The "Kirby Gamecube Game" probably wasn't Air Ride, but the old cancelled kirby game that turned into Kirby's return to dreamland. If you don't know, the game basically went through 3 or 4 scrapped versions on the gamecube before being moved over to the Wii. There are videos on UA-cam that explain the story in way more detail so go look at those.
I remember seeing something about _Kirby Air Ride_ being intended for the N64 before being moved as well but yea this video is a little misleading about certain aspects. Like I don't think the Zelda showcase was ever intended to be an actual game more than it was a showcase of the GameCube's power, same thing with _Super Mario 128_
@@ArgentuTA164-2 clue was talking about the fans' perceptions of the releases of the time, and how disappointed they felt when those games released. i think he was trying to explain their confusion and disappointment by "being" one of the fans
@@godzzwrathNo! That’s not accurate at all. Clue literally said Nintendo promised those were the games fans were getting, when they did NOT promise that at all.
The description of Nintendo in the 2000s kinda feels like how I feel about media from the decade as a whole. A lot of things tried cool new ideas that were thrashed at the time to the point where the reputation of some media released in the period never fully recovered, a lot of people say media in the 2010s relied a lot on nostalgia and avoided experimentation and to be honest I feel like a big part of that was a reaction to how utterly brutal the response to the experimentation of the 2000s was
Disney 2D animation got the worst of it. Atlantis and Treasure Planet were two of their most ambitious and creative films ever made, but because they weren't A)CGI, and B)Princess movies, they were shunned. As a result, 2D animation is virtually extinct in the U.S., and the film industry is worse for it. And the same Hollywood studios wonder why anime has taken over.
@@scaryhobbit211anime already reached the west by the 2000s though and was already growing. Also 2D still exist it’s just not in big movies but besides from that it’s still around and many cartoons still use jt
Liking Super Mario games is far more accepted. But then I've actually the opposite problem occur in a Sonic review where the game was actually awful, but the review was positive toward the game, except...it was more about shit-talking on Sonic fans than talking about the game itself. It instead complained about fans not liking the game, and threw out insults. And this was a professional review.
To be fair, most games used to not even take an hour to complete, so you’ve got a game that takes at least the entire runtime of an older game before it’s fun to play. Sticking with it is quite a commitment.
@@shinyagumon7015And anything that wasn't "adult" or "mature" got an instant score penalty, if it wasn't going for a realistic art direction then it got penalized too
The interactions you have with the characters really feels like episode plots you’d see in a saturday morning cartoon if it was Mario, especially the Bowser ones, and that absolutely endears me. Really unfortunate that the game was pushed out to be something it was not on the surface.
6:25 Think it's worth noting that Guinness World Records: Gamer's Edition is notorious in it's own right for being hilariously bad (the group it was made in collaboration with, Twin Galaxies also got involved in the Donkey Kong high score scandal) and was discontinued in 2020 (likely as a result of aforementioned scandal)...
the gamecube era being so experimental caused nintendo to overcorrect in the wii era, and it's how we ended up having every mario game end up like new super mario bros, and it isn't until recently that they've gone back to trying creativity again
Well, the Mario Galaxy games are still very very good. All thr mainline titles were still good during the Wii. The Wii itself is the embodiment of experimental.
...Mario Party Advance??? I was expecting Mario Pinball Land. A full game that hates save files and passwords but expects hours in return in the post-Gameboy Era? And is probably the one pinball game that I imagine pinball fans will not really like?
3:37 - Kirby's Air Ride was actually originally intended on being on the N64. The "Gamecube Kirby Game" ended up becoming "Kirby's Return to Dreamland" for the Wii (and some development elements seemed to be used in "Star Allies" and "Forgotten Land")
Besides the points brought up in the video about why -Mario Party Advance- Mario's Carnival Quest got slammed, I can think of a few more. 1) People think of the 90s as the 'edgy' era, but plenty of that lingered well into the 2000s. The harsh reception Wind Waker got at the time wasn't just because Nintendo previewed Zelda as one thing and delivered something else, it's because that Space World clip showed a Zelda that was Mature for Mature Gamers, and Wind Waker was a bright cartoon. 2) More than any other Mario series, the Mario Party series suffers from sequel fatigue. I think it's because most of the other series learned to obscure how many titles there were with different titles, whereas at the point in 2005 that this game came out Mario Party was saying loud and proud that there had already been six of these things. 3) Negativity sells. It sells on UA-cam when people talk about the worst game/movie/book/breakfast cereal ever, and it sold in game magazines and websites. The problem is, as demonstrated by the Kane and Lynch Gamespot debacle, some games are beyond criticism if the game's publisher is funding the magazine enough. So when an acceptable target is in their sights, I think it can lead game reviewers to be disproportionately nasty.
It's weird how people conflate darker art style as being mature when a game could have serious themes and be cute looking and vice versa. As for point 3 I feel like one popular youtuber destroying a decent indie game could kill the dev's career.
Early 2000s were peak edge. The edge era kept going strong until 2005, when Shad(ow, the edge)hog was released, and mockery of edginess came into vogue.
@@bowber3434 it's crazy how HAL manage to bring back almost all the scrap concepts from the GameCube era to the recent games for nearly a decade. Like imagine the next dozen Super Mario games (both mainline and spinoffs) bring back all the concept designs from the Odyssey artbook. it's basically that for Kirby.
Sometimes I feel like Kirby is more of a priority to Nintendo than Mario is. They really went in all after Forgotten Land came out whereas Mario finally did something like what Rayman did with Origins/Legends. As nostalgic as I am towards NSMB Wii, I still think Nintendo should’ve made/released Wonder instead on the Wii to keep players from being burnt out.
Reading that review, I think it really does just highlight how like, unnecessarily harsh a lot of 2000s reviews were. I feel like some of it was the harsh deadlines that reviewers often face and in a lot of cases low/no pay. Also the idea of a mythical "bad game design" that is universal for every video game and can never budge for artistic purposes of course. I always avoided this game cause I was told it's just a bad single player mario party game, but knowing it's a weird mario party rpg, I think I'll give it a shot.
People hated "The Wind Waker" at the time because of the graphics, it was a blunt departure that Nintendo paid the price for it at the time. When you hear "Mario Party" you automatically think "multi-player" so the idea of a multi-player game in a handheld console that relied on link cables and multiple cartridges to do that disencouraged people to even try the game in the first place. Bad marketing. Like the video said, Nintendo's communication at the time was lacking.
Looking back... I think I might heavily dislike Generation X gaming journalists and especially Generation X Nintendo fans. They were also disinterested in Luigi's Mansion because it's not the 3D Mario game they were hoping for (then they got Sunshine which is a very polarizing title lol). They also took Star Fox and F-Zero for granted and then those series became dormant.
@@PipeGuy64Bit Journalism in the early-2000s didn't have as much influence as it does nowadays. The only people buying magazines back then were enthusiasts that wanted a second opinion, but most people deciding on which game to buy would just come into a game store and just picked up whatever game that looked potentially interesting on the boxart or maybe saw a commercial of it.
i think most "mean reviews" exist just because they're very entertaining. not only is it a way to flex your creative writing skills as someone whos probably being underpaid, its also just more interesting for a reader if a game is "the worst of all time and made you want to die" instead of just being mediocre or pretty good. unfortunately when you're writing for a big organization about something that is actually relevant, your fun creative writing exercise becomes something people actually listen to and take into account. thats why, on the other hand, it doesnt really matter when someone like the angry video game nerd goes on a rant about a random NES game no one has heard about. its not really supposed to be a review, its just entertainment.
You know, this got me to realize that Mario Party Advance would've been much less hated if it had a different name and didn't force minigames onto the player as often as it did. Nice video!
mario party IS mini game central though?? like that's what you're signing up for when you play a mario party. i think it's trying to look for an apple in the orange section. i can understand it being mismarketed but even then doing a four person mario party is still SO LONG and as "torturous" as they keep describing mario party advance, no matter how much i have playing a mario party
It honestly reminds me a lot of Undertale, which might just be because they're RPGs and have similar comedic qualities, but they remind me of each other
Honestly I have a feeling for most forms of media that are considered better nowadays or not as hated are the result of the media not being meant for the franchise they’re trying to be a part of
Can we stop acting like the tech demos at space world were trailers for actual games rather than just graphical and technology showcases? Nintendo didn't lie at all, and I'm sick and tired of this narrative.
00:00-23:05 is what y'all came for. Context matters. Respect matters. If you don't like it, don't watch. But videos start where the creator decides they start, not you.
