This is 100% true. As my channel grew I started bringing in more casual players, and their comments reflect that. Reddit is a cesspool as you explained, and for exactly those reasons.
@@anonymousg7627 no issue at all with people who don’t understand a game mechanic. My issue is with the same uninformed people loudly telling the rest of us what bad people we are
While some PvEr's are toxic as hell, some PvPers are also toxic, ngl. Some people believe (not you) that every single player should follow pvp etiqutte and point down at every host. Some hosts summon phantoms just for the sake of pve to help them with a boss, but they get pointed down by invaders just bcuz they have a summon, so its no wonder they hate invaders.
From my observation (for ds3) the "PvP Etiquette" crowd are really just interested in duels or are solo PvE players who don't really want to deal with invasions at all. By 2017 the bonfire duel crowd and the invaders PvEers complain about feel like different categories of players. When I think of toxic invaders I think of DSA + 7 max estus high wall griefers (which are many a new co-op players first exposure to invasions)
Made a post on ER subreddit saying "PvP is very unpolished, maybe if we do some noise they can hear us" with the clip of you getting infinite stun lock by 2 greatswords and got 35% downvote by people who hates pvp and wants as many ways to easily kill the invader with their coop friends as possible. So stupid.
This is so true it is unreal. My profile is littered with hate comments from PVE players that alt f4 me. Funny thing is they only seem to alt f4 me once the phantoms are dead, almost as if they are fine with invasions as long as they win them...funny that...
Pve players make fun of imaginary journalists asking for easy mode , but then turn around and cry about invasions because they cannot steamroll the game with 3 bodyguards taking every hit for them
I freaking hate how easy FromSoft made the PvE when playing with phantoms .... Invaders are the only ones making co-op actually fun . I would even be up for a system that allows people to invade ganks in the beginning of boss fights lol because of how easy boss fights are with phantoms ....
@@avipinhasov302 so true! In Nioh 2 co-op expidition modes the PvE gets much bigger buffs + more tough enemies when you add another another player. It keeps it still somewhat fun and challenging when you have backup. Tbh I'd love it if Fromsoft added an item that temporarily Gravelorded the hosts world in exchange for blocking invaders. Maybe I'd actually be interested in co-oping with my PvE focused friends.
Just because I hate being invaded, doesnt mean I can't play the game by myself. I'm a competitive person, and I love playing fighting games, however, I dont come to Dark souls games for competition, I come to do whatever the fuck I want, and I DONT typically like to bother with pvp of any kind, outside of fighting games, like I said. The way I see it, you either like invasions, or you don't, and I don't.
@@SleepyChloeFist too bad then, both PVE &PVE are part of the game and Miyazaki vision , or you could press the magical “offline” thingy so you can do what the “fuck” you want
I don't get how most pver's don't realize how special and unique invasions are. when I started this game 2 years ago I was eager to be invaded but it only happend twice and I will dare to say they made my first run more special.
When I started back in Dark Souls 1 I had no idea invasions were a thing and thought my first one was some sick ai that demolished me. After I realized it was a player I was amazed and how unique the multiplayer was and started invading soon after. These hard core pve players can't put aside their ego for 5 seconds to do something that requires more then hiding behind phantoms.
I want to fight cool dragons and giants not some glitching and lagging idiot coming into my game to backstab me 10 times then fading away while t-bagging on my corpse. One is fun the other is not.
I've been around the souls community for nearly a decade now, and I would say both sides can be pretty toxic in different ways. The way people were treating invading when Ds3 launched blew my mind, it was so ridiculous lol. But I've also had some of my worst encounters with people through souls pvp over the years, some of the people are just so rotten
"SkILl bASeD mAtCHmAkINg" 😂😂🤣🤣🤣 what, like an MMR or ELO system? I'm sorry, but this style of multiplayer will never enter the realm of eSports, so I find it incredibly idiotic that people want to implement systems that you'd find in eSports-represented games.
@@pygy4755 fair. I actually forgot that arenas were a thing, since most of the time you just see invasions and duel clubs. But yeah I could get behind skill-based matchmaking in regards to arena fights. Maybe like a ranking system, and you can choose whether to enter a ranked fight or an unranked one.
Skill based matchmaking is what made me quit Apex. No fun being a Masters player, getting two bronze level teammates, and then being put in Pred lobbies even when you're just playing pubs. No game should ever have such a fucking stupid system. SBMM destroys skill ceilings, because you'll never know how much better you've gotten. It's like making mobs level with you. Imagine if the hollows at the High Wall could still 3 shot you even in NG when you're SL802. That's basically what they're asking for. That's what SBMM is. It kills all sense of progression. When you've put the time in, you have EARNED being better than others.
@@TheStraightestWhitest You make it sound like you just wanna stomp noobs and be overpowered in pve. Getting bronze players on your team in pred lobbies when youre masters? I dont even know if I can call that matchmaking bro. I know Ive gotten better in a game if I start the year peaked at silver and end in plat. And I wont ever be able to get closer to the skill ceiling of souls pvp if I only get to 1v1 noobs in arena that dont know not to spam r1. Because I can just parry and win everytime, but against an actually good player I have the opportunity to try out more advanced things like hardswapping or dead angling. Also your PVE analogy doesnt make much sense, being max SL and one-shotting most mobs is different from playing games at the top competitive level.
I think the real problem with PVErs is that they slowly start to realize when they are invaded that there is such a huge skill gap. They tend to get frustrated because they Aren’t ready to put massive hours into the series. Guys please don’t forget that the game doesn’t tell you anything. You’re just gonna have to figure it out by yourself. I try to respect everyone who plays the game. If I invade a world of a PVEr, and they are just running away from me or alt F4. It’s not fun for me nor him. And the last thing I want it’s for another person to stop playing the soul series just because they aren’t ready for invasions.What I’m trying to say is that if they’re not interested in fighting just leave them alone and find somebody else. I understand that might not be a popular opinion but I’ve tried to get multiple people to play dark souls three with me even to a point where I bought the game for them. Unfortunately They couldn’t see the same appreciation for the game as me. Please comment and tell me what you think. 🥰
TL;dr kind of but not necessarily. Mostly agree. But one or two thing needs to be kept in mind. The first being that invaders typically have builds almost exclusively geared towards PvP, while the host and their phantoms don't necessarily have such builds, if anything their build is geared towards PvE and they don't necessarily have the same requirements. Second, the PvP experience is not the same thing as co-op. And I'm sure variants of this argument has probably already been made but truth be told you can't really fault players who want to play the with others without you. An invader in practice is often more frustrating than it's worth. It's distracting dare I say. Yes sometimes it's about skills but more often I think it's about why each groups play. And I don't think the PvP has as much of a leg to stand on as they might think if they stopped and realized that they need host to play in the way they like while the opposite is not true. A fear I think is almost inherent in the invader type player is that one day fromsoft might actually give the option to players to not have invasions the while keeping co-op active. Which will reduce you player pool to people who might actually want to be invader. Not trying to sound flippant and I apologize in advance if it comes off as that.
@@benjeesilv1596 There’s nothing to disagree with here. When I was new to the series I had my friend help me through the whole game. I found it very frustrating that I was being killed by what seem like professionals at the time. I didn’t want these people in my game just because I had a friend helping me out. It wouldn’t have been so bad if I didn’t need to use consumables that weren’t as easy to get to go online unless you knew what you were doing. That was in the older games and I like how Eldon ring has made going online more easier than ever before. I think at the present time dark souls three has a better PVP system still. Sure you can go invade other peoples worlds but having the arena at the end of the game made things much better. In the fact that you could also play as a boss in one of the DLC‘s was also amazing. And I had a great time with that. I’m hoping that the future DLC‘s will give us more options like in the past. but at the present moment the host is the king and without him there’s no PVP unless the invader himself becomes the host and uses the tongue. Which I’m starting to believe is happening more often. I also want to note that through my months of playing since the game’s been out in Eldon ring I’ve seen almost nobody DC while being invaded. That wasn’t true with some of the older games. And the host has more power over being invaded than ever before. It’s very difficult to keep both the host who is usually newer and doesn’t understand the mechanics of the game and the invader who scored thousands of hours under their belt. Hopefully people will understand that we invaders aren’t here to just ruin your progression. We love the soul series and we’re just trying to find a way to continue playing. Maybe as a community we can make more unspoken rules or a way for the host to say, look I’m not interested in PVP and I want you to respect me and leave my world. Kinda like how you accept a one V one without heals. I feel like most invaders have a lot of honor it’s just difficult to communicate with them.
Reminds me of this one time I invaded a PvE gank at Grand Archives. They were pretty inexperienced, so I easily beat the phantom and then got the host weak and he started panicking and ran back to bonfire. I felt like being a bit generous so I let him run back so he could at least die by the bonfire and get his souls back immediately. After beating him, I got a message from him telling me to kill myself and get in bathtub with a toaster. I was laughing hard after that, but it's unfortunate that people have these attitudes. Fortunately, the phantom sent an apology message after I reported the host, which I wasn't expecting
The other day in DS2 I've received a nasty hatemail from a ganker, who couldn't stand his ground, when invaded alone. Dood straight up went for cyberbullying to compensate his fragile ego. Tried to talk with him in reasonable way, but he kept going no matter what. Still hurts me a bit.
The greatest problem about the whole PvEr v.s. PvPer thing, is that the PvP community in general doesn't have a platform to speak on, even though they have a lot to contribute to the community. The PvP community has to rely on the PvE community to have their voice heard, which means at the same time the toxic part of the PvE community can choose to drown out anything they don't like to hear, even though they're less knowledgeable on the subject. The PvP community needs a specific platform to speak on, an official one that FromSoftware can actually hear, that encourages discussion on PvP mechanics in an organized and productive manner.
Omg I haven't seen that meme but it represents casuls so well 😂😂🤣🤣🤣 I have a friend I co-op with a lot, and he acts this way every time we get invaded, especially if we've been invaded by the same invader more than once during a session. Didn't think I'd ever have to explain to someone who's allegedly "played thru NG+11" that Invaders don't choose in any way, shape or form who they get to invade.
When I die to PVErs in invasion because of bad play or bad luck, it's almost guaranteed they will point down, even if I was just messing around with stupid weapons, not being tryhard at all, taking on 2 or three people face on, yeah you have the shitters in PVP community, but the difference is in the percentage
@@frankgrimes7388 it’s everyone yeah I actually see the community experience as a bell curve according to their perception. Newcomers see it as toxic, the large proportion of clueless sunbros in the middle imagine it’s nice and friendly, then the more experienced people realize that, yeah, it’s always been full of assholes. Deal or leave lol
this is a year old but i have to say this, whats wrong with that? you invaded their world and made yourself their enemy, and adversary, after they defeat you they express their disdain for you, as you are an invader attacking them, i think that's perfectly fine and even good roleplay. i fully believe that people spit on invaders in the lore of the game.
