Can Matt Mercer recover from this?
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- Опубліковано 10 кві 2024
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I was in your Discord, then it wanted some authentication of my phone, after I resent the code back it always fails.
Please do not promote the poison of Füm. It's all the filth in a cigarette, concentrated.
😂 so funny. Props to your writers.
@@tonimojo5859 i have no writers!! :D
while the new group is obliviously not so iconic like S2, CR is really good in using the enforced uses of certain player-types in a useable manner, like the use of a wheelchair-NPC-user in the end of S2 or the non-binary robot (lash out possible?), who has flat-earth believes, thereby making the innovation of 3gender policies a fricking farce on purpose and to highlight the liberty in D&D characters (the real reason these checkmark characters are hated)
Some figures in S3 had bad developments....i try not to spoiler with coded words.....like i disliked the foursome date or the fearn-alpha ship. Other romantic developments were open to allow inserting your own person into these figures, this is hardly possible, if the man is senil old and the viewer is 20. So some core elements of fixed characteristics in the figures and their interactions, that worked out so good in S2 failed to kick off in S3, explicit by the loved and missed blue companion at the start. I loved the ark of the dance festival and the attempt to blend in with this crew in the party, because i knew the character of these people and knew, that it would become comedy gold, but a lot of other areas, like the thief-challenge was to be honest disappointing, like the ship combat in S2 and was not expected to fail like for the cast and for the viewers.
In Ep.20 this is still a problem on my end, but it seem to continue for many fans in later episodes....
The biggest reason for dropped views were simply time. I had time to see S2, but i struggle to go beyond Ep.20 of S3, because of normal live existence etc.
This doesnt mean, that i will not watch S3 to the end. I will just have to catch up and this will take YEARS. It is a different question, of CR has this time to wait for their fans, because i suspect, that tons of other fans failed to keep up like me, as well.
"CAN THEY RECOVER FROM THIS?" *publishes their own streaming service, releases information of their 3rd season of their animated show and announces the production of their second animated show, releases an abridged version of their campaign, continuing their ttrpg production to beta testing with updates frequently on it, scheduled 2 live shows*
Idk I think they fucking can recover from this lmfao.
Im stunned there wasnt all caps in video title, this is such trash clickbait non-issue
Arent they working on a Videogame too?
I expected some actual crisis. Not this.
Right? I was worried and relieved at the news/opinion but now I'm just sad I wasted about 2 minutes (I skipped to find the conclusion) because I clicked on it when it came up on the list of my search for Critical Role Intro reactions by the cast. I've never felt clickbaited until now.
I think a big part of it that's going unmentioned is that twitch is losing numbers across the board.
That's wishful thinking. "Twitch" doesn't explain how you drop viewer numbers so astronomically as CR has.
@@schemage2210 No, but there's a lot of other factors that do.
1) COVID (the obvious)
2) Ever after COVID, COVID Critters (like myself) were still catching up (this only applies to UA-cam viewership, not Twitch).
3) Their numbers got a huge boost in early 2022 because of LOVM. With season 3 delayed that fervor is dying down. I'm interested to see if it will pick back up once LOVM S3 and M9 gets a release date.
4) I haven't done a deep dive to confirm this is true, but I think they used to only broadcast once or twice, not the three or four times they do now. I think this is a huge part of the "average views" going down after COVID since they weren't going live anymore.
5) Their total hours watched are also down, but I think this is mostly because of them broadcasting less than they used to. You can see a significant drop on this after they started taking a break once a month. They also stopped broadcasting most of their other shows.
I'm not saying their numbers aren't down. I just don't think it's as disastrous as most people think. Say what you will but their number of twitch followers have never gone down.
Twitch has so many commercials I deleted their app
Twitch is owned by Amazon, and that’s a shitty company to work for or partner with.
@@1970joedub Which is absolutely irrelevant. Critical Role's live streams on Twitch has absolutely NOTHING to do with Amazon proper.
The numbers first dropped when they stop playing live. When they do a live show the number shoot up.
Its always makes zero sense to me that this would stop people from watching. By the time the Covid break happened they already barely engaged with chat anyways (for good reason, that reason being chat sucks major donkey dick). What is the difference between a live show with 0 chat interaction and a pre recorded show with 0 chat reaction? There has not been one reason to suggest a pre-filmed episode is any different than a live episode other than they get to film it when they want, and I imagine generally they are all more happy for it.
@@Matisyahuwu Because people like the concept of live. Makes them feel more engaged.
A recorded sporting event (when the person watching does not know the end result) is inherently less emotionally engaging. People do not record ones they know they will miss nearly as often as schedules and technology enables.
Why?
Because of that emotional connection. It is not logical. It is not rational. But the feeling of "being there when it happened" is affected by degrees of separation. Being in a live audience is the gold standard. live broadcast is great. And recorded is still good... but it is nowhere near the same.
Other people already know how it ends. The person watching the recording isn't among the first to see it.
*They weren't there when it happened.*
*Live* matters emotionally, to those invested enough. Always has... always will.
@@corwyncorey3703 I don't disagree with you, but with CR only some 20 people max are "there when it happened" (some might say they were in the room when it happened).
The sports analogy is totally valid, the Superbowl would be lame if the world saw it live a week after the attendees in the stadium did.
But with CR, I am still seeing it with everyone else for the first time, and sharing a connection with all of those people, the internet reacting to it at once, etc.
I don't feel anything is diminished from watching a prerecorded stream when it airs live to 99.9999% of the planet at the same time, and we all share that together.
@@Matisyahuwu I actually cannot understand how you could not understand. I'm fine if you disagree with the feeling but for you to not even grasp how something being live makes it seem more important.. well I don't get how you cannot get that. If people are emotionally invested in something then a live engagement (even if to a limited, sometimes even negative, extent) is more compelling and fulfilling than someone sterile and pre-done. If my comment doesn't make it more clear, please read corwyncorey's3703's comment.
@@Matisyahuwu The two replies you've gotten are probably sufficient already, but I would like to add that this emotional sentiment to "being there when it first happened" is a well-known psychological phenomenon. It's called FOMO, Fear of Missing Out. When you're there, in the moment, right as it happens, you're not just experiencing it, *you're a part of it.* It doesn't matter if it's logical, it's something deeply-rooted within the human condition, & has been used to manipulate people into impulsive decisions, probably since even before the bread & circuses of the Roman Colosseum. Even when we know we're being manipulated by it, it's such a deep craving that most people prefer its presence to its absence.
I sincerely tried to watch several videos published on this channel, yet it is impossible to focus on a speech that manages to say nothing of significance a minute and a half in. There is a circular logical motion which ends every sentence at the point it began. Strong opening lines followed by no significant information is frustrating to watch.
I was expecting an actual crisis... Perhaps Hasbro trying to mug them of their pocket money or something... Not a perfectly natural dip in viewership that looks so bad almost entirely because of Covid. It both created a huge peak that was always going down, and then as nobody can watch hundreds and hundreds of hours of actual play content for years straight without burning out a little and needing a break - covid forced every single CR fan to be rather synchronised there... And they still get great numbers.
This video is just her building a conspiracy theory from incomplete information for a gotcha title. Critical role is so much more than their game now.
Creators gotta bait.
Well, youtubers are in millions, and all they do is scavenge any view they can, any means necessary. I'm dumb opening this vid.
this entire channel is nothing but clickbait manufactured outrage. I have no idea why I keep coming back here. I am a malfunctioning person, apparently.
Multiple merch lines, animated amazon episodes, and vods on YT and Twitch...Nevermind the fact all of them are established in their own careers.
