What I liked about the bracelet on the right was that it seemed more consistent throughout the links. It also had a more seamless sheen while moving though the light. Just looked like a higher quality in my opinion.
I guessed the left was San Martin. Not for the brushing, but for the tightness of the links to each other. The bracelet on the right had similar brushing, but I could tell that the tolerances were not as good as the bracelet on the left.
Thanks AJ I agree the finishing is done really well. They said, 300 dollars better than pagani, I’m not sure on that but undeniable it’s the better watch! Thanks for the support pal!!
Thanks mig, I think they would easily be justified in being one hundred dollars plus more than a comparable pagani, but def not 300 more, somewhere in the middle, cannot deny it is a better made watch
I would out my money on the San Martin. QC can be random with PD, but SM seems to be on top of it with what gets sent out to customers. Really nice side by side comparison man! Enjoy that Tudor homage!! 😎🍻🙌
Thanks David! I don’t entirely disagree, it’s interesting that even some watch guys couldn’t tell the difference based on camera shots, however as I mention in video naked eye def catches the quality of a SM over a PD, but I don’t think it’s, in this case, 300 dollars worth more. Being a newer release this one is at its highest price point, I’ve seen other SM’s for 250 or so, and that is a good price for sure if quality is similar to this one
Hello! Thanks for this video. I own the Pagani Chrono similar to this one (I read the comments and it seems that you bought one). I was disappointed at first due to the fact that the dial is not really black. More like charcoal or a faded black. I still don’t like that PD keeps including their long name under the logo (they’ve changed this lately, a huge improvement). Anyway, I’ve made my peace (sort of) with that dial as it really is a great watch, everything else is really good. Could you tell me if the San Martin’s dial is black? Real black (not asking for jet black but the closest). I’m not able to appreciate this from the photos or your video and I’m considering buying it. Thank you!
Shortly after I wrote that comment above I realized two things: the dial IS black, it’s just that the glass does not have AR and when it reflects the light it looks milky. Second thing: I found your comparison video with the similar PD and I prefer the PD’s smaller size. Oh and lastly, the Tudor also looks larger than its other 41mm siblings.
Thank you Miguel! Funny, realised that an entire clip I did with the specs/measurements somehow didn’t make it in lol! I appreciate you taking time to check the video our, and dm me with any tips you might have for me to improve the videos, appreciate you man!!
The left has more defined edges and tighter reflections off the brushing. Plus, I could tell it was the San Martin from the more 3d machining of the clasp pusher.
Very interesting seeing these 2 brands side by side. Now me personally I would buy & keep a San Martin but I'm very unlikely to keep a PD in the collection. The question of whether the SM is worth the extra cost compared to the PD really is down to personal preferences & a difficult question to answer but one that could be asked at any price range so I'm kind of tempted now to put the Longines hydroconquest (£1300) up against the Tudor black bay (£3000) & I wouldn't mind betting that the result would be similar & difficult to separate the 2 pieces quality wise. But this was a great video very well presented mate 👍👍
Almost forgot chronograph seconds hand don't hack while they're running if there is a running seconds subdial that will hack but the chronograph seconds counter will keep running
@@somewhereintimewatchreviews thanks Adrian and yeah that would be interesting to compare longinea to the Tudor and my point I think stands, esp whilst considering Ali express brands as opposed to Swiss where movements play a bigger factor. I honestly don’t think the San Martin is 300 dollars better than a pagani. Could be taken both ways though, pagani could decide to start charging 250 plus for their watches and that is likely not far away, but they have much to improve upon other than the fit and finish to justify that. Thanks for watching and for all the support my friend!!
Very good video Chris and I must confess I couldn’t tell which was which but under macro I’m sure all would of become clear 😂 For me what it comes down to is; I’d keep a San Martin and I doubt I’d ever keep a Pagani Design as the quality in general is night and day. Although SM need to start being careful as many of their pieces have become more and more expensive, I know they have released a more ‘budget’ range but generally they really are getting more expensive then what I feel comfortable spending on AliExpress. Great work my man 👍👍
Thanks Simon, and I do think it’s hard to decipher the diff in quality with looking at a camera lens vs the naked eye, but I still feel that while the San Martin is definitely better quality, it isn’t to the degree that the price is that much more than a pagani. Thanks for the support as always m8!
@@jesuspadilla8814 it’s an aliexpress watch, I would caution in doing so as I don’t think they are reliable for water resistance. You should be ok as long as the pushers are screw down and the crown but even then it’s a gamble with these or any from aliexpress to be honest
In my haste to edit the video I forgot to put include basic specs of the watch: Case size 41mm, 44 from end of pushers to opposite side of case, 46 from 9 to crown Lug to lug 49.5mm Lug width 20 mm Case thickness 13.8mm
Yeah I’ve had my eye on a sugess for a long time esp since they have the display caseback! One of these days I’ll grab one I really dig their new zenith el primera homage
Is San Martin really worth $300 more to buy than a Pagani Design? Let me know what you guys think? Did anyone pick out the better finishing from the pics/video before the reveal? Would love to hear your thoughts! Giveaway very soon at 750 subs, so please consider subscribing if you haven't yet already.
in my personal opinin a value for money criteria is not something what gave a lot of people satisfaction in a long term. At first i bought 3 watches from pagani design and these wathces were really good for the money but after a few weeks of using it i realised it wasnt quite what i was expecting. After that i bought san martin, felt their quality and understood that i could sell 3 pagani design to buy another san martin. Now i have 3 watches from san martin and im absolutely in love in them. In my opinion it is better to have 3 really good watches than 12 average ones but of course it depands on what you really wants. Good video, good luck
Thanks Pawel, great points. The pagani I compared the San Martin too was one of their 2021 models and I found it (and still do) to be excellent. Did you have three of their older watches? They are getting better. Not near as good as San Martin though, freely admit that, however in this particular case I don’t think 300 dollars worth better. Undeniably fantastic watch by San Martin though and it is one of my favourites
@@MirrlyonTime i sold pd-1639 and pd-1651 but kept pagani pd-1644 daytona hommage and im still very satisfied. Currently im wondering to buy a new daytona pd-1676. Of course i totaly agree that san martin although is better quality, objectively is not worth 3x of the pagani price. For me it is just easier to develope lets say "connection" with a better watch than with better value for money watch. Having said that, have to admit that pagani is probably the best value for money
From the images the one on the left just has more uniform brushing and looks cleaner, the other looked good but wasn't as nice in terms of finish. Its honestly not a huge difference, but there is a difference. Is it worth paying all that extra for though? Nice job with the video mate
Thanks Wes. The diff is even more noticeable with the naked eye. Undeniable SM is better in quality, but I really don’t believe, in this case, that 300 dollars more is justifiable. Thanks for watching and for your support m8!
