Kyle-what a great video! We are trading in our 1st Ed. Id4 for a Y due to be delivered in late May. We had two reasons for doing this tradein. Firstly, the id4 , which we loved and thought was so great at first hasn’t turned out that way. The software issues have gone on and on. When we bought the car, we were told that updates would be coming in a matter of weeks. When that didn’t happen and still hasn’t happened, we are now waiting for whatever parts are “coming in”. The car is also under recall for a battery issue. Service one week ago said the car is ok on that front. Then rebates and now lower prices on the Y made for an easy decision. To your point here about charging networks. At first we thought free 3 year charging at EA was a great selling point. That was before we knew more about fast charging not being good for the battery as the only form of charging. Then, guess what? The EA at our local Target always has some off line. At first, the EA app caused problems which required phone calls for help. Even now the app doesn’t accurately show which chargers are working. Sorry for the long comment, but this has been a long journey for us. We have already installed the Tesla wall charger in happy anticipation. Our google account is under my husband’s name, but I am Patti and I watch all your informative videos. Your dad’s too and I feel that we even know Bailey, the dog. We are getting the long range Y in red with black and white interior. Gerry is fine with 19” tires. I can’t wait. So, thanks again.
One of the reasons I enjoy your videos is because unlike some pro-EV channels, you can cheerlead without shilling. You are one of the few that point out some of the still-existing teething problems that potential EV owners can face, unlike some channels that are like: "get an EV or your (misspelled on purpose) stoo-pit."
Adding on to my last comment. One of the big reasons to get the Model Y is that we travel to Fort Wayne Indiana regularly to visit family. I took the ID.4 there once, knowing it would be a challenge and it was. Very limited CCS availability. We charged at the Caddy dealer twice that trip. Painful when you have kids and a wife that don't want to sit around waiting for the car to charge on a 62kW unit with nothing to do nearby. Contrast that with the fact that there are TWO supercharger sites in the city. Fort Wayne isn't a tiny city, something like 500k people or so. Nearest EA is over an hour away. And don't even get me going on traveling through West Virginia!
I totally understand your predicament. I live in the OKC metro area, with over 1.5M residents and there is only ONE Tesla supercharger and ONE Electrify America station. In addition, the state of Oklahoma penalizes EV owners by tacking on an additional $250 of 'EV fees' for the annual license plate renewals. I understand having EV owners help pay road taxes, but this fee amount would be equivalent to a ICE vehicle driving 30,000 miles a year.
I just wrote a comment myself complaining about West Virginia! My wife and I were trying to plan a roadtrip from Kokomo, IN to Norfolk, VA. West Virginia is a DCFC desert and the route planner said we would need to stay at a dealership Chargepoint station in West Virginia for an hour just to BARELY have enough juice to make it to the nearest EA station in Charlottesville, VA.
I don't feel that they should have added more superchargers there unless they are version 4. Tesla should have moved down the road either 50 miles before or after that site to another Love's or TA to give more options and less range anxiety.
As someone who traveled from SoCal to Phoenix regularly, the quartzsite station was a absolute nightmare. Sucks because it’s in an excellent off the highway location with great amenities. Also it’s absolutely vital as almost the only link between Palm Springs and Phoenix. Regularly there would only be 1/4 working and huge line with people charging to 100%. I eventually gave up on this charger and would just drive much slower to be able to skip this station. Just an absolute disaster. Unbelievable that even after a year+ of these issues, EA has barely touched the site. It need new reliable stations and to be expanded to at least 12 chargers.
Somehow when I rolled through Quartzsite in my ID.4 last month I got lucky. No one else was there and I happened to plug into the only properly functioning charger and got a good charge. A few minutes later an ID.4 pulled in and plugged into the only other (partially) functioning charger and got 32kW. I told him to try the other handle but he seemed to not understand why that might help and just left it. EA (or someone else) needs to step up and step up fast. I've put over 15,000 miles on the ID.4 in four months and have "gotten lucky" a lot of times with EA so I haven't had any real issues. But we decided to go to a full EV fleet now so of course we got a Model Y to go along with the ID.4. so we can push the easy button for road trips when we want to.
We started with a Bolt (which we love) but when we started looking into road trips Tesla was the only real option we considered due to the issues we ran into while road-tripping in the Bolt (not the 55kW limit - we knew about that and that was not a real problem for us). Adding the CCS adapter to the Tesla basically means "if it's fast charging, we can probably use it" which is nice in areas like Quebec and Nova Scotia which have built out massive (albeit 50kW) CCS infrastructure and Tesla is still kinda figuring it out and focusing on more chargers where they already have them.
Here in Canada, Electrified Canada still does not have a cross country charging corridor on our really only major Trans Canada highway and most of our BC and AB EC sites have single 350KW and 3 of the 150Kw charge points, time to buy a Tesla!
Tesla is the only reliable Charging across Canada which is sad. BC hydro has a decent infra in BC and near my home but its just limited to 50KW and there are just 1-2 chargers.
@@simplygregsterev I believe all the on route stations along the 401 are going to have 150kw chargers by the end of this year. I'm hoping that that big change improves EV adoption along the seaway. It's truly bizarre how the vast majority of chargers in Canada are seemingly useless 50 kw chargers
@@jasonquaile2492 50kw has become the new L2… good if you are out shopping or similar around town or driving a smaller distance. Montreal Toronto you need 150kw and 6-10 dispensers per stop. I was just in Germany with a model 3 and having one connector standard is nice. That being said they seem to be taking it more seriously. Fastned, Ionity etc are pretty common
There is no CCS charging currently on a whole stretch of highway through Louisiana on I-20 and one lone ChargePoint 62.5kW on I-49 in between I-10 and I-20 it added an extra hour or so on my trip from Florida to Oklahoma. Meanwhile along those same stretches Tesla has about 4 supercharger stops
I’ve charged at Quartzsite almost every month. Only 2 of 4 CCS chargers were available Christmas Eve. 1.5 hours waiting to charge my Kia Niro. This week in a model Y. 18 minutes of charging across the street (36 stations) and I was on my way!!
I used the EA in Quartzite to charge my Ioniq 5 twice a couple months ago. Decent experience using the 350W headed west bound, and had great results using one of the 150s headed east. That said 4 chargers is not nearly enough given the location.
It's crazy to me that I charged my previously owned ID4 two years ago at this location (even back then I ran into 3/4 chargers occupied) and two years later there are still only four stalls here. Even crazier that there is no canopy or anything covering the chargers like the newly opened 88-bay Tesla charging station has. It gets HOT out there in the middle of the day.
These public charging issues only enforces the buying decision for EV's. Buy a Tesla, you can use reliable supercharger stations, and with a ~$180 CCS adapter can use CCS chargers. I rented a Tesla Model Y in Oregon recently, my first opportunity to try public charging for myself. Tesla superchargers are so easy to use, simply plug in and charge. No complicated apps, waving cards/phones in front of a reader, or hoping the station even works at all.
Nothing hard about it I have done it for 9 years . And even when Tesla opens the 3500 chargers it still takes a app and a lucid air that Kyle is driving only charges at 50 kw on the magic dock. Don’t exaggerate everything. I tap my phone and it starts. And some cars have plug and charge just like Tesla
@@markfitzpatrick6692 what other chargers have a plug and charge where no apps are required to be opened/CCs are required at the charging station? That’s awesome if another exists.
@@markfitzpatrick6692 Well, that settles it. Your anecdotal evidence proves everyone else wrong! Kyle has posted at least 20 videos of him trying to charge with EVGo, Electrify America and others assorted charging networks and it's always the same thing. Hell, we just saw IN THIS VIDEO the issues that are typical. * "350kW" chargers, that, if you're lucky, delivery 150 kW. * Frozen apps that think you're connected when you're not. * Apps that simply refuse to work and MIGHT work if you call and ask for a reboot. And I don't just watch Out of Spec. I watch many, many, MANY other EV videos. TFLEV, individuals like MKBHD, I've had to have seen at least 50 videos at this point and charging on non Tesla networks are always hit or miss, more miss than hit. I'm also subscribed to a few EV forums and it's the same thing. Heck, just read the comments for various chargers around the US that are not Tesla. But hey, believe as you wish.
I wanted a Tesla. However, I don't have the money for a Model X and cannot stand the Model Y drive. Happy with the Mach-e I have. Already 11,000 miles.
Own a Tesla S and Ioniq 5. I live in So California, my son lives in Phoenix. Made the trip many times in the Tesla, no issues. I was at the Quartzite on my way back to California and experienced the same bricked EA unit. Your video shows 202 hours idle time, I was there at 151 on Friday evening. On the way out, the line for EA was 8 cars deep and added over 90 minutes to our one-way trip. From this point forward, only the Tesla on this route.
Why don't you do an video interview with the management team from E A and have them explain themselves and thier plans for their infrastructure. We need to hear more from these dependent charging companies.
But they don’t need the adapter if the Tesla network is so great. If you spend time using a ccs adapter then they don’t have enough Tesla chargers like people brag about.