@@schnapps2241 talk about role play, then invaders should always point down since they hate the host so much that they need to kill them might as well express distain
Generalizing an entire group of people as toxic pve players or toxic pvp players is not a good move because it makes it seem like your talking about a lot more people than you actually are. The people your talking about are called “babies”
PvErs outright deny the importance of multiplayer and pvp for the longevity of the game. Some of them even asks From to remove pvp in general, not just invasions...
As someone who enjoy to grind ranks in the pvp arena on Elden Ring, the multiplayer aspect of the game isn't limited only to invasions. If you can't adapt and consistently get your ass raped in these 2 vs 1 invasions, then it's a you problem and you must get good. The devs gave you loads of tactics and stratagems to deal with gank squads, use the environment to your advantage instead of charging ahead like and idiot and get spanked by 3 spammers simultaneously attacking you back.
Got curious about the lifehunt scythe thing and it looks like you could get a ~650 pure dark damage lifehunt scythe that heals for ~260 HP per hit, so i guess if you catch a full 4 man gank with the canvas talisman poise cast you could get a solid near full heal. Was just looking at sl 90 with blindfold mask, nothing too crazy. Probably further optimizations, but looks like it could work well if you trade with the team. This was still with ~25% absorptions on the armor too seems fun i might try it out :)
@Sam NGL, I kinda want to try this. If you add dark clutch ring to that setup with RotSFB and Mourne's it hits 1000 flat while using the Sunless Talisman (though you still get 945 at 30 int 45 faith or 930 at 30/41). If you went fully committed to minimum dex and strength investment, you could run 30 int 41/45 faith with a raw DSA on pyro which would be level 56/60 if you didn't put anything into your body stats. Your swap options at 12 str and 14 dex are pretty limited though. So for level 90 you'd have 30-34 points to put into your other stats while having a roughly 930-950 dark damage LHS which would be absolutely nasty at those levels for players (*especially* phantoms) who don't level vig. Though if you went the level 60 route and dropped the talisman to a +3 you'd still be doing 861-874 which would be ludicrously dangerous. It almost seems that it to a point becomes very difficult to actually lose trades if it lands, because almost nothing short of 60int crystal friggen soulspear scales that hard, and you have both life steal *and* poisecast to boot. Not unless your opponent can poises through the LHS to swing something like an UGS twice *and* connects both swings. This is a lot of "on paper" theory crafting, but I think Jeenine is onto something here.
g made a point here that imo gets glossed over alot - the majority of "pve" players really dont hate invasions like this. the survey given over at the elden ringg sub after "no solo invasions" was announced for ER shows this - the vast majority of people want the option for solo hosts to opt into invasions, very few people think you should be able to turn off invasions and do co-op, and the amount of casual players that made comments in favor of invasions was pretty surprising to me. it is those periods of high activity surrounding events like trailer or info drops that really illuminate how the actual majority of players feel - the rest of the time its only people who feel strongly enough to comment, which means people who love invasions or hate invasions. the majority seems to be in the middle, and it seems like alot of these players really are not all that into the actual pvp combat - they like the feeling of never actually being safe, the adrenaline rush of getting the "you got invaded" message while fighting a tough mob, the unpredictability, the potential for funny situations/memes, and stuff like that.
@@frankgrimes7388Exactly bro 😂, it’s almost comical how little understanding there is. Just grabbing genuine actual points and adding quotation marks with a shit eating grin on their face. You gotta be understanding of the other side atleast a LITTLE bit :/
I dont get why PVE-ers get mad and toxic.. i started playing DS3 only this year and after finishing it four times i naturally started practicing PVP and invading because it is fun. On my playthroughs i got invaded maybe three times and killed the invader each time...and i was always embered because i consider it part of environment for you to be invaded, a part of the lore and the world. ( i dont summon thou, i consider it dumb, if i die to a boss i just need to practice it more... thw whole purpose of the game is to die and practice and get the sense of acomplishment... if i want to run through the game and get "instant gratification" i would play some other rpg game. )... Invasions i had most problems with were actually NPC invasions, that guy in undead setlement and the other guy with makramuko at the entrance to Irithyll dungeon...if i would get mad on invaders i would get mad on those two. AI adversaries always make me much more mad than real people... there is just something about that mechanical machine repeating its set of moves in background of it that pisses me off... if a human beats me, points down or whatever, ok no problem here..better mind and reflexes won, but if a machine beats me...i am far more angrier. I will never forget that Mauldron npc invader guy in Dark Souls 2..i was never so pissed of at a game as i was at him.. XD
Ds3 was the first souls game I played out of series, and when I first started, I played strictly offline. Only cause I wanted to get decent feel for the game and at the time, it lowkey gave me anxiety knowing I could get invaded at anytime. Like, it fucked me up when Hodrick invaded me cause I was like, how did this dude just invade me while I'm playing offline? I then realized later on that was supposed to happen, it wasn't a real person invading me, and it's built into the game, lol. And with the few invasions that happen within the game in my first playthrough, it helped me out on not feeling so afraid to be invaded when playing online. You can read every message and look at all the bloodstains in the game as much you want, you're still going to die regardless and that's absolutely fine. It's part of the game. I recently started playing the game again and last night I got invaded by a red and watchdog at the same. It's a 2v1 situation and while I know I'm going to lose, it's not something that happens to me all the time. And after I die, I just simply move on and progress through the game. I don't ever invade cause it's just something that I don't ever do, but I personally don't mind it happening to me. I honestly don't know how anyone could complain about being invaded when there's an offline option. If you're playing online with friends, or by yourself, just be prepared to be invaded, I don't know what to tell you.
The Souls games are the only games we don't ever feel bored playing, and all we play is PVE. We are interested in invading in Elden Ring, though, so we can only hope that FromSoft focuses more intently on the PvP, as they have pretty much perfected PvE.
I'd just be happy to be able to play without having to worry about random guys crashing my world all the time trying to kill me. I have yet to have a game from them where I could fully enjoy the pve
Absolutely incorrect. Me and my group of friends play through the souls games at least twice a year with a new build and we enjoy going thru as co op buds. Invaders will invade us, slow us down, spam us with hate messages, and try and call us literal slurs for having some fun with friends. I don't know what community you're talking about but clearly it's not the same one
Honestly, what did you even expected from what might be the most hypocrite, disgusting and pathetic gaming community of the last years known as the souls fanatics? They have even the balls to call you with slurs if you should ever dare to share around your play style and build that isn't the usual copy pasted braindead pure strength build lmao All this happening in an ARPG game that does encourage different tactics, builds and play styles, which makes everything way sad than what it needs to be. That's practically why i'm enjoying From Software games avoiding like the plague any steam or reddit related community aimed for the "souls elitists", so i won't have my experience ruined by these toxic dullards.
Isn't Lifehunt Scythe stupidly easy to dodge? When chased by 3 guys, you usually want to make some distance or escaping a blender, and by doing that miracle you lock yourself in place, 3 guys dodge the scythe and you are now amongst 3 dude spamming R1. Idk, the only "viable" solution i know is Lightning Storm poisecast, it does work well, but even that gets countered by caestus.
I was driven to the Souls games because of their reputation of being difficult, once I played it and saw how good they are, I knew that the fans of these games are terrible.
I feel super attacked right now lol about 90% of my playtime in Souls games has been completely offline due to living in a really poor location regarding internet access for the last several years. Admittedly I play online whenever I can, and now that I have decent wifi I do so a lot, but still. Also, speedrunners fall into that category of "PvEers", and I'd say they are just as, if not more so vital to the longevity of the game as the Co-opers and PvPers.
I just don't appreciate the toxicity I've experienced. Frigging people invade, kill me, then send hate filled messages on Xbox? I can deal with being killed, whatever, I need to get better, maybe not panic, but just because you're GuD aT pVp you have to send hate filled messages too? That's cool. I haven't met a single one of these "honorable" pvp players. I'm mainly a PvEr, and I do pvp from time to time. I haven't met a single helpful, non toxic PvPr yet, maybe I haven't played enough, I don't know. I see so many comments about people trying to help people they invade? Wtf lmao last person who invaded me called me a piece of sh*t and Said I should off myself. 🤣 so honestly f*ck both parties. If you're toxic, you're toxic.
The ultimate pve experience is waiting 45 minutes to get blue summoned, then bc'ed 5 seconds later because you didn't psychically infer they were hosting an fc. Good thing they enforced that etiquette, wouldn't want the covenant specifically designed for ganking to gank a poor invader or anything . . .
This is such a good point because all the complaints I hear from PvErs are clearly those of people who will play the story for one or 2 playthrus then never play again, PvP is the most unique thing to games in this genre these days. The multiplayer is something that these games still have wholly unique to them.
I don't enjoy pvp that much, but I don't mind getting invaded... and that is when I have no danger of save file being corrupted and they want to fight with no cheating, glitch, or flee and hide behind mountain of enemies and point down at me when I die afterwards as if he/she just kicked my ass 1v1. Waving hands or other gestures would be nice if the invader killed me solo, but I wouldn't mind getting point down for losing the fight. If the invader hid behind the enemy line to take advantage but used friendly or no gestures afterwards, I wouldn't mind. But those who point down after playing dirty is what I have problem with. I mean come on. If it's just trolling around to irritate me as much as they could, that's fine as well, but tryhard invaders behaving like that just suck out any enthusiasm I have with invasions.
Nah, to me everyone is the same. PvErs and Invaders are as toxic if not more than the deepest parts of Blighttown. My advice to everyone who reads this: Try your best to have Fun, cause no matter what you do, you'll always get hate from someone.
They don't care enough about the games to keep replaying it like we do. It's the childish group of people who just want beat the game with their friends so they can brag about beating such a "difficult game" but then when invaders rebalance the game and kill them, they throw a hissy fit and beg for invasions to be removed.
