I probably won't look at comments for this video (JIC there are still meanies lurking around), but just know that I am satisfied with my first DA playthrough, I love my characters and their relationships so much. There is a lot of debate about the ending of this quest, but all I'll say is that I have faith in the person I left behind (and the one I dragged out with me 🤣). Regardless of what happens in DA4, this was a badass way to go, and such an intense quest. Thank you again, Bioware, for breaking my heart so beautifully. And thank you, mages, for supporting me through my big feelings I would fall into the abyss for you any day!
Your playthrough, your choices, your story. I'm pretty sure everyone made mistakes/not-so-popular choices during their fisrt one. Please don't let the haters get to ya. Love your playthrougs! edit: wish I could join your streams, but friggin' timezones make it impossible
I've been following your DA streams since Origins, curious as to what choices you make in each one, and having played through several times myself, I *knew* how things would end up, and honestly, this is the video I have been waiting for because of those very choices. And now, to watch the video.
I honestly have quite a bit of faith either would live, but for sure, Hawke even more so. No way Hawke doesn't kick that fey spider's ass like cmon. I still can't leave my Hawke behind for anything though haha. Holding onto that "likely" as if it were my last breath.
I've not seen another playthrough, so this was wild to see. I only got Hawke vs. Random Warden and I felt bad but sacrificed the Random Warden without a doubt. Would've helped if Bioware introduced us to him earlier on so we could have some kind of an attachment to him.
To me, it's Alistair as king (with queen Warden), sacrifice Hawke, and banish the wardens from Orlais. I don't want them in Corypheus' path, or in the Inquisition (since I couldn't avoid using them in battles that would eventually kill them off), and I just assume that my royal couple will allow them to rebuild in Ferelden (like, at Soldier's Peak). I can't sacrifice the Wardens. Not after spending a whole game trying to save the last two in Ferelden... And while I love my Hawke; her story didn't hit me emotionally as hard as my Warden's story. The Ostagar scenes still kills me. And after all they went through together, I can't in good conscience destroy what they fought so hard for. And while Hawke never would have released Corypheus knowingly, that is ultimately what she did. And she deserve to be given a chance to get in his way, by giving the wardens a chance to survive, as well as securing the Inquisitor's escape from the fade. But I have to say: Sacrificing her for a character I love and care for, was much easier than leaving her behind for Stroud...
Remember back to flemeths words in dragon age 2, "the world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment, and when it comes do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn weather you can fly". And what's the quest titled? Here lies the abyss. She knew what would happen... Hawks fate foretold and sealed. Not bad for an old old woman eh?
@@margisama I had Stroud and, despite not knowing him, I always sacrificed Hawke. My favorite game in the saga is Dragon Age Origins, but the protagonist I loved the most was Hawke. I think her story is a tragedy (On top of that, in my first gameplay, both twins died) and her dying as a hero made sense. Also...(spoiler) in the prologues if there is neither Stroud, nor Loghain nor Alistair left, the order of the Greys Wardens falls... and there are already indications that the Sixth Blight is here. I love wardens too much to allow that.
@@margisama Depends on from what perspective do you view the decision from. From the inquisitor pov in my opinion, Stroud/Alistair/Loghain is the obvious choice because the Wardens really needed a leader. Without them, the wardens of orlais/ferelden are done after what happened that day. Not to mention this is exactly the type of thing my Hawke would do. A normal guy/gal who didnt need to do anything but still did it anyway because its the right thing to do
Well, it's true we don't yet know what will come of this quest in DA4, but let's be real: Flemeth told Hawke to watch for this moment, and to not hesitate to leap. The quest's name is Here Lies the Abyss. If it was meant for someone to survive being left in the fade, it was Hawke.
@@slyktech1860 i dont think she was necessarily calling the fear demon corypheus but rather was just saying generally whatever the fear demon represents, its corypheus's doing thus she has to be the one to do it
Well in each DA game they all mention something from the previous games that you either did or someone else did and it always get connected. So If Hawke was destined to stay behind in The Fade to make us believe she'd die but she actually survives, then we'll see in Dread Wolf
Unfun fact. The original concept of that big choice in the fade was that the Warden would be your Hero of Ferelden vs Hawke. In the end they realised that would’ve been too hard to implement, so we got the three potential wardens instead.
I'm glad you addressed some of the gatekeeping in the DA community, it's truly one of the community's only weaknesses. They're usually really nice but sometimes get super judgmental when you make different choices than them lol
Youre lucky you didn't bring Varic, there is nothing more heartbreaking than having Varic turn around after leaping out of the rift asking 'Hawke! Hey, where's Hawke?"
I have seen people getting upset and criticizing your choice in dragon age origins but I think your choice is a great one because of three reasons. 1) This moment is more impactful when you care about both warden and champion. In case of Stroud or Loghain, you won't care about the warden. 2) Because Alistair is warden, he was able to talk about how much he loves the Hero of Ferelden, the king Alistair won't be doing that. 3) We got an amazing tender moment with Morrigan, Alistair and their biological son.
Hawke: Corypheus is mine! *Charges off towards the Nightmare demon* Blackwall whispering to the Inquisitor: You think we should tell her that that is not Corypheus, but the Nightmare demon? The Inquisitor: Nah.
Hopefully this’ll provide context. Sparing Loghain makes him the Warden for this questline, and you can see just how much being a Warden changed him, all while his legacy follows him. If he stays behind, then he gets remembered as a hero who fell from grace, but redeemed himself to save the world twice Stroud is your Warden if Alistair or Loghain aren’t around. If you bring your sibling to the Deep Road, they contract the taint, which will kill them. But if you brought Anders, he helps lead you to Stroud, who agrees to put the sibling through the Joining. You meet him again during the Qunari invasion. The choice isn’t as impactful because he only gets two major scenes in the game, but he still makes his character known both times before Inquisition
I dont leave comments often... But let me say this. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE your investment, I love your reactions, And that is PRECISELY why I watch. I (like many others) have been waiting for this reaction, and this decision (I had the same two there) was so hard for me. But to see that it was almost immediate for you, even through fighting tears, speaks to how sound and thoughtful your decisions are. This series emphasizes choice, and the fact that you had to make a hard one, makes the game that much more impactful and beautiful. I think you're on to something with the "likely" and how that plays into DA4, but even if you're not... THE GAME IS NOT SOLELY ABOUT HAPPY ENDINGS (NONE OF THE OTHER GAMES HAVE BEEN) They all emphasize sacrifice, and you lose people the whole way through. (EVEN YOUR OWN CHARACTER UNDER CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES) You did a great job Meg, keep being the compassionate, vulnerable soul you are.
Solas and his "I'm not mad just disappointed" sight fucking killed me I think people who insist on picking 'correct' choices for the best outcome really miss the point of roleplaying games. You arent meant to play to get the optimum results, you play to get YOUR story that results from YOUR actions. As long as your decisions are made doing what you want the consequences, good and bad, are yours and make your experience special and personal. I loved my Hawke so much, DA2 was my favorite and I really wanted her and Isabella to live a great life together. When I had to choose between Hawke and Stroud, even though I as a person cared way more about Hawke I decided to sacrifice her. I was so upset, I called my friend and cried down the phone to her. I felt so bad about bethaney losing the last of her family. about Varric losing his best friend. about Isabella losing the only person in her life who connected with her emotionally and pushed her to be the best version of herself after a lifetime of giving up on other people. But I sacrificed Hawke because I knew that the wardens needed Stroud, that my inquisitior would try to be practical and unbiased. I dont regret my choice, even though I still feel really sad about it years later because it was my characters who I love being themselves. I care too much about them to treat them like pieces to move around a chess board to reach the 'optimum outcome'. Safe harbours Isabella
This could be true true only if you knew the consequences but most of the time the game is vague in explaining your choices. A lot of times you are given 2 choices and you choose one and you are like, wait this isn't what i wanted. And even in this case the 2 choices leave hawke or the x warden is vague. The choice has a "might die "in it so it is possible the one you left behind dies or you can still find him lost in the fade or who knows becomes evil in the fade or possessed, it's all a matter of how the writers will feel when making dragon age 4 or the next dragon age games just because they let this little gate " might die" that they can choose to open later or not. Don't say that people miss the point of roleplaying games, each and all can play videogames like they want, If you want to to a blind playtrough it's your choice and you do you, but if there are people that feel lost and want a little guidance for the game and it's choices and that's the way they want to play and enjoy the game, it's not your problem:)
I totally get not wanting to know what's going to happen, to not be spoiled or swayed one way or another by the opinions of others. When watching people play games, that is what I want. The surprise, the journey. Personally I prefer playing games the opposite way though. I always have the wiki open, and I use it to reference the best people to take on certain missions or the best responses to conversations. I want things done optimally my first go around, because that's what I find to be fun. I don't enjoy myself when I mess up without meaning to. So while I agree with your main points, you are wrong about there being a "right" or "wrong" way to play games. Just because people play differently from you doesn't mean that they don't understand how to play certain games. Games are meant to be enjoyed, period. What that looks like to different people varies wildly, but one should be respectful of all ways of enjoying a game rather than putting down one certain group of gamers in order to lift up another. Except for spoiling backseaters, put those people down as much as you like.
