Revisiting An Amp I Didn't Care For.
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- Опубліковано 31 бер 2024
- Have you ever found yourself not into a piece of gear? Guitar? Pedal? Amp? Give it some time and come back to it, you may be surprised.
Diezel VH2: sweetwater.sjv.io/Diezel_VH2
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The trick to Diezels is to bias them cold. You want like 45-50% dissipation. This will help control the congestion in the mids. Try with 6550's too!
Really????
@@RiffsAndBeards Yeah. If you have an AxeFX you can go into the Diezel models and try it out. Go to the Power Amp section of the VH4 (preferably Blueface) amp block and reduce the bias to 45%. You will lose a small amount of gain but the amp will gain a lot of midrange clarity.
@@RiffsAndBeards Also this why Adam Jones jokes that he puts his amps in the freezer to improve their tone. He’s being facetious but it’s true - cold bias.
Fluff inebriated on this one.
This man speaks the truth. Ask mark fluff, he will tell you, he’s been doing this to his Herbert for years…. Bias it cold. My Herbert is insane this way. Better low end, less congested shitty midrange, better high end. This man is 100 percent on point. In fact, just about every damn high gain amp sounds better cold, and for good reason.
Also, the best Herbert the audio hammer dudes ever heard, and I’m sure mark will tell you, is my Herbert with 6550s and E34L’s, it ruled . And you can get eerily similar doing what this guy said to do in the axe fx, I do this exactly as well when using an emulation of a Diezel instead of my real Herbert.
My relationship with gear is as follows: Whatever I can afford, is what I like most
I think back to how much good gear used to cost, and how cheap good gear is now. We're so lucky to live in these times.
Great way to think bro
I have a line 6 Spider Valve MkII HD100 akd HD147 and I can recreate most tones.
Cost me less than 1k and that's with 2 4x12 cabs.
FB marketplace
@@hughjanus5518 what are you trying to “recreate” and why? Be you, man. Create your own tone that defines you. Who cares how you found it. It’s like we’re a bunch of snobs. If you aren’t playing the best brands, you suck. When I start my channel it’s going to be interesting. I have almost everything. MLC’s from Poland, Driftwoods, Mark IIc++, you name it. I won’t even get into guitars.
The best part is, I am a horrible player. All the gear in the world may not make me sound better than you. But at least you’re rockin with your own style. My channel is going to be … interesting.
Ok…are you going to revisit Blackstar again?? 😂😂
HAHHAAHA
Amazing amps they have one of the best amp designers in the world and have done more things to help guitarists to get great tone at an affordable price
@@adiecummingsshredguitar9306They are solid amps and you have to respect that they try to keep their prices affordable.
Blackstars have that same midrange granularity that Diezels have. I just can't jive with it, personally. Feels like walking with sand in your shoes. I don't hate the sound but I definitely don't like playing through Diezels.
I actually really like my series 1 people always ask what it is because it sounds good then scoff when I saw it's black star. (I took the logo off)
You just blew my mind about CAVE IN'S ANTENNA. I had always assumed they used a Sunn Model T, as they had for years. The tones on that record are so good. That first big chord and lead line in "Joy Opposites" is my favorite.
I've seen The Ocean (Collective) a couple of times--Robin Staps used a VH4 and it sounded awesome.
There is nothing better than the intro to Youth Overrided to me. Greatest commercial failure of all time.
That is the only album they used one though. They have used a ton of different amps through the years.
Lets no forget Matt Skiba also used Diezel VH4 on Alkaline Trio records Good Mourning and Crimson!
Yessss
Crimson is so fucking good! It’s one of those albums to me..we all got “those” albums and it’s one of mine.
I played a 100W Einstein for years and it was the most hi-fi amp I’ve ever owned. The build quality of components is also like what you find in high end audio. Peter Diezel is always helpful and responds to emails immediately, sometimes in the middle of the night (for him). I sold it after it broke a few times (only one local - 30 miles away - place at the time serviced them) and now play a 6L6 5153, which has the same frequency extension but less openness to the sound.
