For those saying they are rip offs , they are not really, they are clones of older saws no longer produced. The patents have either expired or they have bought the old designs from Stihl or Husqvarna. They are essentially the same saw with cheaper quality parts and often poorer tolerences or finish. All parts are however interchangeable which is handy for those of us with older machines. Granted squish bands are often greater, nikasil coatings probably thinner, have more flashing etc but the parts have improved and they do usually work very well
I built the ms 660 farmertec kit and it was AMAZING!!! I had it on an Alaskan mill with a 4' bar. I had to sell it years ago and now plan on getting another to slab again.
Awesome video... I use a lot of the holzfforma products! I'm able to completely work on them so a rebuild for me is an afternoon of good times. However, I agree if a guy is not able to work on them probably not the saw for them. However, it's a awesome option for when I have a customer come in that can't afford a OEM rebuild. Also, the clone saws allowed me to take my self to chainsaw school by working on and modification of them without the OEM price. Thanks for the video sir
Very informative video my Dad was a Stihl man and so am I. They do this with soda pop to you go buy a pack of them and the bottles are thin but go to a gas station and get a single one and the bottles are a harder plastic and I can tell the difference in taste also yet there is so many knock off things out there.
I got a scam by somebody where I bought a farmer tech a 660 and I thought it was a Stihl 660. When they put OEM bars and chains on these they really do look like stihl saws. But I've actually loved the farmer tech saw.
I just ordered a proyama 68cc saw comes with 20 and 24 bar. With a 3 year warranty under $300 on Amazon. I just need it for some trees around my house had a few fall during the last hurricane and my cordless 14" saw isn't going to do it.
I have looked for this video for years. It wouldnt pull up in search. This video got me into the chinese saw industry, im very very deep in it now, way deeper than farmertec and holtzfforma/hutzle.....i can provide some amazing saws....im literally on a daily contact with factory owners who make amazing incredible saws, like with OEM factory parts, no joke. The big saw companies contract secretly with non-disclosure agreements, nearly everything is chinese made....i dont know exact parts but there are three contracted factories and i know cylinders are chinese now.....maybe still brazillian too but not the "Molly" which is like mahale.
I run a blue gen 3 g660 as a cut down saw everyday. Runs and cuts amazing. My only problem with the farmertec is the carb always needs tuned. I have been running them for years. They are worth the money. I usually get about a year to a year and a half out of them before they lunch the top or bottom end. When that happens I throw it on the shelf and grab a new one and go back to work. Good running and cutting saw
I'm a Stihl die hard fan, so I picked up a Stihl off market place that was burn't up and rebuilt it with farmertec rings and piston, it runs ok but I for my daily saws I would opt for OEM parts.
Most of those parts are really good, the Achilles heel of those parts are the carburetors. Get a walbro rebuild it and it should run just as good as a real sthil.
This is one of the better videos comparing the clones with the original. I have a had few Husqy saws and a couple Stihl saws. Both last for many years without trouble. Been wondering about a china clone tho. I might buy one for fun and video comparison one day when I have some extra money to blow on it. But for daily use I will stick with an original.
Good video. I like that you were open and honest about what Farmertec offers and what you are getting when buying one. I thought about buying one a year ago, but I found a good used Stihl 026 for $100 and a 193t for $65. I'm not opposed to buying a China made saw if it will a trim a tree or help cut one down. I think Stihl is way overpriced and mfg's. like Echo offer a nice alternative for the arborist. I think for home owners Farmertec may be a nice alternative rather than spending a bunch of money on a saw you may only used a few times.
I have run a lot of saws In my life, and I agree with what you said. I own a lot of older Stihl saws that are great and have hundreds of hours on them. I have recently started buying Echo saws, as I believe their saws are the best bang for the buck at this point. There is no reason for your average non-pro to buy a Stihl anymore. Too expensive, they don’t want to work with you to warranty anything, and the quality isn’t as good as it once was.
True unless it's something you want to last or you want a warranty so yeah I like stihl and husqvarna there top dog for a reason there expensive because people will pay
I'm very sorry but I can't totally agree with your assessment of these saws. I mean yes, certain parts can be inferior, but generally speaking once you've ironed out the kinks these saws last and perform just as well as the OEM saws, and even if you're unlucky and you trash an engine then so what! You can buy a pot, piston and crank ect for absolute peanuts direct from farmertec. For example I could literally rebuild a 375xp clone half a dozen times or more for the price of one original saw!! And they perform just as well in the woods. We've run these and original huskies and there's very little difference overall, the cut rate is pretty much identical, at least that's the case for the husky clones anyway. To be honest apart from the price they make a lot more sense in other ways as well. Firstly they are based on older tech, the new saws now are more complicated and can be troublesome to deal with, sometimes requiring them to go in to be fixed by a dealer. Also there's plenty of people who experience issues such as poor hot starting, premature piston wear, overheating issues etc. All problems associated with engines that use a stratification engine design and autotune carbs. It's becoming almost impossible to buy a new professional grade saw now that doesn't use such tech, however buying a clone means that you still can. Another perhaps overlooked aspect is that these saws aren't as valuable. Having a stable full of OEM huskies and stihls is a big investment, it's also an attractive proposition for anyone who want to steal them! This has happened to me a few times over the years. But now I'm not so worried, firstly they're not as likely to want to steal a load of Chinese knock offs! And even if they do it's no great loss by comparison. Actually I've started buying the all blue versions of these saws as they are even less attractive to any would be thief. Regards
Your point really isn't valid....IMO I understand what you're saying but why would you want to be inconvenienced with an inferior product and additional work to keep it running. ??