@@alexconnor6456 haha, interesting. I kinda agree with all of you actually. But Alex, I play the same way. RPGs for me are like books. I want to know every word, every outcome, all the ways I could be and go before actually "reading" it. I want to choose my story, know what I'm reading, before I put down my time investing in it. I'm not gonna start a book I don't want to read. I want to see everything, and build my character in that way. I want to know the endings most times. Sometimes specifically, mostly vaguely (like, happy/sad), rarely, not at all. I really love surprises sometimes, I like to mix it up. Regardless, at the end of the day I'll have read every codex and wiki, seen every relationship play out, just because it's all delicious. I'll choose the story I love most and experience it to its fullest. For example, if in DA4, we can redeem Solas (and I hope it's at least possible, even if very difficult), you bet I'm gonna wait if I must until someone figures it out first to see what I need to do. There are many other things, but it's just like that for me. If I end up needing to change my world state, I will make one with edits (and then play my OG one too, first or second who knows). But yep! We all play our own way. People's playthroughs are shared freely, so if you don't like it, just, leave.
Yessss you brought Solas. He has my favorite dialogue for this quest. Absolutely have loved your playthroughs so far Meg! Been thinking about Here Lies the Abyss since you’d started DA2! Stoked with your choices too. You’re killin it! 🙏🏻🤘🏻
The episode everyone was waiting for. I've always had Alistair as King, but given this situation I'd have made the same one. Hawke feels like the right choice, she's had such a tragic life and this feels like a fitting end for her. But as others have said, there's interesting prophecies from Flemeth, so there's always hope.
Didn't Flemeth prophesised or told Hawke to watch for the moment and to not hesitate to leap or something? Which kinda foreshadows her death but also not her death? If Hawke was destined to stay behind and somehow survive, we'll have to see in Dread Wolf. And besides, every DA game all show the outcomes of certain choices made in every DA game so it is certain we're gonna see Hawke (alive), see/hear The Hero of Ferelden, The Inquisitor (regardless if you romanced Solas or no) and any other characters from all 3 games.
Flemeth: The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment... and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly.
Hello, Meg! I’m a new subscriber and just wanted to say that you’re a wonderful person and I’m glad I found you. I find your personality so warm and welcoming, and your thoughts interesting. Thank you for your content and stay safe!❤️
This was the easiest decision for me because it was Stroud. I by some chance had Alistair become king and so, to me, the choice was "me" or some random dude I had seen like twice before. Pretty easy. Stroud seemed a good man, but it was no choice between him and Hawke.
A lot of people prefer to make Alistair a King but I feel like he’s happier with the wardens, his home. The only tragic thing is that you need to sacrifice hawke :(
To be slightly fair to some and to give a little bit of clarification, a lot of people when making Alistair king they are playing/ have played as Cousland, the noble human origin, [SPOILER] whom hasbthe possibility to become Alistair's queen if they are in a romance, which makes it "the perfect ending" with Alistair because he actually accepts his rol as king and becomes one of the greatest Ferelden has ever had. [END SPOILER] But people been straight up bullies and mean to you has no excuse. If they think you are making bad choices, then they should stop watching you and play the game themselves. This js your first playthrough through the saga, I think is beautiful you are following your heart's desires while you play it, so keep doing it. Is delightful seeing you play ✨
@@ecksbest yeah I know but I'm talking in a case for people like Meg whom want a happy Alistair. The dialogue when hardening Alistair is quite mean if you play the rest of the game laughing at his jokes and be overall kind. Also I'm talking in the case of people whom romance Alistair, like Meg did.
@@itslukalee But even when you let a female Cousland and King Alistair marry, he needs to be hardenend to accept his role, at least in DAO. His personality doesn´t make much difference in the next games. The hardening trigger is just written bad. Alistair refers to something completly different you said to him when talking to him after his personal quest. Alistair´s version is much nicer, but a player doesn´t know that until that point.
@@sneakysquirrel7352 if you don't hardened him while meeting his sister and you kill Loghain instead of him, you can have Alistair as king unhardened and Cousland as Queen. In this case, he accepts his role as king out of love for the warden, trusting she will be there to help him rule. He only needs to be hardened when becoming King if you want your Warden to be his mistress/right hand. Is completely possible to have an unhardened Alistair as King. And as you said, yeah, his personality doesn't really change in the next games, but personally I think it leaves you with a better gratification of what his life has went after Origins. As king in DA2, he's still a jokester for the little time you interact with him, looking like his actually happy within his first years of reign and with the Warden as queen, his "old ball and chain". And in DA:I, puts you a little bit more at ease thinking that his harsh treatment to Fiona and the mages on their recruitment mission in Redcliff is a combination of him hearing The Calling and having the Warden apart from him trying to find a cure for the Joining, not only to leave at peace, but to be able to give Ferelden an heir. I agree that the hardening is bad written, but can be completely avoidable.
@@itslukalee But I wanted to argue that he only truly accepts his role, means he embraces it, when he he is hardened. When not the lacks the confidence to do do and thinks he will be a bad king. Even when married he didn´t seemed to be happy with his new role. My first Cousland playthrough was such a paring His joker side actually concerned me because when he jokes a lot and seems to be not taking his job seriously, it means, at least in my eyes, he hides his unhappiness und anxieties. But when he was hardened, he had still his joker side, but he seemd to be a lot more at ease with himself and the situation and he was more relaxed and a litttle bit grumpy and badass at times, which I adore. I truly enyoed this character development and I will never make him king if he doesn´t say to me "Make me king". But in DA2 and DAI I was utterly disappointed, becasue there was no real continuation of this character development. I was mad that they merged his unhardend self with his hardened self. They are not the same person!
@@sneakysquirrel7352 yeah, I get what you are saying. And you're right, is disappointing how they didn't make any difference in the next games out of that outcome.
On my first play through I sacrificed Hawke as well - since I had no clue about the previous games. I sacrificed them instead of Stroud because I knew them both 'equally'. Really, I knew them as well as my Inky did. I didn't know about all the shit Hawke went through in Kirkwall. I just knew 'Hawke has history with Corypheus' and 'Stroud is a senior warden who stood up against this whole plan'. So, Hawke stayed. After I played DA:2 I never left Hawke behind in the fade because ... well, now I knew them and the shit they went through. They suffered so much and I didn't want them to suffer yet again. Also, not gonna lie, Fenris was gonna totally wreck my weak ass rogue/mage Inky xD Don't need that grief stricken hot boi coming for me. BUT I totally get why one would sacrifice Hawke. I've done it - and not even when it was with Alistair, but with random warden dude xD
Proud of you sticking up against the backseating meta-gamers. Especially in the wake of such an emotional decision. And I appreciate so much your willingness to be vulnerable for your viewers. It’s why I’ve fallen in love with your content. It’s not something I could do- my crying and emotion was completely in the privacy and safety of my own room. So keep being you because the real ones support that (your core community seems so incredible and amazing and supportive). My Inquistor had Loghain/Hawke and he saved Hawke. In his mind (with the info he had right there)- that situation was not Hawke’s fault- it was the Wardens, he didn’t think Hawke should sacrifice himself for it. In terms of rebuilding- he knows the Hero is out there somewhere, at -that- point he also believed Blackwall would’ve had the capability I think the “Hawke will survive because of Flemeth’s prophecy” is wishful thinking but if I turn out to be wrong I won’t be mad about it. (Also I had that world state with Queen Anora, Warden Loghain, and drunk Alistair. My Warden was trying to be practical and have the political marriage and a useful Warden but it didn’t work out). But like majority of major BioWare choice there’s pros and cons on all outcomes and in my mind no “perfect” outcome, only an outcome that makes sense for your character and their context.
Just like my recent Origins playthrough it made sense for my power hungry human noble to be Alistair’s queen and have Anora/Loghain dead.) Currently continuing that world with a power grabbing wants to be Viscount supports the Templars Red Hawke. I’m curious as to what my power hungry Inquisitor continuation will do. I don’t think I’ll know u til I get there and inhabit that character
Yeah, that's a hard choice. The only reason I didn't have to make it, is because my first Warden was a female noble origin, so she and Alistair are quite happily married as king and queen of Ferelden lol, but it does diminish the importance of that choice by quite a bit. It's always Stroud that dies in that scenario, not even a thought is given to any other option. But when Alistair stays as a Warden, yeah, I leave my Hawke behind too. My thought process is that, while I love Hawke, they're ME. Just like the Warden and the Inquisitor. And I would absolutely sacrifice myself for those I love, and I sure love Alistair. So Hawke goes. But yeah, it's extremely sad when that's a choice, and I always feel bad for Varric most of all.