Cave In Antenna is my favorite album as well!! Glad to see it’s getting more (well-deserved) appreciation these days!
Even though I do not play guitar I find myself gravitating to this channel. It is quite enjoyable to get your take on many subjects as the channel diversity is great. Your personality creates interest and even has me looking at some 6 strings to add to my room and who knows may even pick it up and give it a go. Thank you Fluff for your time and efforts.
Somebody say Diezel? I'm in
The Mercedes Benz of high gain amps. They also have the best cleans and edge of breakup tones of any high gain amps imo. Tons of studio and Nashville players use them. Unfortunately, they’re very expensive.
I own a Diezel D-Moll and I absolutely love it. I’m glad your revisit to the Diezel amps has been a great one.
First off, I love your videos! As a VH4 owner for over twenty years, it's nice that you give Diezel the respect they deserve. The cabinets and tubes used play a big part in their sound. I use a Diezel Cabinet rear loaded with Celestion G12T-75 speakers. The head uses EL-34 tubes. I am trying to figure out how I missed the Cave In Antenna album. Great stuff!
Recently I traded a 1986 Mesa Blue Stripe Mark III for a Diezel VH2 in the last month or so as well. Never tried Diezel myself. I was more impressed with the clean channel, as it has quite a unique character to it. And an excellent effects loop to boot! I think the most notable about the "Diezel" tone in general, is the same thing we talk about with Rectifiers. Magic and shit happens in those lower mids, with the Diezel being more "bubbly" and harmonically rich in this area comparatively. Always excellent to hear another players perspective as well though, so THANK YOU for making a video sharing your thoughts!
I noticed that diezel has a compression that I don't care for. Also, plenty of times it just wasn't a tone I was looking for. The $4k price tag made it where I don't want to get 6 of them and play around.
The faceplate always makes it look like the controls are supposed be adjusted by sliding from left to right.
I tried the UAD Diezel Herbert plugin when it comes out. The very first thing I remember was "How is it possible that so many people can like that tone?! It sounds like s**t!!".
I've tried it maybe for 2-3 hours with different guitars, IRs... And still nothing good for me to play with. It was literally a non sense that an amplifier like that got a such good reputation.
About a year after, my uad demos were resetted after a plugin purchase and I'll give the Herbert plugin an other chance, with some new guitars, plugins and IRs...
And the magic appears. It was the tone, or the matrix of tone for all of the others.
1 year after purchasing the UAD Herbert Plugin, I've purchased the Herbert MK3 Head.
I'm no longer looking to buy an other amp. The clean channel is the most beautiful thing I heard from an High Gain Amp, and of course, the crunch (+ & -) and lead channel are far enough for me with the Midcut option.
So, I clearly agree with this video :)
Sitting over here with 3 Diezels in my lineup. Love them.
What I like about Diezels is that everything tends to sound big. The chords, but also the single note lines. But yeah sure, it´s always a very personal thing how good or intuitive an amp feels to play.
Thank You Fluff. Finally my Diezel gets the Kudos it deserves!!!!
Yeah, using marshall cab wont help you to like diezel, try diezel cab front loaded v30 try that and make another video explaining how much actually you like the tone from diezel
I have diezel einstein 100 try it with my marshall 1960 with v30 - it was bad, i try it with my engl pro front loaded v30 it was great, and in my diezel cab front loaded v30 - there you go! And try to keep level higher than the master volume - more level less master.
Love your channel best of luck🍀
Thanks Fluff, some good thoughts at the end. Sometimes the problem sits more in front of the gear, because we want the wrong thing out of the right gear. And especialy with Diezel, this happens a lot.