It's hard to see these things from non-magnified pictures. Usually you can feel the better bracelet, especially if it has a diver’s extension. Some of the cheaper bracelets are really stiff & might have screws that are unremovable. The Pagani Design GMT-Master II homage has a 120 click unidirectional, aluminium bezel. The San Martin & Cronos GMT-Master II has a 24 click bi-directional two-tone ceramic bezel. The Pagani Design uses a DG5833GMT I’m guessing is a 21800 bph movement & the slave GMT hand can’t be adjusted by 1 hour increments, the Cronos & San Martin uses a Hangzhou 6460 which is a 28800 bph movement & the slave hand is adjusted by 1 hour increments. The lume is better on both Cronos & San Martin, than on the Pagani Design. It doesn’t sound like a lot. But the movement, ceramic bezel & lume is what you’re paying more for. It’s not fair to compare different models, because you can’t make a fair comparison.
True Jay, I had to deal with what I had in hand. Fit and finish is much better on the San Martin for sure. The main question I was hoping to answer is it 300 dollars better. Thanks for your insight m8!
I just bought the PD 1718...BB58 PANDA. For $80 it's far better than expected. Sapphire crysaland ceramic bezel. The VK63 runs fine. This is a 24hr dial which is useless to me and 60 min sub. Pushers are solid crown is smooth NOT LIke a TUDORof course. My only issue is lack of a running seconds hand. The finish is nice but just one direction.
Thanks for the review... I'm really interested in getting the same San martin. But a bit worried about the quality. I had experience with pagani... Absolute rubbish bracelet.. Rattle a lot, sharp edges not smooth, and mine break at the clasp after just 2 weeks used. Is the San Martin better? Any sharp edges? Pagani clasp is also harder to unlock at the edge...it look like San martin has better clasp.
Orang, you will not be disappointed with San Martin, the finishing is excellent and rivals many entry level Swiss luxury watches, some think just as good as brands like Tissot or Hamilton for example with the finishing and I can concur. No sharp edges anywhere and the clasp is perfection, truly, it’s a bit more money but it does not disappoint
I guessed wrong. Thanks for the video. I am not a chrono guy, but I do have the Pierre Paulin Chrono with moon phase (because every watch collector needs a chrono) It is very cool 6 hander with a moon phase complication and a blue dial. My Wife wears it as it is a 38mm piece and I find it small. She likes it.
Thanks for watching Bill. I do think the finishing on both watches is good, San Martin is better (naked eye catches it more) but I’m not convinced the extra 300 dollars is justified in comparison, but a greed watch for sure
@@BCallum a chronograph? Haven’t had a Phylida yet so will have to keep my eye out for them for sure…..I have a couple watches (brand name) that I’m hoping to get that I need to save some loonies for haha
Try buying a watch in the high street that matches the specs and quality of finishing that the San Martin offers and you will find out what an absolute bargain it is. Love your reviews.
Thanks m8 and yes I have heard the same from several other people, the finishing on this one is really second to none. Thanks for watching, please subscribe and God bless m8!
The Tudor has an aluminum bezel insert I prefer the ceramic on the San Martin, more durability for sure. I don't find the San Martin better than the Steinhart's I have though. I find the San Martin sharp on the end of the lugs, and edges of the bracelet links.
Very interesting! This one (because I just checked) def has some sharp edges at the lugs which I would have noticed if I had of removed the bracelet…..so thanks!! And Steinhart is another brand that I have to get my hands on for sure. Thanks Chris!
Yes the looseness of the links (note how the tolerances left to right are different between the links) these betray the pagani design bracelets everytime, as do the male end links. You want a real difference, check out the Dandong movement on that GMT Pagani. It is absolute junk and is known to have problems with the hands skipping when one sets the hands, also the ST19 movements that I have all work under 10 seconds +/- per day. Please regulate the ST19 movement! Sorry, but I’ve owned both.
There is a way to set those pagani gmts without the hands skipping forward, a little trick that I have figured out re watches with that movement (I have two of them). My ST19 is running at -21 seconds per day and the pagani gmt movement is running about the same at -18 seconds per day. I am going to do a follow up video to this one soon as I have purchased and received pagani’s Tudor bb chrono homage, so will be interesting to see how it compares to the San Martin :) Thanks for watching, and for your insight please subscribe and God bless m8!
Hi Steve, yep, however at the time of filming the pagani version wasn’t out yet so I plan to do an updated comparison at some point as I have the pagani version now. Thanks m8!
Hey Chris, the first picture gave it away imho. You could really see in that one the finer brushing and the more delicate looking cross section on the links. I honestly think that San Martin make great watches from a technical perspective and usually their qc is among the best from AliEx. However I think with their prices they are encroaching on a completely different side of the market that starts to include stuff like Zelos and Steinhart and other cool microbrands and even some historically relevant Swiss brands like Hamilton or Tissot. I truly think that if they start moving a bit more away from the general AliEx philosophy of making mostly homages and shipping them almost exclusively from China (which they are kind of timidly doing and have been doing with their own designs more or less) they can make their name as a microbrand. By the way the numbers on the ST19 movement on the app sound pretty bad although not really out of spec afaik, but check the timing on the wrist. Did you check other watches on the app? Maybe it's not that accurate.
