Thanks to Dave and a few others I have finally purchased this machine. I am sooo happy and appreciate all the knowledge you contribute with. It will arrive this week and I cant wait to start my journey:). I am curious which filter basket would be the best for a double or a trippel shot? I am now on a dealers page where they sell VST baskets of 15g, 18g, 20g, 22g and 25g. Are there any you would prefer? Does a bigger basket mean just more coffee in the cup(longer extraction)? I was going to start with the stock one but have read many that prefer vst baskets. Also, does this mean that I also should change the shower screen to get the best out of my new vst? Also, I would like to buy a naked porta filter. Is it as simple as just choosing one 58mm no matter which brand? Tried to join your coffee forum but during the sign up ...I must be stupid for not understanding maybe..... they have a question I have to answer so the system knows I am not a robot... the question is "What are the letters CFUK short for? " . haha, I googled what I found is not correct.. haha
2:30 that rough insert, I understand was probably because of the awkward angle working around the camera, but I would be concerned about possible upset to the puck, what do you think? Is it that easy to crack up a puck and cause channeling doing something like that?
No it's not easy to crack a puck and auto gain probably made it sound louder than it was. Working around the camera is really hard and it's only me doing it all. Don't have time for multiple takes or production perfection. 😉
This reply is probably a little late. I do like them both,..but the Elizabeth is functionally the better machine, especially if your making milk drinks and very economical.
Software has changed a little since this video, depending on when you purchased yours you might be on the latest version of software...where they have actually dropped the pure HX mode. find out more here coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/360-lelit-marax-stuck-in-hx-mode/64
Cool review! I currently use a pre millennium la pavoni and the specialita and have been considering upgrading my espresso machine to a semi-auto in the near future. I am between a rocket apartamento and the lelit mara x, so finding your video was a useful example of this machine. Do you have experience with both or could you possibly recommend one over another for any real reason besides maybe price and design? Thanks!
I have experience of both, if it was for my personal use I'd be choosing the Lelit Elizabeth, because it's the much more advanced machine and it's a dual boiler.
Thanks for an informative video. I've received my MaraX a week ago as an upgrade of my Musica. It indeed makes an excellent espresso . I use 20g of coffee to make 2 Americano's at a time - 30ml espresso + 180-200ml per cup. Hot water is dispensed from the hot water wand (+-360ml). I lift the lever to boost steam pressure as mentioned in your video. While dispensing the water, the pump starts to fill the boiler, which is expected. However, after dispensing water, the steam pressure keeps on dropping until it hits zero. Then it starts with it normal "startup" procedure - steam hissing, valve closing (don't know the name of this valve), build-up of steam until the pressure hits the target. This takes 5+ minutes, before I can make the next 2 cups. Is this normal for the MaraX or did I miss something? Or are my expectations, set by the Musica, too high? Lelit's documentation on the use, and perhaps expectations, is lacking a lot of detail.
Sounds like you are dispensing so much water than the cold water entering the boiler is dropping the temperature below 100C which will lower steam pressure to Zero, open vacuum breaker and cause the hissing sound as it closes again on heat up. You shouldn't use an espresso machine as a Kettle, I'm sure I say that in all my reviews. The odd cup is OK but not for large amounts. I know they put a hot water tap there but it's best and nicer to use a kettle. I don't really use hot water from any of my machines apart from the Lelit Elizabeth (dual boiler) and then only because of the special system for hot water on that machine. Too much to explain in a youtube comment.
Hi Dave, I’m considering of getting one of this Lelit beauty for home use. I’ve been reading it’s predecessor Lelit Mara as well. With this, which one would you recommend and why? Looking forward to your expert advice.
The Lelit MaraX takes the Mara to a new level, and I personally believe is the final logical technical development of the E61 HX machine before moving to a dual boiler. For many it will make the move to a DB machine unnecessary.
Very useful to see how easy it is to pull a decent shot. Potentially considering the Mara X in the future, coming from a Dedica - I have worried that it will be too involved. But clearly, once you have dialled in the grind size and brew time, it's not that bad. Thanks for this demonstration, very valuable!
@@DaveCorbey I have an acceptable grinder and bottomless basket holders. I don't weigh my coffee. Machine is ready less than a minute after turning on and I consistently get very enjoyable drinks. To be fair, I drink lattes/flat whites/cappucinos (somewhere between the three!) but I can taste the difference between a milk drink made with a decent shot and one made with a poor shot. The Dedica seems to get a bad rap, but with the addition of bottomless basket holders, once you have the grind dialed in, it's very easy to pull acceptable shots. I am VERY confident that the Mara X would pull a BETTER shot and from your video it seems to me that the only thing I'd need to do would be to put a smart socket in the power chain so that it turns on half an hour before I wake up/get home - after I've dialled in the grind, temp, time and with the addition of weighing my coffee.
Dave, I’ve seen a few of your videos which are fantastically detailed and helpful! but could possibly go through hundreds in order to make a decision. I thought I’d outline my situation and ask you to help me out. I am marginally experienced in (home) coffee brewing, starting at a moka pot and hand grinder through different levels of home machines and currently with a Sage machine which I thought was best value for money. My brother has a commercial style single group head machine and the difference in espresso is massive, the sage blondes very quickly. I understand tamping pressure, grind size, coffee roasts and the permutations and combinations...what I am looking for is a basic commercial style machine for the house, single boiler is fine and ideally not too fiddly - budget is around 6-800 pounds. can you advise what my best option is?
