How Can The Transformers CHANGE in Size? Mass Shifting?
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- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- Scale as it pertains to the Transformers is all over the place! How is Powerglide as tall as Bumblebee? How can Soundwave shrink into a micro-cassette recorder? Let's find out!
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There was that time when Bruticus held Shockwave's gun mode during his rampage on Cybertron. That size comparison seemed the most sensible, compared to whenever Megatron entrusts his gun mode to his subordinates.
And at this point in Generation 1 Megatron and Shockwave can change their size because Megatron's been the size of a human and a cybertronian gun he and later Galvatron can both rescale themselves to ride in their minions think it's a feature at this point
In the Marvel comics Shockwave is a 30 foot long flying laser gun.
This mass shifting explains why Astrotrain asked them to dump weight in the movie. He was running low on energon to mass shift big enought to hold them all. Drop some of the weight able to shrink down more save energon make it to Cybertron
That’s something not mentioned in the video!
my favorite scene in the movie was when the Constructicons formed Devestator INSIDE ASTROTRAIN
Molecular compression has been my headcanon for decades. In robot mode, the Transformers are relatively light for their size. That's because the molecules that make them are spread relatively far apart. That's why they don't really go crashing through the streets or anything as they walk by. When they transform, those molecules compress and fit relatively closer together, shrinking their overall size. That's also why a human actually could pick up Soundwave or Megatron. The metal that makes them is also more like skin than like plates of metal as we know it, giving it the flexibility we see in the cartoons. Now that DOESN'T solve the problem of a combiner like Devastator being SO light for their size that he might actually float away, but meh, it's a cartoon.
Maybe the fighter jet and tank bots weren't truly the size of their human mimicked counterparts and were scaled down, where as the car and truck bots were closer to real scale
the size comparison thing never bothered me i just loved how they transformed and how their robot modes looked.
ladies say that about me all the time!!!! I surprise them. you gotta see their eyes!!!
Thank you..we were kids..who cares 🤷🏾♂️
That's one of the things I loved about the Michael Bay _Transformers_ movies. They didn't grow in size when shifting from vehicle to robot, because he wanted the size of each robot be relative in size to their vehicle forms. It's more realistic.
Only true in the first movie. Afterwards they absolutely mass shifted with several of the robots.
@@RodimusPrimal I think that had more to do with them designing the robot modes first, (on the later movies) then that guy who could work out how to fold the cgi models into there car/ault modes .
Don't ever say that name again.
@@goatintuxedo2206 Don't you ever tell me what I can or can't say or do again.
Yeah that made sense in a more realistic way to have them transform in their perspective sizes according to the vehicle. Mass shift and all that crap was probably added in later to have an excuse as to how they went from one size to another and other abnormalities. For instance in the early cartoons,Optimus Prime’s trailer would simple disappear out the scene when converting to Autobot mode LOL,and then certain toy models would have the trailer as his legs,I give up😂
I use Mass shifting. This is the beauty of been a Transformers fan! All of this explanations made by fans, which HASBRO then acknowledges!
It's really great to see you remake your old videos,it give so much nostalgia
I bet he'll do a remake on Dinobot
With earthspark soundwave being another jet version of soundeave after cybertron,prime and siege,I think a fitting alt mod for him should be a news van,just like energon/superlink towline(yes,there was an actual character named towline in the energon toyline),since soundwave can communicate and hide and spy so easily with that alt mod
Fantastic update Rodimus, greatly enjoyed the added content with WFC and Legacy toys. Very thorough as usual.
I'd disagree, I think Blaster should be a news van and Soundwave should be a military vehicle similar to Animated Ultra Magnus with communications equipment mounted on top
I’m in the camp that wants Soundwave to be a party van, with his minions taking on the form of discs that he’d use to play audio.
I think a military themed vehicle is more appropriate for Soundwave like a secret service vehicle with communication equipments and his minicons becoming said equipments.