I actually hate the "Warden vs Hawke" decision because it is only a moral conundrum for the player and not for the Inquisitor as a character. The Inquisitor barely knows Hawke or Alistar/Loghain/Stroud yet it is made out to be this big tragic choice that they are barely able to make. But it is only a tragic choice for the player. The Inquisitor doesn't have any kind of attachment to these characters outside of a strictly professional one. Contrast this with the Virmire decision in Mass Effect 1, where that is both a big decision for the player and for Shepard as a character simultaneously. Both Shepard and the player see Kaiden and Ashley and friends and colleagues. And the fact that one of them could be in a relationship with Shepard compounds with that. "Will Kaiden think less of me when he dies since he knows I chose Ashley because I'm sleeping with her?" That is not the case in Inquisition and the choice is lesser as a result.
My Grey Warden was Loghain, and yet I still chose Hawke to stay behind. I don't know why, but this seems like a fitting end for this character, especially considering Flemeth's words in DA2. Plus, Wardens needed a Leader, and Loghain, someone who caused the destruction of Grey Wardens in DAO, being the one to rebuild and lead them forward (and not just any Grey Wardens, but Orlesian ones) seemed super ironic and poetic to me.
I actually gasped when you made your choice. I just thought you loved them too much and it was a genuinely a devastating moment. It always was and it's so difficult to see someone face that for the first time.
this was the first stream i ever caught live. it gave me a ton of new perspective on this quest. if you have a king alistair (i always either had him unite the lands with anora or with trevelyan so he was never ruling on his own) and played a hawke whose sibling was rescued by stroud in the deep roads, this choice can have SOME weight. stroud is not just a rando warden and you have SOME history with him. hawke being familiar with stroud and arguing with him felt more real to me thanks to that history. and that’s how i always justified my choices. but watching this happen organically, with no prior knowledge other than “meg will be sad,” this was even more of an emotional gut punch than even just simply watching alistair and hawke in the fade. this is how it was meant to feel, imo. and i hate it but i rate it at the same time. your choices are your own, and that’s the beauty of this series. each one of us can have our own canon playthrough and catch scenes we would have otherwise missed (for instance that blackwall scene in the tavern that i’ve never seen before until your stream and my jaw DROPPED) 😂♥️ as always, thank you for sharing your journey with us!
BioWare was being sneaky with that choice, it says likely, not will. So there’s a chance we see either choice roaming the fade in some future installment
Oof. In my first play through I brought Varric with me so at the end instead of some rando soldier I had Varric tearfully ask about Hawke and it broke my heart. I had to reload an older save.
"Sorry Fenris" THE SCREAM I LET OUT IN PURE SORROW PLEASE I was never able to play the other dragon age games- ps4 and what not. So seeing this, and having it actually hurt...it's... wow. Hawke was amazing. I hope you don't have to end up breaking the news to Fenris if he is in the next dragon age game.
1:57:58- Love how Inquisition pulls a Mass Effect 1 of "choose which one dies", but this time (possibly) with characters who you ACTUALLY care about... 😨😨🥺🥺😭😭
Mass Effect 1 did it better though. Since Shepard as a character is actually invested and views them both as friends and family unlike the Inquisitor who just met Hawke and the Warden a week ago.
@@kutless45 That's true. However, the player themselves is far more invested in Alistair and Hawke likely if they completed the first 2 games properly (as everyone should)!
@@michaelmcclelland9876 But that's the problem. Its an out of character choice that the character you play has does not care one way or the other on. They have created a divide between player and character for the sake of a cheap choice.
@@kutless45 My Shepard mistreated both Ashley and Kaiden, so it doesn't exactly make PERFECT sense why he would care so much about either of them dying... Lol
@@michaelmcclelland9876 To me choosing between Alistair and Hawke is kinda like choosing between Mordin and Wrex. I loved them both but i knew that it was what Mordin wanted. The scene when Wrex gets to know about genophage's sabotage and attacks Shepard is just too heartbreaking.
"I know what I have to do but it's really hard", my thoughts exactly XD btw I think hawke will survive and we will see him/her again in DA:4 Great video, I love how you live the game, and beautiful character you made!
I applaud you in the decisions you made! I don't have to heart to choose hawk but it's your playthrough and you should be proud of everything you have chosen! Am loving your content
I often wonder if perhaps the original plan for this quest, (at least at any time in the early development stages of the game), would have been choosing between the Hero of Ferelden (if they survived DAO) or the Champion of Kirkwall to be left behind in the Fade..? How much more crushing/punishing that would that have been for players, I wonder..?
My first playthrough I made Alistair king and when it came to this part of the game, it was an easy choice. What is now my canon playthrough that will carry on to DA4, Hawke stays behind. Only because I'm hopeful that Hawke still has enough plot armour left to make it to the next installment of the franchise.
I knew this playthrough would be painful, it was a tough choice but it will resonate more with the player. like you said, it would be Loghain or Alister, or Stroud. You can meet Stroud In DA2 while Qunaris are taking over the city if Alister wasn't present (DA2 potential spoiler **** In case you bring Carver or Bethany with you to the deep road expedition and you have Anders with you, Stroud save your sibling from the blight diseases, later on, Hawke sibling will become a gray warden ***** ).
I accidentally sacrificed Hawke, because I was like, "will likely die," doesn't mean anything serious, and that Dragon Age isn't going to kill off Hawke for sure! I was wrong. I was crushed. Tears are warranted; and ANY one person sieving the obvious implication of their own mistakes through the lense of someone else shedding tears on the internet, written in their 'Har-dee-har YOU are gonna be wronnggg', because they believe themselves to singularly, premeditatively understand *ALONE* someone else's consequences being made in a game that's currently a Trilogy is not being serious. Like, seriously; if you're looking for that weird, vicarious--'human' experience of traveling along numerous narrative timelines, then you can literally just dive back into the game or spend a few hours clicking back-n-forth through the pages of Dragon Age Keep. Not whatever those fiends in chat were doing stuffing coal in stockings 24/7.
I love the reasoning that you as a player of DA2 played as Hawke and can make that decision. I have never been forced to make that decision, because I happend to prefer Alistair as King, and now I will never look back
okay controversial personal thought, but Logain is such an interesting character/villain, making him a warden is such an underrated and interesting choice. But we all know we cant lose Alastair over it. In my personal playthrough, Alastair and Anora rule and Logain becomes a warden, with Logain as the father of Morrigan’s son.
Gotta keep Alistair alive cause it's hinted through his blood it could cure the wardens. So no matter what I sacrifice Hawke or stroud or Logain if Alistair happens to be there. Sucks but gotta do what's best for the world not just the wardens. If they don't have a leader currently so what? Just given time they'll be back, but Alistairs blood is the only thing we got
In my canon Alistair isn't king because he didn't want to be and didn't want to make the love of his life (my warden) forced into being a queen or mistress to him because thats also not what my warden wanted. They wanted to find a cure for the calling and then live out their days in a cottage on the countryside. I agree whole heartedly with your decision to not make Alistair king, and would have agreed with whatever decision you made regardless because this is your playthrough and your decisions are what make you happy! It isn't up to anyone else to decide what is the best option for YOUR playthrough! That is the beauty of these games! The players decide what is right for them! People should not try to make you feel bad for playing the game the way you want instead of playing it the way they want you to play it! I'm sorry people have been mean to you about your choices you don't deserve that! p.s. I know this playthrough is from years ago and you may never see this comment but I wanted to say this anyway! can't wait to see your reactions to DA4!
My Warden romanced Alistair and he gave up everything so they could be together. When given the choice I practically yeeted my Hawke into the Fade. Sorry, Varric, but my Amell's happiness comes first.
I actually stood on taht particular choice for an hour before I made the decision to sacrifice Hawke - and only because Flemeth said that when Hawke sees the Abyss to make sure to jump. This quest is called Here Lies the Abyss. This was my cope. I hope that this meant that sending Hawke would solve whatever issue there is in there and be able to survive while anyone who isn't Hawke wouldn't be able to survive. I hope I'm right. Also idk if you played this again, but IIRC if you take Varric with you in Here Lies the Abyss, Varric runs towards you right before you have to answer about what Hawke did and asks twice where Hawke is, and when he realizes Hawke's dead, he walks away.