Thanks Andrei! Yea I did a rather large sample of watches using the app, and I found the app quite accurate over a test sample of watches, at least as far as the plus/minus seconds per day, obviously the beat error can’t be judged but the other was actually quite accurate over a half dozen other watches
@@MirrlyonTime Oh then it seems you got a rather unfortunate example of the ST19. Afaik these are not factory regulated in general. I have one in a dressier version of the 1963 and it's running very nicely at around +9/+11s day. Maybe you can pop the caseback and regulate yours? Or a local watchmaker can do it for less than 20 bucks I would assume.
@@AnCar88 I’m not sure if this one has the gooseneck regulator or not? And it would have to go to a jeweller as I don’t have the tools to take off the style of caseback this one has.
@@MirrlyonTime Oh this has the Rolex style caseback I guess? You can use a squishy grippy ball to unscrew those I think, although I've never tried it. But yeah just take it to your local watchmaker if it averages -30s/day on wrist. I'd assume this does not have the gooseneck regulator anyways (as most ST19 don't afaik) and the movement is notorious for needing very small budges of the regulation arm for huge rate changes :)
I Feel like if you could easily market San Martin watch’s for £1000 and people would still buy. PD couldn’t do that In it’s current state. San Martin has mastered making bracelets 80% of watch brand’s make bad bracelets. San Martin is clearly getting better at watch making year over year. PD should probably invest in a better facility it shows.
only my opinion but san martin and steeldive seemed up until recently had an infinity with each ,but lately san martin pulled away and seemed to increase prices i personally think steeldive is better value for money with Pagani getting better this year with their sometimes hit or miss on quality control . just my opinion .
Interesting Victor! Just today I saw the price of this San Martin and it is up 25 plus dollars what it was when I bought it this past November. Pagani is getting better but they usually have at least one minor issue. Steeldive is quite good, out of the three I think value for dollar spent would go to the Steeldive, esp because of the lume. Pagani ups there game there and doesn’t hike up price too much and they’ll be back in the game if not on top for value for dollar spent. Thanks for sharing, please subscribe, and God bless m8!
Don’t disagree Perry. SM make better watches, based on this one, and others I’ve seen second hand, but not 300 dollars better imo. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Dude I've owned 3 Pagani's (PD 1661, 2× 1644s) and all of them had QC issues. San Martin is head and shoulders above pagani, it ain't even a comparisson. There is no way you've owned one to come up with that conclusion.
@@MirrlyonTime the seagull 1963, with the same movement, is 150$, one of the most sold watches on Aliexpress. But the seagull doesn't have a stainless steel bracelet, 200m water resistance, ceramic bezel, AR coating, lume. So I disagree, it justifies it's 300$ price tag.
@@Godotlv5000 thanks Godot not contesting it’s a better watch, I don’t think it’s 300 dollars better, not in this case with the watch I have. Thanks for chiming in m8!
I love SM quality i have Cartier Roadster and Rolex Cellini and the quality of sm is equal to these for several thousands less after discovering sm i kind feel i over paid for my Rolex and Cartier and i love those watches there all in the same watch winders together with my Oris and tessot diver seastar 1000 80 hr power reserve kicks Rolex and Cartier ass in that way 👍so it's not always what you pay to get great quality
lol Miami, pagani is a car as well so even that name is trademarked, and design, you are right on, but the watches are great value for dollar spent and then newer ones like the one I am getting soon just has the logo on the dial and not the words. Thanks for watching m8 and please subscribe
Diff movement, I was not focusing my comparison on that, but I hear ya, you will have to look up the updated video I did comparing the pagani homage of the same watch to this one. There is more to a watch than just the movement, respectfully. Thanks m8
Ha that’s the pagani. Tough to judge on the camera tbh but with the naked eye the finishing on the San Martin is noticeably diff/better. 300 dollars more? Not convinced of that in comparison to the newer pagani releases
Lol Rico, I highly doubt that, I have one coming in for comparison but I’ve already seen it reviewed. It is definitely inferior, we’ll see how much soon.
@@MirrlyonTime that's why I put "IMO". You'll find out when your unit arrives. Make sure it's the newer version, without the anchor etched at the back.
@@ricoswabe18 not sure what I’m getting Rico pretty sure it’s 2022 version. It might surprise me, I don’t think it will be better quality than the San Martin but I can see it being the better deal. Time will tell, mine should arrive in a week or so
Good observation, stay tuned because I have paganis version of the actual San Martin watch so a proper head to head will be coming. Thanks for watching, please subscribe, and God bless m8!
I would rather buy seiko & I can buy a nice seiko diver's watch or a seiko presage watch the price of san martin.. But my money is well spent on a pagani design watch that is why I have 3 pagani design & very happy with it... Pagani is now my favorite brand than may seikos... san martin is so proud of their watch they overpriced them so much... I remember few year back when I bought a san mating 62mas homage for only about 170 bucks.. but now it is almost double the price.. I sold my san martin because seiko brand is not woth to homage... I only buy homage of rolex, tudor & other swiss known brands.. but not seiko because I can afford the original seiko watch...
In light of my giveaway in which I am giving away this watch, I am going to do a video comparing the pig any design of the same homage with this one and I agree, 100% with you. I have one San Martin in my collection now after I give this one away and I won’t buy another one. Thanks for watching Thomas please subscribe and God bless you m8!
Most of the comments here pretty much sums up to this youtube video ua-cam.com/video/3l5Cxv-boPc/v-deo.html Seriously though, the question is not is San Martin watch worth a couple hundred dollars more than pagani design. The question should be, is there a watch brand that offers equal or better quality than San Martin at a lower price. I think the answer is no. Thats what the value is at then gentlemen.