@@Solitude2500 Eh, I hate the idea of his minicons becoming equipment or whatever. I'd prefer to just have them turn into rectangles for the purpose of convenient storage. Plus if you make them equipment you completely lose the popping out of the chest gimmick
Well, whenever you notice inconsistencies in scale, a wizard did it.
Quite literally happened in The Last Knight....
@@RodimusPrimal lol very true. I didn't even mean for it to make that much sense
While I don't have a problem with mass-shifting as a concept, many of the altmodes were very "of their time" without modern contemporaries so I respect that the live action approach tried to side step that.
So I've been thinking about this for about a month or so... What if 1989 Micromasters are not really that small, but they had to shrink the toyline down to be more cost effective. Just look at the Victory show, the micromasters was large enough for humans also, the classic pretenders that year basically became core class figures. It's really I guess the nostalgia for the toys instead of as characters.
2:35 I Like The Photo Of That Jet Next To Dale Earnhardt's #3 NASCAR Winston Cup Series Car.
I always figured it was like an origami. As much as a shitshow the live movies were I appreciate the logic behind alot of the grounded, design, giving them weight and heft.
THIS!!! Is why i love bayverse so much more, the more realistic scaling makes cybertronians so much more believable and possible.
Then you see that Bayformers did the same thing as all Transformers series did with scale after the first movie.
Ehhhh I wouldn't say that since Starscream is around the same size as Optimus during the ROTF forest battle even though fighter jets are way bigger than semi trucks
Whenever you mention the mass-shifting with Prime Bulkhead I feel like it's worth noting that they actually managed to pull it off with the voyager first edition toy, so I wouldn't really consider it mass shifting.
And I wouldn't count the Allspark or staff either since they're literally mystical artefacts.
Even with the First Edition, it doesn't fully capture his bulk as seen in the show. Not to say they didn't try.
Artifacts*
@@matthewreynoso6904 Autocorrect said that was the wrong spelling
Maybe mass shunting is a better term since they shunt parts or inner workings into 4D space. Compression would make many of them very heavy even if they are constructed of something lightweight yet durable.
They are extremely heavy in G1.
The Earth shakes everytime a transformer lands or falls on the ground. Also, human cars driven into them usually blow up and won't even do a dent on the hulking robots.
They are probably sturdier and heavier than tungsten
Seeing the transformations in the animated series and having the toys to transform gave me another perspective... Animated series had Optimus Prime truck interior depicted in animation, but when I got the actual toy I wondered where the truck interior actually was...
Please discuss the issues with alligned countinuity. I don't understand why there are two grimlock and sideswipe and prime doesn't look that connected to cybertron games.
That’s a great idea!
Actually Primal’s newest bayverse depiction shows that his body enlarges while in Gorilla form, but compacts whilst in robot form!.
I like the term mass shifting. Especially when I reminisce about their Marvel affiliation, the Hulk and Multiple Man use a similar "mass shifting" dimension, the Hulk for his extra mass and height (I would say the same for Colossus who doesn't just stay at 6'6 when he dons his organic steel skin, he grows to 7'5), Multiple Man for the creation of his duplicates.
I love in anime where they look away from a character and from that eighth of a second looking back, they are a little version of themselves.
2:34 Dale Earnhardt SR.....Rest in Peace The Intimidator
Another awesome video. In my head, the size changing is just a part of Cybertronians' abilities. Stories about giant alien robots from a metallic planet have massive creative license imo. I use the same reasoning when thinking about the different weapons/components in the Transformers' hands or Unicron having his upgrade powers. It's just part of their design.
The only issues I had with scale was concerning characters like Megatron, Soundwave, Blaster, the cassettes, etc. Since I read about it in the IDW comics, I like to refer to it as mass displacement. As far as the energy use is concerned, I like to believe that only a select few Transformers (such as the previously aforementioned characters) are capable of it, but only shrink down to human size when they feel they absolutely have to.