@@victormarinelli5660 In my experience there's actually very little difference between the OEM saws and the clones.....once you've gone through them and changed out the parts that are likely to be a problem. In operation they perform and hold up just as well, and they're certainly not inferior once you take costs into consideration! Like I've said, these saws are older tech, there's nothing you can't fix yourself, and have it up and running again with minimal down time. Even if I had to do a full rebuild on one, it would only take a few hours and cost absolute peanuts to do, the saw would be back in the woods and working the same day! i.e. if I did the same with an OEM saw and used OEM parts to repair it how much extra work would I need to do to pay for that? So even in that equation they make more sense to me. I'm not into brand snobbery or preconceptions, I prefer to assess a product by how well it actually performs, and on that basis I think calling them inferior products is a tad inaccurate. They are simply project saws for someone who doesn't mind tinkering a little bit to get the best out of them. It's one of the reasons I was buying them in kit form and building them up myself, so I could check everything was good as it could be. Regards
@@JimN_AustinTx Pay more then if you really think you'll get a better deal. But bear in mind you can have four or more of these saws for the same cost as one new OEM saw!
hell i got a hulzforma 372 xp i use it all the time work great i have had it for 3 years now.i use it for work and for firewood i never had mine to stop working.its payed for its self so many times. if mine stopped working trw i go buy me one again.
I have a generator from harbor freight the predator one. When they 1st came out. Must be over 10 years old by now. Still starts one pull and has never let me down.
I'm the "tree guy" or "chainsaw" guy for the small company I work for and was thinking of buying one of the ms660 clones for our bigger trees . We're not a tree service , but I do alot of clearing for farms .... Would it hold up? I'm really looking into this saw and adding a few upgrades and or just replacing parts with stihl parts . Would you recommend this saw for commercial use (light commercial) I'm tired of running small stihls (because that's what my boss buys) or his brother's husky 460 that just needs thrown in the river.
I’ve been running a g660 clone saw for over 2 years milling with it falling trees etc etc…for myself on our land but nevertheless it has hours & hours on it if hard use good bar/chain real stihl air filter rebuild the carb with genuine parts replaced the decompression valve and run it a little richer then my 562xp it sings everytime I genuinely have no complaints we run a 36 & 42” bar on it I’m by no means easy on it because I wanted it to break I wanted to be able to say it sucks but I can’t 😂 it runs!! & runs strong everytime
Overall they are very good. The rubber and plastic parts aren’t great but can easily be replaced with oem Stihl or Husky parts. You can save a ton of money on the large cc saws.
I bought and ran two 066. I had to put a OEM carb to get them to run, OEM handle bars and chain adjuster. They ran great until they blew up fairly quickly, maybe 200 mbf on each. I don’t buy them anymore.
the first one i got was the g888 and love it, the handle i had to change. The 395 you have to change the piston(slap) now a great saw. i have oem 394 and 395 and the jugs from hiyway are just as good to me.
I’d probally get a farmertech and then replace parts as they brake with stihl OEM and then if the motor ever gives out. I can then buy a real stihl and take the oem parts off farmer tech and use them as spares on the stihl. I feel this will be the cheapest long term option
Great informative video, thanks. Any experience with the JonCutter 2500? I hear it's a good/small cutter especially for tree climbing at only about 3 kilos.
Super random question. Any idea why are chainsaw engines like 1/3-1/4 the hp of a comparable sized dirtbike engine? Like whys a 125cc dirtbike 35+ hp and a 881 is only 8ish, is just the increased weight of the rotating mass in the engine?
It’s mainly because of the exhaust, an expansion chamber adds a MASSIVE amount of power to a 2 stroke engine, it’s pretty much the equivalent of a supercharger.
Don't forget those dirt bikes are also water cooled so you can run more compression and rpm to make that power. As everyone else said also have that expansion chamber, reed vales and bigger flywheel to help with low end torque.
Dirt bikes aren't wide open 95%of the time like chainsaws they got to deal with turns and jumps... also as mentioned the water cooling part. Where do you get 35hp from? At the crank? I been away from mx bikes a while I know my 250 makes 49ish to the wheel, pretty sure 125's was around 30hp.. if that.
Good video I am interested in buying equipment from China but disagree with companies like farmertec just ripping off Stihl etc. However I think the Farmertec Holzforma is a good idea for most people. Have you ever had any dealings with Gezhi equipment? They do a range of equipment that I'm interested in as a landscaper. TIA if anyone has experience with the brand.
Let's be fair here. Though the country is well-known for it's industrial espionage, it is fully legal and moral for Farmertec to build/sell these saws using expired monopolized US/German patents. The fact that they can build, ship, and sell them back to us for so much cheaper may say more about us than they? There is no dispute about their sub-standard quality, but every consumer product has a balance between quality .vs cost. We each must determine our own break-even point for our individual use. In the past decade many import products have increased in quality while many locally produced products have decreased in quality while exponentially increasing in cost. I own many OEM orange saws, but also purchase and use clones when the crossover error rate favors it.
Is neotech the same? I've also seen that you can get saw that comes with brand name parts like a Walbro carburettor, spark plugs and more, how much does this improve the saw and is it worth paying the bit extra to get the upgrades
I just bought the cheapest ms 660 clone I could find knowing all the clones are Chinese. My plan is to replace broken parts with oem. Unless it get out of hand and I'll throw it in the dumpster. I did put a oem stihl 25" bar and chain on it. I can always sell that and it hold value pretty good. I got $400 in my g660.
There are several folks on FB running them in mills. Just know going in they may not live as long as the OEM. Considering a ms661 is 1500 and an ms881 2200 a clone 660 for 500 or 880 for 800 is less than half the price. If it smokes a cylinder in the 1st season opt for a high quality or even OEM replacement cylinder and piston and keep on moving.
I got a 660 clone and put a 25" stihl bar and chain on it for $400. Maybe they just sold it cheap because they knew it was leaking fuel. ($15 for the Stihl tank elbow and fuel line to the carb) fixed it.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw they are great saws, slight downfall has been cost of parts. I've offered it as suggestion in the Farmertec group to Manny and others, but it sounds like you have the strongest relationship stateside with them.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw and the "g" option for the 070/090 platform. As well as the 090 clutch. I'd love to have an 090g clone to run a huge bar for milling monster logs
The parts are interchangeable, yes, but inferior quality. The metal is soft, the plastic gets brittle and they don’t last. The blue ones were pretty, though, and cheap, but they don’t last especially if you put oem on them.
