The Restrictor Plate Controversy - May 1988
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- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- One year after Bobby Allison's terrifying wreck at Talladega, ESPN produced this neat segment on the introduction of the restrictor plate - and driver's reactions to it - during the opening stages of the 1988 Winston 500.
Back when NASCAR drivers could voice their opinion without being fined
No they still got fined
@@jdsedberry3074 A lot more too.
@Nicole M I can throw a football so I am a NFL QB.
@Nicole M why are you watching lol
Exactly now they are afraid to even speak
80s nascar looked the coolest
That’s when it was really starting to takeoff late 80s through the 90s and then died mid 2000s now the grand stands are gone and so are the sponsors lol too many rules too many regulations too scared to hurt somebody’s feelings... I’m not saying the drivers shouldn’t be safe but when you crawl in to that cockpit you know what you’re getting into.
If you think 80's nascar was cool watch some group b rally footage🤣 shit was fucking crazy! They were also required restrictor plates and smaller engines but they would over bore and stroke them and fill the cylinders with cigarette buts so it would pass the displacement inspection. The engines would start the buts would burn and 900hp twin turbo v6 would be blasting through the trees
Rules ruin everything, in daily life, in sports, in motorsports. Rules absolutely, unequivocally destroy every. single. thing.
At that point it had to reached perfection, so in true nascar style... they changed everything 🤦♂️🤦♀️🤦
It was better when there were more manufacturers competing.
Imagine tuning the engine and then slapping a restrictor plate on... depressing
Clearly you've never watched a day of motorsport, if your complaining about that.
donkey ass reviews and do's imagine making millions just turning left
Wouldn’t u have to tune it so it’ll run with one?
Nothing keeping you from making your own for dyno tuning.
@donkey ass reviews and do's 20 bucks says you'd shit your pants at 150mph max. That is if you could even get the car off of pit road.
Immagine if they made a new rule after every Isle of Mann TT accident.
Brian Morrison all racers only allowed to use 10 kph scooters
We race like real men. We die like real men.
Killing 50 fans in 3 seconds probably more of an issue here.
E bicycle
NC_29 North exactly
Roof flaps finally fixed the issue. Keep the out-of-control cars from getting airborne, and you've done much more to keep them safe than simply slowing them down.
LackThere0f No they didn't fix the issue. Just ask Carl Edwards or Austin Dillon. Who both flew into catch fences with restrictor plates and roof flaps
@@speedy_j9368 yea but those were those stupid ass COT and that dumbass wing, that anybody with half a brain would have seen from the get go, would provide lift if they got turned around backwards.
SGTJDerek Dillion's car was this current gen car, not a COT
Larson also got into the fence at Daytona in a NNS race on Saturday and that also wasn't a COT Car
@@JameyCampbell_54 both run on the COT chassis, so your point is invalid. However both examples you provided have nothing to do with the cars lifting on their own so it doesn't matter anyways.
The change to absorption barrier wall, mandatory full face helmet was the biggest improvement, decades after Smokey tried to get France yo adopt it, to the loss of DE to get it done and the HANS, but now the current France has f*does the whole show on his own.
Ken Schrader was freaking profetic back then: "The plate ate it all up. Made us all the same speed and probably makes it more dangerous than when we were running 210".
Yep, cars getting into the fence now is pretty commonplace, before it was rare.
I know that's right...
Even worse now with the serious reduction in power. Just fucking unleash the cars and let the R&D teams run wild.
@Your President you showed your age with that meme
Warden Freeman You showed yours as well buddy
@@RATD0GG I'm 19 lmao
Let's keep everyone going about the same speed so that the drivers will have to take higher risk maneuvers, and ballsy intimidation methods that creates more accidents, injuries, and deaths than previous unregulated systems. Fuckin genius!
Herr Denker last death in nascar was in 2009
Doesn't matter if it's a smaller series. ALL events covered by Nascar are Nascar races. The main 3 are the most well known because they're the only ones nationally televised.