This is a fantastic discussion video RodimusPrimal!!! My favorite scene showing that mass shifting is all over the place and has very little consistency is when Bruticus picked up Shockwave and used his cannon mode as a blaster. :D Keep on being amazing.
Actually that is extremely consistent with Shockwave across the entire cartoon. Unlike the others who decide to either make themselves smaller or larger Shockwave stays at roughly the same size in both modes. His gun form is too large to be wielded by a normal Transformer becasue in that mode he is still the size of one. Devastator has picked up Prime before demonstrating the size differential between normal sized Transformers and combiners. Only combiners and maybe Broadside could wield Shockwave in gun mode.
As a kid watching in the 80's my explanation was to just not think about it. There was a level of silliness in these shows that you just accepted. Was all just fun anyway.
So in my Perspective, I think there should be Size Limitations for how much one could Mass-Shift. It would be mostly based on for 1 the Cybertronian Type like if it's say one of Unicorn's Minicons, or one of the City Transformers. 2 The type of Altmode that the Cybertronian Species takes. 3 Their Age. 4 The amount of Energon one has. & 5 how Supernatural they really or, or say their Max Power Level. So obviously Primus, Unicron, and the Primes would have the most Mass Flexibility. I definitely agree no matter what ever they should call it, Mass Shifting or a Pocket Universe Storage System should be Cannon will True Transformers Lore. But at the same time I do think that varying out the Max Size of the overall roster dose Spice things up a lot more than making everyone near the same size. As usual though Optimus and Megatron should always be at least Twice The Size of a majority of the cast, and they are only really allowed to get any bigger than say if they ever aquire something to make em Evolve / Upgrade IE becoming Super Optimus and Galvatron of course.
My girlfriend refers to my gut as a subspace pocket. Also, it has mass shifting.
Lol
I know it's show accuracy to have huge combiners. Sometimes you can see them grow while combining, (Bruticus in B.O.T., Superion in The Return of Optimus Prime Pt 1., Predaking in Chaos)... Devastator could be super tall (The Master Builders)... like really? But I'd rather they be like the toys and be the size of a couple vehicles or robots stacking upward. The same goes for Titans... I think they work better as battle platforms than cities based on how their toys scale. I am okay with mass shifting for individual robots. They all did in some way. For some they just had that ability and I think alien molecular technology can't be explained to us puny humans... Megatron could fit in a case or underneath Starscream in jet mode if he wanted. Perceptor has been a giant microscope a couple times. Ratchet can be huge enough to carry other bots, yet Prime was too big for Cosmos, but Blaster was ok? Anyway, it's all good fun to use imagination.
Every Transformer has their abilities and limitations.
I dunno, back in the day, I didn't think much of the Transformers cartoons. But I got back into Transformers with the movies.
A lot of people bagged the movies but I had a great time watching them all. Lately I've caught up with Transformers Prime on YT and I've thoroughly enjoyed every episode of the three seasons. I'm not into the complexities of Transformers lore, I just sit and watch and enjoy and suspend my disbelief and have a good time. In Transformers Prime, to me, the scariest Decepticon is Soundwave. He never says a word, highly intelligent and every time he acts, it's precise and calculated.
I think he's the only one Megatron respects.
I will go with the mass shifting theory, when I was kid I didn't care about this. BUT now I appreciate this explanation made by fans whom keep Transformers G1 alive and rollin'
Now I wanna see a Titan turn into a bike
Mass shifting never bother me while transforming, I kind of accepted it as part of the show. Inconsistent robot side bugged me more.
Yeah the robots not being consistently colored right was the real issue, especially when it came to the Seekers.
@@RodimusPrimal agreed. Also things like that time when there was another optimus prime, as prime ran off to catch Washington monument. All those animation errors are kind of funny to think of now, but they bugged the heck out of me when i was a kid.
@@jamiemcneil9682 I always tried in my mind to correct them. It should have been Grimlock standing there while Optimus was running. A lot of it had to do with the production schedule and the fact that the show was animated in Japan (some episodes in Korea) and it had to be sent back to California in time for the episode to air.