I generally don't work in the £600-800 area. It's the stage between non prosumer and prosumer. A sort of no mans land in my opinion. Stretching the budget just £150 gets you into the Lelit MaraX, way better than anything in the £600-800 range. you spend 16% more than your maximum, but get 60% more machine...if that makes sense. Have a look at the MaraX review and videos, perhaps it will appeal to you. coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/2020/03/10/lelit-marax-review-in-progress/ Lots to read and think about, but it's a very clever HX machine indeed and doesn't need flushing.
Dave Corbey great that’s good to know, I am flexible with the budget I guess. I’ll have a look through your videos on this one, if you have any more thoughts do let me know. Thanks a lot for responding so soon!
Hi Dave! Thank your for all the effort you put into making these videos - I know from experience how much time this takes. Couple of questions: 1. I’ve never used a machine with Groups 61 but I remember reading somewhere that the internal valving is designed in a way that releases remaining water pressure into the drip tray after each shot. Your coffee cake appeared to have some water left on it when you removed the portafilter from the machine - is this typical for all machines with group 61 or is this typical for this particular one? 2. If I was to make 4 lattes with this machine, what would be the correct sequence? 4 shots first and all the steaming after, or 1 shot and then steaming (x4)? 3. Would the lights on the front panel go off or start flashing if the machine is not ready either the steaming or brewing? I.e for a novice like myself does the machine tell you when its ready or do you have to just know the sequence and rely on your experience? BTW - you should be on commission from Lelit, I would imagine that thanks to your videos and online reviews you’ve convinced number of people to go for Lelit instead of alternatives... and I’m hoping to join them soon 😀. All the best, Shem
1. The coffee puck will have more or less water retained in it depending on the particular coffee variety and fineness of grind 2. you could do 4 shots and then the steaming, or you can do 1 or two shots and steam while the 3rd shot is running, then during the 4th shot steam for the remaining 2 lattes. 3. Once the machine is warmed up 25m or so the lights don't matter too much...just follow the tips in the written review, there's loads of information in it. I try and review only what I like and Lelit is a really innovative company...I do it as a hobby and not for money, although some recent quite negative life changes for me, affect my ability to do all the reviews I do because they take a lot of work and focus to produce...........
@@DaveCorbey Thank you for the prompt reply. Based on your understanding of the mechanics of coffee machines, I thought you may be servicing or reviewing them for living. And yes, videos take a lot of work to produce. I've recently started a new channel focused on off-road motorcycling, and I put together a video about suspension upgrades and setup, and it took about 12h to film and 6h of editing, and that gave me about 50min of the video. Not to mention all the prep work before. Despite all of this, it is nice to actually give something back and produce some educational content (as opposed to people showing what they've had for breakfast and having millions of followers ;). Sorry to hear about the negative change in your life. I hope that sooner or later things will get better for you! All the best, Shem
@@DaveCorbey if having to do these milk based drinks... would both Elisabeth and Mara have no problem doing this or is one of them struggling would you say?
Thanks Dave for yet another interesting video. a question: As I learned from your review one must not preflush to not offset the calculation. how to go about cleaning flushes between shots? Are they necessary
I don't think they are because I drop my shower screen every two days and clean behind it. Some people don't drop the shower screen for weeks or months, and no amount of water preflush will remove the taint. I have videos on it in my morning coffee series and in other videos. It's the biggest improvement you can make to your espresso quality and costs a few minutes every 2 days.
3:09 your shot timing is based on start of pre-infusion, but most people start from first drop of espresso. I guess that's due to the fact that the pre-infusion time is a variable. I think I worked out your pull time was 20 seconds which I would previously have thought was a bit too quick. But I'm no pro... taste good?
Ah...I think I have got one somewhere, when I get time I will dig it out and perhaps do a little review...your talking about the old battered brown coloured one...right?
Bit the bullet ans bought the mara x. My first semi auto but having issues with it. Cannot get a nice tasting shot at all and no crema. Pairing with niche zero and tried from from 10 Grind setting to 23 or so. Even with pre ground coffee from Bella b, no crema. I've noticed the brew head leaks a lot of water, is it normal? Post coffee I've put a cup under. In 5 minutes or so the cup is almost full with water from brew head. In addition, post shot, brown water continues to drip quite quickly from the brew head and basket after stopping the shot. Very different than in your video. I'm worried this is causing an issue with the shot quality. I'm using very good beans and gone through the entire grind cycle... But no luck at all.
Pre ground coffee is no good, you have to tune the espresso grind level to the weight being used and the type of basket you use. I always use unedited video and usually the first take (not multiple takes). Everything you saw on the videos is real (I used the Niche grinder as well) and your MaraX is capable of doing the same thing. With the lever in the full down position (pointing towards the drip tray), then nothing should leak from the brew head. If you are saying water is coming out of the group when the portafilter isn't loaded and the lever in the fully down position, that' not correct. Watch all my morning coffee videos and search back through them, watch me prepping shots on different E61 machines....the MaraX is no different except for the fact it has a unique temperature management system for HX machines and a super quiet pump. If you still can't get it right, definitely reach out to Bella B and get some help. It's a great machine and I absolutely loved using it.
