Rhino-Rack roof rack: Why I didn't buy one | Auto Expert John Cadogan
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- If you’re thinking about buying a Rhino-Rack for your 4X4, I suggest you don’t. I certainly didn’t, and I was going to. Here’s why:
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4X4 roof load limits are typically in the 75-100 kilo ballpark. The Rhino Rack for Hilux weighs 27 kilos - that’s the flat ‘Pioneer’ rack and the ‘Backbone’ rail system. Therefore, that’s 48 kilos of cargo ‘upstairs’. This might be OK if that were the end of this story, but it’s not.
There’s a further reduction in payload capacity mandated by Rhino in conditions Rhino calls (erroneously) ‘off road’. Basically, you have to knock a further one-third off the payload. The basis for this reduction is not stated.
If I got this right, this reduces the Hilux roof rack payload by 16 kilos, to just 32 kilos. Nearly $1800 for a roof rack system to carry just 32 kilos.
It’s just bad value, dude - $55 per kilo (of off-road payload). That would be like paying $1000 for a jerry can. You’ve got to be kidding.
I suspect, were this limitation to be prominently displayed on Rhino’s website it might turn many people off buying the product. It certainly turned me off, but I had to dig to find it.
This load reduction is buried in the PDF fitting instructions for the ‘Backbone’ rail part of the system. I’m not saying Rhino is actively or maliciously hiding it. I’m saying that this critical safety information should be much more prominently displayed and unequivocally clear to intending buyers, in my view.
I’d suggest, if you’re a potential customer, you’re unlikely to download the fitting instructions. That’s the kind of thing you’d do only after buying, and even then, only if you plan on fitting it yourself.
Even though Rhino refers to this reduction as a (quote) ‘off road cargo allowance’ … in the fine print it actually applies to:
“Any driven path taken that does not contain a surface protection layer (tar/bitumen)”
Unsealed roads are roads. They are not ‘off road’. That seems kinda misleading to me.
But it’s even worse than that:
“Load must be evenly distributed over the system”
Rhino fitting instructions there. So let’s not be putting a 32-kilo second spare tyre ‘up there’, maxxing-out the rack. Because that’s not evenly distributed.
The latent engineer in me considers this an entirely impractical operational stipulation. This rack is supposed to carry 4X4 gear. That’s why people generally buy them. This equipment is not generally amenable to even load distribution. It doesn’t work like that. Gas bottle. Spare wheel. Jerry can. Whatever.
Even load distribution is, like, sand in a trailer. You can’t spread out a gas bottle and a jerry can. (And you can’t carry much more than that either.)
Bottom line: I’ve got a Triton. It’s got a 100kg factory roof load limit. I’d only be fitting a rack that enabled me to exploit all of Mitsubishi’s roof load capacity, in all foreseeable driving conditions. And I think that’s what most roof rack buyers expect.
I ask you: Why fit a product that actually degrades your vehicle’s fundamental capability? This makes no sense to me.
Amazing 🙌 100% support everything you said. Thanks for helping bring this information to the public eye
Thanks Tyler - you started all this mate!
Apart from not all 4WD owners are wankers like he says
Thanks to you mate you might have saved someone from a terrible tragedy
Nah, thank you tyler, if it wasn't for you, I'd still be overloading my crappy rhino that can carry nothing.
As above.
This wouldn’t be a thing if Tyler Thompson hadn’t done the hard yards with Rhino! Rhinos conduct is a disgrace!!
They are all piggybacking off him. Good that the word is getting out though.
Tyler is a great guy, and extremely fair about all things 4WD.
Yes, some more value added via different perspectives, but definitely feels like piggybacking
100% Tyler Thompson did the hard yards.
#facts. Ronny was caught with his hands in the cookie jar. Tyler thompson is the real hero here, ronny is a sell out.
So basically a Rhino is as useful as a screen door on a submarine!
I love my pioneer platform! It is the most expensive LED light bar bracket I have ever bought :)
You could put a trenching tool/shovel up there along with some trax.
Shameful. I have been a member of a large 4WD club for over 30 years and it seems appropriate to link this video to our members site. Others should do the same.
Done! Cheers
And just like THAT, Dingo Piss Creek becomes overcrowded & unusable. Thanks Cado!
"These hopeless hippies had broken down and it turned out the only tools they had were themselves." (Outback expert Russell Coight) 😂😋
Need to try dingo piss lake. I was there recently. It’s amazing
I have 2 new sayings this week...
Industry Standard. And
Dingo Piss Creek...
The few thumbs down must be from Rhino management.
