When i read "darkhorse", I thought: "What? Darkhorse?". PILs' biggest, maybe only, hit ("Rise") is on Album - which made me thought that "darkhorse" didn't fit, and so did Grant. But... when Andy pointed out why Album can be seen as one, it made sense. Album was my gateway to PIL in 86/87, so my perception is different: 1-"Rise" was playing on radio (in Brazil, mind you), 2- PIL played some concerts here in august 87, 3- it has Vai, Baker, Ryuichi Sakamoto as musicians... To me it was succesful. But, for such a weird band, critic's darlings with "non-muscians", an album with a big hit (and a marvelous one), great musicians, top notch recording it is a "darkhorse moment" - specially if its not well received by critics and long time fans. Great comments on this one, people, congrats!. Reed points were interesting - specially coming from a non-alternative kid from the 80's. His points on the post-punk movement were well-based and funny (although not that accurated).PS: Like Andy, I got into BAD at the same time (both PIL and BAD played in Brazil at the same month - I did not see either, I was too young, 13, and lived in a city far away from São Paulo). But, funnily enough, BAD was not as popular as PIL. They didn't have a hit (at the time and ever) like Rise.
Glad you guys are discussing this “Album,” lol. I listened the hell out of this (cassette in car mainly)! I loved the songs, the production and both Lydon and Vai. Lots of passion and creativity!
What is funny about the generic titling of the album is that Lyndon described PIL as a corporation and “Album” was product and packaged in a simple label, much the same as the generic products that were on supermarket shelves at the time - corn, tomato soup, etc. There were no credits, so it took a trained ear to hear a DX-7 or know who was playing on it. I laughed at the “people who need people” comment because there is a Streisand song with the lyrics like “people who need people are the luckiest of people” and that was typical Lydon to turn it into a theme that he would revisit again in the single Disappointed. Great discussion on a great album. Thank you.
Just wanted to say I loved this episode, would love to see the contrarians doing more post-punk, synth pop and alternative, to became "less rockist" cause I think you have done all the major rock and metal bands by this point. So what about doing Kraftwerk, Depeche Mode, NIN, Cocteau Twins, Ministry, Devo, maybe Pere Ubu? More stuff like that. "More synths, less guitars", fuck early Queen lol, but of course I love Steve Vai.
The album before this (this is what you want) was commercial. The one before that was actually called "commercial zone" and is only available in vinyl. That is a very good album and is the best example of the mid point between early and late PIL. I think "Album" is pretty firmly in the modern PIL era for me. But its very good too. I dont think PIL ever got back the innovation and creativity of the first 4 records but Album is my favourite of the later ones. I think the people on it are amazing but sometimes I wish their personality shined throught a bit more. The drums are PIL drums, not ginger baker or tony williams drums. They are doing a job
A thought for a Contrarians episode. Best Paul Simon album as Rhythm of the Saints. Though commercially successful coming on the heads of Graceland, it did not enjoy the success on the single chats that other Simon efforts have. But it is adventurish, taking what Simon started on Graceland further in a rich, percussion driven soundscape. It can challenge listeners, but the rewards are immense. And Adrian Belew plays on 1 track (he's on like 5 or 6 on Graceland).
I agree this is a dark horse since it's a departure from any other PIL record, & I think that's what John Lydon wanted. He loved to say "fuck off" even to devoted fans.
I bought the LP when it first came out, and still listen to the CD. "F.F.F." is one of my favorite songs of the '80s. Lydon's vocals are captivating, the drums and bass are like thunder, and Vai's guitar takes it to another level. In my opinion, Vai's playing here sounds more like Andy Taylor than Adrian Belew, if there must be a comparison. Definitely a 9 out of 10 album for me. As far as the later PIL albums, I would say they were slicker sounding and much less raw. I wouldn't call them commercial due to the subject matter of a lot of the lyrics, despite the music being very danceable. I like them, but "Album" was the perfect bridge between the band's early and later material, and pretty much stands alone.
Big fan of Flowers of Romance & Live in Tokyo. Never quite got "Album" and don't like anything that followed. I do think Album is a good album though, but it just doesn't speak to me. great show! Probably 7/10 for the performances and production. Cheers.
On paper this album is a disaster. It shouldn’t work. In reality it’s a masterpiece…and imo the best album of the decade. Credit to Bill Laswell (for his vision and ability to pull this off) cannot be overstated. 10/10
Terrible album, PiL went to crap after Keith left. Everything from 78 to 83 was killer though. PS please do more vids on Post-Punk, Alternative, Noise Rock etc. That stuff is just as good as "rock" and metal.
What do you rate PiL album out of 10?