I asked this on another video too... But if they are clones... then why do they specify a different fuel mixture/ratio from the OEM ones? I.e. I know a Husq 372xp uses 50:1 fuel, but all these Holz saws specify 25:1 in their documentation... And 25:1 is pretty extreme for a fuel mix no? What fuel mix ratio do you actually run in them?
Out side USA husqvarna calls for 33 to 1 oil mix. Guess oil mix depends on EPA requirements .I run 40 to 1 in ever thing. Never seen a 2 cycle engine last long on 50 to 1 mix.
All my saws run 50:1 u have to tune your saws or any 2-cycle engines to fuel mixture unless u have an auto tuner & then u have to run it through their specific tuning process. Also u have to tune chainsaws to the size bar & ANY engine mod esp advanced timing, head & exhaust porting. If you're not mechanically inclined these after market saws are far more forgiving, cost effective, & use OEM parts from original manufacturer.
25:1 is bogus because your engine will build way too much heat. I use VP full synthetic at a 40:1 ratio and adjust the high jet so that it four strokes when I let up in the cut. That way it's slightly rich and you'll never score a piston and cylinder a bit rich, but lean is trouble.
@@yungsmile7546 you obviously don't know what you're talking about. 25:1 is richer that 50:1. Don't give advice you don't know what you're talking about. Lol you made me chuckle when you said 4 stroking. Come on man.
@@ajcutler3472 four stroking is a term used to describe what happens when the high-speed jet is backed out too far. I know because that is the term used by factory technicians, and I was a Stihl tech for a long time.
i just bought a blue one for 99 $ its new if its a box of parts il assemble it better than they can its getting ripping blade on a 29 inch bar thats attached to mill i got mantle orders to fill live edge is on fire so i dont burn it
I just bought two Hulzfforma saws, a 372XP and a MS660, the 372 ran for about 20 minutes and stopped, the 660 started once, and now I cant get it to fire at all. Two paper weights.
Weird if Farmertec ends up buying Stihl...they're probably outselling them 1000 to 1 * seems that you hold Farmertec in high regard for producing a decent quality chainsaw at a "very" reasonable price point...you're not alone
Looks like you are in pretty tight with Farmertec and give them feed back, Could you maybe put a bug (so to say) in their ear to possibly produce a Husqvarna 570, 575, 576 series of saws and/or a complete line of replacement parts instead of the few they now how ? I've tried but with no response.
To many company's in china already making the parts for the 570 575 saws. They are very cheap. And thank god they are, because the 570 and 575 are two of the worst saws ever sold by husqvarna. Might as well keep extra parts on hand. Or buy 570 cheap and install new 575 cylinder and piston.
The content and background are appreciated. A few questions though: 1:Are these aftermarket manufacturers in china peddling their product as stihl counterfeits or are they transparent about it not being OEM? 2: are the chinese made knock off products made using expired patents or some kind of licensing process or is it just a criminal operation based on blatant intellectual property theft? 3: many of the farmertec products are copies of products no longer available. The OEM phased out those models because they didn't meet EPA emissions requirements. How are the clones getting a free pass on emissions? Anyone with factual insight, please clarify if able.
I am frustrated by, and avoid all counterfeit products. The Chinese clone saws (ie Farmertek/Holzfforma) that I have, are clearly marketed as Stihl-compatible clones and not counterfeits. I have no problem with that. They are made from expired patents. (Though I am fully aware that there is a lot of past/present foreign industrial espionage occurring)
Yeah bro he said he bought a whole container 😂 I'm joking idk if he still does, I found 1 on ebay a few months ago for $260 shipped. (The orange/Grey one) most was over $300. Mine did have a fuel leak at the elbow at the top of the tank.$15 of still parts fixed it. For the price it's a beast, just no idea how long it will last.
I was at Canton Fair in China when I first met them. I was originally over in China buying some left over Caterpillar parts from the factory over there. I saw some of the Chainsaw parts booths, and we have been friends ever sense.
@@rockymountainchainsaw I wish they'd make jonsered clones I have the 2077 turbos and the 2083 turbo and I have a bear of a time finding parts and have had for awhile and now that they no longer make jonsered chainsaws it's even harder to get parts
I aways had husky saws but the new ones a junk 562 and the 572 and didn't not last long and I had enough that I will buy a cloned saw next time witch is soon
Thank you, How would a person get in contact with you about spare parts? Do you have a Farmertec reseller/distributor for a person to by a complete saw or a kit saw? Thank you for sharing your experiences.
Happens all the time. Stihl and OEM Husqvarna always have part numbers stamped into the part. The Chinese made parts never have part numbers on anything.
To me any American or Canadian citizen should have a real problem with supporting Chinese businesses and manufacturers. If you favor doing that you should consider possibly moving there and supporting them to your fullest potential.
I don't know if you ever noticed but I noticed 30 years ago when I was a child EVERYTHING is made in China. Where is that phone or computer you made that post with made at? For example😂
Why create a new wheel that already has proven itself reliable! Buy quality tools the first time! I couldnt support any product made outside our alliance countries and would rather have everything made in America. What a mess our government has put us in. Embarassing.. Work hard...save your money and buy quality....period.
You've discovered the same thing I did in that they come with their issues to be resolved. They are a work in progress, so I hope you have a working saw while you're working on the Farmertec.
I believe the difference is modular vs integral design. However, stihl has pushed from as much integral design. They have a lot of cheaper modular saws that aren’t worth their weight.
the difference is one company steals designs while the other puts millions into R&D. However these are all old designs and Stihl and Husky have more advanced current products. The problem is consumers buy cheap throw away single use items that they throw away. At some point the world will realize we need to build quality items that last vs single use. The other issue is first world companies need to stop charging an arm and a leg for products. Catch 22.