I don't mind PVP community, I think it's rather fascinating and open to its on form of creativity with builds. And helps flesh out the RPG elements of the Souls series. Being Invaded is terrifying, but gets the blood pumping XD I do hate invaders that just attack first without waving or bowing, especially when it's just me. I play mostly solo, it's been a long time since I played with my old M8s. If people don't want to be invaded, they could just go offline and use NPC summons. :/
I think Sekiro is less popular because it's replayability is weaker than ds3 mmo style of game. There is little to no customization or builds in Sekiro, just pure combat. Turns off phantom summoning pvers and people who like to make builds. I agree pvp would have kept the game more active but the there's a lot of things keeping it from being really active. I still think it's a masterpiece.
So Only you PvP people keep the game alive. So according to you the people who buy fromsoftware games on day 1 full price then buy all the dlc aren't keeping it alive because they prefer to play the game by themselves without some random person coming in their world and attacking them that wouldn't be there otherwise if the game was in offline mode
I saw that post from the thumbnail, that guy is one hell of a case. Don't know what's wrong with him or if it's a troll but he keeps posting more and more stuff.
Dark Souls is about the Environment. The dark World. The Toxic dark world of the undead, and mutated monsters. It's kinda funny for you offensive players, the ones that ignore all that, to literally attack players doing jolly coop, and try to kill them "Toxic." A toxic substance, environment, or person kills other people, or kills the discussion, or kills the party they're going to. That's what toxic means. Invasions are literally killing the party. That's the whole point, but EVEN THE ENVIRONMENT IS TOXIC. Look around you, that's the game. You want to point out the most toxic thing, in a world where Smough exists?
Toxic is a status effect. In the environment. There's entire levels of Toxic where you can attack players who're already dying, and collect their tongues. You can even throw shit on them, but you can't teabag them. YTF aren't you bragging about being the most lethal, and toxic thing in Dark Souls? That would be something.
As someone who does primarily pve and only somewhat dabbles in pvp i don't hate losing to invaders who are better. I hate that the only invaders i tend to be invaded by is douchebags using rkss cancel, estus cancel, estus refill, splitleaf infinite combo, etc. And all against a solo host just because they're getting their asses kicked by a pve player, then once they kill me they throw dung pies as if they somehow outskilled me, if this was uncommon i wouldn't mind but truth is this is all i get invaded by
I don’t necessarily agree with you. Sure, the elden ring sub reddit is a trash can, and I’m the first to say it, but the whole “pve and pvp players” argument is always a big can of worm to open. On one hand I’m of the idea that if pvp players want to engage with pvp, they have all the means to do so with people that enjoy pvp. Invading a clueless host who just wants to play the game with an optimized pvp build isn’t fair by any means let’s not kid ourselves (and also let’s please not use the excuse “but you can die just fine if it’s a boss!” Or “it’s to balance the pve bro!” It’s not like you guys are worried that the pve isn’t challenging enough kek) On the other there are some people that want to co-op but still not get invaded, and they think that red invaders are the anthicrhist coming to eat your children alive, while in reality at worst you’ll just die and respawn. (Also the hatred in general that pve players produce, as well as their close mindedness is astounding. I legit saw people saying they shouldn’t fix pvp bugs because it’s a pve game. What about players who enjoy pvp? If it exists then surely it needs to work right? Even if from games are not pvp focused, why would you mind if they fix things?) That’s why I like elden ring pvp, I just hope they fix backstabs and the damned glitches (why from? Why still?) All in all I think we shouldn’t generalize like you did, and we all have our bad apples on both sides; this whole me vs you mentality is generally speaking very toxic, and doesn’t help anyone at all. Honestly with all this drama going on I’m happy that I can opt out of online, this community already is crumbling on itself and it didn’t even start. I’ll just play the game and enjoy some pvp arena, like I always do.
@@coldfire2753 you could argue that dying to an invader it’s not the same as dying to an enemy: if I die to a mob I simply didn’t learn the pattern, with a player it’s different. They can hide behind enemies and now field bosses, and it’s no fun to chase “cuntslayer69” across the open field because he wants some pvp. Saying you vs me is toxic is easy, but that’s just because it’s true; both sides are ignorant of the other and want things their way disregarding the other, it’s not only pvp nor pve players’ fault. Heck this whole discussion is stupid, since elden ring has a very fair system, and it only needs bug fixing.
i try really hard not to complain but man it's hard not to complain when you just want to get better with a friend and some try hard comes in and makes it look easy. can't please everybody and cant voice your opinion so guess ill jjust be quiet .
Pvers should try pvp. Pvpers already have pve experience and understand the advantage that home team carries. Its fine to play with your friends so long as youre ok with the game challenging you and your friends. In fact, we encourage people playing with their friends. Just dont get upset at us playing the game how we want to play it; putting ourselves at a disadvantage and taking on your whole team.
I wanted to play with pvp on in Remastered and I gave up after I lost 55k souls in Anor Londo. I was right next to the bonfire after the terrible archer bridge and then came an invasion before I could rest at the bonfire. They were really trolly and impossible to kill with my current gear. Can you really blame me for not wanting to touch pvp again afterwards? I died on the way back to the bonfire and lost those souls.
@@swag489 Oh really? Well here is another one for you: I unfortunately don't give a damn about what swag489 got to say. Go back to playing fortnite while I enjoy ds3
I dont PVP that much, I mainly play Souls games on PC for the mods after I beat the vanilla game. That said I have mad respect for the PVP community as they are the ones that keep the games alive. You can tell how "alive" a game is by how long it takes you to enter a PVP match. And let be honest, if you are a hardcore PVE player just play on offline mode. If I happen to play PVP and I get invaded I just take the fight, probably lose and get to my souls, no big deal. The only people that PVP that I have an issue with is Twinks that basically prey on new players and get kicks out of killing inexperienced players, Ill never understand that.
Your title makes complete sense. I beat this game with handicaps just to feel something anymore, so the idea that people need help just for pve is is insane to me. Hmm Old wolf curved great sword and lifehunt scythe?
Everyone can't be good at certain games, some need help, some can't shoot straight in cod even after years of playing. Not everyone has good reflexes too.
Your pvp skills are pretty good, but your weird echochamber "We are why the game liiiiives" looking down your nose at people who don't pvp is just as toxic as what you're claiming bud.. just saying. This is some cringeworthy elitism.
Pve players are more toxic since they just wanna go through the area they are in and not deal with invaders, which is kinda a main point in the souls series; you fight enemies and invaders at the same time if you are unlucky or fortunate enough. I personally do pve first in the souls series and then a bit of both when I have finished one NG, after that I go and level my character up to use all weapons and spells to then mix and match things for a potential pvp build
If everyone just bowed after killing me I'd never be salty about losing. More people in this community need to learn to win with grace, invaders and hosts alike.
PVE players will lose twenty times to the same boss and keep plugging away at the game but they lose one invasion and completely rage at the whole game!
HEY! I use to do the lifehunt Scythe build! Super effective, powerful, and fun, and the regen is great. I don't have playstation plus currently, but Im getting it again soon, and the build is good in both pvp and pve.
Nah, there are asshats on both sides. There are more on the pve side because the bulk of the players are pve. But it runs deeper in pvpers. I honestly shouldn't have looked back into the state of the souls community. It has gotten tremendously worse over time. It's a big turn off from the games.
I think what g means here by pvers is just casuals, cause the actual existing pvers in the comunity are challenge runners like no hit/speed runners and that comunity is not specially toxic and arguably keeping the game alive just as much, if not more than the pvp comunity. Of course there are toxic casuals that dont understand pvp and will complain, but it feels weird to call them pvers when what they are is mostly people that are not even part of any comunity of souls games.
Personally if we're talking Pontiff its just a toxic free for all on both sides of the fence! Random invasions everywhere else is pretty chill! I invade a lot and host at pontiff often ( without friends on mics ) sometimes with the odd random summons, but mostly solo for the carnage! The amount of toxic energy is ridiculous!! Hosts and phantoms dc'ing all the time, tryhard invaders bow glitching or BC because they not winning..it's a mess!! But hey.....i always go back!!🤣
Not really, You have entire communities of people who dont online in all souls and have thousands of hours in these games of just playing and enjoying the environment......like the souls games arent really PVP oriented in the first place, Its something extra to keep it alive
Hard disagree, I focused on pve in Dark Souls 2 and I have 1267 hours in it between OG Dark Souls 2 (867) and Scholar of the First Sin (400). For me a big chunk of the experience was trying out specific roleplay builds and seeing how it would effect the feel of the gameplay. I didn't ever actually get bored with Dark Souls 2, either - the main reason I stopped playing it was simply because other games came out and I eventually drifted to them.
@@HeroOfTheHolySword im mostly refering to ds3. Ds2 and ds1 have more to explore when it comes to secrets and world mechanics. Ds3 seems to be heavily combat oriented than the rest and in that case i find less people play ds3 pve once they beat it so many times and either stop playing or gravitate towards pvp
@@stephenreid6686 im referring to ds3. And i would disagree in the case of ds3. Maybe its not oriented around it, but its a huge part of it, as they continued to release nerfs and buffs that mainly affect pvp until they stopped supporting it. Pvp has been in souls games since demon souls. Ignoring what mods can do for single player (exploring in no clip mode, doing mod runs, changing skins and weapon arts etc) most people quite playing if they dont get into pvp (pvp includes but is not limited too being in ganks, using covenants, invading, dueling, ect). You dont see console players playing this game after so long cause they are bored and nothing less to do(unless they engage in pvp). Pvp is always different and people adapt to your playing in a way AI cant which keeps it entertaining 6 years later. If you can show me atleast 1 person who just plays pve for fun and has been playing since release of ds3, (continuously) then you will convince me
@@jiddy30 So I gotta correct you there man. While DS3 has more combat features it is not a huge part of it, It is just more difficult so if you choose to engage with the combat system and not roll through the game ofc its gonna be a huge part of it but if I just scaled down the number of mobs in DS3 relative to DS1 based on map size and kept the same combat systems would you still say its a huge part of it OFC not and thats just numbers man. Anyways ill do you one better, ill show you a whole discord. Check Manfighdragon or Lance McDonald's channel.
The problem is skill gap. PVP'r have, no surprise, a lot of pvp expierence and pvp build. They can invade when they 100% ready for pvp fight, with full hp and estus (on their halved means) while pve player can fight the mobs playing the game for first time, out of estus, not knowing where the save zones are, with poorly upgraded weapon etc. If PVPr invade PVEr with little to no pvp expierence, of course he's gonna lose, not consider it fair and be upset, what did you expect? You didn't seek other PVP-enjoying players to begin with. "It's just part of the game" as much as being ganked when tables turn. Also, what's that psyop? To believe that community that is, supported by forums and youtube videos, constantly invading the High Wall with twinks, unable to use any gesture besides point down, throws dung pies, and, to begin with, comes with PVP build against PVE builds is less toxic that players who don't intent on beating other players to begin with is top tier delusional. Seriously, aren't you guys constantly cry about being ganked, isn't that enough pvp toxicity for you?