Good point. I am getting the pagani version of this same watch so we will get to see how they compare fit and finish wise. The pagani comes with a Seiko mecaquartz movement but it will be interesting to see how they do finishing wise. From the pictures online it looks like they have done a good job with this one
I have returned all of my PD watches back to Amazon after I find out how crappy inside of these watches are running. Along with horrible wobbly fit of the bezels etc.. just buy San Martin. There is a reason why low budget watch enthusiasts are praising SM. (Only if the price is less than $300 thou)
I agree around 300 is a good price point on SM the newer paganis are much better, bezel action is good on them. I do enjoy my paganis very few issues with them overall still good value for dollar spent. Thanks for watching, please subscribe and God bless m8!
That’s ok Dan, I have the actual Pagani design homage to the exact same watch coming in, they are getting better with their qc and fit and finish, so this will be an interesting comparison, the finishing on the explorer ii homage that I used in this video is excellent in fact I am releasing a review on that watch soon that I feel is def one of pagani’s best ones. The San Martin will not disappoint, the white face will look fantastic I’m sure (that’s the one I got by pagani :) thanks for watching m8, God bless!
I quest right but there is not a lot in it u can see just a little bit better finishing but not worth £300 pound more in my opinion oh yea by the way I do own both watches in different model’s
Thank you Paul, I tend to agree with you, I think there is unquestionably better quality all around with San Martin, but not 300 dollars worth more. I have the panda version of this homage in a pagani design, so a proper head to head comparison is coming soon. I think this watch is properly priced no higher than 325 bucks, should be around 300 I think
I have a San Martin and the bracelet is still not great. I have a pagani so I’m sure I will not be super thrilled about tgat bracelet either. I think the money is going to the head of the watch
You make a valid point there m8, my San Martin bracelet had a couple stiff links near the watch head that worked themselves out and the SM bracelets and clasps are def far better than the pagani design bracelets for the most part, some of their bracelets are good. Thanks for watching and giving feedback, please subscribe and God bless m8!
You aren't the only one, but to be fair, the camera doesn't quite do the same as the naked eye does so to speak, the finishing on the San Martin is definitely better, and I will do a proper comparison soon since I have the pagani version now as well. Thanks for watching!
Ha Keinan you aren’t the only one. Pagani finishing is def getting better, I’m going to do another video soon comparing the San Martin to pagani version of the same homage, as pagani didn’t release one til after this video was made. Thanks for watching m8
no, definitely not - theres is a little plus in outer appearance but San Matin use to have inner lacks. Both of my SM using the PT5000 went defective within weeks after a few times of usage. Expensive crap out my experience. I dont look at my watches, I want to wear and use them. Their plus - they have a for Europeans catchy brand name. Also Pagani has problems with the "diver extensions" of their clasp. But a more creeping hand is not worth double of triple of the price. What I'm really positively exited about ist the Heritage SN052 - even if handwinded, this is a very good watch using a very precise and reliable movement. Also this has some lack at the screws of the bracement. These are not well fitted and inaccurate made. - so a big no from my side - personally dont buy SM any any more.
Thanks for your insights uwe. I tend to agree, though this is my first San Martin I can’t speak to their reliability as a brand overall, but I can definitely say the fit and finish of this watch that I do have is amazing, definitely better than the pagani…..but I don’t think 300 dollars better, not convinced. I would see this watch priced around 100 dollars cheaper to be a proper deal imo, worth 150-200 more with over all quality and finish, but def not 300 more. Thanks for chiming in m8 I appreciate it, God bless! Oh, what models of San Martin did you buy?
@@MirrlyonTime both I'm very disappointed about are the really good looking BB58 homages. The black one had out the box problems to screw the crown back - also winding has a very strong resistance. Out the box with malfunction was the blue BB58 homage. The rotor is attached to the crown mechanism. If you wind it up it rotates very fast and noisy inside. Even if you screw the crown back it also rotates. A pity - both movements work very accurate at +0 /+2 and outside quality is stunning. But if you own +/- 100 watches you need to give them a jumpstart taking out the box to wear.
the blue will go back to SM for refund. May be I'll order a blue one using a Selita 200 some time or propably the black BB chrono using the handwinded 1901. The white one is one of my most favorite watches at the moment.
@@uwe5935 Ugh, must feel bad, I'm sorry for you. I really wanted the bb58 homage, my plan was to buy it on the 11.11 sale, but I've seen a lot of complaints about the crown on this model. I bought the 39mm Explorer instead, which is a fantastic watch.
Purchase this watch (affiliate link): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_Dltpqkn
What I liked about the bracelet on the right was that it seemed more consistent throughout the links. It also had a more seamless sheen while moving though the light. Just looked like a higher quality in my opinion.
SHORT ANSWER ---- YES.
I guessed the left was San Martin. Not for the brushing, but for the tightness of the links to each other. The bracelet on the right had similar brushing, but I could tell that the tolerances were not as good as the bracelet on the left.
Good eye! Thanks for watching and if you haven’t done so yet please subscribe
I have had both in hand and San Martin has better finishing than most watches I’ve seen under 500.
Thanks AJ I agree the finishing is done really well. They said, 300 dollars better than pagani, I’m not sure on that but undeniable it’s the better watch! Thanks for the support pal!!
I agree with you, there is no doubt San Martin manufacture prime quality watches, however in my opinion they overpriced their products unnecessarily.
Thanks mig, I think they would easily be justified in being one hundred dollars plus more than a comparable pagani, but def not 300 more, somewhere in the middle, cannot deny it is a better made watch
I would out my money on the San Martin. QC can be random with PD, but SM seems to be on top of it with what gets sent out to customers. Really nice side by side comparison man! Enjoy that Tudor homage!! 😎🍻🙌
Thanks David! I don’t entirely disagree, it’s interesting that even some watch guys couldn’t tell the difference based on camera shots, however as I mention in video naked eye def catches the quality of a SM over a PD, but I don’t think it’s, in this case, 300 dollars worth more. Being a newer release this one is at its highest price point, I’ve seen other SM’s for 250 or so, and that is a good price for sure if quality is similar to this one
Take a look at a San Martin SN019. The quality of the case and bracelet is amazing, the bezel clicks will blow you away.