@@machaf Problem polega na czymś innym. Firmy w produkty wsadzają programy, które po pewnym czasie blokują ich ziałanie i produkt jest do wyrzucenia, gdyż musisz kupić inny, nowy produkt danej firmy. Tak jest z produktami zawierającymi elektronikę. Pralki, lodówki, zmywarki, TV, piły sterowane elektronicznie i wiele innych.
How do you explain models that no one else even has parts for? Farmertec is the only place that you can buy ALL the parts, or a complete kit, or a complete clone ms200t? This comment is in response to them being only a trading agent.
to each their own...if you are willing to put up with the component failures of the china saw, having the mechanical ability to troubleshoot, fix and perhaps increase your investment by substituting OEM saw parts then maybe it is worth the gamble. For the occasional sawyer that has just this clone I think it is a bad idea. It is one thing to have critical need to clear downed trees or travel distance into back country to cut firewood and have backup saws including some name brand that are reliable and quite another to have just the clone and find it craps on you when needed most. Yeah I read all the comments and hundreds more across you tube channels and many have experienced, by their report, excellent service life from the clones. But when you have knowledge of the many, many deficiencies...starting with piston fit, cylinder finish as the most important...then you begin to realize the builtin increased odds of failure in the clones. Maybe you get a really good one...maybe not... but you can never get away from the lingering uncertainty of the clones reliability and durability.
Is everyone just going to ignore how much dirt had gotten past the filter!? That cheap 066 copy won’t be running long with a faulty fitting air filter or whatever is going on there
That's what I usually say. Sometimes you get lucky and the thing works as well as OEM and lasts almost as long. My friend has a 372xp clone and uses it daily just about for tree work. Runs good so far, has only had it a few months so time will tell. Hell, a piston and jug is pennies to rebuild. I hate shitty tools as much as the next guy but theres something to be said for these things. Especially when the OEM is moving to more and more Chinese parts anyway, and sometimes are unavailable.
Here's an Economics awakening. You cannot compete with "slave" labor - China pays 50cents/hr. (likely much less); USA pays $15 - $25/hr.w/benifits. At 1000 employees, China saves about $100,000/day and about $30 million a year and another $30 mil. for no benifits & cheap parts. Stihl & Husky use China parts too and can cut their prices in half and still make good profits. The real problem is Americans WANT cheep prices over quality. It will be interesting/shocking to watch artificial intelligence and robots proliferate.
Farmertec was not selling kits here when you said and the blue saws and such came much later, I saw none on your table. They did sell parts in bulk but kits were overseas only. The owner used to send his card to the VIPs in the saw kits. Their weakness is the chinese "good enough" attitude. A note, the part#s on Stihls many of them are internal #s and don't show up when you search, internally they refer to another part number, but your correct the parts are easy to tell apart. Guys way back bought all the farmertec parts separately and assembled them and tried to get over on people on craigslist and ebay. The kit story was very interesting to guys that want to save money but post covid saving money is real hard if not impossible. Lots of forum posts on the kits. Funny thing is there are now knockoffs of the knockoffs. Project farm did a video recently on a farmertec knockoff
For those saying they are rip offs , they are not really, they are clones of older saws no longer produced. The patents have either expired or they have bought the old designs from Stihl or Husqvarna. They are essentially the same saw with cheaper quality parts and often poorer tolerences or finish. All parts are however interchangeable which is handy for those of us with older machines. Granted squish bands are often greater, nikasil coatings probably thinner, have more flashing etc but the parts have improved and they do usually work very well
I built the ms 660 farmertec kit and it was AMAZING!!! I had it on an Alaskan mill with a 4' bar. I had to sell it years ago and now plan on getting another to slab again.
We appreciate your honesty brother. As in all consumables goods ,you get what you pay for. Thanks for the content
Awesome video... I use a lot of the holzfforma products! I'm able to completely work on them so a rebuild for me is an afternoon of good times. However, I agree if a guy is not able to work on them probably not the saw for them. However, it's a awesome option for when I have a customer come in that can't afford a OEM rebuild. Also, the clone saws allowed me to take my self to chainsaw school by working on and modification of them without the OEM price.
Thanks for the video sir
Very informative video my Dad was a Stihl man and so am I. They do this with soda pop to you go buy a pack of them and the bottles are thin but go to a gas station and get a single one and the bottles are a harder plastic and I can tell the difference in taste also yet there is so many knock off things out there.
I got a scam by somebody where I bought a farmer tech a 660 and I thought it was a Stihl 660. When they put OEM bars and chains on these they really do look like stihl saws. But I've actually loved the farmer tech saw.
What did you pay for it? Shady business by whoever sold it to you if they didn't state it was a clone saw.
I just ordered a proyama 68cc saw comes with 20 and 24 bar. With a 3 year warranty under $300 on Amazon. I just need it for some trees around my house had a few fall during the last hurricane and my cordless 14" saw isn't going to do it.
I have looked for this video for years. It wouldnt pull up in search. This video got me into the chinese saw industry, im very very deep in it now, way deeper than farmertec and holtzfforma/hutzle.....i can provide some amazing saws....im literally on a daily contact with factory owners who make amazing incredible saws, like with OEM factory parts, no joke. The big saw companies contract secretly with non-disclosure agreements, nearly everything is chinese made....i dont know exact parts but there are three contracted factories and i know cylinders are chinese now.....maybe still brazillian too but not the "Molly" which is like mahale.
I follow ur stuff and I’ve subscribed to ur channel, these saws are good saws
You've peaked my interest. What have you got to recommend?
I run a blue gen 3 g660 as a cut down saw everyday. Runs and cuts amazing. My only problem with the farmertec is the carb always needs tuned. I have been running them for years. They are worth the money. I usually get about a year to a year and a half out of them before they lunch the top or bottom end. When that happens I throw it on the shelf and grab a new one and go back to work. Good running and cutting saw
How many hours of use or tanks would you say you get out of them in that year or year in a half?
Lemme just have one spare I'll trade ya a carving! What a beautiful collection
I'm a Stihl die hard fan, so I picked up a Stihl off market place that was burn't up and rebuilt it with farmertec rings and piston, it runs ok but I for my daily saws I would opt for OEM parts.