Could it be that your coffee is too fine and the resistance is too high? Because the pressure rises to 10 bars and one can see the water running into the drip tray. Possibly because the pressure relief valve is open?
No, it's because this machine was the previous version, before the changes I asked for. I reflashed the software, changed the pump, but left the older not so adjustable expansion valve. So unlike the production machines, can't get my pressure lower. I should change it for another expansion valve I have.
You can really do both at the same time, but just give a little time for the steam to initially start boosting up when you do the first coffee, then steam (e.g. 20-30 seconds). On subsequent cups you can steam as you want (during or after the shot).. If you wanted to steam straight after the 1st shot then lift the lever for a second before you grind and by the time you start pulling the shot the steam will be already boosted.
Hi Dave, At last I got my Mara X and the espresso is only luke warm. I keep it on most of the day so even after 2-3 hours it's still the same. I have tried the 3 switch positions and I pre heat the cup. Got any ideas? Thanks in advance.
If warming the cups doesn't help....and the brew pressure gauge is not reaching around 0.6 bar or higher on idle. If it is reaching that temperature or higher, then the espresso won't be cold and either cups are cold, or machine not warmed up for 25-30 minutes. If you already do these things, it's under warranty...contact your dealer for advice.
I see that the second shot was pulled when the steam boiler was about 1.5 bar. My machine tends to be at around 1 to 1.5 bar of pressure even for my first shot? Is that normal? I'm in the brewing priority setting at setting 0
It depends on whether you are turning it on when you want a shot, or going to it once it's finished the fast warm up and calmed down to a steady state.
Thanks for all the videos, preordered from BB and i cant wait. Going from Sage DTP & Pro grinder, both have not missed a beat for 4/5 years to be fair. But ready to take my home espresso to the next level, not sure ill ever get used to steaming as the shot is pulling though :D very informative videos btw, and enjoyed your written review. really appreciate it
Dave sorry quick question so when do you think the best for this machine to start the scale is it like when the liquid hit the cup? And you said here better to be more than 30s? Thanks
your work is so awesome Dave that we literally can’t be without you🙏🏻 I have seen so many videos now and read almost both your reviews on Mara and Elizabeth . If you compare the water spout/outlet... if one wants to make a large cup of tea for example. I have seen you use it on Elizabeth but not Mara. Is it the same on Mara or not?
I don't actually use the water spouts for tea on coffee machines...although there is one exception I would make (if I had to) and that is the Elizabeth, because of the specific way it supplies hot water
The Mara is £300 cheaper in this country, it's quite a significant saving. Some people like the E61 group and the relative simplicity of the MaraX. Other reasons can be aesthetics, or even where it fits best, based on the shape of the machine. Both are great machines.
If Elisabeth only looked like Mara I wouldn’t hesitate buying it at all. I I’ll still end up buying it anyway... Have never had this hard to choose between two machines 😆 Going crazy
I have lelit bianca if you remember they reduce classic e61 flow rate 12ml/sn to 6ml/sn. They did this because precision pressure control. I have a Marax for test. I thinnk that they reduce flow rate 5ml/sn whey they do this i dont understand
The characteristics of the very quiet pump result in a low flow rate, this also happens to be good for espresso production as the pressure ramps slowwly and smoothly.
Dave Corbey ok, why do not other manufacturer use this low flow rate? If you remember bianca discussion, some people said low flow rate change classice espresso taste? I think that your decision positive side?
@@suatulutas5959 Other manufacturers don't because they use standard pumps. The Lelit pump is modified....the low flow rate is a result of such a modification. That flow rate happens to produce a very good shot. It was not by design but hat we call "serendipity"...it was just fortunate. The Crem One 2B LFPP for example uses a large cut away inverted dome instead of a standard dispersion screen under the show screen of their E61 to trap a large quantity of hot water. This softens the effect of the flow on the puck adds temperature stability and was a designed approach that works very well. Check out that video and review. Sometimes these things are a lucky effect, sometimes they are designed.
I think one of my portafilters has an IMS, I do have a VST so might try them. I would not bother changing the shower screen but do recommend a bottomless portafilter.
Yes, it's keyed to the pump running, rather than the brew switch itself. On mine I also found cracking the steam valve activated the boost as the programming must additionally be picking up the rapid temperature drop when the valve is opened.
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@@DaveCorbey thank you for the response :) will be getting the Mara X next week :)
@ are you satisfied? Am also choosing between Mara and Elisabeth.
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@@AzizIzgin yes, absolutely. I think there is not a better machine for this kind of money today. Elizabeth is also good but Mara X feels more like a professional commercial machine.
