Making A TAP Follower - Should Have Made It a long Time Ago
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- Опубліковано 6 чер 2024
- G'day everyone,
To finish up this small build series I have done on taps and tap wrenches, I wanted to build a tap follower. They are a popular first tool to make on the lathe, and for good reason. They help you tap parts perfectly straight. it is essentially a spring loaded center which locates into the centers in your taps. Helps you tap straight, which is pretty helpful on the lathe.
Now for my set up wanted a very specific design. The body had to be a morse 3 taper, to suit the lathe and the mill. I also wanted to move away from the stepped piston design. I think its adds a extra machining time that isn't necessary for the desired result.
Tap follower build
Making a tap follower
#machining #diy
Timestamps
0:00 - Intro
3:05 - Design and Tolerances
6:02 - Making The Tap Follower
12:47 - Assembly And Testing - Наука та технологія
One method I've seen when you need a centered through hole is to drill the hole first, then turn the outer taper between centers.
Hearing these clever methods to nail precise geometry always makes my day
A four-jaw chuck sounds like a """fun""" project
I can just see him cutting the 15cm diameter stock with the hacksaw
@matiastripaldi406 that's cheating, use that crusty folding knife granddad gave you like a real man
In all seriousness though dude get a freaking bandsaw even a portaband would do your wrists are gonna hate you by the time you're 40
😂
@@SpookyMcGhee Given the hacksaw-obsession maybe a power hacksaw, could even make one as a project
@@SpookyMcGheeHe needs to learn the This Old Tony karate chop technique!
I like the reversible end feature. If you replace the grub screw with a small thumb screw you won't have to hunt for, lose, or misplace the wrench.
Very nice, I think I'd have replaced the retaining grub screw with a counter sunk screw - that way you can set the screw length such that it is never trying to clamp the follower but will always retain the plunger as the head bottoms out in the counter sink first. And as concentricity is only really important at one end of the tool I think I'd be tempted to cut the taper the other way - that way the worst of any drill wandering would be in the spring part of the pocket and have no impact on the tool. (Assuming of course I actually thought of any of this before just doing it, and was confident enough I could cut the taper right without being able to test it.).
I used a tipped carbide burr as a tap follower recently, decided I’d power drive the tap out, pushed back and locked the tail stock, forgot I had the spindle speed set fairly high, so when I flipped the motor on, the tap started backing out exceedingly fast, I had my hand between the burr and the tap handle, and I drove the burr straight through my hand as it pinched on the back of the tap. Freaking out mentally, but keeping cool, hit the e-stop, unlocked the tail stock, moved it, looked through my hand and watched it for a few seconds until the blood started…thought goddammit! Shut the garage up went inside approached the wife doing the dishes, calmly began to tell her I’d put a hole through my hand when she looked at my hand and freaked out, which caused the the kids to freak out. Drove myself to urgent care, a cleaning and a Band-Aid later, all patched up, still some tenderness, fairly small scar, but dam it was stupid…lucky I had the tail stock as far back as I did or my entire hand may have gotten caught up by the tap handle.
Dang 😮 I almost did the same thing years ago! Hope you heal fast.
i am capable of such a feat with hand tools alone. note to self: don't cut towards yourself with a dull blade.
I've got to say man, over the course if all your videos, you're getting better and better at your craft. Love your work buddy
The trick I learned to tap straight holes in the lathe is to use a point to push the tap straight in the center of the hole. I use the tap handle as a rotation stopper and I pull on the chuck to turn the part while the tap is not rotating. That makes it easier for tight spaces!
Seems like every time someone wants to make a tool, having that tool already would be a great help in creating the tool. 😀
I'm going to make one properly scaled for my machine. Nice simple design.
No ones design is better than anyone else's, That's the fun part about machining parts. Each custom tool is unique and fun to study and watch work.
Thanks for all your great video work. I am in the process of upgrading my 7x16 mini-lathe and really appreciate the videos you have produced about the subject. This video is also timely as I am planning to make a better tap follower than one I made when just beginning my hobby machine journey. Cheers!
If you don't have blueing compound to tell your contact patches on a part you can use a candle to deposit a thin layer of soot on the outside of your part and then slide them together and check that way
So excited to see a new video. Keep going m8
Smart idea to have concave and pointy ends of the following shaft. Nice work.
Dear Sir ,you brought back a lot of memories,my days as a machinist was way back in ‘60s an never touched one since,it was a rather large beast,a Herbert No 4..happy days 🇪🇸
Good practical design! And "easy to make" is worth a lot. 👍
Excellent design- well done!