Or those who can see the errors in what John is saying. He seems to be singling Rhino out for the Hilux having a low roof load-capacity and a lack of adequate anchor points. I'd like to see how the other makers are getting around physics with their racks. I agree that Rhino should be up front about the use and limitations of their product - but that is a Toyota problem too. They know how people intend to use their cars when they construct them Why is John singling out Rhino and not Toyota?
@@technopsychobedlam I reckon you should actually look into how others mount before you comment. Also, the actual guy who blew the lid on this was driving a navara when his rack fell out of its mounting points in the roof.
It is squarly rhinos poor enineering and deceitful hiding of important safety information in a place where no reasonable person would ever read. Who fits thier own racks to actually warrant reading the fitting instructions to find the true limit?
Why does rhino and retailers promote this rack to all makes of ute if as you say its about a utes load limits and not the rack?
@@sloth_e Ronny definitely had a Hilux. If its a similar issue on the Nissan, then they have an issue to address also.
I agree that mounting a rack via rivets into the roof metal is just wrong. Rhino is wrong to suggest that is an ok solution.
But if Toyota/Nissan only provides a low roof load limit and no proper mounts that is also a problem
Other rack companies can't do better than the roof limit minus the rack weight - so that part is a Toyota/Nissan issue. It's weird that people aren't whaling hard on Toyota/Nissan about it though.
Wow... thank you for researching and raising awareness on this. So many potential court cases and deaths out there flying around blissfully unaware
I'm in Las Vegas in 'Murrica and I look forward to John's videos from Straya. Always great information and funny as fuck! Thx!
I love Vegas. Visited 13 years in a row to attend a swap meet in Henderson. Just three days then fly back to Straya. Strangely enough not once have I ever played the slot machines. I must be Nevada's worst tourist.
If you love auto expert John's work you'll pee your pants with outback downunder expert Russell Coight's work. 🤣😋
@@mael-strom9707 Everything I know about outback survival I learnt from Russel Coight. That's probably why I tend to stay in the city.
@@coover65 that's where I live, to be exact, Henderson. I say Las Vegas to simplify things.
@@mael-strom9707 I will check him out for sure. Thank you
I am glad this popped up in my feed as I was about to do the same, purchase a full rack as opposed to roof bars. Needless to say a standard set of 2 bar roof racks will suffice, saving about $1K, thanks.
I can think of a few cases where a big set of racks is great, and it doesn't include 4WD's
I can think of many, many cases where big racks are awesome, but I also support little racks, because I can! :)
@@markh.6687, here here to that!
Gentlemen...I think we can all agree that racks of differing shapes, sizes and sometimes even ones made of composite materials like silicone are all fantastic...but when they get to the point where they end up dragging on the ground because of poor "supporting hardware", be that pop rivets or no underwire/straps then i think you'd agree its time we look for a better set of "racks" :)
@@weegaz22 I should rather have natural than enhanced racks, with a few carefully-vetted enhanced racks grandfathered in (Dolly Parton, El Vira, surgical/medical issues, etc.) But wholesale mass market rack enhancement simply to show off simply doesn't work for me. Nor does it work on vehicles. :)
And here was the opportunity for a few videos of racks of different shapes and sizes. I was waiting for it and it didn't happen!
Damn it John i just bought the rhino for my triton last week and now you put this up.. Thanks heaps
Triton has 4 bolt down points under the rubber gutter strip. I've got cross bars and a flat tray attached, triton roof load is 80kg, cross bars and tray are about 15 -20 kg, so you'll be let with around 60kg to load up there. Take the rhino rack back
I have been running said roof rack on my 200 series land cruiser for a couple of years now. Luckily I do load it to more than about 50kg. When I saw Tylers video I was so pleased he made this public. I don’t plan to load mine up any heavier than that but I’m glad this information is now out there. Buy the way the 200 has a roof load of 150kg. So I’m safe but things could have been a lot different potentially. Cheers Steve
That’s fantastic mate, next time i head up to my favourite campsite at dingo piss creek, not only will it be crowded because of your exposure to this great place but my roof rack supplied by rhino of course will most likely fall off 🤠.
Lol
Now the word is out all Rhino RRs will jump off and DP creek will be
full of abandoned RRs.
Exactly why I didn't buy one. Instead I have a aluminium canopy with cab overhang. It can take the same weight as the tray but the most I would put up there is 200kg to avoid rolling over. A box up there with a face of 100cmx50cm seems to increase fuel use by 50% at 110kmph
I’ve been looking at getting one of these for my Shitlux. Thank you for the heads up.
So what roof rack did you buy John ?
Snorkels ✅
Roof racks ✅
Please do lift kits next.
From a person that obviously has never been off road lol
My Rhino rack fell apart after about 12 months there complete crap. I’ve moved over to Yakima platforms now and after 2 years it’s such a solid product ! 👍🏼
Have you got their rail kit with rivets mate? Any issues off road?