I love to PvE. But I also love to PvP. I always playthrough my first time online. Then I like to break the game with a build offline. But then I always have a couple PvP builds just to play multiplayer online either coop or invasions and love fight clubbing too. Win or lose it's all about the moment
Most PVEers just wanna play the game at their own pace and leisure. You guys who enjoy PVP can easily just go involve yourselves with others who also like PVP. Why does anybody care how somebody decides to play the game? I play Souls by myself all the time, but the most fun I have is when I summon my friends and we fuck around together. I don't see what the problem is with choosing to play this way..... This is like if you went to a Tennis Court, and made fun of everybody for not playing Volleyball with you.
I agree with you, literally the game forces you to deal with pvp when you are just trying to fuck around with your friends killing things and bosses. An invader comes, kills you and then you have to do it all over again until another invader comes and kills you again (Or you kill them and they call you a ganker or they just run and heal over and over again without letting you play the game how you wanted to).
@@june4000 I've been playing Demon's Souls by myself for years now. Now that I have the Remake, I can FINALLLY play with my friends, but we're constantly getting invaded in certain worlds. 😞 😓 it's fine now, but when my character was a baby, I couldn't defend myself against anybody. Now I just 1-shot them with magic, but still.. It's never fun, lol. I feel like we just have to agree to disagree with most invaders.. They enjoy it, and we don't.
Co op legit ruins the balance of pve, like you can steam roll everything with overleveled phantoms carrying you like how is that fun?, yes ppl can co op but why be so God damn toxic about an ingame mechanic and claim invaders are immoral ppl who force there way into hosts world when in reality the game is pvp/pve you consent to a invasion as soon as you pop an ember, invasions are there to balance the game when you want easy mode, hell dark souls 3 is the easiest dark souls.
Souls games are not balanced around co-op, the hardest areas and bosses become trivialized. Thats why DS3 prioritizes and Elden ring only has invasions occur against co-opers.
I love the Souls PvP. Dark Souls 3 PvP was pretty awesome. Only gripe I have is the poise being for hyper armor and not passive like DS1. Killed most strength only PvP. But did make it really satisfying to 2 or 3 k with a GS or GA.
I would have played Dark Souls Three once and then left it behind for newer games, were it not for my introduction to a PVP experience I had never imagined would capture me so wholly. I therefore consider the arguments for balanced PVP to be more healthy to a Souls game than the drivel being spewed from the PVE enthusiasts' perspective.
For me I'm a casual souls fan who loves pve normally pvp to me is just not my style. I love the games world n such. I think most of the hate is just salty assholes. It's not just pve but both ways you know? Like if u beat someone in pvp. I respect all souls fans
I feel like this is a microcosm of any game community where you can label two groups as "casual" or "hardcore". Anecdotally the former is ALWAYS disproportionately more toxic and entitled, and tend to project by claiming the hardcore playerbase do this. I think this is because for a casual the game they're playing doesn't mean that much to them outside of a temporary diversion. They want an experience tailored towards them and will demand it without considering the consequences those changes might have on the game long term because they won't be around to deal with them.
Imagine playing a game that is challenging, that you will likely die in hundreds of times in a single playthrough, that is known for having an incredibly high pvp player base, but then complain about being invaded and getting killed a couple of times out of the hundreds of times you are likely to die. I guarantee, that if those players tried the invasions, they would probably start to think that the people they invade are the dickheads :P
The games are pretty much set up to make pve players angry and most of the people I know who love invading get their fun from pissing off pve players so it's just a never ending cycle. Cause they don't find pvp fun they only find attacking people who don't want to pvp fun. I I personly would love if I could play atleast one of their games without having to worry about the whole forced pvp aspect that simply doesn't seem possible unelss you wish to play completely alone which to me as a mainly co op player is a no go.
@@coldfire2753 not entitled at all its simply knowing what I like the whole invasion system had been only downside for me in these games for years. I wish I could play without them but it is what it is I'll still buy their games no matter what cause that single negative cant bog down otherwise amazing games. Not wanting to be attacked by players when I am trying to enjoy the game isnt picky at all.
@@coldfire2753 I don't fail to understand its impossible to play co op offline and that's how I enjoy to play. There for I don't play offline. Extremely simple to understand. Same as how their is actual pvp in the game but they don't want to pvp they want to kill the pve players instead
Not only this, another community has a problem too. The game isn't hard enough, or oh, this will be the _____ armor, making it broken. This game is easy, I'll cry about it. Wahhhhhh! If you are crying about the game not being difficult enough, go outside and rock climb, you baby. *If you know what game series I'm talking about, you will understand what I am talking about.* The one percent of our community is a bunch of whiny, ungrateful babies who use Longsword. They are a big joke.
I would think it would be in their best interest to have invaders because it keeps the gameplay "fresh" and high in replay value....makes no sense to play a game like this and there's nothing to push you trying new builds and tech.
@@hoked2194 don't fix what isn't broken. Invaders don't search for fight with PVP-players on arenas, they don't sit all the time in fight clubs, but also they complain when their target hides behind the mobs, i mean, behind phantoms, so what's left besides the easiest options like clueless players without PVP expierence?
@@hoked2194 video called "The most toxic part of souls community are PvErs". No details. I didn't say "i think invasions are just clueless PvE players", why you blame that other person using strawmen when you use them on your own?
What you call "in game toxicity" is literally what invaders/PvPers are supposed to do. I'm also pretty confident that PvE lords genarate most of the hatemail :)
@@hoked2194 Yeah, you should tell the same thing to these invaders losers who used to abuse the carian retaliation glitch during the first months of Elden Ring, who consistently flooded your dms with hate if you somehow managed to outplay them lmao
Pvpers (especially DS3) get labeled as toxic, join the discord to find out more. I just wanted to tell the people in Farron they were awesome to fight, Ive got alot to learn--and the person got mad because I'm a wolf of farron or something. I dunno 15 Dms of different ways I should off myself because I didn't even kill anyone. Like... you're welcome for the pvp medal buddy...
So many say the invader is OP but really invaders have so many disadvantage such as half estus half health and almost always get ganked to death and they can’t even keep their one advantage that they have A.I enemies because of the giant tree seed almost as though Miyazaki lost to a invader and made DS3 pvp to spite them
I dont really condone people going out if their way to message you because they don't like pvp, turn offline and you don't have to deal with them but pvp is part of the experience. I prefer PVE but I relish in an invader or even a pvp arena because it switches up the whole vibe of the game. Invaders make you worried you won't make it back to your souls and you have to suddenly leave your comfort zone and try and get good 😆 the arenas are more so because the all around vibe is so chill and upbeat! Everyone's there to show off their builds and chill and watch matches or even participate 😀
![[Dark Souls 3] Satisfying Clutch 1v3 Lone Pyro Style](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/jAkloUpaIBQ/mqdefault.jpg)
![[Dark Souls 3] Satisfying Clutch 1v3 Lone Pyro Style](/img/tr.png)
pve or pvp isnt toxic, its humanity in general they're all hollow
Its a damn curse...
The damn curse is called reddit bias
Sounds like you’re a souls npc for real, Undine the Accursed 😂
@@Asthetic-Horizonno life sentiment fr.
Evil red man destroys all hope and kindness left in the world.
made me drop my souls momentarily
This is 100% true. As my channel grew I started bringing in more casual players, and their comments reflect that.
Reddit is a cesspool as you explained, and for exactly those reasons.
The few souls reddit interactions I've had/seen have been god awful lol
r/shittydarksouls is the best souls subreddit by miles
@@anonymousg7627 no issue at all with people who don’t understand a game mechanic. My issue is with the same uninformed people loudly telling the rest of us what bad people we are
While some PvEr's are toxic as hell, some PvPers are also toxic, ngl. Some people believe (not you) that every single player should follow pvp etiqutte and point down at every host. Some hosts summon phantoms just for the sake of pve to help them with a boss, but they get pointed down by invaders just bcuz they have a summon, so its no wonder they hate invaders.
@@coldfire2753 Well don't forget that you need to use an ember to summon a phantom, only to have an invader come and basically make it useless.
Yeah well I don’t take the opinions of nut jobs too seriously whether they’re pvpers or pvers.
From my observation (for ds3) the "PvP Etiquette" crowd are really just interested in duels or are solo PvE players who don't really want to deal with invasions at all. By 2017 the bonfire duel crowd and the invaders PvEers complain about feel like different categories of players.
When I think of toxic invaders I think of DSA + 7 max estus high wall griefers (which are many a new co-op players first exposure to invasions)
Made a post on ER subreddit saying "PvP is very unpolished, maybe if we do some noise they can hear us" with the clip of you getting infinite stun lock by 2 greatswords and got 35% downvote by people who hates pvp and wants as many ways to easily kill the invader with their coop friends as possible. So stupid.
@oohanalligator I prefer blues 100% over resummoned white buddies
This is so true it is unreal. My profile is littered with hate comments from PVE players that alt f4 me. Funny thing is they only seem to alt f4 me once the phantoms are dead, almost as if they are fine with invasions as long as they win them...funny that...
@@frankgrimes7388 Apart from the fact it is very true
Pve players make fun of imaginary journalists asking for easy mode , but then turn around and cry about invasions because they cannot steamroll the game with 3 bodyguards taking every hit for them
Still funny even tho it's tragic
I freaking hate how easy FromSoft made the PvE when playing with phantoms ....
Invaders are the only ones making co-op actually fun .
I would even be up for a system that allows people to invade ganks in the beginning of boss fights lol because of how easy boss fights are with phantoms ....
@@avipinhasov302 so true!
In Nioh 2 co-op expidition modes the PvE gets much bigger buffs + more tough enemies when you add another another player. It keeps it still somewhat fun and challenging when you have backup.
Tbh I'd love it if Fromsoft added an item that temporarily Gravelorded the hosts world in exchange for blocking invaders. Maybe I'd actually be interested in co-oping with my PvE focused friends.
Just because I hate being invaded, doesnt mean I can't play the game by myself. I'm a competitive person, and I love playing fighting games, however, I dont come to Dark souls games for competition, I come to do whatever the fuck I want, and I DONT typically like to bother with pvp of any kind, outside of fighting games, like I said. The way I see it, you either like invasions, or you don't, and I don't.
