I love this! Just note that Ice Path would not have been aded to introduce Sneasel because, inexplicably, Sneasel was only accessible in Kanto in both Silver and Gold and was only added to Ice Path in Crystal version.
It's a shame Goldenrod doesn't connect to Cianwood. Also, the inside of the "rectangle" created by Ecruteak, Violet, Azalea, and Union Cave should've had something in there too, like a post-game forest that features rarer Pokemon.
Wow thank you for this. Crystal was my first video game ever, I always liked to look at the maps and wonder about the out of bounds areas that looked like they could be used for assets. Very cool.
Looking at beta gen 2 stuff is a lot of fun. It would’ve been a completely different game if they didn’t revise the whole thing midway through development. You forgot about a couple of the craziest changes to the maps they made. Kanto was meant to be a city rather than its own region and the regional map was meant to be based off of the majority of Japan rather than just a single part of it. For example, you can visit a town that’s effectively an early version of snowpoint city in Sinnoh, or go to what later became the region that Hoenn is based off of. A nice follow up about how much the dex and the Pokémon designs changed could be cool. Iirc the dex was always meant to have 100 mons but they swapped between like 200 different ideas during development and only kept whatever happened to be the last favorites in the final game
The moment as I was watching this got to the unnamed town seeing that have a gym and Azalea originally not having the gym gave me the idea of what you explained about the former being replaced with the Pokémon Centre at the bottom of Route 32 and what became the Azalea gym
Am I wrong in thinking you never saw train tracks anywhere else except in Goldenrod and Saffron city? Because if they’re connected by train then theoretically you should have crossed over them at some point in your adventures. Unless the train is all underground or something. But it does seem weird you wouldn’t see any tracks in between.
I love Pokemon Super Gold 97. It's a great hack that really keeps the spirit of the beta Johto intact while fleshing it out and finishing it up for a nice "what-if". It's interesting to see that stuff like Newtype City would go on to have their layout recycled for Canalave in Sinnoh. Really shows you how much they keep on file and go back to for ideas for newer games
I have a couple suggestions for GS Crystal: first is to see if more than 10 contacts can be stored in the Pokegear, second is to have Goldenrod sell the stones but that clerk won't do business unless you beat Whitney and those prices should match since typical players reach Celadon with 3 badges.
I'm really curious what the gym and plot progression would have looked like with some of these original designs. It also doesn't look like Union Cave originally existed?
As a kid I was very excited when I realized that Kanto was back into the back. However I now wish they had made a much bigger and complete version of Johto instead of including Kanto, which also feels bland, is too easy and too fast to clear.
All the shrinking.. is it due to Kanto? Like if Kanto was not gonna be added on.. would Johto have been more populated and more of its own thing? Like imagine a Johto that doesn't rely on Kanto as a post game Some of the places did look more interesting than what we go imo
That extra house in violet might have been falkners house, he says how he borrows his dads pokemon, either that or the aide that gives you the togepi egg
Started off watching this dude during prime fortnite, found out he used to make zombies videos went back and watched those, then he started making new zombies videos, watched those, and now he makes Pokémon videos. Never gonna stop watching 😂
In your gen 2 rom hack, could you make it so that everyone has a bed? I always found it weird that there are so many homes without beds. Couches would be fine too, as long as we can assume they are pull-out couches
I think that some of the beta designs look somewhat better. I think Newbark town looks more interesting (especially with the sea to the south, but also cherrygrove city. I think the backtracking problem should ofc be fixed, but to me the final design was always kinda boring. Maybe a mix between the two designs? The same goes for violet city. A mix between the two would probably be great.
Connecting Goldenrod to the ocean and whirl islands would have been so good. Although it does open the player up to entirely skipping the ampharos subplot until after beating Chuck
@@Jotari that's not a bad idea. Although if the route is only available after you do that, you'll probably have beaten Chuck to use Fly and by that stage the route would be mostly pointless. Kinda like route 212 in Sinnoh
I wonder why it did not stay as City Of Rage. We can still fly there. Chuck's gym could have just been moved to a different place. It's probably due to cartridge space.