@@Ethan-mv2un I do, and so far it's pretty solid, a year down the road, literally. The issue of limits still applies though, but luckily I only put the slight excess I can't fit in the tray, up there..
Let's not forget rhino is just the accessory provider - it's the car manufacturers who have a duty to provide a roof attachment/structure suitable for the end user. It's like getting pissed off at your pair of Nikes for you getting tired/unfit and not being able to run a 42 km marathon
Good to see things haven't changed much in 50 years! When working with a mining company in WA back in the early 70's, all their LWB (and narrow track) Land Rover wagons (weren't called 4WD's in those days) were fitted with very heavy full length roof racks. They were loaded with spare axles, spare spring sets and many metal trunks full of spare parts and tinned food (just in case you got stranded somewhere northeast of Kalgoorlie). With more than 200kg about 7ft off the ground they were absolute dogs to drive on seriously rutted roads and even worse on the highways at higher speeds. You can imagine what the fuel economy was awful and we had to carry extra fuel tanks and jerry cans as well. Many were lost to roll-overs and of course if you rolled one you lost your job instantly. I managed 12 months with the company without rolling one but I didn't put all the heavy stuff up the top only deck chairs and bed rolls. Actually it was better to tow a small Heavy Duty trailer with all the heavy stuff in it and then park it at the campsite whilst doing daily bush exploration trips.
My sister's factory Toyota roof racks were ripped off the roof on the highway (at around 90km/hr), and it only had a surf board on it. The load was obviously not "heavy" but I'd love to know what the air pressure from the flat surface of the surfboard was when the rack's mounting points failed, and if that has to be taken into account in the load calculations. As you said, having a B-Double coming the other way would have had a significantly higher impact than just highway driving air pressure.
I’m so disappointed with mine. Wish I had have known then what I know now. Ridiculous situation from a company that proclaimed to be leaders. Unethical indeed!
Love the Rhino website, lots of pics of "overloaded" racks, shame ongoing
I'd like to see their engineering computations. Reasonable for an Australian driver to expect full compliance and capability while traveling at 110kph. Then there's NT's "open" speed limit as long as it's safe. What happens when the Rhino is the difference between safe and unsafe?
Really? Which picture shows a clearly overloaded rack?
@@mrrberger Faulty engineering and had to hide their mistakes in the installation instructions after the fact? Maybe. I think you could gaff 30kg to the roof and it wouldn't come off. Save you $ :)
@@technopsychobedlam all of them with anything on, that's the point
Nope. The lower limit is specifically for a Hilux with off-road use. That is exactly none of what is shown.
My MUX has double the roof capacity of the Hilux and comes with a dozen 8mm roof rail bolt mounts. There is no problem.
The Hilux has low load limit and doesn't provide appropriate mount points. I totally agree that Rhino should be up front with purchasers about the Hilux being unsuitable before they buy anything. But I see this as a Toyota problem as much as anything...and that isn't being addressed because these youtubers are dumping exclusively on Rhino.
Separately, I think Rhinos response to Tyler was crap
Good stuff John. I am a weekend warrior watching this market segment 20+ years, this stuff is of real concern with modern vehicles. Thank you very much. My family is safer for it.
Got the front runner flat roof rack , similar look , way cheaper , and you can get a rack mounted bottle opener, win win 🏆😉
I have seen a few of the riveted on rack channels with missing rivets. The only possible reason for fitting a roofrack like this is for cost saving. Just drop the headlining and bolt them on with fish plates.
The other issue is seeing all the Rhino accessories such as spare wheel clamps, jerry can holders and gas bottle holders. On one hand they tell you you spread the load while on the other they sell you the accessories to point load the rack.
Another product is the Mirack product. I was going to put the spare wheel carrier that connects to the towbar on my X-Trail. To find out others have and need to reinforce the welding and other components. For the 1500 dollar expense is not worth the money out lay for any client. They also are not adr approved so installation of the Mirack spare wheel carrier is a lethal and illegal one at that.
This scared me in to cancelling my order for a Rhino platform, however some more investigating and emailing with Rhino cleared things up. It appears to depend on how the system is mounted. For the Triton GSR at least, the platform and backbone system use the vehicle’s fixed roof rack mounts and incurs no off-road penalty. I’m guessing that the off-road penalty applies when factory installed mounts are not provided.
Good rational advice! Bad for suppliers that are not upfront with their client, and future revenue!
Hi john love your work. Me not an engineer nor highly educated but think to my deterrent (peroberby) l'm reasonably sensible and yes I go to dingo piss creeks often and every time I do I try to keep all my cargo as low as possible. Have never run roof rack and never will
Perfect timing to see this. Cado, you’re a legend. Cheers 🍻 mate.
