I will say: "Dialogue with the Dragon" is a really important element to have. At least I (If I was PC) would wake up when "a fragment of its own soul" gets mentioned, it hints there is more to the story.
Absolutely! Now that you mention it, stories become richer when the "Dialogue with the Dragon" happens. I'm reminded of Empire Strikes Back when Darth Vader reveals his identity to Luke. That short exchange brought a huge hint that something greater was at play.
@@EmergentGM What I am looking for is the (part of the) worldbuilding (the "conflict" that launches the story) made prior to the campaign start, so far we only really know about a king, who is missing a princess, and an involved dragon. For a good story, you need to have more than that. So far we know the king's side of the story. When we get to the dragon, it is time to reveal the dragon's part in the "conflict". Here I can give an example (Yes, it is only a guess from my side) to illustrate what the group can learn from the "Dialogue with the Dragon": *The dragon is partially enslaved to the king, as the king intends to convert the dragon into a weapon, so far a fragment of the dragon's soul is now part of a sword.* *The king needs some powerful weapons to win the war, a war the king is planning to conquer a part of an adjacent republic.* What did I do there? - It looks like a plot twist, but it is part of what happened before the campaign started. In reality, the group gets some insight that makes them understand things, they already have been through, better! How much did I write about the dragon? Two sentences are enough foundation to go into more details about the dragon later. We can now expand on it, now the group is gotten so far: The dragon asks: "Look at what is left of me. - I live a half-life. - Tell me how could I have kidnapped the princess?". - or - The dragon asks: "If you believe the princess is in that old castle, and you wish to see her, then you could just have asked me nicely. Actually, you can go look for yourself now, she isn't there.". Now I branched the story, as I considered two different reactions from the group. Especially the latter reaction is based on another part of the (worldbuilding) the "conflict" that launches the story: The princess. -> How much do we know about the princess so far? (I feel: Almost nothing.) So my guess can be as good as any, but I have a few sentences describing her (Similar to what I made with the dragon.) But, before I reveal them, then let me continue the "Dialogue with the Dragon": The dragon continues: "Yes, I did it, but I had help, as I could not do it alone, or rather: I am not the real kidnapper, I only helped.". Here the dragon makes the group aware that there is more to the story than they are told so far. Yes, there are more from before the campaign started: The princess' motivation is still waiting to be revealed. (Plot twist coming up!!!) If the group decides to be more curious. (Yes! We are at a crucial decision moment for the group, so there are many paths the group can take.) Then the dragon can (drop the bomb): "It was the princess!" And when the players' jaws collide with the table, just let the dragon continue the speech: "The princess made the plan, arranged the details, and for me, it was just simply to follow the plan.". "Yes, she gave me an explanation: Her father was going to make the remaining part of me into another sword, a sword intended to be given as a gift to her father's brother." Ok... Let me now reveal my worldbuilding lines for the princess: *The princess is 15 years old and thus has reached the age where kids rebel against their parents, as she has no intention of following the tradition where princesses get married away as part of treaties, especially not her father's promise about marrying her to his brother, the ruler of the neighboring kingdom, with a dragon-sword as dowry, to seal the pact to conquer and divide the republic both kingdoms border.* Yes... She ran away from home, as rebellious kids sometimes do. Ok, a little noisier (staging her own kidnapping) than most teenagers do. The group may (Highly unlikely, I know... Players are normally not that observant) ask: "But... Mister Dragon... What has the kidnapping of the princess to do with converting you into a sword?" The dragon: "First! My name is not Dragon... My name is Florima... And I am a girl, so don't call me Mister... Sorry... I do not know... It does not make sense to me either... You have to ask the princess." --- My point is "Dialogue with the Dragon" makes the story so much more open-ended; Will the group: Go on with the plan and defeat the dragon? (I think in this case the group deserves to find the princess missing.) Will they undo the sword and make the dragon whole again? (And thus gain the lifetime friendship of a dragon. - How cool is that?!) Will they search for the princess? (Following a vague hint about her having found her first teenage love; some boy living in the republic.) Forget about the king, the dragon, and the princess. Instead, they settle in the republic and open a cookie bakery? (Thus fulfilling their background-story motivation/goal.) --- I can compare "Dialogue with the Dragon" to the scene in Harry Potter with Snape's memories: We get Snape's background story, explaining previous events, and unleashing some plot twists. - Still, the story is not over with it, there are still decisions to be made. The *Last Session* comes later: Five years after you opened the cookie bakery, you can feel that its success has grown over the years, now attracting fine customers. This day started out as an ordinary day, but one customer made the day unforgettable: A young woman entered the shop, and you had the feeling that you knew her, but you could not name her. Much to your surprise she gave a card to each of you: An invitation to her wedding! - You were all invited!!! She spoke: "My name is Victoria, yes I figured my father never told you my name. But, let us forget about my father and his brother, they are still fighting each other, and they are not invited. We, on the other hand, are into cookies! You are hereby invited, I hope you can attend! - Though I have renounced the old traditions about marrying family members to keep the blood pure, I have not abandoned the old ways completely. The one about a wedding lasting 3 days and 3 nights, that one I upkeep! - Can I pay for these cookies? - Oh! No, they are not only for me, I share them with my friend, and she is waiting outside, we girls know what we like! Her name is Florima. - See you!".