008 rip nobody has died in nascar since 29001 with dale get your facts straight
"Doesn't matter if it's a smaller series. ALL events covered by Nascar are Nascar races."
That may be technically true, but it's irrelevant to the discussion given that the original comment was asserting that restrictor plates result in more deaths. NASCAR's top three divisions are the only ones to run on superspeedways.
Nascar is so gay n pc # world of outlaws ftw
"I think it limited my driving abilities" - the greatest restrictor plate racer on restrictor plate racing
Cue "calm before the storm" from FFX
We need to bring this kinda racing back! No res plate, no fines for speaking your mind, no bull shit. Just race and fight for that #1!
Y'all just gonna act like that background music ain't the real star of this show?
The great irony is that the fans are in more danger statistically on their way to and from the gig!
We all learned that it was the car aerodynamics was the reason why the cars kept getting airbourne. In 1994 the Fooflaps practically elimated 80% of cars flipping. Now with the side plate on the rear window and trunk, it should take it to 85-90%.
Andrew Hayes
Then the got wings so that when you went backwards, you'd take off! lol
FOOFflaps
They killed nascar one step at a time. It's finally dead
No that’s when they decided to go ahead with V6’s.
It's dead? What am I watching on TV right now then?
@@RippingItAllSportsCards it aint nascar
@@spence7985 It was. And they are going to race 312 miles today like they always have at ISM. And next week they will race 400 miles like they always have at Homestead.
Things change, welcome to sports. Welcome to technology. Can't be the 80s forever.
@@RippingItAllSportsCards u dont see nfl having 3 winners in a game. u dont see mlb having 3 winners in a game. and you sure as hell dont see nfl and mlb change how the champion is crowned 50 years into the sport. thats why their still alive and nascar is in the shitter
hell take the plates off and do like indycar did at most of the ovals, don't allow anyone to sit too close to the fence
good idea
As dead as nascar is today they could take em off and move everyone to the upper half
Earnhardt complained about the plates initially, but he would definitely change his tune later on, since he would win a lot of races on "restrictor plate" tracks for the rest of his career.
+brtshstel Especially Talladega. Heck, he even won the Daytona 500 as a restrictor plate race.
+nascarfanatic2425 Well considering the rule was made in 19 *88* and Sr. didn't win at Daytona until 19 *98* I'd say we have a clear cut case of "Thanks Captian Fucking Obvious", how would we know these things without you pointing them out.
+brtshstel
Just because he won doesn't mean anything. He never liked restrictor plate racing.
Instead of restrictor plates, they should have left the horse power alone and changed aerodynamics so they didn't get as much downforce. With the horsepower, they could still pass (which was the biggest complaint), but without the downforce, they would never be able to reach the 200+ mile-per-hour speeds, which was the whole point.
Slyguy threeonetwonine His first win at Daytona was the 1990 Pepsi 400
True, my team bought one of his engines and it is one of our best, codename: 911
Nothing will beat the sound of a pre 2008 restrictor plate, x-pipe exhaust with a boomtube, it's just magic 👍
"Cuban inches"
Anyone else catch that ?
Dick Beatty
Cuban inches are when you have a 57 Chevy powered by a Soviet tank engine.
@@boataxe4605 lmao
Yep, and then I looked for this comment
I think he's saying 'cubit' with a silent 'T'.. Although its not silent..
What a blast from the past. Thanks for posting this.
Dale sr “it limited my driving abilities” also being the best super speedway racer of all time.
tAmEz ZoDiAc he died because of it
roccotaco87 yeah I mean most likely wouldn’t of died if they didn’t restrict the engines cause they wouldn’t of been racing like that so I agree.
@@roccotaco87 he died due to not having a hans device
@@tashawegmueller1866 No, the moron wouldn't change his lap belt like Mr. Simpson told him to do. He was told that it was going to tear and the arrogant Dale Sr. didn't listen and died because of it. A HANS would not have mattered.