@@markfitzpatrick6692 I never understand this fanboy hatred where you support one multi-billion dollar company but hate another. It's like when there was that iPhone vs Android battle where people were literally getting into fights because someone dared to spend their money on one brand versus another. Tesla's network is the best. Arguing that just makes you look childish. Tesla has access to its supercharger network PLUS all CCS chargers. Is it perfect? Obviously it's not. But then again, no one said it is. There are roughly 150k gas stations in the US. But it took over 100 years for us to get there! Ideally, in 15 years, we'll have 300k EV charging stalls that all EVs can use. But no need for the fanboy stuff.
Oh, this is perfect timing! I'm about to take my first road trip from LA to Sedona in my model Y. This is one of the charge stops I've been evaluating! Thanks much!
I've been to Quartzite twice to charge on trips from NorCal to Phoenix and back again. Place was mostly empty when I was there, so barring "big driving times" I don't think you'll have much trouble. Plus Carl's Jr has decent food for fast-food.
Exact reason why I no longer have ID.4 and now drive a model 3. Had enough (~4 years) waiting for CCS infrastructure to improve. Kind of seems it's getting worse at least in my neck of the woods (Central Oregon).
@@simoc24 At least in my area chargers are constantly full, mostly ID.4 hogging up spaces and charging to 100%. Just a lot of EVs in general. Couple that with chargers constantly down and EA's terrible customer service, yeah it's a crapshoot.
Living in Atlanta, CCS does have an advantage in the mountains where Georgia Power has put in some chargers (along with EVgo). Can’t think of many other places through. Perhaps more rural areas where they’ve put in some ChargePoint CPE250s.
Tesla CCS adapter fixes that. It's nice there are a few single and double stall installs up there though if you really need them. The CCS infrastructure around ATL proper is a bit lacking in comparison though.
Another CCS desert is the route between Dayton, OH and Virginia. Most of West Virginia is barren of EA stations, and it leaves road trippers at the mercy of the few DCFC Chargepoint stations at dealerships.
They have zero ea in West Virginia. The Hyundai dealer put in som charge point. Wv is a really small state compared to oh . I would just go thru pa and the Down or when wytheville va is back up you can make it there then Virginia has chargers going east
Similar situation in Ellensburg, WA with 4 CCS at EA. Ellensburg is halfway between Seattle and Spokane on I-90. The nearest westbound CCS chargers are 80 miles away in North Bend, WA and the nearest eastbound CCS chargers are in Ritzville, WA another 115 miles away. During our last stop at Ellensburg EA only 2/4 chargers were working.
If you want to travel across Michigan's Upper Peninsula, DO NOT BUY A CCS VEHICLE! We are just starting to get some Big Boy CCS Enel X JuicePump 175kW Chargers, but they're all on the west side of the peninsula. Tesla currently has 3 Version 3 Superchargers up here. In places I believe make sense, including one on the east end of the Peninsula in Sault St. Marie. There are Freewire chargers at those location too, but Freewire just ins't great for Vehicle throughput. Tesla is just destroying the competition!
I used that specific EA charge site many times. Lately, I had to wait for 3-4 cars in front of me during day light. This is pretty much the only charging station with good speed between Indio and Buckeye. Rivian had planed a charge site here too... I can't wait.
Haven’t drove from Camarillo to Scottsdale for a long time. When we did, there was only 6 SuperChargers at the Carl’s Jr. At that time we never had to wait, but that was in 2018. So glad that we purchased a LR M3. Now we have added a Model Y. Very lucky, we added solar panels in 2009 and have been very happy and fortunate to be ahead of the electricity cost and gasoline cost in California. Really enjoy your videos.
Watching this video, it's clear that Tesla is ahead of the game when it comes to charging infrastructure. The vast difference between CCS and Tesla Superchargers in Quartzsite, Arizona is a testament to Tesla's commitment to making EV ownership a seamless experience. It's remarkable to see Tesla's continuous expansion, including plans for an 88-stall Tesla Supercharger at Terrible's gas station. As an EV owner, having access to reliable and extensive charging infrastructure is crucial, especially for long road trips. The issues faced at the CCS Electrify America station, such as derated and malfunctioning chargers, can be a real pain point for drivers, but it seems like Tesla owners can breathe easy knowing that there are plenty of Superchargers available. For someone considering buying an electric car, this kind of dependable charging network could be a game-changer and a major selling point in favor of Tesla. It's not just about the car itself; the charging infrastructure is a critical part of the ownership experience. Kudos to Tesla for taking the lead and investing in a robust Supercharger network!
Tesla is not going to offer the best charging to everyone. That is not in Tesla interest. Their commitment of 10% of chargers open to CCS is like a drug dealer offering free sample.
Driving from Dallas to New Orleans: In a Tesla Model Y LR AWD: More direct via Shreveport, 521 miles, 3 charging stops totaling 40 mins - total trip 8hr 25mins total. In a Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD: Have to go via Houston, 568 miles, 3 charging stops totaling 1hr - total trip 9hr 43mins And that's assuming the chargers work on the way and there's no line for the working ones...
Been to the Quartzite Superchargers many times. My worst experience was the Tuesday before Thanksgiving last year. There was actually a line out to the street from the bank of 32 chargers. However, since there are so many chargers it only added about 7 minutes to my total charge stay. By the way, there were long lines at Terrible's for the fuel pumps too though total time spent there would have been less.
Columbia, SC is the same way. We have 1 EA site with 4 units and usually half of them are down or derated at any point. Tesla now has 5 Sites in Columbia with 50+ stalls combined between them. There is even a 6th one on the drawing board.
South & Southwest of San Antonio Texas there are no CCS1 DCFCs. I live in McAllen, and my sisters & I bought our mom a Model S as she regularly visits relatives in San Antonio & Austin. We love her, but she has always been a ditz, so the foolishness with CCS1 along with more Tesla chargers made it a no brainer.
Here is MN the CCS network leaves much to be desired. If you want to drive I90 west across South Dakota good luck! Sioux Falls has a few CCS DC chargers, all at car dealerships, slow and expensive. Worthington MN has a fairly new Electrified America, 3 of the 4 are normally working, but I've actually never seen it full. Car dealership in Luverne MN has a Charge Point, only 50kw but it works well and priced resonably. We've had our Polestar 2 for about a year, charging really hasn't been a problem, but I really wish companies would put in more 200-250kw chargers and just make sure they all work rather than 350's that don't!
I live in Quartzsite 6 months a year, off grid (can’t charge in the desert). I have charged at the Quartzsite Supercharged 135 times, never waited in line. Only twice has there been a single dead charger. Traffic has increased this year. The site also has a large dog walking area. New Rivian chargers are being installed by the Times 3 restaurant.
So Kyle I live in Ocala FL with Interstate 75 driving threw the center of my city. I have no EA, EVG or Blink networks here. I don't count new car dealerships with DC chargers. I will not beg to use their slow DC chargers. I do have 2 Tesla charging stations here. One station level 2 and one station level 3. I believe a total of 16 stalls. While I have a day job I do have a part time job with food deliver, you never know when you will need a quick charge to get home. With no CCS support in my city I choose the Model 3 RWD last year and never looked back. By the way Buc-ee"s has been approved to build a location in Ocala with 120 gas pumps and 28 DC chargers. I personally have only seen Tesla Super Chargers at Buc-ee's lets hope this holds true for this location.
Been there. Lucked out, only had to wait for one user to leave. It is a funnel for travelers, I ended up seeing the same cars at a couple of these stops on the way to California. It began to feel like a real community!
Little Rock, Arkansas to New Orleans, Louisiana: Model Y LR AWD: 446 miles - 7hr 39mins - inc 1x 12 minute charging stops Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD: 449 miles - 9hr 29mins - inc 2x charging stops one of which is an EV Connect at a Cadillac/GMC dealer for 2hrs.
6:47 Don't forget, the HUMMER EV is also an 800 V system, so it would be pulling a similar ~70ish kW (so also about 3 hours for it to charge to full). When CCS providers reduce power, it's typically limited to100 A, so they are really operating as 40 kW units. I'm not sure the exact reason they would do that for an update, but it likely has to do with either the cooling system or the thermistors needing to be shut off.
This is why Tesla is selling more cars than the others. The away from home Charging network is very important factor. By the other companies wanting tesla to open its netork for use speaks volumes on how smart they were with their network. Remember they built the network before the Model S was released for sale, and its been the strength of their sales.
A tale of two states right next to each other. Ohio and West Virginia. Ohio actually has relatively extensive CCS coverage given the low adoption of EVs relative to places like California. But W Virginia has virtually no CCS at all. I would say Colorado and Wyoming are a bit similar where Colorado has extensive CCS coverage with some decent Tesla coverage as well while Wyoming is virtually a CCS desert but does have Tesla SC coverage.
Between Plano, Dallas and Katy, Houston (270ish miles), for charger locations with 100kW plus chargers on route (within say 1 mile off route) there are: 4 CCS sites with a total of 18 chargers. 15 Tesla sites with a total of 200 chargers. And the numbers get worse if we play "count the working chargers only"...
It’d make a lot of sense to add solar to the supercharger locations in Az where feasible. Free electricity, reducing load on the grid, and free shade for the cars below. Cars won’t need AC pumping as hard, battery might charge a bit faster
Are you able to get an interview with EA staff and understand what is happening? You say EA listens to you, so we’d love to hear what EA is doing based on your feedback.