Would be very cool to see a remake that plays like Scarlet (with better performance) and some of the nuances put back in given the limitations are not as bad today.
I do prefer the artstyle of the overworld in the spaceworld build it had so much more variety. But yeah, with the issues they were having when it comes to space it makes sense they would simplify it a bit in the final game
One great idea would be to make a rom hack that used this original map with the best design for each city. Blackthorne, for instance, may be linked to Route 44 by its original way & the Ice Path, but the way in is closed by someone who really wants to see a Delibird or the Never-melt Ice item, so the player has to go through the path. If the HGSS map is used, you mau need to use HM08 (Rock Climb) to enter Blackthorne directly from Route 44.
This information is well known and not complete in this video. It has all already been recreated in the past in a rom years ago. The devs tried to create Japan as a whole while linking the two regions but changed their plans due to limitations.
So I was gonna share a red and green beta rom as well some words seem to be banned, possibly by this channel since something shady is going on, it seems. Its not that hard to find on the internet archive under Pokemon Green Beta (Strength Fix).
@@eyalinbar4845 everything just leads to more subs and more money. He could at least wait til the end of the vid to tell u to sub if you liked, but this dudes mission is just MO MONEY. Passion is by dudes like jrose11
@@dogemcmoon9644 i love jrose as much as the next guy, but he also does it to earn a living. Smith and Jrose and most of the community are passinate about pokemon and sharing info and questions about it more than money.
I love this! Just note that Ice Path would not have been aded to introduce Sneasel because, inexplicably, Sneasel was only accessible in Kanto in both Silver and Gold and was only added to Ice Path in Crystal version.
Swinub, jynx and delibird would be though.
It wasn't even available in Kanto. It was only available in freaking Mount Silver, you know, the very last lockable area of the game!
Also tbh the city of rage is pretty dope and it definitely feels very appropriate for Chuck as opposed to his random island
It's a shame Goldenrod doesn't connect to Cianwood.
Also, the inside of the "rectangle" created by Ecruteak, Violet, Azalea, and Union Cave should've had something in there too, like a post-game forest that features rarer Pokemon.
Something besides the Ruins of Alph? There is wasted potential there.
Wow thank you for this. Crystal was my first video game ever, I always liked to look at the maps and wonder about the out of bounds areas that looked like they could be used for assets. Very cool.
Looking at beta gen 2 stuff is a lot of fun. It would’ve been a completely different game if they didn’t revise the whole thing midway through development. You forgot about a couple of the craziest changes to the maps they made. Kanto was meant to be a city rather than its own region and the regional map was meant to be based off of the majority of Japan rather than just a single part of it. For example, you can visit a town that’s effectively an early version of snowpoint city in Sinnoh, or go to what later became the region that Hoenn is based off of.
A nice follow up about how much the dex and the Pokémon designs changed could be cool. Iirc the dex was always meant to have 100 mons but they swapped between like 200 different ideas during development and only kept whatever happened to be the last favorites in the final game
You should put all the maps together into their seemingly intended order to show what a full view would have looked like.
The moment as I was watching this got to the unnamed town seeing that have a gym and Azalea originally not having the gym gave me the idea of what you explained about the former being replaced with the Pokémon Centre at the bottom of Route 32 and what became the Azalea gym
Am I wrong in thinking you never saw train tracks anywhere else except in Goldenrod and Saffron city? Because if they’re connected by train then theoretically you should have crossed over them at some point in your adventures. Unless the train is all underground or something. But it does seem weird you wouldn’t see any tracks in between.
HeartGold and SoulSilver added train tracks to Route 32 exactly to address this fact
I love Pokemon Super Gold 97. It's a great hack that really keeps the spirit of the beta Johto intact while fleshing it out and finishing it up for a nice "what-if". It's interesting to see that stuff like Newtype City would go on to have their layout recycled for Canalave in Sinnoh. Really shows you how much they keep on file and go back to for ideas for newer games
The ironic thing about sneasel is that in gold and silver it isn't found in the ice path
I have a couple suggestions for GS Crystal: first is to see if more than 10 contacts can be stored in the Pokegear, second is to have Goldenrod sell the stones but that clerk won't do business unless you beat Whitney and those prices should match since typical players reach Celadon with 3 badges.