4wd youtubers - amicably talk about the situation in hopes to keep sponsorship
Cadogan - totally reams rhinorack
More specifically - Ronny Dahl
or 4wd UA-camrs have a fear of lawyers.
@@DMSVICAU Ronny has a massive fear of lawyers.....in my opinion.
@@adamsimpson2041
I guess when you say it the way it is, you can easily rub the fur the wrong way of cashed up corporates.
i have noticed he uses the term “in my opinion” a lot, there must be a loophole there somewhere (options are like arsholes, everybody’s got one)
It’s funny though, because I think his sister is a lawyer too.
@@DMSVICAU Yeah you can't really be sued for having an opinion. But companies will try if they think they can spin it as you trying to state a fact. I guess ronny just likes to make it very obvious that it's his opinion.
MANDATORY ADR Compliance plate on ALL roof racks, that'll fark'em
If they charge those prices without ADR testing I don't want to imagine what would they if they needed to test and destroy a few.
Most of those 4 by 4 accessories are for show only. You are buying an image. And the sellers are enjoying their trips to the bank to deposit your cash.
Pop rivets through tin !? , yeah there’s a great idea 🙄 . Gutter mount is still the strongest option but besides that let’s teach softroaders not to pack the entire contents of their house on the roof of the bloody car !
Pity there is ALWAYS going to be someone who WILL do it just out of spite AND they'll still wine and moan about the whole thing and will insist that "It's not my fault" and "How could this have happened to ME?"
Good old gutter mount. Only the 70 series by now?
@@xpusostomos no there is still plenty of 4x4’s with full length gutters on the market
Does Fair Trade have anything to say about this? Misleading and deceptive conduct / consumer guarantee?
Just actually picked up a Rhino catalogue and it does have statement in it regarding roof loading on/off road and static
Might be a (very) new addition?
32kg. I'm amazed it can hold itself up.
Don't look at it; it might spontaneously disassemble!
@@markh.6687 Like a SpaceX rocket.
@@ScottMurrayBestFamilyCars Hahaha! Good one!
I'm on the old side so my imputed is also old ... back in the 80's almost every Patrol that had a roof rack fitted used to crack the A pillar at he top of the windscreen either or both sides I believe it was caused by inability of the turret to flex as it was designed.
But it has nothing to do with the rack. Its more to do with how it is mounted To a dual cab ute.
That inner rail mounting system is dictated by the actual vehicle.
This is the flaw. It is very hard to install sturdy plates under the roof lining and the outer supports, of any rack. Any a roof rail mounted rack will be compromised.
I have had a rhino rack on my defender for years and never had an issue.
Why, because it is mounted to proper roof gutters with 4 sets of very strong rhino legs. Racks mounted on gutters have more structural Support.
Rhino platforms are an excellent roof rack. Its not to blame. What is to blame is the shite roof rail mounting system on all dual cabs.
I'm glad Tyler brought this issue to our attention.
Agree mate. Lack of understanding is why this needs to be out in the public domain. Retailers of both racks, bars and products that end up on roofs often don't make consumers aware of the limitations of the roof. Accidents waiting to happen, the potential for lives lost. For those reasons, this message needs to get out.
Att: Rhino - Cherry Aerospace Blind Rivets are the only ‘Pop Style’ rivets you should be using in a structural installation...
What a load of horse shit!
They will still pull through the thin sheet metal roof of the vehicle
@@DMSVICAU - Thank you for your very intelligent contribution 😂
@@garageblitztv3215
Glad I could be of service.
A structure is only as strong as its foundation.😲
@@DMSVICAU Ha ha - well thank goodness that you are not an Aircraft Engineer 😉
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I've got one of these, but it came with the car. Only use it to put sleeping bags and other large but lightweight things up the top. I don't want to spend half my time weighing things and doing maths prior to a camping trip...
5 years later..no problems carrying heavy crap on my Ranger in Central Qld on our wonderfully smooth roads out here at Dingo piss Creek. Was fitted by ARB.
Good luck with the insurance claim if something ever happens
My interpretation of Rhino's definition of "off-road" suggests that anyone living in a house with a gravel driveway would technically _never_ be able to use their vehicle's Rhino rack to its full capacity, as said driveway is deemed by Rhino as "off-road driving".
Do they mentioned tarred road? Concrete road? Gravel road? What is your definition of road?
@@darrenhale6320 Did you even watch the video?
@@Beavereater84 yes a year ago but I can’t remember it why the hell would I remember a video like this from a year ago?