Hello! Thanks for this video. I own the Pagani Chrono similar to this one (I read the comments and it seems that you bought one). I was disappointed at first due to the fact that the dial is not really black. More like charcoal or a faded black. I still don’t like that PD keeps including their long name under the logo (they’ve changed this lately, a huge improvement). Anyway, I’ve made my peace (sort of) with that dial as it really is a great watch, everything else is really good. Could you tell me if the San Martin’s dial is black? Real black (not asking for jet black but the closest). I’m not able to appreciate this from the photos or your video and I’m considering buying it. Thank you!
Shortly after I wrote that comment above I realized two things: the dial IS black, it’s just that the glass does not have AR and when it reflects the light it looks milky. Second thing: I found your comparison video with the similar PD and I prefer the PD’s smaller size. Oh and lastly, the Tudor also looks larger than its other 41mm siblings.
Bracelet: YEAH, BABY! 🥳
Keep up the great work my friend 👏
Thank you Miguel! Funny, realised that an entire clip I did with the specs/measurements somehow didn’t make it in lol! I appreciate you taking time to check the video our, and dm me with any tips you might have for me to improve the videos, appreciate you man!!
@@MirrlyonTime ❤️
The left has more defined edges and tighter reflections off the brushing. Plus, I could tell it was the San Martin from the more 3d machining of the clasp pusher.
Good eye Kev!!
Very interesting seeing these 2 brands side by side. Now me personally I would buy & keep a San Martin but I'm very unlikely to keep a PD in the collection. The question of whether the SM is worth the extra cost compared to the PD really is down to personal preferences & a difficult question to answer but one that could be asked at any price range so I'm kind of tempted now to put the Longines hydroconquest (£1300) up against the Tudor black bay (£3000) & I wouldn't mind betting that the result would be similar & difficult to separate the 2 pieces quality wise.
But this was a great video very well presented mate 👍👍
Almost forgot chronograph seconds hand don't hack while they're running if there is a running seconds subdial that will hack but the chronograph seconds counter will keep running
@@somewhereintimewatchreviews thanks Adrian and yeah that would be interesting to compare longinea to the Tudor and my point I think stands, esp whilst considering Ali express brands as opposed to Swiss where movements play a bigger factor. I honestly don’t think the San Martin is 300 dollars better than a pagani. Could be taken both ways though, pagani could decide to start charging 250 plus for their watches and that is likely not far away, but they have much to improve upon other than the fit and finish to justify that. Thanks for watching and for all the support my friend!!
Very good video Chris and I must confess I couldn’t tell which was which but under macro I’m sure all would of become clear 😂
For me what it comes down to is; I’d keep a San Martin and I doubt I’d ever keep a Pagani Design as the quality in general is night and day.
Although SM need to start being careful as many of their pieces have become more and more expensive, I know they have released a more ‘budget’ range but generally they really are getting more expensive then what I feel comfortable spending on AliExpress.
Great work my man 👍👍
Thanks Simon, and I do think it’s hard to decipher the diff in quality with looking at a camera lens vs the naked eye, but I still feel that while the San Martin is definitely better quality, it isn’t to the degree that the price is that much more than a pagani. Thanks for the support as always m8!
Can I use this San Martin to swim? I just got this beautiful time piece and I’d like to use it everyday, every time without taking it off.
@@jesuspadilla8814 it’s an aliexpress watch, I would caution in doing so as I don’t think they are reliable for water resistance. You should be ok as long as the pushers are screw down and the crown but even then it’s a gamble with these or any from aliexpress to be honest
Good buy if they are priced at $280?
Yes San Martin make excellent watches
In my haste to edit the video I forgot to put include basic specs of the watch:
Case size 41mm, 44 from end of pushers to opposite side of case, 46 from 9 to crown
Lug to lug 49.5mm
Lug width 20 mm
Case thickness 13.8mm
A comparison against.the sugess would be nice..great review!
Yeah I’ve had my eye on a sugess for a long time esp since they have the display caseback! One of these days I’ll grab one I really dig their new zenith el primera homage
Great to hear!!
@@jorgeshss thanks m8
And please subscribe to the channel if you haven’t done so yet :)
Is San Martin really worth $300 more to buy than a Pagani Design? Let me know what you guys think? Did anyone pick out the better finishing from the pics/video before the reveal? Would love to hear your thoughts! Giveaway very soon at 750 subs, so please consider subscribing if you haven't yet already.
in my personal opinin a value for money criteria is not something what gave a lot of people satisfaction in a long term. At first i bought 3 watches from pagani design and these wathces were really good for the money but after a few weeks of using it i realised it wasnt quite what i was expecting. After that i bought san martin, felt their quality and understood that i could sell 3 pagani design to buy another san martin. Now i have 3 watches from san martin and im absolutely in love in them. In my opinion it is better to have 3 really good watches than 12 average ones but of course it depands on what you really wants. Good video, good luck
Thanks Pawel, great points. The pagani I compared the San Martin too was one of their 2021 models and I found it (and still do) to be excellent. Did you have three of their older watches? They are getting better. Not near as good as San Martin though, freely admit that, however in this particular case I don’t think 300 dollars worth better. Undeniably fantastic watch by San Martin though and it is one of my favourites
@@MirrlyonTime i sold pd-1639 and pd-1651 but kept pagani pd-1644 daytona hommage and im still very satisfied. Currently im wondering to buy a new daytona pd-1676. Of course i totaly agree that san martin although is better quality, objectively is not worth 3x of the pagani price. For me it is just easier to develope lets say "connection" with a better watch than with better value for money watch. Having said that, have to admit that pagani is probably the best value for money
From the images the one on the left just has more uniform brushing and looks cleaner, the other looked good but wasn't as nice in terms of finish. Its honestly not a huge difference, but there is a difference. Is it worth paying all that extra for though? Nice job with the video mate
Thanks Wes. The diff is even more noticeable with the naked eye. Undeniable SM is better in quality, but I really don’t believe, in this case, that 300 dollars more is justifiable. Thanks for watching and for your support m8!
Great comparison Chris. Thanks for sharing. SM is a better option. Love the explorer version.