This is why I let Loghain live, and I made Alistair rule with Anora. I was fine with my female warden being a mistress to King Alistair, I’m so glad I never had to make this decision
Hey Meg!!! Just wanted to say I see what you mean about how you as an individual human being with morals, values and opinions see Alistair best path is to stay a grey warden. It is about what we as an individual placing ourselves in a mindset of this character. One thing people forget is that war is not sunshine and rainbows, it is filled with death and so many good people die. It is a part of life. When I myself first played DAO I went in 100% blind and I as another individual with differing morals, values and opinions saw Alistair stagnating in the grey warden because at that point in my life I was stagnating in life too. I thought it be best to harden Alistair and become king. It is all about our experiences in life. I didn’t have any guides or walkthrough just my cousin helping me with the janky controls sometimes, he never said anything bad about my choices as a 13year old. He just watched. Don’t give up with games that have choices and paths. You do you. Love you so much Meg. I remember the first play though I did of dao. As I said before Alistair was a hardened king, my fem warden was dalish and I didn’t do the ritual so I bawled my eyes out for so long. I romanced Alistair and the little turd broke my heart and broke up with me, then my warden died. I make that my canon play though even though now I play the game differently as times have changed for me. That first one will always stick with me. We will see when da4 comes out . I hope you aren’t discouraged into never playing this game series again cause some don’t want to see your personally choices. You play the game how you want…plus if BioWare wanted the one true way they wouldn’t have put multiple pathways in the game. ❤️❤️❤️
GIRL, you have no idea how happy I am to finally see someone reason in a similar way as I did when playing these games! I kept Alistair as a warden my first time around and let Anora have the throne (absolutely love her btw). When I finished Origins and started looking online for discussions of the game I was actually shocked to find out that it seemed like almost everyone made Alistair king. Like...even after years I've still found very few who didn't LOL. Despite my canon and first playthrough being a human noble, it didn't feel right for me to make him king, neither to have my warden rule with him. I felt like Anora was already capable on her own and that Alistair and my character needed to rebuild the wardens and focus on their order. When Inquisition came out and I played that, I was so ecstatic to have him with me for such a huge chunk of the game - and that choice in Here Lies the Abyss? I felt exactly like you did. I left Hawke too, and I would regardless of who the warden was (because as you said, without a warden they're leaderless), but the fact that it was Alistair made this mission leave such a huge emotional impact on me. Oh, and I also romanced Fenris first time around but kept thinking my purple Hawke should be with Isabella LMAO (saw you mention something about considering that on another video), I went with her for my second playthrough and never regretted it. She's my canon DA2 romance now :) I'd thoroughly enjoy your content regardless of the choices you make, but it's really nice to see someone stray from what so many people deem the "correct" choices to be and stick to what they want. Keep it up
I honestly might replay DA2 for my canon playthrough and have her end up with Isabella. That’s the only thing I would change about it. 😂❤️ thank you so much!!
My choice of who leave behind the fade is much easier. Because in my playthrough, Alistair become King so Warden Stroud will be there and I left him behind. It makes no sense for me to leave Hawke there and Warden are natural good fighter that Stroud could have a slight chance to escape once he distracted Corypheus. EDIT: Seriously though, if I have to choose from Hawke or Alistair, Hawke will be my pick because she is far capable to handle such situation by herself.
Its so sad to see people being mean to you over your choices or reactions. I love seeing people make choices different from my own and seeing your reactions to these events is really fun. I've played all the DA games dozens of times so I know what the consequences are to my actions, but watching your playthrough is like being able to play them again for the first time ❤❤
Honestly the only reason I didn’t sacrifice Hawke in my canon play through ( King Alistair so I had Stroud ) was because I don’t trust BioWare to not pull a fast one on us and either kill off Hawke or give her a fate worse than death. If I’m wrong, I will gladly go back and change that decision because I agree that it’s the most appropriate choice story ( and character ) wise, even with Alistair as king.
I think the Elf that was sacrificed was the one you encouraged to join the grey wardens in Crestwood...so sorta in a way died because of you. Not trying make ya feel bad I was just thinking about it lol
I believe That Hawke was meant to fight the demon. Flemeth foretold it, and as (canonically) a mage they are better equipped to fight a demon in the fade and survive than just a single grey warden. Regardless of how events turn out, I don't think Alistair's warden instincts would make him very happy as king. On top of that whether or not they show it in the game, he would still hear the calling just like all the other's. It's best he stay with the wardens.
I don’t give a damn to what Flemeth said, Hawke is me myself, Alistair is just a companion. As much as you love your companion, he is not you. When it’s a matter of life or death, you yourself is most important.(unless you are sacrificing yourself for your loved one, that is)
I too also felt instinctively that Hawke is the one who is supposed to be left behind BUT I COULDN'T MAKE THAT CHOICE. I had Stroud in my "canon/original" playthrough as the Warden here, but I was thinking about the collapse of the Wardens and the impact this decision will likely have on the future games. Also, from the Inquisitor's perspective saving the Grey Warden order is more sensical than saving Hawke who is just a recently met companion. I literally sat there thinking for a few good minutes and made the selfish choice to save Hawke. But I'll have to live with those consequences come DA4. I also agree with your gatekeeping comments! Just play it once through organically based on your own actual choices. The DA franchise has so much replay ability, that's what multiple playthroughs are for. To make different choices. 🤷♀️
lol, I feel like one of the few who will drop Alistair in a heartbeat. Guess that's the gift I get for falling for Zevran. I love Ali to bits, but I'm not leaving Fenris and Varric alone for anything. Even if I had romanced Ali, I'd still leave him. Cause I know my girl would be just fine. Thankfully he ended up King so I didn't have to make this choice.
I applaud you looking for all the details. But you missed the opportunity to actually look at the black city from quite close. Its far more closer than when we see it in Awakening.
You did teh right decision to leave Hawke behind. That was the advise Flemeth gave to her in Dragon Age 2. _"We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment - and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly."_
And this is why Alistair is always King in my playthroughs...hardened or not he DOES grow to be a good king and he's my Warden's bestie.....And...sorry Stroud but I love my Hawke too much to deprive her of her happy ending with Fenris :P
I don't think my choice to let Alistair marry Anora and become King was about min maxing. I always romance Morrigan, and Alistair becoming king, though not what he wants, is what is best for his country. That is a sacrificial decision too. I also sacrificed Hawke in the fade, because it was the right choice to make, but not the emotionally appealing one.
AAAAAANNND this is why Alistair is always king in my canon playthrough (with my Hero of Ferelden as his queen👸) so that I can keep Hawke alive and just sacrifice Warden Stroud 🤷♀️ not hating, just saying, making alistair the king is not always a bad choice. It saves you from this situation
There are no good choices here. Sorry that you had to face this decision, but I felt you were going to pick Hawke because you would sacrifice yourself to save a loved one. DAO holds a special place in every Dragon Age players heart. I wonder whomever is left in the Fade show up in DA4. I know from a story perspective they die in the Fade but they could always change that in DA4.
I probably won't look at comments for this video (JIC there are still meanies lurking around), but just know that I am satisfied with my first DA playthrough, I love my characters and their relationships so much. There is a lot of debate about the ending of this quest, but all I'll say is that I have faith in the person I left behind (and the one I dragged out with me 🤣). Regardless of what happens in DA4, this was a badass way to go, and such an intense quest. Thank you again, Bioware, for breaking my heart so beautifully. And thank you, mages, for supporting me through my big feelings I would fall into the abyss for you any day!
Your playthrough, your choices, your story. I'm pretty sure everyone made mistakes/not-so-popular choices during their fisrt one. Please don't let the haters get to ya. Love your playthrougs!
edit: wish I could join your streams, but friggin' timezones make it impossible
I've been following your DA streams since Origins, curious as to what choices you make in each one, and having played through several times myself, I *knew* how things would end up, and honestly, this is the video I have been waiting for because of those very choices. And now, to watch the video.
The Eluvian
I honestly have quite a bit of faith either would live, but for sure, Hawke even more so. No way Hawke doesn't kick that fey spider's ass like cmon. I still can't leave my Hawke behind for anything though haha. Holding onto that "likely" as if it were my last breath.
I think this is probably the most impactful decision to make and I'm really glad I got to see someone come to it organically.
I've not seen another playthrough, so this was wild to see. I only got Hawke vs. Random Warden and I felt bad but sacrificed the Random Warden without a doubt. Would've helped if Bioware introduced us to him earlier on so we could have some kind of an attachment to him.
@@writershard5065 he was introduced in dragon age 2
I have a hard and fast rule about this decision: If Alistair is the Warden, Hawke stays behind. If not, the Warden stays behind.
To me, it's Alistair as king (with queen Warden), sacrifice Hawke, and banish the wardens from Orlais. I don't want them in Corypheus' path, or in the Inquisition (since I couldn't avoid using them in battles that would eventually kill them off), and I just assume that my royal couple will allow them to rebuild in Ferelden (like, at Soldier's Peak).
I can't sacrifice the Wardens. Not after spending a whole game trying to save the last two in Ferelden... And while I love my Hawke; her story didn't hit me emotionally as hard as my Warden's story. The Ostagar scenes still kills me. And after all they went through together, I can't in good conscience destroy what they fought so hard for.
And while Hawke never would have released Corypheus knowingly, that is ultimately what she did. And she deserve to be given a chance to get in his way, by giving the wardens a chance to survive, as well as securing the Inquisitor's escape from the fade.
