Pulled it off! Trouble Free Santa Fe 3.5
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- Part 1: I’m in Trouble! No Turning Back! 2005 Santa Fe 3.5 • I’m in Trouble! No Tur...
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I cannot believe how good natured you are over such a PITA fix. I'd be turning the air blue and be an absolute bear to deal with if I was doing it. You're amazing.
I would have cursed it into submission by now
The beauty of editing. lol
especially all that back-breaking work over a Kia. I could understand if it were a 911 or sth cool. Ray needs a "Superman" stand with wheels. Maybe he could fab one up - that would help his back.
I concur. I would be using words most people have never heard before!
As someone once told me, sometimes you gotta talk to the parts!
I hope you remembered to tighten the nut on the tube to the EGR valve. 🤔
Ray, don't care how long your videos are. . They're way better than anything on TV.
FTR, if that was me doing that job, the audio would be full of beeps!
Am I the only one that finds those beeps far more offensive than anything someone could dispense from their noise hole?
@@IntegerOfDoom Honesty is suppose to be the Best Quality! Unless you deal with the public!
TBH? I would rather hear Ray swear! That makes him Hooman! (Star Trek Reference) His channel (like Everyone else) is Family Oriented.
If he does "Slip Up" once in awhile? I will SMILE! :)
Likewise, but something tells me the channel is also a bit of a family channel aswell, so best not swear in front of kids me thinks.
Plus, we don't really hear Ray swear, do we?
I always play just about everything at 2x.
I usually get notified of your videos each morning. I'm so glad "we" finished this one today and it was sucessful. I was suffering along with you last night. You are so right, "We" should have pulled the engine out. PS I'm a 72 year old female. Your fanbase is all over the map. Don't forget to have yourself a great weekend.
Lanie where you from I'm from a place they call (Sheffield) England UK 🇬🇧🇺🇲👨🏻🔧✌🏻
@@dainsmart6237 South Carolina
I'm subscribed. How do you sign up for notifications?
@@desotosky1372 click the bell next to the subscribe button .. there is also a creator button somewhere .. it notifies yuou of new updates by Ray
More proof anyone can be into this stuff.
Have you had that experience where you have learned from Ray and share it to see others deliver that, "WTF?" look yet?
Happened to me a couple weeks ago. Brother in law had battery trouble. I ran the Ray playbook and he was good to go quick, no parts cannon.
Of course he said, "WTH is a parts cannon?"
I watch Ray with Closed Captions enabled and it sometimes has the best side effects. After 4 hours of wrenching on the Santa Fe, it interpreted the engine's start sounds at 24:20 as [Applause]. How appropriate.
I had to go and see that for myself. Brilliant! 🤣
I was watching an A10 warthog video. Firing the cannon was "laughter"
Good idea, going to be doing this for now on.
Protip:
Anti-seeze oxygen sensor threads. Always.
Dielectric grease in connectors go a long way to future proofing older connectors.
I remember driving a lot of less than ideal cars, and I try to remember that a car may look a beater to me, but to the owner it's the best they can do at the time and it's very important to them. Thanks for thinking that way too.
Ray, long is fine. Short is fine. The story is what the story is!
When you share that story with us and your efforts are more about conveying that story you can't go wrong!
That story, your journey with each car, is why we are here! We appreciate you and what you do.
If I were you, I would maximize that and have few worries about the rest.
Here is a thought for you:
Notice how some UA-camrs have crazy good production values? How they can turn a few minute story into 10 to 20 minutes no matter what? Trust us, the many who share what I just did, notice that.
People can smell the sell. Always.
And I am not talking anyone down. There are lots of ways to produce videos people enjoy. No worries.
Just know you are right there with the best! Dude with a camera getting after it! And while writing this, I heard your outro and realized something I think is pretty neat! You have "us" along for the ride. When you are deep into the weeds, It seems like you have us in your head, and that energy, not unlike when we have friends around to lift us up when we are down, is there contributing to the work atmosphere in a Positive way. Spiffy! And yes, happy to help. :)
...same as you help many of us! The reality of a good natured struggle is catchy! I have seen changes in my own work. I laugh more, power through and I know it is your influence contributing to it happening that way more. It is sort of like being around or working with a mentor. People know that path is possible and that it works! Damn cool, I say.
Think about what that means.
It means you and what you do matters most!
Whatever you end up doing, please remember to have fun. Laugh, love, play, fix, build, explore, and everything else will work out just fine.