Wrong. Richard Petty Seven Daytona 500 wins, Dale Sr., One. Lol. Best? Not even close.
I remember watching my grandparents passively watch nascar on a Sunday afternoon on an old glass screen TV set that weighed a ton.
NASCAR still uses restrictor plates for one reason & one reason only. Insurance purposes. As Petty said in this video “it looks good on paper.” If speed was truly an issue then a series such as Indy Cars would greatly be affected in the speed category of things as well (since they run well over 210mph on oval tracks). It’s a way to keep their costs down.
indy cars arent shaped like an airfoil
Yeah indy cars are pushed into the track more than NASCARs.
3500 lb machine vs something that is almost half that weight and when it goes airborne, you can picture the rest. I don't like plate racing anymore than the next person but the last thing you want is something going over the fence and killing people.
Your exactly right. The cost of liability insurance for nascar and the tracks was skyrocketing...newr policies had riders in them that increased the premiums if qualifying speeds exceeded certain speeds. Thats why the original goal was to be under 200mph
Indycar has gotten slower than in the past
Should've just gone with a smaller small block engine and smaller carburetor. Would've been a whole lot better and still get the slingshots and keep cars spaced out.
How does the smaller combo do that while the restrictor plate doesn't?
@@Catcrumbs 3:43 this guy nails it.
@@Catcrumbs still can tune it to be faster than another car instead of them all making the same at more hp
While it create a number of new problems... Taking it off now isnt an option either... Rusty wallace did a tire test for goodyear in either 03 or 04... And on an open track at talledega they removed the plate... Unoficial times measured laps at around 238 mile per hour average... This test ended after 4 laps at speed... Rusty came in feeling a vibration... The vibration was the right front peeled to the cords in 4 laps....
who would have thought C.I. actually stands for Cuban Inches...
Ryan Winkelman I thought it was Canadian inches..
Ernie Elliott is what caused restrictor plate racing,his engine that brother Bill qualified at 212 mph at Talladega is why they came up with the plates in my opinion.
It wasn't just the engine. They built the car smaller to cut wind resistance. It was like shoving that engine into a Ford Escort.
Nice shot of my favorite driver at 5:04 - #55 Phil Parsons won this race for his sole career Cup victory.
We gonna make it safer by having everyone run the same speed. 🤦♂️
20+ years later they STILL haven't figured out just how ignorant they (plates) are.
They don't use plates anymore.....
@@forresthodge1024 no they don't but the concept of what they do now is the same.
@@SGTJDerek They're just making it safe.
I always liked how sealing the windows up actually made them faster, awe NASCAR 😅
This was a scape goat. The real reason is because of what Bill Elliott was doing to the field back then. Look AL football had the scholarships limit, the Yankees got the salary cap, and Bill Elliott got the restrictor plate. Not in that order.
How did UA-cam Know I needed to watch this 10 yr old documentary ?
This is the moment when they killed Nascar and it was never the same after restrictor plates was made mandatory
Its kind of weird how the replay of Petty's crash at Daytona was always split into two segments, even though there was a clear camera angle showing his car blowing over in the wind flying across the track and rolling against the catch fence as we know now. Did they deliberately cover that up back then to justify their changes as completely successful?
That triangular mustache is mind blowing.
Classic example of unintended consequences
Seeing that restrictor plate on the engine is so cursed
I sure miss Larry Nuber (he is narrating), he was a great voice for motorsports much in the same way the great Ken Squire, not playing any favorites but making all entries sound equally important.
Seeing Schrader flip once compared to how they flip now makes me wonder where they went wrong.
Anytime air gets under the car, it spells trouble (depending on the cars 'angle of attack') at high speeds
4:01 did he just say Cuban Inches?