Most of those parts are really good, the Achilles heel of those parts are the carburetors. Get a walbro rebuild it and it should run just as good as a real sthil.
Thank you for such an informative video. You have made it all very clear and it makes perfect sense.
This is one of the better videos comparing the clones with the original. I have a had few Husqy saws and a couple Stihl saws. Both last for many years without trouble. Been wondering about a china clone tho. I might buy one for fun and video comparison one day when I have some extra money to blow on it. But for daily use I will stick with an original.
Why is there so much saw dust past the air filter?
Good video. I like that you were open and honest about what Farmertec offers and what you are getting when buying one. I thought about buying one a year ago, but I found a good used Stihl 026 for $100 and a 193t for $65. I'm not opposed to buying a China made saw if it will a trim a tree or help cut one down. I think Stihl is way overpriced and mfg's. like Echo offer a nice alternative for the arborist. I think for home owners Farmertec may be a nice alternative rather than spending a bunch of money on a saw you may only used a few times.
I have run a lot of saws In my life, and I agree with what you said. I own a lot of older Stihl saws that are great and have hundreds of hours on them. I have recently started buying Echo saws, as I believe their saws are the best bang for the buck at this point. There is no reason for your average non-pro to buy a Stihl anymore. Too expensive, they don’t want to work with you to warranty anything, and the quality isn’t as good as it once was.
True unless it's something you want to last or you want a warranty so yeah I like stihl and husqvarna there top dog for a reason there expensive because people will pay
StihL 660 con ko bạn
@@FreedomotorsportsLlc😊
Great review - appreciate your honesty too
Good video man ide like to add some of those older huskys for my collection
I'm very sorry but I can't totally agree with your assessment of these saws. I mean yes, certain parts can be inferior, but generally speaking once you've ironed out the kinks these saws last and perform just as well as the OEM saws, and even if you're unlucky and you trash an engine then so what! You can buy a pot, piston and crank ect for absolute peanuts direct from farmertec. For example I could literally rebuild a 375xp clone half a dozen times or more for the price of one original saw!! And they perform just as well in the woods. We've run these and original huskies and there's very little difference overall, the cut rate is pretty much identical, at least that's the case for the husky clones anyway.
To be honest apart from the price they make a lot more sense in other ways as well. Firstly they are based on older tech, the new saws now are more complicated and can be troublesome to deal with, sometimes requiring them to go in to be fixed by a dealer. Also there's plenty of people who experience issues such as poor hot starting, premature piston wear, overheating issues etc. All problems associated with engines that use a stratification engine design and autotune carbs. It's becoming almost impossible to buy a new professional grade saw now that doesn't use such tech, however buying a clone means that you still can.
Another perhaps overlooked aspect is that these saws aren't as valuable. Having a stable full of OEM huskies and stihls is a big investment, it's also an attractive proposition for anyone who want to steal them! This has happened to me a few times over the years. But now I'm not so worried, firstly they're not as likely to want to steal a load of Chinese knock offs! And even if they do it's no great loss by comparison. Actually I've started buying the all blue versions of these saws as they are even less attractive to any would be thief.
Regards
Dudé i enjoy reading your reply, so much true on every aspect
Your point really isn't valid....IMO
I understand what you're saying but why would you want to be inconvenienced with an inferior product and additional work to keep it running. ??
@@victormarinelli5660 In my experience there's actually very little difference between the OEM saws and the clones.....once you've gone through them and changed out the parts that are likely to be a problem.
In operation they perform and hold up just as well, and they're certainly not inferior once you take costs into consideration! Like I've said, these saws are older tech, there's nothing you can't fix yourself, and have it up and running again with minimal down time. Even if I had to do a full rebuild on one, it would only take a few hours and cost absolute peanuts to do, the saw would be back in the woods and working the same day! i.e. if I did the same with an OEM saw and used OEM parts to repair it how much extra work would I need to do to pay for that? So even in that equation they make more sense to me. I'm not into brand snobbery or preconceptions, I prefer to assess a product by how well it actually performs, and on that basis I think calling them inferior products is a tad inaccurate. They are simply project saws for someone who doesn't mind tinkering a little bit to get the best out of them. It's one of the reasons I was buying them in kit form and building them up myself, so I could check everything was good as it could be. Regards
But my time is worth more than this trash.
@@JimN_AustinTx Pay more then if you really think you'll get a better deal. But bear in mind you can have four or more of these saws for the same cost as one new OEM saw!
hell i got a hulzforma 372 xp i use it all the time work great i have had it for 3 years now.i use it for work and for firewood i never had mine to stop working.its payed for its self so many times. if mine stopped working trw i go buy me one again.
Yes I totally agree.
Glad I went with an OEM Husky. I went down the China knockoff path years ago on a generator. Nothing but a headache.
The 372xp clone is a great saw.
I have a generator from harbor freight the predator one. When they 1st came out. Must be over 10 years old by now. Still starts one pull and has never let me down.
I'm the "tree guy" or "chainsaw" guy for the small company I work for and was thinking of buying one of the ms660 clones for our bigger trees .
We're not a tree service , but I do alot of clearing for farms ....
Would it hold up?
I'm really looking into this saw and adding a few upgrades and or just replacing parts with stihl parts .
Would you recommend this saw for commercial use (light commercial) I'm tired of running small stihls (because that's what my boss buys) or his brother's husky 460 that just needs thrown in the river.
I’ve been running a g660 clone saw for over 2 years milling with it falling trees etc etc…for myself on our land but nevertheless it has hours & hours on it if hard use good bar/chain real stihl air filter rebuild the carb with genuine parts replaced the decompression valve and run it a little richer then my 562xp it sings everytime I genuinely have no complaints we run a 36 & 42” bar on it I’m by no means easy on it because I wanted it to break I wanted to be able to say it sucks but I can’t 😂 it runs!! & runs strong everytime
Overall they are very good. The rubber and plastic parts aren’t great but can easily be replaced with oem Stihl or Husky parts. You can save a ton of money on the large cc saws.