Electrify my 🍑hole exists solely to satisfy VW’s government spanking from dieselgate, and to vacuum up as many Biden Bucks as they can to recoup their loses. They do not actually care whether you can charge your EV or not as long as they’re getting juicy taxpayer dollars. There is one company that seriously benefits from a vast network for reliable fast chargers, and that is Tesla. Nobody else has much to lose. DEMAND that automakers switch to NACS and add Supercharger support or don’t buy their garbage. I can’t believe that anyone disagrees with me.
EA has stopped interacting with Kyle/Out of Spec Studios, and Tom Moloughney - State of Charge/InsideEVs. Kyle & Tom ask hard questions and don't accept dismissive PR answers.
I don’t think VW/EA ever took charging seriously as a business. They spent what they were forced to out of “dieselgate” and leave it at that. Kyle, you did the Kempower video but without real site locations. Any update?
I charged our EV6 at EA Quartzite last week. On the site it said 50 kw but I charged at 146 at 30% SOC. We need the magic dock on those new Tesla chargers.
When I bought my Tesla model s nearly 6 years ago I I would use this quartzite supercharger at least 2 times a Month. Then 2021 I was in the market to get another ev. Mine had over 121,000 miles on it . I watched videos that said the VW id4 was amazing a great road trip car or even others but I saw this problem in quartzite. And Tesla built the additional 32 chargers s. Also opened Ehrenberg az chargers just down the road and it cemented my next car as a model Y. This site is the ccs charging system in a nutshell. No plans to improve while Tesla has an entire section of their business to continuously improve the charging situation. Btw if you are just getting an around town car that you charge in your garage. Why do you need anymore range than you drive in a day ? We also have a mini Cooper SE for our around town trips.
One thing you could mention explicitly to really drive you point home: EA is basically the BEST that CCS has to offer in the US. Like, everything else is less prevalent, even more finicky, and probably charges slower. I (and other EV owners) know you're comparing EA to Tesla because EA is basically the biggest game in the country for CCS, but other viewers won't know that necessarily - and should be reminded of it - because it just makes the whole point you're driving home that much more depressing. Yeah, there are other CCS options, but for the most part they are EVEN WORSE. :(
NACS charging standard designed by engineers to encourage EV adoption. CCS charging standard designed by the ICE manufactures marketing department to discourage EV adoption, trying to keep EV’s from catching on.
I really wish EA would get their stuff together. I've got a polestar 2 and I love it...and so far I haven't had any EA issues outside of 1 derated charger in a spot(which I checked in on plugshare for) and at least here in cali EA seems to have a lot of larger stall installations. Sites with 10 or 12 stalls which isn't amazing but it's a lot better than those 4 stall spots but they need to continue to expand. 12 is nice...but it isn't 36...and we really should be getting to that point.
El Paso Texas to Albuquerque New Mexico: Model Y LR AWD: 267 miles - 3hr 57mins - inc 1x 6 minute charge stop Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD: 298 miles - 5hr 24mins - inc 1x 40 min charging stop (only 1x 60kW unit)
I've made stops on 3 occasions at that exact EA stop in Quartzsite two years ago. Only one resulted in a successful charge, the other two were unsuccessful. That corridor REALLY needs a charger revamp. There's similar issues when taking the 8 from San Diego to Phoenix.
I make the drive from Orange County to Mesa multiple times per year. The Quartzsite location helped with our decision to buy a Tesla. Hopefully the 88 stall addition will bring in more food choices. A little burned out on Carl’s.
Another issue in Canada, charging providers get free Federal money to intall chargers with no requirement our guarantee on the operations and reliability end and it is getting reflected in many sites similar to the EA station that you have shown, only one 150kw charger functioning totally not acceptable.
On a recent trip to Phoenix, the Quartzsite station was COMPLETELY DOWN on the route east. On my return, the chargers were deliberately slowed (like 50 kW). Worse, the door to my charging socket wouldn't open. After an half an hour of frustration, I ripped the door open with my fingers and then taped it closed. To the dealer's credit, the door was replaced under warranty.
13:27 - you are funny!!!😂 Ironically i just a horrible experience charging at EA with my Model Y. EA charged me for 2 short sessions and customer service said nothing was wrong. Does non-Tesla manufacturers even know how bad EA is? Smh
Kyle, great video that really hit home for me. The legacy automotive companies are clueless about the CCS charging network. They cheerlead the EA movement with free charging and get a bunch of clueless new owners on the road. I get so tired of reading articles about "Why I am unhappy about my EV because I never thought the (CCS) charging network is so bad" And then the media posting the article almost always posts a picture of a Testa!! I want to buy a Lucid Gravity next year and trade in my Tesla. I am watching the CCS charging network very closely. The Tesla magic dock is not the primary solution. Why would Tesla want the liability of damaging someone's non-Tesla battery via fast, or super fast, or hyper fast charging??
Yup, that EA is definitely a bottleneck...thank goodness Rivian just opened up their station down the street! Not yet showing on App though...kinda funny, kinda tragic you didn't know so could also include in this video
I stopped there on Saturday of last week with my 21 ID.4. I can confirm the station where the Lucid was plugged in was derated to 50 kw. I guess there's no urgency to fix the station.
There is a 100+ charging station that is almost complete at the Barstow Outlets and from what I can tell they are all covered with solar panels. I've been to the Quartzite location when it's full on the weekends, it's not exactly fun when you have to use split charging.
The fact that there is a line says they EA needs to add more chargers and be on top of repairs, I work at a convenience store with 30 pumps and even 1 pump being down is a 4 hour priority ticket, we only have a line peak summer travel as well so them being on top of repairs in the winter is Impressive. We also only have 6 L3 Tesla chargers with no CCS plugs.
You nailed it Kyle...my son has a 2022tesla m3lr, I do like some non tesla cars, but I would only buy tesla for now because of super charger, we go to Orlando to Miami many times using the tesla, and charging is no problem
The entire state of Minnesota, there is a single Electrify America and one EVGo that's it. Otherwise there's a few of really expensive Zef energy 50kw chargers and PLENTY of tesla chargers
Is Tesla going to add CCS to that new station? With the demand for the EA station outstripping the supply and reliability so much it seems like a lot of money on the table if they don't.
We have 1 car (TM3 RWD LFP) we so rarely have to public charge in the UK, but for both our jobs we sometimes have to travel around the country. I did not want to risk having to hunt a working charger or end up sat queuing for a 50kw. We are lucky [almost] all EV in Europe are CCS combo, so we can use any charger. The amount, placement and reliability of superchargers is just too good. I really hope the rest of the public network could catch up for competitive reasons. Thanks again for a great video
Can't they (EA I mean) , just reboot them on a regular basis? Looks like the software is just super unstable and needs a fresh start. Or ... probably, a way for the customer to perform this operation?
I own both a Tesla and an ID.4. My wife wanted to take the ID.4 on a trip with her sister, I had to tell her not to do it. She did several Tesla road trips in the past, but I had to explain to her that she is much more likely to have an issue with CCS. I can probably survive a road trip in an ID.4, but my wife does not have the same level of endurance with putting up with issues when it comes to EV driving. If there are 4 chargers in place, but only one is working, and she has to use an app to start the charge session each time, and so on...
I hope that giant Tesla supercharging station you talked about is opened to other EVs. If not, people who drive CCS cars may be jealous of the Tesla stations.
that "line" you pointed to, I've experienced it personally. Last summer there was a team of 4 EU VW ID4 vehicles charging past 80% while taking up 3 out of 4 stalls that day. They were testing autonomous driving here in the US. i felt so privileged to have been waiting after them to charge my ID4. SMH.. lol
In March 2023, EVGo opened Conejo Gateway Plaza (Thousand Oaks/Newbury Park, CA) and 6 350 Kw A CCS and 2 150A CCS / CHAdMO units. Currently, 2 x 350 Kw are down. I went over after they opened up, (just for fun) and Charged my 2022 F-150 Lightning, from 20% to 80%. It was the first week they were open, and the session was perfect. The closest charging for Tesla is at the Oaks Mall 3 miles away and there are about 12-16 units. In the area for CCS there are not many options, and the Mall has 1 50Kw CCS/CHAdeMo/Tesla unit, 1 50Kw out-of-service CCS/CHAdeMO, and 1 out-of-service L2 Others are 5, 12, and 16 miles away with no more than 4 units. mostly 50 and 100Kw Most newer locations are 2x 350Kw and 2x 100Kw This is a highly traveled area along the 101 freeway in northern Los Angeles and is mostly bedroom urban neighborhoods. There are many electric vehicles here, and most people charge them at home.
This site was literally one of our 1st charging experiences on our 2nd day of owning our i4. The loves in nice but that parking lot is so busy especially when 5 EVs are waiting to charge parked against the curb. 2 chargers were working on our way to Phoenix and only 1 on our return trip. Thankfully most of the EV owners were courteous and not charging to 100% although that is more the norm these days.