@ You are totally right about the feel being commercial... If the look of mara had elisabeths features I would choose it without hesitating. Even Dawid would pick Elizabeth over mara not saying Mara is bad. Elisabeth has also a lot to offer. It is nice to hear that your machine. For me it is harder to understand the hx I think comming from a SB mahine, meaning that I don't know its limits if making ex 4 lattes and maybe 2 erspressos together or any other combination of that aboumt of coffee. When do one have to wait in between the shots/drinks and how would one plan this? I compare the same situation with the Elisabeth and for me to be able to see the actual temp is more calming for me, just my imagination but I think it heats up faster efter loosing som water after making an americano for ex. What is your exprerience here, have you made several shots in a row with your machine, how was it?
I find the MaraX has a really nice gentle ramp rate and produces a good shot, so I will not bother. The system is also well balanced with respect to flow and temperature.
I find brushing the small amount of coffee grounds left in the portafilter after knocking it out a paintbrush works to brush them neatly into a bin, leaving it dry for the next coffee you make. Grounds stick to a cloth then later go everywhere, so I moved to a paint brush which works best for me, although I can accept some might prefer a cloth..
@@ironmantooltime Nope, I'm retired, I do all this as a hobby. I review machines I like and that are good. If they are not, I can't be bothered with them and don't produce a review. I do feed back to manufacturers a lot though and help them make better machines.
Hi, I got Mara X and so far I get very disgusting sour espresso, I know I do something wrong, but on paper it seems right: I add 16g coffe to default 14-18 basket, in 25 seconds extraction time (from moving lever up) I get about 33 g liquid, while pressure gradually ramps to 9,2-9,5 bar. Prolonging extraction time and pouring more liquid does not help much...Tried setting "II" for highest temp without any good results. Tried bottomless handle and coffee stream connects to one single stream, but sometimes i see some liquid drop splash, especially at start. I have a feeling it is channeling problem...Any ideas? What basket/dose is best suited for mara x? And how much time from turning lever up to returning it back?
Try 18g, usually it's a good start, and the most common dose in 58mm. Grind enough fine to have 25-26s extraction, first drip should appear at 5-6s after moving the lever up. I ordered mine yesterday, can't wait to try it too :D
It can be a big subject. Channeling won't cause sourness, the opposit in fact. Best to join a coffee forum, tell them a lot more about you routine, warm up schedule etc, and they will sort you out.
@@DaveCorbey well the taste was not typical sourness, but somewhat disgusting sourness, and color of the coffee was not clear, but somehow muddy. With other beans and 18g dose I had lot better results, but coffee tends to go more towards bitter end... What is typical extraction time of Mara X from the moment levetta switched on? It hits 9 bars about on the 9-10th second, not instantly...And then golden rule of 20-28 seconds gets totally unclear...
Interesting are you thinking of sending it back? I havent bit the bullet on this as its an expensive unit. I figure i can get a good espresso for under a $1000 i just need to find the right machine. I may go manual and get a robot i hear they are good. And about a 1/3 of the price
@@jm7720 It is a keeper for sure. With other beans I got a proper balanced coffee. Although be prepared to experiment, as it is not as forgiving as some low end thermoblock based machines. But this is build like a tank.
You have to be kidding, it's what we in the UK call British Leyland Brown...I thought I had seen the last of it when we left the 70s but Eureka bought it back! ;)
Depends on the coffee.....if you have to grind it quite fine...the puck might be wet. Also density of coffee determines headspace in the puck, more of which can leave a wetter puck.
Thanks to Dave and a few others I have finally purchased this machine. I am sooo happy and appreciate all the knowledge you contribute with.
It will arrive this week and I cant wait to start my journey:).
I am curious which filter basket would be the best for a double or a trippel shot? I am now on a dealers page where they sell VST baskets of 15g, 18g, 20g, 22g and 25g. Are there any you would prefer? Does a bigger basket mean just more coffee in the cup(longer extraction)? I was going to start with the stock one but have read many that prefer vst baskets. Also, does this mean that I also should change the shower screen to get the best out of my new vst?
Also, I would like to buy a naked porta filter. Is it as simple as just choosing one 58mm no matter which brand?
Tried to join your coffee forum but during the sign up ...I must be stupid for not understanding maybe..... they have a question I have to answer so the system knows I am not a robot... the question is "What are the letters CFUK short for? " . haha, I googled what I found is not correct.. haha
Coffee Forums UK. I just use the standard baskets supplied with the machine...tey seem to work well for me.
2:30 that rough insert, I understand was probably because of the awkward angle working around the camera, but I would be concerned about possible upset to the puck, what do you think? Is it that easy to crack up a puck and cause channeling doing something like that?
No it's not easy to crack a puck and auto gain probably made it sound louder than it was. Working around the camera is really hard and it's only me doing it all. Don't have time for multiple takes or production perfection. 😉
Can you tell me if you like the Elizabeth or mara x v2 more? I'm having such a tough time deciding. 1-2 milk drinks a day max
This reply is probably a little late. I do like them both,..but the Elizabeth is functionally the better machine, especially if your making milk drinks and very economical.
Thanks for the vid! Just got Mara X, brew temp is on, 0 setting. I do everything same but my shots not greater than 2 bars…
Software has changed a little since this video, depending on when you purchased yours you might be on the latest version of software...where they have actually dropped the pure HX mode. find out more here coffeetime.freeflarum.com/d/360-lelit-marax-stuck-in-hx-mode/64
3:23 I love how the humble tupperware has been promoted to a "drip catcher device"
I've been using it for 16 years
@@DaveCorbey that’s what you call value for money
I subscribed to your channel, it's like saying thank you.
