2015 ALL BLACKS vs 2023 SPRINGBOKS | PICK YOUR STARTING XV
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- Опубліковано 7 жов 2024
- This debate will never be settled. Two of the most dominant rugby teams of their time. Both sides off the back of back2back RWC Titles and literally un stoppable.
I try select a combined starting XV out of these two stacked sides.
What changes would you make?
Who do you think was the better side?
#springboks #allblacks #springboksrugby
I generally agree with your picks, but there's a few asterixes. Savea had a very short peak, which was basically 18months to 2 years, and just happened to coincide with 2015rwc. And it kinda also reflects how tight the rwc23 was, with 4 fantastic teams who could beat each other on any given day (minus nz red cards 🙄). So the rwc23 was a very special tournament to win.
Fwiw:
1. Kitshoff
2. Coles
3. Franks (excellent around the field as well as scrummaging - more to his game)
4. Eben
5. Whitelock (my favorite player ever, so I'm kinda biased, and you almost made me cry happy tears talking about him).
6/7 PSDT
7/6 McCaw
8 Read (I'd pick the 2019 Vermulean, but 2023 not quite)
9 Smith
10 DC
11 Savea (2015 version)
12 Nonu
13 Smith (he was the rock in the nz defence structure for 5 seasons)
14 Kolbe
15 Ben from accounts. Very underrated player
16 Mbongi
17 Ox
18 Koch (i seriously think he's the forgotten man sometimes. Love watching him play)
19 Retallick
20 Kwagga
21 TKB (he was at his peak too), and I must admit i have a mindblock on Faf
22 Beauden Barrett
23 Arendse
Let the hate begin!
Arendse over SBW whaaat?!😅
That comment over Vermeulen is so true.
And yes S Whitelock the best to do it🤝🤝
@@KickOnRugby a little light on centre cover ay. Wouldn't feel right to pick SBW over DDA.
22. DDA
23. Barrett... But that feels wrong cos Arendse is class. Ah, can't win here can i
@@Thudsrayz can’t win but can also win because no matter who you pick they’re all class🫡
As a NZer we dont need to announce that AB team. Your current Springbok side is right up there and not taking anything away from that, but interestingly, they were pretty ave until Rassie Erasmus took the reins. I remember us beating the core of the team
56 - 0 and Japan knocking them out in the WC. Only saying to highlight the incredible comeback from that to World domination within a couple of years. Its remarkable and must have been a hell of a journey for them all. 🖤
So it must be said 1. the Coach 2. Heart & 3. TWI (cohesion) are must-have crucial factors in a winning team.
The whole lot, both sides deserve all the praise, takes a lot of knocks and hard work to get there, both full of remarkable Rugby Union players - 2 of the best teams ever.
(ours are better looking tho (haha 🖤🖤🖤)
Absolutely!! Damn should’ve used “looks” as selection criteria😅
@@KickOnRugby ha ! Good video
@@ljawgtn1393 🤝🤝
When it really clicks the 2025 Boks will be the main comparison to the 2015 AB
🤝🤝
You can't leave retalick out, during 2015 he was the one with the title of world rugby player of the year. Best of the best
You definitely can 😂
Eben and Sam though😬
@@KickOnRugby 100% imagine the dominance any team would have with those two together
@@KickOnRugby Sam Whitelock was a student of the game, but Retallick was the more freakish athlete. I’d pick Retallick and Etzebeth myself.
The problem with hypothetical match ups and combined XVs is that they tend to get parochial in the end, in the same manner that each team thinks they are better than their opponent until they actually have a match result set in record.
As is happens, many of the current Springboks team actually played against the 2015 All Blacks at their peak, during the 2015 World Cup Semi final. It was, by some margin, the All Blacks tightest and most difficult match of the year - and they won by 20-18. Make of that what you will...
Yep. Playing at different stages of their careers. Hypotheticals will just stay hypothetical. But it’s fun to talk about🤝
Tbf, the 2019 All Blacks also beat the 2019 World Cup winning Springboks in pool play during that tournament, only to lose to England in the semi. So, it's always been incredibly fine margins between the two teams. Usually comes down to the bounce of the ball or a referee's call.