I did the hertz EV manager special at LAX and picked a Kia Niro. I needed to charge to 70% to return it, they didn't include a cord to charge where I was staying. I found an Electrify America near Fullerton, all new chargers, but not on. I found another charger, all were in use. I found another charger, but they were all down for repair. Finally I found one that was at a bank and only 50kw. So, I went to get breakfast as it charged. I had to plan around 2 hours to find and charge the car. Not good. I liked the car, but charging it was such a pain. Similar issue on another trip to San Diego and a polestar two. Broken chargers, or all in use.
The whole state of WV is a CCS charging desert. According to Plugshare (1)62kWh and (1)24kWh CCS location in the whole state and these are 3rd party installations. Tesla has supercharges along most major routes so you can at least travel through the state.
Good video and as we are about to make the drive from Scottsdale to Santa Barbara in our EQS580 there is additional concern with the apparent closure of the Walmart Indio Electrify America chargers. You would think this is not rocket science. Maybe the issue is they are not profitable enough because they are not charging enough. Just a thought.
As you state in many of your other videos, if you are NOT road tripping and you can charge mostly at home or work, this is not an issue. There are many other factors that made me choose a Tesla over other allegedly available vehicles (hint at why I chose Tesla), but being able to road trip was not at the top of my list. But for those 5 percenters that road trip a lot (and that might be high) then it should be a strong consideration.
Did Electrify America respond to this video? It's the same everywhere...I was charging in New Jersey (Pompton Lakes) last month and all the stations ,150 and 350 were downgraded to 50 kw. The same happened in Albany, NY at the Washington Ave charging station. I have an Ioniq5 and an ID4 and I now feel screwed...
The only areas I can think of where CCS beats Tesla are in Eastern Canada. In particular around the Gaspe Peninsula and in Nova Scotia - especially up around Cape Breton. But those are mostly older single-stall 50kW stations which are "better than nothing", not shiny new infrastructure. I got my CCS adapter mostly so I could travel more conveniently into those areas, and Flo and Circuit Electrique work quite well and are smoothly partnered with each other - and I believe ChargePoint back here in the US.
My 1st road trip (GV60) from Palm Springs CA to Tuson AZ included Quartszite as the 1st charging station. I had some range anxiety not knowing how the GV60 mileage would be effected by elevation changes, high speed driving (75 MPH) , number of passengers (3), plus the status of this EA station (broken units and or slow charging speeds). We were lucky, only a 10 minute wait with a charging speed in the 90s. Others behind me had to wait about 30 minutes. Once charged up to 80%, we were in good shape to make it to any of the EA stations in Phoenix. Based on your video and articles I have read on the Federal funds for new charging stations, I think Tesla wants to become a national charging network for all EVs - maybe even a monopoly and give the other charging networks a real run for their money. I don't think EA will ever be able to catch up once Telsa starts it conquest. EA was built as a result of the government VW diesel engine punishment / fulfilling (at a minimum) their obligation without the goal of high customer satisfaction. Tesla built their network to sell EVs - depending on very high customer satisfaction. It will be interesting to have this conversation again in 1 and 2 yrs - hopefully taking a road trip in a non Tesla will become a non issue. Love your channel - without it probably still driving an ICE!
I drove my Rivian through Quartzsite twice a week ago. First time charged on the EA 350 and only got about 64 kw max rate. On the way back I used the 150 kW unit that is supposedly fully operational. I got a maximum of 101 kW. My Rivian can easily accept over 200 kW at the state of charge I was at. The first time, when using the 350 kW station I contact EA's costumer service and asked if they could tell me which station was operating at the best rate. Their response was that they didn't know and could not help me. Amazing costumer service, NOT!
LOL! While watching this video I just saw an ad for the Ioniq 6, which does not have access to the supercharger network. And the add claims it "wins every time" against the Tesla!!!!
After watching hundreds of videos like yours, 2 years ago I made the decision to buy a Tesla over any CCS car here in Ontario, Canada. The CCS network here is much worse than it is in the US as far as I have heard and experienced. I would like to try a higher end German EV, but would not for that reason. Just imagine how much worse that situation is going to get if the number of EV's doubles every year or two. I think those who are in charge of pushing the conversion to an EV future should be forced to drive only EVs in order to enrich their experience of the real world of EV ownership.
@@anthonyc8499 I think both of them already have more charging stations than pumps, but in fairness fewer pumps can service more cars because the "charging" time for gas is so much lower. ;)
That station was slowed for an update when I was there in March. I guess the update is being done by carrier pigeons or smoke signals. Still can’t figure out why they have to slow charging to update software, but slow is better than none. Hope that new Tesla station has CCS capabilities.
Our first supercharging experience was at Quartzite. It was March 2020 everything was closed because of covid. Only had those original ones back then. Couldn’t even go into a restroom anywhere they wouldn’t allow it. I had to pee behind the box although I could be seen from the freeway😂😂😂
Every time I see a Tesla using a V2 vs a V3 I wonder if people even know the difference. I'm guessing people don't know since people don't know V2 stalls are shared. There are times when V3 is almost too fast. There are a lot of stations between AZ and CA with mixed V2 and V3 Superchargers as they've updated stations.
I’d use a V2 over a V3 if I plan to stop and eat, sometimes V3 finishes charging before I’m done eating and I have to run out and unplug to avoid idle fees 😬
Just went through Quartzsite a few weeks ago, driving from Palm Springs to Virginia. RV's, mobile homes and campers far outnumbered permanent structures. City Hall very well may have been in a tent, as far as I could tell. I doubt any of the locals own an EV.
Sure the locals don’t have many EVs but the point is that it’s the only CCS charger in between SoCal and Phoenix. That’s why it’s so vital and in demand. I’ve been stranded at this site multiple times, it’s just a nightmare and I can’t believe even over 2 years after the demand issues and equipment issues started ramping up, EA still hasn’t fixed this site in any substantial way.
Talking extreme cases, take a look at West Virginia. You basically can not cross WV in a CCS car without using a level 2 charger. The fastest DC CCS chargers in the state are 50 kw and most are single charger locations at dealerships that cost a fortune and are frequently broken.
Asked a friend of mine who lives here in Bakersfield about her opinion of her Tesla. She said it was fine but Tesla doesn’t have any superchargers here in Bakersfield. I was surprised to hear that but she was right. Bakersfield, a town with a population of mire that a quarter million people has no supercharger in Bakersfield proper. Sad!
In Quebec the Electric Circuit and Flo networks offer many more CCS stations than Tesla does Superchargers. They also cover more areas of the immense province than Tesla and are generally more reliable than CCS providers in the USA. However, many of their stations are only 50 kW - 100 kW. There are also Chargepoint, Petro-Canada, and Electrify Canada CCS in Quebec, but the latter two are less reliable. For the heavily traveled Montréal to Quebec corridor Tesla is best. For areas like the North coast (Tadoussac to Sept-Iles), Gaspésie (until the Supercharger in Gaspé comes online), Lac St-Jean, and Abitibi CCS is King. The best overall option currently in Quebec for long distance travel is a Tesla with a CCS adapter.
13:21 EA did the same thing with their charging site in Firebaugh, though to your point, they aren't nearly as active as they should be about expanding their sites in response to demand.
3:08 was there in December twice. 2 out of 4 working on way to LA. Continued to Dennys in Blythe and charged at 50Kw instead. Way back to Phoenix 3/4 working and 8 cars waiting. Had no choice but to wait (couldn’t make it to Buckeye). If there was ever a place for EA to put in a 20 station location this is it. EA unfortunately is just deaf too any issues. Hopefully Tesla will install V4s here (as I heard this weekend they are added 40 more there???)
Kyle-what a great video!
We are trading in our 1st Ed. Id4 for a Y due to be delivered in late May. We had two reasons for doing this tradein. Firstly, the id4 , which we loved and thought was so great at first hasn’t turned out that way. The software issues have gone on and on. When we bought the car, we were told that updates would be coming in a matter of weeks. When that didn’t happen and still hasn’t happened, we are now waiting for whatever parts are “coming in”.
The car is also under recall for a battery issue. Service one week ago said the car is ok on that front.
Then rebates and now lower prices on the Y made for an easy decision.
To your point here about charging networks. At first we thought free 3 year charging at EA was a great selling point. That was before we knew more about fast charging not being good for the battery as the only form of charging. Then, guess what? The EA at our local Target always has some off line. At first, the EA app caused problems which required phone calls for help. Even now the app doesn’t accurately show which chargers are working.
Sorry for the long comment, but this has been a long journey for us. We have already installed the Tesla wall charger in happy anticipation.
Our google account is under my husband’s name, but I am Patti and I watch all your informative videos. Your dad’s too and I feel that we even know Bailey, the dog.
We are getting the long range Y in red with black and white interior. Gerry is fine with 19” tires. I can’t wait.
So, thanks again.
Congrats on the new car
Watching the Lucid lock and unlock itself for the first several minutes was fun.
This really should become its own series where you highlight significant dead spots along the traveling corridor.
One of the reasons I enjoy your videos is because unlike some pro-EV channels, you can cheerlead without shilling. You are one of the few that point out some of the still-existing teething problems that potential EV owners can face, unlike some channels that are like: "get an EV or your (misspelled on purpose) stoo-pit."