This is an important issue. I get it. Rhino did not disclose the fine print properly and they use pop rivets. After watching the video I reckon he is singling out Rhino unfairly. To be fair, Frontrunner, Tracklander and Yakima are all heavier than Rhino. (All backbone systems). Rola is couple of kilos lighter, but definitely not as sturdy (and not a backbone system). I own a Rola platform and the fastening bolts of the actual platform came loose on my last trip, causing damage - and the platform was not overloaded. But their low-mounts are just rivnuts into aluminium body holes. I have decided to get rid of it.
Another issue is that the mounts of some 4WDs under the rails are made of PLASTIC (My 4WD brand included), backbone system SHOULD make it more sturdy. So exactly what is the alternative? And I am aware of all the calculations and limits. But frankly the other two guys' videos were more balanced in this case.
I'm not a 4x4 owner, but the wind noise generated from roof-mounted accessories would drive me insane during the times they're not being utilised.
Plus the extra fuel usage, Ouchies!
@@oldbloke204 I'm in a similar boat, I am a fruit grower that really needs a ute but I don't want/need the hight and handling of modern utes. The old commadore and falcon utes are ideal but I can't see a replacement out there?
@@mcduck5 Yeah same reason people are buying 4wd wagons these days as the old school falcon/kingswood large wagons don't exist now.
Maybe have a look at the single cab 2wd varieties from various makers.
Not nearly as well advertised but they do exist, well last time I looked they did.
I had racks on my last vehicle, and only used them a few times per year. I removed them when not in use. Yes, the wind noise at 110kmh was pretty loud.
@@njwithers Fair call but I actually use mine off road and, at least for me, my MaxTrax have already saved the vehicle once and they go on every trip with me.
I am happy to trade off a bit of noise and worse fuel economy but I hadn't expected to trade it off for so little.
What about the ARB Base Rack John?
Bloody awesome explanation of the fundamental flaws in rhinos racks! Ive been following Tyler and Ronny for a while and as you would've seen Tyler explained it well but Ronny was a proper 🐓🐓 about it initially but did save a bit of face with his follow up vid. Bottom line this needs a lot more info out there so rhino can pick up the big ball they dropped 👍👌
35 years ago I was travelling from Wollongong to Melbourne to see my brother. He wanted me to bring his “rainbow” class wooden sailing boat on the roof of my Toyota Corona wagon. He insisted I loaded it face up so the gun rails didn’t get squashed. I cursed this as I didn’t go above 80k’s the whole way. The racks where “‘Kenard” which probably haven’t existed for some time. Both cars and racks where simple then. I comprehensively tied the boat to the racks. I was just passed Yass when a B -Double went passed. I felt the strong air bash impact and suddenly the boat was gone. I looked into the rear view mirror and saw a man in a ford falcon (I can see his face even today) with a look of sheer terror on his face yank the steering wheel down and swerve violently. Immediately the boat landed on the road right where he had been. The wooden boat surprisingly survived by blowing out all its bungs but the falcon driver was gone. The B-Double driver must have saw it and doubled back. He calmed me down and helped me put the boat back on the roof (this time pointed down like it should have been). This time I tied the boat to the car as well. When I arrive in Melbourne and told my brother the story he never said a word.
Wow what a story mate! That's incredible! I bet that Falcon driver still spins that yarn around the bar! Glad you saved the boat and no one was hurt.
The Hilux roof load limit is the problem John, not the rack. You seem to be blaming the rack maker for the car's low roof load limit and the effects of physics when off-roading. Are the other rack companies somehow defying the roof load limit and physics?
The backbone system has no apparent triangulation in the design. It looks tremendously strong longitudinally, but laterally it looks to my eye Dingo piss weak.
There's not a gusset in sight. Perhaps your engineering eye could do an addendum piece looking at this.
Kind regards, Sean (currently at Dingo Piss Creek - it's in WA out near Laverton somewhere) 🤠
So.... now you've bent RHINO over and f#$@ed them up the dung funnel, what did you buy for your triton and was the load rating any different?
Every manufacturer covers their arse from wankers and warranty claims.
I'd like to know what the OEM triton roof racks can carry for example.
Let us know what we should buy now you've told us what we shouldn't.
Prorack, Yakima, wedgetail, OEM, ARB, TJM, some unknown brand from eBay. Let us consumer's know so we don't end up "Dingo piss Creek " without a paddle because it was too heavy for our roof rack.
Good question!
What's wrong with Dingo Piss Creek? Awespme spot just the other side of the Black Stump. Never trusted these new fangled racks, Tracklander with a load spreading rail for me.
Not far from Destination Fukt.
Rack convo worked across Aussie to UK. We all value a decent rack.
The Rhino Roofrack fitted to my 100 series Landcruiser is not going anywhere. The Backbone system is held down with 14 m8 bolts that bolt down to the factory inbuilt nutserts and the rack itself is attached to the backbone system with 6 m10 bolts with nylocks. Seems to me that a lot of car models shouldn't have any roofracks attached to there roof if they don't have adequate factory mounting points.
