For those interested, Sean J. Barry has a great instruction document on the web. Here is the link to a .pdf www.hangoutstorage.com/banjohangout.org/storage/attachments/archived/files/preparing-bone--2012-574917912014.pdf
I have a big shin bone from a cow that's been naturally dried out in the sun do you think it would work it's been dried white for two years at lest I keep it because of the bone nut's I could maybe cut from it. I just got a Squire Strat CV 60's it was the last one they had a rosewood fingerboard now they use palmeno wood or maple salesman the guitar was ordered w/a Bone Nut installed guys wife made em send it back they charge $90 for a Bone Nut upgrade at Sweetwater. I have to say no ping's in the bone nut. Great playing Strat. I'd love to have bone nut & saddle for my 12 string acoustic & 6 string acoustics. That thing sings it could only get better w/bone I think.
I am not sure if time will take the oils out of the bone by itself. I am no authority on the subject but I would try to degrease it regardless. The sun MAY have taken the moisture out, but it is the oils that will react with glues and finishes, and may also go rancid as far as my logic tells me.
Hey bro!! Thanks for your time in sharing this process with us! I’m about to make my own nut and saddle for a bashed up, 1970s _EKO_ guitar I have been restoring somewhere near to its former glory. I actually think it’s gonna be better than it was in the first place as it never had any bone components but instead an aluminium saddle (🤔🤷♂️😵💫), was literally covered in a 2mm layer of lacquer that was all cracked and nasty looking, the machine heads were all bent and terrible looking, so I’m now waiting for the new ones to arrive. I bought some nice looking chrome ones that lock. I really can’t wait to get some strings on it and hear what it sounds like!!!!!
One last step to removing the grease from the bones is after the soak in the white gas (Colman fuel) place the bones in a pan of cold water (make sure the bones are completely covered with the water). Add a couple of cap fulls of clear ammonia ( the amount is not highly critical) to the water and bring the water to a full boil. Let it boil for a few minutes. You will see any remaining grease come to the surface. Simply soaking the bones in a degreaser, ie. the Colman fuel, loosens the grease but you need to then drive the loosened grease from the bones. The boiling action accomplishes this. The ammonia further facilitates the removal. After the boiling (2-5 min), let the water cool and skim off as much of the gunk as you can and remove the bones. You can use a bit of liquid dish soap and water to wash off any residue that might be on the outside of the bones from the gunk in the water. If you decide you want bleached bone use hydrogen peroxide for the bleaching agent. You can use the stuff you get from the drug store. I think it is around a 3 percent concentration. You could add a bit of water to it, perhaps up to 1 part water to one part peroxide. Either way how long you leave it in the solution is somewhat by trial. Start with a few hours, rinse and let dry, preferably in the sun. If, after the bones are dry you want more bleaching put them back in the solution. This type of bleaching will be pretty gentle to the integrity of the bone. Any bleaching will deteriorate the bone to a degree, but this method is pretty good. DO NOT USE BLEACH, LIKE CLOROX!! This is harmful to the bone. As far as the initial boiling of the bones, I believe the more you boil the more the bone is compromised. I would re-evaluate that. Thank you for sharing this. Creating one's own materials can be fun for the full "hand crafted" experience.
Just wanted to chime in here. I hadn’t seen this method elsewhere in my research either but I decided to try out boiling the blanks after the gasoline soak...and was amazed to see the drops of grease leach and gather on the surface! This tells me that it’s worthwhile to do so
What’s the benefit you get from thoroughly degreasing the bones like this? I haven’t actually tried making my own blanks yet, so I’m just curious about the “why” behind this part of the process. Do they stink like rancid beef if you don’t degrease them thoroughly lol
@@arsamy96 Do you have access to charcoal lighter fluid? Lighter fluid is a light petroleum distillate, aka naphtha. Maybe they’re just calling it by a different name in your country?
An alternative is to boil the bones in 30 per cent bleach and just wash and dry them. You will get white and odor-free pieces. In fact, Vet college used this method to build a frame for anatomy model.
Bleach will break down the bones hardness & made it crumbly. Not good way to go in the long run it's as bad a greasy bone a couple of the Naphtha baths should suffice.That's a great article on the subject in the description.