I bought and ran two 066. I had to put a OEM carb to get them to run, OEM handle bars and chain adjuster. They ran great until they blew up fairly quickly, maybe 200 mbf on each. I don’t buy them anymore.
Those orange and white chainsaws are awesome
the first one i got was the g888 and love it, the handle i had to change. The 395 you have to change the piston(slap) now a great saw. i have oem 394 and 395 and the jugs from hiyway are just as good to me.
I’d probally get a farmertech and then replace parts as they brake with stihl OEM and then if the motor ever gives out. I can then buy a real stihl and take the oem parts off farmer tech and use them as spares on the stihl. I feel this will be the cheapest long term option
A new engine, available for less than $100, might bolt right into it.
Great informative video, thanks. Any experience with the JonCutter 2500? I hear it's a good/small cutter especially for tree climbing at only about 3 kilos.
Will you sell the 500i shown in video?
Super random question. Any idea why are chainsaw engines like 1/3-1/4 the hp of a comparable sized dirtbike engine? Like whys a 125cc dirtbike 35+ hp and a 881 is only 8ish, is just the increased weight of the rotating mass in the engine?
It’s mainly because of the exhaust, an expansion chamber adds a MASSIVE amount of power to a 2 stroke engine, it’s pretty much the equivalent of a supercharger.
dirtbikes are reed valve engines not piston port and they have tuned pipes with expansion chambers not can mufflers
Don't forget those dirt bikes are also water cooled so you can run more compression and rpm to make that power. As everyone else said also have that expansion chamber, reed vales and bigger flywheel to help with low end torque.
Dirt bikes aren't wide open 95%of the time like chainsaws they got to deal with turns and jumps... also as mentioned the water cooling part.
Where do you get 35hp from? At the crank? I been away from mx bikes a while I know my 250 makes 49ish to the wheel, pretty sure 125's was around 30hp.. if that.
oh,man , you are showing off, but I love it
Good video I am interested in buying equipment from China but disagree with companies like farmertec just ripping off Stihl etc. However I think the Farmertec Holzforma is a good idea for most people. Have you ever had any dealings with Gezhi equipment? They do a range of equipment that I'm interested in as a landscaper. TIA if anyone has experience with the brand.
That sounds good until you realize stihl is ripping you off.
Let's be fair here. Though the country is well-known for it's industrial espionage, it is fully legal and moral for Farmertec to build/sell these saws using expired monopolized US/German patents. The fact that they can build, ship, and sell them back to us for so much cheaper may say more about us than they? There is no dispute about their sub-standard quality, but every consumer product has a balance between quality .vs cost. We each must determine our own break-even point for our individual use. In the past decade many import products have increased in quality while many locally produced products have decreased in quality while exponentially increasing in cost. I own many OEM orange saws, but also purchase and use clones when the crossover error rate favors it.
Is neotech the same? I've also seen that you can get saw that comes with brand name parts like a Walbro carburettor, spark plugs and more, how much does this improve the saw and is it worth paying the bit extra to get the upgrades
Yes the performance model isn't much more and it's the way to go. They have the good carb ngk plug etc.
I just bought the cheapest ms 660 clone I could find knowing all the clones are Chinese. My plan is to replace broken parts with oem. Unless it get out of hand and I'll throw it in the dumpster.
I did put a oem stihl 25" bar and chain on it. I can always sell that and it hold value pretty good. I got $400 in my g660.
THATS A GOOD LOOKING TRAILER !
Do you think a Farmertec would work for a part time chain saw mill?
Yeah that is what I use.
Heck if you would sell a farmertec 660 whole I’d like to know a price I might buy one to try out in wood cutting thxs in advance…
You can buy them on Amazon. Or buy the powerhead + bar + chain on Amazon.
I have an 024 av wood boss I am wanting to put a 44.7 mm cylinder and piston in it do I also need to change crankshaft
Ive got a neo tec 872 its a clone of a 381 Stihl fairly descent saw for the price
i had all my jonsered chainsaws stolen from me once wish i could find them again. how do you feel about makita?
That's what I run for chainsaws is jonsered I've got the 2077 and 2083 turbos good saws I really like mine
I own a small tree company do you recommend we use our Stihl chainsaw every day. Will thay handle like the Stihl?
If you smash stihls alot.. yeah 100%😂
So would it be a no for Farmertec for an Alaskan chainsaw mill?
There are several folks on FB running them in mills. Just know going in they may not live as long as the OEM.
Considering a ms661 is 1500 and an ms881 2200 a clone 660 for 500 or 880 for 800 is less than half the price.
If it smokes a cylinder in the 1st season opt for a high quality or even OEM replacement cylinder and piston and keep on moving.
I got a 660 clone and put a 25" stihl bar and chain on it for $400. Maybe they just sold it cheap because they knew it was leaking fuel. ($15 for the Stihl tank elbow and fuel line to the carb) fixed it.
Get them to clone the Makita/Dolmar 6401 to 7900 series.
There is a HUGE following for them and Makita will be stopping support for them
Wow....thanks for the info. That is a good idea.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw they are great saws, slight downfall has been cost of parts.
I've offered it as suggestion in the Farmertec group to Manny and others, but it sounds like you have the strongest relationship stateside with them.
@Rocky Mountain Chainsaw and the "g" option for the 070/090 platform.
As well as the 090 clutch.
I'd love to have an 090g clone to run a huge bar for milling monster logs
The parts are interchangeable, yes, but inferior quality. The metal is soft, the plastic gets brittle and they don’t last. The blue ones were pretty, though, and cheap, but they don’t last especially if you put oem on them.
I asked this on another video too... But if they are clones... then why do they specify a different fuel mixture/ratio from the OEM ones? I.e. I know a Husq 372xp uses 50:1 fuel, but all these Holz saws specify 25:1 in their documentation... And 25:1 is pretty extreme for a fuel mix no? What fuel mix ratio do you actually run in them?