@@chronossage Donkey Kong Jungle Beat! Short game, but still very possibly my favorite Donkey Kong game ever made. Beating the crap out of evil Kongs by hammering the bongos is one of the most satisfying gaming experiences for me lol
Gotta say, I ADORE the mentality of "Hey, this game isn't perfect, but i like the core! Lets try and fix it!". I can think of multiple games I've grown up with that id love to fiddle with (Bionicle Heroes being a big one), i just don't have the know-how, or even where to start. Maybe one day ill investigate... Keep up the good work!
Mark my words, a few years from now some small game developer on Itchio going to take this game’s system and make a fun sleeper hit rougelite out of it
Metroid Prime did not need a reevaluation. It was criticized after it was announced as first person, but the demo silenced almost all of that when it was clear the gameplay would work.
And I don’t think it had weak storytelling, it was just environmental. Samus is a silent protagonist and she’s a badass at it. Other M showed us the horrors of turning her into a yandere anime heroine.
The reason why this game is bad, is because unlike 3 other Nintendo games that came out in the same year, it didn't have too much water. (Gen 3 Pokemon, wind waker, sunshine)
I actually thought he's talking about Pinball Land too (which I actually also like, and I actually think is playable despite the jank - I had like 20+ stars now there hehe) but MPA is another candidate for sure.
As someone who's 100% that game… TWICE… I don't really hate the experience. Some moments were frustrating for sure but far from the worst pinball clone I've played. MPA might not have the actual "party" aspect but the characters and minigames kept me entertained.
@@Mariorox1956 Damn, mad respect for you dude, just trying to complete the game is hell, because of the garbage physic of the ball, and im not saying that because i hate pinballs, iv'e played other nintendo pinballs games that handelds the physic better, like Pokemon pinball and Kirby Pinball, which both were on the game boy.
I can literally imagine what this video’s thumbnail would look like if it had that same sad photoshopped Mario image. Thought you were talking about the image with a sad Mario pulling over a curtain. I can still imagine it with the other sad Mario render though.
I personally like the name “Mario’s Party Quest” more than “Mario’s Carnival Quest”. I think that “Mario’s Party Quest” has the same benefits you mentioned (using the word quest implies it’s more of an rpg and it’s further removed from being a main line Mario Party), while highlighting its status as a Mario Party spin off more clearly (things like rolling to move and mini games). Also, “Mario’s Party Quest” makes more sense for the narrative of the game, given that the game is about Mario’s Quest to save Party City
@@nonbuddy I disagree with that take because 1: there wasn't another Mario Party for the GBA, and 2: that argument could also work against Mario Party Advance as it already exists if we're assuming the kid in question wanted, for example, Mario Party 5 for the GameCube. At least calling it "Mario's Party Quest" or something similar would both serve as a means of keeping the connection to the main MP games while also demonstrating in the title that it's a bit different than the main titles on the consoles of the time.
I don’t know how you think the words “Mario party” and “Mario’s party” would be legible as different series to the average consumer, but ummmmm no, no it wouldn’t. Just stay away from the word party, it clearly ruined the first impression of the game already.
@@gronodon Stadats never said anything about having the title appear as if it's from another series, though? The entire point of their comment is to keep a connection with the Mario Party series, since it still features most of the trappings of those games, while also having the title be different enough to convey to people that it's also a different experience. "Mario's Party Quest" fits both of those things for the reasons they stated.
I love how this random advert at 6:57 decided to use a render of Paper Mario to advertize Mario Party Advance (although they did unintentionally predict the boot car in TOK).
Basically none of the renders except that boot car were from Mario Party Advance. For some reason there's also a Yoshi render from SM64DS, and the hosts from Mario Party 4 (with the Goomba being on there twice). Early 2000s marketing was a charming mess.
I wonder if video game reviewers were nursing an anti-Nintendo bias that bled into a criticism for most videogames that led to the emulation of AVGN even more than the emulation of AVGN.
@@autobotstarscream765 I meant Mario Kart Tour should have been in the video if they were going to discuss worst games of all time, I didn't mean it was for the GBA. My bad if I wasn't clear there.
i still think neither of these deserve to be the most hated because both ooze with early 2000s Mario charm & creativity, from MPA's very unique Toads to Pinball featuring 3D Koopatrols. I have no idea why these are rated lower than games like Sticker Star from the 2010s that are just as bland as bland can possibly get.
Yeah but you don't show off something like that without claiming "these are not games". There's no need to side with a greedy game company that knew what they were doing :3
Those first two are actually decent at their function: Being educational and being made for pre-10 year old kids. In that, they actually do their jobs properly. And Hotel Mario isn't even a bad game, it's just a lackluster one. It's a low-effort clone of Elevator Action, but fundamentally it's not even that bad.
@@the-NightStari really hate it when gamers shit on games simply for being for young audiences or cash outs and not because the actual game design didnt do what it set out to do very well. There are some good hidden gems that are licensed cash grabs, and the mario mud pies series is inoffensive and works well for what it set out to do. There is nothing wrong with having a target audience so young it alienates the overgrown internet nerds. Kiddies need games too!
I thought this was going to be towards Sticker Star. The game that took down both sides of the Mario RPGs at the end of the 2010s; the game that made sure there was 6! groups of fans after The Origami King; the game that was literally only correctly with a remastering of the most wanted Paper Mario game. A game so bad you have to compare it to particularly bad point-and-click adventure games to like it beyond the worst parts of Color Splash and The Origami King.
7:59 Uh that's how most spinoffs are though. That's what spinoffs are _for_ in the first place. Mario Party itself is a spinoff series of the Super Mario platforming games... Mario Party, Mario Golf, Mario Sluggers, DDR Mario Mix, Wario Land, SMW2: Yoshi's Island. All spinoffs of Super Mario. Hell, the original unsuper Mario Bros is a spinoff of Donkey Kong, Super Mario Bros is a spinoff of Mario Bros and Donkey Kong Country is also a spinoff of Donkey Kong. Heck, it wasn't until Mario vs Donkey Kong that we got anything _close_ to the classic arcade Donkey Kong trilogy again but it was a puzzle platformer, still a spinoff.
For Mario it's actually really hard to tell what counts as a spinoff, since the series was designed from the beginning to be able to work with a lot of genres.
the issue is that mario party advance is a spin off of mario party, but it doesn't really show that at all and seems like just another mario party game on the surface it's as if nintendo had released a "New Super Mario Bros." game, but it was actually a visual novel. obviously that's what spin offs are, and that's fine. but mario party is a clear spin off from the mainline mario series since it uses the "Mario Party" title. mario party advance on the other hand uses the SAME "Mario Party" title, but is a spin-off of THAT series, with no clear hint of that
the issue with you two thinking of ultra smash and battle league is that it needs to be a game someone can reasonably sit and defend for a 23 minute video. ultra smash and battle league are not games one can defend for 23 minutes 💀
At that time, I remember not knowing what a tech demo was. 128 Marios was just plain confusing to me. I imagine a lot of kids who were finally old enough to start following the gaming industry thought the same.
@@mowkikowski I was 14 and never thought any of it was supposed to be a game... except Meowth's Party, because Nintendo Power discussed it in an issue and it sounded like it was supposed to be an actual game. I was one of the first people to point out first that the Zelda clip didn't even look like it was supposed to be a game, and frankly doesn't even look that good.
Even just the pixel art and character designs are so incredibly charming, I can't believe nobody gave it the benefit of the doubt just because of the name for so long...
The difference between random encounters and mushroom challenges Is that Random encounters in games usually increase exp or level or in cases like Pokémon, it has an ability to expand YOUR abilities But mushroom challenges only serve to make you roll a dice more to get more mushroom challenges…
I feel like the minigames could’ve also been improved if they had a reasonable difficulty curve, like if they got more challenging the further you got through the game. Some of the minigames are genuinely very fun, but by the time you’ve mastered all of them they just get so easy to the point where they feel like a massive waste of time. If they had harder variations, this problem could’ve been fixed and it would be way more fun, perhaps by increasing the speed of the obstacles, increasing the score needed to win, or changing up the level design.
Totally agree with this part, I think it's the most unfortunate part about this game for me, especially since every game has an "score attack" version, why is there only one "story mode version" when you made such adaptable games like that? Missed opportunity!
Yeah, I found that the minigame quality and difficulty varied enormously - Cloud Climb rarely took me more than 10 seconds from its 1 minute time limit to complete, but I only managed to beat Stompbot XL one time in my entire run. It's a problem when, as soon as the minigame you'll be playing is announced, your reaction is either "oh this is a freebie" or "ok, well, guess we've lost". There's very, very few of the games that felt like a reasonable challenge every time.