Eben and Sam, bak row 100% Smith DC, was suprised you went with conrad nonu coz Jesse Kriel is a monster also, kolbe putting people on skates what a team! Oh and Rassie as coach surely
Yeah Kriel vs Smith is a tough one. I grew up watching C Smith and Nonu playing. Loved that combo man
@@KickOnRugby yea i get that they worked well together
With Richie McCaw as captain, the 2015 AB side would win 8 times out of 10 over the 2023 Springbok side : being captain is not just being a great player or the woo woo " inspirational stuff" but McCaw has a great rugby brain and would effectively function as a second coach on the field and direct his team to the win. Also Ben Smith was unbeatable at catching high balls and Conrad/Nonu is the best centre pairing EVER in Rugby Union. McCaw had Reade and Kaino in the loose trio, both arguably the best in their positions. 2023 Springboks had a great team with a few X factor players. 2015 AB team was almost completely X factor players with few competent players. The only person from 2023 Springboks I would take to put in the 2015 ABs would be PSDT and I would play PSDT as lock to replace Sam Whitelock and keep the AB loose trio. And maybe the Boks front-row.
No way. You’re overrating that team. They only beat the Boks 20-18 in the semi and that Bok team was nowhere near the current team. World Rugby in 2023 is a much higher level than 2015. The ABs haven’t dropped off much since then, everyone else has just raised to their level. And the Bok team has just as many X factor players, that’s such a casual take.
I’m taking at least Malherbe in the front row, Etzebeth is first choice pick ahead of either Kiwi, PSDT over Kaino, Vermeulen over Read. Kriel over Smith, Kolbe over Milner Skudder.
All this talk about McCaw is nonsense, the Springbok leadership group is just as good, Kolisi is the motivator, and Vermeulen the coach on the field as you put it.
If they actually played, I’m taking the Boks 6 out of 10 times, the level of coaching today is the reason for the All Black downfall, the way the Springboks defend prevents any dominant carries, and has irradiated the traditional AB offloading game, and the transition in world rugby to all kicking contestables off 9, eliminates their traditional counter attacking game. The Boks would bully them in the collision.
@@jameswyatt4443 to say the ABs have only dropped off slightly is an understatement. Are you forgetting Aaron Smith and Dan Carter?, or what about Dane Coles and Kevin Mealamu?. Come on dude yes the 2023 Boks are good but, in the RWC they only won their Quarter, semi and final by 1 point. Yes the ABs beat the Boks by 2 points but they blitz the rest especially the final!.
@@raelkington647 How slow are you? The ABs in 2024 have dropped off more, but in 2023, their team was still stacked, that drop off narrative isn’t true for 2023, like I said, the other teams raised their level. After Carter and McCaw retired, the year after in 2016, the All Blacks were arguably better.
The Springboks played the best Scottish side ever, the best Irish side ever, the best French side ever in France. The only reason England were a problem is because it was raining, and the Boks started with Libbok, and setup to run the ball, which didn’t work in the conditions. They then beat the ABs by point. As I said, the level of competition is so much higher, all of the teams were better in 2023, than in 2015, the ABs only had comfortable games in 2015 because the opposition sucked, which was not the case in 2023. In the final the Springboks played 78 minutes without a hooker, and ABs concede just 5 penalties, and if you’re not aware, conceding only 5 penalties genuinely historically low. A normal amount of penalties, and a real hooker, the Boks thrash the ABs in the final, like they did at Twickenham with the maul variations.
Cheslin Kolbe surely get’s a start in that side….
@@natnut2008
Based in 2015 form and 2023 form:
1. Moody < De Groot
2. Coles > Taylor
3. Franks > Lomax
4. Retallick 2015 > Retallick 2023
5. Whitelock > Barrett
6. Kaino > Frizzell
7. McCaw > Cane (this is actually very close based on form in those years, although Cane undid his great play with his discipline)
8. Read > Savea
9. Smith 2015 < Smith 2023
10. DC > Mo'unga
11. Savea > Telea
12. Nonu > Barrett
13. Smith > Ioane
14. Milner Skudder < Jordan
15. Smith > Barrett (at playing fullback)
16. Mealamu > Taukieaho
17. Franks =< Williams
18. Faumuina >= Laulala (although Laulala had parity with Boks bomb sqd scrum, so I might be harsh there)
19. Vito < Whitelock
20. Cane > Papalii
21. TKB > Christie
22. Barret =< Mckenzie (very close)
23. SBW > ALB
Can't tell me NZ hasn't dropped off since 2015.
You are not right on that one buddy
Thanks for the comment. Buddy.