I'm really curious what the gym and plot progression would have looked like with some of these original designs. It also doesn't look like Union Cave originally existed?
As a kid I was very excited when I realized that Kanto was back into the back. However I now wish they had made a much bigger and complete version of Johto instead of including Kanto, which also feels bland, is too easy and too fast to clear.
3:37 To be fair, Mt. Moon's Pewter City side entrance had a PokeCenter too, so they may have just did the same thing here.
This is real cool. I love the data mining stuff, and wish nintendo would release more of their early design builds and stuff.
im a huge zombies and pokemon fan so your channels are literally perfect for me lol
7:40 "needed a spot to show off the new ice Pokemon before the dragon gym"
Shown: a Pokemon not shown off before the dragon gym in gold/silver.
Very enjoyable watch, i think you might be right about that water spot in the final build of Cherrygrove City.
RIP city of rage, early violet, unamed town and space world ecruteak. You actually looked pretty decent.
All the shrinking.. is it due to Kanto? Like if Kanto was not gonna be added on.. would Johto have been more populated and more of its own thing? Like imagine a Johto that doesn't rely on Kanto as a post game
Some of the places did look more interesting than what we go imo
I love that Kanto is heavily featured. As a kid, I think revisiting Kanto three years later was my first real contact with nostalgia.
I recreated Jhoto on my animal crossing island and took inspiration from the originals and the remakes. I’ll definitely take some cues from this vid.
I kinda love OG Goldenrod. SO much less of a mess of buildings.
The "pagoda" tilesets in Violet and Ecruteak Cities look so nice! A shame that those didn't make it into the end product.
Before anyone asks, the cellular trade center was for Crystal, not Gold and Silver.
That extra house in violet might have been falkners house, he says how he borrows his dads pokemon, either that or the aide that gives you the togepi egg
Started off watching this dude during prime fortnite, found out he used to make zombies videos went back and watched those, then he started making new zombies videos, watched those, and now he makes Pokémon videos. Never gonna stop watching 😂
Pretty interesting looking at these changes
Great video! Nice to see part 2 in the future!
In your gen 2 rom hack, could you make it so that everyone has a bed? I always found it weird that there are so many homes without beds. Couches would be fine too, as long as we can assume they are pull-out couches
Japan so they use futons.
yeah i think this is just a cultural thing, lots of people just have a futon so it's rolled up and put away until they're going to sleep!
The player character is a rich kid with their own room and own bed! Clearly a stand-out luxury in the Pokémon world.
I assume a lot of the home have an upstairs and/or bedroom, you just can't access them because you're a random stranger breaking into their house.
I think that some of the beta designs look somewhat better.
I think Newbark town looks more interesting (especially with the sea to the south, but also cherrygrove city.
I think the backtracking problem should ofc be fixed, but to me the final design was always kinda boring.
Maybe a mix between the two designs?
The same goes for violet city. A mix between the two would probably be great.
But beta Newbark is just Pallet town...
@@mokarokas-1727 after taking a second look... you're right.
Still, I think the newbark town we ended up with isn't the most interesting
No mention of Silent Hill? The earlier starting town not being where the Professor's Lab is may be the origin of Twinleaf & Sandgem towns concept.
Lake of Rage Town would of being better for the level curve of the game
Love your videos SmithPlays
Connecting Goldenrod to the ocean and whirl islands would have been so good. Although it does open the player up to entirely skipping the ampharos subplot until after beating Chuck
Unless that route was only open afterwards. Light house should cause issues everywhere.
@@Jotari that's not a bad idea. Although if the route is only available after you do that, you'll probably have beaten Chuck to use Fly and by that stage the route would be mostly pointless. Kinda like route 212 in Sinnoh
But you CAN entirely skip anything relating to Ampharos until after beating Chuck... aside from a mention from Silver.
Totally random, but the inclusion of Majima's karaoke song from Yakuza 0 as background music for Cherrygrove city threw me for a loop
Love how 24h cinderella is playing in the background 👀
2:35
The additional building is the portal through which all the gen2 pokemon passed from Johto to Kanto.
