Hello me and a few others have been experimenting around trying this and weve found that fomapan negatives work very well with this process However the sodium hydroxide solution was something we were missing for for a more alkaline developer as we were using amonia for the corrosive agent Currently weve only been able to test 4x5 slides using a 545 back but if you have a 8x10 processor it would be a perfect opportunity to try some 8x10 shots i have a few polaroid 8x10 components i can send a few photos of for a sleeve template (they can be reused)
Hi there, I have cut down some old aerial film for my next experiment of using film as the negative. may I know where U guys hang out online to share your instant film experiments and experience?
So exciting. I have been trying to figure this out and had gotten very close to understanding the process, but I was missing some key information, which you are massively helping fill in. Thank you!
Amazing work. Well done! I never realised that the transfer would work so simply. For oxidation: I've got a system where I use a small bottle of pure argon for welding and just put a little squish of it in a bottle before closing. It is a very heavy inert gas so stops oxidation very well. Once you have a valve the bottle of gas is pretty cheap. Much cheaper than commercial wine preserver some people use.
WONDERFUL,we have to simplify a little the process and find a way to do more formats,also in colours and that last longer without oxydating.Is it possible to do the process with a light of some kind ?And with different format like polaroid 600 film frame and without the peel a part system?
Looks amazing! Too many steps for me, also I only own RB67 with Polaroid back, but still it's great to see people are still keeping this great format alive:D
Very, very interesting. Well done for all the experimentation you have done and for your clear explanation. I came here via your post on the large-format-photography forum and I'm sure that I'm not the only one! Keep up the good work :o)
Great video, thank you very much for putting this together. I'm a big fan of both Polaroid peel apart and New55, and saw Laurent Ete on Flickr doing this. I have much of what I need to do this, just haven't found the time to put it all together, so this is a big help and likely just what I need to get me over the hump and start doing this myself.
This is great! I've been looking for the recipe for the positive receiving layer, which is key in this process. Photo paper must have a chemical that converts the solubilized silver back to metallic silver, though the positive receiving sheet likely had specific chemicals to do that. Nice work!
The basic principle behind the diffusion transfer reversal process is the dissolution of silver halides by the fixer (thiosulfate), that are undeveloped by the developer, get reduced back to metallic silver and deposit onto the surface of the receiver sheet. But there has to be physical "nuclei" to precipitate the silver, otherwise it won't happen. Heavy metal sulfides were the first type of "nuclei" tested. Edwin Land describes on one of his patents (around 1946), using a solution of cadmium, zinc and lead acetate/nitrate, to coat the receiver sheet. Gelatin is also present in this solution, to provide a smooth surface (just like normal photographic paper emulsion). Another patent describes the receiver coating containing nickel/silver sulfide (mixed sulfide), suspension in gelatin, along with "toning" agents (by far the most obscure and hard to find class of compounds in this recipe). All I know is that they're derived from mercaptans (sulfide-contaning organic molecules). If I were you, I'd start by coating a sheet of watercolor papel with a dilute solution of nickel chloride/sulfate/nitrate (the second method, avoiding the use of lead/cadmium, but these should work as well) and gelatin. To create the active "nuclei", nickel sulfide (NiS), you'll need a solution of sulfide ions. An alternative to sodium sulfide is thioacetamide, which is safer to handle. After the nickel salt solution coat, dry, and apply a dilute solution of thioacetamide/sodium sulfide. That should slightly darken the paper, as NiS is a black insoluble compound. All of this is just based overall on the patents, I haven't tried the procedures myself, but the amounts of solutions and concentrations are not to be followed strictly, just as a guide.
@@Ryan-lc4bl that a lot of good information. one thing i found that when preparing the receiver paper, i have to fog the receiver paper in daylight first before fixing it, else the transfer won't occurs. not sure what is the chemical explanation behind this.