Theyll be fine.
yeah, i think this is a lot of drama over.. well.. pretty much nothing. they're still getting about half a million on the main campaign's youtube releases didn't do much better at the time, only really gathering most views over the years. most episodes settle around 2 million views after a while.
candela obscura, like call of cthulhu, is a niche genre of the already niche genre of ttrpg; and it's not even one continuous campaign, it's different mysteries run by different gms with different players; of course that's catching less viewers than *the* critical role campaign.
This is a clickbait channel that mostly overdramatizes things and uses misinformation to get as much clicks as they can
@@rabl3535 Yeah the title "Will matt Mercer Recover From This?" is like, one of the the most scummy clickbait titles I've ever seen
@@alechs My thoughts exactly.
I suspect it's a perfect storm of many factors... Viewer fatigue, a less exciting Campaign 3, end of the pandemic, and all the Hasbro/D&D controversy.
I agree. I actually really like the cast of characters in Bell's Hells, but I personally fell off when the party got split up and teleported all over the place because that plotline felt so incredibly railroaded. They literally blew up multiple of the doomsday machines and grievously damaged the final one only for a single dude to pull a Thanos and be all, "Fine, I'll power the spell myself." Just ridiculous. Even if they had completely destroyed the machine, I guarantee that Ludinus would still have succeeded in someway.
Minor rant over but... Critical Role requires a dedicated viewer to be very invested in the show. It's been airing for ~10 years by this point and a lot of its fan base has grown up and become more embroiled in adult life and problems. Dedicating 4 to 5 hours a week to a single show can be difficult. Binge watching a show is easy because you are getting the whole plot of a season or series in one go. Watching ~12 hours of Critical Role is like watching only a single episode of any regular series, and probably having less plot, story, or character arc progress on top of that.
So people have swapped to a shorter nerdy content, a 1 or 2 hour episode is easier to digest, especially if there is significant plot progress happening.
Plus, people who fall off find it very difficult to get back onto Critical Role, because missing ~10 episodes could mean it takes several weeks to catch up unless you can somehow binge 40 to 60 hours of content very quickly.
Long episodes, a slow plot, a plot that requires watching ~1,000 hours of previous content to really get and understand, an older audience base, some nonsensical and divisive plot elements, WotC controversy... it's just a perfect storm of things to hit Critical Role.
I agree with this.
I’m with you.
People are fixated on a single or as few as possible huge reasons to cite for something happening. But things in real life are not as dramatic and simple as that. More often than not, it’s actually a slow, gradual process we don’t notice because the daily changes are so tiny. It’s only when a tipping point is hit and something big, binary (“something was here, but now it’s gone”), and grand happens.
from what I heard last episode was actually exciting. One of the characters finally dies just hope they don't revive it cuz that kills the immersion like how Laudna kept being revived
Matt dropped the ball super hard with season 3. Set up a whole world ending event only to put it on hold for how many episodes of fucking around with the characters.
to be fair, there's not really any reason to watch them live when it's prerecorded
Even when it was live, I preferred waiting for them to post it on UA-cam. Watch it on my one time.
Do you think it's a little scripted ?
Maybe, but who cares if it's entertaining
@@unholywarrior9007 Nope I don't think it is scripted at all.
@@unholywarrior9007 How are peope still on about that... It isn't and has never been scripted. There is literally no evidence for it
I think drop off in viewers is natural. The problem i see is that so much of campaign 3 relys on references from campains 1&2 and if you are new to watching CR you are gonna miss a lot of those references and probably dont have the time go back and catch up on previous events. They need a new campaign, with a new setting and characters that dont reference the old ones to bring new people into it...maybe even a new game.
This exactly. We watched C2 completely, but have never made it very far into C1. It's fun, but it's rough, especially early on. So we stopped watching C3 only a couple of episodes in because it was painfully obvious we weren't up to date, and they didn't take time to explain.
Just checked with chatgpt
Season 1 = 402.5 hours
Season 2 = 525 hours
That's 927.5 hours of video just so you can start in on Season 3. That's 38.65 DAYS.
No thanks.
I don't think Matt Mercer or anyone else at CR is hurting from the drop in views. If anything they purposely made this campaign as a love letter to the dedicated fans of the last 2 campaigns, and that's perfectly fine. I just hope they do something new and different to bring more TTRPG players into the fold.
I didn't start watching CR until episode 33 of Campaign 3, so fall of 2022. I did catch up with the backlog of C3 episodes by the end of that year, but I've never felt compelled to watch C1 or C2 to be able to appreciate C3. I've learned enough about the previous characters and story milestones just hanging around the CR ecosphere for the last 2 1/2 years to appreciate what they did and see how some of it relates to current events.
I think suggesting that someone is obligated to watch almost 1000 hours of content just to even begin to dip their toes in to CR is overblown. It does seem to me that C3 is approaching its climax, so it might be inefficient to try to jump into it now and expect to keep up to date, but people should feel free to start wherever they want and go as deep or as shallow as they're comfortable with.
@@acollectionofthings I mean, they're making it sound like we don't already binge watch 4 straight seasons of a show we only just realized exists.
I've also notice some channels run two campaigns in parallel. One being a initial, generally bigger campaign; and a second one with different/shuffled player group and different part of the setting. Great for cross over setups, and can use guest spots for when someone can't make the session.
I would love for someone, anyone, to break the monopoly of D&D, but I just don’t see Daggerheart being the proverbial dagger to the heart.
I don't see it either, I think a lot of the initial excitement will disappear once people try it and realise that their group is not made up of professional voice actors and they're not putting on a show. And they'll go back to their previous system, or maybe try something else -- I think Pathfinder might be the big winner in all this.
I don’t think that will happen. We are a severely fractured people in the TTRPG space. There are people still playing older editions of D&D, along with the current one. Many of us left D&D for Pathfinder after 3.X because 4E didn’t interest us.
Then you have groups who play a myriad of other TTRPGs. Examples: Warhammer, Vampire The Masquerade (or other types similar), Call of Cthulhu, DCC, and way too many list, really.
Unless someone creates a game that can migrate all of us to them, I think these factions will stay separated. But I do agree with it would be nice to be done with WotC/Hasbro.
It's a good start. I'm definitely going to try it.
As cool as it would be for Knave 2E to take the throne, ik it won't
Dungeons and Dragons is a pretty terrible game system. If you want to break its monopoly don't play it. Start with you and your group.
And OSR games that use an SRD/OGL/d20 system?
They are all D&D too.
18 minutes of yaping just to say "it is what it is"
You watched 18 min of her yapping to day “it is what it is”? Sounds like she’s got your viewership
@@undeadbynight you heard of the slider on youtube videos?
@@cptclonks7279 No, what can you tell me about them?
@@zed6709 I’m sorry I miss gendered them?
just the standard dnd discourse space. lol
Poor Orym, Matt should give him a rank in cat herding.
Or a rank in Grog. Some of VM's best moments were when they were forced to actually _do_ something when they waffled enough to let the Barb get bored.
I’m surprised how little you actually said in 5 min and 21 seconds like I wanna click of the video but wanna know please be better at this
Quick tip: Since there is no longer the dislike counter, I usually go read the top few comments to get the main point of the video before I watch it. This video has 5,2k likes and 2k dislikes. I wonder why.
From what I got, they have been losing twitch viewers, theres no drama or nothing and most people think they will be fine thanks to merch and TV deals.
So yeah, time spent on this video? One minute reading the comments, 3 minutes writing this reply. We efficient in here! XDD
THIS
It took this clickbaiter 13 minutes to say "I'm dumb so I look at this dip in live viewers on twitch specifically and assume it's the end of the world instead of looking at literally everything else, thanks for the view"
@@martinpecar7683 Dislikes are at 2.5k
@@martinpecar7683 I use a browser extension - "Return UA-cam Dislike" - to put the dislike counters right back where they were. Do recommend fully. I'm only here cuz... well, train wreck.