But I have to say: Sacrificing her for a character I love and care for, was much easier than leaving her behind for Stroud...
Alistair is always king for me cause I'm not having me being killed or my buddy Alistair. Especially since i romance fenris
To me its Hawke every time simply because 1) That's just who he is 2) It goes in line with exactly what Flemeth told him
@@Wanted.ForArsonin the books Alistair is alive and king of ferelden
Remember back to flemeths words in dragon age 2, "the world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment, and when it comes do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn weather you can fly".
And what's the quest titled? Here lies the abyss. She knew what would happen... Hawks fate foretold and sealed. Not bad for an old old woman eh?
maybe that same prophecy allows Hawke to survive the fight
Except my Hawke is never sacrificed because who cares about Stroud?
@@margisama I had Stroud and, despite not knowing him, I always sacrificed Hawke. My favorite game in the saga is Dragon Age Origins, but the protagonist I loved the most was Hawke. I think her story is a tragedy (On top of that, in my first gameplay, both twins died) and her dying as a hero made sense. Also...(spoiler) in the prologues if there is neither Stroud, nor Loghain nor Alistair left, the order of the Greys Wardens falls... and there are already indications that the Sixth Blight is here. I love wardens too much to allow that.
Damn. I didn't even pick up on that.
@@margisama Depends on from what perspective do you view the decision from. From the inquisitor pov in my opinion, Stroud/Alistair/Loghain is the obvious choice because the Wardens really needed a leader. Without them, the wardens of orlais/ferelden are done after what happened that day. Not to mention this is exactly the type of thing my Hawke would do. A normal guy/gal who didnt need to do anything but still did it anyway because its the right thing to do
Well, it's true we don't yet know what will come of this quest in DA4, but let's be real: Flemeth told Hawke to watch for this moment, and to not hesitate to leap. The quest's name is Here Lies the Abyss. If it was meant for someone to survive being left in the fade, it was Hawke.
They have to have some kind of bad impact for not sending Hawke into the Abyss to defeat the Nightmare. Do they explain why she calls it Corypheus?
@@slyktech1860 i dont think she was necessarily calling the fear demon corypheus but rather was just saying generally whatever the fear demon represents, its corypheus's doing thus she has to be the one to do it
@@slyktech1860 she does not call it Corypheus, she just admits that all this mess is her fault as she was the one to set Corypheus free.
Well in each DA game they all mention something from the previous games that you either did or someone else did and it always get connected. So If Hawke was destined to stay behind in The Fade to make us believe she'd die but she actually survives, then we'll see in Dread Wolf
Unfun fact. The original concept of that big choice in the fade was that the Warden would be your Hero of Ferelden vs Hawke. In the end they realised that would’ve been too hard to implement, so we got the three potential wardens instead.
I would probably saved the Hero of Ferelden. But a difficult choice indeed 😟
That wouldve been an even more difficult choice but yeah, the problem is that the warden isnt a voiced character
@@khalduras784or can die in there game as well
I'm glad you addressed some of the gatekeeping in the DA community, it's truly one of the community's only weaknesses. They're usually really nice but sometimes get super judgmental when you make different choices than them lol
There was only 1 reason Varric didn't want to bring Hawke...
Youre lucky you didn't bring Varic, there is nothing more heartbreaking than having Varic turn around after leaping out of the rift asking 'Hawke! Hey, where's Hawke?"
your aggressive 'let me romance her!!!' about cassandra was the biggest mood btw 😆
I knew this moment was going to wreck you emotionally, but remember, only the best games give you this kind of feeling!
I have seen people getting upset and criticizing your choice in dragon age origins but I think your choice is a great one because of three reasons.
1) This moment is more impactful when you care about both warden and champion. In case of Stroud or Loghain, you won't care about the warden.
2) Because Alistair is warden, he was able to talk about how much he loves the Hero of Ferelden, the king Alistair won't be doing that.
3) We got an amazing tender moment with Morrigan, Alistair and their biological son.
Thank you 💜
also, flemeth's prophecy in da2...
@@mrsgreenleaf - absolutely epic!!!
@@supergirlvideoclips894 it really is! one of my favorite lines.
Hawke: Corypheus is mine! *Charges off towards the Nightmare demon*
Blackwall whispering to the Inquisitor: You think we should tell her that that is not Corypheus, but the Nightmare demon?
The Inquisitor: Nah.
Hopefully this’ll provide context.
Sparing Loghain makes him the Warden for this questline, and you can see just how much being a Warden changed him, all while his legacy follows him. If he stays behind, then he gets remembered as a hero who fell from grace, but redeemed himself to save the world twice
Stroud is your Warden if Alistair or Loghain aren’t around. If you bring your sibling to the Deep Road, they contract the taint, which will kill them. But if you brought Anders, he helps lead you to Stroud, who agrees to put the sibling through the Joining. You meet him again during the Qunari invasion. The choice isn’t as impactful because he only gets two major scenes in the game, but he still makes his character known both times before Inquisition
I dont leave comments often... But let me say this. I ABSOLUTELY LOVE your investment, I love your reactions, And that is PRECISELY why I watch. I (like many others) have been waiting for this reaction, and this decision (I had the same two there) was so hard for me. But to see that it was almost immediate for you, even through fighting tears, speaks to how sound and thoughtful your decisions are. This series emphasizes choice, and the fact that you had to make a hard one, makes the game that much more impactful and beautiful. I think you're on to something with the "likely" and how that plays into DA4, but even if you're not... THE GAME IS NOT SOLELY ABOUT HAPPY ENDINGS (NONE OF THE OTHER GAMES HAVE BEEN) They all emphasize sacrifice, and you lose people the whole way through. (EVEN YOUR OWN CHARACTER UNDER CERTAIN CIRCUMSTANCES) You did a great job Meg, keep being the compassionate, vulnerable soul you are.
Solas and his "I'm not mad just disappointed" sight fucking killed me
I think people who insist on picking 'correct' choices for the best outcome really miss the point of roleplaying games. You arent meant to play to get the optimum results, you play to get YOUR story that results from YOUR actions. As long as your decisions are made doing what you want the consequences, good and bad, are yours and make your experience special and personal. I loved my Hawke so much, DA2 was my favorite and I really wanted her and Isabella to live a great life together. When I had to choose between Hawke and Stroud, even though I as a person cared way more about Hawke I decided to sacrifice her. I was so upset, I called my friend and cried down the phone to her. I felt so bad about bethaney losing the last of her family. about Varric losing his best friend. about Isabella losing the only person in her life who connected with her emotionally and pushed her to be the best version of herself after a lifetime of giving up on other people. But I sacrificed Hawke because I knew that the wardens needed Stroud, that my inquisitior would try to be practical and unbiased. I dont regret my choice, even though I still feel really sad about it years later because it was my characters who I love being themselves. I care too much about them to treat them like pieces to move around a chess board to reach the 'optimum outcome'.
Safe harbours Isabella
This could be true true only if you knew the consequences but most of the time the game is vague in explaining your choices. A lot of times you are given 2 choices and you choose one and you are like, wait this isn't what i wanted. And even in this case the 2 choices leave hawke or the x warden is vague. The choice has a "might die "in it so it is possible the one you left behind dies or you can still find him lost in the fade or who knows becomes evil in the fade or possessed, it's all a matter of how the writers will feel when making dragon age 4 or the next dragon age games just because they let this little gate " might die" that they can choose to open later or not. Don't say that people miss the point of roleplaying games, each and all can play videogames like they want, If you want to to a blind playtrough it's your choice and you do you, but if there are people that feel lost and want a little guidance for the game and it's choices and that's the way they want to play and enjoy the game, it's not your problem:)
I totally get not wanting to know what's going to happen, to not be spoiled or swayed one way or another by the opinions of others. When watching people play games, that is what I want. The surprise, the journey.
Personally I prefer playing games the opposite way though. I always have the wiki open, and I use it to reference the best people to take on certain missions or the best responses to conversations. I want things done optimally my first go around, because that's what I find to be fun. I don't enjoy myself when I mess up without meaning to.
So while I agree with your main points, you are wrong about there being a "right" or "wrong" way to play games. Just because people play differently from you doesn't mean that they don't understand how to play certain games. Games are meant to be enjoyed, period. What that looks like to different people varies wildly, but one should be respectful of all ways of enjoying a game rather than putting down one certain group of gamers in order to lift up another.
Except for spoiling backseaters, put those people down as much as you like.
@@alexconnor6456 haha, interesting. I kinda agree with all of you actually. But Alex, I play the same way. RPGs for me are like books. I want to know every word, every outcome, all the ways I could be and go before actually "reading" it. I want to choose my story, know what I'm reading, before I put down my time investing in it.
I'm not gonna start a book I don't want to read. I want to see everything, and build my character in that way. I want to know the endings most times. Sometimes specifically, mostly vaguely (like, happy/sad), rarely, not at all. I really love surprises sometimes, I like to mix it up. Regardless, at the end of the day I'll have read every codex and wiki, seen every relationship play out, just because it's all delicious. I'll choose the story I love most and experience it to its fullest.