French Onion Soup makes great banjo nuts and pistol grips. My local meat market got all excited when I told them what I wanted.Brought out a whole tray to pick from. I got some hamburger to say thanks. Nice job.
Yep...you're welcome! Just working on a bone nut now! It's satisfying to make something from scratch! Makes the instrument special when you hand fabricate the parts.☺🎸🎶
I love doing stuff like this. Who cares if you save money or it even costs more. The fact that you can do it is enjoyment enough. Just like when someone compliments my shoes and I say "Thanks, I made them myself."
You can buy the same piece of bone filled with peanut butter for your dog. My lab cleans the peanut butter and I get cheap nut and saddle material. Also, the bone is already cooked and cured. A win/win situation
Is ist better to cut the nuts vertically or horizontally out of the bone. Thinking about it, it seems to better to cut it so the porous sides are pointing to the head and the saddle of the guitar...
From what I have seen, the "ends" of the bone go across the board. So the strings go across the "grain" of the bone, more or less. I could be mistaken though.
Hello. Thank you very much for the tutorial! I've been doing a thorough research about the process and there are a variety of recipes on internet but this one, which make heed on the degreesing of the bone, seems to be the smartest. I boiled the bone and I have it clean and drying. I think I will use turpentine instead of coleman fuel but I haven't decided yet. Any thoughts about it? Thanks again!
Question: is it necessary to de-fat the bones? I feel like then, the nut would be, "self-lubricating," for a while, at least. Or maybe it would make gluing the nut much harder/impossible?
If you do not remove the fat, it will go rancid and smell bad. You only need a couple of dots of glue to hold a nut in place, usually on the end grain of the finger board. More than that will cause issues if it needs work again. Yes, fat will interfere with the glue.
Hey thanks for making this video a lot of great info. I watched your vid on making nut blanks with the dog bone from petsmart , is the bone from petsmart as hard and dense as the bone you get from the butcher?
I was wondering if antler would work, as I have a decent supply of it already well enough cured for stuff like knife handles. Does it still require degreasing, or any other special steps?
I just came across your post, I have tons of red stag & axis antlers, And I kept thinking these would make wonderful nuts for a Stratocaster I'm rebuilding.. Is there anything special I need to consider, or can I just simply shape the very tip and make a nice fitting blanked out of it? Danny in Texas..
I use a arc saw, is much better, you can easily cut the piece. Sometimes I ask my butcher to cut it to me. For the cleaning, I use to throw them to my dogs lol. They work on the meat and marrow for a while, and they use to forget about the bones (or burry them). Then I boil it if needed. I make picks, and I've made a knife for opening letters.. I really love the picks, and my son loves the knife.
Naptha is different from kerosene and acetone. Naptha is also sold as Lighter fluid (Zippo, Ronsonol, etc), White gas, Camp stove fuel, Coleman fuel (for their lanterns and stoves).
you can save yourself a lot of soaking time, by cutting the bone into blanks or at least slices before defatting. cutting is a little less smelly and dusty, if you dont wait for it to dry. simmer 20 minutes or so with plenty of dish spap and a little splash of bleach, wash and let them dry. letting the bones dry between ~24h (or 1h with initial vacuum) naphta soaks helps to draw out the fat faster. 3-4 passes should do. for a pure white you can bleach with H202 after this. long story short, i used bone for inlays. EDIT: spap was supposed to read soap, too amusing to change it.
Did you eat the remaining broth? It's all upside down: most people throw out bones from their soup not having a slightest idea of how many guitar nuts they could make out of those bones.
That's just what was left over after cutting off slightly oversized nut blanks, or, I can cut it in half again and get 2 more nut sized blanks, which I may have more use for. 20 strings? You're giving me ideas....lol.
@@JimDockrellWatertone When dad was a diver on Guam in the 1960's - they would spearfish and after they cut up the catch for the meat the locals would use the bones to make stuff with so dad would put the carcass on an ant bed and they stripped fast and neat.
Jim Dockrell but whats the reason for it? I bought bone at the dogstore and didnt use all these steps still worked superb. And very fun doing it! You should make a video shaping saddles too,with these approach.
Good raw material, even for inlays. I learned a lot from the process. The three weeks seem to have changed a lot. Thanks for sharing. Have you used the broth for a meal?