Thanks Hector. What’s your opinion on the cost
It's hard to see these things from non-magnified pictures. Usually you can feel the better bracelet, especially if it has a diver’s extension. Some of the cheaper bracelets are really stiff & might have screws that are unremovable. The Pagani Design GMT-Master II homage has a 120 click unidirectional, aluminium bezel. The San Martin & Cronos GMT-Master II has a 24 click bi-directional two-tone ceramic bezel.
The Pagani Design uses a DG5833GMT I’m guessing is a 21800 bph movement & the slave GMT hand can’t be adjusted by 1 hour increments, the Cronos & San Martin uses a Hangzhou 6460 which is a 28800 bph movement & the slave hand is adjusted by 1 hour increments.
The lume is better on both Cronos & San Martin, than on the Pagani Design.
It doesn’t sound like a lot. But the movement, ceramic bezel & lume is what you’re paying more for. It’s not fair to compare different models, because you can’t make a fair comparison.
True Jay, I had to deal with what I had in hand. Fit and finish is much better on the San Martin for sure. The main question I was hoping to answer is it 300 dollars better. Thanks for your insight m8!
I just bought the PD 1718...BB58 PANDA. For $80 it's far better than expected. Sapphire crysaland ceramic bezel. The VK63 runs fine. This is a 24hr dial which is useless to me and 60 min sub. Pushers are solid crown is smooth NOT LIke a TUDORof course. My only issue is lack of a running seconds hand. The finish is nice but just one direction.
Yes I have the panda version of that pagani and will be doing a comparison to the San Martin at some point. The PD is a solid watch
Excellent analysis
Thanks Whit, glad you enjoyed the video :)
Thanks for the review... I'm really interested in getting the same San martin. But a bit worried about the quality. I had experience with pagani... Absolute rubbish bracelet.. Rattle a lot, sharp edges not smooth, and mine break at the clasp after just 2 weeks used. Is the San Martin better? Any sharp edges? Pagani clasp is also harder to unlock at the edge...it look like San martin has better clasp.
Orang, you will not be disappointed with San Martin, the finishing is excellent and rivals many entry level Swiss luxury watches, some think just as good as brands like Tissot or Hamilton for example with the finishing and I can concur. No sharp edges anywhere and the clasp is perfection, truly, it’s a bit more money but it does not disappoint
Agree..Pagani is absolute rubbish but San Martin no. I have one and quality finish is great
I guessed wrong. Thanks for the video. I am not a chrono guy, but I do have the Pierre Paulin Chrono with moon phase (because every watch collector needs a chrono) It is very cool 6 hander with a moon phase complication and a blue dial. My Wife wears it as it is a 38mm piece and I find it small. She likes it.
Thanks for watching Bill. I do think the finishing on both watches is good, San Martin is better (naked eye catches it more) but I’m not convinced the extra 300 dollars is justified in comparison, but a greed watch for sure
@@MirrlyonTime but, you are comparing apples to oranges. What would PD ask for a auto or manual wind Chrono?
@@BCallum good point Bill, They haven’t done one quite yet, but based on their current offerings I would imagine around 185 dollars to start?
@@MirrlyonTime Phylida sells one every once in a while, right around 200. This is truly the one to get. ST19 as well.
@@BCallum a chronograph? Haven’t had a Phylida yet so will have to keep my eye out for them for sure…..I have a couple watches (brand name) that I’m hoping to get that I need to save some loonies for haha
Try buying a watch in the high street that matches the specs and quality of finishing that the San Martin offers and you will find out what an absolute bargain it is. Love your reviews.
Thanks m8 and yes I have heard the same from several other people, the finishing on this one is really second to none. Thanks for watching, please subscribe and God bless m8!
The Tudor has an aluminum bezel insert I prefer the ceramic on the San Martin, more durability for sure. I don't find the San Martin better than the Steinhart's I have though. I find the San Martin sharp on the end of the lugs, and edges of the bracelet links.
Very interesting! This one (because I just checked) def has some sharp edges at the lugs which I would have noticed if I had of removed the bracelet…..so thanks!! And Steinhart is another brand that I have to get my hands on for sure. Thanks Chris!
Yes the looseness of the links (note how the tolerances left to right are different between the links) these betray the pagani design bracelets everytime, as do the male end links. You want a real difference, check out the Dandong movement on that GMT Pagani. It is absolute junk and is known to have problems with the hands skipping when one sets the hands, also the ST19 movements that I have all work under 10 seconds +/- per day. Please regulate the ST19 movement! Sorry, but I’ve owned both.
There is a way to set those pagani gmts without the hands skipping forward, a little trick that I have figured out re watches with that movement (I have two of them). My ST19 is running at -21 seconds per day and the pagani gmt movement is running about the same at -18 seconds per day.
I am going to do a follow up video to this one soon as I have purchased and received pagani’s Tudor bb chrono homage, so will be interesting to see how it compares to the San Martin :)
Thanks for watching, and for your insight please subscribe and God bless m8!
Just paid $204.68 for the San Martin during the sale.
Is that USD? Or 🇬🇧?
@@MirrlyonTime USD
@@csigouin1 that’s a good deal for sure
@@MirrlyonTime price is now back up to $360ish on the official San Martin Ali store.
@@csigouin1 wow! You got er at the right time m8!
I do like the clasp on the San Martin better.
Bracelet: i like the one on the right.
Would have been a better comparison if you did the pagani bb crono homage
Hi Steve, yep, however at the time of filming the pagani version wasn’t out yet so I plan to do an updated comparison at some point as I have the pagani version now. Thanks m8!
Hey Chris, the first picture gave it away imho. You could really see in that one the finer brushing and the more delicate looking cross section on the links. I honestly think that San Martin make great watches from a technical perspective and usually their qc is among the best from AliEx. However I think with their prices they are encroaching on a completely different side of the market that starts to include stuff like Zelos and Steinhart and other cool microbrands and even some historically relevant Swiss brands like Hamilton or Tissot. I truly think that if they start moving a bit more away from the general AliEx philosophy of making mostly homages and shipping them almost exclusively from China (which they are kind of timidly doing and have been doing with their own designs more or less) they can make their name as a microbrand. By the way the numbers on the ST19 movement on the app sound pretty bad although not really out of spec afaik, but check the timing on the wrist. Did you check other watches on the app? Maybe it's not that accurate.