Adding on to my last comment. One of the big reasons to get the Model Y is that we travel to Fort Wayne Indiana regularly to visit family. I took the ID.4 there once, knowing it would be a challenge and it was. Very limited CCS availability. We charged at the Caddy dealer twice that trip. Painful when you have kids and a wife that don't want to sit around waiting for the car to charge on a 62kW unit with nothing to do nearby. Contrast that with the fact that there are TWO supercharger sites in the city. Fort Wayne isn't a tiny city, something like 500k people or so. Nearest EA is over an hour away. And don't even get me going on traveling through West Virginia!
I totally understand your predicament. I live in the OKC metro area, with over 1.5M residents and there is only ONE Tesla supercharger and ONE Electrify America station. In addition, the state of Oklahoma penalizes EV owners by tacking on an additional $250 of 'EV fees' for the annual license plate renewals. I understand having EV owners help pay road taxes, but this fee amount would be equivalent to a ICE vehicle driving 30,000 miles a year.
I just wrote a comment myself complaining about West Virginia! My wife and I were trying to plan a roadtrip from Kokomo, IN to Norfolk, VA. West Virginia is a DCFC desert and the route planner said we would need to stay at a dealership Chargepoint station in West Virginia for an hour just to BARELY have enough juice to make it to the nearest EA station in Charlottesville, VA.
@@mowcowbell Yikes, oil lobby getting their lunch made
@@mowcowbell I charged in OKC on my way to Florida for Christmas. Definitely need more CCS chargers there.
I don't feel that they should have added more superchargers there unless they are version 4. Tesla should have moved down the road either 50 miles before or after that site to another Love's or TA to give more options and less range anxiety.
As someone who traveled from SoCal to Phoenix regularly, the quartzsite station was a absolute nightmare. Sucks because it’s in an excellent off the highway location with great amenities. Also it’s absolutely vital as almost the only link between Palm Springs and Phoenix.
Regularly there would only be 1/4 working and huge line with people charging to 100%. I eventually gave up on this charger and would just drive much slower to be able to skip this station. Just an absolute disaster. Unbelievable that even after a year+ of these issues, EA has barely touched the site. It need new reliable stations and to be expanded to at least 12 chargers.
Somehow when I rolled through Quartzsite in my ID.4 last month I got lucky. No one else was there and I happened to plug into the only properly functioning charger and got a good charge. A few minutes later an ID.4 pulled in and plugged into the only other (partially) functioning charger and got 32kW. I told him to try the other handle but he seemed to not understand why that might help and just left it. EA (or someone else) needs to step up and step up fast.
I've put over 15,000 miles on the ID.4 in four months and have "gotten lucky" a lot of times with EA so I haven't had any real issues. But we decided to go to a full EV fleet now so of course we got a Model Y to go along with the ID.4. so we can push the easy button for road trips when we want to.
We started with a Bolt (which we love) but when we started looking into road trips Tesla was the only real option we considered due to the issues we ran into while road-tripping in the Bolt (not the 55kW limit - we knew about that and that was not a real problem for us).
Adding the CCS adapter to the Tesla basically means "if it's fast charging, we can probably use it" which is nice in areas like Quebec and Nova Scotia which have built out massive (albeit 50kW) CCS infrastructure and Tesla is still kinda figuring it out and focusing on more chargers where they already have them.
Here in Canada, Electrified Canada still does not have a cross country charging corridor on our really only major Trans Canada highway and most of our BC and AB EC sites have single 350KW and 3 of the 150Kw charge points, time to buy a Tesla!
I used an “EC” station yesterday in Ottawa. 3/4 dispensers were broken in various ways. I uploaded my rants to my channel
Tesla is the only reliable Charging across Canada which is sad. BC hydro has a decent infra in BC and near my home but its just limited to 50KW and there are just 1-2 chargers.
@@simplygregsterev I believe all the on route stations along the 401 are going to have 150kw chargers by the end of this year. I'm hoping that that big change improves EV adoption along the seaway. It's truly bizarre how the vast majority of chargers in Canada are seemingly useless 50 kw chargers
@@jasonquaile2492 50kw has become the new L2… good if you are out shopping or similar around town or driving a smaller distance. Montreal Toronto you need 150kw and 6-10 dispensers per stop. I was just in Germany with a model 3 and having one connector standard is nice. That being said they seem to be taking it more seriously. Fastned, Ionity etc are pretty common
Come north into Alberta. Charging infrastructure essentially halts around Edmonton.
There is no CCS charging currently on a whole stretch of highway through Louisiana on I-20 and one lone ChargePoint 62.5kW on I-49 in between I-10 and I-20 it added an extra hour or so on my trip from Florida to Oklahoma. Meanwhile along those same stretches Tesla has about 4 supercharger stops
I’ve charged at Quartzsite almost every month. Only 2 of 4 CCS chargers were available Christmas Eve. 1.5 hours waiting to charge my Kia Niro. This week in a model Y. 18 minutes of charging across the street (36 stations) and I was on my way!!
I used the EA in Quartzite to charge my Ioniq 5 twice a couple months ago. Decent experience using the 350W headed west bound, and had great results using one of the 150s headed east. That said 4 chargers is not nearly enough given the location.
It's crazy to me that I charged my previously owned ID4 two years ago at this location (even back then I ran into 3/4 chargers occupied) and two years later there are still only four stalls here. Even crazier that there is no canopy or anything covering the chargers like the newly opened 88-bay Tesla charging station has. It gets HOT out there in the middle of the day.
These public charging issues only enforces the buying decision for EV's. Buy a Tesla, you can use reliable supercharger stations, and with a ~$180 CCS adapter can use CCS chargers. I rented a Tesla Model Y in Oregon recently, my first opportunity to try public charging for myself. Tesla superchargers are so easy to use, simply plug in and charge. No complicated apps, waving cards/phones in front of a reader, or hoping the station even works at all.
Nothing hard about it I have done it for 9 years . And even when Tesla opens the 3500 chargers it still takes a app and a lucid air that Kyle is driving only charges at 50 kw on the magic dock. Don’t exaggerate everything. I tap my phone and it starts. And some cars have plug and charge just like Tesla
@@markfitzpatrick6692 what other chargers have a plug and charge where no apps are required to be opened/CCs are required at the charging station? That’s awesome if another exists.
@@markfitzpatrick6692
Well, that settles it. Your anecdotal evidence proves everyone else wrong!
Kyle has posted at least 20 videos of him trying to charge with EVGo, Electrify America and others assorted charging networks and it's always the same thing. Hell, we just saw IN THIS VIDEO the issues that are typical.
* "350kW" chargers, that, if you're lucky, delivery 150 kW.
* Frozen apps that think you're connected when you're not.
* Apps that simply refuse to work and MIGHT work if you call and ask for a reboot.
And I don't just watch Out of Spec. I watch many, many, MANY other EV videos. TFLEV, individuals like MKBHD, I've had to have seen at least 50 videos at this point and charging on non Tesla networks are always hit or miss, more miss than hit.
I'm also subscribed to a few EV forums and it's the same thing. Heck, just read the comments for various chargers around the US that are not Tesla. But hey, believe as you wish.
@@markfitzpatrick6692 the 50kw charge limit is a Lucid issue on SC’s not the supercharger itself.
I wanted a Tesla. However, I don't have the money for a Model X and cannot stand the Model Y drive. Happy with the Mach-e I have. Already 11,000 miles.
Own a Tesla S and Ioniq 5. I live in So California, my son lives in Phoenix. Made the trip many times in the Tesla, no issues. I was at the Quartzite on my way back to California and experienced the same bricked EA unit. Your video shows 202 hours idle time, I was there at 151 on Friday evening. On the way out, the line for EA was 8 cars deep and added over 90 minutes to our one-way trip. From this point forward, only the Tesla on this route.
Why don't you do an video interview with the management team from E A and have them explain themselves and thier plans for their infrastructure. We need to hear more from these dependent charging companies.
Even for the areas where CCS chargers beat Supercharger availability, Teslas can still use a CCS adapter 😎
But they don’t need the adapter if the Tesla network is so great. If you spend time using a ccs adapter then they don’t have enough Tesla chargers like people brag about.
@@markfitzpatrick6692 We brag about Tesla because is the best not because we have enough.
@@yacahumax1431 amen
@@markfitzpatrick6692
I never understand this fanboy hatred where you support one multi-billion dollar company but hate another. It's like when there was that iPhone vs Android battle where people were literally getting into fights because someone dared to spend their money on one brand versus another.
Tesla's network is the best. Arguing that just makes you look childish. Tesla has access to its supercharger network PLUS all CCS chargers. Is it perfect? Obviously it's not. But then again, no one said it is. There are roughly 150k gas stations in the US. But it took over 100 years for us to get there! Ideally, in 15 years, we'll have 300k EV charging stalls that all EVs can use. But no need for the fanboy stuff.
Yes they can use the adapter, as long as you are prepared for disappointment.
Oh, this is perfect timing! I'm about to take my first road trip from LA to Sedona in my model Y. This is one of the charge stops I've been evaluating!
Thanks much!
I've been to Quartzite twice to charge on trips from NorCal to Phoenix and back again. Place was mostly empty when I was there, so barring "big driving times" I don't think you'll have much trouble. Plus Carl's Jr has decent food for fast-food.