Any TV-series have it's run for a number of years until it will decline. I think it's a natural development that it will be the same for UA-cam series. Critical Role has been running for 9 years. I think it's really impressive what they have accomplished, even if it ended tomorrow.
I did watch Critical Role, but I think that 4 hours was just too long for me. I would be interested in watching if they made a new Daggerheart show with a shorter format, preferable edited.
This. Shorter, edited episodes will solve the problem.
You nailed it. Make the full time version available, but also an 1-hour edited episode for the rest of us. I´d watch it esily.
I think there's probably additional discussion to be had around other groups that may be pulling away viewers. I can't imagine someone watching more than a couple of groups in any given week so if something about the current Critical Role game doesn't grab you you can always go somewhere else.
Yes. Stinky Dragon Tavern have taken a huge cut of the TRRPG watch time I think.
Only if you have a lot of money to spend watching. The paywalls for other groups is prohibitive.
I like the episode, but DaggerHeart is not a DND killer or even dick puncher. It's play style makes it completely a different game that will draw different players.
It also isnt a very good game. At least last version wasnt. They released a new version this week, with some changes.
@@TheManyVoicesVA agreed. I think they are trying to make a system, but not really sure how to do it.
When it's just a narrative based game you can do that in any system that you like better.
@@GravityFail87 they literally list it as rules light and narrative driven... and it is one of the crunchiest games ive ever seen
@@TheManyVoicesVA 100000000%
@@GravityFail87 if you want a crunchy game make one. But dont also have like 3 separate things to track damage, and confusing dice mechanics, and no actual initiative system.
It’s a rare show, live or otherwise that can sustain an audience for longer than 5 years. 340 episodes in a regular 22 episode a season show is about 15.5 seasons. Now if you factor in time filmed at an average of 4 hours per episode that then turns into almost 62 seasons worth of content if it was a regular tv show based on time alone. That’s a lot. Because it’s so much it can be daunting to anyone interested to start watching. Even if each storyline is self contained, so to speak, unless you’re coming in at the beginning of an arc, it can seem nearly impossible to anyone new to get involved with. All of this to say that I think a large component that has to be factored in is that viewer retention is always a struggle so there’s always a natural fall off that is going to occur, but coupled with a genuine lack of new consumers then add to that them having what could be described as an off/lackluster season none of this should be surprising. I think the official release of Daggerheart could change things up if they lean into it.
This ^^ ppl point at so many things but miss this big red dot that everyone can see but no one is wants to call out the noticeable elephant in the room. Thank you for articulating it so well 👏
@@Noirwulfenhart Thank you for your kind words, I appreciate it!
I kept seeing comments blaming one thing or another…. Not that those other things might play some small role for a very few people, everyone was just seeming to try to make it either more complicated than it is or they were not thinking realistically at all. I also forgot to mention that overall interest in 5e D&D has dropped by 30% according to sales numbers since 2022 which I’m sure is also playing a factor.
Chances are they will see a large bump in viewership if they shift to the new D&D version once that releases or once they release Daggerheart and shift to that game. Likely a quick uptick will occur once both games release because that’s how entertainment consumerism works, however it won’t sustain if they don’t shift too.
If Critical Role really wanted to liven things up, and increase their numbers they could learn a bit from their predecessors in the TV industry.
Shorten the length of their story arcs so that each “season” is more encapsulated and doesn’t have to be hundreds of episodes long. Shorten their episodes to be more manageable for a newer fan base to get involved with; go from 4+ hour long episodes to keeping it to a tighter 2.5-3 hours long. With climactic episodes being a bit longer or double episodes.
Not every season has to go from level 1-20. Maybe have seasons where we follow characters from levels 1-10, 5-14, 11-20, etc, etc.
Really cut down on the “Side quest” content or have that as detached “bonus” content.
They could try running an “arc” with two smaller teams of 4 players each trading off every other week and only coming together to take down the big bad. This would have multiple benefits: Combats would be quicker, Matt wouldn’t have to herd as many cats, Fans could get more personal time with each character. Episodes could accomplish more in the allotted time. There might be a little more organizational depth needed on the backend but I doubt it.
Any one of these ideas would help them, but ultimately if they don’t change anything the problem will continue to compound with more drop off, not enough new consumer interest, and it will likely fade away..
Something that might be incredibly helpful for new viewers is if they made some highly produced highlighted recaps for whatever “arc” they are doing at the quarter marks or even the half way points.
Honestly, season 3 just didn't catch me; I gave up on it. I LOVED Mighty Nein. Now it's just .... not for me. Maybe season 4. With CR now introducing Daggerheart, what's going to happen for season 4? We'll find out.
I dropped it and recently picked it up again cus I had too much free time. I can honestly say I like the characters more now, but I can see even better how attrocious the pacing was and why I didn't enjoy the start of the campaign.
I think it started out as them being just a group of friends having fun sharing their hobby. They were genuinely surprised and excited when they got so much response, just go back and see their live reactions when they launched their first merch and it sold out in less than 20 minutes after being introduced to their stream. And they played like the majority of us do, sometimes impulsive, doing sh*t for kicks and giggles, without to much worry about consequences. Like when Keyleth jumped off the cliff without judging the risk, morphing into a fish in the air and slamming onto the rocks beneath. The players reactions to being surprised or having laughing fits with their best buds were what drew us in.
And then many years pass. This becomes the fulltime job for some of them. They are older, having kids, dogs, houses and now a media company they have to run together. They go through stuff irl and still join in on game night (whenever they record them) because its a job they are committed to. Its the time in peoples lives when most stop getting together with friends to hang out and play, because life gets in the way, but maybe its also because other things feel more important.
And now they have other series, projects and events together, so its no longer this one night each week that they get to hang out as a friend group and share their hobby. Its just a great work day with their fave colleagues doing what they always do. And I feel like there is simultaniously less at stake and more at stake. They no longer spend the week in between live streams eagerly awaiting figuring out what happens next, texting each other challenges or coming up with character twists or planning the perfect spell list. But they also know that viewers get attached to anything they create, so even though they start each session looking like "So, what am I playing as and where are we again?" they also seem to avoid doing impulsive stuff just for fun. Its like they are putting more value in telling an immersive story with complex characters than in doing stuff that make them laugh or cry. And I think that is why people assume its more scripted. These actors are pro storytellers. They can improv better than most of us can do scripted drama. But there is a difference between doing a dramatic performance and playing a game with your friends. And they might have blurred the lines too much.
I think its the same as with other youtubers. If this was a different job or hobby, something not shared with the world, we would think it was normal to change it up over a decade. Hardly any of us stay in the same job or stick to the same hobby all through our 20s. And maybe the Critical Role group would regain the spark if they stopped running an empire and just live streamed their game night once every two weeks, having a beer together and bringing an empty character sheet just in case somebody did something foolish. But I dont think any of us would ask them to do that just to please us. They grew up and became responsible adults and they did it well. They will figure it out and go on to do great things. And we can rewatch old seasons and find other roleplaying content, and still support Critical Role as they branch out and create stuff.
Doing the show pre-recorded doesn't exactly help. why tune in when you can vod it?
The vod numbers are way down too...
Can watch vods at 2x speed, but not lives.
Maybe an odd compliment, but - one of my dogs gets scared at the typical curse-word BLEEP, so I really appreciate you using the duck sound instead. He is unbothered by that.
hey i'm really glad
Love for doggos
Same with my dog.