This is almost 10 years before my time but damn the glory days of Nascar
Although initially and primarily designed for safety, the restrictor-plate is also one of the best competition enhancing inventions in NASCAR's history. For 4 out of the 36 official races in the Cup season, we fans get to see the closest, most competitive, pack draft racing there is, with up to 30 cars running within a second of the leader.
Followed by an extremely safe Big One where cars will fly in the air and half the field will get totaled.
I know there are people like David Land for example who despise packed racing. He's made two videos on this.
ua-cam.com/video/dXoiVR3P3NA/v-deo.html&t
ua-cam.com/video/1spNGbpEZR4/v-deo.html
You wouldn't realize it but those flaps they have now really make a difference. as far as cars keeping the cars on the ground when spinning.
When the big plate was made mandatory you could supply your own gaskets. If you chamfered the 4 holes you picked up 20 hp on the dyno. I worked in NASCAR for over 15 years building engines. Always cheating going on we had nitrous for qualifying at Daytona. It sprayed through a pop to rivit on the fire wall. Another we had a hydraulic controlled rear spoiler for Daytona another year. Just tuned the “brake bias knob” and lay it down then turn it back so it’s normal after the run an passed tech. We sat on the pole for both of those. We used a radio to trigger the nitrous. Click it on when exiting the corner and off about 100 yards from the turn. We figured out the sweet spots during practice.
I hear for 2021 NASCAR is using Elon Musk’s autopilot features in the cars so there will be no room for human error.
Could of just went to a two barrel carb because even though the firecracker 400 had an airborne crash if you could call it that the 390 cfm was a decent idea instead of the bs plate
Great idea but now it's fuel injected
Great post Brock!
The spoilers on the roof made it alot safer
4:02 Trully unfortunate to have a name like "Dick Beatty"
Still better than Dick Trickle IMO.
Well if the current engine displacement limit is 358, why can't they just drop the CID limit to 250 or 200? And get rid of the restrictor plates. That will take care of the excess horsepower, and the cars won't be forced to draft all the time.
Race go carts at the local amusement park.
@@zanstrom686 What's your point? Do you even know what I am talking about?
@racermac1988 The easiest way would be with an air restrictor, as it is used in (too) many racing series around the world.
I am so glad they did not go to V6s. American V6 engines sound like hell. Maybe worse.
Worst sound ever!
@@adamwebster9784
Absolutely! I would rather listen to a lawnmower.
Instead, we're stuck using the same basic engine package that they put in place when Gerald Ford was president.
@@almostfm
Yes and I am glad it has. Parts are plentiful for nice V8s. Innovation used to come from F1 and Indy cars, now that they are both pretty much spec series innovation has slowed. Stock car racing rarely provided useful innovation even before Gerald's presidency.
It all depends on the firing order......
The Nascar stock Cars in the '80s looked so cool, I wish they kept that design.
Would it have been a better choice if they ran a smaller 5 liter V8 for the superspeedways? Either run a 4" bore 3" stroke, or keep the 4.125 bore with 2.875 stroke? So many questions on this matter.
Wow, only what I know now what I didnt know then...its amazing to see that we (in 2019) still are in battle with the power of the engines and speeds and yet nascar still can't get it right! Once they implemented the restrictor plate rule they took the excitement away from the sling shot maneuver. Bobby Allison had a point...why didnt they just go to a more smaller carb then using a plate. You are still restricting the amount of air flow in smaller venturis therefore not as much power is produced. However, now we are in fuel injection mode but what they do now is more problematic making all these cars run too damn equal causing these massive car pile ups to show up at practically every race. I rather watch side by side racing at high speeds rather then waiting for 'the big' one to occur...
I would certainly like to know the purpose of the small braided line @1:40 entering the front of the intake plenum, just under the new "plate." (Just the perfect place to shoot some nitrous ?)
It took drivers a whole lap to get up to speed. It also closed the pack together. The restrictor plate was retired in 2019 in favor of the Tapered spacer. It did increase the speed slightly and improve throttle response. But had the same effect.