3:37 As a lost media enjoyer, if I recall correctly, they tried to make a full 3D Kirby game 2 separate times for GameCube, and it just didn't work out both times. So they settled on AirRide. This may not be 100% accurate, since I'm going based off of memory here. But I remember there being a beta for AirRide that's lost, and at least 1 beta for a 3D game that is lost. Edit: More memory here. Yes, the original version of AirRide was a remake of Tilt & Tumble, that got reworked into AirRide.
I do feel a little confused; the Metroid Prime point of "these games being heralded as masterpieces" feels weird. While Sunshine and Wind Waker definitely are more well-loved in retrospect than at the time of release, Metroid Prime was extremely beloved at release. I don't really remember anyone throwing a fuss over minor issues with the game.
Yeah, you can tell this guy either wasn't alive in 2001 or was too young to be reading magazines. He just saw there was initial skepticism and assumed it got the same treatment from older kids and teenagers that all the other Gamecube games did. He hasn't figured out that Prime got praised by us because it was aimed at us while Wind Waker was not.
@@catkaboodle "Aimed at "us"? What are you talking about lol, just because windwaker was more cartoony doesn't mean it was "for kids". Were you one of those "Celda" people way back when? lmao
@@sdf434-pp8jd I liked TWW from the start, but I also knew that the artstyle was an obvious rejection of the notion that they needed to pander to older American gamers to make money. The difference between me and the millions of angry randos online is that I didn't take this rejection personally. After writing that out, I realize how absurd it must sound to people who grew up with the Gamecube. But it's true! There were people with college degrees that publicly melted down because Nintendo wasn't interested in making games for them anymore. In mid-2000s America, cartoons were considered to be for children without any exception.
@@catkaboodle That's funny because I was college age at the time, as well as my friends, and we all thought it was amazing. The only people I saw who didn't like it were ironically younger teenagers (like 12-15 ish) who felt it wasn't "grown up" looking enough for them. I think CS Lewis has some choice quotes about this.
@@luigifan4585 Correct, but the title said the most hated Mario game so that's immediately what my mind jumped to. I agree, Sticker Star does not deserve justice lmao
I'd argue that specifically the beta for Sticker Star deserves justice. The few screenshots of it looks like the true follow up to Super and TTYD and it's kind of depressing.
@@Bighaid91 Tour is objectively the worst game to ever exist, not just because of micro transactions but also because of how it is poorly designed and the fact that you can never play any track at any time. Plus it no longer gets any new content so it will die for good one day.
The point that you raised in 7:53 is one that seems to get lost in a lot of Nintendo discourse: that it's valid for some fans to be disappointed in an established series going in a suddenly extremely different direction from usual, and they shouldn't be shamed for being disappointed or expressing it just because the new game might have strengths of its own separate from the context of its series. Also that Nintendo often plays a big part of fostering misaligned expectations but tend to get totally overlooked.
I never understood the weird hate so many people have when games go a different route with a spin off or a singular title. Do people really want the same game over and over and over again? I am honestly bored these days with AAA and AA gaming, because nobody dares to make something new anymore.
@@ikagura Exactly. Fans of spaghetti might want to try a new sauce or cheese on their noodles, but most importantly they still want spaghetti noodles at the core. They don't want rice when they're craving spaghetti, especially not if it's being LABELED as "spaghetti" to specifically evoke their interest in spaghetti.
This conversation feels a lot like the Banjo-Kazooie Nuts & Bolts conversation. Lose the Banjo Kazooie and its actually a better than decent game, but *because* it was promised as "Threeie" but released as an Open World Kart Builder (which, btw, is really fucking cool), it was very poorly recieved.
What makes this an RPG? The closest thing I can find to a roleplaying element is being able to choose your character which doesn't really make a difference outside of a few quests. I think it makes way more sense to call this an adventure game (in line with point-and-click adventure games) than an RPG
Oh boy yet another game that is basically like an adventure game that is a sign of how bad the series will become until 2023! The other game being Sticker Star.
BONUS BOARD! Don’t forget about Bonus Board! Where you can get PHYSICAL with Mario’s Carnival Quest and use a SINGLE GAME BOY ADVANCE to play small minigames with up to 4 players, while moving PHYSICAL PIECES on a REAL BOARD! It’s nuts! Now seriously, I’ve never once hated Mario Party Advance. I’ve been a fan of this game since I saw it way back when on a Club Nintendo magazine (Latin American Nintendo Power, if you will) and I love it. It’s quirky, it’s different, but it’s my kind of game and the minigames are all kinds of fun, so much so that only now are they being appreciated through their addition in fan games like Party Project.
3:35 There actually was a sequel or follow-up to Kirby 64 in the works for GameCube but it was canned. The biggest broken promise was Earthbound/MOTHER 64, which became the Japan-exclusive MOTHER 3 the GBA. Granted that was 1999 but close enough.
@@wobblzYT Yeah, gotta be fair. Played this game as a kid and liked it, but it doesn't live rent free in my head like Animal Crossing and Luigi's Mansion does.
This was one of my favorite GBA games growing up. I get it's not everyone's cup of tea and it's nowhere near a traditional Mario Party experience, but for a single player offering in the same spirit of the series I think it does really well for the system it's on.
This looks pretty cute and charming... If you ask me the worst Mario game and a game that should be hated is Super Mario Bros 2. Japanese version of course, American version is great. The japanese version was just a worse version of the first one with like two new things? Poison mushroom and wind. No new enemies, music, level types, power ups. Weakest sequel and mario game I have ever seen.
I was actually expecting that one too because I think it’s over hated especially when you consider it was made in just one year. It was simply just more Mario bros one which was fine And personally I like the increased difficulty (Minus the backwards warp pipes that still baffles me)
NGL, this sort of reminds me of how a lot of BOF fans see Dragon Quarter, since it wasn't a traditional RPG, you're just a normal person, and can't spam your powers. And it was even from the same generation as this one.
At least now people changed their minds on Dragon Quarter, especially after the mess that was the mobile title that they forced to be a mainline numbered title
17:00 To be fair, games journalism has pretty much always been utter crap. Back in those days, it's because games were seen more at toys for children rather than anything that could be meaningful like art. There's still a lot of issues with games journalism today, and for the foreseeable future, people will always jump to wild conclusions about things to serve a narrative rather than actually enjoy a dang video game.
04:55 Never hated Wind Waker. Just hatred (and STILL hate) the art style. No. Before anyone comes at me. I dont hate cel shading optic. It can look very good. But for me the way Wind Waker done it is just not appealing
i didn’t know that mario party advance was THAT hated! i knew that people didn’t like it compared to the other party games, but there’s a whole lot worse that you can find in the mario series.
To be fair game journalists can have some very questionable opinions IMO hehe...but even within Mario Party fans it is in the bottom because of its non-Mario Party gameplay; that being said many do recognize the charm it has.
Yes you can blame them for "being misled", Nintendo clearly put out TECH DEMOS and people assumed it was going to be a representation of the final product.
Sonic Adventure 2: 9.4 IGN Sonic Adventure 2 Battle (released 8 months later literally just a port with better fps): 6.9 IGN I suppose the exclusion of Big the Cat cameos was worth the -2.5 in score😂
7:47 Disagree. Final Fantasy is the ultimate example of "titles do not matter" and "every game can be as different from the last, title be damned." Especially for Spin offs. The Spirits Within , Crystal Chronicles, aren't JRPGs, and they are barely related to the core series, yet they all have plenty of fans. Fans need to take responsibility for once in their lives.
Final Fantasy built up an expectation of every game being substantially different: FFII went completely nutso with its progression system, FFIII had a better class system than the first game and FFIV had a playable party of actual characters (this would become status quo but it was still different at the time). I'm not entirely sure how FFV and FFVI changed things up but I know for a fact that they did. FFVII would introduce more contemporary settings (which again would become status quo but still new at the time), FFVIII had the draw and junction systems, FFIX was a throwback to the first three to six games, FFX had turn-based gameplay and the sphere grid, FFXI was a persistent-world online multiplayer RPG, FFXII had the license system, FFXIII had the paradigm system and crystarium I think it was called? FFXIV is another persistent-world online multiplayer RPG with real time class changes, FFXV had a setting more closely based on our world and more action-based gameplay and I never played FFXVI and likely never will so IDK aside from it copping GoT (which Yoshida did to a lesser extent in FFXIV with Ishgard but apparently this game went full GoT? Pretty sure Ishgard got all the dragon stuff though) with a return to a high fantasy setting.