I thought that was super common on yt
Dog approved channel. Cool beans.
Honestly, I like CR too, but this newest campaign is pretty boring. I honestly cannot connect with the characters. It feels like a giant filler. Especially, for a show that's 4 hours an episode. I still like the CR team as a whole but also all the other content is underwhelming. I'm not into Candela or Midst. So, every time those come up, I skip. I'm honestly looking forward to the next campaign, be it they use Daggerfall or D&D. I'm still a fan but not motivated to keep up with the show right now.
I feel the same, that and some of their content goes against my taste. I love the story and the drama of Season 1 and Season 2 had its moments... But I stopped watching Season 3 after 12 episodes.
I think campaign 3 definitely has some strong moments, especially between Laudna's resurrection and the party splitting then reuniting, BUT...yeah. They meander so much and I know it's because Matt wants to let them explore this huge world he's created, but I'm sure a lot of people started skipping episodes because they felt most of the stream would be filler combat or goofing off with no consequence. It's not something that's new to the campaigns, it's just now things have come to a head. I think they could get those rookie numbers back up if they committed to shorter campaigns - not even miniseries! Just a year or two tops.
Same here, except I gave up trying to let them grow on me after the first few months. So the campaign could have gotten awesome since, for all I know.
Same. Plus it airs so late on a weekday, making it impossible to watch live, and then have to wait until it's released to the channel.
The first several episodes were a bit rocky, since we've been dropped onto several different characters with the three narrators doing the voices, but Midst really picked up once it found its legs. I've honestly been preferring it over Campaign 3 at the moment.
I also think it's time to put Exandria to rest, at least in its current form. I'm also not sure how enthusiastic the crew is for C3 anymore.
Matt made the mistake to not do at least a big time jump (remember that all three campaigns are within about 35 years of each others) so they're rubbing shoulders with VM and M9 - which is fine in a one-shot - but boring and dangerous for C3 since it gets used as a crutch and takes the spotlight off the current characters.
Bells Hells have their moments but are mostly bland and boring, plus they meander around too much. My own interest fizzled out around the time they got split and reunited.
If the older campaigns are any indication we'll get another year of this and then they might switch to Daggerheart for a fresh start, either in a new world or an changed Exandria without the former campaigns ballast.
I think that at least part of the problem is the Legend of Vox Machina. people who have been brought into the fandom are used to its type of storytelling, and when joining campaign 3, were probably thrown off a lot by how much slower the pacing is. I don't think it's the whole problem or even most of it, but I think it's definitely contributing
Correct me if I'm wrong, but hasn't Campaign 3 of Critical Role but generally less-well received? Might be time to wind that one down.
EDIT: As soon as I posted this, you got to the reasons and now I feel like a fool.
I find the characters ALL to be very uninteresting and the plot uninteresting as well (I'm only at episode 31.. I used to watch religiously but after 20 boring episodes of campaign 3, I just watch once a month basically so have a huge backlog.. and even then, it's a chore to get through most episodes.... LOTS of fast-forwarding). I will not miss a single one of these player characters when the campaign ends.. unlike Campaign 1 & 2 which mostly had very memorable characters.
If only there had been Something to keep your hands busy! Oh wait, that got handled as well! :)
I liked Campaign 3 a lot more than 2... at first. The more openness with party backstories, nicer party, and cool character concepts and promises of arcs right from the start compared to C2's unlikable initial characters and sandbox style was a big draw. But then...
Well, I could go on and on, I but I sum it up in a few ways:
-While the Mighty Nein started as assholes but gradually developed into genuine heroes who cared deeply for eachother, Bells Hells went the opposite direction. To me, seeing characters spiral into becoming worse people is only enjoyable if it's a tragedy or villain origin story.
-Most early arcs and promises of Marquet politics and lore got thrown out the window in favour of a "kill the gods" plot that seems to be at attempt to leave D&D and move to a new system.
-The party can't agree on the gods, having the same cyclical arguments over and over. FCG turned into an annoying evangelist parody and this overtook all his previous interesting lore. Gods from previous campaigns are derailed for the sake of arguments. (e.g Pelor in C3 is borderline Lawful Evil in comparison to his Neutral Good C1 self, I feel the Lawful Neutral Lawbearer would've worked better in that role)
-While Episode 51 was peak, things escalated too fast for a sub Lv 10 party, leading to the world seemingly on the brink of destruction while the party has to do filler just to be ready for the fight.
-I never got the feeling what Ludinus was doing needed stopping urgently? Sure the ley-lines are out of balance, but the party is constantly confronted with evidence that the removal of the gods won't change anything. Contrast that with Vecna riding a titan into a massive city, the Chroma Conclave taking over the continent or Lucien trying to bring a living eldritch abomination city into reality.
@@HathurWell, there’s your problem, stuff didn’t really kick off until episode 35.
As far as campaigns go, #3 is my least favorite with campaign #2 being my favorite. But I personally think they are just spreading themselves too thin. I'm sure Matt has less than half the time to prepare as he used to. But that's just my opinion.
I think D&D 5E's decline has dragged CR down a bit, too. The next version of D&D and how CR handles it will make or break the show.
I just think campaign 3 wasn't as strong as previous campaigns overall. The story is slow, and the PCs aren't as compelling as in previous campaigns. For me personally, my interest died off when Robbie left. Dorian Storm was one of my favorite characters, and his departure left a huge void in my opinion. After that I felt my interest waning more and more, until finally I just stopped watching. I keep up with major plot points with recaps and episode reviews, and I plan on watching again once a new story starts up. I hope in the future they pace campaigns a little better. More condensed and shorter, making them easier to digest in the long term. 400+ episodes that are well over 3 hours long each is just a bit much for me. It's the same thing that keeps me from watching the entirety of the One Piece anime. I just don't have enough time for that, no matter how interested I may be.
THIS! When I saw Robbie at the start of Campaign 3, I was like, "Oh shit, new permanent player!" only for him to have just been a long running guest. 🙃 It also just feels like Imogen is 'the main character' because of being so connected to the moon, having her mother be part of the antagonist's group, etc. It's also, in my opinion, not as character driven as Campaigns 1 and 2. I'd genuinely rather watch someone's recap videos of the Campaign rather than the actual Campaign at this point. Maybe I'll come back for Campaign 4, maybe it'll be their new system, or they'll add a new, permanent, cast member. We already know Matt can handle 10 people at the table.
@@carlycchapman Good to know ahead of time that Robbie isn't permanent! Thank you for a helpful spoiler.
Years ago, I got up at 4am to catch the very first episode of campaign 3 live, but after a few weeks stopped watching due to personal reasons getting in the way. Been meaning to get back into things, probably will aim to finish season 2 first, from what I'm hearing.
I agree. I wasn't even a big fan of Robbie or Dorian Storm, in fact kind of hated he was on the show instead of others, but at least he made it new/interesting in some ways. I would've much rather they found a way to make it work with him than to just have him leave. But, maybe he had other professional projects/goals to work on. Unless one obsessively follows Robbie, who's to know?
Caleb and Robbie’s characters were adorable together. They had great chemistry which is otherwise lacking in season 3.
I think it’s a combination of not doing live recordings anymore, but a good portion of us are just growing up. Critical Role is about ten years old now, and that’s ten years for us to grow up, have families, get new jobs, all the things that come with getting older. I started watching in college when Geek and Sundry first started the show, and now I am nearly thirty and have a ton of other responsibilities. I catch up when I can, but I’m still about eight episodes behind, and I haven’t even touched Candela Obscura because I wanted to catch up on the main campaign first, but catching up just isn’t happening yet. Same with Midst; I listened to the first five episodes and then decided to put it off until catching up on the other stuff even though I loved those first few episodes. I don’t think I am alone in this.