When I was a first year apprentice I made a tap follower similar to this but for a Jakob's chuck. I also made a second tip which I bored out to use a die follower
That's genius, great job!
Nice work. I like the idea of the dual purpose tip.
What it all boils down to is what you want to or capable to make as there are a multitude of different designs.
Looks like the best design I have seen. Found my next project 😂 thanks!
Awesome make
Brilliant 👍👍
Good video as usual. We shared this video on our homemade tool forum this week 😎
Great project!
Elegant design! I had decided more than a year ago, that if I ever finish my antique lathe, that one of the 1st projects would be an MTtap follower. Hadn't worked out the double points, or retention... Thanks!
I would prefer to have 2 of them,one with a male point and another with a female centre to accommodate the smaller taps with a male taper on the shank. By having a pair you never have to mess around dismantling and reversing the spring loaded inner shank.
Very nice making the follower double ended.
Nicely done, I like the design.
Really well done Sir.
Keeper! Nice work, great video!
Nice design of sprung centre, and well made, ref hardening the 2 ends, it only needs a few mm hardened and tempered.
Thanks for sharing
I was thinking the same as you. Just the tip heated to cherry and quenched won't cause any distortion/warping.
You might not want to say your design is better... but it is! I made a follower that clamps in a drill chuck or a collet chuck and takes most of the Z axis travel in the mill to use.
I might be tempted to copy this design in the future. Thanks!
I like it a lot!
Good job! The keep it simple attitude I like that. Great video.
Useful tool
Thanks for this video, it came out nicely!
👍💪✌
Cheers
Love this design ! Making one for my PM 1130 V lathe with 3MT .. keep the videos coming ! You are definitely one of my top 3 utube machinists !
Nice little project. I'm sure that with the hard work you'll be putting this tool through, if the point becomes "dull" you'll be able to "dust" a bit off and it'll be as good as new.
Very nice. Thanks.
Great Video thanks, Really enjoyed it 👍
It sounds like you already need new bearings for your new lathe. That's a pretty significant noise it is producing.
This is a really great design, great build. Thanks for sharing! I like the idea of using precision ground stock, it's quick and inexpensive.
Nice project.
Nice 👍🏼
Thanks !
Nice design. I like how low profile it is for your machines.
Oh wow, it's crazy you got a guest appearance from This Old Tony at 3:05 !
First thing i ever machined! Still have mine, i definitely need to make a new one 😂
nice!
Lol that vid opening. That was dadjoke masterful
great work, I think I'll subscribe
I can make that, The pointy not pointy end feature is cool beans
Hardening it would also risk warping it and no one wants a bendy tap follower
Thanks for sharing
I tried to take a zip of my beer every time you said Tap, I'm about 4 minutes in and soon out of beer, CHEERS 😅
Nice looking tap follower, it's really weird but I made a follower today similar to the the one you cut in half, but I think mine is to a higher tolerance than that one. What does surprise me is you have a collet chuck for your tailstock and you are not using that to hold taps, you should try it, it works really well, I do this whenever I tap a thread on the lathe.
I cant get a drawbar in to the collect chuck in place since im using a taper sleeve, so I probably wouldn't be able to use it for turning in the lathe
The hand pointer makes it!
Hey Sir i follow both you and "inheritance machining" .. it seems that you saw his video about the same topic.. Well done thou.. both of you ... WOW 🙂 love your projects
Love love love the channel. Thank you for making such intriguing content. Quick question. Are you not using your quick change tool holders for the mill anymore? If not, can you share why? I love the idea. I bought all the stuff to do one for myself, but haven’t had time yet.
I use it all the time, you probably see it in most videos. I've just bought 4 more er20 collet holders to expand my tool holding capacity with it. I just thought with the tap follower, it makes sense to make it mt3, then I can use it on the lathe and mill, rather than have one dedicated for the mill only
At work I simply used aluminium round stock to make a set of bushings with the right internal diameter and length, so that I can get the tap two or three turns in. Once you have a straight start it usually isn't much of a problem to keep it straight.
You obviously don't understand what a tap follower is. There are is nothing to hold the bushes, and what about round stock, how do you ensure the Bush is straight?
You should make a Hemingway tailstock die holder (with a clutch)
its looks easy and safe to use on a lathe with the feeder on.
Sneaking up on a hundred thousand subscribers.
Show some more hacksawing and you should get there!👍👍
Only reason why people watch, no? :)
If your 3 jaw isn't too far out you can dial in using different key holes and tapping the jaws the way you want it to move.
Looks great, though I was really hoping we'd get to see what the giant tap is for this week!
Next week.