Spot on - its all about " we told you"
Ranger has 80kg max load weight and max load height or 300mm
I just check the owners manual, this limit is for the passenger seat
Pop rivets!?
In my day we used Juicy Fruit.....
Long before I bought a 100 series LC and a serious off road camper trailer I had a career as a tradesman. As such you quickly learn that anything heavier than a ladder strapped to the roof racks is going to break the rack. Even then, the aerodynamics of a car/ute is such that the air passing over the roof is compressed and puts a huge load on whatever is up top. It is quite the moment when you see your ladder sailing up behind your car...
Take a look at what is on the top of tradie's utes... not a lot! Why not? Because is blows off, falls off, breaks off and you damage the vehicle and yourself getting it on and off.
Use the Camper trailer, just as tradies use trailers and put the heavy stuff down low. The light stuff, bedding, camp tables and chairs goes on top.
Love your work John!
Arrrrrrrrrrr the old roof rack, wait till you go through a car wash with one mayhem.
Why are you taking one through a car wash? Many car washes have signs up stating that they take no responsibility for any accessories fitted, ie, roof racks, aerials, bullbars, etc.
@@llaughton69 was the car in front of me, very entertaining though 🤣
I've said it in reply on the other YT channels too, but Rhino-Rack's customer service is appalling as well. Their support@ email address is useless (even beats the write 7 times rule) and even ARB (from where my platform was installed) can't get onto them...No wonder ARB have designed their own rack system.
Thanks John enjoy your time and knowledge well done dude
No racks for me especially the crap rhino ones
Totally agree. Even the Yakima racks information doesn't clearly display this fact. I certainly didn't know about it when buying mine, and was told it has a 100kg limit but didn't realise that the Hilux was only 75 either. I trusted the supplier to warn me, but again that didn't happen either. Now I don't know what to do with the damn thing, but alas my 4x4 doesn't do the hardcore stuff some do. I just want to take stuff to camp grounds on road trips, not up some remote Wombat Poo Hill.
Trouble is the options are few and far between. And the bloody thing is really really noisy I don't know how people drive around with one.
This can not get too much coverage! My Rhino rack failed for a different reason and they wouldn’t even sell me replacement parts.
What would you say about the ARB BASE Rack? Is there just an issue with Rhino racks, or any roof platform in general?
I don’t think i can ever afford this roof rack nevertheless this vid was an eye opener! Thnx for the heads up.
As I see it, it's a vert expensive rooftop light bar.
You should make a video about the new Mitsubishi Express and its ZERO star safety rating.
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I've used roof racks but no rhino rack and when I'm done with them, I take them off. with them off I get less noise inside vehicle and less wind resistance. which is a win for my wallet at the servo. I must say I've never liked the idea of a permanent roof rack UNLESS you are using it all the time which just isn't the case.
Though it is very entertaining to watch people in their jacked-up 4WDs complete with roof top racks and all, smash their roof-racks and whatever they pack on top into the low underground entrances to the local shopping center. Or a low hanging branch on a goat track/trail out in the bush. It's a real hoot to watch these people look around as though they have someone else to blame for their dimwittedness.
Yup, roof racks are noisy and can make a significant dent in your fuel consumption. As you say, unless you are using it every day, go removable. I only use mine if I need to carry something that is too big to fit in the vehicle and I can't be arsed to use a trailer.
"semantically promiscuous" a phrase I shall remember forever!
"4x4 Wanking Crap" Brutal John, but funny
So my 200 gravel driveway is off road
Wow. Quality product.
So the roof loading weight limit is specified by the car manufacturer and not the rack manufacturer. This means they all have the same problem. When researching roof racks for my cars I found that all roof rack sellers hide the useable capacity in varying degrees, so the problem is not just limited to Rhino. I would suspect some of the "Heavy Duty" steel racks exceed manufacturer’s specs before they are even loaded.
That said Rhino do have a useful weight calculator on their website here: www.rhinorack.com/en-au/load-rating-calculator which requires you to enter your vehicle's load limit.
I ended up going with Rhino as I like the look and layout and I only use it for bulky but light kit like swags, camp tables and gazebos.
Problem with this is that a couple of other manufacturers that I am aware of don't de rate the load carrying capacity of their rack for off road work.
It will be up to the individual to find out, as witnessed by all this crap.
I basically lose about 18kg because of this which makes it marginal if you have an awning and want to carry recovery gear as well.
I do not want to be behind the 4x4 where the rack comes unhinged ;)
Really ! I'm actually going to take my 4x4 off road 😂
I joined the beard strokers in may during lockdown.
As in lockdown I did some research for my rack, and found all this BS, and have been rattling on about it ever since.