Thanks Andrei! Yea I did a rather large sample of watches using the app, and I found the app quite accurate over a test sample of watches, at least as far as the plus/minus seconds per day, obviously the beat error can’t be judged but the other was actually quite accurate over a half dozen other watches
@@MirrlyonTime Oh then it seems you got a rather unfortunate example of the ST19. Afaik these are not factory regulated in general. I have one in a dressier version of the 1963 and it's running very nicely at around +9/+11s day. Maybe you can pop the caseback and regulate yours? Or a local watchmaker can do it for less than 20 bucks I would assume.
@@AnCar88 I’m not sure if this one has the gooseneck regulator or not? And it would have to go to a jeweller as I don’t have the tools to take off the style of caseback this one has.
@@MirrlyonTime Oh this has the Rolex style caseback I guess? You can use a squishy grippy ball to unscrew those I think, although I've never tried it. But yeah just take it to your local watchmaker if it averages -30s/day on wrist. I'd assume this does not have the gooseneck regulator anyways (as most ST19 don't afaik) and the movement is notorious for needing very small budges of the regulation arm for huge rate changes :)
I Feel like if you could easily market San Martin watch’s for £1000 and people would still buy. PD couldn’t do that In it’s current state. San Martin has mastered making bracelets 80% of watch brand’s make bad bracelets. San Martin is clearly getting better at watch making year over year. PD should probably invest in a better facility it shows.
I paused at 2:00 minutes- the one on the right side.
only my opinion but san martin and steeldive seemed up until recently had an infinity with each ,but lately san martin pulled away and seemed to increase prices i personally think steeldive is better value for money with Pagani getting better this year with their sometimes hit or miss on quality control . just my opinion .
Interesting Victor! Just today I saw the price of this San Martin and it is up 25 plus dollars what it was when I bought it this past November. Pagani is getting better but they usually have at least one minor issue. Steeldive is quite good, out of the three I think value for dollar spent would go to the Steeldive, esp because of the lume. Pagani ups there game there and doesn’t hike up price too much and they’ll be back in the game if not on top for value for dollar spent.
Thanks for sharing, please subscribe, and God bless m8!
The simple answer is no!!
Anybody with a San Martin will obviously say yes!!.
Simply because they don't want to believe they have been ripped off!!
Don’t disagree Perry. SM make better watches, based on this one, and others I’ve seen second hand, but not 300 dollars better imo. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Dude I've owned 3 Pagani's (PD 1661, 2× 1644s) and all of them had QC issues. San Martin is head and shoulders above pagani, it ain't even a comparisson. There is no way you've owned one to come up with that conclusion.
@@MirrlyonTime the seagull 1963, with the same movement, is 150$, one of the most sold watches on Aliexpress. But the seagull doesn't have a stainless steel bracelet, 200m water resistance, ceramic bezel, AR coating, lume.
So I disagree, it justifies it's 300$ price tag.
@@Godotlv5000 thanks Godot not contesting it’s a better watch, I don’t think it’s 300 dollars better, not in this case with the watch I have. Thanks for chiming in m8!
I love SM quality i have Cartier Roadster and Rolex Cellini and the quality of sm is equal to these for several thousands less after discovering sm i kind feel i over paid for my Rolex and Cartier and i love those watches there all in the same watch winders together with my Oris and tessot diver seastar 1000 80 hr power reserve kicks Rolex and Cartier ass in that way 👍so it's not always what you pay to get great quality
why in the world would they name them selves pagani design ? they do no design and pagani wtf ?
lol Miami, pagani is a car as well so even that name is trademarked, and design, you are right on, but the watches are great value for dollar spent and then newer ones like the one I am getting soon just has the logo on the dial and not the words. Thanks for watching m8 and please subscribe
Yes yes and yes it worth more to me always
Can't really compare this watch to the pagani equivalent as its an automatic not a mecca quartz!!!
Diff movement, I was not focusing my comparison on that, but I hear ya, you will have to look up the updated video I did comparing the pagani homage of the same watch to this one. There is more to a watch than just the movement, respectfully. Thanks m8
I think the one on the right looks better
Ha that’s the pagani. Tough to judge on the camera tbh but with the naked eye the finishing on the San Martin is noticeably diff/better. 300 dollars more? Not convinced of that in comparison to the newer pagani releases
Bruh, Manicure! Lol 😂
Love your channel - THANK YOU for the honest and insightful reviews!
Thanks Michael, I do my best and try to keep improving and learning
The $75 Pagani Design PD-1718 is better than this SM BB homage, IMO. You're welcome.
Lol Rico, I highly doubt that, I have one coming in for comparison but I’ve already seen it reviewed. It is definitely inferior, we’ll see how much soon.
@@MirrlyonTime that's why I put "IMO". You'll find out when your unit arrives. Make sure it's the newer version, without the anchor etched at the back.
@@ricoswabe18 not sure what I’m getting Rico pretty sure it’s 2022 version. It might surprise me, I don’t think it will be better quality than the San Martin but I can see it being the better deal. Time will tell, mine should arrive in a week or so
San martin brushing was cleaner, but the pagani end links were better fitted.
Good observation, stay tuned because I have paganis version of the actual San Martin watch so a proper head to head will be coming. Thanks for watching, please subscribe, and God bless m8!
Left…still watching
Actually I did recognize the left to be San Martin👍
Good catch!!
I would rather buy seiko & I can buy a nice seiko diver's watch or a seiko presage watch the price of san martin.. But my money is well spent on a pagani design watch that is why I have 3 pagani design & very happy with it... Pagani is now my favorite brand than may seikos... san martin is so proud of their watch they overpriced them so much... I remember few year back when I bought a san mating 62mas homage for only about 170 bucks.. but now it is almost double the price.. I sold my san martin because seiko brand is not woth to homage... I only buy homage of rolex, tudor & other swiss known brands.. but not seiko because I can afford the original seiko watch...