@@AnaloguePT Probably the fogging before fixing creates a small amount of metallic silver, that can act as the "nuclei", helping the silver halides that are dissolved by the fixer (thiosulfate) from the negative to precipitate onto the receiver, as metallic silver.
@@Ryan-lc4bl This is good information! I just found the notes I took when I was reading patents with receiver layer recipes a while back. There are various ways to make the receiving layer and the one you mentioned seems like the best path forward...
@@AnaloguePTwhat do you suggest for making a pack film?Also,I m Total newbie and don't have a dark room,how can I work with all of that?I own a polaroid and a Kodak ek Old camera
Thanks for sharing and all the efforts to run the experiment! You mentioned about washing the positives to reuse. Can the positive prints be kept? What if you just spread the monobath on the negative without the positive paper. Will the negative still develop?
Hi hi the positive prints can be kept after washing. If you spread the monobath on the neg without the positive it will still develop. In fact a good way to test your monobath paste.
Hello and thank you so much for all of this awesome information. With this process do you need to use a coater on the print to keep it from fading like you would with Type 57?
In a nutshell, the monobath paste also contain silver solvent that dissolved the unexposed silver and it diffuse over to the receiver sheet. Have not try RA4 or can I find anyone who has done that. Something to experiment in the future.
@@AnaloguePT Thank you for the reply. I found on google following patent information. Perhaps an interesting read on the process also. patents.google.com/patent/US2662822A/en?q=G03C8%2f28 if not mentioned by someone else.
Excellent video, well done! I followed your preparations and unfortunately I have a small problem, the negative is OK but the positive image is very very very pale... Perhaps you have a solution? And good luck to you and your videos
Great that you have tried. You can try underexposing. You would have more unexposed silver that will diffuse over to the positive. The old type55 behaved similarly but the new55 was able to get both a good positive and negative in exposure.
How about ilford HC? It is supposed to be the equivalent of Kodak hc110. But I have not try it out. The other developer I have tried is to mix it from scratch using one listed in one of the patents.
thank you. yet to try other commercial developers. it seems to need a quick acting developer so i would search for one based on this criteria if trying.
Congratulation this is a great process, Thanks for share!!!. I have a little question, do you know the recipe to create White and black paper for pinhole camera? Here in my country it´s very expensive and I would like to know if its posible to create a gelatin to apply the paper and create my own. Could you do a video on this subject, this will helpme to create more experiments with my pinhole camera. See you and enjoy!!!
Search in UA-cam ' lostlight art silver gelatin' you will find so someone has made an video on it. Not going to be cheap cos you still need silver nitrate or something.
This is a long video and have lots of steps. DO visit the blog at sgwetplate.com/2023/09/how-to-create-your-own-instant-film/ too.
If you use X-Ray or Ortho sheet film, you can handle it under a red safe light and avoid having to work in total darkness. Great video!
One of the most interesting videos on youtube, beautiful work. Thanks!
@@FrancescoFucito-r2j thank U for watching!
Hello me and a few others have been experimenting around trying this and weve found that fomapan negatives work very well with this process
However the sodium hydroxide solution was something we were missing for for a more alkaline developer as we were using amonia for the corrosive agent
Currently weve only been able to test 4x5 slides using a 545 back but if you have a 8x10 processor it would be a perfect opportunity to try some 8x10 shots i have a few polaroid 8x10 components i can send a few photos of for a sleeve template (they can be reused)
Hi there, I have cut down some old aerial film for my next experiment of using film as the negative. may I know where U guys hang out online to share your instant film experiments and experience?
So exciting. I have been trying to figure this out and had gotten very close to understanding the process, but I was missing some key information, which you are massively helping fill in. Thank you!
please try it out and we can all make it better as a DIY product :)
I shall! This will be a great first project for my upcoming community darkroom. :)
Terrific! - Finally I know why I kept my Polaroid 545. I look forward to trying it. Best wishes from the UK.
Amazing work. Well done! I never realised that the transfer would work so simply.