I think Goldenrod used to have a dock rather as it features a building exiting towards the sea just like Olivine has currently
I wonder why it did not stay as City Of Rage. We can still fly there. Chuck's gym could have just been moved to a different place. It's probably due to cartridge space.
Wait how were you able to get gameplay play on these towns
Would be very cool to see a remake that plays like Scarlet (with better performance) and some of the nuances put back in given the limitations are not as bad today.
That would be HeartGold and SoulSilver...
Is there an up to date link to his discord? I am super interested in his crystal rom hack, but all links in previous videos are invalid.
The cut town is called singu because its based on the port town of singu japan
This is SWEET!!!
This may be out of topic but I think johto needs more pokemon or a balanced type diversity
Edit: Also how about pokegear features?
Perhaps more than 10 contacts saved? 3 are always locks in the Mom, Elm, and Bill.
@@kildawg Yeah
@@kildawg - Bill is neither mandatory nor locked in though, right?
I do prefer the artstyle of the overworld in the spaceworld build it had so much more variety. But yeah, with the issues they were having when it comes to space it makes sense they would simplify it a bit in the final game
Was that a 24 hour cinderella instrumental i heard?
Is the discord still live for the Pokemon Crystal rom hack? I'd like to join and hear the news.
So the question is. Are you going to update your Crystal ROM with finished versions of these maps?
One great idea would be to make a rom hack that used this original map with the best design for each city. Blackthorne, for instance, may be linked to Route 44 by its original way & the Ice Path, but the way in is closed by someone who really wants to see a Delibird or the Never-melt Ice item, so the player has to go through the path. If the HGSS map is used, you mau need to use HM08 (Rock Climb) to enter Blackthorne directly from Route 44.
I just wish they had stuck closer to the Japanese aesthetic for some of the buildings, like in the beta version
That scrapped Ecruteak reminds me of Fuschia
Is the Discord link broken?
This information is well known and not complete in this video. It has all already been recreated in the past in a rom years ago. The devs tried to create Japan as a whole while linking the two regions but changed their plans due to limitations.
Is the rom playable? What is it called?
commenting for the rom as well
There was another I was searching for (besides the 1997 spaceworld roms) but this is more complete:
Pokemon Gold and Silver 97: Reforged
So I was gonna share a red and green beta rom as well some words seem to be banned, possibly by this channel since something shady is going on, it seems. Its not that hard to find on the internet archive under Pokemon Green Beta (Strength Fix).
When is the rom going to be finished?
When he corrects all the spelling mistakes, so never
While you wait you should play Polished Crystal 3.0
part 2?
interesting video
Why don’t you go in those buildings and find out what they are?
Because there is no leaked or recovered dump of 1998 Gold & Silver 💀
Why are you so obsessed with gen 2?
Are you serious? Do you know what obsession is? Tell me something you like, and I'll ask you why you're so obsessed with it. lol
how is gen 2 my favorite but its the least explored of gen's 1-3 for me?
I am ashamed.
What happened to the discord server? No more links in your videos, old links don't work. I'm dying for updates on your romhack.
I just realized I wasn't subscribed. My bad, but i fixed it
7k more for 100k!!
What’s up with the new Crystal rom hack? I’m waiting patiently
Play Polished Crystal 3.0 it's pretty good
Lmao great video
Is it true, creator need videos at least 8 Minute long to earn Money with their content ?
Videos under 8 minutes make money
5th
first
gg
3rd comment!
This guy only does these vids for money as he begs you to sub
Excuse me? Remember the gen 2 project he is doing? Yeah that is not getting monitary funds, it is just a passion project.
@@eyalinbar4845 everything just leads to more subs and more money. He could at least wait til the end of the vid to tell u to sub if you liked, but this dudes mission is just MO MONEY. Passion is by dudes like jrose11
Is this the time in your hateful life where you find out subs dont equate to money on UA-cam
@@dogemcmoon9644 i love jrose as much as the next guy, but he also does it to earn a living. Smith and Jrose and most of the community are passinate about pokemon and sharing info and questions about it more than money.
I think you look up and down before crossing the street
can i get the link to your discord for this project?