CHILD
That mirrors my story exactly. Life's getting in the way. It's not like I'm actively avoiding the show, but unfortunately, other priorities are cropping up that make dedicating 4 hours out of my week a hard ask
I started watching when I was 56 :)
IMO they need to get back to live so it feels like friends hanging around a table again.
Also, the plot and shear amount of lore/names is getting pretty hard to follow.
Sheer
I fail to see how that's literally not exactly what's happening though? The set would be exactly the same if it was filmed live, the episodes would be just as long, theyd interact the exact same way.
I'm genuinely curious though, please tell me what specifically would make them seem like "friends sitting around a table" if that's not what C3 is.
Campaign 3 had way too much going on. Matt's central plot for the entire first arc was taking a back seat to all the characters' side plots.
The climactic boss fight against the big bug queen thing felt like a side story despite being the *GM's main plot.*
*spoilers ahead for c3* I feel like this is only partly the issue, though I see it in a lot of people's meh-ness for the campaign. I haven't completed C2, but in C1 there were distinct arcs. They felt like they were distinctly separate with threads connecting them. I only felt like there was a single arc in C3. even the sub-plots, like the bug queen were left unanswered. in addition Character progression story (what a lot of people say is taking up the time against the main story) is hindered because Matt does things like completely reverse what the whole party did to forward it (Delilah was done, period, but Matt brouight her back, rewinding Laudna's campaign. Imogen was looking for info on her mom early on, and suddenly the BBEG shows up at that exact time to stop her from getting information. The group finally gets the titan shard and lo and behold, the BBEG shows u to screw with the party despite him not having any real way to know exactly where they were (he scried on them while they were with an omnipotent god tree, really?), Ashton passes a near impossible skill challenge only to be given a promise of a boon but then only getting a penalty to their CON, only getting the boon when the party does what Matt wanted them to do in the first place, despite not giving any direction to the party, (you know because they couldn't ask the tree everything they wanted because Matt forced them to jump to get the shard before they were done)). If Story progression was allowed to actually progress, that would help. Couple that with making the BBEG an immortal wizard who routinely has his OP minions fighting underpowered players (let's not give the party a long rest in 6 potential encounters, and right after the thankfully avoided 4th encounter, boom BBEG minion shows up and almost kills half the party. Really?!) and the whole season seems like it's going to be an impossible slog. If it were in arcs and the players didn't constantly feel like what they're doing was making no effect to their story and the main storyline, maybe there would be more love for the season. What I want to know is why the players don't bring this up to Matt off-screen, or if they do, it doesn't seem like it's making a difference.
@@Robit-d20 lol those are some major spoilers I made it to the water city before I gave up on the season. Imogen's main character status was kinda irking me, and I wasnt really that into some of thr side plots.
There was just way too much going on. Every single character has a really dramatic back story, like amped up to 11. The plot is just getting pulled in like a million different directions at once. I feel like from C1 to C2 we got characters with slightly more back story, and a couple of the characters had majorly traumatic/consequential things in their back story. Fjord and Yasha mainly, Beau kind of I guess... But they all sort of had *an* arc where their back story was dealt with, and Yasha's was actually brilliant as a way to write Ashley out. Caleb's was woven into the campaign throughout, but only started to come through once some of the other PC's backstories had been dealt with already. Nott had 2 sort of beats that were both dealt with in solid chunks, saving her husband, and curing her curse.
Fjord's was probably the best, the pirates and stuff was a great setting to explore. His came back in the special they did and was sort of wrapped up nicely. Molly's return was fantastic, a great cap to the season. Beau was mainly used as a way to research information which was a great GM tool to drop important puzzle pieces in the PC's lap. Even Cadeucus, they went and found his family, back story solved. Just a neat side quest. And Jester's "I am my own God" arc was so fun, discovering a little nod to the previous campaign, and Traveler-con was like hyped up the entire season, and then ended up being kind of a cool party with a nice mystery and dungeon delve with very interesting mechanics.
The story was new and fresh. New setting, new locales, a cool political backdrop of a cold then hot war, and having to play both sides to accomplish their goals. The different characters' stories were sort of compartmentalized, and you felt the group growing closer over time as they grew to trust eachother.
As opposed to the sort of messy everything is connected, whiplash from plot point to plot point that we have in C3.
er your sentiment is correct but climactic not climatic. climatic refers to the ambiance, climactic means the big important moment climax is also a synonym for orgasm. climactic boss fight, is the money shot. climatic boss fight is you and your sister fighting over the thermostat.
@@ratholin maybe I meant it was cold in that cave, u ever think of that?!
Lol ty, stupid auto correct.
@@TheManyVoicesVA sorry about potential spoilers! I didn’t realize you weren’t caught up. I need to get better at putting spoiler warnings on my comments. I’ll edit the original now.
There's a lot of reasons for the decline, but business decisions seem to be part of it. Campaign 3 seems specifically structured to kill off any remaining wotc trademarks. While a good business decision, not a very compelling story when the characters have little to no connections to the gods. No more livestreaming means little incentive to subscribe to twitch. Which if they're not live, why have the break in the middle? It used to be fan art and give you a vhance to hit the bathroom. Now it's ditched the fan art and doubles down on merch ads, which they also di at the beginning. And somehow Laura has gotten worse at merch plugs. Yes, hold up an item that is the size of a quarter, don't blther to zoom in, and tell me how cool it is. Her flustered and unprepared schtick isnt cute or endearing, it's grating on someone who has been doing this for 8 years.
All this is not to mention they have fewer episodes per month, so things drag out more. All of the above make this feel more corporate and less "we just turned on a camera for our home game."
A big issue for critical role is they are too self-conscious about creating a show. It started and went viral because it was literally just a group of friends, who happen to be talented improve voice actors, putting their weekly TTRPG game in front of a camera. Rough around the edges, very spontaneous. Humor and drams just happened. Now it feels like they are drying to _force_ the drama (and sometimes the humor). For C4, they should try creating characters with no more than 3 lines of backstory each, and Matt should run it as a sandbox with a high chance of death. And they should literally film in someone's kitchen, family room, or basement. Get back to roots. Let the "story", drama and humor go where they may. Unfortunately it looks like Daggerheart leans heavily into story/drama, so they may end up even more self-consciously trying to force drama, humor, and big personal character arcs.
There has been a drop across everything classed as 'nerdy'. The hype days are over, going back to the core fandom again slowly.
thats really cool to hear if true, if tourist piss off maybe games will stop being dumbed down.
It feels like, when im watching, the cast is checked out.
By design as they have had a falling out with Hasbro and are attempting to split on their own. They are under contract I would imagine.
@@oldmanfunky4909 So far, I havent liked any of the other stuff they have done, Candela and Dragon Heart dont interest me.
Candela Obscura is boring
@@funkymunky7935 I dont find the game boring, but dessing up olde timey and playing it serious throughout is off putting for that length of time.
I think they know they're not live anymore. They got complacent.
I think there are a few things that go into it, but I highly doubt this is the end of CR
Are we sure it doesn't have a lot to do with the fact that season 3 isn't nearly as good as season 2? Like, we went from Ruths Chris Steakhouse to Applebees. I WANT to love it all like in the past, but C.O. is....plodding.