Out side USA husqvarna calls for 33 to 1 oil mix. Guess oil mix depends on EPA requirements .I run 40 to 1 in ever thing. Never seen a 2 cycle engine last long on 50 to 1 mix.
All my saws run 50:1 u have to tune your saws or any 2-cycle engines to fuel mixture unless u have an auto tuner & then u have to run it through their specific tuning process.
Also u have to tune chainsaws to the size bar & ANY engine mod esp advanced timing, head & exhaust porting.
If you're not mechanically inclined these after market saws are far more forgiving, cost effective, & use OEM parts from original manufacturer.
25:1 is bogus because your engine will build way too much heat. I use VP full synthetic at a 40:1 ratio and adjust the high jet so that it four strokes when I let up in the cut. That way it's slightly rich and you'll never score a piston and cylinder a bit rich, but lean is trouble.
@@yungsmile7546 you obviously don't know what you're talking about. 25:1 is richer that 50:1. Don't give advice you don't know what you're talking about. Lol you made me chuckle when you said 4 stroking. Come on man.
@@ajcutler3472 four stroking is a term used to describe what happens when the high-speed jet is backed out too far. I know because that is the term used by factory technicians, and I was a Stihl tech for a long time.
Dam that 372 was 385 hp ! Thats insane ! Lol
i just bought a blue one for 99 $ its new if its a box of parts il assemble it better than they can its getting ripping blade on a 29 inch bar thats attached to mill i got mantle orders to fill live edge is on fire so i dont burn it
Billy Ray says there not a good saw that he used one and it failed in one of his videos.what do u think about this.
Billy Ray is a hack.
I just bought two Hulzfforma saws, a 372XP and a MS660, the 372 ran for about 20 minutes and stopped, the 660 started once, and now I cant get it to fire at all. Two paper weights.
BS
Haha
Napisz co wlałeś do zbiornika paliwa? Czy mieszanką oleju z paliwem czy samo paliwo? Może sam olej??
Weird if Farmertec ends up buying Stihl...they're probably outselling them 1000 to 1
* seems that you hold Farmertec in high regard for producing a decent quality chainsaw at a "very" reasonable price point...you're not alone
If it happens it's because they priced themselves out of business. Idk about you but $1500+ is absolutely ridiculous for any chainsaw.
Looks like you are in pretty tight with Farmertec and give them feed back, Could you maybe put a bug (so to say) in their ear to possibly produce a Husqvarna 570, 575, 576 series of saws and/or a complete line of replacement parts instead of the few they now how ?
I've tried but with no response.
To many company's in china already making the parts for the 570 575 saws. They are very cheap. And thank god they are, because the 570 and 575 are two of the worst saws ever sold by husqvarna. Might as well keep extra parts on hand. Or buy 570 cheap and install new 575 cylinder and piston.
“You get what you pay for!”
The content and background are appreciated. A few questions though:
1:Are these aftermarket manufacturers in china peddling their product as stihl counterfeits or are they transparent about it not being OEM?
2: are the chinese made knock off products made using expired patents or some kind of licensing process or is it just a criminal operation based on blatant intellectual property theft?
3: many of the farmertec products are copies of products no longer available. The OEM phased out those models because they didn't meet EPA emissions requirements. How are the clones getting a free pass on emissions?
Anyone with factual insight, please clarify if able.
I am frustrated by, and avoid all counterfeit products. The Chinese clone saws (ie Farmertek/Holzfforma) that I have, are clearly marketed as Stihl-compatible clones and not counterfeits. I have no problem with that. They are made from expired patents. (Though I am fully aware that there is a lot of past/present foreign industrial espionage occurring)
And I've been using the 372xp models beating the crap out of them, daily use
If you want the truth and honest opinion from a small engine business owner. Your better off with a poulan than a farmertec
No
why are they blue now. Are they trying to stand out or was it a legal thing.
You can get the original orange and white or the blue and white.
Do you sell the 660
Yeah bro he said he bought a whole container 😂 I'm joking idk if he still does, I found 1 on ebay a few months ago for $260 shipped. (The orange/Grey one) most was over $300. Mine did have a fuel leak at the elbow at the top of the tank.$15 of still parts fixed it. For the price it's a beast, just no idea how long it will last.
In the video he said he just sold parts then... that was 3 years ago.
Hy where i can buy a this price ?
how much are them china saws
\
How did you first get involved with farmertec?
I was at Canton Fair in China when I first met them. I was originally over in China buying some left over Caterpillar parts from the factory over there. I saw some of the Chainsaw parts booths, and we have been friends ever sense.
@@rockymountainchainsaw I wish they'd make jonsered clones I have the 2077 turbos and the 2083 turbo and I have a bear of a time finding parts and have had for awhile and now that they no longer make jonsered chainsaws it's even harder to get parts
I aways had husky saws but the new ones a junk 562 and the 572 and didn't not last long and I had enough that I will buy a cloned saw next time witch is soon
What happened? Seems I hear of husqvarna having more issues everyday.
there was MORE dust behind the filter then on it... HOW is that possible... Thats nuts... ive never seen anything like that....
I have two 660s and a 881 they run good, ran them hot for hours
What are you doing with that bunch of old saws? 😅
Thank you,
How would a person get in contact with you about spare parts?
Do you have a Farmertec reseller/distributor for a person to by a complete saw or a kit saw?
Thank you for sharing your experiences.
I can say China looking out for us with these cheap 660 saws. Thank you China.
Is Farmertec and Neotec the same company! Good video, thanks!!!
Id be pretty mad buying a Husky or Stihl that's had many of its OEM parts swapped to farmer tec and I wasn't aware of it.
Happens all the time. Stihl and OEM Husqvarna always have part numbers stamped into the part. The Chinese made parts never have part numbers on anything.
To me any American or Canadian citizen should have a real problem with supporting Chinese businesses and manufacturers. If you favor doing that you should consider possibly moving there and supporting them to your fullest potential.
I don't know if you ever noticed but I noticed 30 years ago when I was a child EVERYTHING is made in China.
