 ft. on one foot before transferring to the other. Perhaps that's why I have a tolerance for pushing (only when I must) a board definitely set up for pumping with VERY loose trucks.Nice work being able to make your way up a 4%, even if it's a struggle. I've never seen a g-bomb in person. But my impression is that the brackets would allow you to raise it above push-level to make it more pump-friendly. Further, I wonder if the bracket adjustments can also provide the same effect as wedging. It's all a matter of what you want. Let me know of your progress.
G|Bomb makes a dedicated pumping board that is higher. My trucks are Dont-Trip Poppys. Yes, the brackets allow you to wedge - front is set at 45° and rear is fully adjustable over a wide range of angles.
Thankfully where I live is all flat so no problem with being stopped by hills. Wind is a different story of course. Cheers!
Thanks for the clarification. Winds can be a problem here too. It's a matter of timing. 8 am to 11:30 am is optimal. After that I expect anything. The highest wind I've pumped is 24 MPH (I carry and anemometer). Fortunately, I only had 3 miles to go. I find that anything above 17 MPH takes the fun out of it. But I purposely set my route to take advantage of wind direction relative to the hills. Any wind velocity 10 MPH and above makes me look (and feel) like an uphill super-star. Pumping downhill is a drag, but there's no such thing as a free lunch.
I've made an exact copy of this longboard with all parts as in the video. The setup works great!
I'm new to LDP (with background in freeline skate) but in my first ride I had no problems to outspeed other longboarders. I've just started to experiment with setup and it looks like the trucks should be very loose. I can even hear a rattling sound when washer beats upon front kingpin nut if the the board is not leaning. Hope I'll fix it somehow later. My rear wheels happen to lift off the ground. Decided to fix it with softer bushings as I am about 10kg lighter than Turboganz. Today I changed rear bushing to 80/79a and it worked. The board now turns so easy, it's like a feather. And I have more space to transfer my body motion to board propulsion.
It still feels like my front truck can be more soft and agile, my front wheels sometimes lift when going up the hill.
Anyway, building the skill and researching a personal setup is a lot of fun! Thanks Turboganz for motivating me to get into pumping!
Thanks for telling me about this. You've made my day! One thing to remember about wheel lift, it's not all about gear. A lot of it has to do with smooth technique (weight transfer), even when moving quickly. Of course, sometimes wheel lift is unavoidable. Yes, the idea is to run loose and how loose is your choice, but I'm concerned that the washer rattle indicates too loose and might result in excessive truck wear. It can make control a little jerky or sloppy in some situations. My preference is to always let the bushing keep all of the parts in contact as they were designed to be. Because I like to short swing, like skiing, to control speed in the downhill, that extra control is important. I'm especially happy that you readily outperform other longboarders. It verifies the efficiency of the setup and how "boarder-friendly" it is. When I discovered this, I HAD to share it. It's too much fun! Enjoy!
You were right. I could solve that rattling after my technique improved. First, I put my feet closer in a narrow stance so I could transfer more force to the front truck. The second thing was timing. I learned to catch a stronger resonance and pumping became easy. I could now tighten my trucks and finally they became silent. I still hear some rattling on a rough surface or when I ride over cracks, but I think it's ok.
What I like the most about this setup is that I can pump in wide arcs. That is incredible! 20 km ride? No problem, just relax in those arcs.
Outstanding! Thanks for telling me of your progress. 20 km is my usual training/workout distance. Well done. I agree, those bigger arcs are fun. I don't know where you are or your terrain. I was wondering if you have tried short-swing ski-like movements to control speed on the downhill. Keep it up. Your obvious joy came through in your writing.
I have a couple of steep downhills on my route. But the board has surprisingly high stability on high speed and usually I just rush downhill. Breaking is still a thing to master for me. Carves work for breaking, but the road should be twice as wide as in your video. How do you carve-break on a narrower road?