Give your head a shake there. Of the millions of people working in processing meat in the world, if it gave you Anthrax..........well, we would know wouldn't we? Kinda hard to hide that if it were true.
I don't think the Anthrax spores (assuming they were there in the 1st place) would survive boiling for such a long time... But thanks for the suggestion, I'll listen to Anthrax when I'll be shaping my blanks.
you could have broiled the bone/marrow and had a haute cuisine. People pay big bucks to eat the shit parts of the animal. In all seriousness though I have made a few nuts this way and they work fantastic, just a little labor intensive.
@@cseeger1 Know the joy and the procedure. More knowledgeable builders and less dumb consumers. If the factories go bust or importation taxes skyrocket, we go Meh and keep on with business as usual - or even better.
Have not had an opportunity to have an instrument that needs one....but there will be one soon that needs a new saddle....stay tuned and thanks for watching. This one just shows how to prepare it properly so the fats and oils don't mess with glues or finish.
For those interested, Sean J. Barry has a great instruction document on the web. Here is the link to a .pdf www.hangoutstorage.com/banjohangout.org/storage/attachments/archived/files/preparing-bone--2012-574917912014.pdf
Ha! I think that is the one of the sources I used. Thanks.
I have a big shin bone from a cow that's been naturally dried out in the sun do you think it would work it's been dried white for two years at lest I keep it because of the bone nut's I could maybe cut from it. I just got a Squire Strat CV 60's it was the last one they had a rosewood fingerboard now they use palmeno wood or maple salesman the guitar was ordered w/a Bone Nut installed guys wife made em send it back they charge $90 for a Bone Nut upgrade at Sweetwater. I have to say no ping's in the bone nut. Great playing Strat. I'd love to have bone nut & saddle for my 12 string acoustic & 6 string acoustics. That thing sings it could only get better w/bone I think.
I am not sure if time will take the oils out of the bone by itself. I am no authority on the subject but I would try to degrease it regardless. The sun MAY have taken the moisture out, but it is the oils that will react with glues and finishes, and may also go rancid as far as my logic tells me.
Ah! "Just what I need for dissection lab tomorrow!" Thanks!
This has got to be the most diy thing I've ever seen
Well, I didn't do the part where I go out to the field and get the cow...lol. Thanks for watching.
Hey bro!!
Thanks for your time in sharing this process with us!
I’m about to make my own nut and saddle for a bashed up, 1970s _EKO_ guitar I have been restoring somewhere near to its former glory. I actually think it’s gonna be better than it was in the first place as it never had any bone components but instead an aluminium saddle (🤔🤷♂️😵💫), was literally covered in a 2mm layer of lacquer that was all cracked and nasty looking, the machine heads were all bent and terrible looking, so I’m now waiting for the new ones to arrive. I bought some nice looking chrome ones that lock. I really can’t wait to get some strings on it and hear what it sounds like!!!!!
Hey just wondering what model of eko you have as I have just got an old eko off Facebook for free that I'm restoring as it's in rough shape
@@michaellodge4927
I’m not sure but I will check for you when I get back to my friends house.
That's different using a bone, cant wait to see you make the guitar pieces.
Thanks for sharing
Thanks, I have no idea when I will need it, but good to have on hand.
One last step to removing the grease from the bones is after the soak in the white gas (Colman fuel) place the bones in a pan of cold water (make sure the bones are completely covered with the water). Add a couple of cap fulls of clear ammonia ( the amount is not highly critical) to the water and bring the water to a full boil. Let it boil for a few minutes. You will see any remaining grease come to the surface.
Simply soaking the bones in a degreaser, ie. the Colman fuel, loosens the grease but you need to then drive the loosened grease from the bones. The boiling action accomplishes this. The ammonia further facilitates the removal.
After the boiling (2-5 min), let the water cool and skim off as much of the gunk as you can and remove the bones. You can use a bit of liquid dish soap and water to wash off any residue that might be on the outside of the bones from the gunk in the water.
If you decide you want bleached bone use hydrogen peroxide for the bleaching agent. You can use the stuff you get from the drug store. I think it is around a 3 percent concentration. You could add a bit of water to it, perhaps up to 1 part water to one part peroxide. Either way how long you leave it in the solution is somewhat by trial. Start with a few hours, rinse and let dry, preferably in the sun. If, after the bones are dry you want more bleaching put them back in the solution. This type of bleaching will be pretty gentle to the integrity of the bone. Any bleaching will deteriorate the bone to a degree, but this method is pretty good. DO NOT USE BLEACH, LIKE CLOROX!! This is harmful to the bone.