Go back to 1:39....Kenny Schrader got caught in practice (too much faster than the field).How does a carb mount to an intake ? Four studs. IF hollow . . .they are air tubes down into / through intake. It was enough.
30 Years later there still getting into the Catchfence with the restrictor plate but get ready for the 2019 rules package. Only the Daytona 500 next year will use a restrictor plate and the other 3 races at Daytona and Talladega no restrictor plate there downsizing the horsepower to 500. O yeah I miss that 80's music from when I was a kid the cars and drivers too.
lol kenny schrader sounded like barney fife
In forza I take the restricted plate off 😎
MADLAD
Nobody fucking cares
@@thisisyou420 you care
Why wasn't the answer adding canards and spoilers for more down force, or is the body already designed for down force?
The lexan windows and nets made sense but the restrictor plates caused accidents
In 2016, the restrictor plate is a piece of junk. Since all the cars use a McLaren Engine Management System computer. The engine horsepower can be controlled through the PROM chip inside the sealed EMS, if the seal is broken, the tem's disqualified, plain and simple.
wrong
Anyone notice that Nascar used a plate to slow the cars down when they had 100's of ways to do so. Chevrolet just happened (yeah right) to dominate with this plate for 30 years and when Ford finally started dominating with the plate......it went bye bye. Of course Ford also had to use a larger spoiler for a season or two during those years.
If they want to go faster they could try not stopping for fuel and fresh tires.
So you think they'll go faster by driving on worn out tires, and making less HP by burning less fuel?
@@almostfm
They should shorten the races. And turn right once in a while.
@@fredgarvinMP To get the races in on one tank of fuel, they'd be about 100 miles. And they do "turn right once in a while"-or were you totally oblivious to the fact that they do run a couple of road courses each year?
@PixieWrangler Cup runs Watkins Glen and Sonoma (whatever they're calling it now). I know the Xfinity series has three next year: Mid Ohio, The Glen, and Road American. Honestly, I'd love to see both the Cup and Xfinity series do at least four road courses.
@PixieWrangler Oddly, it's probably my _least_ favorite road course. Places like the Glen and Road America feel like it's a road going someplace. I've never gotten that feeling with Sonoma. It's not that I hate it-it's just not near the top of my list.
Dick Beatty clearly didn’t know what he was talking about saying that a V6 couldn’t run as fast as the V8s
I miss this days, when NASCAR made changes and people still watched! Now NASCAR can't make a change without everyone complaining.
Should have been increased drag via downforce not decreased power.
silkysixx
High downforce isnt nascar
Besides, the catchfence was the problem, no the speeds
I find it interesting that they didn't mention the incident that occurred during the 1987 Twin 125 qualifier, where Phil Barkdoll's car got sideways going into the tri-oval, lifted up into the air, and started rolling until the rear of the car plowed into the fence. That situation garnered a fair amount of interest in slowing the cars down also.
Yes, it did; in fact, this was one of the main reasons (Bobby Allison's crash later that year at Talladega being the primary reason) why NASCAR re-introduced the restrictor plate for all races at Daytona and Talladega starting the following year to keep cars from sailing into the catch fence. Unfortunately, since Bobby Allison's crash in '87, there have been three other crashes, one at Daytona in 1988 involving Richard Petty (even though he rocketed against the fence and didn't damage anything or hurt anyone, thank goodness) and twice at Talladega (Neil Bonnett in 1993 and Carl Edwards in 2009), where drivers were hit or spun and sent into the catch fencing.
There was also the 2012 Craftsman Truck race when Joey Coulter was turned in the tri-oval and the rear of the truck grazed the fence.
And the 2013 Daytona Nationwide event with Kyle Larson, which subsequently forced the banning of two-car-tandems in the lower series (Even if that wasn't the cause).
Falling Pictures Productions I recall Kyle Larson's crash two years ago, and if memory serves me right, two-car tandems were also banned in the Sprint Cup series later that year as well. Joey Coulter's crash I don't remember hearing anything about.