For example, if in DA4, we can redeem Solas (and I hope it's at least possible, even if very difficult), you bet I'm gonna wait if I must until someone figures it out first to see what I need to do. There are many other things, but it's just like that for me. If I end up needing to change my world state, I will make one with edits (and then play my OG one too, first or second who knows). But yep! We all play our own way. People's playthroughs are shared freely, so if you don't like it, just, leave.
Yessss you brought Solas. He has my favorite dialogue for this quest.
Absolutely have loved your playthroughs so far Meg! Been thinking about Here Lies the Abyss since you’d started DA2! Stoked with your choices too. You’re killin it! 🙏🏻🤘🏻
The episode everyone was waiting for. I've always had Alistair as King, but given this situation I'd have made the same one. Hawke feels like the right choice, she's had such a tragic life and this feels like a fitting end for her. But as others have said, there's interesting prophecies from Flemeth, so there's always hope.
Didn't Flemeth prophesised or told Hawke to watch for the moment and to not hesitate to leap or something? Which kinda foreshadows her death but also not her death? If Hawke was destined to stay behind and somehow survive, we'll have to see in Dread Wolf. And besides, every DA game all show the outcomes of certain choices made in every DA game so it is certain we're gonna see Hawke (alive), see/hear The Hero of Ferelden, The Inquisitor (regardless if you romanced Solas or no) and any other characters from all 3 games.
I had the exact same reaction during my first playthrough. Bioware is very good at these heart-wrenching, cry your eyes out moments.
dragon age is the series that stabs you and just keeps twisting
Edit: if anyone can survive the fade, its Hawke
1:57:57 - the die was cast all the way back at the landsmeet. felt for the tough choice building to this moment. quite the journey from then to now
Inquisitor: Wait a minute,we were in the Fade,how did we end up on Virmire?😁😎
Flemeth: The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment... and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly.
Hello, Meg! I’m a new subscriber and just wanted to say that you’re a wonderful person and I’m glad I found you. I find your personality so warm and welcoming, and your thoughts interesting. Thank you for your content and stay safe!❤️
This was the easiest decision for me because it was Stroud. I by some chance had Alistair become king and so, to me, the choice was "me" or some random dude I had seen like twice before. Pretty easy. Stroud seemed a good man, but it was no choice between him and Hawke.
A lot of people prefer to make Alistair a King but I feel like he’s happier with the wardens, his home. The only tragic thing is that you need to sacrifice hawke :(
To be slightly fair to some and to give a little bit of clarification, a lot of people when making Alistair king they are playing/ have played as Cousland, the noble human origin, [SPOILER] whom hasbthe possibility to become Alistair's queen if they are in a romance, which makes it "the perfect ending" with Alistair because he actually accepts his rol as king and becomes one of the greatest Ferelden has ever had. [END SPOILER]
But people been straight up bullies and mean to you has no excuse. If they think you are making bad choices, then they should stop watching you and play the game themselves. This js your first playthrough through the saga, I think is beautiful you are following your heart's desires while you play it, so keep doing it. Is delightful seeing you play ✨
@@ecksbest yeah I know but I'm talking in a case for people like Meg whom want a happy Alistair. The dialogue when hardening Alistair is quite mean if you play the rest of the game laughing at his jokes and be overall kind.
Also I'm talking in the case of people whom romance Alistair, like Meg did.
@@itslukalee But even when you let a female Cousland and King Alistair marry, he needs to be hardenend to accept his role, at least in DAO. His personality doesn´t make much difference in the next games. The hardening trigger is just written bad. Alistair refers to something completly different you said to him when talking to him after his personal quest. Alistair´s version is much nicer, but a player doesn´t know that until that point.
@@sneakysquirrel7352 if you don't hardened him while meeting his sister and you kill Loghain instead of him, you can have Alistair as king unhardened and Cousland as Queen. In this case, he accepts his role as king out of love for the warden, trusting she will be there to help him rule.
He only needs to be hardened when becoming King if you want your Warden to be his mistress/right hand. Is completely possible to have an unhardened Alistair as King.
And as you said, yeah, his personality doesn't really change in the next games, but personally I think it leaves you with a better gratification of what his life has went after Origins. As king in DA2, he's still a jokester for the little time you interact with him, looking like his actually happy within his first years of reign and with the Warden as queen, his "old ball and chain". And in DA:I, puts you a little bit more at ease thinking that his harsh treatment to Fiona and the mages on their recruitment mission in Redcliff is a combination of him hearing The Calling and having the Warden apart from him trying to find a cure for the Joining, not only to leave at peace, but to be able to give Ferelden an heir.
I agree that the hardening is bad written, but can be completely avoidable.
@@itslukalee But I wanted to argue that he only truly accepts his role, means he embraces it, when he he is hardened. When not the lacks the confidence to do do and thinks he will be a bad king. Even when married he didn´t seemed to be happy with his new role. My first Cousland playthrough was such a paring His joker side actually concerned me because when he jokes a lot and seems to be not taking his job seriously, it means, at least in my eyes, he hides his unhappiness und anxieties. But when he was hardened, he had still his joker side, but he seemd to be a lot more at ease with himself and the situation and he was more relaxed and a litttle bit grumpy and badass at times, which I adore. I truly enyoed this character development and I will never make him king if he doesn´t say to me "Make me king". But in DA2 and DAI I was utterly disappointed, becasue there was no real continuation of this character development. I was mad that they merged his unhardend self with his hardened self. They are not the same person!
@@sneakysquirrel7352 yeah, I get what you are saying. And you're right, is disappointing how they didn't make any difference in the next games out of that outcome.
The bard song really hit hard especially after that mission
I have been looking forward to seeing this decision ever since she romanced him and kept him as a Grey Warden.
In my playthrough, Loghain was the Warden, and it made the ultimate redemption story ending for him to stay in the fade. It was soooo good.
On my first play through I sacrificed Hawke as well - since I had no clue about the previous games. I sacrificed them instead of Stroud because I knew them both 'equally'. Really, I knew them as well as my Inky did. I didn't know about all the shit Hawke went through in Kirkwall. I just knew 'Hawke has history with Corypheus' and 'Stroud is a senior warden who stood up against this whole plan'. So, Hawke stayed.
After I played DA:2 I never left Hawke behind in the fade because ... well, now I knew them and the shit they went through. They suffered so much and I didn't want them to suffer yet again. Also, not gonna lie, Fenris was gonna totally wreck my weak ass rogue/mage Inky xD Don't need that grief stricken hot boi coming for me.
BUT I totally get why one would sacrifice Hawke. I've done it - and not even when it was with Alistair, but with random warden dude xD
😂 don't cry, we've been through the same thing
lol this part is always an easy choice for me, since Alistair is always a king in most of my playthough.
Proud of you sticking up against the backseating meta-gamers. Especially in the wake of such an emotional decision. And I appreciate so much your willingness to be vulnerable for your viewers. It’s why I’ve fallen in love with your content. It’s not something I could do- my crying and emotion was completely in the privacy and safety of my own room. So keep being you because the real ones support that (your core community seems so incredible and amazing and supportive).
My Inquistor had Loghain/Hawke and he saved Hawke. In his mind (with the info he had right there)- that situation was not Hawke’s fault- it was the Wardens, he didn’t think Hawke should sacrifice himself for it.
In terms of rebuilding- he knows the Hero is out there somewhere, at -that- point he also believed Blackwall would’ve had the capability
I think the “Hawke will survive because of Flemeth’s prophecy” is wishful thinking but if I turn out to be wrong I won’t be mad about it.
(Also I had that world state with Queen Anora, Warden Loghain, and drunk Alistair. My Warden was trying to be practical and have the political marriage and a useful Warden but it didn’t work out).
But like majority of major BioWare choice there’s pros and cons on all outcomes and in my mind no “perfect” outcome, only an outcome that makes sense for your character and their context.
Just like my recent Origins playthrough it made sense for my power hungry human noble to be Alistair’s queen and have Anora/Loghain dead.)
Currently continuing that world with a power grabbing wants to be Viscount supports the Templars Red Hawke.
I’m curious as to what my power hungry Inquisitor continuation will do. I don’t think I’ll know u til I get there and inhabit that character
Meg is like Zorro from One Piece: Able to get lost even with a map in her own home.
Yea I fully agree my hawk was a mage, aliaster is a Templar however for a giant fort size spider give it to the mage/main character.
Yeah, that's a hard choice. The only reason I didn't have to make it, is because my first Warden was a female noble origin, so she and Alistair are quite happily married as king and queen of Ferelden lol, but it does diminish the importance of that choice by quite a bit. It's always Stroud that dies in that scenario, not even a thought is given to any other option. But when Alistair stays as a Warden, yeah, I leave my Hawke behind too. My thought process is that, while I love Hawke, they're ME. Just like the Warden and the Inquisitor. And I would absolutely sacrifice myself for those I love, and I sure love Alistair. So Hawke goes. But yeah, it's extremely sad when that's a choice, and I always feel bad for Varric most of all.