"a spin-off should never stray from the source material as much as mario party advance does while still sporting the name" the past 10 years of the paper mario franchise:
Man I used to love this game as a kid. I never played the original Mario Party so I just thought all of the games would have been like this if I played them. Never knew it was such a hated game.
I expected there to be less Nintendo biased comments after claiming there wouldn't be Yall just need to lower expectations, cause you guys take it way further and add words (and the GC example is a perfect example, they never claimed WHAT were coming from the Demos, Fans assumed it would be a new Pokemon game etc)
just completed Mario's Carnival Quest. Pretty good game, thanks for the rec! Two things tho: 1. Please buff the timer in Sort Stack from 30 to 60 seconds! It's far too stressful! 2. Please nerf the timer in Cloud Climb from 60 to 30 seconds! It's far too easy!
7:16 I call this the Earthbound Curse. Thankfully terrible marketing wasn't enough to stop the cult following that game earned and now it's an all-time-beloved classic. I feel like this is why Nintendo is best service by the Directs, where they just... show off the game and explain what it is. No clever marketing gimmicks, no campaigns. Just... here's the game. It's fun, try it.
When I was a kid, I got to play my big brothers' copy of this game where they had already completed the entire story. I basically never touched the town mode, objectively _the main mode of the game_ , because instead I was just having the time of my life going for high scores in the endless versions of the minigames in the arcade. I've spent so many hours just playing the bullet bill one, for example! I had no idea this game had a reputation as an awful experience... As the target audience in 2005, I can assure everyone I had a blast.
I guess it did help that it was my first mario party, so I had no idea it was a series and no multiplayer expectations to go along with it. Heck, even some of the gadgets had a bit of a mesmerizing factor to them.
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Oh no
No.
*drinks water* ahem...
*NO ONE CARES!!!!!!!!!!!!*
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It's a tesla with home depot plywood
The "Kirby Gamecube Game" probably wasn't Air Ride, but the old cancelled kirby game that turned into Kirby's return to dreamland. If you don't know, the game basically went through 3 or 4 scrapped versions on the gamecube before being moved over to the Wii. There are videos on UA-cam that explain the story in way more detail so go look at those.
I remember seeing something about _Kirby Air Ride_ being intended for the N64 before being moved as well but yea this video is a little misleading about certain aspects. Like I don't think the Zelda showcase was ever intended to be an actual game more than it was a showcase of the GameCube's power, same thing with _Super Mario 128_
@@ArgentuTA164-2 clue was talking about the fans' perceptions of the releases of the time, and how disappointed they felt when those games released. i think he was trying to explain their confusion and disappointment by "being" one of the fans
Turned into Return to Dreamland, Triple Deluxe, Star Allies, and The Forgotten Land.
@@godzzwrathI suspect he WAS one of those fans. Honestly it seemed most Zelda fans of the time were expecting the demo to be a teaser for a new game.
@@godzzwrathNo! That’s not accurate at all. Clue literally said Nintendo promised those were the games fans were getting, when they did NOT promise that at all.
"the joke is nobody would want to marry Bowser because he's a scary monster." 13 thousand hits on e621.
Chin up Bowser.
I’m never expecting someone to bring up that site until it happens.
@@thegreatpapyrus2306 become the change you want to see in the world. i alone mention the funny monosodium glutamate site over 10,000 times each day
Nobody wants to marry bowser because in Mario FMK he’s always the F
@@ebucario furries georg
dubious information jumpscare
The description of Nintendo in the 2000s kinda feels like how I feel about media from the decade as a whole. A lot of things tried cool new ideas that were thrashed at the time to the point where the reputation of some media released in the period never fully recovered, a lot of people say media in the 2010s relied a lot on nostalgia and avoided experimentation and to be honest I feel like a big part of that was a reaction to how utterly brutal the response to the experimentation of the 2000s was
Good point
Sonic
Disney 2D animation got the worst of it. Atlantis and Treasure Planet were two of their most ambitious and creative films ever made, but because they weren't A)CGI, and B)Princess movies, they were shunned. As a result, 2D animation is virtually extinct in the U.S., and the film industry is worse for it.
And the same Hollywood studios wonder why anime has taken over.
Sums up Saturn/Dreamcast-era Sega and Post-renaissance Disney. And even some toy companies.
@@scaryhobbit211anime already reached the west by the 2000s though and was already growing. Also 2D still exist it’s just not in big movies but besides from that it’s still around and many cartoons still use jt
if sunshine is “roleplaying as a janitor” im taking “janitor” as the really cool fun school janitor that was so nice and kind
I was best friends with my middle school janitor, I used to help her occasionally and always enjoyed talking to her
switch 2 launch game will fr be sunshine 2
That moment reminded me of when the New York Times mistakenly said Mario and Luigi were janitors back in the 80s.
oh yeah :D for us it's the hall monitors
People really sleeping on Janitors not realizing how cracked or badass they really are.
17:06 "I have never in my life seen a game review that was this blatantly cynical."
Sonic fans: "First time?"
Liking Super Mario games is far more accepted. But then I've actually the opposite problem occur in a Sonic review where the game was actually awful, but the review was positive toward the game, except...it was more about shit-talking on Sonic fans than talking about the game itself. It instead complained about fans not liking the game, and threw out insults. And this was a professional review.
Sonic games are so different from other games reviewers fucking combust.
SEGA has done so much experimenting with the Hedgehog since the move to 3D that the fan base as a whole can’t agree on what they want.
@@SchwarzornLemme guess: James Stephanie Sterling's review of Sonic 4 Episode 1
@@kfcnyancat Yeah. That one.
the tragedy of the early 2000s, when everything got reviewed based on the first hour of gameplay
To be fair, most games used to not even take an hour to complete, so you’ve got a game that takes at least the entire runtime of an older game before it’s fun to play. Sticking with it is quite a commitment.
Also reviewers were so negative in general, idk if everyone was trying to be the next Angry Videogame Nerd but it gets so tedious.
@@shinyagumon7015And anything that wasn't "adult" or "mature" got an instant score penalty, if it wasn't going for a realistic art direction then it got penalized too
*cough* sonic the hedgehog *cough*
if the first hour of a game is shit, then the game is shit.
The interactions you have with the characters really feels like episode plots you’d see in a saturday morning cartoon if it was Mario, especially the Bowser ones, and that absolutely endears me. Really unfortunate that the game was pushed out to be something it was not on the surface.
Posted 30 seconds ago:
Your crazy time traveling ass: 1d ago
@@RockProductionsYTlocal youtube comment discovers people who are members of a channel can watch videos a day early, more at 9
@@yggdrasilsaltar patreon but yeah
so you’re saying they feel right out of the mario super show?
@@masonasaro2118 yeah basically
What I'm getting here is that they should have abandoned faking a Mario Party and just leaned into the first ever Super Mario Visual Novel
This is giving me a real Yakuza vibe.
Have you ever heard of Mario: The Music Box?
@@SEiMEi_EXiSTSnot an official game
It’s a banger, but it doesn’t count cus it’s not official
and it would be called Doki Doki Mario Club
As an insane Visual Novel Collector / Lover, I'd absolutely buy that lol
6:25 Think it's worth noting that Guinness World Records: Gamer's Edition is notorious in it's own right for being hilariously bad (the group it was made in collaboration with, Twin Galaxies also got involved in the Donkey Kong high score scandal) and was discontinued in 2020 (likely as a result of aforementioned scandal)...
the gamecube era being so experimental caused nintendo to overcorrect in the wii era, and it's how we ended up having every mario game end up like new super mario bros, and it isn't until recently that they've gone back to trying creativity again
Well, the Mario Galaxy games are still very very good. All thr mainline titles were still good during the Wii. The Wii itself is the embodiment of experimental.
Id say Super Paper Mario was VERY creative
...Mario Party Advance???
I was expecting Mario Pinball Land. A full game that hates save files and passwords but expects hours in return in the post-Gameboy Era? And is probably the one pinball game that I imagine pinball fans will not really like?
nah, mario pinball land was good actually
The underwater music is just that good
am I the only one who likes mario party advance omggg?? i didn't know it was hated. maybe i liked it because it was my first ever mario party.
@@faithstea My comment is legit a comment defending it
Yes that game did suck
The hate is not unfounded, you can't play as Wario. Instant 0/10
Funny how he keeps showing Wario World too... And yet doesn't mention it.