As far as the initial boiling of the bones, I believe the more you boil the more the bone is compromised. I would re-evaluate that.
Thank you for sharing this. Creating one's own materials can be fun for the full "hand crafted" experience.
All the research I did didn't specify the second boiling with ammonia. Thanks for sharing the info.
Just wanted to chime in here. I hadn’t seen this method elsewhere in my research either but I decided to try out boiling the blanks after the gasoline soak...and was amazed to see the drops of grease leach and gather on the surface! This tells me that it’s worthwhile to do so
I don't have access to Coleman fuel (naphtha-based products) in my country. Are there similar alternatives that can do the same job?
What’s the benefit you get from thoroughly degreasing the bones like this? I haven’t actually tried making my own blanks yet, so I’m just curious about the “why” behind this part of the process. Do they stink like rancid beef if you don’t degrease them thoroughly lol
@@arsamy96 Do you have access to charcoal lighter fluid? Lighter fluid is a light petroleum distillate, aka naphtha. Maybe they’re just calling it by a different name in your country?
An alternative is to boil the bones in 30 per cent bleach and just wash and dry them. You will get white and odor-free pieces. In fact, Vet college used this method to build a frame for anatomy model.
Correct, but you don't get beef broth for cooking when you're done.
Bleach will break down the bones hardness & made it crumbly. Not good way to go in the long run it's as bad a greasy bone a couple of the Naphtha baths should suffice.That's a great article on the subject in the description.
French Onion Soup makes great banjo nuts and pistol grips. My local meat market got all excited when I told them what I wanted.Brought out a whole tray to pick from. I got some hamburger to say thanks. Nice job.
lol....Thanks for the story.
Yep...you're welcome! Just working on a bone nut now! It's satisfying to make something from scratch! Makes the instrument special when you hand fabricate the parts.☺🎸🎶
That's great!
I love doing stuff like this. Who cares if you save money or it even costs more. The fact that you can do it is enjoyment enough. Just like when someone compliments my shoes and I say "Thanks, I made them myself."
When you can enjoy doing it AND save money it's even better. Thanks for watching and commenting. I agree with you, but I don't make shoes...lol.
You never know someone until you walk a mile in the shoes they made.
Great Tutorail very detailed and helpfoul! Thanks
You're welcome. Thanks for watching.
You can buy the same piece of bone filled with peanut butter for your dog. My lab cleans the peanut butter and I get cheap nut and saddle material. Also, the bone is already cooked and cured. A win/win situation
LOL....I love that!
for a minute i was wondering what kind of lab you worked in
@@mark1800 he works in a lab bro door.
hey that was great!!! good info!! did they work good?
Awesome! Keep it up!
Thank you very much!
Wouldn't leaving the grease in the bone make the stings slide in their slot better? For tremolo bar usage and intonation?
No, the grease will go rancid, bleed into the finish, and interfere with glue.
Ok, thanks.
Ahhrghhh bulalo ♥️👌🏻
Nice Vid, I learned a lot...
Thanks for watching.
Is ist better to cut the nuts vertically or horizontally out of the bone. Thinking about it, it seems to better to cut it so the porous sides are pointing to the head and the saddle of the guitar...
From what I have seen, the "ends" of the bone go across the board. So the strings go across the "grain" of the bone, more or less. I could be mistaken though.
Hello. Thank you very much for the tutorial! I've been doing a thorough research about the process and there are a variety of recipes on internet but this one, which make heed on the degreesing of the bone, seems to be the smartest. I boiled the bone and I have it clean and drying. I think I will use turpentine instead of coleman fuel but I haven't decided yet. Any thoughts about it? Thanks again!
I had to go through a lot of research to find my way of doing it. I do not know about using turpintine, it would probably work, but the smell!
Question: is it necessary to de-fat the bones? I feel like then, the nut would be, "self-lubricating," for a while, at least. Or maybe it would make gluing the nut much harder/impossible?
Michael Jung no need to glue the nut, tight fit and the strings hold it on, need to remove fat or it will soak into the wood.