Cool review! I currently use a pre millennium la pavoni and the specialita and have been considering upgrading my espresso machine to a semi-auto in the near future. I am between a rocket apartamento and the lelit mara x, so finding your video was a useful example of this machine. Do you have experience with both or could you possibly recommend one over another for any real reason besides maybe price and design? Thanks!
I have experience of both, if it was for my personal use I'd be choosing the Lelit Elizabeth, because it's the much more advanced machine and it's a dual boiler.
@@DaveCorbey good to know! The search continues!
Thanks for an informative video.
I've received my MaraX a week ago as an upgrade of my Musica. It indeed makes an excellent espresso .
I use 20g of coffee to make 2 Americano's at a time - 30ml espresso + 180-200ml per cup. Hot water is dispensed from the hot water wand (+-360ml). I lift the lever to boost steam pressure as mentioned in your video. While dispensing the water, the pump starts to fill the boiler, which is expected. However, after dispensing water, the steam pressure keeps on dropping until it hits zero. Then it starts with it normal "startup" procedure - steam hissing, valve closing (don't know the name of this valve), build-up of steam until the pressure hits the target. This takes 5+ minutes, before I can make the next 2 cups.
Is this normal for the MaraX or did I miss something? Or are my expectations, set by the Musica, too high?
Lelit's documentation on the use, and perhaps expectations, is lacking a lot of detail.
Sounds like you are dispensing so much water than the cold water entering the boiler is dropping the temperature below 100C which will lower steam pressure to Zero, open vacuum breaker and cause the hissing sound as it closes again on heat up. You shouldn't use an espresso machine as a Kettle, I'm sure I say that in all my reviews. The odd cup is OK but not for large amounts. I know they put a hot water tap there but it's best and nicer to use a kettle. I don't really use hot water from any of my machines apart from the Lelit Elizabeth (dual boiler) and then only because of the special system for hot water on that machine. Too much to explain in a youtube comment.
@@DaveCorbey Thanks for your response. I'll do it the way you've suggested.
Hi Dave, I’m considering of getting one of this Lelit beauty for home use. I’ve been reading it’s predecessor Lelit Mara as well. With this, which one would you recommend and why? Looking forward to your expert advice.
The Lelit MaraX takes the Mara to a new level, and I personally believe is the final logical technical development of the E61 HX machine before moving to a dual boiler. For many it will make the move to a DB machine unnecessary.
@@DaveCorbey thank you for your advice. Appreciated.
Very useful to see how easy it is to pull a decent shot. Potentially considering the Mara X in the future, coming from a Dedica - I have worried that it will be too involved. But clearly, once you have dialled in the grind size and brew time, it's not that bad. Thanks for this demonstration, very valuable!
I think I personally would have a lot more trouble and effort using a Dedica and would probably get very frustrated with it.
@@DaveCorbey I have an acceptable grinder and bottomless basket holders. I don't weigh my coffee. Machine is ready less than a minute after turning on and I consistently get very enjoyable drinks. To be fair, I drink lattes/flat whites/cappucinos (somewhere between the three!) but I can taste the difference between a milk drink made with a decent shot and one made with a poor shot.
The Dedica seems to get a bad rap, but with the addition of bottomless basket holders, once you have the grind dialed in, it's very easy to pull acceptable shots.
I am VERY confident that the Mara X would pull a BETTER shot and from your video it seems to me that the only thing I'd need to do would be to put a smart socket in the power chain so that it turns on half an hour before I wake up/get home - after I've dialled in the grind, temp, time and with the addition of weighing my coffee.
Dave, I’ve seen a few of your videos which are fantastically detailed and helpful! but could possibly go through hundreds in order to make a decision. I thought I’d outline my situation and ask you to help me out. I am marginally experienced in (home) coffee brewing, starting at a moka pot and hand grinder through different levels of home machines and currently with a Sage machine which I thought was best value for money. My brother has a commercial style single group head machine and the difference in espresso is massive, the sage blondes very quickly. I understand tamping pressure, grind size, coffee roasts and the permutations and combinations...what I am looking for is a basic commercial style machine for the house, single boiler is fine and ideally not too fiddly - budget is around 6-800 pounds. can you advise what my best option is?
I generally don't work in the £600-800 area. It's the stage between non prosumer and prosumer. A sort of no mans land in my opinion. Stretching the budget just £150 gets you into the Lelit MaraX, way better than anything in the £600-800 range. you spend 16% more than your maximum, but get 60% more machine...if that makes sense. Have a look at the MaraX review and videos, perhaps it will appeal to you. coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpress.com/2020/03/10/lelit-marax-review-in-progress/
Lots to read and think about, but it's a very clever HX machine indeed and doesn't need flushing.
Dave Corbey great that’s good to know, I am flexible with the budget I guess. I’ll have a look through your videos on this one, if you have any more thoughts do let me know. Thanks a lot for responding so soon!
hey @@foodsillustrated how did your decision making go?
Hi Dave! Thank your for all the effort you put into making these videos - I know from experience how much time this takes.