@@SleepyChloeFist too bad then, both PVE &PVE are part of the game and Miyazaki vision , or you could press the magical “offline” thingy so you can do what the “fuck” you want
I don't get how most pver's don't realize how special and unique invasions are. when I started this game 2 years ago I was eager to be invaded but it only happend twice and I will dare to say they made my first run more special.
When I started back in Dark Souls 1 I had no idea invasions were a thing and thought my first one was some sick ai that demolished me. After I realized it was a player I was amazed and how unique the multiplayer was and started invading soon after. These hard core pve players can't put aside their ego for 5 seconds to do something that requires more then hiding behind phantoms.
@@Julius064 lol unfortunately I knew about invaders before I play. yeah salty pvers are just sad really
I was desperate for more invasions in DS1 and I absolutely suck at DS1 pvp cuz, well, im not one of the .1%
some people are just boring pussies
pve'rs can get shit on by a boss for hours and its fine but when another human starts outplaying them is when they have a problem. egos are funni
reee ur breakin mah game and invading is morally wrong lol
One word, Pride
I want to fight cool dragons and giants not some glitching and lagging idiot coming into my game to backstab me 10 times then fading away while t-bagging on my corpse. One is fun the other is not.
@@portalmanHUN but bother are subjective, play offline.
@@portalmanHUN play offline then
I've been around the souls community for nearly a decade now, and I would say both sides can be pretty toxic in different ways. The way people were treating invading when Ds3 launched blew my mind, it was so ridiculous lol. But I've also had some of my worst encounters with people through souls pvp over the years, some of the people are just so rotten
@@CapitanSonaglio Yeah a lot of it comes across as super elitist sometimes aswell.
Eliatorx: "Skill based matchmaking would help."
It would help kill the player count, yes.
"SkILl bASeD mAtCHmAkINg" 😂😂🤣🤣🤣 what, like an MMR or ELO system? I'm sorry, but this style of multiplayer will never enter the realm of eSports, so I find it incredibly idiotic that people want to implement systems that you'd find in eSports-represented games.
@@SynysterProjects Putting a ranked/MMR system in invasions would be kinda dumb but arenas in dks could benefit from skill based matchmaking.
@@pygy4755 fair. I actually forgot that arenas were a thing, since most of the time you just see invasions and duel clubs. But yeah I could get behind skill-based matchmaking in regards to arena fights. Maybe like a ranking system, and you can choose whether to enter a ranked fight or an unranked one.
Skill based matchmaking is what made me quit Apex. No fun being a Masters player, getting two bronze level teammates, and then being put in Pred lobbies even when you're just playing pubs.
No game should ever have such a fucking stupid system. SBMM destroys skill ceilings, because you'll never know how much better you've gotten. It's like making mobs level with you. Imagine if the hollows at the High Wall could still 3 shot you even in NG when you're SL802. That's basically what they're asking for. That's what SBMM is. It kills all sense of progression. When you've put the time in, you have EARNED being better than others.
@@TheStraightestWhitest You make it sound like you just wanna stomp noobs and be overpowered in pve. Getting bronze players on your team in pred lobbies when youre masters? I dont even know if I can call that matchmaking bro. I know Ive gotten better in a game if I start the year peaked at silver and end in plat. And I wont ever be able to get closer to the skill ceiling of souls pvp if I only get to 1v1 noobs in arena that dont know not to spam r1. Because I can just parry and win everytime, but against an actually good player I have the opportunity to try out more advanced things like hardswapping or dead angling. Also your PVE analogy doesnt make much sense, being max SL and one-shotting most mobs is different from playing games at the top competitive level.
I think the real problem with PVErs is that they slowly start to realize when they are invaded that there is such a huge skill gap. They tend to get frustrated because they Aren’t ready to put massive hours into the series. Guys please don’t forget that the game doesn’t tell you anything. You’re just gonna have to figure it out by yourself. I try to respect everyone who plays the game. If I invade a world of a PVEr, and they are just running away from me or alt F4. It’s not fun for me nor him. And the last thing I want it’s for another person to stop playing the soul series just because they aren’t ready for invasions.What I’m trying to say is that if they’re not interested in fighting just leave them alone and find somebody else. I understand that might not be a popular opinion but I’ve tried to get multiple people to play dark souls three with me even to a point where I bought the game for them. Unfortunately They couldn’t see the same appreciation for the game as me. Please comment and tell me what you think. 🥰
TL;dr kind of but not necessarily.
Mostly agree. But one or two thing needs to be kept in mind. The first being that invaders typically have builds almost exclusively geared towards PvP, while the host and their phantoms don't necessarily have such builds, if anything their build is geared towards PvE and they don't necessarily have the same requirements. Second, the PvP experience is not the same thing as co-op. And I'm sure variants of this argument has probably already been made but truth be told you can't really fault players who want to play the with others without you. An invader in practice is often more frustrating than it's worth. It's distracting dare I say. Yes sometimes it's about skills but more often I think it's about why each groups play. And I don't think the PvP has as much of a leg to stand on as they might think if they stopped and realized that they need host to play in the way they like while the opposite is not true. A fear I think is almost inherent in the invader type player is that one day fromsoft might actually give the option to players to not have invasions the while keeping co-op active. Which will reduce you player pool to people who might actually want to be invader.
Not trying to sound flippant and I apologize in advance if it comes off as that.
@@benjeesilv1596 There’s nothing to disagree with here. When I was new to the series I had my friend help me through the whole game. I found it very frustrating that I was being killed by what seem like professionals at the time. I didn’t want these people in my game just because I had a friend helping me out. It wouldn’t have been so bad if I didn’t need to use consumables that weren’t as easy to get to go online unless you knew what you were doing. That was in the older games and I like how Eldon ring has made going online more easier than ever before. I think at the present time dark souls three has a better PVP system still. Sure you can go invade other peoples worlds but having the arena at the end of the game made things much better. In the fact that you could also play as a boss in one of the DLC‘s was also amazing. And I had a great time with that. I’m hoping that the future DLC‘s will give us more options like in the past. but at the present moment the host is the king and without him there’s no PVP unless the invader himself becomes the host and uses the tongue. Which I’m starting to believe is happening more often. I also want to note that through my months of playing since the game’s been out in Eldon ring I’ve seen almost nobody DC while being invaded. That wasn’t true with some of the older games. And the host has more power over being invaded than ever before. It’s very difficult to keep both the host who is usually newer and doesn’t understand the mechanics of the game and the invader who scored thousands of hours under their belt. Hopefully people will understand that we invaders aren’t here to just ruin your progression. We love the soul series and we’re just trying to find a way to continue playing. Maybe as a community we can make more unspoken rules or a way for the host to say, look I’m not interested in PVP and I want you to respect me and leave my world. Kinda like how you accept a one V one without heals. I feel like most invaders have a lot of honor it’s just difficult to communicate with them.
@@michaelakadap924 No invader is gonna leave your world unless you bribe them. Don't expect slack, though. We all had to go through it.
well said
Reminds me of this one time I invaded a PvE gank at Grand Archives. They were pretty inexperienced, so I easily beat the phantom and then got the host weak and he started panicking and ran back to bonfire. I felt like being a bit generous so I let him run back so he could at least die by the bonfire and get his souls back immediately. After beating him, I got a message from him telling me to kill myself and get in bathtub with a toaster. I was laughing hard after that, but it's unfortunate that people have these attitudes. Fortunately, the phantom sent an apology message after I reported the host, which I wasn't expecting
The other day in DS2 I've received a nasty hatemail from a ganker, who couldn't stand his ground, when invaded alone. Dood straight up went for cyberbullying to compensate his fragile ego. Tried to talk with him in reasonable way, but he kept going no matter what. Still hurts me a bit.
And they want us to believe pvpers are the toxic ones lmao.
The greatest problem about the whole PvEr v.s. PvPer thing, is that the PvP community in general doesn't have a platform to speak on, even though they have a lot to contribute to the community. The PvP community has to rely on the PvE community to have their voice heard, which means at the same time the toxic part of the PvE community can choose to drown out anything they don't like to hear, even though they're less knowledgeable on the subject.
The PvP community needs a specific platform to speak on, an official one that FromSoftware can actually hear, that encourages discussion on PvP mechanics in an organized and productive manner.
This, so much
my favorite pver meme is when they blame you for invading them. like as if youre targeting specifically them lol
exactly lmfao
Omg I haven't seen that meme but it represents casuls so well 😂😂🤣🤣🤣 I have a friend I co-op with a lot, and he acts this way every time we get invaded, especially if we've been invaded by the same invader more than once during a session. Didn't think I'd ever have to explain to someone who's allegedly "played thru NG+11" that Invaders don't choose in any way, shape or form who they get to invade.
Tbf you still decided to invade, they didn't decide to get invaded.
When I die to PVErs in invasion because of bad play or bad luck, it's almost guaranteed they will point down, even if I was just messing around with stupid weapons, not being tryhard at all, taking on 2 or three people face on, yeah you have the shitters in PVP community, but the difference is in the percentage
they have to revel in what rare victories the achieve lol
@@frankgrimes7388 it’s everyone yeah
I actually see the community experience as a bell curve according to their perception. Newcomers see it as toxic, the large proportion of clueless sunbros in the middle imagine it’s nice and friendly, then the more experienced people realize that, yeah, it’s always been full of assholes. Deal or leave lol
this is a year old but i have to say this, whats wrong with that? you invaded their world and made yourself their enemy, and adversary, after they defeat you they express their disdain for you, as you are an invader attacking them, i think that's perfectly fine and even good roleplay. i fully believe that people spit on invaders in the lore of the game.
@@schnapps2241 talk about role play, then invaders should always point down since they hate the host so much that they need to kill them might as well express distain
Generalizing an entire group of people as toxic pve players or toxic pvp players is not a good move because it makes it seem like your talking about a lot more people than you actually are. The people your talking about are called “babies”
Yeh, I really apologize on the behalf of all PVErs both online and offline.....why go online and complain about basic multiplayer dummies.
PvErs outright deny the importance of multiplayer and pvp for the longevity of the game. Some of them even asks From to remove pvp in general, not just invasions...
As someone who enjoy to grind ranks in the pvp arena on Elden Ring, the multiplayer aspect of the game isn't limited only to invasions.
If you can't adapt and consistently get your ass raped in these 2 vs 1 invasions, then it's a you problem and you must get good.
The devs gave you loads of tactics and stratagems to deal with gank squads, use the environment to your advantage instead of charging ahead like and idiot and get spanked by 3 spammers simultaneously attacking you back.