Wow Doug, you just pretty much encompassed everything I have ever wanted to say to Mr. Ray! It is amazing to me that we can be such different people, but still perceive life in the same, exact way! Beautifully written comment Mr. Doug and I must thank you for writing it so well, as I feel all of my thoughts have finally been spelled out accurately by you for our favorite guy; Rainman Ray. Beautiful day to you Mr. Doug and everyone else also! Fred
Amen 👍🏻
@@electronicengineer Thanks! It's is interesting how similar we are, put another way and from my point of view.
A lot gets in the way of us seeing that in my opinion.
Cheers!
Such a spot-on appraisal of why we view Ray's channel. Thanks for that.
Who else was nervous when they didn't see him go back to tighten the EGR valve piping? 😁
yup. was wondering about that also. 🤔
Yup!
I was looking back through the comments to see if anyone else caught it. He put the bolts and gasket on valve but didn’t tighten the nut on the exhaust pipe. Hopefully just a camera edit issue.
No joke. This is the exact same reason I was looking at the comments.
Same..
Proper diagnosis and finding the actual issues, then repair! Great job Ray.
In regards to your O2 sensor split socket. I ran into the same issue with them wanting to spreading open and wanting to round off the sensor. I fit a gear type hose clamp around the socket (a good quality one) and cranked it as tight as I dared before stripping it out. It added enough tension/support to the socket to make the difference to get the sensor out. It has worked for both the offset shallow one as well as the deep one. Of course you need the room to clear the gear mechanism of the clamp. I have however escalated to a pipe wrench when all else has failed.
I don’t understand why people wanna struggle with that slotted O2 sensor socket…
You’re GONNA replace the sensor anyways…..No need to preserve any part of that O2 sensor except for the hex part in order to wrench it out.
@@Casmige Me neither. I just chop off the wire, grab a deep well socket, and hit it with the impact. It'll come out with enough Ugga Dugga's! (Reverse click.)
Last one I did, Even after heating it up , impact wrench etc. I finally got it out with a full socket on a breaker bar with a five foot extension. The threads off the sensor stayed in the manifold and I had to buy a special tap to rethread the manifold. I am surprised that most current day mechanics aren’t alcoholics.
The only problem with your videos is….. what do I do with the rest of my day once it’s over?! Ray great videos enjoy them everyday sir!
I run into this same, exact problem as well daily. We've seen the best (Ray's new, awesome video), now all that is left on YT is the "rest"...
Do what I do - save watching til last thing in the evening and treat it as a reward for doing useful stuff in the day.
Ray, it did not take you long to make the shop appear to be well lived in. Tools every where, as it should be.
I'm glad we're getting back to the old style content. Fixing cars! Getting it done.
Feels like I organize my shop once a day and it's somehow still never organized
@@yeahitskimmel I have found many things in my shop. Only to be lost months later when I needed them.
@@yeahitskimmel I've already given up. They end up scattered all over the car anyway. I just put the tools back, only when the project is finished.
I can't work like that. I put everything away at the end of the day. Goes back to my dealership days where you had to put everything away and lock it up, or your stuff would grow legs.
Can't lie. Caught myself grinding my teeth. Good with the hard. Thank U for showing ALL.
I'm glad for small skinny men like ray, I'm a huge monster with huge hands and arms, I cannot reach places like you do.
There's always Jenny Craig or the tred mill 😆
Watching you fight with the bolts for the egr ,and the battle of the O2 sensor replacement, reminded me of the time I removed and replaced spark plugs on our '87 Pontiac Gran Prix 3.1 v-6,,front 3,no problem, rear 3 'bout destroyed me and brother in-law,2 days fighting and cursing with various flex sockets,extensions, and then found out we just had to remove the upper dog bone engine mount,roll the engine forward,and complete the job!! Great job on this one!!😎😎😎
Did I miss him tighten the EGR nut that was so stuck on the last video? I watched it twice and didn’t see him tighten after he got the EGR mounted to the intake. Just curious….
Jst wanted to say I love what you do for us. In a world of chaos and crybabies your channel is a breath of fresh air. No shitty background music or clickbait videos much appreciated
Ray, did not see you tighten the EGR line you fought so hard to loosen, or a clamp for the exhaust shield.
He could have done it off camera, but yeah I noticed the same thing.
Thought this also.
I was looking for that also.
Ditto
To be honest I was hoping He did it off camera I didn't see it either have a great day
I had to watch the strip down and reassembly between my fingers as it was so stressful. Your relief when was all over even reached across the pond to here in the uk. Brilliant videos and much appreciated.
Regarding the long videos, I honestly don't mind the longer ones because they show more of the connected plan to repair a car. The hour-long one yesterday made perfect sense because you had to deal with all those pieces that refused to move, and watching you escalate and experiment was really fascinating.