My thougts on these glorious amps: 1. Yes, there are a lot of low mids. Leave 'em in. They sound great. If you and your guitar deliver. Most balanced midrange ever. You may miss this 2k-3k spike at first, get used to it. 2. Cabs matter more than anything else! Diezels can be piky about cabs, especialy with low tunings. Bass/depth can be humungous, if your cab can handle it. Coffee cabs are very tight, Diezels are great, Mesa 412, well, a lot of people like it. But its boomy. The cab, not the Diezels.
3. Boosts don't work that well with Diezels. I always find them to take away the unique charakter of these amps, which is just big, balanced, articulate and dynamic/touch sensitive. If you want that saturated high mid thing, you are better of using the mid cut of the Herbert or VHX. Or get a 5150/TS9/Mesa cab. And a really good noise gate. Something you don't need with a Diezel. Good example for Diezel tones: Myles Kennedy/Alter Bridge. Three Days Grace.
Based off the thumbnail I thought this was going to be a April Fools joke but it turned out to be insightful. Looks like I'm going to have to revisit Cave In. 👍🤘
This is the kind of content I subscribed for, great vid
I hate the VH4 but I love the Herbert. However, biasing those amps is key as is the cab. If I had only ever played the Herbert through a Mesa Standard OS w/V30s I'd of never known... but when you connect the Herbert to the front-loaded 412 matched cab with GTK-100s OMFG dude!!!!! That amp will literally blow you across the room like Marty in Back to the Future lol
Finally some Cave In love! That album is amazing!
I have a VH4 and VHX. VH4 has 6L6’s and is a beast but the VHX is God tier. Most versatile tube head I’ve owned. I just need to change the KT-77’s out for 6L6’s.
Awesome video! Diezel amps are great!!
I agree and value your viewpoint of unhappiness. my Bogners, Framus and other amps shouldn’t be dialed in like the old & Epic Mesa rectifiers - they’re sonically different or it could be your choice of specific tubes and dial-in habits 🤷🏽 Love your channel 🤘🏽
I have done what you said very recently. For YEARS I have loved how Les Paul's sounded. Never could go along with one when I played it. Just felt odd. Granted I only played epiphones never genuine UsA Gibson's. Late last year I saw a silver burst Epiphone LP and tried it and for whatever reason loved it. Went back and my local GC had a bunch of high end USA guitars down low on the rack where anyone could easily try them. And I played my first Gibson's. And I flat fell in love. Specifically with an exclusive Seafoam green one. It just felt and played great. So I feel you on revisiting things for sure.
I had heard GC moved the expensive guitars to where you can actually try them out
I’ve had a D-moll for almost a year now. It’s a great well-built amp. I’ve had the Peppers Dirty Tree for 2 years now and only did I find today that they go very well with each other.
I like the topic of this, because I feel the same about Oranges, Rectifiers, and Marshalls. I enjoy the tones everyone else gets, but I just cannot figure out the amps for myself. It's user error, but I think it's an interesting topic to hear from people who have similar difficulties
I still love the review you did of the Bugera Tri-Rec, that amp sounded amazing in your AB test with the Mesa, and I still prefer the sound of the Bugera. Unfortunately that model is no longer being produced, and they are getting harder to find on the used market.
Great description of Diezels.
I found using the Diezel models in my FX 3 blended with the 2C++ makes for a massive “ wall of Guitar” tone
The Diezel also sounds really good on its own
Diez is the king. The fm3 version is close as I've gotten.
Super clear with hi gain
The only time i really loved diezels was with a matching diezel cab... somehow i never understood how ppl made them work with a marshall cab (shrill and congested), or an orange (tubby and screechy) cab or a mesa OS (too boomy and rounded in lower mids with a weird presence spike)
Then i had a chance to play a herbie through a FLV30 cab and the vh4 through a RLV30 and i LOVED BOTH.
i'm not *trying* to make a backhanded comment, but this is the best tone i've ever heard in one of your videos.