Exact reason why I no longer have ID.4 and now drive a model 3. Had enough (~4 years) waiting for CCS infrastructure to improve. Kind of seems it's getting worse at least in my neck of the woods (Central Oregon).
Yeah no reason to reward vag. This is just Dieselgate all over again.
Worse? 👀 how so?
@@simoc24 maybe even more ccs cars and more break downs from the heavy usage.
@@simoc24 At least in my area chargers are constantly full, mostly ID.4 hogging up spaces and charging to 100%. Just a lot of EVs in general. Couple that with chargers constantly down and EA's terrible customer service, yeah it's a crapshoot.
@@vincenty747 wow
Living in Atlanta, CCS does have an advantage in the mountains where Georgia Power has put in some chargers (along with EVgo). Can’t think of many other places through.
Perhaps more rural areas where they’ve put in some ChargePoint CPE250s.
Tesla CCS adapter fixes that. It's nice there are a few single and double stall installs up there though if you really need them.
The CCS infrastructure around ATL proper is a bit lacking in comparison though.
Another CCS desert is the route between Dayton, OH and Virginia. Most of West Virginia is barren of EA stations, and it leaves road trippers at the mercy of the few DCFC Chargepoint stations at dealerships.
They have zero ea in West Virginia. The Hyundai dealer put in som charge point. Wv is a really small state compared to oh . I would just go thru pa and the Down or when wytheville va is back up you can make it there then Virginia has chargers going east
West Virginia + coal legacy = no EV charging.
Similar situation in Ellensburg, WA with 4 CCS at EA. Ellensburg is halfway between Seattle and Spokane on I-90. The nearest westbound CCS chargers are 80 miles away in North Bend, WA and the nearest eastbound CCS chargers are in Ritzville, WA another 115 miles away. During our last stop at Ellensburg EA only 2/4 chargers were working.
If you want to travel across Michigan's Upper Peninsula, DO NOT BUY A CCS VEHICLE! We are just starting to get some Big Boy CCS Enel X JuicePump 175kW Chargers, but they're all on the west side of the peninsula. Tesla currently has 3 Version 3 Superchargers up here. In places I believe make sense, including one on the east end of the Peninsula in Sault St. Marie. There are Freewire chargers at those location too, but Freewire just ins't great for Vehicle throughput. Tesla is just destroying the competition!
I used that specific EA charge site many times. Lately, I had to wait for 3-4 cars in front of me during day light. This is pretty much the only charging station with good speed between Indio and Buckeye. Rivian had planed a charge site here too... I can't wait.
Charger for Rivian is open now 🙏🏿
On Labor Day last year ALL of the EA chargers at Quartzite were down. Some people were stranded for over 9 hours!
Haven’t drove from Camarillo to Scottsdale for a long time. When we did, there was only 6 SuperChargers at the Carl’s Jr. At that time we never had to wait, but that was in 2018. So glad that we purchased a LR M3. Now we have added a Model Y. Very lucky, we added solar panels in 2009 and have been very happy and fortunate to be ahead of the electricity cost and gasoline cost in California. Really enjoy your videos.
Watching this video, it's clear that Tesla is ahead of the game when it comes to charging infrastructure. The vast difference between CCS and Tesla Superchargers in Quartzsite, Arizona is a testament to Tesla's commitment to making EV ownership a seamless experience. It's remarkable to see Tesla's continuous expansion, including plans for an 88-stall Tesla Supercharger at Terrible's gas station.
As an EV owner, having access to reliable and extensive charging infrastructure is crucial, especially for long road trips. The issues faced at the CCS Electrify America station, such as derated and malfunctioning chargers, can be a real pain point for drivers, but it seems like Tesla owners can breathe easy knowing that there are plenty of Superchargers available.
For someone considering buying an electric car, this kind of dependable charging network could be a game-changer and a major selling point in favor of Tesla. It's not just about the car itself; the charging infrastructure is a critical part of the ownership experience.
Kudos to Tesla for taking the lead and investing in a robust Supercharger network!
Tesla is not going to offer the best charging to everyone. That is not in Tesla interest. Their commitment of 10% of chargers open to CCS is like a drug dealer offering free sample.
Driving from Dallas to New Orleans:
In a Tesla Model Y LR AWD:
More direct via Shreveport, 521 miles, 3 charging stops totaling 40 mins - total trip 8hr 25mins total.
In a Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD:
Have to go via Houston, 568 miles, 3 charging stops totaling 1hr - total trip 9hr 43mins
And that's assuming the chargers work on the way and there's no line for the working ones...
Been to the Quartzite Superchargers many times. My worst experience was the Tuesday before Thanksgiving last year. There was actually a line out to the street from the bank of 32 chargers. However, since there are so many chargers it only added about 7 minutes to my total charge stay. By the way, there were long lines at Terrible's for the fuel pumps too though total time spent there would have been less.
Columbia, SC is the same way. We have 1 EA site with 4 units and usually half of them are down or derated at any point. Tesla now has 5 Sites in Columbia with 50+ stalls combined between them. There is even a 6th one on the drawing board.
South & Southwest of San Antonio Texas there are no CCS1 DCFCs.
I live in McAllen, and my sisters & I bought our mom a Model S as she regularly visits relatives in San Antonio & Austin.
We love her, but she has always been a ditz, so the foolishness with CCS1 along with more Tesla chargers made it a no brainer.
Here is MN the CCS network leaves much to be desired. If you want to drive I90 west across South Dakota good luck! Sioux Falls has a few CCS DC chargers, all at car dealerships, slow and expensive. Worthington MN has a fairly new Electrified America, 3 of the 4 are normally working, but I've actually never seen it full. Car dealership in Luverne MN has a Charge Point, only 50kw but it works well and priced resonably. We've had our Polestar 2 for about a year, charging really hasn't been a problem, but I really wish companies would put in more 200-250kw chargers and just make sure they all work rather than 350's that don't!
I live in Quartzsite 6 months a year, off grid (can’t charge in the desert). I have charged at the Quartzsite Supercharged 135 times, never waited in line. Only twice has there been a single dead charger. Traffic has increased this year. The site also has a large dog walking area. New Rivian chargers are being installed by the Times 3 restaurant.
So Kyle I live in Ocala FL with Interstate 75 driving threw the center of my city. I have no EA, EVG or Blink networks here. I don't count new car dealerships with DC chargers. I will not beg to use their slow DC chargers. I do have 2 Tesla charging stations here. One station level 2 and one station level 3. I believe a total of 16 stalls. While I have a day job I do have a part time job with food deliver, you never know when you will need a quick charge to get home. With no CCS support in my city I choose the Model 3 RWD last year and never looked back. By the way Buc-ee"s has been approved to build a location in Ocala with 120 gas pumps and 28 DC chargers. I personally have only seen Tesla Super Chargers at Buc-ee's lets hope this holds true for this location.
Rivian just got their RAN chargers fired up in Quartzite (per the RAN Tracker). So, six new chargers for Rivians in that area.
Been there. Lucked out, only had to wait for one user to leave. It is a funnel for travelers, I ended up seeing the same cars at a couple of these stops on the way to California. It began to feel like a real community!
Little Rock, Arkansas to New Orleans, Louisiana:
Model Y LR AWD: 446 miles - 7hr 39mins - inc 1x 12 minute charging stops
Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD: 449 miles - 9hr 29mins - inc 2x charging stops one of which is an EV Connect at a Cadillac/GMC dealer for 2hrs.
Yeah, listened to you and for my one car household just bought a CR-V hybrid. So far so good.
Hybrids are still a great choice.
6:47 Don't forget, the HUMMER EV is also an 800 V system, so it would be pulling a similar ~70ish kW (so also about 3 hours for it to charge to full). When CCS providers reduce power, it's typically limited to100 A, so they are really operating as 40 kW units. I'm not sure the exact reason they would do that for an update, but it likely has to do with either the cooling system or the thermistors needing to be shut off.
That’s an insane extreme. 125 nacs vs. 4 ccs lmao 🤣
This is why Tesla is selling more cars than the others. The away from home Charging network is very important factor. By the other companies wanting tesla to open its netork for use speaks volumes on how smart they were with their network. Remember they built the network before the Model S was released for sale, and its been the strength of their sales.
A tale of two states right next to each other. Ohio and West Virginia. Ohio actually has relatively extensive CCS coverage given the low adoption of EVs relative to places like California. But W Virginia has virtually no CCS at all. I would say Colorado and Wyoming are a bit similar where Colorado has extensive CCS coverage with some decent Tesla coverage as well while Wyoming is virtually a CCS desert but does have Tesla SC coverage.
Joe manchen has a lot to do with wv problems. And all the coal lovers there. I don’t know how he allowed tesla to install in Charleston and Huntington
Between Plano, Dallas and Katy, Houston (270ish miles), for charger locations with 100kW plus chargers on route (within say 1 mile off route) there are:
4 CCS sites with a total of 18 chargers.
15 Tesla sites with a total of 200 chargers.
And the numbers get worse if we play "count the working chargers only"...