Should be Australian Standard that loads are on a fixed plate on all racks to be transparent.
Installers should also be accountable.
Note Landcruiser 100 series ( which I bought ) is rated to 200 kg, as roof mounting points, I guess are better engineered.
That said I would not carry that much anyway.
I was surprised that prominent 4x4 people were easily misled ?
All that said The ARB base rack much better engineered as fully welded and not assembled with bolts, screw & rivets.
As after taking into account all the on road, off road, system weights, its still good for 100 KG approx. on my vehicle.
There are so many punters out there 4x4 or not, carrying loads that will not help their insurance claim if needed ?
Especially roof top tents on under rated racks.
This has been a total PR disaster for Rhino thanks to the exposure from people like Tyler and one which will hurt them for a long time I think.
The dingo piss creek goers make a point of sharing these issues because we need to. And I think perhaps for many it wasn't the piss poor design of the racks and their associated mounting systems as much as it was the Volkswagen-esque complete refusal to take ownership of the problem that really bothered us. (Sorry Amarok owners)
There are many companies, even in Australia alone, building quality 4x4 accessories who will practically fall over themselves to help you if something goes wrong. So don't waste time with those who do not.
Now, thanks to people like Tyler, we don't have to......
Based on what I've learnt, unless you have old style 70 series Toyota channels, not much point getting a roof rack at all.
Numerous cars come with bolt into roof support holes. Question of buying the right car and rack. My prado in theory can do 200 kilos on the roof using bolt in. Do I ever put over 100 kgs on? No because the centre of gravity and off road driving can teach physics in a pant staining way. Rack is great for bulky light things like swags.
@@rawnature8148 Exactly. My MUX is like your Prado. 12 8mm bolts into OEM roof rail mounts. This is not just a Rhino Rack problem, its a Hilux problem. Why is nobody querying Toyota on why there aren't appropriate roof mounts on the Hilux?
Obviously havnt researched to well to come up with that summation.....
Dude.. I am the guy who had it fitted and have used it for 5 years happily overloading it and never knew about it and gladly.. It's still there!! Perhaps it's the strength of the D22 Navara tractor roof. I don't know, but yes, I saw Tyler's and Ronnie's vids and have since reduced the load. I intend to remove the roof lining and see how it's mounted and replace the pop rivets with bolts and a plate. Check my drabby channel for a gawk and look at all the stuff I have on it. Perhaps a good plug for Nissan for a change, after all I seem to get every where I want to go. Cheap, reliable and apparently strong D22's aren't all that bad after all. Bit slow on the road, but who cares when you're cashed up after not paying shit loads for a show pony. On ya buddy you're the goods, keep up the good work.
I installed one rhino rack several years ago and seen it was junk for real use and had refused to fit anymore. Much better options out there
I think that's true.
Just renamed my 4x4 to “wanking chariot” 😂😂😂 these 4x4 videos are golden! Bought a bogan wife beater to match my snorkel after the last video 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
hi John, please start each vid with a long shot to allow us to read the full text of your t-shirt. ie all of maxwell's equations rather than the one we saw today. tia.
Big props for giving the credit up front to those two youtubers who broke this story.
Had a roof rack fall off a Subaru Forrester in front of my Bus doing 100 on Surfcoast Highway. It was a tray rack with sides. Had a mattress on it and a box. I missed it but it was a mess. The roof on the car must have looked like a shotgun had been fired inside the cab - 4 times over. The rack lifted up and the mattress separated from it. The rack landed in the lane behind the car and slid along with the slowing car. The mattress went to the right into the right lane and into the median under the barrier wire. As it crossed the lane, I was going past it. Passengers were just watching as I dodged this mattress.
The car stopped in the emergency lane.
The roof rack stopped in the left lane.
The mattress was high on the median wires and part way into the right lane.
If this was peak hour - it would have been a total shit show.
I bolted a 6kg wire mesh panel for $75 from Hammer Barn to my roof rack.
It looks like arse but supports the roof bag full of relatively light stuff like bedding and clothes when we head to Dingo Piss Creek.
Did you also get a new pizza oven from Hammer Barn? #Bluey
@@ScottMurrayBestFamilyCars Nope. Nobody's gnome husband was injured either. Greatest kids show ever.
Spot on.. I bought the 1st Backbone system developed for the Y62 Patrol. 2015. Got my Rhino Platform full rack. Had 1 day to load up 5 weeks of remote touring gear to go to Dingo Piss Creek :P after fitting the Rhino rack, which alone took over an hour to fit. I too saw the 100kg load limit - the weight of the rack as my payload limit. So off I go to Dingo Piss Creek, and halfway through my trip, I find every pop rivet that was on the rack had broken off. So I had to go find screws, drill out the rivets, and screw it all back together. Went back to ARB to show them how "good" the rhino rack was. And I was told that they are only rated for 30kgs offroad.. So they got out of fixing/replacing the platform rack.....