If you do not remove the fat, it will go rancid and smell bad. You only need a couple of dots of glue to hold a nut in place, usually on the end grain of the finger board. More than that will cause issues if it needs work again. Yes, fat will interfere with the glue.
Hey thanks for making this video a lot of great info. I watched your vid on making nut blanks with the dog bone from petsmart , is the bone from petsmart as hard and dense as the bone you get from the butcher?
I didn't use a petsmart bone. Just this one which is a cow shin bone....apparently as hard of a bone as you can get with any ease.
Pretty cool. I use wild deer antler for nuts and saddles all the time. The outer "bark" on antler is very hard and slippery.
Thanks. I never thought antler would work. Good information there.
I was wondering if antler would work, as I have a decent supply of it already well enough cured for stuff like knife handles. Does it still require degreasing, or any other special steps?
I just came across your post, I have tons of red stag & axis antlers, And I kept thinking these would make wonderful nuts for a Stratocaster I'm rebuilding.. Is there anything special I need to consider, or can I just simply shape the very tip and make a nice fitting blanked out of it? Danny in Texas..
@@livergen antlers are suppose to be too soft.
Thanks for the video!
You're welcome, thanks for taking the time to watch and comment.
do you think thinner could work as a fuel replacement¿
I don't know that much about chemistry.
I use a arc saw, is much better, you can easily cut the piece. Sometimes I ask my butcher to cut it to me. For the cleaning, I use to throw them to my dogs lol. They work on the meat and marrow for a while, and they use to forget about the bones (or burry them). Then I boil it if needed. I make picks, and I've made a knife for opening letters.. I really love the picks, and my son loves the knife.
I have not heard the term "arc saw" before. Is that an oscillating multi tool? Very curious to find out. Thanks for the information.
Cool!😎
Is 'Naptha' also called kerosene. A petroleum product. Or is it acetone?
Naptha is different from kerosene and acetone. Naptha is also sold as Lighter fluid (Zippo, Ronsonol, etc), White gas, Camp stove fuel, Coleman fuel (for their lanterns and stoves).
Did you do a video where you used one to make a nut?
Not yet. Been busy around here, but I do have an acoustic that needs a new saddle and I will make a bone one....eventually.
you can save yourself a lot of soaking time, by cutting the bone into blanks or at least slices before defatting. cutting is a little less smelly and dusty, if you dont wait for it to dry. simmer 20 minutes or so with plenty of dish spap and a little splash of bleach, wash and let them dry. letting the bones dry between ~24h (or 1h with initial vacuum) naphta soaks helps to draw out the fat faster. 3-4 passes should do. for a pure white you can bleach with H202 after this.
long story short, i used bone for inlays.
EDIT: spap was supposed to read soap, too amusing to change it.
I don't mind spap. Thanks for chiming in.
I’ve got loads of these bones. My dogs have them filled. I might try one. I can use my chop saw to cut them down.
My dog only weighs 11 pounds. Takes a long time to clean a bone....lol.
Jim Dockrell . I've got staffies. Cleaned in no time.
Hello can you tell me the alternative for Coleman fuel
Yes....Naptha, White gas, Lighter fluid (like for a Ronson), Camp stove fuel, are all the same thing.
Can I use acetone? I can't get camp fuel here, thanks.
Did you eat the remaining broth? It's all upside down: most people throw out bones from their soup not having a slightest idea of how many guitar nuts they could make out of those bones.
It went to beef stock for cooking.
Good - no waste.
Yeah most people make hundreds of guitar nuts what a waste
i wanna try this to make "selletas" for my classical guitar
Good luck on the project!
@@JimDockrellWatertone Gratias!
thank you
You're welcome. Thanks for watching.
20 string Guitar to need a FOUR & 1/2" Saddle????
That's just what was left over after cutting off slightly oversized nut blanks, or, I can cut it in half again and get 2 more nut sized blanks, which I may have more use for. 20 strings? You're giving me ideas....lol.
does this harden bone?
I don't think so. It doesn't need to be hardened anyway. It held up a cow for it's entire life.
Sir where did you gather your raw bone, butcher?
Yes, I asked for a beef shin bone and they got one for me.
Thanks.
I tried this but after the bone was boiled it became porous ?