From your question I'll assume that you are not a skier or snowboarder. So, here's what happens. First of all, this is not braking. It's just speed control. There is no braking friction and no skidding. Looking at the video, you'll see that I have up and down movement in specific segments of the turns. I'm weighting and un-weighting. This where the spring of the board helps and makes it fun. The up un-weight is when you retract your legs to lighten the pressure on the board as you change from turning, left for instance, you begin banking the board to turn right while your weight is light on the board. As you commit to the right turn you will settle onto the board, pressuring it, as you extend your legs again getting ready for the next turn. In a really tight turn, I find it useful to keep my upper body relatively quiet (no big twists) and chest pointed down the fall line (slope). Your upper body is an inertial anchor that allows you to rotate your lower body. I often keep my arms out to aid in this inertial effect. Remember that the pressure is mainly directed toward the pavement, not the outside of the turn. That pressure makes it easier to stick to the road surface. It's the weighting and un- weighting aggressively that makes it work. Definitely keep your weight forward (over your feet). If wind pressure pushes your upper body back, you'll lose control. It's subtle, but you can feel it and correct for it. When you get the hang of it, you'll feel like you are springing down the hill. It's a matter of moving quickly and decisively to really crank the board around. It may seem obvious, but remember too that you should be looking down the fall line to where you want to go, NOT where you don't want to go. Your body will follow.
Nice & Thanks :)
You're welcome. Have fun!
Why did you choose two different size axel widths for the front and rear and why? if you went 125mm in the rear wouldn't 125mm in the front as well provide even quicker turning up front? Or did you do this because of the deck you were using and clearance? I am working on a similar setup and just want to get the expensive parts right the 1st time. I already have a blaster with the old bennet/RTS combo.
Yes, it would turn quicker, but that's for the slalom guys. In theory the back truck acts a bit like a pivot to the whole board and provides movement chiefly in a vertical plane. In the video this is shown by the red and green tracks in one of the still photos. So, more narrow means less vertical "hopping" of each wheel during aggressive side to side movement. A wheel off of the pavement is lost energy. The larger truck up front provides a lot of stability and a nice big available arc, but of course the response time will be slower. To me it's like having long legs to reach farther while running. It doesn't provide clearance in my setup because the trucks are so loose that the wheel can swing under the board, hence, depending on wheel size, risers are a given for clearance. But, it's matter of preference. As I explained in the video, I like to carve hard, short radius turns for speed control, yet want decent stability on the downhill, plus a good comfortable pump for long distance with reasonable hill climbing. Shorter trucks might make for better hill climbing for instance because of the shallower arc and quicker side to side response, but that's not my goal. A shorter wheel base would also contribute to shorter radius carved turns, but could aggravate road vibration. It's all a matter of choice. Keep in mind that Poppys are adjustable. You are not stuck with one axel width. I understand your concerns about expense. It's almost a leap of faith, but worth it. All I can tell you is that my setup is almost universal. I have yet to find someone who could not use it right away. With your experience on Bennett/RTS I'm sure you can tweak it to best advantage with a little analytical patience.
How to handle wheel lift? Either front or back? Is wheel lift unavoidable with front or back trucks? I assume it's better to get wheel lift front first as back grip is more important? How to best approach wheel lift with respect to bushings, truck angles & also of course technique (weighting on front back trucks). I know the question is very general and the answer is probably too complex :)
Actually, not all that complex. The problem is usually more obvious in the rear truck. The situation is strongly influenced by bushing stiffness and technique. During setup I know that my front bushings will be ultra soft and the kingpin tension will be loose. No correction necessary. The rear is the variable. I keep selecting lower and lower durometer rear bushings until the problem is solved. However, technique has a strong influence. You can be quick, but not violent. If your movements are more like a rod, tipping from side to side, lift is more probable. To lower the probability of lift (and be a better pumper), your movements need to be more sinuous, from shoulders done to your ankles (and sometimes you toes). The motion is like a vertical wave of inertia transfer. Good flexibility (doesn't have to be yoga quality) helps. That's all that there is to it and why I like the setup that I have shown. Sometimes, when you are fighting up a steep hill, some hop is inevitable, but it should be the exception.
Hello, Turbo! It is now the third season that I ride an exact copy of your longboard. And I have to say that your setup is perfect! Treating your video as an instruction was the best decision. How do I know it? This year I got a second board - GBomb with torsion tail. It costs twice as much but it is not that good as your setup. GBomb is really very lightweight, easy to push, feels like a feather and very fast. But on slow speed it is hard to pump and uphill is a torture. The problem is the torsion tail. It gives tremendous amortisation, the half of the board is actually a spring. It gives a very smooth ride. But the turn radius is too large and there is no way to change it. On your board it is a matter of technique to go uphill or to speed up on a horizontal surface. Bur the GBomb is only good at high speed. My experiments are still in progress but i doubt that it will become as good as my goldcoast. Going to change torsion tail for a hanger for the next season.
I also tried changing bushings on my first board, but each experiment gave me weaker setup than before. I have no idea how long it took you to get to this setup. Great job! And a big thank you for sharing your results with us.