For oxidation: I've got a system where I use a small bottle of pure argon for welding and just put a little squish of it in a bottle before closing. It is a very heavy inert gas so stops oxidation very well. Once you have a valve the bottle of gas is pretty cheap. Much cheaper than commercial wine preserver some people use.
thank you for the tip. will check out argon gas
THank you for sharing, great introduction.
Fascinating! Thank you for sharing your process. Imagine that this was both frustrating and fun at the same time.
Hope U can try it and make it better!
Thanks for sharing the full process! Excellent work.
Great video. You've shown this is practical to do with materials that are easy to find.
Glad you think so!
WONDERFUL,we have to simplify a little the process and find a way to do more formats,also in colours and that last longer without oxydating.Is it possible to do the process with a light of some kind ?And with different format like polaroid 600 film frame and without the peel a part system?
Very interesting video, thank you so much for sharing.
So interesting!
Looks amazing! Too many steps for me, also I only own RB67 with Polaroid back, but still it's great to see people are still keeping this great format alive:D
Very, very interesting. Well done for all the experimentation you have done and for your clear explanation. I came here via your post on the large-format-photography forum and I'm sure that I'm not the only one! Keep up the good work :o)
thank you for dropping well. LF photography forum is my go to forum for LF stuff so happy to add a thread there on this process.
Great video, thank you very much for putting this together. I'm a big fan of both Polaroid peel apart and New55, and saw Laurent Ete on Flickr doing this. I have much of what I need to do this, just haven't found the time to put it all together, so this is a big help and likely just what I need to get me over the hump and start doing this myself.
Thank U. Laurent Ete's sharing on Flickr is a very great resource. I linked to his page on my blog post too.
Wow! That is amazing dude. Keep it up.
Really interesting , thank you !
Wow!! Thank you!!!
Wow! Bravo and thank you for your excellent work!
This is great! I've been looking for the recipe for the positive receiving layer, which is key in this process. Photo paper must have a chemical that converts the solubilized silver back to metallic silver, though the positive receiving sheet likely had specific chemicals to do that. Nice work!
There are some mention of the coating on the positive paper in the patents. Certainly something to look into next
The basic principle behind the diffusion transfer reversal process is the dissolution of silver halides by the fixer (thiosulfate), that are undeveloped by the developer, get reduced back to metallic silver and deposit onto the surface of the receiver sheet.
But there has to be physical "nuclei" to precipitate the silver, otherwise it won't happen.
Heavy metal sulfides were the first type of "nuclei" tested.
Edwin Land describes on one of his patents (around 1946), using a solution of cadmium, zinc and lead acetate/nitrate, to coat the receiver sheet. Gelatin is also present in this solution, to provide a smooth surface (just like normal photographic paper emulsion).
Another patent describes the receiver coating containing nickel/silver sulfide (mixed sulfide), suspension in gelatin, along with "toning" agents (by far the most obscure and hard to find class of compounds in this recipe). All I know is that they're derived from mercaptans (sulfide-contaning organic molecules).
If I were you, I'd start by coating a sheet of watercolor papel with a dilute solution of nickel chloride/sulfate/nitrate (the second method, avoiding the use of lead/cadmium, but these should work as well) and gelatin. To create the active "nuclei", nickel sulfide (NiS), you'll need a solution of sulfide ions. An alternative to sodium sulfide is thioacetamide, which is safer to handle.
After the nickel salt solution coat, dry, and apply a dilute solution of thioacetamide/sodium sulfide.
That should slightly darken the paper, as NiS is a black insoluble compound.
All of this is just based overall on the patents, I haven't tried the procedures myself, but the amounts of solutions and concentrations are not to be followed strictly, just as a guide.
@@Ryan-lc4bl that a lot of good information. one thing i found that when preparing the receiver paper, i have to fog the receiver paper in daylight first before fixing it, else the transfer won't occurs. not sure what is the chemical explanation behind this.