Got curious about the lifehunt scythe thing and it looks like you could get a ~650 pure dark damage lifehunt scythe that heals for ~260 HP per hit, so i guess if you catch a full 4 man gank with the canvas talisman poise cast you could get a solid near full heal. Was just looking at sl 90 with blindfold mask, nothing too crazy. Probably further optimizations, but looks like it could work well if you trade with the team. This was still with ~25% absorptions on the armor too seems fun i might try it out :)
Isn't there a dark talisman/chime that could work better for the damage portion?
@@sterlingg.759 U right im dumb that hits 926 damage with sunless talisman 45int/faith lol, so like 365 HP per hit. Kinda silly tbh
@Captain_Morgan it'd probably only work against ganks who just mindlessly r1 but it might be funny a couple times :)
I use to use it when I had playstation plus, it was crazy fun, and people usually couldn't stop me when I started.
@Sam NGL, I kinda want to try this.
If you add dark clutch ring to that setup with RotSFB and Mourne's it hits 1000 flat while using the Sunless Talisman (though you still get 945 at 30 int 45 faith or 930 at 30/41). If you went fully committed to minimum dex and strength investment, you could run 30 int 41/45 faith with a raw DSA on pyro which would be level 56/60 if you didn't put anything into your body stats. Your swap options at 12 str and 14 dex are pretty limited though. So for level 90 you'd have 30-34 points to put into your other stats while having a roughly 930-950 dark damage LHS which would be absolutely nasty at those levels for players (*especially* phantoms) who don't level vig. Though if you went the level 60 route and dropped the talisman to a +3 you'd still be doing 861-874 which would be ludicrously dangerous.
It almost seems that it to a point becomes very difficult to actually lose trades if it lands, because almost nothing short of 60int crystal friggen soulspear scales that hard, and you have both life steal *and* poisecast to boot. Not unless your opponent can poises through the LHS to swing something like an UGS twice *and* connects both swings. This is a lot of "on paper" theory crafting, but I think Jeenine is onto something here.
g made a point here that imo gets glossed over alot - the majority of "pve" players really dont hate invasions like this. the survey given over at the elden ringg sub after "no solo invasions" was announced for ER shows this - the vast majority of people want the option for solo hosts to opt into invasions, very few people think you should be able to turn off invasions and do co-op, and the amount of casual players that made comments in favor of invasions was pretty surprising to me.
it is those periods of high activity surrounding events like trailer or info drops that really illuminate how the actual majority of players feel - the rest of the time its only people who feel strongly enough to comment, which means people who love invasions or hate invasions. the majority seems to be in the middle, and it seems like alot of these players really are not all that into the actual pvp combat - they like the feeling of never actually being safe, the adrenaline rush of getting the "you got invaded" message while fighting a tough mob, the unpredictability, the potential for funny situations/memes, and stuff like that.
I don't understand the anger. I mean my first 1-2 playthroughs I hid in offline mode out of fear. That should just be the solution.
Fair point, but they can't steamroll the game with 4 people in offline mode
"See that's where you're wrong. Even though I have only played PVE I still suck at the game and need 3 extra phantoms to beat Deacons."
"But muh friends! I cannot play without muh friends!"
@@frankgrimes7388Exactly bro 😂, it’s almost comical how little understanding there is. Just grabbing genuine actual points and adding quotation marks with a shit eating grin on their face. You gotta be understanding of the other side atleast a LITTLE bit :/
I dont get why PVE-ers get mad and toxic.. i started playing DS3 only this year and after finishing it four times i naturally started practicing PVP and invading because it is fun.
On my playthroughs i got invaded maybe three times and killed the invader each time...and i was always embered because i consider it part of environment for you to be invaded, a part of the lore and the world.
( i dont summon thou, i consider it dumb, if i die to a boss i just need to practice it more... thw whole purpose of the game is to die and practice and get the sense of acomplishment... if i want to run through the game and get "instant gratification" i would play some other rpg game. )...
Invasions i had most problems with were actually NPC invasions, that guy in undead setlement and the other guy with makramuko at the entrance to Irithyll dungeon...if i would get mad on invaders i would get mad on those two.
AI adversaries always make me much more mad than real people... there is just something about that mechanical machine repeating its set of moves in background of it that pisses me off... if a human beats me, points down or whatever, ok no problem here..better mind and reflexes won, but if a machine beats me...i am far more angrier.
I will never forget that Mauldron npc invader guy in Dark Souls 2..i was never so pissed of at a game as i was at him.. XD
Ds3 was the first souls game I played out of series, and when I first started, I played strictly offline. Only cause I wanted to get decent feel for the game and at the time, it lowkey gave me anxiety knowing I could get invaded at anytime. Like, it fucked me up when Hodrick invaded me cause I was like, how did this dude just invade me while I'm playing offline? I then realized later on that was supposed to happen, it wasn't a real person invading me, and it's built into the game, lol. And with the few invasions that happen within the game in my first playthrough, it helped me out on not feeling so afraid to be invaded when playing online. You can read every message and look at all the bloodstains in the game as much you want, you're still going to die regardless and that's absolutely fine. It's part of the game. I recently started playing the game again and last night I got invaded by a red and watchdog at the same. It's a 2v1 situation and while I know I'm going to lose, it's not something that happens to me all the time. And after I die, I just simply move on and progress through the game. I don't ever invade cause it's just something that I don't ever do, but I personally don't mind it happening to me. I honestly don't know how anyone could complain about being invaded when there's an offline option. If you're playing online with friends, or by yourself, just be prepared to be invaded, I don't know what to tell you.
Let me just ask this question to answer my confusion. You don’t mind me playing in offline? I hate anything pvp so….
The Souls games are the only games we don't ever feel bored playing, and all we play is PVE. We are interested in invading in Elden Ring, though, so we can only hope that FromSoft focuses more intently on the PvP, as they have pretty much perfected PvE.
I'd just be happy to be able to play without having to worry about random guys crashing my world all the time trying to kill me. I have yet to have a game from them where I could fully enjoy the pve
@@De1usionsofGrandeur but offline mode is straight up pve
@@pygy4755 he just wants uninterrupted co-op w his F•R•I•E•N•D•S
@@Yelzabub thank you that's exactly right.
@@pygy4755 ya but then I can't do co op which is the real draw for me with these games.
Absolutely incorrect. Me and my group of friends play through the souls games at least twice a year with a new build and we enjoy going thru as co op buds. Invaders will invade us, slow us down, spam us with hate messages, and try and call us literal slurs for having some fun with friends. I don't know what community you're talking about but clearly it's not the same one
Honestly, what did you even expected from what might be the most hypocrite, disgusting and pathetic gaming community of the last years known as the souls fanatics?
They have even the balls to call you with slurs if you should ever dare to share around your play style and build that isn't the usual copy pasted braindead pure strength build lmao
All this happening in an ARPG game that does encourage different tactics, builds and play styles, which makes everything way sad than what it needs to be.
That's practically why i'm enjoying From Software games avoiding like the plague any steam or reddit related community aimed for the "souls elitists", so i won't have my experience ruined by these toxic dullards.
You should see the slurs people will call you when you invade them then lol
Isn't Lifehunt Scythe stupidly easy to dodge? When chased by 3 guys, you usually want to make some distance or escaping a blender, and by doing that miracle you lock yourself in place, 3 guys dodge the scythe and you are now amongst 3 dude spamming R1. Idk, the only "viable" solution i know is Lightning Storm poisecast, it does work well, but even that gets countered by caestus.
After over 2500 hours in this game I can safely say that I suck at it
pveers officially see dark souls 3 as a game where they break 5 controllers till they finish game, what do you expect?
Its reddit what did you expect?They have to brag about the difficulty in these games because they never experienced a difficult game in their lives
I was driven to the Souls games because of their reputation of being difficult, once I played it and saw how good they are, I knew that the fans of these games are terrible.
underrated comment
Dark Souls 3 is anything but hard tho lmao
I feel super attacked right now lol about 90% of my playtime in Souls games has been completely offline due to living in a really poor location regarding internet access for the last several years. Admittedly I play online whenever I can, and now that I have decent wifi I do so a lot, but still. Also, speedrunners fall into that category of "PvEers", and I'd say they are just as, if not more so vital to the longevity of the game as the Co-opers and PvPers.
I just don't appreciate the toxicity I've experienced. Frigging people invade, kill me, then send hate filled messages on Xbox? I can deal with being killed, whatever, I need to get better, maybe not panic, but just because you're GuD aT pVp you have to send hate filled messages too? That's cool. I haven't met a single one of these "honorable" pvp players. I'm mainly a PvEr, and I do pvp from time to time. I haven't met a single helpful, non toxic PvPr yet, maybe I haven't played enough, I don't know. I see so many comments about people trying to help people they invade? Wtf lmao last person who invaded me called me a piece of sh*t and Said I should off myself. 🤣 so honestly f*ck both parties. If you're toxic, you're toxic.
The ultimate pve experience is waiting 45 minutes to get blue summoned, then bc'ed 5 seconds later because you didn't psychically infer they were hosting an fc. Good thing they enforced that etiquette, wouldn't want the covenant specifically designed for ganking to gank a poor invader or anything . . .
I'll try lifehunt scythe although i don't see it being any better than lightnight stake or lightingh storm
This is such a good point because all the complaints I hear from PvErs are clearly those of people who will play the story for one or 2 playthrus then never play again, PvP is the most unique thing to games in this genre these days. The multiplayer is something that these games still have wholly unique to them.
Jeenine really pulled a pot calling the kettle black moment when considering how bad the pvp community and a bite of that fur burger is alone.
I don't enjoy pvp that much, but I don't mind getting invaded...
and that is when I have no danger of save file being corrupted and they want to fight with no cheating, glitch, or flee and hide behind mountain of enemies and point down at me when I die afterwards as if he/she just kicked my ass 1v1.
Waving hands or other gestures would be nice if the invader killed me solo, but I wouldn't mind getting point down for losing the fight.
If the invader hid behind the enemy line to take advantage but used friendly or no gestures afterwards, I wouldn't mind.
But those who point down after playing dirty is what I have problem with. I mean come on. If it's just trolling around to irritate me as much as they could, that's fine as well, but tryhard invaders behaving like that just suck out any enthusiasm I have with invasions.
They also don’t have the most fun, even if your bad, being a blue or any type of invader or a phantom going for pvp, you will have so much fun
Nah, to me everyone is the same. PvErs and Invaders are as toxic if not more than the deepest parts of Blighttown.