Couple of questions:
1. I’ve never used a machine with Groups 61 but I remember reading somewhere that the internal valving is designed in a way that releases remaining water pressure into the drip tray after each shot. Your coffee cake appeared to have some water left on it when you removed the portafilter from the machine - is this typical for all machines with group 61 or is this typical for this particular one?
2. If I was to make 4 lattes with this machine, what would be the correct sequence? 4 shots first and all the steaming after, or 1 shot and then steaming (x4)?
3. Would the lights on the front panel go off or start flashing if the machine is not ready either the steaming or brewing? I.e for a novice like myself does the machine tell you when its ready or do you have to just know the sequence and rely on your experience?
BTW - you should be on commission from Lelit, I would imagine that thanks to your videos and online reviews you’ve convinced number of people to go for Lelit instead of alternatives... and I’m hoping to join them soon 😀.
All the best,
Shem
1. The coffee puck will have more or less water retained in it depending on the particular coffee variety and fineness of grind
2. you could do 4 shots and then the steaming, or you can do 1 or two shots and steam while the 3rd shot is running, then during the 4th shot steam for the remaining 2 lattes.
3. Once the machine is warmed up 25m or so the lights don't matter too much...just follow the tips in the written review, there's loads of information in it.
I try and review only what I like and Lelit is a really innovative company...I do it as a hobby and not for money, although some recent quite negative life changes for me, affect my ability to do all the reviews I do because they take a lot of work and focus to produce...........
@@DaveCorbey Thank you for the prompt reply. Based on your understanding of the mechanics of coffee machines, I thought you may be servicing or reviewing them for living.
And yes, videos take a lot of work to produce. I've recently started a new channel focused on off-road motorcycling, and I put together a video about suspension upgrades and setup, and it took about 12h to film and 6h of editing, and that gave me about 50min of the video. Not to mention all the prep work before. Despite all of this, it is nice to actually give something back and produce some educational content (as opposed to people showing what they've had for breakfast and having millions of followers ;).
Sorry to hear about the negative change in your life. I hope that sooner or later things will get better for you!
All the best,
Shem
@@DaveCorbey if having to do these milk based drinks... would both Elisabeth and Mara have no problem doing this or is one of them struggling would you say?
Very very good questions for real life scenarios!
Thanks Dave for yet another interesting video. a question: As I learned from your review one must not preflush to not offset the calculation. how to go about cleaning flushes between shots? Are they necessary
I don't think they are because I drop my shower screen every two days and clean behind it. Some people don't drop the shower screen for weeks or months, and no amount of water preflush will remove the taint. I have videos on it in my morning coffee series and in other videos. It's the biggest improvement you can make to your espresso quality and costs a few minutes every 2 days.
@@DaveCorbey Thanks Dave. I'll follow your advise. Still, before a session I can do an empty pull, wail 100s and proceed, I guess
@@maxbas6674 you can do a small flush and pull a shot, it won't impact temperature too much if its small e.g 25 or 30ml
3:09 your shot timing is based on start of pre-infusion, but most people start from first drop of espresso. I guess that's due to the fact that the pre-infusion time is a variable. I think I worked out your pull time was 20 seconds which I would previously have thought was a bit too quick. But I'm no pro... taste good?
Yes tasted fine. I just time from when pump is on and allow some extra for the preinfusion phase.
I"m curious how did you like the Specialita grinder. And any chance for a review on it? Thanks :)
Ah...I think I have got one somewhere, when I get time I will dig it out and perhaps do a little review...your talking about the old battered brown coloured one...right?
@@DaveCorbey Yes! Hopefully you'll get the chance to. Will definitely look forward to it if you do :)
Bit the bullet ans bought the mara x. My first semi auto but having issues with it. Cannot get a nice tasting shot at all and no crema. Pairing with niche zero and tried from from 10 Grind setting to 23 or so. Even with pre ground coffee from Bella b, no crema. I've noticed the brew head leaks a lot of water, is it normal? Post coffee I've put a cup under. In 5 minutes or so the cup is almost full with water from brew head. In addition, post shot, brown water continues to drip quite quickly from the brew head and basket after stopping the shot. Very different than in your video. I'm worried this is causing an issue with the shot quality. I'm using very good beans and gone through the entire grind cycle... But no luck at all.
Pre ground coffee is no good, you have to tune the espresso grind level to the weight being used and the type of basket you use. I always use unedited video and usually the first take (not multiple takes). Everything you saw on the videos is real (I used the Niche grinder as well) and your MaraX is capable of doing the same thing. With the lever in the full down position (pointing towards the drip tray), then nothing should leak from the brew head. If you are saying water is coming out of the group when the portafilter isn't loaded and the lever in the fully down position, that' not correct.
Watch all my morning coffee videos and search back through them, watch me prepping shots on different E61 machines....the MaraX is no different except for the fact it has a unique temperature management system for HX machines and a super quiet pump. If you still can't get it right, definitely reach out to Bella B and get some help. It's a great machine and I absolutely loved using it.
Could it be that your coffee is too fine and the resistance is too high? Because the pressure rises to 10 bars and one can see the water running into the drip tray. Possibly because the pressure relief valve is open?