It's a feature for G1 Megatron I mean I don't really like it but it's just part of the one he literally rescales himself to write another people's vehicle modes
In my fan story I just excuse all the excess parts going into subspace and that’s how mass shifting works.
I once saw an episode where a full sized Megatron was sitting inside of Thrust in his jet mode. My brother picked up on the scale inconsistancy and I burst out laughing. 😂
I've always just liked Transformers for what it was. Robots transforming into things was cool. I never did like how they mass shifted though. It didn't make any sense and they could have done something better. Just transform them into stuff that makes sense.
In Bionicle we have Makutas, who can change their size, but must use pocket dimensions for that. And if they want to be smaller, they transport a part of their mass in this dimensions. If they enlarge themselves, then they should absorb some mass from outside, or take more mass from pocket dimension.
And yes, in Transformers we already have this pocket dimensions thing, and in Robots In Disguise (2003) this dimensions was explanation of all strange powers, such as mass-shifting, teleportation and, yes, disappearing parts of altmodes.
I think this version is better than just "molecular compression", because, you know, it is not MASS shifting, it is only SIZE shifting. But transformers can change their masses too.
My brain cells after understanding transformation logic of robots in transformers franchise.
Me:Confused unga bunga.
I always hated mass shifting but it is the best explanation for it. Besides my idea that in universe jets are the same sizes as old ww2 planes
🤖 good discussion! (I've been thinking about this since watching that infamous AstroTrain scene!)
I was calling it "Krang tech" (TF G1 here came in Greece 1991 along with TMNT)
As a kid, we just called it " A really cool idea they could do that, because they're not just robots...but outer space ALIEN ROBOTS!!! Who KNOWS what else they can do?!"
Of course and it's still cool. Some fans need an explanation though.
The idea of shifting ones size is actually a very incredible ability. Just imagine how one could incorporate it into everyday life.
Having trouble reaching something that is higher than your height just mass shift. Need to be just a wee bit shorter to avoid hitting the ceiling in a small room just mass shift.
It would be something if humans could somehow develop such an ability be it through technology or biological means.
I personally prefer that idea of the first live-action film. It seems more realistic.
My favorite size issue has to be Scorponok. A humanoid becomes the head of a whole titan. How would he mass shift? Whatever, still a great toy.
The Diaclone toys were in a nice scale. The one inch figures could fit in each one. I noticed this when staring at the empty cockpits in America.
I never had a problem with the autobots and the decepticons mass shift but I love how when they do they break the laws of physics in a fun way I remember watching an episode where starscream picked up a baseball coach and locked him in a locker room it was too small for the coach but too big for starscream
I wish soundwave turned into a blue van
I'm getting use to your videos getting updated and it makes me smile.
Thanks! I'm pausing on the updates as I'm writing some new ones so that I can start on those once my family moves. The videos that still need updating are also going to eventually be reworked, but I think I will do that in the slower months.
@@RodimusPrimal No worries take your time and we'll wait whatever videos you have coming rodimus.
transformums one hell of a drug
I feel like a news van fits Soundwave, with a weather van for SG!Soundwave
I've used (and still use) "Matter Shunt" when talking about superheroes like Plastic Man, anime characters like Luffy (talking Gear 5, not the fusen series of forms,) or Transformers
I prefer the bots NOT mass shift. In fact, I would have liked to have seen Starscream, Thundercracker, and Sky Warp all work similar to Reflector. In the original Transformers movie I would have all three seeker bots merge to form a single F-15 Eagle fighter. Or use other planes in their single aircraft mode, such as P-51 Mustangs. Then you could have two toys per seeker for the movie release. A combiner, but vehicle mode. And then another toy for just transforming into a plane, but a realistic sized WW-2 plane instead of a massive modern jet.
One of my favorites video that you updated your doing amazing job robimus
This is an excellent way to put things into perspective when comes to size. "More than Meets the Eye" is truly defined in this wonderful video!