End of the 2012 Truck series' race.
Not sure if the Cup series got the two can tandem ban, or if the cars at that point were no longer able to run in tandems.
RIP DALE
358 Cuban Inches?! What standard measure is that?! 😂
For some reason I thought this video would be James May talking about the Toyota restrictor plate fiasco.
Don't forget: restrictor plates were brought about as a direct response to Bobby Allison's car getting airborne and flying into the catch fence at Talladega in 1987. So what happens at the first race with plates on the cars, the 1988 Daytona 500? Richard Petty gets airborne and flies into the catch fence.
They really worked, didn't they? /s
The power in any engine is in the heads like a big pump more air you can move the more power it will make...roush racing sells old sb2 cup engines after they are done with the season 13k and u can have one
It's weird, restrictor plates were made out of a necessity for safety. But in the long run, it ended up changing the nature of dangers that occur at Daytona and Talladega.
Before restrictor plates, these races were all about speed, now it's basically cars racing in a pack, one bad move, and a quarter of the field's day are done.
And it surely hasn't stopped cars from flinging into the catch fence.
What's the name of the song at 0:24? It was used on the grids from like 1986-1989
Lol... Of course DW love plates.... #sellout
ROFL....
I guess he was an idiot back then...
I think he might have been somewhat sarcastic in his interview.
Why slow the cars down? Build the damn fence bigger and more side aerodynamics
The end of an era.
Dale Earnhardt Sr. said it himself, maybe not in this video, but......"Knock down the banking and force 'the drivers' to lift."(quoted it the best I could)
Did I hear that right at 2:00? A whole -200WHP difference? They may as well just have gone back to driving actual basic sedans lol
I never liked Dale Earnhardt, But he was absolutely right when he said they need to dirty up the aero dynamics to slow the cars down!
They should have focused more on aerodynamics than restricting the engines. It doesnt matter how much you slow the cars down if driving in reverse creates lift and sends the car flying.
More drivers died with restrictor plates than before.
I like how the parts they're using are basically what I have on my little weekend beater mustang. These days, the pros are using parts we can't afford or don't have access to.
You have access to anything and everything they do actually. Sure it may cost a little more, but not out of regular person price range for performance parts.
3:26
How ironic that Earnhardt would say such. Because he would eventually become the master of restrictor plate racing.
wouldnt it make sense to match the intake manifold to the restrictor plate?
*crashing in un-aerodynamic boxes*
"Ahh yes it's the speed that's done it"
As of today, there are no restricter plates.
If and when the day of fuel injection comes... I want to know how NASCAR intends to keep speeds down then... No plate to put over the intake then.
You've had your answer for 7 years now
Also in the 80's most cars speedometer's only went to 85mph. I never really understood it because you could be going 120mph and it only read 85mph or in the case of my old car go around back to 10mph.
Hey, could you make that background noise louder? I can still hear the drivers talking.
NASCAR said oh yeah! Just wait till 2019!
Something oddly familiar about those first three drivers they interviewed.
Mark Martin said it best, remove the down force and lets see who can drive!
In the 70s the cars were huge, probably over 4000 pounds each. Then in '81 when NASCAR downsized the cars, narrower width, smaller wheelbase, 3,700 lb weight limit. That's when I started seeing cars taking off into the air. Most notably Connie Saylor and Johnnie Anderson in the qualifying races for the 1981 Daytona 500.
Why cant racers who are willing to risk their lives get to liven up the sport, without their cars being downtuned and it being blamed on safety? If you want safety, get better nets for the spectators
Adding the windows made them faster
I'd take plates over 230mph speeds.
Gary Nelson said "plates are the only safe solution too keep speeds down." I'd take Gary Nelsons word over any arm chair QB anyday.
Atleast i think Gary Nelson said that.
combatking20 They could have just as easily made them run smaller egines.