Hi fluff. I fiddled quite a bit with my vh2 and found out: presence and depth both at 7 is the same as presence 8 and depth 5 on a 6505. give that a try. You can set the preamp the same as you would on a 6505 and you get in the ballpark; just without the upper mids of the peavey and more like an Evh like you said. Really nice amp. Just sold mine, because the Revv generator red channel can get really close and I can’t justify owning it if the Revv can do the same and more.
I have a early 00's Diezel VH4 and with EL34B's it is the best tone I've ever had. It's very different feeling. But I love it and yeah you gotta dial it in.
Myles Kennedy of Alter Bridge also used Diezel
I returned a rockerverb 100-was just British crunch and not much more, and a Mesa Badlander 50, which just had zero tonal spectrum, you could tweak the EQs and it barely sounded any different, so wasn’t for me.
I was coming off of an orange dark terror which gave you tones from British crunch all the way to scooped Pantera.
I’m on a TH30 now and love it!
Wow,that first lil playing was awesome.Correction,it all sounds killer.👍
Sepultura's rhythm tone on Quadra is amazing
My friend has a Diesel VHX…that thing is incredible…I use a QC but if I were to ever get an amp…that’d be the one
Diezel amps actually aren’t that crazy expensive. Here in Germany the VH2 goes for 1895€. But once they’re shipped over the Atlantic…
Mesa amps are basically prized after their weight in Gold over here.
Right? Ill easily trade a measa for a vh or Herbert.
I would love to see a tone tutorial on your VH2 and the sounds you're getting. Also, I have a power amp/pedal setup and have been having trouble getting into my VH4 pedal. Grab one of those and give a bro a hand pretty please. I'm struggling to get tones I love from it. Good advice though in this vid!
i don't know why fluffs tones always sound "active" for a lack of better term
He always runs boosts/ ods set as boosts before them. Gives his tone that 'hot' sound
I felt the same way with bogners now I love them even more
Good video. Commenting to let you and the algorithm know. Also hell yeah Cave In
Antenna is over 20 years old... that was a fact I was unprepared for! Thanks!
VH-2 can be loaded with EL34, 6L6 or KT77. So obviously there can be sonic differences. Mine is a 6L6.
with a Duncan distortion pickup it’s set up like this:
Gain => between 2 & 3 O’clock
Volume => 11 O’clock
Treeble => 1 O’clock
Mids => Between 12 & 1 O’clock
Bass => 2 O’clock
Presence => 11 O’clock
Deep => 1 O’clock
Master 1 => 12 O’clock
The Vh-2 is plugged into a powerstation 2 with the Volume at noon and all the switch set to Flat (Presence and Depth at noon)
The PS is plugged on a Engl E212VB Pro with V30.
The sound is huge, nasty, bestial, tight… no need to plug an OD in front.
With a EMG 81 it’s the nirvana.
This amp is insane.
Right now, I'm looking for a D-Moll or a Hagen, as they're much cheaper in Europe than in the US.
Three questions: 1.) How does it sound with the AJ settings????? 2.) Would you make a paid QC capture with the AJ settings? 3.) you’re the second tuber I’ve seen use IRs by forward audio. Do you like them? Are they better than ML?
Regarding the sound of the VH-2/VH-4, just watched an interesting interview with Steven Fryette where he mentioned Peter Diezel based the original VH-4 on the preamp of the VHT Pittbull Ultralead into a Marshall style power amp for people who couldn't afford VHT amps in the early 90s. I used to own a VH-2 but now am using a 90s VHT Pittbull and I can definitely hear a similarity, the VHT wins for me but both are absolute monster amps. FWIW it took me a while to dial in the VH-2, I found the EQ controls to be really odd compared to 'normal' amps but once I got there I fell in love! It took a bit of speaker experimentation to get the best out of it for me, ended up settling on V30/Creamback X pattern in a 4x12, crushing but defined 🤘
Oh wow that’s amazing info!