Thanks for the very complimentary reply. I'm VERY happy that it worked so well for you compared to the high-tech boards. My thinking is that simpler is better (if possible). You have shown this to be the case. Thanks for your thoughtful analysis. You've made my day!
Pretty new to this whole thing, what changes would you recommend for an even heavier rider? I'm at least 250lbs
First, you should have had a reply much earlier. UA-cam is not alerting me to posts again. So, your needs are a stiffer flex, more like what Karen is on. The trucks will handle you, but primary changes will be in the bushings and the wheel durometer. Unfortunately, it will take a lot of experimentation. Expect to spend time and money to get it right (depending upon how picky you are), but it won't cost a fortune.
Heey, Didnt I meet you at the Dutch Ultraskate of 2017? :O
No. I promised myself that I would NOT compete in this sport. I have in other endurance sports, but it can be a time and energy trap.
How exactly do you take the spherical bearing out?? I really don't want to force or break anything :/. Any help would be great!
Sure, no problem. It's quite simple. Once the kingpin (hanger bolt) has been removed, the bushings et al, covering the bearing will expose the bushing. You'll have just the axle assembly in your hand. The bearing nests very securely in that axle assembly due to some very close tolerance machining (my guess 1/1000" or so). There is nothing holding it there but friction. You may be able to push the bearing out with a thumb on either side. DO NOT PRESS ON THE SPHERE. If the sphere pops out, don't faint. Just pop it back in. You haven't damaged anything. If the bearing case won't budge, just use a socket (as from a socket wrench) of the appropriate size to gently pound out with a rubber mallet, dead blow hammer or very carefully with a claw hammer. Make sure that the axle is supported right and left over the cushioned, open jaws of a vise or just two 2 by 4 scraps. I think you get the picture. It's not a high pressure press-fit (at least mine aren't). The key to success is good support and even pressure. In re-assembly, I have put a tiny bit of grease on the exterior bearing walls to make assembly/dis-assembly easier. In re-assembly, make sure that the bearing is as close to perfectly aligned to the axle boring as possible. Forcing it in at an angle can scar the walls. I liken it to cross threading a bolt. Just take your time and be observant. You'll have no problem and...you just learned something!
@@Turboganz oh man, thanks so much! Your awesome 🙏
@@KevinBene You're welcome.
OK, love to see someone my age skateboarding! I have an Arbor Blunt 44" longboard with a 25.75" wheelbase and 50" Gullwing trucks on .25" risers. I can't make this pump... I'd love to convert this to something pumpable. I could put on the trucks/risers as per your video but the wheel base would still be considerably shorter thank yours. My Blunt has front/rear rocker/kick so I can't move the trucks further apart. Thoughts?
On another note - I see you stance on the board has your front foot just behind the truck but your rear is rather far forward toward the center of the board. Is this for comfort? de-weighting the rear wheels/ loading the front wheels? Changing the deflection angle front/rear?
I'm currently getting the parts together to build a carver surfskate board with c7 trucks, 30.75 board (CI Flyer). I think this is a whole different realm of pumping. We shall see. I have no idea what I'm doing BTW.
I really enjoyed your video. Thanks. Chris
We're living proof that boarding is NOT just for 16 year olds. Your Blunt deck should work. It's a matter of what you hang on it. The length and shape should be plenty. Don't be hung up on the manufacturer's statement of wheel base. Measure your actual wheel base axle to axle. I have found that almost any board can be pumped, though not all can be pumped efficiently. If you change to the hardware and setup that I have, you will notice that the wheel base changes remarkably, because the truck angles change. The on-pavement (contact) wheel base will lengthen. I don't know how stiff the Blunt is, that has a lot of influence. A little flex can actually allow you to dynamically alter the above angles as you pump. I like that. But really, it's personal preference. My stance is not static. It changes relative to a number of factors, but only by an inch or two. Board flex is a big one and radius of the turns that I want. The back foot is located to extract the degree of flex that I want. A wide stance works against the arcing effect that you are trying to obtain for the front trucks. Opinions will differ, but the rear trucks are more for stabilization. I find that in carved turns that I can weight/unweight very similar to skiing. The main action is on the front trucks. Remember, you are driving a tangential force into the arc of the turns. It's the frictional properties of the wheels and your weight or inertial orientation that allows those forces to move into the arc. I don't have experience with every truck or deck available (eight probably). I made the video to show what works for almost everyone with a high degree of success. Don't forget the bushings. I like them very soft on the front. It makes a huge difference. You'll get there. Let me know how you are doing.