@@AnaloguePT Probably the fogging before fixing creates a small amount of metallic silver, that can act as the "nuclei", helping the silver halides that are dissolved by the fixer (thiosulfate) from the negative to precipitate onto the receiver, as metallic silver.
@@Ryan-lc4bl This is good information! I just found the notes I took when I was reading patents with receiver layer recipes a while back. There are various ways to make the receiving layer and the one you mentioned seems like the best path forward...
could this be used for a film pack camera?
@@Federico84 this is designed to be used with a 545 holder. Theoretically the concept can be adapted for a film pack camera I guess
@@AnaloguePTwhat do you suggest for making a pack film?Also,I m Total newbie and don't have a dark room,how can I work with all of that?I own a polaroid and a Kodak ek Old camera
Thanks for sharing and all the efforts to run the experiment!
You mentioned about washing the positives to reuse. Can the positive prints be kept?
What if you just spread the monobath on the negative without the positive paper. Will the negative still develop?
Hi hi the positive prints can be kept after washing.
If you spread the monobath on the neg without the positive it will still develop. In fact a good way to test your monobath paste.
Very cool! It seems the thickness could be slightly reduced for a better spread?
lots of variables to nail down and I hope more people will try and hep to test out the best way to do the various steps.
Hello and thank you so much for all of this awesome information. With this process do you need to use a coater on the print to keep it from fading like you would with Type 57?
I did not and they look okay but I guess time will tell how would they last
Super Cool!! I just can't understand how the receiver sheet will get a positive ... probably have to try it to see it happen
do you think RA4 paper can be used to get color?
In a nutshell, the monobath paste also contain silver solvent that dissolved the unexposed silver and it diffuse over to the receiver sheet.
Have not try RA4 or can I find anyone who has done that. Something to experiment in the future.
@@AnaloguePT Thank you for the reply. I found on google following patent information. Perhaps an interesting read on the process also. patents.google.com/patent/US2662822A/en?q=G03C8%2f28 if not mentioned by someone else.
Increíble
Excellent video, well done! I followed your preparations and unfortunately I have a small problem, the negative is OK but the positive image is very very very pale... Perhaps you have a solution? And good luck to you and your videos
Great that you have tried. You can try underexposing. You would have more unexposed silver that will diffuse over to the positive. The old type55 behaved similarly but the new55 was able to get both a good positive and negative in exposure.
@@AnaloguePT héhé thanks next batch I will try it 👍🏼 And don't stop your work & tuto !
Hi! Any alternative to Kodak Hc110 it’s impossible to find here in Europe :(
How about ilford HC? It is supposed to be the equivalent of Kodak hc110. But I have not try it out. The other developer I have tried is to mix it from scratch using one listed in one of the patents.
@@AnaloguePT thanks ill try it out!
Brilliant!! If one can’t get HC110, any recommendations for a substitute?
thank you. yet to try other commercial developers. it seems to need a quick acting developer so i would search for one based on this criteria if trying.
Congratulation this is a great process, Thanks for share!!!. I have a little question, do you know the recipe to create White and black paper for pinhole camera? Here in my country it´s very expensive and I would like to know if its posible to create a gelatin to apply the paper and create my own. Could you do a video on this subject, this will helpme to create more experiments with my pinhole camera. See you and enjoy!!!
Search in UA-cam ' lostlight art silver gelatin' you will find so someone has made an video on it. Not going to be cheap cos you still need silver nitrate or something.
@@AnaloguePT Thanks for your repply!
This process looks tough.. not easy to get good results.. good work bro.
i wish i have tried it 10years ago when i learnt about this process. Now, I hope more people will try and help improve the DIY process.
Woohoo
my father India in Pushkar work box camera, this book Indian Box camera my father name Kishan Chand hemnani
very nice. great work by your father. i reviewed the book here ua-cam.com/video/Ldk-kyjNjCg/v-deo.html