Northlane's albums are a masterclass on the VH4 and the bogner Uberschall/uber ultra if you haven't heard em. A lot of their songs are primarily a mix of those 3 amps
I have definitely used the UAD Plugin DIEZEL VH4. I've done a few demos with it & it sounds solid! I wonder how it fairs in comparison to the actual amp it's self.
Had a vh4 back in 2010 hated it but revisited it in 2023 ...still wasnt a fan but it's true what you say it's worth revisiting things. The first time I had an engl invader I didn't like it but now it's one of my fave amps of all time. Same with Gibson Les Pauls hated them at first now I can't get enough of them.
I've never really gassed for the Ernie Ball guitars before, but damnit Fluff?!!
You got me.
Dayum!
I still rock an Eleven Rack for my live rig. But I love my ML Baseford (vh4) plug in. I've always been a fan of the vh4, and its probably as close as I'll ever get to the real thing. I really really hope ML comes out with a SLO 100 style amp. Then I honestly got every type of sim that can get me a sound like hte guys that inspire me and eras of rock and metal that I like.
I never tried one of their amps until last month when plug-in alliance had a sale for the Herbert. I got it set up in my DAW and just could not get over how usable it was. The only thing I didn't like was the clean channel had this low end Strange harmonic distortion, but the two gane channels were awesome.
Would love to try one of these but man at 50 lbs and $3000 it's a little hefty for my needs. Someday I want to try one of their 50 watt heads. Thanks for the vid!
Most direct experience I had everytime I played a diezel 💜🤘 tight ❤
I am like that with VOX amps :D 90% of my top players used them, but they just do not get along with my hands. Matt Bellamy also used Diezels =] Great video!
Can we get frequency response graphs?
I don't have the original, but I have 1-2 plugins of vh4 and I just can't get a good tone out of it , then I tried tonality and the Diezel tones are amazing in there , if you know how to dial those they are amazing
I have the vh4 amp in a box pedal and yes the knobs are super sensitive. Still have not found the sweet spot in my rig.
Immediately understood that comparison lol
Many people had the same issue getting from mesa to a diezel, ti is a totaly different world
Ok so it was a Diezel VH4, But what kind of cab, speaker and mic combo was used??
My problem with Diezel isn’t their tone. It’s the pricetag 😂
I have a VH2 and it took me a while to get the mids figured out. Didn't help that I was trying to dial it in like a 5150.😅
I get the revisiting gear thing. I think it just mainly comes from inexperience and knowledge on how to use it. There have been many amps and pedals that I disliked or was biased against just cause of a particular experience or artist used it.
These days an amp is an amp. 99% are well made, versatile beyond what those in the 1960s and 70s ever dreamed of, and cheap enough that if you dont like them you can switch. Yeah 2-4k is a lot of money, but back in time the amp was as much as a new car. And there are hundreds in the hundreds to be had that do the thing.
I feel the same way about Vox amps. I absolutely LOVE hearing other people use a Vox, but for the life of me, I can't get one to sound any sort of way that I can agree with (with the exception of the Pathfinder 15r)... myself, Im a hardcore Laney fan, and I can get the sound in my head out of a Supergroup, but I cant afford a real one 😢
Absolutely love my vhx
I’ve played several and my fave was the VH4. The Paul was a close second. I thought the VH2 wasn’t as good as the VH4. Plus I think these amps sound better with medium to lower output pickups…..
Diezel VH4 is obviously a no brainer amp, too many a bucket list amp.
Billy Corgan played through a Diezel during the "Machina" touring cycle!