@@Turboganz You have given me hope good sir. I will begin to accumulate bits and pieces. C.
Glad to hear it! That's why I made the video. Hang in there.
Hi - @@Turboganz , now that I have squandered many hours on the web researching this universe (snow covered ground still here in CO) I have a couple of quick questions for you. when you put the 15 degree riser in, did you you do anything about the bolt head on the top of the board coming in at an angle? The truck you are using has a spherical bearing in it, did you install that or do those trucks come with one? There is a very good video on DIY installation with a little machining and epoxy. Thanks, Chris.
You need to go to the Don't Trip website and look at the Poppys and look closely at my video. Everything that I show you is Plug and Play. No epoxy, no machining, no re-drilling. The trucks already have a spherical bearing right out of the box. Of course you will be replacing the bushings with those of your liking. Don't Trip did a fine job in their design. I don't like home grown extensive modification of hardware. Modification tells me that the part was not designed for the job and will be inferior performers in the end or will have lower durability. I've tried the Tracker and Bennett setup (which is still being pushed in writings by others) because it was less expensive. It didn't last one season. Hence, in the long run, it really isn't less expensive. That's why I took a deep breath and blew cash on the Poppys. From mechanical/engineering stand point it seemed to make sense. Worth IT! I had no problem with the angle of the bolt heads against the maple laminations of the deck. Perhaps a bamboo deck would be too soft and require washers, but I'm not a bamboo fan. I have a few hundred miles on my Poppys and only replace bearing cups/sleeves and bushings. THAT'S durability. Don't Trip came out with a Poppys SP that eliminates the urethane bearing cup by adding another spherical bearing. Theoretically, that should be even better. I demand performance and durability in ALL of my equipment. I don't throw something away just because there is a NEXT BIG THING. One more thought. If you don't have a set of metric tools (1/4 inch socket set and allen wrenches minimum) they'll make life easier. Those longboarder t-wrenches are a joke IMHO.
Would you have any opinion on getting Gbomb (either pump or push-pump) or one of the boards from Subsonic?
I'm going to be travelling a bit, and wanted to pick up a board when I'm in the US. I don't know that I'll be able to do a lot of setup/mods, so I want to get something already complete, and that won't require much maintenance. (Although after watching the video, maybe I should get some extra bushings... and a dremel. I'll have to watch it a couple more times to figure that out.)
I'm also thinking of a shorter, more fun board that's pumpable.
I'd appreciate any thoughts. Thanks
Glad to help. All that matters with the board is a good wide place to put your feet, moderate flex (not brick stiff) and a wheel base between 26-31" (although mine is 32-1/4"). I like flexible choices in equipment, so that kills the G-bomb. The brackets are an odd extra dedicated to that board. I don't like being stuck with one manufacturer's board. However, plenty of guys really like it. Subsonic's Century 40 is said to swing both ways...but the trucks are not dedicated LDP trucks. I can tell you from personal experience, they are sloppy and easily worn. If maintenance is a concern Poppys is your choice. Further, I don't like the weight distribution of a drop deck for PUMP, but it's fine for push. I prefer my weight higher on a non-dropped deck to serve as longer "lever" above the trucks as I move (get the image?). The cut-away deck is not to my liking. Less choice of where to put my feet and more road grit or water in the face. Another caveat, whatever board you choose, if you do any wedging, the effective wheel base will increase. The wheel base stated by any manufacturer is only a starting point. So, if you want a low maintenance, really fine pumper, it's Poppys, wedges, risers and top mount "straight" board of your choice (the board can be very inexpensive because they are simple). (Wheel and bearing choice is pretty straight forward.) It doesn't have to be a pintail, but I would stay away from deep rails, your feet go numb when you hang them over, we're not going downhill here. As I have told others, the set up I show is almost universal and versatile. It's rather easy to assemble and the parts are readily available. Those are important factors to consider. I checked around the net and I haven't found a complete with these specs. There are lots of options. The choices are very personality and goal-related. Oh, and you don't have to buy a Dremel. For much less, Harbor Freight has a similar tool at a much lower price. Good luck. Where are you, by the way?
Thanks very much. I really appreciate the detailed reply. I'm in Australia, to answer your question.
Subsonic recommended the Gbomb partly because that weird bracket situation means you can break the board down shorter - good for travelling. I wonder if they'd put Poppys on it? I'll have to get that pivot tube, as well. (I'm not sure what a barrel is... but I guess I'll be needing those.)