@@artisanmakes such a tease
@@artisanmakes liar!
Add a second grub screw to lock it all in place. 👍
If hole was not properly centered, best thing to do would be remove chuck and fit into head-stock taper then bore slightly larger, either enough to clean up or well oversize and make sliding point to fit.
You could have done that anyway to avoid drilling and reaming a very long hole that you knew you were going to drill oversize for most of it's length.
Could also have made it with threads on outer end and made the cap to guide follower, (need a slight amount of extra length to have nut locate on shoulder to keep it concentric) that way it's much easier to change from a point to a cone.
Unfortunately, that would go against the KISS principle 😁 (although a single 4mm grub screw is simpler)
Any time you use coil springs stacked, you should use washers between them as they will 'screw' into each other in use
I still don't have a tap follower. In the milling machine I use the power taping function to cut it a few turns. In the lathe I turn the chuck by hand. Small diameter taps might hold in the drill chuck for bigger ones I use a collet chuck. With a straight start it is easy to finish it by hand with a tap wrench.
👍
The bearings in the new lathe already sound like rocks 😮😢
EYE DUNT NU BOUT YEW
Have a drink every time he says "I don't know about you but'
ill drink to that :)
An other way to check the fit of the taper by drawing 3 longitudinal lines 120 degrees apart on the taper with chalk then put the sleeve on it and turn 60 degrees and checking how the lines were smeared.
I was hoping you'd knurl the cap. But I like the design.
Интересная идея
Hey that’s a great project. Well done too !
I’m currently working on a new quill nut for my tail stock. It’s got some funky Left hand 5 TPI Acme threads, problem I just figured out is the internal threading bar is 12mm and it doesn’t fit in the hole ! It’s the smallest one I could find.. make a tap ?? Or make a custom 5 TPI Acme threading tool? What would you do in this situation??
Enjoy your videos man ! 🍻 from 🇺🇸 mate !
Blimey. I would personally try and go with making a custom threading tool if you can. Making a tap isnt hugely difficult but it is probably faster to avoid making one if you can.
@@artisanmakes thanks for the reply, you know how it goes, spend the big bucks and have a custom tool, or spend the time and make one. Then use it once and it sits in the drawer for the next ten years. I have everything to make the cutter, and I have made form tools before with brazing in chunks of carbide, then grinding them to fit. But the tap is another story… I’ve never made one, I would have to order the blank, and I’m not too sure on the geometry really. But again, thank you for time and the response 🙏
Someone get that man a new brush !
hey i just need to know, for the process of adding carbon to steel parts you use on your videos, can i use sodyum bicarbonate instead sodyum carbonate? also what kind of of flux you use for avoid the shrinking or warping of the material in the template process? is the one used for soldering brass with torch?
How much pressure does the tap follower push with? Maybe put some scales on the mill vice and lower the quill down to get a reading ?
Mr pete did a test with his and its usually between 30-50 grams
@@artisanmakes Thank you - I'm pushing down with most of my body weight when trying to tap, clearly something else is wrong. Starting to suspect tje Aliexpress taps aren't any good for more than brass or plastic.
I've used a few Chinese taps, for oddball sizes. They can be real hit or miss. Some work some don't
Been a keen follower of your channel and have recently purchase a lathe.
Do you have a tap and die set brand recommendation to purchase in Aus? Something not too pricey but still decent value for lathe use? Cheers
Probably not the best guy to ask, I haven't used too many brands and a lot of what I have are older taps. I would avoid buying the frost tap sets, they are pretty rubbish. I use a toolmster brand tap set from HAFCO, they are the ones you see in pretty much every video. They are a good set but I dont know how they stack up against other brands
Thanks, i'll keep looking, there are too many "middle brands" at stores which are just marked up Chinese sets which can be had at 1/4 of the price for the same thing on eBay. So trying to sort the wheat from the chaff is a bit hard. Cheers, @@artisanmakes
nice build, should do the job nicely.
A spring with ~15 lbs per inch would maintain quill-pressure as the tap threads in.
Edit: Ah ... pretty much like that device appears to have @3:25 (inside the device)
If you need your reamer to run true, bore the first 5mm of the hole to just under the finished size.
He bored the entire length of the hole just under the finished size. That's the only way that reamers are used
The whole bore was drilled undersized with a 25/64" drill and reamed to final size
I can hear the chattering you've got in your gearbox. I had it in my lathe 250 and it was being caused by the auto feed gearbox, one of the spacers was a 250um too thick and was causing too much intermittent resistance to the lathe and causing the gears to slap around in the headstock. I had an H&F technician troubleshoot it for me, might be a fun project, no auto feed, just use your lathe to fix itself.