My advice to everyone who reads this: Try your best to have Fun, cause no matter what you do, you'll always get hate from someone.
Delusionnal.
They don't care enough about the games to keep replaying it like we do. It's the childish group of people who just want beat the game with their friends so they can brag about beating such a "difficult game" but then when invaders rebalance the game and kill them, they throw a hissy fit and beg for invasions to be removed.
I don't mind PVP community, I think it's rather fascinating and open to its on form of creativity with builds. And helps flesh out the RPG elements of the Souls series.
Being Invaded is terrifying, but gets the blood pumping XD
I do hate invaders that just attack first without waving or bowing, especially when it's just me.
I play mostly solo, it's been a long time since I played with my old M8s.
If people don't want to be invaded, they could just go offline and use NPC summons. :/
Pvp is goated i swear i have a character at end game in ds2 ane i choose pvp idc if i win or lose
I think Sekiro is less popular because it's replayability is weaker than ds3 mmo style of game. There is little to no customization or builds in Sekiro, just pure combat. Turns off phantom summoning pvers and people who like to make builds.
I agree pvp would have kept the game more active but the there's a lot of things keeping it from being really active. I still think it's a masterpiece.
The thing is if you actually enjoy pve and dislike pvp you just play offline
B-but then I can't have 3 phantoms handhold me and beat the entire game for me so I can brag about beating the game on reddit :(
So Only you PvP people keep the game alive. So according to you the people who buy fromsoftware games on day 1 full price then buy all the dlc aren't keeping it alive because they prefer to play the game by themselves without some random person coming in their world and attacking them that wouldn't be there otherwise if the game was in offline mode
Let them have it. Apparently real life hasn’t been too kind to them 😂
And it’s the PVE’ers and people who don’t even care much for the game who use bots to scalp consoles and games
Glitchers manage to be even worse.
I saw that post from the thumbnail, that guy is one hell of a case. Don't know what's wrong with him or if it's a troll but he keeps posting more and more stuff.
Dark Souls is about the Environment. The dark World. The Toxic dark world of the undead, and mutated monsters. It's kinda funny for you offensive players, the ones that ignore all that, to literally attack players doing jolly coop, and try to kill them "Toxic." A toxic substance, environment, or person kills other people, or kills the discussion, or kills the party they're going to. That's what toxic means. Invasions are literally killing the party. That's the whole point, but EVEN THE ENVIRONMENT IS TOXIC. Look around you, that's the game. You want to point out the most toxic thing, in a world where Smough exists?
Toxic is a status effect. In the environment. There's entire levels of Toxic where you can attack players who're already dying, and collect their tongues. You can even throw shit on them, but you can't teabag them. YTF aren't you bragging about being the most lethal, and toxic thing in Dark Souls? That would be something.
As someone who does primarily pve and only somewhat dabbles in pvp i don't hate losing to invaders who are better. I hate that the only invaders i tend to be invaded by is douchebags using rkss cancel, estus cancel, estus refill, splitleaf infinite combo, etc. And all against a solo host just because they're getting their asses kicked by a pve player, then once they kill me they throw dung pies as if they somehow outskilled me, if this was uncommon i wouldn't mind but truth is this is all i get invaded by
@@coldfire2753 i play at sl 250... i wouldn't call that meta lol. And most invaders i find in playthroughs are glitchers
I don’t necessarily agree with you. Sure, the elden ring sub reddit is a trash can, and I’m the first to say it, but the whole “pve and pvp players” argument is always a big can of worm to open.
On one hand I’m of the idea that if pvp players want to engage with pvp, they have all the means to do so with people that enjoy pvp. Invading a clueless host who just wants to play the game with an optimized pvp build isn’t fair by any means let’s not kid ourselves (and also let’s please not use the excuse “but you can die just fine if it’s a boss!” Or “it’s to balance the pve bro!” It’s not like you guys are worried that the pve isn’t challenging enough kek)
On the other there are some people that want to co-op but still not get invaded, and they think that red invaders are the anthicrhist coming to eat your children alive, while in reality at worst you’ll just die and respawn. (Also the hatred in general that pve players produce, as well as their close mindedness is astounding. I legit saw people saying they shouldn’t fix pvp bugs because it’s a pve game. What about players who enjoy pvp? If it exists then surely it needs to work right? Even if from games are not pvp focused, why would you mind if they fix things?)
That’s why I like elden ring pvp, I just hope they fix backstabs and the damned glitches (why from? Why still?)
All in all I think we shouldn’t generalize like you did, and we all have our bad apples on both sides; this whole me vs you mentality is generally speaking very toxic, and doesn’t help anyone at all. Honestly with all this drama going on I’m happy that I can opt out of online, this community already is crumbling on itself and it didn’t even start. I’ll just play the game and enjoy some pvp arena, like I always do.
@@coldfire2753 you could argue that dying to an invader it’s not the same as dying to an enemy: if I die to a mob I simply didn’t learn the pattern, with a player it’s different.
They can hide behind enemies and now field bosses, and it’s no fun to chase “cuntslayer69” across the open field because he wants some pvp.
Saying you vs me is toxic is easy, but that’s just because it’s true; both sides are ignorant of the other and want things their way disregarding the other, it’s not only pvp nor pve players’ fault.
Heck this whole discussion is stupid, since elden ring has a very fair system, and it only needs bug fixing.
I got you. I'll do a life hunt wombo combo you'll never forget
i try really hard not to complain but man it's hard not to complain when you just want to get better with a friend and some try hard comes in and makes it look easy. can't please everybody and cant voice your opinion so guess ill jjust be quiet .
They have no problem dying to same boss for 150 times but when it comes to invaders, oh boy
i use lifehunt scythe when im memeing - never on a regen build though. It catches a lot more people than youd think.
Pvers should try pvp. Pvpers already have pve experience and understand the advantage that home team carries. Its fine to play with your friends so long as youre ok with the game challenging you and your friends. In fact, we encourage people playing with their friends. Just dont get upset at us playing the game how we want to play it; putting ourselves at a disadvantage and taking on your whole team.
I wanted to play with pvp on in Remastered and I gave up after I lost 55k souls in Anor Londo. I was right next to the bonfire after the terrible archer bridge and then came an invasion before I could rest at the bonfire. They were really trolly and impossible to kill with my current gear. Can you really blame me for not wanting to touch pvp again afterwards? I died on the way back to the bonfire and lost those souls.
you died trying to pick up the souls🤦♂️ skill issue
@@swag489 you have swag as your name. Opinion immediatly invalid
@@justin4fun490 wasn’t an opinion, simply a fact 💀
@@swag489 Oh really? Well here is another one for you: I unfortunately don't give a damn about what swag489 got to say. Go back to playing fortnite while I enjoy ds3
@@justin4fun490 funny thing is you are clearly not enjoying ds3, you are busy complaining about invaders on the internet 😂
I dont PVP that much, I mainly play Souls games on PC for the mods after I beat the vanilla game. That said I have mad respect for the PVP community as they are the ones that keep the games alive. You can tell how "alive" a game is by how long it takes you to enter a PVP match. And let be honest, if you are a hardcore PVE player just play on offline mode. If I happen to play PVP and I get invaded I just take the fight, probably lose and get to my souls, no big deal.
The only people that PVP that I have an issue with is Twinks that basically prey on new players and get kicks out of killing inexperienced players, Ill never understand that.
I can almost hear the self-sucking sound when you said us PvPers are the pillar that keeping the game alive.
Your title makes complete sense. I beat this game with handicaps just to feel something anymore, so the idea that people need help just for pve is is insane to me. Hmm Old wolf curved great sword and lifehunt scythe?
Everyone can't be good at certain games, some need help, some can't shoot straight in cod even after years of playing. Not everyone has good reflexes too.
@@vanaak9070then play different games
Your pvp skills are pretty good, but your weird echochamber "We are why the game liiiiives" looking down your nose at people who don't pvp is just as toxic as what you're claiming bud.. just saying. This is some cringeworthy elitism.
Pve players are more toxic since they just wanna go through the area they are in and not deal with invaders, which is kinda a main point in the souls series; you fight enemies and invaders at the same time if you are unlucky or fortunate enough.
I personally do pve first in the souls series and then a bit of both when I have finished one NG, after that I go and level my character up to use all weapons and spells to then mix and match things for a potential pvp build
It's true but to be fair, anyone who cannot take a loss at this game is cancerous, and that applies to all of us to some degree, and I say ALL of us
If everyone just bowed after killing me I'd never be salty about losing. More people in this community need to learn to win with grace, invaders and hosts alike.
no one buy a souls game for pvp thay only get to it if thay stik long enough
PVE players will lose twenty times to the same boss and keep plugging away at the game but they lose one invasion and completely rage at the whole game!
HEY! I use to do the lifehunt Scythe build! Super effective, powerful, and fun, and the regen is great. I don't have playstation plus currently, but Im getting it again soon, and the build is good in both pvp and pve.
Nah, there are asshats on both sides. There are more on the pve side because the bulk of the players are pve. But it runs deeper in pvpers. I honestly shouldn't have looked back into the state of the souls community. It has gotten tremendously worse over time. It's a big turn off from the games.
I think what g means here by pvers is just casuals, cause the actual existing pvers in the comunity are challenge runners like no hit/speed runners and that comunity is not specially toxic and arguably keeping the game alive just as much, if not more than the pvp comunity.
Of course there are toxic casuals that dont understand pvp and will complain, but it feels weird to call them pvers when what they are is mostly people that are not even part of any comunity of souls games.
Personally if we're talking Pontiff its just a toxic free for all on both sides of the fence! Random invasions everywhere else is pretty chill! I invade a lot and host at pontiff often ( without friends on mics ) sometimes with the odd random summons, but mostly solo for the carnage! The amount of toxic energy is ridiculous!! Hosts and phantoms dc'ing all the time, tryhard invaders bow glitching or BC because they not winning..it's a mess!! But hey.....i always go back!!🤣
Only people who pve over and over again and dont get bored are speed runners and any percenters
Not really, You have entire communities of people who dont online in all souls and have thousands of hours in these games of just playing and enjoying the environment......like the souls games arent really PVP oriented in the first place, Its something extra to keep it alive
Hard disagree, I focused on pve in Dark Souls 2 and I have 1267 hours in it between OG Dark Souls 2 (867) and Scholar of the First Sin (400). For me a big chunk of the experience was trying out specific roleplay builds and seeing how it would effect the feel of the gameplay. I didn't ever actually get bored with Dark Souls 2, either - the main reason I stopped playing it was simply because other games came out and I eventually drifted to them.