It’d make a lot of sense to add solar to the supercharger locations in Az where feasible. Free electricity, reducing load on the grid, and free shade for the cars below. Cars won’t need AC pumping as hard, battery might charge a bit faster
Are you able to get an interview with EA staff and understand what is happening? You say EA listens to you, so we’d love to hear what EA is doing based on your feedback.
Electrify my 🍑hole exists solely to satisfy VW’s government spanking from dieselgate, and to vacuum up as many Biden Bucks as they can to recoup their loses. They do not actually care whether you can charge your EV or not as long as they’re getting juicy taxpayer dollars. There is one company that seriously benefits from a vast network for reliable fast chargers, and that is Tesla. Nobody else has much to lose. DEMAND that automakers switch to NACS and add Supercharger support or don’t buy their garbage. I can’t believe that anyone disagrees with me.
EA has stopped interacting with Kyle/Out of Spec Studios, and Tom Moloughney - State of Charge/InsideEVs. Kyle & Tom ask
hard questions and don't accept dismissive PR answers.
@@anthonyc8499 EA is truly a garbage corporation. Amazing to me that EVgo or ChargePoint don't take them head on.
I don’t think VW/EA ever took charging seriously as a business. They spent what they were forced to out of “dieselgate” and leave it at that. Kyle, you did the Kempower video but without real site locations. Any update?
@@anthonyc8499 state of charge literally interviewed ea at the new york auto show last week
I charged our EV6 at EA Quartzite last week. On the site it said 50 kw but I charged at 146 at 30% SOC. We need the magic dock on those new Tesla chargers.
When I bought my Tesla model s nearly 6 years ago I I would use this quartzite supercharger at least 2 times a Month. Then 2021 I was in the market to get another ev. Mine had over 121,000 miles on it . I watched videos that said the VW id4 was amazing a great road trip car or even others but I saw this problem in quartzite. And Tesla built the additional 32 chargers s. Also opened Ehrenberg az chargers just down the road and it cemented my next car as a model Y. This site is the ccs charging system in a nutshell. No plans to improve while Tesla has an entire section of their business to continuously improve the charging situation. Btw if you are just getting an around town car that you charge in your garage. Why do you need anymore range than you drive in a day ? We also have a mini Cooper SE for our around town trips.
One thing you could mention explicitly to really drive you point home: EA is basically the BEST that CCS has to offer in the US. Like, everything else is less prevalent, even more finicky, and probably charges slower. I (and other EV owners) know you're comparing EA to Tesla because EA is basically the biggest game in the country for CCS, but other viewers won't know that necessarily - and should be reminded of it - because it just makes the whole point you're driving home that much more depressing. Yeah, there are other CCS options, but for the most part they are EVEN WORSE. :(
NACS charging standard designed by engineers to encourage EV adoption.
CCS charging standard designed by the ICE manufactures marketing department to discourage EV adoption, trying to keep EV’s from catching on.
I really wish EA would get their stuff together. I've got a polestar 2 and I love it...and so far I haven't had any EA issues outside of 1 derated charger in a spot(which I checked in on plugshare for) and at least here in cali EA seems to have a lot of larger stall installations. Sites with 10 or 12 stalls which isn't amazing but it's a lot better than those 4 stall spots but they need to continue to expand. 12 is nice...but it isn't 36...and we really should be getting to that point.
El Paso Texas to Albuquerque New Mexico:
Model Y LR AWD: 267 miles - 3hr 57mins - inc 1x 6 minute charge stop
Hyundai Ioniq 5 AWD: 298 miles - 5hr 24mins - inc 1x 40 min charging stop (only 1x 60kW unit)
I've made stops on 3 occasions at that exact EA stop in Quartzsite two years ago. Only one resulted in a successful charge, the other two were unsuccessful. That corridor REALLY needs a charger revamp. There's similar issues when taking the 8 from San Diego to Phoenix.
I make the drive from Orange County to Mesa multiple times per year. The Quartzsite location helped with our decision to buy a Tesla. Hopefully the 88 stall addition will bring in more food choices. A little burned out on Carl’s.
Try Love's.
Another issue in Canada, charging providers get free Federal money to intall chargers with no requirement our guarantee on the operations and reliability end and it is getting reflected in many sites similar to the EA station that you have shown, only one 150kw charger functioning totally not acceptable.
The CCS situation in Toronto is a joke.
On a recent trip to Phoenix, the Quartzsite station was COMPLETELY DOWN on the route east. On my return, the chargers were deliberately slowed (like 50 kW). Worse, the door to my charging socket wouldn't open. After an half an hour of frustration, I ripped the door open with my fingers and then taped it closed. To the dealer's credit, the door was replaced under warranty.
13:27 - you are funny!!!😂
Ironically i just a horrible experience charging at EA with my Model Y. EA charged me for 2 short sessions and customer service said nothing was wrong.
Does non-Tesla manufacturers even know how bad EA is? Smh
Kyle, great video that really hit home for me. The legacy automotive companies are clueless about the CCS charging network. They cheerlead the EA movement with free charging and get a bunch of clueless new owners on the road. I get so tired of reading articles about "Why I am unhappy about my EV because I never thought the (CCS) charging network is so bad" And then the media posting the article almost always posts a picture of a Testa!! I want to buy a Lucid Gravity next year and trade in my Tesla. I am watching the CCS charging network very closely. The Tesla magic dock is not the primary solution. Why would Tesla want the liability of damaging someone's non-Tesla battery via fast, or super fast, or hyper fast charging??
Yup, that EA is definitely a bottleneck...thank goodness Rivian just opened up their station down the street! Not yet showing on App though...kinda funny, kinda tragic you didn't know so could also include in this video
I stopped there on Saturday of last week with my 21 ID.4. I can confirm the station where the Lucid was plugged in was derated to 50 kw. I guess there's no urgency to fix the station.
There is a 100+ charging station that is almost complete at the Barstow Outlets and from what I can tell they are all covered with solar panels. I've been to the Quartzite location when it's full on the weekends, it's not exactly fun when you have to use split charging.
The fact that there is a line says they EA needs to add more chargers and be on top of repairs, I work at a convenience store with 30 pumps and even 1 pump being down is a 4 hour priority ticket, we only have a line peak summer travel as well so them being on top of repairs in the winter is Impressive.
We also only have 6 L3 Tesla chargers with no CCS plugs.
You nailed it Kyle...my son has a 2022tesla m3lr, I do like some non tesla cars, but I would only buy tesla for now because of super charger, we go to Orlando to Miami many times using the tesla, and charging is no problem
The entire state of Minnesota, there is a single Electrify America and one EVGo that's it. Otherwise there's a few of really expensive Zef energy 50kw chargers and PLENTY of tesla chargers
Hunter, do you have any knowledge of the Kempower/Zeffirelli locations in Minnesota?
Zef
Is Tesla going to add CCS to that new station? With the demand for the EA station outstripping the supply and reliability so much it seems like a lot of money on the table if they don't.
We have 1 car (TM3 RWD LFP) we so rarely have to public charge in the UK, but for both our jobs we sometimes have to travel around the country. I did not want to risk having to hunt a working charger or end up sat queuing for a 50kw. We are lucky [almost] all EV in Europe are CCS combo, so we can use any charger.
The amount, placement and reliability of superchargers is just too good.
I really hope the rest of the public network could catch up for competitive reasons.
Thanks again for a great video
This makes me appreciate being able to charge at home and not doing long road trips all the more.
Can't they (EA I mean) , just reboot them on a regular basis? Looks like the software is just super unstable and needs a fresh start. Or ... probably, a way for the customer to perform this operation?
EA touts their super high tech network monitoring system but this proves that it's all for show.
I own both a Tesla and an ID.4. My wife wanted to take the ID.4 on a trip with her sister, I had to tell her not to do it. She did several Tesla road trips in the past, but I had to explain to her that she is much more likely to have an issue with CCS. I can probably survive a road trip in an ID.4, but my wife does not have the same level of endurance with putting up with issues when it comes to EV driving. If there are 4 chargers in place, but only one is working, and she has to use an app to start the charge session each time, and so on...
I hope that giant Tesla supercharging station you talked about is opened to other EVs. If not, people who drive CCS cars may be jealous of the Tesla stations.
just a thought... also include a safety rating at charge sites? IE. lighting, amenities...
that "line" you pointed to, I've experienced it personally. Last summer there was a team of 4 EU VW ID4 vehicles charging past 80% while taking up 3 out of 4 stalls that day. They were testing autonomous driving here in the US. i felt so privileged to have been waiting after them to charge my ID4. SMH.. lol
Looks like Rivian just opened a RAN charger site in Quartzsite in the last couple days
In March 2023, EVGo opened Conejo Gateway Plaza (Thousand Oaks/Newbury Park, CA) and 6 350 Kw A CCS and 2 150A CCS / CHAdMO units.
Currently, 2 x 350 Kw are down.
I went over after they opened up, (just for fun) and Charged my 2022 F-150 Lightning, from 20% to 80%.
It was the first week they were open, and the session was perfect.
The closest charging for Tesla is at the Oaks Mall 3 miles away and there are about 12-16 units.