The Door of Doom? Have you considered getting one of those things that will automatically pull it closed?
Standing ovation for a job well done!!! 👏🤠You are the MAN !!!
Ray, me being in aviation and FOD is a big thing we use rags under our work in case we drop a nut, bolt, cotter pins etc. When you were worried about dropping that gasket you could of used a rag for protection instead of looking around to search for it in the engine bay. Just a suggestion. Love what you do..
Like Taryl Dactal says, "It ain't the Space Shuttle!" (: But, yeah - Great tip -
I plugged the intakes like where he does but as far as everything else I can hear parts form where they hit if I have a rag I can't hear them and then I have a clue where anything's at including myself sometimes have a great day
I learned that trick a while back, especially working on conversion vans and mini vans. I got tired of fishing for dropped parts. A rag directly under the fastner guarantees its not going far.
I pickup cardboard from bikeshops and furniture stores. Slide those under the vehicle and if whatever you drop hits the ground, chances are you merely slide the cardboard out and grab it.
You did all that and didn't bust a single knuckle or bleed a drop of blood or say a single cuss word. YOU are a man with lots of patience my friend. That's why we watch you. That's why we pay people like you to do that work which we don't want to. Pressing enter in 3.....2.....1....
I'm really surprised you didn't add any anti seize to anything. At least to the tube and O2 sensor.
I was thinking the same thing. I live in Wisconsin, so I use anti seize a lot.
Maybe Florida folks don't have to contend with corrosion often enough.
Most come coated out of the box.
I had to do a similar job a few years ago and ever since then, when working on a transverse V6 the motor comes out! I usually do the same with old school V8s, but that's more for personal feelings rather than any real work performance reasons. Newer V8s I don't touch as I'm not a fan. It should be noted that I'm NOT a professional mechanic.
You're a patient fella Ray.
Your like my good morning America I wait for your upload every morning lol. Thanks for the hard effort to get clips and edits uploaded.
watching you argue with fastening the EGR valve to the intake reminds me of when I found a cross threaded bolt on an EGR tube for my 97 Plymouth Grand Voyager. I know for a fact it was cross threaded from the factory too, no one had been under the hood of that van for anything beyond oil and fluids before I got a hold of it. Another thing I know, because my parents purchased it brand new and had never had any problems that needed the intake or EGR removed. It also still had original plugs in it, I was replacing them when I found the cross threaded bolt. (I removed the upper intake manifold to gain access to the back set, it was easier then the other suggested ways I had found.)
Ray, I missed watching you tighten the back nut on the egr valve I’m sure you did off camera, and I’m surprised you didn’t use the tin man goo for the next poor mechanic on that O2 sensor. Always great content keep them coming
New o2 sensor has the goo already on it straight out of the box, the white plastic cover Ray removed from the threads keeps the goo from smearing around inside the box👍 I was more surprised he didn't put some tin man goo on the EGR tube nut threads before screwing on the new EGR valve🤣
I kinda miss the "doodlee doodlee doo".... but it's obvious you're far happier and productive in you own shop. Room to grow.
Perseverance, Pride, Professionalism! Excellent work!
I'll say it again, I love the way you diagnose a problem and don't just fire the parts cannon. Looking forward to the next one. Gidday from the Ottawa Valley to you and the wife unit.
Ray, just a suggestion. When working on the back of engines like that I like to keep a thick blanket doubled over onto itself and lay it over the front of the engine. It keeps the hood latch and everything else from digging into you and makes it WAY less painful to work and helps to not scratch the paint on certain cars.
YES! Especially if you are old and bony Ike me. And the pickups with the huge engine compartments that I have to crawl into to do anything stink.
Woohoo. That must feel like a monsterous accomplishment. Nice feeling on a Friday!!!!
Something that I learned from doing work on firearms, as well as Automotive but I learned this trick from working on firearms and applied it to working on autos. If you take the new EGR valve, or even when you clean an old one and you actuate the valve while spraying some dry Teflon on it, it will help to ensure that that pental valve no longer gets sticky or clogged up nearly as easily and it will last a much greater length of time. It also tends to insulate some of it from heat because Teflon, once it has taken a set does not transfer heat easily. And we learned this because back in the 19 70s there was a company that had made some clutch plates that were Teflon coated. What happened was not fun. The clutch plates started building up so much heat that they literally sheared off and would start entering the passenger compartment of the car or dig really good trenches into the drag strip surface. And it is why they started requiring clutch armor on many of the cars. But with a little bit of engineering testing, they found out that it was because of the Teflon coating. Teflon coating is great but there's things you cannot use it on.