No, it's because this machine was the previous version, before the changes I asked for. I reflashed the software, changed the pump, but left the older not so adjustable expansion valve. So unlike the production machines, can't get my pressure lower. I should change it for another expansion valve I have.
Which way would you suggest we should do first: to Brew coffee or to Steam milk?
Or can we really do both at the same time?
You can really do both at the same time, but just give a little time for the steam to initially start boosting up when you do the first coffee, then steam (e.g. 20-30 seconds). On subsequent cups you can steam as you want (during or after the shot).. If you wanted to steam straight after the 1st shot then lift the lever for a second before you grind and by the time you start pulling the shot the steam will be already boosted.
I assume your explanation is while you are in BTP.
Make another video of using STP, curious to see what is the grouphead temperature like
Hi Dave, At last I got my Mara X and the espresso is only luke warm. I keep it on most of the day so even after 2-3 hours it's still the same. I have tried the 3 switch positions and I pre heat the cup. Got any ideas? Thanks in advance.
If warming the cups doesn't help....and the brew pressure gauge is not reaching around 0.6 bar or higher on idle. If it is reaching that temperature or higher, then the espresso won't be cold and either cups are cold, or machine not warmed up for 25-30 minutes. If you already do these things, it's under warranty...contact your dealer for advice.
@@DaveCorbey Thanks Dave I will give the dealer a call.
I see that the second shot was pulled when the steam boiler was about 1.5 bar. My machine tends to be at around 1 to 1.5 bar of pressure even for my first shot? Is that normal? I'm in the brewing priority setting at setting 0
It depends on whether you are turning it on when you want a shot, or going to it once it's finished the fast warm up and calmed down to a steady state.
Thanks for all the videos, preordered from BB and i cant wait. Going from Sage DTP & Pro grinder, both have not missed a beat for 4/5 years to be fair. But ready to take my home espresso to the next level, not sure ill ever get used to steaming as the shot is pulling though :D very informative videos btw, and enjoyed your written review. really appreciate it
I hope you will love it. if I'm honest I always steam after the shot....simply easier.
Dave sorry quick question so when do you think the best for this machine to start the scale is it like when the liquid hit the cup? And you said here better to be more than 30s? Thanks
From when you lift the lever aim for a 32s shot e.g. If your aiming for a 1:2 ratio 17g of ground coffee into 34g of espresso in 32s
@@DaveCorbey thanks so much dave.. it helps.. have a great day and GOD bless youu.. 😊
your work is so awesome Dave that we literally can’t be without you🙏🏻
I have seen so many videos now and read almost both your reviews on Mara and Elizabeth .
If you compare the water spout/outlet... if one wants to make a large cup of tea for example. I have seen you use it on Elizabeth but not Mara. Is it the same on Mara or not?
I don't actually use the water spouts for tea on coffee machines...although there is one exception I would make (if I had to) and that is the Elizabeth, because of the specific way it supplies hot water
What is that scale? Thank you.
woah your latte shot took 40 seconds to pull 30g? Would that not produce an over extracted shot?
It depends on the ramp up, and coffee used. I experiment until I find something that works for a particular coffee. The rules are guidance.
Why would someone choose an HX machine like the Mara over the dual boiler Elizabeth? Dont you have better control and stability with the Elizabeth?
The Mara is £300 cheaper in this country, it's quite a significant saving. Some people like the E61 group and the relative simplicity of the MaraX. Other reasons can be aesthetics, or even where it fits best, based on the shape of the machine. Both are great machines.
If Elisabeth only looked like Mara I wouldn’t hesitate buying it at all. I I’ll still end up buying it anyway...
Have never had this hard to choose between two machines 😆
Going crazy
I have lelit bianca if you remember they reduce classic e61 flow rate 12ml/sn to 6ml/sn. They did this because precision pressure control. I have a Marax for test. I thinnk that they reduce flow rate 5ml/sn whey they do this i dont understand
The characteristics of the very quiet pump result in a low flow rate, this also happens to be good for espresso production as the pressure ramps slowwly and smoothly.
Dave Corbey ok, why do not other manufacturer use this low flow rate? If you remember bianca discussion, some people said low flow rate change classice espresso taste? I think that your decision positive side?
@@suatulutas5959 Other manufacturers don't because they use standard pumps. The Lelit pump is modified....the low flow rate is a result of such a modification. That flow rate happens to produce a very good shot. It was not by design but hat we call "serendipity"...it was just fortunate. The Crem One 2B LFPP for example uses a large cut away inverted dome instead of a standard dispersion screen under the show screen of their E61 to trap a large quantity of hot water. This softens the effect of the flow on the puck adds temperature stability and was a designed approach that works very well. Check out that video and review. Sometimes these things are a lucky effect, sometimes they are designed.
Have you used any precision basket, ims or vst, with the marax? Would you recommend bothering to upgrade the shower screen?Thanks
I think one of my portafilters has an IMS, I do have a VST so might try them. I would not bother changing the shower screen but do recommend a bottomless portafilter.
The baskets that come with it are by IMS.
What scale are you using? It's the perfect size for the drip tray.
The scale is no longer made...