In the area for CCS there are not many options, and the Mall has 1 50Kw CCS/CHAdeMo/Tesla unit, 1 50Kw out-of-service CCS/CHAdeMO, and 1 out-of-service L2
Others are 5, 12, and 16 miles away with no more than 4 units. mostly 50 and 100Kw
Most newer locations are 2x 350Kw and 2x 100Kw
This is a highly traveled area along the 101 freeway in northern Los Angeles and is mostly bedroom urban neighborhoods.
There are many electric vehicles here, and most people charge them at home.
This site was literally one of our 1st charging experiences on our 2nd day of owning our i4. The loves in nice but that parking lot is so busy especially when 5 EVs are waiting to charge parked against the curb. 2 chargers were working on our way to Phoenix and only 1 on our return trip. Thankfully most of the EV owners were courteous and not charging to 100% although that is more the norm these days.
I did the hertz EV manager special at LAX and picked a Kia Niro. I needed to charge to 70% to return it, they didn't include a cord to charge where I was staying. I found an Electrify America near Fullerton, all new chargers, but not on. I found another charger, all were in use. I found another charger, but they were all down for repair. Finally I found one that was at a bank and only 50kw. So, I went to get breakfast as it charged. I had to plan around 2 hours to find and charge the car. Not good. I liked the car, but charging it was such a pain. Similar issue on another trip to San Diego and a polestar two. Broken chargers, or all in use.
The whole state of WV is a CCS charging desert. According to Plugshare (1)62kWh and (1)24kWh CCS location in the whole state and these are 3rd party installations. Tesla has supercharges along most major routes so you can at least travel through the state.
Good video and as we are about to make the drive from Scottsdale to Santa Barbara in our EQS580 there is additional concern with the apparent closure of the Walmart Indio Electrify America chargers. You would think this is not rocket science. Maybe the issue is they are not profitable enough because they are not charging enough. Just a thought.
For the ones that don’t want to buy a Tesla, thank you! I don’t want every car on the road to be like mine.
As you state in many of your other videos, if you are NOT road tripping and you can charge mostly at home or work, this is not an issue. There are many other factors that made me choose a Tesla over other allegedly available vehicles (hint at why I chose Tesla), but being able to road trip was not at the top of my list. But for those 5 percenters that road trip a lot (and that might be high) then it should be a strong consideration.
Did Electrify America respond to this video? It's the same everywhere...I was charging in New Jersey (Pompton Lakes) last month and all the stations ,150 and 350 were downgraded to 50 kw. The same happened in Albany, NY at the Washington Ave charging station. I have an Ioniq5 and an ID4 and I now feel screwed...
The only areas I can think of where CCS beats Tesla are in Eastern Canada. In particular around the Gaspe Peninsula and in Nova Scotia - especially up around Cape Breton. But those are mostly older single-stall 50kW stations which are "better than nothing", not shiny new infrastructure.
I got my CCS adapter mostly so I could travel more conveniently into those areas, and Flo and Circuit Electrique work quite well and are smoothly partnered with each other - and I believe ChargePoint back here in the US.
Love the superchargers and glad Tesla is opening up a portion of them to the public. This will increase EV mass adoption for sure 🌎 ⚡️
I’m hoping the 88 new charger stalls include the magic dock!!
My 1st road trip (GV60) from Palm Springs CA to Tuson AZ included Quartszite as the 1st charging station. I had some range anxiety not knowing how the GV60 mileage would be effected by elevation changes, high speed driving (75 MPH) , number of passengers (3), plus the status of this EA station (broken units and or slow charging speeds). We were lucky, only a 10 minute wait with a charging speed in the 90s. Others behind me had to wait about 30 minutes. Once charged up to 80%, we were in good shape to make it to any of the EA stations in Phoenix. Based on your video and articles I have read on the Federal funds for new charging stations, I think Tesla wants to become a national charging network for all EVs - maybe even a monopoly and give the other charging networks a real run for their money. I don't think EA will ever be able to catch up once Telsa starts it conquest. EA was built as a result of the government VW diesel engine punishment / fulfilling (at a minimum) their obligation without the goal of high customer satisfaction. Tesla built their network to sell EVs - depending on very high customer satisfaction. It will be interesting to have this conversation again in 1 and 2 yrs - hopefully taking a road trip in a non Tesla will become a non issue. Love your channel - without it probably still driving an ICE!
I drove my Rivian through Quartzsite twice a week ago. First time charged on the EA 350 and only got about 64 kw max rate. On the way back I used the 150 kW unit that is supposedly fully operational. I got a maximum of 101 kW. My Rivian can easily accept over 200 kW at the state of charge I was at. The first time, when using the 350 kW station I contact EA's costumer service and asked if they could tell me which station was operating at the best rate. Their response was that they didn't know and could not help me. Amazing costumer service, NOT!
Sit at that station in July in the middle of the day, baking in the desert sun. Good times.
Your dad was asking where his lucid was in his last video!!!!
Curious that it appears that none of the charge bays are configured for drive through for people towing trailers.
LOL! While watching this video I just saw an ad for the Ioniq 6, which does not have access to the supercharger network. And the add claims it "wins every time" against the Tesla!!!!
Did you forget Blythe? There’s 2 CCS chargers there and 8 more superchargers in Ehrenberg about 10 miles from Quartzsite.
After watching hundreds of videos like yours, 2 years ago I made the decision to buy a Tesla over any CCS car here in Ontario, Canada. The CCS network here is much worse than it is in the US as far as I have heard and experienced. I would like to try a higher end German EV, but would not for that reason. Just imagine how much worse that situation is going to get if the number of EV's doubles every year or two. I think those who are in charge of pushing the conversion to an EV future should be forced to drive only EVs in order to enrich their experience of the real world of EV ownership.
I wonder if Quartzite is (or will be) the first city with more fast chargers than gas pumps.
Baker, CA might be that way already.
@@anthonyc8499 I think both of them already have more charging stations than pumps, but in fairness fewer pumps can service more cars because the "charging" time for gas is so much lower. ;)
Sutherlin, Oregon has 51 superchargers and 7 gas stations. If the gas stations all have six pumps, then there are more superchargers than pumps.
That station was slowed for an update when I was there in March. I guess the update is being done by carrier pigeons or smoke signals. Still can’t figure out why they have to slow charging to update software, but slow is better than none.
Hope that new Tesla station has CCS capabilities.
Our first supercharging experience was at Quartzite. It was March 2020 everything was closed because of covid. Only had those original ones back then. Couldn’t even go into a restroom anywhere they wouldn’t allow it. I had to pee behind the box although I could be seen from the freeway😂😂😂
Every time I see a Tesla using a V2 vs a V3 I wonder if people even know the difference. I'm guessing people don't know since people don't know V2 stalls are shared. There are times when V3 is almost too fast. There are a lot of stations between AZ and CA with mixed V2 and V3 Superchargers as they've updated stations.
I’d use a V2 over a V3 if I plan to stop and eat, sometimes V3 finishes charging before I’m done eating and I have to run out and unplug to avoid idle fees 😬
Just went through Quartzsite a few weeks ago, driving from Palm Springs to Virginia. RV's, mobile homes and campers far outnumbered permanent structures. City Hall very well may have been in a tent, as far as I could tell. I doubt any of the locals own an EV.
Sure the locals don’t have many EVs but the point is that it’s the only CCS charger in between SoCal and Phoenix. That’s why it’s so vital and in demand. I’ve been stranded at this site multiple times, it’s just a nightmare and I can’t believe even over 2 years after the demand issues and equipment issues started ramping up, EA still hasn’t fixed this site in any substantial way.
Talking extreme cases, take a look at West Virginia. You basically can not cross WV in a CCS car without using a level 2 charger. The fastest DC CCS chargers in the state are 50 kw and most are single charger locations at dealerships that cost a fortune and are frequently broken.
Asked a friend of mine who lives here in Bakersfield about her opinion of her Tesla. She said it was fine but Tesla doesn’t have any superchargers here in Bakersfield. I was surprised to hear that but she was right. Bakersfield, a town with a population of mire that a quarter million people has no supercharger in Bakersfield proper. Sad!
In Quebec the Electric Circuit and Flo networks offer many more CCS stations than Tesla does Superchargers. They also cover more areas of the immense province than Tesla and are generally more reliable than CCS providers in the USA. However, many of their stations are only 50 kW - 100 kW. There are also Chargepoint, Petro-Canada, and Electrify Canada CCS in Quebec, but the latter two are less reliable. For the heavily traveled Montréal to Quebec corridor Tesla is best. For areas like the North coast (Tadoussac to Sept-Iles), Gaspésie (until the Supercharger in Gaspé comes online), Lac St-Jean, and Abitibi CCS is King. The best overall option currently in Quebec for long distance travel is a Tesla with a CCS adapter.
13:21 EA did the same thing with their charging site in Firebaugh, though to your point, they aren't nearly as active as they should be about expanding their sites in response to demand.
3:08 was there in December twice. 2 out of 4 working on way to LA. Continued to Dennys in Blythe and charged at 50Kw instead. Way back to Phoenix 3/4 working and 8 cars waiting. Had no choice but to wait (couldn’t make it to Buckeye). If there was ever a place for EA to put in a 20 station location this is it. EA unfortunately is just deaf too any issues. Hopefully Tesla will install V4s here (as I heard this weekend they are added 40 more there???)