Agreed!
I never noticed they really changed size lol. I just thought it was for the cartoon but that is cool that some people over think this. I never would have guessed.
"When it comes to scale, there isn't a franchise that screws it up as much as Transformers"
Star Trek says hi. They screwed up the scale on the Klingon Bird of Prey so much they just decided there's 3 different versions, each wildly different in size.
Kurtzman's trek in particularly has no idea what distance or speed even mean and just screws it up on purpose
I literally can't put into words how much your channel means to me. 100% my favorite youtube channel
What is the number so I can put it in
Shifting massively
In one episode i remember the autobots getting captured and hooked up to some torture machine that seemed to drain their colour and cause alot of pain. Which got me thinking, in the many wars and battles, was interrogation and torture common place and what did it encompass
I’m just happy that they made the g1 Megatron to scale to a human hand
Even as a kid watching Transformers The Movie I did think about that there is no way all the Decepticons fitted inside Astro-Train in Train shape / form and then it transformed into Space-Shuttle mode with all them inside.
Then Astro-Train called for some weight to be dropped-off (jetison) because it won't make it to Cybertron after traveling a huge distance trough the Universe?
I find it funny when they either shrink or grow 😆 personally I prefer they to mass-shift, starscream being a big ass guy compared to others like optimus would look kinda weird, specially megatron, he would be a rat sized guy in G1. I only care about realism If it looks
good on execution, but i also found interesting that someone tried to justify it inside the plot by giviving it a term and how it happens, I think it gives more dept and personality to the history.
Love your content, mate!
I coincidentally asked myself this question the other day!
Resembles the idea how Spikeyvincibles use mass shifting, in size! Such as any Spikeyvincible, starring the Gangsters Kids, as the name suggests, Spike, Amaru, King, Swapper, RR Liam, Molly and Dwight, pitted against the Tokyian-led Deviantrons' Antane-RVEGette-led Deviantrons, such as Princess Candy, Sweet Mayhem, Jeterella, Jeta Zakaijina, Thrustrena, Sci-Fi Starina, DaiTenku Jetixa, and their Supreme Leader Minimecha Sean. 😏😏😏😏
I may be 14 but I still enjoy your content and I still enjoy transformers I love how you are remaking this one I have always enjoyed this video and it answerd some of my original questions I had about the show thank you so much rodimus primal
Your channel is very educational on the subject of Transformers RodimusPrimal
Fenslerfilms Spike: “how do you change from a tape recorder into a giant?”
Fenslerfilms Soundwave: HOW DO YOU SURVIVE A METALLIC BITCHSLAP
LMAO!
4:37 meme 🤣
Is for them to know and you to find out I guess stay safe rodimus till all are one
in the episode where perceptor uses his chip to reduce and expand chips and shunk down to get the heart of darkness out of megatron
Microbots.
Wow seeing back those animals was a blast from the past
The look like PS2 graphics 😁
(Jetfire can also "series change" into a Robotech Valkyrie!)
i remember when the pretenders were introduced in the comics the humans were as bigvas a building 😂
This was an interesting topic to discuss, because I was puzzled with this topic as well
Awesome video! For me, mass shifting is the go to term because it’s close to being self explanatory. Although I do wonder how heavy Megatron is when down sizing for a humans hand 🤔
Awesome video!🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
There is nothing to explain.
The cartoon was perfect as it was, otherwise we wouldn't be here today to collect and talk about this phenomenon of the 80s.
Thanks for doing a mass shifting video
please do one for why Transformers never run out of ammo, never have to reload and their guns never overheat
Energon.
They never run out of ammo but the weapons are getting weaker with every shot fired.
They need energon to live and function just like we need water to live.
My theory is their guns are using the robots energon reserve while they're holding it.
Also; every energy beam are probably energon based which we know, is extremely devastating.