This all sounds less like a game and more like a novel. You recommended writing down how you (the GM) want the grand finale to unfold. So... what happens if it doesn't? What happens if the players fail, or choose not to engage in the way you expect? If you only plan out one outcome, that sounds suspiciously like you are going to be fudging to make sure it happens. At which point, what's the point of playing? Why not just write a story together with your friends instead? You mentioned at the end, "Don't be afraid to change things around in your outline." Well, fair enough, but if you're mapping out what may happen, you should at least have an idea of what happens if there is a failure or divergence at major points along the way. Something this linear just doesn't sound like there is much room for player agency. Worse than that, it even seems to suggest that player agency would be an obstacle, or something that exists in tension with the outline. All of this is should really make you consider why people would want to play a game, when the act of playing it is something that doesn't even seem to figure in to the plan.
Hey @Henry-zv3nj, thanks for the reply! I get where you're coming from, and I agree with you in that the players' actions can drastically alter the outcome of your campaign, and we should absolutely adjust to those actions accordingly! However, it's not unheard of to start with an end in mind when designing a campaign, and I am certainly not the only GM to suggest that. It is not to imply that it is the ONLY outcome that will happen, nor am I suggesting that you should railroad the campaign to that ending, for the reason you pointed out: player input. The only accurate player input we can account for is the kind that happen in the session itself. Which means planning multiple outcomes ahead of time is not any better than planning one, because there's no telling which ending the players will arrive at until they get to the climax. The best-case scenario is the easiest to imagine, and easier to change one happy ending than to ponder and revise multiple what-ifs. That could be time spent on other things. In a pre-written adventure, the ending is literally written out. Should we follow it to the 'T'? By no means are we locked into it. But we do have an idea of where the adventure is headed, and that gives us a big picture to follow. If the journey of our campaign doesn't line up with what's suggested in the adventure books, it's up to us to find our way to an ending that makes sense. Our campaigns are no different. Which is why I mentioned to "not to be afraid to change things around in your outline"; that includes the ending. The point of the campaign outline is to create a simple, light-weight overview of our campaign so we can adjust to the inevitable changes that player agency introduces, without sifting through a novella of notes. My goal for this video was to help us identify what stages we should consider for the final act of our campaign. Not to imply that everything must happen according to what we've pre-written. Hope this helps clarify :)
I will say: "Dialogue with the Dragon" is a really important element to have.
At least I (If I was PC) would wake up when "a fragment of its own soul" gets mentioned, it hints there is more to the story.
Absolutely! Now that you mention it, stories become richer when the "Dialogue with the Dragon" happens. I'm reminded of Empire Strikes Back when Darth Vader reveals his identity to Luke. That short exchange brought a huge hint that something greater was at play.
@@EmergentGM What I am looking for is the (part of the) worldbuilding (the "conflict" that launches the story) made prior to the campaign start, so far we only really know about a king, who is missing a princess, and an involved dragon.
For a good story, you need to have more than that.
So far we know the king's side of the story.
When we get to the dragon, it is time to reveal the dragon's part in the "conflict".
Here I can give an example (Yes, it is only a guess from my side) to illustrate what the group can learn from the "Dialogue with the Dragon":
*The dragon is partially enslaved to the king, as the king intends to convert the dragon into a weapon, so far a fragment of the dragon's soul is now part of a sword.*
*The king needs some powerful weapons to win the war, a war the king is planning to conquer a part of an adjacent republic.*
What did I do there? - It looks like a plot twist, but it is part of what happened before the campaign started.
In reality, the group gets some insight that makes them understand things, they already have been through, better!
How much did I write about the dragon? Two sentences are enough foundation to go into more details about the dragon later.
We can now expand on it, now the group is gotten so far:
The dragon asks: "Look at what is left of me. - I live a half-life. - Tell me how could I have kidnapped the princess?".
- or -
The dragon asks: "If you believe the princess is in that old castle, and you wish to see her, then you could just have asked me nicely. Actually, you can go look for yourself now, she isn't there.".
Now I branched the story, as I considered two different reactions from the group.
Especially the latter reaction is based on another part of the (worldbuilding) the "conflict" that launches the story:
The princess. -> How much do we know about the princess so far? (I feel: Almost nothing.)
So my guess can be as good as any, but I have a few sentences describing her (Similar to what I made with the dragon.)
But, before I reveal them, then let me continue the "Dialogue with the Dragon":
The dragon continues: "Yes, I did it, but I had help, as I could not do it alone, or rather: I am not the real kidnapper, I only helped.".
Here the dragon makes the group aware that there is more to the story than they are told so far.
Yes, there are more from before the campaign started: The princess' motivation is still waiting to be revealed. (Plot twist coming up!!!)
If the group decides to be more curious. (Yes! We are at a crucial decision moment for the group, so there are many paths the group can take.)
Then the dragon can (drop the bomb): "It was the princess!"
And when the players' jaws collide with the table, just let the dragon continue the speech:
"The princess made the plan, arranged the details, and for me, it was just simply to follow the plan.".