Where is that phone or computer you made that post with made at? For example😂
Can you get a 462 stihl clone
Great honest info thanks
All you need to do to any of the Holzfforma saws is add a ported muffler & a tank guard
Do you have a complete farmertech ms250 engine
Yes I do please email Snowxparts@gmail.com
Why create a new wheel that already has proven itself reliable! Buy quality tools the first time! I couldnt support any product made outside our alliance countries and would rather have everything made in America. What a mess our government has put us in. Embarassing.. Work hard...save your money and buy quality....period.
My oil ports only line up half way with hole. New g660 and 25 in bar hollzfarma, leaks oil at motor but doesn't oil chain.
You've discovered the same thing I did in that they come with their issues to be resolved. They are a work in progress, so I hope you have a working saw while you're working on the Farmertec.
If it makes you feel any better my brand new stihl ms 271 does the same thing lol
A g888 would be nice.
máy này bán sao ở Việt Nam mua nổi
👍👍👍 Great information!!
I believe the difference is modular vs integral design. However, stihl has pushed from as much integral design. They have a lot of cheaper modular saws that aren’t worth their weight.
the difference is one company steals designs while the other puts millions into R&D. However these are all old designs and Stihl and Husky have more advanced current products. The problem is consumers buy cheap throw away single use items that they throw away. At some point the world will realize we need to build quality items that last vs single use. The other issue is first world companies need to stop charging an arm and a leg for products. Catch 22.
1113, 1115, 1117, 1118, 1119, 1121, 1122, 1128. All Stihl families of saws that were more or less modular, and all were commercial saws.
@@machaf Problem polega na czymś innym. Firmy w produkty wsadzają programy, które po pewnym czasie blokują ich ziałanie i produkt jest do wyrzucenia, gdyż musisz kupić inny, nowy produkt danej firmy. Tak jest z produktami zawierającymi elektronikę. Pralki, lodówki, zmywarki, TV, piły sterowane elektronicznie i wiele innych.
How do you explain models that no one else even has parts for?
Farmertec is the only place that you can buy ALL the parts, or a complete kit, or a complete clone ms200t?
This comment is in response to them being only a trading agent.
can i buy you a farmetec !?
New sub here love this type of content
to each their own...if you are willing to put up with the component failures of the china saw, having the mechanical ability to troubleshoot, fix and perhaps increase your investment by substituting OEM saw parts then maybe it is worth the gamble. For the occasional sawyer that has just this clone I think it is a bad idea. It is one thing to have critical need to clear downed trees or travel distance into back country to cut firewood and have backup saws including some name brand that are reliable and quite another to have just the clone and find it craps on you when needed most. Yeah I read all the comments and hundreds more across you tube channels and many have experienced, by their report, excellent service life from the clones. But when you have knowledge of the many, many deficiencies...starting with piston fit, cylinder finish as the most important...then you begin to realize the builtin increased odds of failure in the clones. Maybe you get a really good one...maybe not... but you can never get away from the lingering uncertainty of the clones reliability and durability.
I’m looking for a real O 44 or MS 440
You ever find 1? Ebay is your friend. Lol
Take s close look at that 660. It's sucking dirt thru the air filter!
I've seen a few people recommend stihl gas and oil filters for them. I'm going to order a stihl filter tonight😂
@ 1 min that saw had a lot of dust inside the intake.
Thanks for the vid. But
Chuck Finia!
So farmertec is like Harley Davidson
Lol...that is one way to put it. Very well said.
I’m about to order one of these if you are selling pm me.
Email Snowxparts@gmail.com
Máy tốt quá a ơi.
Tăng mình 1 cái được không
Got any Rolexes? 🤣
Thx for the info. I’m out on the China crap
Can I have a couple
Is everyone just going to ignore how much dirt had gotten past the filter!? That cheap 066 copy won’t be running long with a faulty fitting air filter or whatever is going on there
They don’t run very long anyways
How long do they run?@@HubertofLiege
Kup filtr OEM lub zamiennik za 3$ z metalową górną pokrywą. Te są lepsze.
Thanks for vid
Give me one stihl 440
Kind of sickening watching middle america race to the bottom.
Well known fact Chinesium is weaker than badly made Pastry you get what you pay for is a very true saying
😂😂😂😂! I love that comment. Chinesium! Very funny, but oh so true.
That's what I usually say. Sometimes you get lucky and the thing works as well as OEM and lasts almost as long. My friend has a 372xp clone and uses it daily just about for tree work. Runs good so far, has only had it a few months so time will tell. Hell, a piston and jug is pennies to rebuild. I hate shitty tools as much as the next guy but theres something to be said for these things. Especially when the OEM is moving to more and more Chinese parts anyway, and sometimes are unavailable.
@@ctdieselnut how's it holding up?
U still got that 2101 husqvarna
Here's an Economics awakening.
You cannot compete with "slave" labor - China pays 50cents/hr. (likely much less); USA pays $15 - $25/hr.w/benifits. At 1000 employees, China saves about $100,000/day and about $30 million a year and another $30 mil. for no benifits & cheap parts. Stihl & Husky use China parts too and can cut their prices in half and still make good profits. The real problem is Americans WANT cheep prices over quality. It will be interesting/shocking to watch artificial intelligence and robots proliferate.
Mane lol send/sale me a few THATS burned or something lol
Farmertec was not selling kits here when you said and the blue saws and such came much later, I saw none on your table. They did sell parts in bulk but kits were overseas only. The owner used to send his card to the VIPs in the saw kits. Their weakness is the chinese "good enough" attitude. A note, the part#s on Stihls many of them are internal #s and don't show up when you search, internally they refer to another part number, but your correct the parts are easy to tell apart. Guys way back bought all the farmertec parts separately and assembled them and tried to get over on people on craigslist and ebay. The kit story was very interesting to guys that want to save money but post covid saving money is real hard if not impossible. Lots of forum posts on the kits. Funny thing is there are now knockoffs of the knockoffs. Project farm did a video recently on a farmertec knockoff
Can I have one