I ordered a vh2 to try out at home with my stuff. Tried it for 15 days. The clean channel was wonderful. The distortion channel on the other hand had a slow mushy attack for riffing and the distortion sounded more like a fuzz pedal. Dirty channel couldn't compete with my rev g triple rectifier so I returned it. I seem to have the same experience, I like bands that use Diezels, but my experience with them has never been good. Tried a Herbert at a store one time and it was way too dark.
don't know what you're tubes were??? i had KT77 and the second channel was horrible , fuzz like you say , congestion on the mids , muddy as hell ; i changed to 6L6 with a 7025 in V1 and then ....not the same amp , unbelievable no more fuzz tone , clarity , articulation , more open etc....i wanted badly to try a VH4 but believe it or not ......not anymore !!
I got red label 6L6 tubes in mine.
Look at front pedal. Is it soft clip or hard clip.
I was that way with egnaters - generally didn’t like them, but tried out a renegade and was extremely impressed by it. Too bad the brand is a bit zombified currently and their QC issues marred what were otherwise great sounding and innovative amps (mines got aftermarket upgrades so it runs much better than stock w/ new output transformer, etc).
The marshall/evh description actually did make sense lol
The self titled killswitch engage album (last album with howard jones) was a diezel vh4! Honestly i like that tone on that album
@@psychonaut9110not entirely! A vh4 was used and a cobra was primarily on the ADLD album along with a soldano!
I love my Diezel’s I have a VH4 & a Hagen
I don't disagree with the "revisit gear again" take, especially since our opinions and tastes change and evolve over time. I used to be a staunch 6505/5150 fan but as ive gotten older, i definitely appreciate how a lot of bands with one guitarist can take the looser-feeling tones of Oranges, Marshalls etc and make them sound so huge and defined.
Just sold it and buy a Herbert or VH4.
I love my Einstein and VH4
Had a Mesa Caliber and it sounded like a Diezel with a Mesa rectifier..
I sold it because my Mark have more Dynamics. Diezel Dynamics are fantastic like a cranked plexi power Hand Amp: roll off the volume on your Guitar and you will have a nice fenderisch Clean.
Your Welcome.
I love my Herbert. I also love my JP2C.
Myles Kennedy Diezel's too like a boss
I like it in a 90s industrial rhythm way more than stereotypical shredding or the modern metalcore thing.
Had a vh4. Not bad. Nothing to write home about (compared to my SLO 100 and Ecstasy)
I also hope/think that works maybe the other way around... I own an Herbert for more than 10 years ... atm in my amp collection it is my least favorite (Earforce, Invective, Engl Savage and a Marshall JCM). But it is the amp I own for the longest time... maybe I should just keep it for another 2 years and I will like it again ;)
lololol
Most of the players that use diesel use it in a pairing. Wonder if that would be better for their use
I don’t like handouts. But if you don’t want that diezel ill take it from you. I love those amps. Best of all.
😂
Didn't Brent Hinds use the VH4's for ages, for his gain tone? On things like Leviathan and Blood Mountain, I might be wrong.
Oblivion and The Hunter tours when I saw them for sure not sure about studio!
@@RiffsAndBeards loved the tones on Oblivion and Crack the Skye
2:25 dude that sounds AMAZING.
Taste I guess. To me its WAY too brittle. Pretty much hurts my ears.
@@metalpuppet5798 same
Yeah I didn't like this sound at all. I actually made the "Ew" face when it started. It's a great amp, but doesn't sound like it plays nice with that 1960VB IR. You'd have to cycle through a bunch more IRs to get one that works better.
There earlier VH4s were voiced for G12-K100s. If you own a Fractal: A/B the VH4 Blue vs Silver. Night and day.
In other words: your earlier Diezel encounters might have been watered down by cab mismatches.
Oh that is fascinating that would make total sense
Diezel rules. However I prefer the D-Moll because it has more gain, VH2 needs more gain in my opinion.
Antenna baby 🤘
Billy Corgan also used a VH4 for a little bit
Not a little bit...and an Einstein and a Herbert
Antenna 😍
"...you're sure you dislike it, give it one more chance" "Busts out a Line 6 Spider..."
I'm trying to determine if this is an April 1st themed video or not since it seems pretty serious.