Mario kart Tour: -10/10
@@hitkid2456yeah because this is about Mario party advance
300tg like
Finally, actual valid criticism
the bit in the background where you died immediately in 5 mario games in a row had me giggling like an idiot
i thought it was a metaphor
and then surviving in hotel mario LOL
Same LOL
3:37 - Kirby's Air Ride was actually originally intended on being on the N64. The "Gamecube Kirby Game" ended up becoming "Kirby's Return to Dreamland" for the Wii (and some development elements seemed to be used in "Star Allies" and "Forgotten Land")
Besides the points brought up in the video about why -Mario Party Advance- Mario's Carnival Quest got slammed, I can think of a few more.
1) People think of the 90s as the 'edgy' era, but plenty of that lingered well into the 2000s. The harsh reception Wind Waker got at the time wasn't just because Nintendo previewed Zelda as one thing and delivered something else, it's because that Space World clip showed a Zelda that was Mature for Mature Gamers, and Wind Waker was a bright cartoon.
2) More than any other Mario series, the Mario Party series suffers from sequel fatigue. I think it's because most of the other series learned to obscure how many titles there were with different titles, whereas at the point in 2005 that this game came out Mario Party was saying loud and proud that there had already been six of these things.
3) Negativity sells. It sells on UA-cam when people talk about the worst game/movie/book/breakfast cereal ever, and it sold in game magazines and websites. The problem is, as demonstrated by the Kane and Lynch Gamespot debacle, some games are beyond criticism if the game's publisher is funding the magazine enough. So when an acceptable target is in their sights, I think it can lead game reviewers to be disproportionately nasty.
It's weird how people conflate darker art style as being mature when a game could have serious themes and be cute looking and vice versa.
As for point 3 I feel like one popular youtuber destroying a decent indie game could kill the dev's career.
Early 2000s were peak edge. The edge era kept going strong until 2005, when Shad(ow, the edge)hog was released, and mockery of edginess came into vogue.
the kirby game was technically gonna come out, but it went through development hell and eventually became kirby's return to dream land.
there was actually multiple kirby games in development for the gamecube that were cancelled pretty far in developemnt! :D
One of the designs that got scrapped alongside it eventually got reused as Morpho Knight!
Kirby Air Ride mogs Return to Dreamland
@@bowber3434 it's crazy how HAL manage to bring back almost all the scrap concepts from the GameCube era to the recent games for nearly a decade. Like imagine the next dozen Super Mario games (both mainline and spinoffs) bring back all the concept designs from the Odyssey artbook. it's basically that for Kirby.
Sometimes I feel like Kirby is more of a priority to Nintendo than Mario is. They really went in all after Forgotten Land came out whereas Mario finally did something like what Rayman did with Origins/Legends. As nostalgic as I am towards NSMB Wii, I still think Nintendo should’ve made/released Wonder instead on the Wii to keep players from being burnt out.
Reading that review, I think it really does just highlight how like, unnecessarily harsh a lot of 2000s reviews were. I feel like some of it was the harsh deadlines that reviewers often face and in a lot of cases low/no pay. Also the idea of a mythical "bad game design" that is universal for every video game and can never budge for artistic purposes of course. I always avoided this game cause I was told it's just a bad single player mario party game, but knowing it's a weird mario party rpg, I think I'll give it a shot.
People hated "The Wind Waker" at the time because of the graphics, it was a blunt departure that Nintendo paid the price for it at the time.
When you hear "Mario Party" you automatically think "multi-player" so the idea of a multi-player game in a handheld console that relied on link cables and multiple cartridges to do that disencouraged people to even try the game in the first place. Bad marketing.
Like the video said, Nintendo's communication at the time was lacking.
Looking back... I think I might heavily dislike Generation X gaming journalists and especially Generation X Nintendo fans. They were also disinterested in Luigi's Mansion because it's not the 3D Mario game they were hoping for (then they got Sunshine which is a very polarizing title lol).
They also took Star Fox and F-Zero for granted and then those series became dormant.
@@PipeGuy64Bit Journalism in the early-2000s didn't have as much influence as it does nowadays. The only people buying magazines back then were enthusiasts that wanted a second opinion, but most people deciding on which game to buy would just come into a game store and just picked up whatever game that looked potentially interesting on the boxart or maybe saw a commercial of it.
i think most "mean reviews" exist just because they're very entertaining. not only is it a way to flex your creative writing skills as someone whos probably being underpaid, its also just more interesting for a reader if a game is "the worst of all time and made you want to die" instead of just being mediocre or pretty good. unfortunately when you're writing for a big organization about something that is actually relevant, your fun creative writing exercise becomes something people actually listen to and take into account. thats why, on the other hand, it doesnt really matter when someone like the angry video game nerd goes on a rant about a random NES game no one has heard about. its not really supposed to be a review, its just entertainment.
Not just video games but alot of cartoons had this treatment too because of John Kricfalusi influence
You know, this got me to realize that Mario Party Advance would've been much less hated if it had a different name and didn't force minigames onto the player as often as it did. Nice video!
mario party IS mini game central though?? like that's what you're signing up for when you play a mario party. i think it's trying to look for an apple in the orange section. i can understand it being mismarketed but even then doing a four person mario party is still SO LONG and as "torturous" as they keep describing mario party advance, no matter how much i have playing a mario party
It honestly reminds me a lot of Undertale, which might just be because they're RPGs and have similar comedic qualities, but they remind me of each other
Honestly I have a feeling for most forms of media that are considered better nowadays or not as hated are the result of the media not being meant for the franchise they’re trying to be a part of
Can we stop acting like the tech demos at space world were trailers for actual games rather than just graphical and technology showcases? Nintendo didn't lie at all, and I'm sick and tired of this narrative.
5:22 what y'all came for.
Holy shit the yap, thx
Yap? I was staring at that booty! @@xNytus
5 minutes of garbage yap is crazy
00:00-23:05 is what y'all came for. Context matters. Respect matters. If you don't like it, don't watch. But videos start where the creator decides they start, not you.
@@camannwordsmith bros the yappist
I can deal with the Opera GX ad, but calling the Donkey Konga Bongos “dumb” is a step too far 😢😢
@@NxSpiderxN Not just the music games but the whole platformer using the bongos is one of the best Donkey Kong games made.
Apparently gave help to create the Wii and Joycon controls too.
@@chronossage Donkey Kong Jungle Beat! Short game, but still very possibly my favorite Donkey Kong game ever made. Beating the crap out of evil Kongs by hammering the bongos is one of the most satisfying gaming experiences for me lol
Yeah that was stupid
Can't fault a company for experimenting.
The one I can't get down with is the LABO they were pushing a few years back.
Gotta say, I ADORE the mentality of "Hey, this game isn't perfect, but i like the core! Lets try and fix it!". I can think of multiple games I've grown up with that id love to fiddle with (Bionicle Heroes being a big one), i just don't have the know-how, or even where to start. Maybe one day ill investigate...
Keep up the good work!
"1d ago" when the video was posted 2 hours ago???? am i going crazy?
omg another bionicle heroes fan exists?
Mark my words, a few years from now some small game developer on Itchio going to take this game’s system and make a fun sleeper hit rougelite out of it
@@wutadam He viewed the video which was posted before via Patronite, simple as that
@@Jodrik713 then how would he have commented on youtube from patreon if the video went live on youtube 4 hours ago?
Metroid Prime did not need a reevaluation. It was criticized after it was announced as first person, but the demo silenced almost all of that when it was clear the gameplay would work.
And I don’t think it had weak storytelling, it was just environmental. Samus is a silent protagonist and she’s a badass at it. Other M showed us the horrors of turning her into a yandere anime heroine.
"It was hated upon announcement, but once the demo released, that opinion changed."
My brother in Christ. _That is a reevaluation._
And Nintenweebs still shit on it for being a "generic FPS".
@@Crazy56U Not the way the video meant, which was years after release, not before the release.
@@mechadeka I rarely see that, but I don't doubt it.
The reason why this game is bad, is because unlike 3 other Nintendo games that came out in the same year, it didn't have too much water. (Gen 3 Pokemon, wind waker, sunshine)
After jan Misali's latest video on the subject, I was expecting this to be about "I am a Teacher: Super Mario Sweater"
Is Mario Party Advance a mainline Super Mario game?
Who knows? There's no concensus after all...
Well, it certainly is not a mainline Mario Party game, and if it did not bear the name it would be consigned to oblivion except for jokes.
Wait, this isnt Pinball Land 😧
I actually thought he's talking about Pinball Land too (which I actually also like, and I actually think is playable despite the jank - I had like 20+ stars now there hehe) but MPA is another candidate for sure.