@@HeroOfTheHolySword im mostly refering to ds3. Ds2 and ds1 have more to explore when it comes to secrets and world mechanics. Ds3 seems to be heavily combat oriented than the rest and in that case i find less people play ds3 pve once they beat it so many times and either stop playing or gravitate towards pvp
@@stephenreid6686 im referring to ds3. And i would disagree in the case of ds3. Maybe its not oriented around it, but its a huge part of it, as they continued to release nerfs and buffs that mainly affect pvp until they stopped supporting it. Pvp has been in souls games since demon souls. Ignoring what mods can do for single player (exploring in no clip mode, doing mod runs, changing skins and weapon arts etc) most people quite playing if they dont get into pvp (pvp includes but is not limited too being in ganks, using covenants, invading, dueling, ect). You dont see console players playing this game after so long cause they are bored and nothing less to do(unless they engage in pvp). Pvp is always different and people adapt to your playing in a way AI cant which keeps it entertaining 6 years later. If you can show me atleast 1 person who just plays pve for fun and has been playing since release of ds3, (continuously) then you will convince me
@@jiddy30 So I gotta correct you there man. While DS3 has more combat features it is not a huge part of it, It is just more difficult so if you choose to engage with the combat system and not roll through the game ofc its gonna be a huge part of it but if I just scaled down the number of mobs in DS3 relative to DS1 based on map size and kept the same combat systems would you still say its a huge part of it OFC not and thats just numbers man. Anyways ill do you one better, ill show you a whole discord. Check Manfighdragon or Lance McDonald's channel.
True I got call an a hole even tho it 1v3
The problem is skill gap. PVP'r have, no surprise, a lot of pvp expierence and pvp build. They can invade when they 100% ready for pvp fight, with full hp and estus (on their halved means) while pve player can fight the mobs playing the game for first time, out of estus, not knowing where the save zones are, with poorly upgraded weapon etc. If PVPr invade PVEr with little to no pvp expierence, of course he's gonna lose, not consider it fair and be upset, what did you expect? You didn't seek other PVP-enjoying players to begin with. "It's just part of the game" as much as being ganked when tables turn.
Also, what's that psyop? To believe that community that is, supported by forums and youtube videos, constantly invading the High Wall with twinks, unable to use any gesture besides point down, throws dung pies, and, to begin with, comes with PVP build against PVE builds is less toxic that players who don't intent on beating other players to begin with is top tier delusional. Seriously, aren't you guys constantly cry about being ganked, isn't that enough pvp toxicity for you?
I haven't met a player in DS yet but I know I'd 100% get clapped
I agree to some extent but I pvp a lot n I get enough hate messages when I successfully defend or invade. I use all types of builds.
I love to PvE. But I also love to PvP. I always playthrough my first time online. Then I like to break the game with a build offline. But then I always have a couple PvP builds just to play multiplayer online either coop or invasions and love fight clubbing too. Win or lose it's all about the moment
Most PVEers just wanna play the game at their own pace and leisure. You guys who enjoy PVP can easily just go involve yourselves with others who also like PVP. Why does anybody care how somebody decides to play the game? I play Souls by myself all the time, but the most fun I have is when I summon my friends and we fuck around together. I don't see what the problem is with choosing to play this way..... This is like if you went to a Tennis Court, and made fun of everybody for not playing Volleyball with you.
I agree with you, literally the game forces you to deal with pvp when you are just trying to fuck around with your friends killing things and bosses. An invader comes, kills you and then you have to do it all over again until another invader comes and kills you again (Or you kill them and they call you a ganker or they just run and heal over and over again without letting you play the game how you wanted to).
@@june4000 I've been playing Demon's Souls by myself for years now.
Now that I have the Remake, I can FINALLLY play with my friends, but we're constantly getting invaded in certain worlds. 😞 😓 it's fine now, but when my character was a baby, I couldn't defend myself against anybody. Now I just 1-shot them with magic, but still.. It's never fun, lol. I feel like we just have to agree to disagree with most invaders.. They enjoy it, and we don't.
That's the game the developers made, deal with it or play COD.
Co op legit ruins the balance of pve, like you can steam roll everything with overleveled phantoms carrying you like how is that fun?, yes ppl can co op but why be so God damn toxic about an ingame mechanic and claim invaders are immoral ppl who force there way into hosts world when in reality the game is pvp/pve you consent to a invasion as soon as you pop an ember, invasions are there to balance the game when you want easy mode, hell dark souls 3 is the easiest dark souls.
Souls games are not balanced around co-op, the hardest areas and bosses become trivialized. Thats why DS3 prioritizes and Elden ring only has invasions occur against co-opers.
I love the Souls PvP. Dark Souls 3 PvP was pretty awesome. Only gripe I have is the poise being for hyper armor and not passive like DS1. Killed most strength only PvP. But did make it really satisfying to 2 or 3 k with a GS or GA.
6:59 yozi97: remove gundyr
I would have played Dark Souls Three once and then left it behind for newer games, were it not for my introduction to a PVP experience I had never imagined would capture me so wholly. I therefore consider the arguments for balanced PVP to be more healthy to a Souls game than the drivel being spewed from the PVE enthusiasts' perspective.
I wish lifehunt scythe was viable and wasn’t shit
If the PVErs don’t like the invasions and the PVP…than why not play offline ? It is pretty simple. Just turn off online play.
For me I'm a casual souls fan who loves pve normally pvp to me is just not my style. I love the games world n such. I think most of the hate is just salty assholes. It's not just pve but both ways you know? Like if u beat someone in pvp. I respect all souls fans
Why doesn't JeeNine use Wex Dust?
He's on ps5
@@mellonthegrey1976 Understood. Thanks
How odd. I only see toxicity from pvpers, havent found much from pvers
I feel like this is a microcosm of any game community where you can label two groups as "casual" or "hardcore". Anecdotally the former is ALWAYS disproportionately more toxic and entitled, and tend to project by claiming the hardcore playerbase do this. I think this is because for a casual the game they're playing doesn't mean that much to them outside of a temporary diversion. They want an experience tailored towards them and will demand it without considering the consequences those changes might have on the game long term because they won't be around to deal with them.
Imagine playing a game that is challenging, that you will likely die in hundreds of times in a single playthrough, that is known for having an incredibly high pvp player base, but then complain about being invaded and getting killed a couple of times out of the hundreds of times you are likely to die.
I guarantee, that if those players tried the invasions, they would probably start to think that the people they invade are the dickheads :P
invaderz bad i wanna be carried by my phantoms
The games are pretty much set up to make pve players angry and most of the people I know who love invading get their fun from pissing off pve players so it's just a never ending cycle. Cause they don't find pvp fun they only find attacking people who don't want to pvp fun. I I personly would love if I could play atleast one of their games without having to worry about the whole forced pvp aspect that simply doesn't seem possible unelss you wish to play completely alone which to me as a mainly co op player is a no go.
@@coldfire2753 not entitled at all its simply knowing what I like the whole invasion system had been only downside for me in these games for years. I wish I could play without them but it is what it is I'll still buy their games no matter what cause that single negative cant bog down otherwise amazing games. Not wanting to be attacked by players when I am trying to enjoy the game isnt picky at all.
@@coldfire2753 I don't fail to understand its impossible to play co op offline and that's how I enjoy to play. There for I don't play offline. Extremely simple to understand. Same as how their is actual pvp in the game but they don't want to pvp they want to kill the pve players instead
Not only this, another community has a problem too. The game isn't hard enough, or oh, this will be the _____ armor, making it broken. This game is easy, I'll cry about it. Wahhhhhh! If you are crying about the game not being difficult enough, go outside and rock climb, you baby. *If you know what game series I'm talking about, you will understand what I am talking about.* The one percent of our community is a bunch of whiny, ungrateful babies who use Longsword. They are a big joke.
I would think it would be in their best interest to have invaders because it keeps the gameplay "fresh" and high in replay value....makes no sense to play a game like this and there's nothing to push you trying new builds and tech.
Lol this video is just an invader coping about how he's bad at the game and just wants to destroy PvE players using his powerful build
Why do you people always use the same strawman? Get an original thought, maybe?
@@hoked2194 don't fix what isn't broken. Invaders don't search for fight with PVP-players on arenas, they don't sit all the time in fight clubs, but also they complain when their target hides behind the mobs, i mean, behind phantoms, so what's left besides the easiest options like clueless players without PVP expierence?
@@Michanicks You're deep in denial if you think invasions are just clueless PvE players
@@hoked2194 video called "The most toxic part of souls community are PvErs". No details. I didn't say "i think invasions are just clueless PvE players", why you blame that other person using strawmen when you use them on your own?
I don't understand why people have to pick ONE thing. The more rational decision is to just play both and have fun with the games we all love.
You're speaking on forum post toxicity and they're speaking on in game toxicity
What you call "in game toxicity" is literally what invaders/PvPers are supposed to do.
I'm also pretty confident that PvE lords genarate most of the hatemail :)
@@hoked2194 Yeah, you should tell the same thing to these invaders losers who used to abuse the carian retaliation glitch during the first months of Elden Ring, who consistently flooded your dms with hate if you somehow managed to outplay them lmao
@@jador9641 You talk as if that behaviour was exclusive to invaders. I remember the exploiting gankers pretty vividly.
Pvpers (especially DS3) get labeled as toxic, join the discord to find out more. I just wanted to tell the people in Farron they were awesome to fight, Ive got alot to learn--and the person got mad because I'm a wolf of farron or something. I dunno 15 Dms of different ways I should off myself because I didn't even kill anyone. Like... you're welcome for the pvp medal buddy...
So many say the invader is OP but really invaders have so many disadvantage such as half estus half health and almost always get ganked to death and they can’t even keep their one advantage that they have A.I enemies because of the giant tree seed almost as though Miyazaki lost to a invader and made DS3 pvp to spite them
Half estus is more than being out of estus.
I dont really condone people going out if their way to message you because they don't like pvp, turn offline and you don't have to deal with them but pvp is part of the experience.
I prefer PVE but I relish in an invader or even a pvp arena because it switches up the whole vibe of the game.
Invaders make you worried you won't make it back to your souls and you have to suddenly leave your comfort zone and try and get good 😆 the arenas are more so because the all around vibe is so chill and upbeat! Everyone's there to show off their builds and chill and watch matches or even participate 😀
I like murky
i like ya mum no hate
PvE'ers are just casual players that havent even made it to ng+2