"Yes, she gave me an explanation: Her father was going to make the remaining part of me into another sword, a sword intended to be given as a gift to her father's brother."
Ok... Let me now reveal my worldbuilding lines for the princess:
*The princess is 15 years old and thus has reached the age where kids rebel against their parents, as she has no intention of following the tradition where princesses get married away as part of treaties, especially not her father's promise about marrying her to his brother, the ruler of the neighboring kingdom, with a dragon-sword as dowry, to seal the pact to conquer and divide the republic both kingdoms border.*
Yes... She ran away from home, as rebellious kids sometimes do. Ok, a little noisier (staging her own kidnapping) than most teenagers do.
The group may (Highly unlikely, I know... Players are normally not that observant) ask:
"But... Mister Dragon... What has the kidnapping of the princess to do with converting you into a sword?"
The dragon: "First! My name is not Dragon... My name is Florima... And I am a girl, so don't call me Mister... Sorry... I do not know... It does not make sense to me either... You have to ask the princess."
---
My point is "Dialogue with the Dragon" makes the story so much more open-ended; Will the group:
Go on with the plan and defeat the dragon? (I think in this case the group deserves to find the princess missing.)
Will they undo the sword and make the dragon whole again? (And thus gain the lifetime friendship of a dragon. - How cool is that?!)
Will they search for the princess? (Following a vague hint about her having found her first teenage love; some boy living in the republic.)
Forget about the king, the dragon, and the princess. Instead, they settle in the republic and open a cookie bakery? (Thus fulfilling their background-story motivation/goal.)
---
I can compare "Dialogue with the Dragon" to the scene in Harry Potter with Snape's memories: We get Snape's background story, explaining previous events, and unleashing some plot twists. - Still, the story is not over with it, there are still decisions to be made.
The *Last Session* comes later:
Five years after you opened the cookie bakery, you can feel that its success has grown over the years, now attracting fine customers.
This day started out as an ordinary day, but one customer made the day unforgettable:
A young woman entered the shop, and you had the feeling that you knew her, but you could not name her.
Much to your surprise she gave a card to each of you: An invitation to her wedding! - You were all invited!!!
She spoke: "My name is Victoria, yes I figured my father never told you my name. But, let us forget about my father and his brother, they are still fighting each other, and they are not invited. We, on the other hand, are into cookies! You are hereby invited, I hope you can attend! - Though I have renounced the old traditions about marrying family members to keep the blood pure, I have not abandoned the old ways completely. The one about a wedding lasting 3 days and 3 nights, that one I upkeep!
- Can I pay for these cookies?
- Oh! No, they are not only for me, I share them with my friend, and she is waiting outside, we girls know what we like! Her name is Florima.
- See you!".
dang only 60 views I thought you were a big youtuber ! Great content
Much appreciated @SirDracnix :)
This all sounds less like a game and more like a novel. You recommended writing down how you (the GM) want the grand finale to unfold. So... what happens if it doesn't? What happens if the players fail, or choose not to engage in the way you expect? If you only plan out one outcome, that sounds suspiciously like you are going to be fudging to make sure it happens. At which point, what's the point of playing? Why not just write a story together with your friends instead?
You mentioned at the end, "Don't be afraid to change things around in your outline." Well, fair enough, but if you're mapping out what may happen, you should at least have an idea of what happens if there is a failure or divergence at major points along the way. Something this linear just doesn't sound like there is much room for player agency. Worse than that, it even seems to suggest that player agency would be an obstacle, or something that exists in tension with the outline.
All of this is should really make you consider why people would want to play a game, when the act of playing it is something that doesn't even seem to figure in to the plan.
Hey @Henry-zv3nj, thanks for the reply! I get where you're coming from, and I agree with you in that the players' actions can drastically alter the outcome of your campaign, and we should absolutely adjust to those actions accordingly!
However, it's not unheard of to start with an end in mind when designing a campaign, and I am certainly not the only GM to suggest that. It is not to imply that it is the ONLY outcome that will happen, nor am I suggesting that you should railroad the campaign to that ending, for the reason you pointed out: player input.
The only accurate player input we can account for is the kind that happen in the session itself. Which means planning multiple outcomes ahead of time is not any better than planning one, because there's no telling which ending the players will arrive at until they get to the climax. The best-case scenario is the easiest to imagine, and easier to change one happy ending than to ponder and revise multiple what-ifs. That could be time spent on other things.
In a pre-written adventure, the ending is literally written out. Should we follow it to the 'T'? By no means are we locked into it. But we do have an idea of where the adventure is headed, and that gives us a big picture to follow. If the journey of our campaign doesn't line up with what's suggested in the adventure books, it's up to us to find our way to an ending that makes sense. Our campaigns are no different. Which is why I mentioned to "not to be afraid to change things around in your outline"; that includes the ending.
The point of the campaign outline is to create a simple, light-weight overview of our campaign so we can adjust to the inevitable changes that player agency introduces, without sifting through a novella of notes. My goal for this video was to help us identify what stages we should consider for the final act of our campaign. Not to imply that everything must happen according to what we've pre-written. Hope this helps clarify :)