As someone who's 100% that game… TWICE… I don't really hate the experience. Some moments were frustrating for sure but far from the worst pinball clone I've played. MPA might not have the actual "party" aspect but the characters and minigames kept me entertained.
@@Mariorox1956 Damn, mad respect for you dude, just trying to complete the game is hell, because of the garbage physic of the ball, and im not saying that because i hate pinballs, iv'e played other nintendo pinballs games that handelds the physic better, like Pokemon pinball and Kirby Pinball, which both were on the game boy.
Yeah I thought for sure it’d be Pinball Land
I was totally convinced it was going to be Mario Pinball Land
Thank god the thumbnail is not using that stupid overused sad mario render that most clickbait Nintendo youtubers use
I can literally imagine what this video’s thumbnail would look like if it had that same sad photoshopped Mario image.
Thought you were talking about the image with a sad Mario pulling over a curtain. I can still imagine it with the other sad Mario render though.
Or the other one from Robot Chicken.
which one? sad mario on the stairs or shocked mario from odyssey?
@@user-qy9tz6cb1j Probably that front facing one with the sad mouth. That's the one I associate with sad Mario renders.
I'm guessing the one from "NiNtEnDo HaS fOrGoTtEn AbOuT mArIo"?
I personally like the name “Mario’s Party Quest” more than “Mario’s Carnival Quest”. I think that “Mario’s Party Quest” has the same benefits you mentioned (using the word quest implies it’s more of an rpg and it’s further removed from being a main line Mario Party), while highlighting its status as a Mario Party spin off more clearly (things like rolling to move and mini games). Also, “Mario’s Party Quest” makes more sense for the narrative of the game, given that the game is about Mario’s Quest to save Party City
true, however consider the classic tale of grandma buying her grandkids the wrong game because the title is too similar
@@nonbuddy I disagree with that take because 1: there wasn't another Mario Party for the GBA, and 2: that argument could also work against Mario Party Advance as it already exists if we're assuming the kid in question wanted, for example, Mario Party 5 for the GameCube. At least calling it "Mario's Party Quest" or something similar would both serve as a means of keeping the connection to the main MP games while also demonstrating in the title that it's a bit different than the main titles on the consoles of the time.
I don’t know how you think the words “Mario party” and “Mario’s party” would be legible as different series to the average consumer, but ummmmm no, no it wouldn’t. Just stay away from the word party, it clearly ruined the first impression of the game already.
@@gronodon Stadats never said anything about having the title appear as if it's from another series, though? The entire point of their comment is to keep a connection with the Mario Party series, since it still features most of the trappings of those games, while also having the title be different enough to convey to people that it's also a different experience. "Mario's Party Quest" fits both of those things for the reasons they stated.
@@DurradonXylles There's simply no way I'm reading "Mario's Party " and not reaching the conclusion that it isn't a Mario Party game.
0:02 that would be Devil’s Third…
18:03 fun fact this game wasnt released in south korea because of the gambling games
man they should of started w/ the " you can marry bowser" , instant buy
"So long Gay Bowser 😡" just turned into "Come along Gay Bowser 😏"
And that quest isn't locked to Peach.
I love how this random advert at 6:57 decided to use a render of Paper Mario to advertize Mario Party Advance (although they did unintentionally predict the boot car in TOK).
That's still so funny to me 😭 Nintendo in the 2000s really liked using random stock Paper Mario renders
Basically none of the renders except that boot car were from Mario Party Advance. For some reason there's also a Yoshi render from SM64DS, and the hosts from Mario Party 4 (with the Goomba being on there twice). Early 2000s marketing was a charming mess.
Unrelated but
Nice Fuga PFP
*am i the only one who thinks paper mario sticker star is THE WORST mario game in history?*
@@demonpikmin2343 Real and based
"No one would want to marry Bowser" Oh Nintendo, you sweet summer child.
bro every game in the 2000s got reviewed like they were on avgn
I wonder if video game reviewers were nursing an anti-Nintendo bias that bled into a criticism for most videogames that led to the emulation of AVGN even more than the emulation of AVGN.
AVGN was fairer than pro game reviewers at the time tbh.
[Skip sponsor button] 1:41
Thank you
@@haleyhersh3850 no problem!
Now skip the rambling
It’s a gross sponsorship too. Definitely won’t watch another video of his
@@DerrickWilson-fm7vcMy guess is that he wasn’t educated on the problems with Opera. I haven’t seen much coverage on the issues anyways
the way you phrased and read aloud "you, the player, have to marry bowser" had me laughing so hard i was still feeling it an hour later
First, bringing justice to the worst Chris Pratt game and now bringing justice to the worst Chris Pratt game.
Very accurate 😮
😵💫
Crisp Rat ?
Tfw when Chris Pratt stomps on you
You are massively unfunny.
THIS is the most hated!?! People do realize that Mario pinball land exists for the same system, right?
So does Mario Kart Tour, objectively the worst game to ever exist of all time. Can't wait for when it inevitably dies for good.
@@Thegamingwizard55The Game Boy Advance has 1 1/2 Mario Kart games.
Tour is not one of them.
@@autobotstarscream765 I meant Mario Kart Tour should have been in the video if they were going to discuss worst games of all time, I didn't mean it was for the GBA. My bad if I wasn't clear there.
i still think neither of these deserve to be the most hated because both ooze with early 2000s Mario charm & creativity, from MPA's very unique Toads to Pinball featuring 3D Koopatrols. I have no idea why these are rated lower than games like Sticker Star from the 2010s that are just as bland as bland can possibly get.
And Mario sports mix for Wii, dreadful game
Its crazy how much better reception this game would've gotten if it literally wasn't called and marketed as a mainline Mario Party
Nintendo didn't "promise" anything with those demos tbf, they were just demos.
Yeah but you don't show off something like that without claiming "these are not games". There's no need to side with a greedy game company that knew what they were doing :3
I am legitamitely surprised this is the most hated Mario game. When Mario teaches Typing, Mario is missing, and most importantly Hotel Mario exist.
Those first two are actually decent at their function: Being educational and being made for pre-10 year old kids. In that, they actually do their jobs properly. And Hotel Mario isn't even a bad game, it's just a lackluster one. It's a low-effort clone of Elevator Action, but fundamentally it's not even that bad.
@@the-NightStari really hate it when gamers shit on games simply for being for young audiences or cash outs and not because the actual game design didnt do what it set out to do very well. There are some good hidden gems that are licensed cash grabs, and the mario mud pies series is inoffensive and works well for what it set out to do.
There is nothing wrong with having a target audience so young it alienates the overgrown internet nerds. Kiddies need games too!
@the-NightStar Mario is missing's information isn't even accurate and it's so boring. So it sucks
I thought this was going to be towards Sticker Star. The game that took down both sides of the Mario RPGs at the end of the 2010s; the game that made sure there was 6! groups of fans after The Origami King; the game that was literally only correctly with a remastering of the most wanted Paper Mario game. A game so bad you have to compare it to particularly bad point-and-click adventure games to like it beyond the worst parts of Color Splash and The Origami King.
@@the-NightStarHotel Mario is usually seen as superior to the three Zelda CDI games (nicknamed “The Unholy Triforce”).
I'm so sad that Mario's Carnival Quest will not have an EU version
Just get the NTSC ROM.
GBA is region-free. Unless you wanted a language other than English, it would be the same thing outside of maybe an extra U.
i feel like "mario party rpg" or "mario party quest" would be a more accurate title for it
Fun fact: super mario 128 became pikmin
7:59 Uh that's how most spinoffs are though. That's what spinoffs are _for_ in the first place.
Mario Party itself is a spinoff series of the Super Mario platforming games... Mario Party, Mario Golf, Mario Sluggers, DDR Mario Mix, Wario Land, SMW2: Yoshi's Island. All spinoffs of Super Mario. Hell, the original unsuper Mario Bros is a spinoff of Donkey Kong, Super Mario Bros is a spinoff of Mario Bros and Donkey Kong Country is also a spinoff of Donkey Kong. Heck, it wasn't until Mario vs Donkey Kong that we got anything _close_ to the classic arcade Donkey Kong trilogy again but it was a puzzle platformer, still a spinoff.
For Mario it's actually really hard to tell what counts as a spinoff, since the series was designed from the beginning to be able to work with a lot of genres.
the issue is that mario party advance is a spin off of mario party, but it doesn't really show that at all and seems like just another mario party game on the surface
it's as if nintendo had released a "New Super Mario Bros." game, but it was actually a visual novel. obviously that's what spin offs are, and that's fine. but mario party is a clear spin off from the mainline mario series since it uses the "Mario Party" title. mario party advance on the other hand uses the SAME "Mario Party" title, but is a spin-off of THAT series, with no clear hint of that
I honestly thought it was gonna be Mario Tennis Ultra Smash, because MAN that game is mad boring.