I wonder what trucks and bits Gbomb uses if you buy directly from them. (The boards are expensive enough that they should be good.)
Plus the idea of some pushability appeals.
I'm really clueless as to ALL of this. Even when you mentioned rails, I had to stop and figure that out.) That's why I'm kinda hoping I can find a board set up for me, or customize one.
Maybe it's not as complicated as I'm fearing...
I'm also wanting to have fun... some people seem to have a second, shorter board for about town, sidewalks, crowded areas.
I just recently figured out pumping on... my friend's Penny, of all things. I'd always wanted to do it (having started out with a Ripstik), but knew very little and my first board was a used slide board... didn't work at all for pumping.
I have a fattail now, and just by loosening the front trucks, tightening the back, it's pumping in a way that's amazed me - so much so that I've abandoned my daydream of getting an electric board. (Why bother?) And become obsessed with getting a proper pumping board.
I'm a little confused about the brackets/lack of flexibility with Gbomb. Wouldn't I be able to put whatever trucks I wanted on it?
I'm sure that's a dumb question. But... well, noob.
One more thought (and sorry to clutter with the comments), thanks for explaining that there is no universal pumping setup. One place we'll differ is that right now I'm probably after a bit higher proportion of fun/play than distance suitability. So, I think that might translate to... a bit more maneuverability? You've convinced me on the Poppys, though. Sounds like anything else would be not only less suitable, but would get trashed. (Is it possible to pop them on to another board, when I want to, or is that a big job?)
A beautiful illustration of how personality and goal-driven this is. The combination that works is the one that works for YOU. The break-down for travel is a good argument. For me the re-assembly every time would be a pain. But this isn't about me.Just to clarify, my board is push-able, but I detest pushing. It's the same motion as using a child's scooter. It's half run, half ride, but good at neither. Mine is definitely not a dual purpose set up. Usually dedication to one results in more efficiency.Rails (if you haven't already discovered) are the right and left top edges of the deck. Some are more raised to make a deep U or W cross-section.When last I checked the site, Poppys are now shipped with the harder pivot tubes, but it doesn't hurt to have a spare. I worked with Poppys and Riptide (as did others) to test the tubes. The originals barely lasted 50 miles for my weight (185 lbs) and my degree of wedging. I have hundreds of miles on the new ones with little wear.The barrels are the shape of the very common bushings used in the trucks. Poppys ship with a Riptide variation that I can't stand...too stiff. Rebound is not an important factor to me. I like the elasticity and long wear of the Khiro barrels and strangely, they are less expensive...who knew?Which brings me to another concept mentioned in the video. Some people are bouncers and some are not. Some like a thick high-rebound bushing that stores energy and pushes back with each unweight. I'm not one of those. I like telling the board what to do, not vise versa. A high rebound bushing resists the holding of a turn while carving and limits the radius. The tighter the radius, the higher the resistance. Not good. I like sharp carves for speed control, just like skiing and snowboarding. Just moving in a straight line is boring. So, you'll have to determine which is for you.Tuning your current board to pump is a giant leap forward. Nice work! There are a lot of variations on this theme. It seems complicated at first, but that's only because there are so many choices. The basic concepts are actually quite simple. Keep at it.
Going to copy your setup to start with. What confuses me is that GoldCoast 44" has 30" wheelbase. Is that correct?
Close enough. The manufacture says 30.5 in. However, if you do as I have done you'll have 32" instead. The stated wheelbase is a set of numbers for comparison based on the standard non-pump set up. So, don't be confused. The numbers are only relative, not absolute. You'll find that the wheel cutouts on the deck won't match up quite right either. No problem. The set up is adjusted for wheel bite. Let me know how it goes.
Thanks for making it clear! Does it make pumping harder if I go for a longer wheelbase? I consider Landyachtz 44" deck which has 32" stated wheelbase. Also I'm tall (190 cm) and I supposed that the taller the rider the longer wheelbase can be, does it make sense on practice?