I think a lot of it is too many clowns. Vox machina and Mighty Nein both had about one to two clowns in the cast (Scanlan and Grog/Jester and Mollymauk) and the other characters were more serious in nature. But Bells Hells has FCG, Fern, Laudna, and Chetney. Not to mention most guest characters. The only grounded characters seem to be Orim and Imogen and its just not enough. And the story has just been all over the place, im only like twenty-something episodes in and i dont know what the point is. Which can be fine but there seems to be almost not through-line. They trecked to some other town for like 3 session to do a...thieving competition? Even though that's NONE of their specialties. And then just came back. Like a dozen hours of content for literally no reason. Maybe the plot picks up soon but my god lets do something important please. Half the cast is trying to do the plot but the other half overshadows them to fuck around with hijinx because there's too many clowns trying to out funny each other. Laudna and Imogen's relationship has started to get interesting but now we gotta spend 3 hours with fern as a little mouse thing
I think you accidentally read a description of what my players normally do in my campaigns instead of criticism of campaign 3....
yeah, Its almost like we're watching a bunch of nerdy ass voice actors play DnD
In my opinion, the scheduling has also kind of made it hard to get into the new campaign. A break at the end of the month sounds good, but it also means I never feel like im in a rythm with the campaign, you know? It feels like every time I start getting into it they have a break, and sometimes scheduling lines up in such a way that a new episode doesn't come out for another 2 or 3 weeks. It kills any momentum.
Also it feels really forced
I was fine with it when it was announced, because I was certain (and still am) that it was mainly for Matt's mental health. Having to prep for a massive game _every week_ while still doing everything else I'm sure he does _has_ to be draining... Taking that week off lets him catch up and reset.
But from a viewer's standpoint, I think you're absolutely right. That break interrupts the 'flow' of the show, which makes it difficult to get into.
I feel like if they're gonna pre-record anyway they should make a buffer that way episodes can still play weekly.
I agree with your comment here and the responses to your comment below.
It used to be a game I could see myself playing. Now it is too overproduced, over-accessorized and overacted. I can't afford all those gadgets and extras that they use which makes me feel disengaged.
I completely agree. But I will also say that I think you’re missing some major pieces to the puzzle.
Let’s not forget that Critical Role at the moment plays D&D, and what companies are behind D&D? WOTC and Hasbro. The companies that have had massive scandal after massive scandal for the past what 2 years? People are very dissolutions with D&D right now no matter how much they might love it. So watching a D&D actual play might not appeal as much to many people. On top of that, you kinda have to call it an actual play because Critical Role stopped recording live and has been pre-recorded since the pandemic. During the pandemic it made sense to go pre-recorded because of the restraints. But that’s not a hindrance anymore. Of course live viewers are going to go down if it’s already prerecorded and will be put on UA-cam later. But look at the numbers for the last couple times they were actually live recently being the 9th anniversary episode the Daggerheart open beta session zero and One-Shot, and the sick day. People want to watch and experience the show with them live.
And with Daggerheart on the way many people are absolutely convinced that it will be the system for the next campaign so are also more than willing to bow out on their D&D stuff.
I will say that Dimension20, another 5e user is more entertaining to me. It's the only other actual play I watch, but NADNDPOD, Legends of Aventrius, TAZ, etc also all use 5e and people also enjoy them. For me, I checked out right at the mid season climax. I burned myself out, though I enjoyed testing the Daggerheart beta.
At the risk of getting flamed. Some of the critters can be aggressively toxic and bully people out of the community. Sadly Critical Roll has really done very little about it or to address it.
This is a big factor. Critters at feral and act like the cast are their real life friends, it's very creepy.
Those same toxic ones tend to also flame and bully the cast tbh
Your point is so under-appreciated by the masses.
So not unlike Jameson Stone and Satine Pheonix then? Who would have thought?
Exactly HOW do you propose they address the toxicity? They can't do much more than ask people to not be dicks, and they have done that already. Can't control people with a snap of the fingers mate.
Jack sparrow was very popular in the poc movies, but his stand-alone movie flopped. He worked because others carried the drama. Same thing with campaign 3.
All the C3 characters have dead-end backstorys. All are either near death, dead, nihilistic, or righteously suicidal. Non have any plans or hopes for the future or growth. None of them have anyone depending on them at a personal level, none have anyone to let down or disappoint. Only FCG was actively pursuing growth, making commitments and connections, but at the same time also itching to do what he did. Thats why it actually had an impact, anyone else at the table could have rolled a D100 and died in their sleep or melted into slag and nobody would have really cared. At least that's what it feels like and in the end it's what a show like this makes you feel that is important
"All the C3 characters have dead-end backstorys. All are either near death, dead, nihilistic, or righteously suicidal. Non have any plans or hopes for the future or growth. None of them have anyone depending on them at a personal level, none have anyone to let down or disappoint. "
I'm cautiously agreeing with you here. But couldn't we say the same about the entire vox machina team? The person depending on them was each-other. Thats it.
Mighty Nein, Jester had her mother, Nott had his kid and husband. But thats it.
I have never watched them but I've tried. My major issue is I do not have 4 hour to dedicate to sitting and watching other people play a game. Not sure if there is a fix to that since playing D&D takes alot of time. But like you said, during Covid people had time to spare, now with things back to "normal" I cant imagine many people have that kind of time for a single content provider.
All their sessions are recorded and posted to both Twitch and UA-cam. So you could listen in on partial episodes when time allows.
I tend to watch about an hour an evening so it can take me all week to watch none episode
@@williamatkins3465 I hear ya. I did that for the first 2 campaigns, but I just couldn't get into campaign 3. I think I made it through episode 20 or so, then just stopped.
idk what you expect out of a dnd show....
Its all on Spotify in podcast format.
I listen at work.
It's because for a lot of people d&d fatigue is huge. And BG3 lets the people who couldn't get a d&d group who liked to pretend they were part of online games actually have a real gaming experience.
I'm kind of surprised there's not a single like or response to this. You're . . . probably right? I bet you covered 90% of it in two sentences. I'd add CR itself just has a lot of fatigue to it. Once I've seen 500 hours of their campaign content, do I really need 500 more? I suspect for a lot of people the answer is just no.
No the answer is simple. It's no longer a group of friends having fun with a silly little game of DnD. It's now a large scale corporation producing a high quality game of DnD to then broadcast at a later date. They are also prolonging the current season of this show because they need to wait for an in house product to be finished, and the writer of the show(Matt Mercer) now need to drag out what was clearly meant to be a short low level campaign far past its original time frame.
I'm a Critical Role fan myself, as little of the actual show as I've seen. It just seems natural for *anything* that gets this big to slowly decline after the explosion of hype. I'd honestly just love the next season of the Vox Machina animated series, and to see anything more about the Mighty Nein follow-up.
If I'm honest campaigns 1&2 were the best.
How often does someone actually 'deserve' the internet's ire? The internet is like a blind sniper. They might target someone that does deserve it once in a while, but more often than not someone just gets caught in the crossfire for no good reason at all.
I don't think Daggerheart has a chance to overtake D&D as the de facto game of the hobby. Not even remotely. From what I've seen of it, it wants to boast about being fresh and new, while simultaneously being a close to 1 to 1 conversion of 5e concepts and rules. Similarly, it wants to be "easier" to play, yet has the players and GM having to micro manage different cards and tokens, on top of dice and character sheets. And let's not even get into the whole "no initiative" thing.
There are three sorts of people I can imagine adopting the game.
First are the Critical Role die hards. The people responsible for the whole "Matt Mercer Effect". They don't really care about the D&D aspect of the show at all. They'll get the Daggerheart book because it says "Critical Role" on the cover (actually, I don't think it has a cover yet, but figure of speech, you get the idea)
Second, the D&D players that also watch Critical Role. These people played TTRPGs well before Critical Role was a thing. They like the show, but aren't fanatic about it.
Third, people who have no idea, at all, what Critical Role is. They do exist, rare unicorns though they might be. Might pick up the book completely without bias.