@@DaveCorbey Ah gutted I was scrolling through the comments for this! Thanks so much for your videos, reviews and comments on the forums Dave.
So does it activate the pressure boost after you use only the hot water valve?
Yes, it's keyed to the pump running, rather than the brew switch itself. On mine I also found cracking the steam valve activated the boost as the programming must additionally be picking up the rapid temperature drop when the valve is opened.
@@DaveCorbey thank you for the response :) will be getting the Mara X next week :)
@ are you satisfied? Am also choosing between Mara and Elisabeth.
@@AzizIzgin yes, absolutely. I think there is not a better machine for this kind of money today. Elizabeth is also good but Mara X feels more like a professional commercial machine.
@ You are totally right about the feel being commercial... If the look of mara had elisabeths features I would choose it without hesitating. Even Dawid would pick Elizabeth over mara not saying Mara is bad. Elisabeth has also a lot to offer. It is nice to hear that your machine.
For me it is harder to understand the hx I think comming from a SB mahine, meaning that I don't know its limits if making ex 4 lattes and maybe 2 erspressos together or any other combination of that aboumt of coffee. When do one have to wait in between the shots/drinks and how would one plan this? I compare the same situation with the Elisabeth and for me to be able to see the actual temp is more calming for me, just my imagination but I think it heats up faster efter loosing som water after making an americano for ex.
What is your exprerience here, have you made several shots in a row with your machine, how was it?
What is the name/brand of the weight you are using?
Smartweigh, no longer available, I did a video about them
Hi. Are you planning to install flow valve?I presume, that is compatible.. Thanks
I find the MaraX has a really nice gentle ramp rate and produces a good shot, so I will not bother. The system is also well balanced with respect to flow and temperature.
Many Thanks.
For your paintbrush and drip tray, just get a brown barrista cloth.
I find brushing the small amount of coffee grounds left in the portafilter after knocking it out a paintbrush works to brush them neatly into a bin, leaving it dry for the next coffee you make. Grounds stick to a cloth then later go everywhere, so I moved to a paint brush which works best for me, although I can accept some might prefer a cloth..
@@DaveCorbey I see its because you're not rinsing the pf to maintain temps 👍
@@ironmantooltime For shots in quick progression, no...the Coffee puck keeps it warm and then after knocking out quick brush before the next shot.
@@DaveCorbey I get it. Are you in Bella Barista?
@@ironmantooltime Nope, I'm retired, I do all this as a hobby. I review machines I like and that are good. If they are not, I can't be bothered with them and don't produce a review. I do feed back to manufacturers a lot though and help them make better machines.
Hi, I got Mara X and so far I get very disgusting sour espresso, I know I do something wrong, but on paper it seems right: I add 16g coffe to default 14-18 basket, in 25 seconds extraction time (from moving lever up) I get about 33 g liquid, while pressure gradually ramps to 9,2-9,5 bar. Prolonging extraction time and pouring more liquid does not help much...Tried setting "II" for highest temp without any good results. Tried bottomless handle and coffee stream connects to one single stream, but sometimes i see some liquid drop splash, especially at start. I have a feeling it is channeling problem...Any ideas? What basket/dose is best suited for mara x? And how much time from turning lever up to returning it back?
Try 18g, usually it's a good start, and the most common dose in 58mm. Grind enough fine to have 25-26s extraction, first drip should appear at 5-6s after moving the lever up. I ordered mine yesterday, can't wait to try it too :D
It can be a big subject. Channeling won't cause sourness, the opposit in fact. Best to join a coffee forum, tell them a lot more about you routine, warm up schedule etc, and they will sort you out.
@@DaveCorbey well the taste was not typical sourness, but somewhat disgusting sourness, and color of the coffee was not clear, but somehow muddy. With other beans and 18g dose I had lot better results, but coffee tends to go more towards bitter end... What is typical extraction time of Mara X from the moment levetta switched on? It hits 9 bars about on the 9-10th second, not instantly...And then golden rule of 20-28 seconds gets totally unclear...
Interesting are you thinking of sending it back? I havent bit the bullet on this as its an expensive unit. I figure i can get a good espresso for under a $1000 i just need to find the right machine. I may go manual and get a robot i hear they are good. And about a 1/3 of the price
@@jm7720 It is a keeper for sure. With other beans I got a proper balanced coffee. Although be prepared to experiment, as it is not as forgiving as some low end thermoblock based machines. But this is build like a tank.
Why the 1st puck is not dry ?
I always leave them a moment..the finer you grind the slightly wetter the puck.
nice colour of the specialita
You have to be kidding, it's what we in the UK call British Leyland Brown...I thought I had seen the last of it when we left the 70s but Eureka bought it back! ;)
@@DaveCorbey haha I actually like it :D sort of mr. beans' suit colour lol
@Dave Corbey My grandmother had an Austin Allegro in that colour back in the 80s. It was a real pile of junk!
@@t3chnno all cars used to be that colour in the 70s
@@DaveCorbey otherwise known as pooper scooper
wow, that first puck was pretty wet wasnt it?
Depends on the coffee.....if you have to grind it quite fine...the puck might be wet. Also density of coffee determines headspace in the puck, more of which can leave a wetter puck.
What about a latte art video with the PL62X?