Thanks for the pointer. I need to pull it apart and find out the cause to the noise definitely the box gear box. Cheers
You should have place a washer between each spring.
doesnt your seig 2.7 mini mill have a tapping function?
Only the brushless dc models have that and they weren't available when I bought my mill
ah gotcha cheers for the reply@@artisanmakes
You could put the taper in the lathe and then drilled the hole to have better concentricity
I think the best way to achieve perfect concentricity is to drill the hole in the same set up as when you cut the taper. Cheers
If you like this but cutting the Morse taper scares you then you can buy a blank Morse taper arbor and modify it.
Personaly, I put an auto center punch in the Jacob chuck.
Fair enough
The little brush you're using with your parting tool. It looks like it gives diseases. Bad diseases. Diseases one does not simply recover from. Other than that: great content! :D
Mate is your other channel I did a thing?
Sorry, nobody here understands gibberish.
What's that noise in your lathe? Sounds like a bad bearing or dry gears?
The brand new lathe had grit inside, which he roughly cleaned by draining the gearbox but he didn't clean t he spindle bearings. After a couple of weeks the whole thing is already completely destroyed 😢
@@johncoops6897 yeah I notice the noise more and more each video
It’s kinda funny how the tool you want to make is needed to make the tool you want to make.
HA, I just turned an M2 taper yesterday.
Very important item to have in the shop,,,,but the key way you make is not important for this project beside its allow the chips and dirt goes in the bore ❤
It helps keeps the centre in place. And this this a low wear part, I really couldn't see grit or dust causing an issue, realistically speaking
@@artisanmakes greetings i have done something similar with long open keyway for die holder it doesn't really work cuz of dirt and chips it damaged thats why i say so.
I like your channel and learn a lot of you thanks
Interesting. This is a month old video for me since I edit and publish out of order and I havent had any issues yet, but i'll keep a look out for any issues@@mrayco
@@artisanmakes wish you the best mr i hope this will last longer and forever,😄
Could you not have foregone the cap on the end and just not drilled all the way through the piece?
Why do I get a This old Tony vibe.
I would have made a sharper tip so it fits better in the tap handle
Why didn't you turn the taper between points? It's a much easier setup and you may use the power feed. The only hassle I could think of, is to realign the tailstock after work.
I have always found it quicker and easier to just copy a taper with the compound than offset the tailstock. Not liek link matters a huge amount since the end result is the same. Plus I'm not sure i have a lathe dog in the right size for this size job
@@artisanmakes Ah well, how's about a lathe cat? 😄
If my lathe dogs are anything like my real dog, they would not appreciate a cat of amy kind being introduced
@@artisanmakes 😄😄😄
I made a very similar tap follower. I also made a video of it. My videos aren't very good by the concepts I employ are unparalleled.
I cringe when I see people going back and forth while tapping holes in metal. Yes, I was taught that way too. Experience showed me that when you back off the tap "to break the chips" you have created a problem.
- Those chips that you just broke off get in front of the cutting edges of your tap. Now when you once again advance the tap, those trapped chips wedge against the tap teeth and material causing breakage of the teeth on your taps. Also damaging the new threads that you are cutting.
- Much better to always advance your tap without backing it off, and use lots of cutting oil. Chips never have a chance to get in front of the cutting teeth of your tap. You'll get cleaner new threads, and your taps last for many years.
** If your tap starts to bind, back it all the way out, clear the chips from the tap, and from the hole with compressed air. Apply cutting oil again, and wind your now clean tap back into the clean hole to continue cutting.
Why don't you put your taps in the tailstock drillchuck and just power tap it? Like don't put the handle up for locking the tailstock in place and just let it slide, I do ich all the time 😊
With my taps and chuck it just spins, isnt able to bite on the hard shank of the tool. Sometimes I can get away doing m5 or m6 but anything else and it isn't able to hold it. If I were to powertap i would want a tapping head.
@artisanmakes how about a keyed Chuck or a ER 40 chucl
I only use keyed chucks. I could put them in my er32 collets but the tapping head I have used in the past have a clutch in them to help prevent breaking the taps, especially if they are smaller
okay but you have a spring loaded quill - Why dont you just chuck up a tap and push it into a hole and let the tap do the cutting while the quil gives you spring compensation and just reverse the tap out again - I've done 1000's (litterally) of taped holes that way
The quill on the lathe is not spring loaded and that’s where I get most of the use of if this. Nothing with with a dead centre in the mill, I do that too, I think this is a little easier but each to their own.