I have a 2009 Navara that had a pair of Rhino bars attached via a pop riveted set of tracks. I replaced the bars with the exact flat rack shown, strapped the 2nd spare and the high lift jack to it, and of to the Telegraph Track the missus and I went! 👍🤪👍
When we get to Loyalty Beach I discovered that a heap of the rivets had let go. I borrowed a rivet gun, and re-riveted them, only to have these let go as well. I ended up ratchet strapping the rack in place until I got home.
For noting - the corrugations on much of the development road were HORRENDOUS, some in excess of 10cm high. As such, the roof rack system was being subjected to hundreds of thousands of impulse accelerations, all attempting to pull the gently rounded mandrel and upset head of the rivet through the metal.
I removed the rack when I got home to discover that the previous owner had had the same issue at least twice (but failed to disclose), and there were numerous holes in the roof.
The cost of a panel shop repair was going to be thousands, so considering the options, I went with M6¹ *"nutserts"* to repair and reattach the tracks. I could bore out a number of the damaged holes to fit the nutserts, getting back to fresh metal. The large flat "grab" area at the back of the nutsert _SIGNIFICANTLY²_ increased the attachment strength over the pop rivet, and the nutserts are even available with a blind end in stainless steel, preventing water ingress.
I then asked a _generous_ helping of adhesive mastic under the rails, gluing down the rail along is full length to the roof and sealing the water out of the unrepaired holes, then using domed hex drive bolts³ with silicon applied to the holes, I bolted it was back down.
Since then, nothing has EVER looked like moving again.
ADVICE: if you are planning on doing what I did, beg, borrow or steal a magdrill. Doing it with a stepped drill bit worked, mostly, but wobble trying to hold a hand drill steady means that your tolerances are messed up and the nutsert will not have the maximum grab. The magdrill will help avoid drilling the "side roof frame structure" (the internal structural roll cage). Also try to get the shortest nutserts you can for the same reason.
¹ Might have been M8
² Nutsert manufacturers list _pull through_ strength in thin metal that is (from memory) at least an order of magnitude higher than pop rivets.
³ Had to grind the head smaller to fit in the track slot.
This is insane, I paid $190 for a 4wd supa centre special which is cheap chinese, it weighs 40 ish KG and is rated for as much as the roof will take which is 120kg in my case. I've routinely pushed it right to that limit and probably overloaded it on occasion too. I've been a right dickhead offroadwith it when I was younger and never had any issues. I regularly check it for damage and aside from rust spots it's absolutely fine. I'm more worried about tearing or bending the gutters than damaging the rack.
I couldn't imagine paying nearly 10 times as much for half the effective payload.
To clarify I've put upto 80Kg on there before or maybe a touch over offroad.
Thanks mate for your videos. Stumbled upon your channel a few weeks ago. I have one of those backbone trays on our Pajero. I 100% agree with understanding the different types of load limits your car's roof has been designed to handling.
Cheers mate.
I had my roof racks pull the rivets through the roof on a trip to Uluru. Had my spare tyre up there
I know this is nothing to do with this video but what is your opinion on throttle controllers? Are they actually safe?
Hi John. What rack did you end up using and why.
Dual Cab MR Tritons have an 80KG roof load limit John. I literally read it this morning in the owners manual looking at this issue.
Don't you just hate when the rack falls with age? I hear the application of silicone helps some people, but it just never looks the same.
Bad bad boy
I have a plastic pod on my crv. I imagine it’s more aerodynamic than what you’re discussing. So far, so good, until I forget it and drive into coles underground car park
I bought a Rhino Rack for the Kia Carnival. As I was putting it on, it just appeared to me that the mounting system was dangerously flimsy. I took it down to Kia who told me that the bolts that Rhino Rack had instructed to attach the rack to weren't meant for that purpose. They were intended only to hold the rails on. I though that the shop kid must have just given me the wrong kit, but no, that's what RR prescribes. Dodgy.
Where did you get 100kg? My user manual for a 2021 MR Triton dual cab says 80kg. BTW, Ronny Dahl made a comprehensive video about this - ua-cam.com/video/aA459LxXzCY/v-deo.html
What is needed for those few dodgy 4x4 aftermarket Chinese manufacturers of such equipment is they should be made to use or call apon an Australian Engineer such as JC to design or even be the head of a Dept that follows up/inspects this imported such crap BEFORE BEING CLEARED THROUGH CUSTOMS instead of writing off parts saying their equipment has been designed by trained experienced Engineers (from China who have Engineering degrees from the Internet)