In light of my giveaway in which I am giving away this watch, I am going to do a video comparing the pig any design of the same homage with this one and I agree, 100% with you. I have one San Martin in my collection now after I give this one away and I won’t buy another one. Thanks for watching Thomas please subscribe and God bless you m8!
Right
Just started watching, however, my prediction: Heck No! 😜
HUNDREDS more for a 100m rating?!?! No thank you.
Most of the comments here pretty much sums up to this youtube video ua-cam.com/video/3l5Cxv-boPc/v-deo.html
Seriously though, the question is not is San Martin watch worth a couple hundred dollars more than pagani design. The question should be, is there a watch brand that offers equal or better quality than San Martin at a lower price. I think the answer is no. Thats what the value is at then gentlemen.
Good point. I am getting the pagani version of this same watch so we will get to see how they compare fit and finish wise. The pagani comes with a Seiko mecaquartz movement but it will be interesting to see how they do finishing wise. From the pictures online it looks like they have done a good job with this one
I have returned all of my PD watches back to Amazon after I find out how crappy inside of these watches are running. Along with horrible wobbly fit of the bezels etc.. just buy San Martin. There is a reason why low budget watch enthusiasts are praising SM. (Only if the price is less than $300 thou)
I agree around 300 is a good price point on SM the newer paganis are much better, bezel action is good on them. I do enjoy my paganis very few issues with them overall still good value for dollar spent. Thanks for watching, please subscribe and God bless m8!
I choose the wrong one i love san Martin i just order this watch with white face
That’s ok Dan, I have the actual
Pagani design homage to the exact same watch coming in, they are getting better with their qc and fit and finish, so this will be an interesting comparison, the finishing on the explorer ii homage that I used in this video is excellent in fact I am releasing a review on that watch soon that I feel is def one of pagani’s best ones. The San Martin will not disappoint, the white face will look fantastic I’m sure (that’s the one I got by pagani :) thanks for watching m8, God bless!
I guessed right
Good job m8! Thanks for watching, please subscribe and God bless!
I quest right but there is not a lot in it u can see just a little bit better finishing but not worth £300 pound more in my opinion oh yea by the way I do own both watches in different model’s
Thank you Paul, I tend to agree with you, I think there is unquestionably better quality all around with San Martin, but not 300 dollars worth more. I have the panda version of this homage in a pagani design, so a proper head to head comparison is coming soon. I think this watch is properly priced no higher than 325 bucks, should be around 300 I think
I have a San Martin and the bracelet is still not great. I have a pagani so I’m sure I will not be super thrilled about tgat bracelet either. I think the money is going to the head of the watch
You make a valid point there m8, my San Martin bracelet had a couple stiff links near the watch head that worked themselves out and the SM bracelets and clasps are def far better than the pagani design bracelets for the most part, some of their bracelets are good. Thanks for watching and giving feedback, please subscribe and God bless m8!
I guessed wrong.
You aren't the only one, but to be fair, the camera doesn't quite do the same as the naked eye does so to speak, the finishing on the San Martin is definitely better, and I will do a proper comparison soon since I have the pagani version now as well. Thanks for watching!
And no- I guessed wrong 😆
Ha Keinan you aren’t the only one. Pagani finishing is def getting better, I’m going to do another video soon comparing the San Martin to pagani version of the same homage, as pagani didn’t release one til after this video was made. Thanks for watching m8
On the right
Non-hacking, push pull crown, hundreds more… no thank you again.
Yeah it’s definitely a better made watch but for 300 more I’m not so sure, but can’t deny it’s much better quality, I just don’t think quite that much
The left looks better
Left better
no, definitely not - theres is a little plus in outer appearance but San Matin use to have inner lacks. Both of my SM using the PT5000 went defective within weeks after a few times of usage. Expensive crap out my experience. I dont look at my watches, I want to wear and use them. Their plus - they have a for Europeans catchy brand name. Also Pagani has problems with the "diver extensions" of their clasp. But a more creeping hand is not worth double of triple of the price. What I'm really positively exited about ist the Heritage SN052 - even if handwinded, this is a very good watch using a very precise and reliable movement. Also this has some lack at the screws of the bracement. These are not well fitted and inaccurate made. - so a big no from my side - personally dont buy SM any any more.
Thanks for your insights uwe. I tend to agree, though this is my first San Martin I can’t speak to their reliability as a brand overall, but I can definitely say the fit and finish of this watch that I do have is amazing, definitely better than the pagani…..but I don’t think 300 dollars better, not convinced. I would see this watch priced around 100 dollars cheaper to be a proper deal imo, worth 150-200 more with over all quality and finish, but def not 300 more.
Thanks for chiming in m8 I appreciate it, God bless!
Oh, what models of San Martin did you buy?
I'm also curious to hear what models with PT5000 you bought. I'm afraid to buy one with PT5000 because I've seen a lot of mixed opinions about it.
@@MirrlyonTime both I'm very disappointed about are the really good looking BB58 homages. The black one had out the box problems to screw the crown back - also winding has a very strong resistance. Out the box with malfunction was the blue BB58 homage. The rotor is attached to the crown mechanism. If you wind it up it rotates very fast and noisy inside. Even if you screw the crown back it also rotates. A pity - both movements work very accurate at +0 /+2 and outside quality is stunning. But if you own +/- 100 watches you need to give them a jumpstart taking out the box to wear.
the blue will go back to SM for refund. May be I'll order a blue one using a Selita 200 some time or propably the black BB chrono using the handwinded 1901. The white one is one of my most favorite watches at the moment.
@@uwe5935 Ugh, must feel bad, I'm sorry for you. I really wanted the bb58 homage, my plan was to buy it on the 11.11 sale, but I've seen a lot of complaints about the crown on this model. I bought the 39mm Explorer instead, which is a fantastic watch.
R