Can't be the "most hated" anything if you're so boring everyone forgets you
Scott the Woz moment
What about Mario Strikers: Battle League? That game makes Miyamoto's "Delayed game good, Rushed game forever bad" quote a goddamn joke.
@@RainbyFINchill it's just how they think of the game
the issue with you two thinking of ultra smash and battle league is that it needs to be a game someone can reasonably sit and defend for a 23 minute video. ultra smash and battle league are not games one can defend for 23 minutes 💀
Idk how people thought those GameCube tech demos were supposed to be reveal trailers
At that time, I remember not knowing what a tech demo was. 128 Marios was just plain confusing to me. I imagine a lot of kids who were finally old enough to start following the gaming industry thought the same.
@@mowkikowski I was 14 and never thought any of it was supposed to be a game... except Meowth's Party, because Nintendo Power discussed it in an issue and it sounded like it was supposed to be an actual game.
I was one of the first people to point out first that the Zelda clip didn't even look like it was supposed to be a game, and frankly doesn't even look that good.
More like they just thought something similar would come out of it, specifically the Zelda one
Even just the pixel art and character designs are so incredibly charming, I can't believe nobody gave it the benefit of the doubt just because of the name for so long...
Fancy seeing you around here!
hi poligogn donutute
holy shit its pongon!!!
4:15 How dare you besmirch Donkey Konga.
Pretty sure the correct timestamp is 3:59
Regardless though, this comment got a little giggle in me
The difference between random encounters and mushroom challenges
Is that Random encounters in games usually increase exp or level or in cases like Pokémon, it has an ability to expand YOUR abilities
But mushroom challenges only serve to make you roll a dice more to get more mushroom challenges…
I feel like the minigames could’ve also been improved if they had a reasonable difficulty curve, like if they got more challenging the further you got through the game. Some of the minigames are genuinely very fun, but by the time you’ve mastered all of them they just get so easy to the point where they feel like a massive waste of time. If they had harder variations, this problem could’ve been fixed and it would be way more fun, perhaps by increasing the speed of the obstacles, increasing the score needed to win, or changing up the level design.
Totally agree with this part, I think it's the most unfortunate part about this game for me, especially since every game has an "score attack" version, why is there only one "story mode version" when you made such adaptable games like that? Missed opportunity!
Yeah, I found that the minigame quality and difficulty varied enormously - Cloud Climb rarely took me more than 10 seconds from its 1 minute time limit to complete, but I only managed to beat Stompbot XL one time in my entire run. It's a problem when, as soon as the minigame you'll be playing is announced, your reaction is either "oh this is a freebie" or "ok, well, guess we've lost". There's very, very few of the games that felt like a reasonable challenge every time.
Nobody asked
@@egaycastillo1631 thanks for your input!
Glad I could help you make the balance changes! I hope people will be able to appreciate it for what it brought to the table now.
3:37 As a lost media enjoyer, if I recall correctly, they tried to make a full 3D Kirby game 2 separate times for GameCube, and it just didn't work out both times. So they settled on AirRide.
This may not be 100% accurate, since I'm going based off of memory here. But I remember there being a beta for AirRide that's lost, and at least 1 beta for a 3D game that is lost.
Edit: More memory here. Yes, the original version of AirRide was a remake of Tilt & Tumble, that got reworked into AirRide.
I do feel a little confused; the Metroid Prime point of "these games being heralded as masterpieces" feels weird. While Sunshine and Wind Waker definitely are more well-loved in retrospect than at the time of release, Metroid Prime was extremely beloved at release. I don't really remember anyone throwing a fuss over minor issues with the game.
Yeah, you can tell this guy either wasn't alive in 2001 or was too young to be reading magazines. He just saw there was initial skepticism and assumed it got the same treatment from older kids and teenagers that all the other Gamecube games did. He hasn't figured out that Prime got praised by us because it was aimed at us while Wind Waker was not.
@@catkaboodle "Aimed at "us"? What are you talking about lol, just because windwaker was more cartoony doesn't mean it was "for kids". Were you one of those "Celda" people way back when? lmao
@@sdf434-pp8jd I liked TWW from the start, but I also knew that the artstyle was an obvious rejection of the notion that they needed to pander to older American gamers to make money. The difference between me and the millions of angry randos online is that I didn't take this rejection personally.
After writing that out, I realize how absurd it must sound to people who grew up with the Gamecube. But it's true! There were people with college degrees that publicly melted down because Nintendo wasn't interested in making games for them anymore. In mid-2000s America, cartoons were considered to be for children without any exception.
@@catkaboodle That's funny because I was college age at the time, as well as my friends, and we all thought it was amazing. The only people I saw who didn't like it were ironically younger teenagers (like 12-15 ish) who felt it wasn't "grown up" looking enough for them.
I think CS Lewis has some choice quotes about this.
@@sdf434-pp8jd College makes some people entitled. I think it fills people with pride.
Bowser's a king with an army of monsters. Of course I'd marry him.
the mario series has such a great sense of humor that tends to go unappreciated
The immense relief I felt upon realizing this video was not about Paper Mario: Sticker Star
Why would it be?
Literally nothing is redeemable about that game. A game practically designed for no target audience
@@luigifan4585 Correct, but the title said the most hated Mario game so that's immediately what my mind jumped to. I agree, Sticker Star does not deserve justice lmao
I actually enjoyed Sticker Star, but it definitely has a lot of flaws and could have been so much better...
@@WickBRSTM Mario Kart Tour also deserves no justice at all and is infinitely worse than not only Sticker Star but any game altogether.
I'd argue that specifically the beta for Sticker Star deserves justice. The few screenshots of it looks like the true follow up to Super and TTYD and it's kind of depressing.
Wait a minute… worst Mario game? This isn’t Paper Mario Sticker Star!
Should have been Mario Kart Tour in the video
@@Thegamingwizard55 tour wasn’t that bad, it’s just filled with micro transactions.
@@Bighaid91 Tour is objectively the worst game to ever exist, not just because of micro transactions but also because of how it is poorly designed and the fact that you can never play any track at any time. Plus it no longer gets any new content so it will die for good one day.
@@Thegamingwizard55"objectively the worst game to ever exist" calm down, the likes of cheetahman 2, big rigs, desert bus and super man 64 exist!
@@Reset-sm6rgalso bubsy 3d and crazy bus
guiness isnt a good source ever, as exemplified by tommy tallarico's whole fiasco
Ironically Mario Sunshine is actually still my favourite Mario game just because of the vibes and the aesthetic
"Keep on gaming, but never become arrogant." -Kamek
someone stop him... he fixed garfield, he fixed mario... he's too powerful
The point that you raised in 7:53 is one that seems to get lost in a lot of Nintendo discourse: that it's valid for some fans to be disappointed in an established series going in a suddenly extremely different direction from usual, and they shouldn't be shamed for being disappointed or expressing it just because the new game might have strengths of its own separate from the context of its series. Also that Nintendo often plays a big part of fostering misaligned expectations but tend to get totally overlooked.
I never understood the weird hate so many people have when games go a different route with a spin off or a singular title. Do people really want the same game over and over and over again? I am honestly bored these days with AAA and AA gaming, because nobody dares to make something new anymore.
@@xXYannuschXx the first part of this video literally covers exactly why
@@xXYannuschXx People want difference but also don't wanna get outside their confort zone.
@@ikagura Exactly. Fans of spaghetti might want to try a new sauce or cheese on their noodles, but most importantly they still want spaghetti noodles at the core. They don't want rice when they're craving spaghetti, especially not if it's being LABELED as "spaghetti" to specifically evoke their interest in spaghetti.
True, look at Mario and Luigi: Brothership.
This conversation feels a lot like the Banjo-Kazooie Nuts & Bolts conversation.
Lose the Banjo Kazooie and its actually a better than decent game, but *because* it was promised as "Threeie" but released as an Open World Kart Builder (which, btw, is really fucking cool), it was very poorly recieved.
8:50 Well I'm gonna stop watching there for now. You already convinced me to play it and I'd rather doing it without knowing anything.
What makes this an RPG? The closest thing I can find to a roleplaying element is being able to choose your character which doesn't really make a difference outside of a few quests. I think it makes way more sense to call this an adventure game (in line with point-and-click adventure games) than an RPG
@@UncommentedCode Dice rolls are like RNG and the minigames are random encounters...I guess?