Which bone and from what animal? This is the shin bone of a mature cow.
@@JimDockrellWatertone I cant be sure. It was from a pet store and meant for a dog...?
That could be the problem then. Try a butcher and ask specifically for the shin bone of a cow. The shin is the densest bone in the body of a cow.
@@JimDockrellWatertone Thanks I thought you would say that, but I wondered if anyone else had experienced the sdam problem. Cheers :) PS good vid ;)
@@JimDockrellWatertone I've heard femur was ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I bleached my bones and they had sat around for two years plus.They are stinky when you said them!
One question: why?
Because I can.
What liquid is used to soak
In the jar? Naptha. Just boiled in water first.
Jim Dockrell yes in the jar sir, what is that hydrogen peroxide?
@@bukansiape9612 It is Naptha. Also sold as Lighter fluid, Camp Stove fuel, Coleman fuel, and White gas.
Jim Dockrell oke thanks sir, in Indonesia naptha is tiner
Oke oke thanks a lot
@@bukansiape9612 it's called "thinner", remember the "h".
The easiest way to strip a bone is to put it in an ANT BED... They will clean the marrow as well as the soft tissue.
That's a pretty creative idea.
@@JimDockrellWatertone When dad was a diver on Guam in the 1960's - they would spearfish and after they cut up the catch for the meat the locals would use the bones to make stuff with so dad would put the carcass on an ant bed and they stripped fast and neat.
what the liquid is, at minute 9:20?
Naptha.....also known as White Gas, Camp stove fuel, Coleman fuel, Lighter fluid.
Jim Dockrell but whats the reason for it? I bought bone at the dogstore and didnt use all these steps still worked superb. And very fun doing it! You should make a video shaping saddles too,with these approach.
Good raw material, even for inlays. I learned a lot from the process. The three weeks seem to have changed a lot. Thanks for sharing. Have you used the broth for a meal?
You're welcome Daniel. Glad I could help. We didn't have time to use the broth though.
Yum
Soup is good food!
I thought that boiling the bone makes it splinter ... that is why you can't boil bones and give them to dogs
Never put your hand in front of the jigsaw when you do any cuttings, otherwise bye, bye to your hand or fingers
Correct. You can see it didn't take long for me to change tactics.
My dog is licking is chops right now.
LOL..that's funny
Bone dust contains Anthrax!
Give your head a shake there. Of the millions of people working in processing meat in the world, if it gave you Anthrax..........well, we would know wouldn't we? Kinda hard to hide that if it were true.
I don't think the Anthrax spores (assuming they were there in the 1st place) would survive boiling for such a long time...
But thanks for the suggestion, I'll listen to Anthrax when I'll be shaping my blanks.
Funniest thing on youtube this. have you people got nothing better to do lol
Glad you found it entertaining and had nothing better to do than watch it.
It depends. But then I guess you're not a serious musician or luthier.
I have something better to do, inlay a fretboard, but alas, gotta clean the bones first.
you could have broiled the bone/marrow and had a haute cuisine. People pay big bucks to eat the shit parts of the animal. In all seriousness though I have made a few nuts this way and they work fantastic, just a little labor intensive.
Thanks, I have them sitting in the shop waiting right now. Too dang cold to be in the shop right now.
your intro scared the shit out of me
Oops...sorry. It will probably happen again though...lol
think i would buy one than go thru all that stuff.
It is a long process, but not difficult. For the price on one blank I now have several.
Anybody can just buy stuff but only a few know the joy of making stuff.
cseeger1 I agree!
@@cseeger1 Know the joy and the procedure. More knowledgeable builders and less dumb consumers.
If the factories go bust or importation taxes skyrocket, we go Meh and keep on with business as usual - or even better.
The defatting process of the bone is completely unnecessary and expensive
no offense, but you made no blanks you cut up a bone. make the blank video and then make the nut video. cheers
Have not had an opportunity to have an instrument that needs one....but there will be one soon that needs a new saddle....stay tuned and thanks for watching. This one just shows how to prepare it properly so the fats and oils don't mess with glues or finish.
@@JimDockrellWatertone will do.. cheers
WTF?
No soup for you!
@@JimDockrellWatertone 😂😂
Can I use acetone? I can't get camp fuel here, thanks.