@@goatintuxedo2206 But that doesn't make sense when, in the live action movies and some of the animated shows show their guns expelling shell casings with every shot fired jest like our guns do
It would seem that their weapons, at least in some franchises, are just like ours
It is the same as GI Joe firing laser guns back in the 80s, it's not that they actually had lasers in the 80s, it was just that lasers were easier to animate than bullets are
Id like to see more numbers that describes what we saw. Could we even quantify it in percent?
For example, when the constructicons merged inside astrotrain, just HOW big was astrotrain compared to his normal sized robot mode?
Or how much of soundwaves size and weight must have disappeared so that a human could pick him up… including any casettes he had inside him.
And the titans, how big were they vaguely speaking? could we build a theoretical number of how many normal sized transformers could have been housed inside of the titans such as metroplex?
So this may be silly I sort of assumed that Cybertronians had discovered pym particles and used them to change size. This back when I was reading the Marvel comics run. I came to this conclusion cause other aspects of the Marvel universe appeared in that series.
They did include spider man in early issues but then they kind of ret conned and kept universal's separate i just view.it that they can not.only transform but also change size when needed. Not that far.fetched really 🤷♂️🤔
I'd love to get a line of transformers which are all the right scale. You would have to swap up some of the alt forms. There is no way for example Bruticus could have a space shuttle as one of his limbs. A space shuttle isn't a military vehicle anyway.
A space shuttle has a lot of interior space. in robot mode it would make sense to have blast off to be that in robot mode
Multi-Dimensional spacial folding.
honestly isn't it just things like this and even prime's trailer that make/made g1 so enjoyable and iconic
Absolutely.
great job about How Can The Transformers CHANGE In Size? Mass Shifting?
You definitely took the words right out of my month, thanks For the information like always
Mass shifting is a wonderful thing. Transformers technology like pocket storage dimensions
I'm totally ok with that, but why do Brawn & Hound transform into different size jeeps? Or Warpath being a tank the size of a go kart? Or Huffer & Pipes, being miniature tractor trailers? Worst of all Astrotrain, doesn't even use *train tracks* in his train mode! Not to mention Shockwave being inconsistent in his alt mode sizes, to where other Decepticons could use him like Megatron, & I believe a few instances where people did too! I love the Transformers & don't try too hard not to understand it, but some things truly are mind boggling.
Mass Shifter is a cool term
A simple solution to the problem would be matter to energy processes,simple enough to understand for kids,and can be explorer further down the line.
I just realized how many beast war toys I had owned.
The mass shifting thing didn’t bother me when I was 7 and 8 years old but when I was a pre-teen it was impossible to ignore the inconsistencies in scale. It was really the toys that made me notice it, particularly the minibots where a tank, war plane and flying saucer were supposed to be the same size as a VW beetle. Or how blastoff and Astrotrain both transformed into space shuttles yet their space shuttle modes in toy form were different sizes. But in the cartoon Toei animated it so well on a limited budget that I couldn’t help but forgive such inconsistencies.
But when beast wars had things like wasps and spiders that were the size of cars always struck me
As ridiculous
I like to think mass shifters can store their mass in a pocket dimention a lot like how the Animorphs store their animal forms in Z-Space.
I think only certain transformers can do it, it costs a lot of energon, end it has something to do with maybe a mini space bridge made within you to shrink your down to size and return you to normal size. I believe only a lot of the elite have this feature like Megatron and soundwave, I believe Optimus prime shrinks his tractor trailer with all the extras inside to something he can fit in a little compartment within him.
I gotta say when I first saw soundwave.for the first time I was not even sure if he could transform into a cassette player or just a simply a car since then I was thinking that now he transforms into a vehicle type mode so yeah that's my personal opinion
Depending on continuity
@@darkneon5637 Yeah exactly
Many of the Combiners look to be a bit smaller than most Megazords in the Power Rangers series, but that's just my observation.
I would love to see a series where they are 100# accurate to what they transform to, just think about soundwave being so tiny 😆