Here's where YOUR needs and ambitions come into play. I've had guys your size on my board and it worked fine. I consider my final wheel base of 32" fairly long and I really can't recommend going longer. But, personal preference. Everything else being the same, the difference between longer and shorter is ease and speed at which each arc can be made (shorter-faster, longer-slower). It really does not matter about height (in my experience). What matters is how steep the hills are that you want to climb (pump) and how much control do you want on descent. Mine is a compromise, given that I want to pump the grades shown in the video, yet still make a short-swing descent for speed control. In theory, a shorter board would allow the pumper to ascend a steeper hill. About height, consider too that a taller guy has a longer series of levers (legs, hips, torso) to move. Depending on style, a shorter guy could "vibrate" more of his body side to side faster than a tall guy. Are you visualizing this? BUT, your longer body could have more of "whip" or ripple effect because of the additional length. Shorter faster movements may not matter because of the leverage. I think of my shoulders as an anchor for the other movements. You'll notice I have a pretty quiet upper body. I think of the movement of forces as initiating from either feet or shoulders and rippling vertically up and down. So, longer guy, longer wheelbase, not necessarily. Good question.
The idea of using longer levers is clear. I ride freeline skates, it's very close to pumping a board. I finally decided to go for a shorter 30" wheelbase because I'm going to pump uphill regulary on my routes. Thanks for being so helpful!
Glad to help. Let me know how it goes
why not flip the rear truck kingpin over so that you can pull from the streetside? nut to boardside.
A reasonable question. Short answer, it's personal preference. Years ago I tried it and didn't like it. The bolt head (in my setup) is trapped in the narrow channel to prevent spinning. Inverting the bolt means the nylon-insert lock nut will be trapped there and is untouchable. Trying to accurately thread the bolt into the nut through all of that hardware and bushings AND assuring yourself that it is not cross-threaded is a pain and difficult to assess. Re-stating, it's difficult to determine if the nut is accurately located on the bolt. That's a risk I won't take. Also, by having the nut street-side you can quickly see the condition of the nut ie: how many threads are showing etc. Further, (it's "reaching" a bit, but possible) if the nut should unthread itself I'd prefer that it be the part to fall onto the road, not the bolt, for obvious reasons. Further still, I prefer to spin a nut at the end of the assembly, not the whole bolt which reaches from one end of the assembly to the other. I want that bolt fixed in position at all times. Trapping the bolt head definitely accomplishes that. To me, bolts are meant to be the fixed object...nuts do the spinning.So, I find it easier to remove the mounting bolts then mess with an inverted kingpin. One wrench (for the mounting bolts) and a cordless drill/driver and you are done. The rear trucks don't require anywhere near the maintenance of the front trucks so, demounting should be rare once tuning is accomplished. Happy boarding.
gotcha. i'm spitballing here, could one back the rear KP out if one drilled a hole in one's deck to allow the bolt head to emerge proud of the deck surface? i'm new to this company's products so i'm seeking info and advice from whence i'm able including reputable sources such as yourself. i just purchased a Slalocybin for my front truck, wanted the adjustability in the baseplate, and can't decide how much importance to place on rear truck quality.
If you have no wedging to block the passage of the bolt through the deck it would certainly work. However, is it wise? I anticipate needing a drift pin to knock the bolt through the whole assembly to remove it and replace it. The hole through the deck would have to be large enough to dependably prevent ANY contact with the bolt head as it passes through to prevent accidental splintering. IF you have a very stiff deck with nine plies of maple you may be able to do this without compromising structural integrity. I would not even consider a hole in my moderately flexible board of six maple plies. Bamboo? no way. My reasoning is based in part on the orientation and type of wood fibers, plus, vertical stresses on the right and left side of the deck along the long axis. Also, that hole will be very close to the mounting bolts. I'm not saying there will be catastrophic failure, I just don't like introducing weakness no matter how small. We're talking about the effects of cumulative stress, not a single event. Further, the hole introduces road grime, water and oils in a place they don't belong...the exposed ends of wood fibers. Extra care would be needed to avoid this. Remember, all of this is personal preference. I want my equipment to last as long as possible and I want it to be predictable.Regarding spending the bucks for a good rear truck: My experience says do it. Karen tried what you propose. I tested and she tested. I couldn't tolerate the sluggishness and imprecision of the setup. But, I tend to be fussy about efficiency. After more experience she tried mine again (full Poppy) and was sold. Now her setup is full Poppy and she's still smiling. For US the difference was that obvious. I assume the same would apply to the Slalocybins.
thanks for the info, turbo. it's much appreciated.
ok, here's another question i have for you but first, thanks for your patience with, and generosity to, us noobs. so what do you think about a stationary rear "truck" like DT's Delirium or G Bomb's Torsion Tail? does it actually help to thwart rear truck movement? Also, stiff deck of flexible? i'm thinking stiff transfers more energy into the wheels but flexible equates to more comfort. thoughts?