I actually hate the "Warden vs Hawke" decision because it is only a moral conundrum for the player and not for the Inquisitor as a character. The Inquisitor barely knows Hawke or Alistar/Loghain/Stroud yet it is made out to be this big tragic choice that they are barely able to make. But it is only a tragic choice for the player. The Inquisitor doesn't have any kind of attachment to these characters outside of a strictly professional one.
Contrast this with the Virmire decision in Mass Effect 1, where that is both a big decision for the player and for Shepard as a character simultaneously. Both Shepard and the player see Kaiden and Ashley and friends and colleagues. And the fact that one of them could be in a relationship with Shepard compounds with that. "Will Kaiden think less of me when he dies since he knows I chose Ashley because I'm sleeping with her?" That is not the case in Inquisition and the choice is lesser as a result.
My Grey Warden was Loghain, and yet I still chose Hawke to stay behind. I don't know why, but this seems like a fitting end for this character, especially considering Flemeth's words in DA2. Plus, Wardens needed a Leader, and Loghain, someone who caused the destruction of Grey Wardens in DAO, being the one to rebuild and lead them forward (and not just any Grey Wardens, but Orlesian ones) seemed super ironic and poetic to me.
If you took varric and Cassandra with you, it could be more sad for Varric
I actually gasped when you made your choice. I just thought you loved them too much and it was a genuinely a devastating moment. It always was and it's so difficult to see someone face that for the first time.
this was the first stream i ever caught live. it gave me a ton of new perspective on this quest. if you have a king alistair (i always either had him unite the lands with anora or with trevelyan so he was never ruling on his own) and played a hawke whose sibling was rescued by stroud in the deep roads, this choice can have SOME weight. stroud is not just a rando warden and you have SOME history with him. hawke being familiar with stroud and arguing with him felt more real to me thanks to that history. and that’s how i always justified my choices. but watching this happen organically, with no prior knowledge other than “meg will be sad,” this was even more of an emotional gut punch than even just simply watching alistair and hawke in the fade. this is how it was meant to feel, imo. and i hate it but i rate it at the same time.
your choices are your own, and that’s the beauty of this series. each one of us can have our own canon playthrough and catch scenes we would have otherwise missed (for instance that blackwall scene in the tavern that i’ve never seen before until your stream and my jaw DROPPED) 😂♥️
as always, thank you for sharing your journey with us!
BioWare was being sneaky with that choice, it says likely, not will. So there’s a chance we see either choice roaming the fade in some future installment
Oof. In my first play through I brought Varric with me so at the end instead of some rando soldier I had Varric tearfully ask about Hawke and it broke my heart. I had to reload an older save.
"Sorry Fenris" THE SCREAM I LET OUT IN PURE SORROW PLEASE
I was never able to play the other dragon age games- ps4 and what not. So seeing this, and having it actually hurt...it's... wow. Hawke was amazing. I hope you don't have to end up breaking the news to Fenris if he is in the next dragon age game.
I’ve never been able to leave Hawke behind… I just… I can’t bring myself to. Cried myself to sleep the first time I played this quest 😔
1:57:58- Love how Inquisition pulls a Mass Effect 1 of "choose which one dies", but this time (possibly) with characters who you ACTUALLY care about... 😨😨🥺🥺😭😭
Mass Effect 1 did it better though. Since Shepard as a character is actually invested and views them both as friends and family unlike the Inquisitor who just met Hawke and the Warden a week ago.
@@kutless45 That's true. However, the player themselves is far more invested in Alistair and Hawke likely if they completed the first 2 games properly (as everyone should)!
@@michaelmcclelland9876 But that's the problem. Its an out of character choice that the character you play has does not care one way or the other on. They have created a divide between player and character for the sake of a cheap choice.
@@kutless45 My Shepard mistreated both Ashley and Kaiden, so it doesn't exactly make PERFECT sense why he would care so much about either of them dying... Lol
@@michaelmcclelland9876 To me choosing between Alistair and Hawke is kinda like choosing between Mordin and Wrex. I loved them both but i knew that it was what Mordin wanted. The scene when Wrex gets to know about genophage's sabotage and attacks Shepard is just too heartbreaking.
"I know what I have to do but it's really hard", my thoughts exactly XD
btw I think hawke will survive and we will see him/her again in DA:4
Great video, I love how you live the game, and beautiful character you made!
I applaud you in the decisions you made! I don't have to heart to choose hawk but it's your playthrough and you should be proud of everything you have chosen! Am loving your content
I knew I shouldn't have watched this while at work. Now I'm trying to fight back tears. I love this game but sometimes it makes me hate it so much.
I often wonder if perhaps the original plan for this quest, (at least at any time in the early development stages of the game), would have been choosing between the Hero of Ferelden (if they survived DAO) or the Champion of Kirkwall to be left behind in the Fade..? How much more crushing/punishing that would that have been for players, I wonder..?
Archdeacon was dead in the first one. Now he’s returned to the elder one.
honestly your commentary has convinced me that hawke actually probably survives even if they're left behind in the fade
I can still never look at the monster with all the holes, Nightmare really worked as a title for it at least for me lmao
My first playthrough I made Alistair king and when it came to this part of the game, it was an easy choice. What is now my canon playthrough that will carry on to DA4, Hawke stays behind. Only because I'm hopeful that Hawke still has enough plot armour left to make it to the next installment of the franchise.
I'm sorry Meg, but like Mass Effect this series will either bless you or haunt you for the decisions you made in the past.
I knew this playthrough would be painful, it was a tough choice but it will resonate more with the player. like you said, it would be Loghain or Alister, or Stroud. You can meet Stroud In DA2 while Qunaris are taking over the city if Alister wasn't present (DA2 potential spoiler **** In case you bring Carver or Bethany with you to the deep road expedition and you have Anders with you, Stroud save your sibling from the blight diseases, later on, Hawke sibling will become a gray warden ***** ).
I accidentally sacrificed Hawke, because I was like, "will likely die," doesn't mean anything serious, and that Dragon Age isn't going to kill off Hawke for sure! I was wrong. I was crushed.
Tears are warranted; and ANY one person sieving the obvious implication of their own mistakes through the lense of someone else shedding tears on the internet, written in their 'Har-dee-har YOU are gonna be wronnggg', because they believe themselves to singularly, premeditatively understand *ALONE* someone else's consequences being made in a game that's currently a Trilogy is not being serious. Like, seriously; if you're looking for that weird, vicarious--'human' experience of traveling along numerous narrative timelines, then you can literally just dive back into the game or spend a few hours clicking back-n-forth through the pages of Dragon Age Keep.
Not whatever those fiends in chat were doing stuffing coal in stockings 24/7.
Even if Stroud is in your play through leaving Hawke behind always makes sense to me besides Stroud saves your sibling in DA2 in most play throughs.
I love the reasoning that you as a player of DA2 played as Hawke and can make that decision. I have never been forced to make that decision, because I happend to prefer Alistair as King, and now I will never look back
okay controversial personal thought, but Logain is such an interesting character/villain, making him a warden is such an underrated and interesting choice. But we all know we cant lose Alastair over it. In my personal playthrough, Alastair and Anora rule and Logain becomes a warden, with Logain as the father of Morrigan’s son.
Gotta keep Alistair alive cause it's hinted through his blood it could cure the wardens. So no matter what I sacrifice Hawke or stroud or Logain if Alistair happens to be there. Sucks but gotta do what's best for the world not just the wardens. If they don't have a leader currently so what? Just given time they'll be back, but Alistairs blood is the only thing we got
In my canon Alistair isn't king because he didn't want to be and didn't want to make the love of his life (my warden) forced into being a queen or mistress to him because thats also not what my warden wanted. They wanted to find a cure for the calling and then live out their days in a cottage on the countryside. I agree whole heartedly with your decision to not make Alistair king, and would have agreed with whatever decision you made regardless because this is your playthrough and your decisions are what make you happy! It isn't up to anyone else to decide what is the best option for YOUR playthrough! That is the beauty of these games! The players decide what is right for them! People should not try to make you feel bad for playing the game the way you want instead of playing it the way they want you to play it! I'm sorry people have been mean to you about your choices you don't deserve that!
p.s. I know this playthrough is from years ago and you may never see this comment but I wanted to say this anyway! can't wait to see your reactions to DA4!
My Warden romanced Alistair and he gave up everything so they could be together. When given the choice I practically yeeted my Hawke into the Fade. Sorry, Varric, but my Amell's happiness comes first.
I've been waiting for this episode for a while (I know...I'm terrible). But there's no wrong way to play; only your way to play.