Support us on Patreon or Ko-Fi:
www.patreon.com/contrarians
ko-fi.com/thecontrarians
8/10
When i read "darkhorse", I thought: "What? Darkhorse?". PILs' biggest, maybe only, hit ("Rise") is on Album - which made me thought that "darkhorse" didn't fit, and so did Grant. But... when Andy pointed out why Album can be seen as one, it made sense. Album was my gateway to PIL in 86/87, so my perception is different: 1-"Rise" was playing on radio (in Brazil, mind you), 2- PIL played some concerts here in august 87, 3- it has Vai, Baker, Ryuichi Sakamoto as musicians... To me it was succesful. But, for such a weird band, critic's darlings with "non-muscians", an album with a big hit (and a marvelous one), great musicians, top notch recording it is a "darkhorse moment" - specially if its not well received by critics and long time fans. Great comments on this one, people, congrats!. Reed points were interesting - specially coming from a non-alternative kid from the 80's. His points on the post-punk movement were well-based and funny (although not that accurated).PS: Like Andy, I got into BAD at the same time (both PIL and BAD played in Brazil at the same month - I did not see either, I was too young, 13, and lived in a city far away from São Paulo). But, funnily enough, BAD was not as popular as PIL. They didn't have a hit (at the time and ever) like Rise.
Glad you guys are discussing this “Album,” lol. I listened the hell out of this (cassette in car mainly)! I loved the songs, the production and both Lydon and Vai. Lots of passion and creativity!
You've all forgotten Tony Williams, who is by far the most instrumentally influential musician playing on the album. RIP.
Definitely a massive achievement. Record came from out of nowhere
Steve Vai played with Zappa, Lydon is a Beefheart freak, do the math
What is funny about the generic titling of the album is that Lyndon described PIL as a corporation and “Album” was product and packaged in a simple label, much the same as the generic products that were on supermarket shelves at the time - corn, tomato soup, etc. There were no credits, so it took a trained ear to hear a DX-7 or know who was playing on it. I laughed at the “people who need people” comment because there is a Streisand song with the lyrics like “people who need people are the luckiest of people” and that was typical Lydon to turn it into a theme that he would revisit again in the single Disappointed. Great discussion on a great album. Thank you.
Just wanted to say I loved this episode, would love to see the contrarians doing more post-punk, synth pop and alternative, to became "less rockist" cause I think you have done all the major rock and metal bands by this point. So what about doing Kraftwerk, Depeche Mode, NIN, Cocteau Twins, Ministry, Devo, maybe Pere Ubu? More stuff like that. "More synths, less guitars", fuck early Queen lol, but of course I love Steve Vai.
The album before this (this is what you want) was commercial. The one before that was actually called "commercial zone" and is only available in vinyl. That is a very good album and is the best example of the mid point between early and late PIL. I think "Album" is pretty firmly in the modern PIL era for me. But its very good too. I dont think PIL ever got back the innovation and creativity of the first 4 records but Album is my favourite of the later ones. I think the people on it are amazing but sometimes I wish their personality shined throught a bit more. The drums are PIL drums, not ginger baker or tony williams drums. They are doing a job
bought this when it came out. it knocked my socks off. still haven't found ,em.
Easily my favourite PiL album, nice one!
A thought for a Contrarians episode. Best Paul Simon album as Rhythm of the Saints. Though commercially successful coming on the heads of Graceland, it did not enjoy the success on the single chats that other Simon efforts have. But it is adventurish, taking what Simon started on Graceland further in a rich, percussion driven soundscape. It can challenge listeners, but the rewards are immense. And Adrian Belew plays on 1 track (he's on like 5 or 6 on Graceland).
I agree this is a dark horse since it's a departure from any other PIL record, & I think that's what John Lydon wanted. He loved to say "fuck off" even to devoted fans.
I bought the LP when it first came out, and still listen to the CD. "F.F.F." is one of my favorite songs of the '80s. Lydon's vocals are captivating, the drums and bass are like thunder, and Vai's guitar takes it to another level. In my opinion, Vai's playing here sounds more like Andy Taylor than Adrian Belew, if there must be a comparison. Definitely a 9 out of 10 album for me.
As far as the later PIL albums, I would say they were slicker sounding and much less raw. I wouldn't call them commercial due to the subject matter of a lot of the lyrics, despite the music being very danceable. I like them, but "Album" was the perfect bridge between the band's early and later material, and pretty much stands alone.
10!. Love that album. What an odd combination of musicians, but it worked!.
Miles Davis is somewhere on Album too!
Big fan of Flowers of Romance & Live in Tokyo. Never quite got "Album" and don't like anything that followed. I do think Album is a good album though, but it just doesn't speak to me. great show! Probably 7/10 for the performances and production. Cheers.
On paper this album is a disaster. It shouldn’t work. In reality it’s a masterpiece…and imo the best album of the decade. Credit to Bill Laswell (for his vision and ability to pull this off) cannot be overstated. 10/10
that headset mic makes this hard to listen to.
❤❤❤❤
Terrible album, PiL went to crap after Keith left. Everything from 78 to 83 was killer though. PS please do more vids on Post-Punk, Alternative, Noise Rock etc. That stuff is just as good as "rock" and metal.
I prefer the earlier ones but give it a chance again maybe? the first few times i heard it i wasnt that impressed but now i really like it
That loud mouth breathing🙄