A lot of the comments explain most of the things that I also think about Critical Role. I will say that for the most part critical role was watching voice actors playing LIVE and people could comment. The Players could interact with those people if they chose to do so. when they switched over to pre recorded, the fans carried over for a while to support..but it is a different feel. Not to say you cant do prerecorded stuff and be good. Look at Diminsion 20 but they are also short fast games.
I think if they went back to live show it would help but I also know that it is hard for them to do that. They are all very active and Popular Voice actors on top of having kids and such things. I do hope that critical role can recover in a healthy way.
dude, they stopped responding to comments LONG before they switched to recorded vids. Sure, they "could" respond, and they chose not to interact because Chat is toxic as HELL. Also "recover" lol, I assure you they're doing fine.
Oersonally for me it was them not being live that made me stop cuz it felt....more staged idono
I watched every episode since number one on G&S when they had folding tables and terrible audio, but I ran out of steam by episode 65 of season three. One of the cool things about the first season is that because they started publicly streaming with higher level characters (level eight I think), we got to see them ascend to demi-gods. Season two felt like a missed opportunity, that we never got to see the full potential of those characters through a natural story arc. Season three just felt like such a slog, I kept trying to chew through it to episode 70 so far.
I think you have really come close to hitting the nail on the head there - its not that CR is in any real trouble, but that many folks that have been there from the beginning (or at least of Hells Bells arc) are a little fatigued. I know after campaign one I took a long break before starting 2 as that much CR (or any actual play) at once becomes a slog. So with covid making every single nerd in the world a captive audience at exactly the same time its perfectly natural for many folks to be burning out on trying to find time in their now busier lives for hundreds of hours of watching others play... Even if the content had gotten wildly better and everyone loved it more its a huge time commitment.
It was in no way implied that Alfred was working for the British in Burma. Weird reading. Burma got it's independence in 1948 dude, way too early for Alfred to have been old enough to have been operating there under British rule. Michael Caine himself was actually in his mid 70s at the time of filming The Dark Knight (born 1933) and even he was too young for that. Furthermore, Alfred specifically says that him and his "friends" were working for the local government, likely one of the regional military leaders in the Burmese (wasn't called Myanmar until 1989) junta. Viewers can then logically assume he was part of a hired mercenary outfit post-service during the 60s, 70s, or 80s and the bandit wasn't rebelling against the British because the British weren't in power. The bandit was just an asshat who wanted to watch the world burn.
This has been happening to a lot of UA-cam channels since January 2024. Something in the algorithm has changed and subscribers don't get the notifications when creators post videos.
Would be strange that UA-cam would do it to Critical role given how huge they are but I know it's happening.
Example I wasn't even aware there was a new candela obscura episode. And that's one of the things I actually watch from CR
@@exilelaflamme9184 Sign up for the weekly Critical Role newsletter.
If I was a player in C3, I would feel constantly railroaded but without direction, overshadowed by favourite NPCs, depressed by the overwhelming gloom and desperate to actually do character work. Not saying this is how the players feel, but if they did, it would explain them grabbing any plothook, derailing to talk dresses for hours and the trying to lighting the mood with schemes like pretending to be filming an entertainment product.
Campaign 1 was their masterpiece.
Campain 2 was 'hey, we're familiar with DnD now, i want to try this class next'
Campaign 3 seems more like them trying to figure out how to play classes they're not invested in.
But overall, they've made a multi-million dollar empire, they have 2 TV shows, and just sold out Wembly Stadium. I think they'll be ok.
The general feeling of the show has changed since they moved to pre-recorded, but more importantly the campaign just hasn't been very engaging. It's been painfully slow at times and the cast avoided progressing the intended narrative every chance they got.
At this point I prefer CR one shots, or smaller scope campaigns like Exu.
I haven't watched in forever. Because of my timezone I'd have to stay up late to watch. I just find it easier to wait for UA-cam.
It's hard to get excited by Candela Obscura considering it just is not exciting to watch. If I want to be purposefully depressed, I'll go to the DMV to hang out.
and it is NOT SCARY - it is too americanized to be scary, gory, disgusting ... it is like one of those lame scream movies
Agree. I love horror, so I had high hopes for Candela but as you said, it's very boring and depressing
Problem for me in 3rd campaign is boring. Problem started in beginning. One character died (and seemed it was planned), important npc was killed (harder to get into plot), and new players that were good add-ones, that then simply left. I think that plot was too confusing to even players. Also game doesn't feel natural anymore.
I've watched about 108 episodes of campaign 2 and that required me to almost live the show. I didn't stop liking the content, but it felt like, with 4 hours per week of content, one of two things happen:
1. I keep up and get burned out on it.
2. I don't keep up, and get overwhelmed by how much I need to watch to get caught up.
Eventually I just went to less committal content.
Dear gods, not to be mean, but I'm 5 minutes in and there has yet to be a point made. If there is a point, I will never know it, because after 5 minutes of nothing, I quit xD
Honestly, the reason I stopped watching campaign three is that the cast seem to be bored and going through the motions. Its like its become their Job or something... The whole thing feels phoned in a lot of the time. Then there is the forced pace of the narrative that does not allow for moments when the group can naturally bond. All in all it just feels like a lot of the cast are less engaged and simply going through the motions.
For me the Issue with CR campaign 3 is a lack of tension. There’s a Distinct lack of combat or Situations that have Delivered real stakes. Up until fairly Recently the characters ran from Most Dangerous situations. That and lackluster bbegs/end of Distinctive memorable arch’s within the campaign.
I can't wait for videos called "The 'Great News Everybody!' Crisis gets WORSE!!!!"
i used to watch every thursday night but it ends at like 2am for me and i have a baby now so i cant stay up anymore, i think alot of us are just growing up, to note, i do watch them on monday when it goes up as i have a wireless headset so i can care for bub and catch up :3
also, i want to support candella i just dont care for horror :o
CR season 3 is lacking a lot. It drags, its slow, its boring. More dungeon crawl and less improv is needed,
D&D is still the big seller. Although CR has a fan base, I don't think it will be as popular using another system.
Would you have any interest in cool terrain for your DND table top sessions? Not sure if you play more digital or physical.
As for campaign 3 downtrend... I found the start of the campaign the biggest problem. Unlike first 2 campaigns, it took around 45 episodes to actually get to metaplot going and finally give characters other than Imogen development.
The best thing CR has ever made was when Brennan Lee Mulligan was the DM for EXU Calamity. Nothing they'll make will outdo that.
Brennan is a pretty good GM. But EXU was not a good game. I think Brennan is a better player. Get him a character sheet and let him lead the party.
@@davidbeppler3032 What didn't you like about it? I thought EXU Calamity was great.
@@davidbeppler3032 NGL I consider Calamity to best D&D I've ever witnessed. Just my personal opinion tho :)
There should be a ttrpg where your pipped d6s are 3×3 rubiks cubes and your character sheets are hexatetraflexagons too.
Woah... Rubik's cube d6s is actually kind of a great idea...
@@ogreboy8843 I just need a way to Get Them and I can begin experimenting!!!
@@youtubeuniversity3638 There's mini Rubik's cubes for cheap on Ali Express. Don't ask me why I know that.
@@youtubeuniversity3638 I think to get the distribution as even as possible, 4 pips rotates to become a diamond, and either the 2 or the 3 rotates to horizonal (If you consider the 6 to be two vertical lines).
That leaves 2 opposing corners slightly overweighted. If you wanted to overweight 2 sides instead you'd rotate the 2 or the 3 (the one that's still diagonal) to vertical.
@@ogreboy8843 I'm not confident I necesaarily *want* as even of a distribution as I am able to get to be honest.