He becomes a drunk for a time but the wardens take him back into there ranks so he is fine later on. Just takes time for wounds to heal.
I actually stood on taht particular choice for an hour before I made the decision to sacrifice Hawke - and only because Flemeth said that when Hawke sees the Abyss to make sure to jump. This quest is called Here Lies the Abyss. This was my cope. I hope that this meant that sending Hawke would solve whatever issue there is in there and be able to survive while anyone who isn't Hawke wouldn't be able to survive. I hope I'm right.
Also idk if you played this again, but IIRC if you take Varric with you in Here Lies the Abyss, Varric runs towards you right before you have to answer about what Hawke did and asks twice where Hawke is, and when he realizes Hawke's dead, he walks away.
This is why I let Loghain live, and I made Alistair rule with Anora. I was fine with my female warden being a mistress to King Alistair, I’m so glad I never had to make this decision
1:58:06 I'm already tearing up👨🏼💼
😂 2:46:02 "LEY ME" same...
I know this video is a couple years old now, but I was wondering whether anyone knows what hair mod the character's got on.
Hey Meg!!! Just wanted to say I see what you mean about how you as an individual human being with morals, values and opinions see Alistair best path is to stay a grey warden. It is about what we as an individual placing ourselves in a mindset of this character. One thing people forget is that war is not sunshine and rainbows, it is filled with death and so many good people die. It is a part of life. When I myself first played DAO I went in 100% blind and I as another individual with differing morals, values and opinions saw Alistair stagnating in the grey warden because at that point in my life I was stagnating in life too. I thought it be best to harden Alistair and become king. It is all about our experiences in life. I didn’t have any guides or walkthrough just my cousin helping me with the janky controls sometimes, he never said anything bad about my choices as a 13year old. He just watched.
Don’t give up with games that have choices and paths. You do you. Love you so much Meg.
I remember the first play though I did of dao. As I said before Alistair was a hardened king, my fem warden was dalish and I didn’t do the ritual so I bawled my eyes out for so long. I romanced Alistair and the little turd broke my heart and broke up with me, then my warden died.
I make that my canon play though even though now I play the game differently as times have changed for me. That first one will always stick with me. We will see when da4 comes out . I hope you aren’t discouraged into never playing this game series again cause some don’t want to see your personally choices. You play the game how you want…plus if BioWare wanted the one true way they wouldn’t have put multiple pathways in the game.
❤️❤️❤️
GIRL, you have no idea how happy I am to finally see someone reason in a similar way as I did when playing these games! I kept Alistair as a warden my first time around and let Anora have the throne (absolutely love her btw). When I finished Origins and started looking online for discussions of the game I was actually shocked to find out that it seemed like almost everyone made Alistair king. Like...even after years I've still found very few who didn't LOL. Despite my canon and first playthrough being a human noble, it didn't feel right for me to make him king, neither to have my warden rule with him. I felt like Anora was already capable on her own and that Alistair and my character needed to rebuild the wardens and focus on their order.
When Inquisition came out and I played that, I was so ecstatic to have him with me for such a huge chunk of the game - and that choice in Here Lies the Abyss? I felt exactly like you did. I left Hawke too, and I would regardless of who the warden was (because as you said, without a warden they're leaderless), but the fact that it was Alistair made this mission leave such a huge emotional impact on me.
Oh, and I also romanced Fenris first time around but kept thinking my purple Hawke should be with Isabella LMAO (saw you mention something about considering that on another video), I went with her for my second playthrough and never regretted it. She's my canon DA2 romance now :) I'd thoroughly enjoy your content regardless of the choices you make, but it's really nice to see someone stray from what so many people deem the "correct" choices to be and stick to what they want. Keep it up
I honestly might replay DA2 for my canon playthrough and have her end up with Isabella. That’s the only thing I would change about it. 😂❤️ thank you so much!!
@@MegMage Have fun if you do! :D
My choice of who leave behind the fade is much easier. Because in my playthrough, Alistair become King so Warden Stroud will be there and I left him behind.
It makes no sense for me to leave Hawke there and Warden are natural good fighter that Stroud could have a slight chance to escape once he distracted Corypheus.
EDIT:
Seriously though, if I have to choose from Hawke or Alistair, Hawke will be my pick because she is far capable to handle such situation by herself.
Its so sad to see people being mean to you over your choices or reactions. I love seeing people make choices different from my own and seeing your reactions to these events is really fun. I've played all the DA games dozens of times so I know what the consequences are to my actions, but watching your playthrough is like being able to play them again for the first time ❤❤
Honestly the only reason I didn’t sacrifice Hawke in my canon play through ( King Alistair so I had Stroud ) was because I don’t trust BioWare to not pull a fast one on us and either kill off Hawke or give her a fate worse than death. If I’m wrong, I will gladly go back and change that decision because I agree that it’s the most appropriate choice story ( and character ) wise, even with Alistair as king.
35:14 good book
I cried so much the first time I did it, now every time I do this mission I bring Varric with me:(
I feel like a bit of a sadist but I really looked forward to this Lol
1:54:20 my triphoboa CAN'T AHGGGG (fear of like a cluster of holes)
Keep it up Meg!!! Love you and keep up the positivity
I think the Elf that was sacrificed was the one you encouraged to join the grey wardens in Crestwood...so sorta in a way died because of you. Not trying make ya feel bad I was just thinking about it lol
I believe That Hawke was meant to fight the demon. Flemeth foretold it, and as (canonically) a mage they are better equipped to fight a demon in the fade and survive than just a single grey warden. Regardless of how events turn out, I don't think Alistair's warden instincts would make him very happy as king. On top of that whether or not they show it in the game, he would still hear the calling just like all the other's. It's best he stay with the wardens.
I would bring Dorian and Iron Bull together if you want some spicy and interesting dialogue. ❤️🔥
I don’t give a damn to what Flemeth said, Hawke is me myself, Alistair is just a companion. As much as you love your companion, he is not you. When it’s a matter of life or death, you yourself is most important.(unless you are sacrificing yourself for your loved one, that is)
I too also felt instinctively that Hawke is the one who is supposed to be left behind BUT I COULDN'T MAKE THAT CHOICE. I had Stroud in my "canon/original" playthrough as the Warden here, but I was thinking about the collapse of the Wardens and the impact this decision will likely have on the future games. Also, from the Inquisitor's perspective saving the Grey Warden order is more sensical than saving Hawke who is just a recently met companion.
I literally sat there thinking for a few good minutes and made the selfish choice to save Hawke. But I'll have to live with those consequences come DA4.
I also agree with your gatekeeping comments! Just play it once through organically based on your own actual choices. The DA franchise has so much replay ability, that's what multiple playthroughs are for. To make different choices. 🤷♀️
lol, I feel like one of the few who will drop Alistair in a heartbeat. Guess that's the gift I get for falling for Zevran. I love Ali to bits, but I'm not leaving Fenris and Varric alone for anything.
Even if I had romanced Ali, I'd still leave him. Cause I know my girl would be just fine.
Thankfully he ended up King so I didn't have to make this choice.
good see your hawke form DA2 make cameo this game know it very tough choice to make love your dragon age series
I applaud you looking for all the details. But you missed the opportunity to actually look at the black city from quite close. Its far more closer than when we see it in Awakening.
Your character is so gorgeous :)
You did teh right decision to leave Hawke behind. That was the advise Flemeth gave to her in Dragon Age 2. _"We stand upon the precipice of change. The world fears the inevitable plummet into the abyss. Watch for that moment - and when it comes, do not hesitate to leap. It is only when you fall that you learn whether you can fly."_
And this is why Alistair is always King in my playthroughs...hardened or not he DOES grow to be a good king and he's my Warden's bestie.....And...sorry Stroud but I love my Hawke too much to deprive her of her happy ending with Fenris :P
I don't think my choice to let Alistair marry Anora and become King was about min maxing. I always romance Morrigan, and Alistair becoming king, though not what he wants, is what is best for his country. That is a sacrificial decision too.
I also sacrificed Hawke in the fade, because it was the right choice to make, but not the emotionally appealing one.
I love watching your pained reaction like mine
Hawke and Varric Best Friend.
AAAAAANNND this is why Alistair is always king in my canon playthrough (with my Hero of Ferelden as his queen👸) so that I can keep Hawke alive and just sacrifice Warden Stroud 🤷♀️ not hating, just saying, making alistair the king is not always a bad choice. It saves you from this situation
hands down the hardest decision in Dragon Age and one of the hardest in gaming history.
@@ecksbest hm true but I get the felling you're angry a bit xd
There are no good choices here. Sorry that you had to face this decision, but I felt you were going to pick Hawke because you would sacrifice yourself to save a loved one. DAO holds a special place in every Dragon Age players heart. I wonder whomever is left in the Fade show up in DA4. I know from a story perspective they die in the Fade but they could always change that in DA4.
Time to cry!
Does anyone knows who she romances in dragon age origins?
Alistair