Oh boy yet another game that is basically like an adventure game that is a sign of how bad the series will become until 2023!
The other game being Sticker Star.
BONUS BOARD! Don’t forget about Bonus Board! Where you can get PHYSICAL with Mario’s Carnival Quest and use a SINGLE GAME BOY ADVANCE to play small minigames with up to 4 players, while moving PHYSICAL PIECES on a REAL BOARD! It’s nuts!
Now seriously, I’ve never once hated Mario Party Advance. I’ve been a fan of this game since I saw it way back when on a Club Nintendo magazine (Latin American Nintendo Power, if you will) and I love it. It’s quirky, it’s different, but it’s my kind of game and the minigames are all kinds of fun, so much so that only now are they being appreciated through their addition in fan games like Party Project.
3:35 There actually was a sequel or follow-up to Kirby 64 in the works for GameCube but it was canned.
The biggest broken promise was Earthbound/MOTHER 64, which became the Japan-exclusive MOTHER 3 the GBA. Granted that was 1999 but close enough.
Y'know, this seems the type of game I'd play for a while, then never touch again, and then re-discover, with the cycle repeating itself endlessly.
saying this game is "up there with animal crossing, chibi robo, and luigis mansion" is fucking wild bro
Wild and right
But also accurate.
@@fapuloes not right just wild
@@wobblzYT Yeah, gotta be fair. Played this game as a kid and liked it, but it doesn't live rent free in my head like Animal Crossing and Luigi's Mansion does.
This was one of my favorite GBA games growing up. I get it's not everyone's cup of tea and it's nowhere near a traditional Mario Party experience, but for a single player offering in the same spirit of the series I think it does really well for the system it's on.
I won't say REALLY well (I assume better ways to incorporate the 1 player gameplay with this fetch quest format) but it is fine enough.
1:58 Now you know what it’s like to be a Sonic fan in the 2010s.
ngl, even a Mario Game honestly sold as a Mini-Game filled Visual Novel RPG sounds like a massively hard sell.
This looks pretty cute and charming... If you ask me the worst Mario game and a game that should be hated is Super Mario Bros 2. Japanese version of course, American version is great. The japanese version was just a worse version of the first one with like two new things? Poison mushroom and wind. No new enemies, music, level types, power ups. Weakest sequel and mario game I have ever seen.
That's the game I was expecting.
I was actually expecting that one too because I think it’s over hated especially when you consider it was made in just one year. It was simply just more Mario bros one which was fine
And personally I like the increased difficulty
(Minus the backwards warp pipes that still baffles me)
NGL, this sort of reminds me of how a lot of BOF fans see Dragon Quarter, since it wasn't a traditional RPG, you're just a normal person, and can't spam your powers. And it was even from the same generation as this one.
At least now people changed their minds on Dragon Quarter, especially after the mess that was the mobile title that they forced to be a mainline numbered title
The preview made me think this was gonna be about Super Mario Sunshine ._.
I thought this was going to be a Mario Pinball video
same lmao
Should have been a Mario Kart Tour video instead
I thought it was going to be a Mario Lost Levels video, but i think that game got the hate it deserves
mario pinball land was lit tho
@feIon wait it's called pinball land? I thought it was just pinball also you are the first person that I have seen that actually likes that game
17:00 To be fair, games journalism has pretty much always been utter crap. Back in those days, it's because games were seen more at toys for children rather than anything that could be meaningful like art. There's still a lot of issues with games journalism today, and for the foreseeable future, people will always jump to wild conclusions about things to serve a narrative rather than actually enjoy a dang video game.
I find it hard to believe this game was hated more than Hotel Mario, Mario’s Missing, or Mario’s Time Machine
maybe so, but Mario Party Advance is the one with the Guinness World Record for worst.
04:55
Never hated Wind Waker. Just hatred (and STILL hate) the art style.
No. Before anyone comes at me. I dont hate cel shading optic. It can look very good. But for me the way Wind Waker done it is just not appealing
If the best thing you can say about the minigames is that they're "Fine" and "Manageable" then I'm sorry if you haven't convinced me.
i didn’t know that mario party advance was THAT hated! i knew that people didn’t like it compared to the other party games, but there’s a whole lot worse that you can find in the mario series.
To be fair game journalists can have some very questionable opinions IMO hehe...but even within Mario Party fans it is in the bottom because of its non-Mario Party gameplay; that being said many do recognize the charm it has.
@@zjzr08I put this one over 9 and 10.
Yes you can blame them for "being misled", Nintendo clearly put out TECH DEMOS and people assumed it was going to be a representation of the final product.
"I've never seen a game review that was so cynical."
Sonic the Hedgehog: "First time?"
Sonic Adventure 2: 9.4 IGN
Sonic Adventure 2 Battle (released 8 months later literally just a port with better fps): 6.9 IGN
I suppose the exclusion of Big the Cat cameos was worth the -2.5 in score😂
you get to romance Bowser, 10/10 best game ever
15:25
I bet there are a lot of people who'd love to marry Bowser in his Bowsette form. XD
There are just as many people who'd love to marry Bowser in his normal form 👀
7:47 Disagree. Final Fantasy is the ultimate example of "titles do not matter" and "every game can be as different from the last, title be damned." Especially for Spin offs. The Spirits Within
, Crystal Chronicles, aren't JRPGs, and they are barely related to the core series, yet they all have plenty of fans.
Fans need to take responsibility for once in their lives.
Final Fantasy built up an expectation of every game being substantially different: FFII went completely nutso with its progression system, FFIII had a better class system than the first game and FFIV had a playable party of actual characters (this would become status quo but it was still different at the time). I'm not entirely sure how FFV and FFVI changed things up but I know for a fact that they did. FFVII would introduce more contemporary settings (which again would become status quo but still new at the time), FFVIII had the draw and junction systems, FFIX was a throwback to the first three to six games, FFX had turn-based gameplay and the sphere grid, FFXI was a persistent-world online multiplayer RPG, FFXII had the license system, FFXIII had the paradigm system and crystarium I think it was called? FFXIV is another persistent-world online multiplayer RPG with real time class changes, FFXV had a setting more closely based on our world and more action-based gameplay and I never played FFXVI and likely never will so IDK aside from it copping GoT (which Yoshida did to a lesser extent in FFXIV with Ishgard but apparently this game went full GoT? Pretty sure Ishgard got all the dragon stuff though) with a return to a high fantasy setting.
At this point even the mainline numbered FF games are basically a different franchise with the FF name slapped on.
15:41 I’d marry Bowser ANY day
05:25 Skip background to main body: Mario Party Advance.
"a spin-off should never stray from the source material as much as mario party advance does while still sporting the name"
the past 10 years of the paper mario franchise:
Man I used to love this game as a kid. I never played the original Mario Party so I just thought all of the games would have been like this if I played them. Never knew it was such a hated game.
6:35 ...the frame
LITCHAILY
I expected there to be less Nintendo biased comments after claiming there wouldn't be
Yall just need to lower expectations, cause you guys take it way further and add words (and the GC example is a perfect example, they never claimed WHAT were coming from the Demos, Fans assumed it would be a new Pokemon game etc)
Just seems like another hate Nintendo video 💀😂
just completed Mario's Carnival Quest. Pretty good game, thanks for the rec! Two things tho:
1. Please buff the timer in Sort Stack from 30 to 60 seconds! It's far too stressful!
2. Please nerf the timer in Cloud Climb from 60 to 30 seconds! It's far too easy!
isn't opera gx literally spyware did we all forget about when they made everyone watch their stream that one time
7:16 I call this the Earthbound Curse. Thankfully terrible marketing wasn't enough to stop the cult following that game earned and now it's an all-time-beloved classic. I feel like this is why Nintendo is best service by the Directs, where they just... show off the game and explain what it is. No clever marketing gimmicks, no campaigns. Just... here's the game. It's fun, try it.
5:51 For those who are curious.
Thank you, i was skipping for several minutes, almost 6 minute of intro
When I was a kid, I got to play my big brothers' copy of this game where they had already completed the entire story. I basically never touched the town mode, objectively _the main mode of the game_ , because instead I was just having the time of my life going for high scores in the endless versions of the minigames in the arcade. I've spent so many hours just playing the bullet bill one, for example! I had no idea this game had a reputation as an awful experience... As the target audience in 2005, I can assure everyone I had a blast.
I guess it did help that it was my first mario party, so I had no idea it was a series and no multiplayer expectations to go along with it. Heck, even some of the gadgets had a bit of a mesmerizing factor to them.
"I HATE OPERA GX!!!"
- Shrimpo The Shrimp (or me)