I think in fact it might be more fun to wrestle with the consequences of using a standard pipped die layout.
This is about the fourth time recently that I have heard about viewer numbers falling off a cliff since January. It seems to be happening across many fields and is irrespective of subscriber numbers.
there are several factors causing the downturn, but something people mostly miss and probably has a huge impact is the 4h episode consists of 2h of rolling dice, being terrible at math and then moving back to actual meat and potatoes. it's just boring to watch even when you like the story and their playing.
compound with being prerecorded but without any viewer boons like editing cuts to instill proper pacing or the draws of being live, fatigue, references to previous stuff that alienates those that didn't consume past campaigns, dnd controversies , novelty wearing off, less entertaining characters, a lot of the cast being bad at the mechanical side of play, and it goes on...
daggerheart will get some curiosity and help with some issues but it won't offset things enough much like candela didn't as well. and as soon as people are playing it at large and realize that the system is more new player friendly than dnd but even more reliant on GM fiat than dnd and start having terrible experiences playing it - especially with people trying out GMing first time tricked by it being a simpler system than dnd not realising how it makes life harder for the GM in some aspects - the interest in the system will drop...
I stopped watching (in background while painting minis) because I started to cringe too much at what was happening and the show didn't inspire me anymore.
Discourse has been charmed, quick cast dispel magic before she obliterates us all.
Do your view/watch numbers account for when they started streaming on youtube as well? Because I think a lot of people also stream there instead of twitch now.
Definitely correct on the post pandemic slump. It seems that it is something that a lot of companies forget about as things start slowing down now everything is almost completely like pre-pandemic. I'd be interested to see the view counts on Critical Role videos in the time before and see how they compare to now.
I'm hopeful for future Critical Role games as, strange as it sounds, the third campaign feels like it has lost the magic they had in the first two. As if there has been a greater move towards production quality and promotions, but there is less heart in the game.
For example, in a recent 4-sided dive laura discussed how she spent time deciding on what accent Imogen should have, it wasn't a natural development like Vex'ahlia was from the home game, or Jester from previous one shots which, from what I've read, was more likely a spure of the moment creation. There's also no feeling of an evolving world, there is a deadline approaching which was presented fairly early on in the campaign that casts a shadow over the whole game. It's coming to an end, just in what way, and what comes next?
Can we recover from the clickbait which is flowing all over this episode>
It’s ironic that this video comes out the same day as the episode that has reinvigorated life into this series
It’s a clickbait “drama” channel, their entire purpose is to overdramatize things for attention
If by recover you mean living his best life and being more successful than ever? Then yeah, I think he'll be okay.
Alfreds dimond theif was not trying to combat British empirialism, he was literally just a clepto who wanted to watch both the British buyers and the indigenous sellers suffer bc he was sadistic and criminally insane. If he wanted the brits to suffer he would have just sold the precious stones to improve life for his people. Its not like yhe brits would be able to track the sales at the time.
For me as a DM I quit running games when most of my players started playing silly non serious characters.
Why? Most players seek some place where they can be chaotic. A place where to be free, childish. Not another world where to do chores, chores, chores. I mean... Quests.
@@nicoleta8964 and some DM's don't want that. Super normal man, just chill.
When you're no longer forced to be locked inside, you stop watching s**t.
This is a huuuuge part of it that I think people are missing. I think C2 had a large amount of the audience join during Covid (myself included) and used that time to catch up and begin watching live until the end. Someone who is now too busy to keep up with C3 would have been just as too-busy to keep up if Covid never happened in the first place.
It's a pretty unhealthy capitalist mindset that anything other than permanent growth means the project is dying. Their viewership numbers have dropped for a variety of reasons, and I think that's fine considering they've also expanded horizontally into animated properties, board games, and making their own ttrpg system
I have personally enjoyed C3's story, but I definitely understand where people are coming from critiquing the pace of it. I HIGHLY recommend checking out the most recent episode, as it was probably the best paced one we've had in a long while, & feels like it's coming to some very big things. Something has definitely changed this campaign though. It's taken me a while to really figure it out, but I think it's because the parties' failures have defined who they are, which has led to this constant of them feeling underpowered and doing everything they can to find more. And so it's kind of come off as meandering and uninteresting but there's also been some REALLY great story beats and character work hidden through all of it. Episodes 78,79, and 80 cannot have happened without a nearly 10 episode arc of story beforehand, and as I mentioned at the top, Ep 90 has really felt like Matt is about to up the ante on these players. There's probably around 20 episodes left this year, and I have a feeling we'll be seeing the conclusion of this campaign by then.
This "Doom Rambling" seems a tad disingenuous. Seems like your just trying to have a spicy take with a "CANCELLED" written in big bold red across the CR crew in your thumbnail to grab rage bait views.
A standard episode of Critical Role from 3 days ago is over a quarter of a million views. Seems like they're doing the same numbers they used to.
After 2020 people switched to watching videos after they streamed, when they have free time.
I don't quite inderstand What your take in this video is. The views are basically the same as 2023, they're just shifting from Live views to after views.
Every single TTRPG channel lost live viewers after the pandem...
I know I dropped CR when the OGL shitstorm rolled in.
This is the first time I've seen someone say what I've been assuming is going on, but it's said so quickly in the end. The plot of C3 is setting up moving Exandria to Daggerheart. The main IP issue they had publishing an Exandria setting book, were the gods that are owned by Hasbro. They're pulling out all the D&D elements from their IP to go all in.
The thing is, that kind of IP first creativity second approach is what brought us Morbius and Madam Web so . . .
I dropped C3 pretty early on, for no particular reason other than time management. When I do have time to watch critical role, I pick up where I left off, I've recently been powering through some of the C3 episodes where the team has been split into two separate parties and man did it kill the momentum. So I can understand the pacing issues people bring up. Just as things were ramping up, everything came to an abrupt halt. Then we get introduced to more characters with the one party, and they do their thing for a few weeks. Then we gear shift to the other group, and it just really kills my interest with the start/stop nature of it all.
Critical Role might be able to get their numbers back up if they are willing to run a Pathfinder 2E campaign one of the main problems with Dungeons & Dragons 5E is that there is only so much you can do with it where as Pathfinder 2E you have so many options that it does not become boring
The system you use to play a tabletop game doesn’t influence the narrative. No matter the system they use, the narrative would still be pretty much the same so I’d say your argument is pretty invalid.
Just wanted to commend that fantastic bit of alliteration. I'd have subscribed just for that if I hadn't already done so ages ago.
I have a take, not sure how substantial it is. With the popularity of D&D skyrocketing due to mediums like Critical Role or more recently, Baldur's Gate 3, more and more people are getting into D&D and playing it themselves. And if you're playing a game yourself, there's little reason to watch someone else play it. Their viewership will probably go back up when Daggerheart takes off in full after some testing and serious polishing
They are privately owned, so bad signs don't start sinking the ship, unlike with investors. And if you look up their monthly gained views on youtube, it has not changed in 3 years - at all; 14M views Jan 22, 11M views Jan 23, and 16M views in Jan 24. There used to be incentive for viewers to tune in live but the live aspect was something the stepped away from.
I'm not sure how this warranted a "CANCELLED" thumbnail.
Great video boss. I appreciate you going into the weeds
"... like Ned, before the whole head thing." 😄👍
You have been stating that D&D is dead for at least 2 years. Critical Role will likely have its ups and downs BUT they are talented people that will always be involved in gaming and succeed in any endeavor they see fit to follow. People may stop watching and followers may waiver but Critical Role will exist in some form. People will cry and hate those that continue to produce entertainment. But that never stopped talented people.