Ray is such good natured his commentary is great he explains what he is repairing and why. He makes learning about repairs gun and educational.
Ray dominating that car repair. I love the intro and you should have that as a sign for your shop. The word repair handing cattywhompus like that. Wish you lived near me I get all my friends to come to your shop. Sigh I’ll live vicariously
Getting fancy @ the new shop. Have a nozzle on the hose at the wash station. Nice,
I bet someone returned the sensor with the gray connector in the wrong box. I noticed that, unlike the one with the black connector, there was no plastic shield on the sensor and no twist tie around the assembly.
I was thinking they came in a paired set.
Judging from the harness check at 4:43, the grey-plug sensor is a downstream one.
Ray! I love the videos!! Yesterday I waited all day to watch your video. It makes my day to watch your antics! 😀 keep up being the outstanding person you are!!
Wow Ray! What a marathon effort. Tempted to send you a carton of Australian beer!
Long time listener, first time caller. Ray Ray, huge respect for what you’ve done with setting up the business. But man I get a dread-chill seeing your precious little one in the workshop area. Peace and love. 🇦🇺
🇦🇺 Australia upside down world wish i was there right now nice hot weather its -2 in the morning in the UK lol❄️🌨️.
Love from England ✌🏻👨🏻🔧🇬🇧🇦🇺🇺🇲
I hate to say it but I would put a door closer on that side door I understand it allows fresh air to go into the office but you know one of these days I don't mean I'd run over it have a great day
Michael, yep or a kid proof armour mesh screen door. A mechanics workshop is dangerous enough for adults but kids, crikey!
These vids give me some assurance that some jobs are just awkward and difficult even for an experienced professional. As a home gamer it’s easy to get discouraged, and think wtf am I doing. How many times have I thought to myself “ it would be easier to pull the engine” . For you DIY’ers so much to be learned here.. perseverance is a big one. The reason Ray never quits, it’s because he can’t and won’t.
The patience and determination was at the top of my admiration list for this horrible job mate.
Well done another winner.
Keep Safe Keep Strong 🦘🦘🦘🦘🎄🎄🎅🤶🎄🎄
This triggers some memories. Unforgiven played a lot when I was a teenager.
Ray I admire your patience as you struggle with these tight spots. I could never do a youtube video because I would be dropping expletives way to often.
Definitely be demonetized due to blue language!!
@@johnmurphy6366, Or just one long beep! Lol
Probably the most brutal repair I’ve witnessed on this channel.
THAT was a hard job. It was great watching every step to the final success. Lots of patience and a great lesson for how to do it next time. Your knowledge and experience gets you through a lot of problems. Every up and coming mechanic and DIY should watch these great videos.
You quote "What we've got here" reminded me of that old movie quote: "What we've got here is a failure to communicate!"
Arm chair mechanics need to get their own channel. Love your positive attitude. Love how you made your family a part of the new venture.
ACM’s expert opinions matter tho~!.
-My only wish is that I could find an excellent mechanic here in Palm Bay FL, your patients and mechanical savie amaze me, my hat is off to you.
I feel your pain man, this is the epitome of every time I work on a vehicle.
Ray - your perseverance is much greater than Hyundai's crappy engineering! That whole job was a pain! I hope your customer appreciates all the effort you put into that repair.
BTW - yellow propane bottles no longer have MAPP gas - that was discontinued early 2008 in North America. MAP Pro is a bit better than propane.
From watching you struggle with that nightmare in the last video I'm a little sore also today. While watching you struggle with that sensor I caught myself straining my muscles along with you as if it was doing it myself or helping you. Crazy right? LOL!!!!
If you crazy, so am I. I was doing just like you.
Nice Get Ray! Well diagnosed and repaired!!!! Thanks for the long videos...love them.. like how your channel is evolving
Looking at the two sensors, the first thing I noticed was one had a twist tie and the other did not leaving me to wonder if someone hadn't pulled the old switcher-ru then returned it!
nice to have a happy ending. & no extra parts. the hour long video was your best, most painful one yet. more please!!
Ray, I didn’t see you tighter the egr tube nut !🔧🏴
worked on cars since 1966
i have to agree with you sir
i would never want to do that job a second time
Laten we niet vergeten wat voor geweldige “vrouw” je hebt, die achter je staat in dit spannende nieuwe avontuur.
Omdat een eigen zaak beginnen niet voor iedereen is weg gelegd.
A good wife is a treasure beyond value. And seems a good mother as well. Double treasure!
Netso Pragtig. Groete uit Windhoek Namibië.
I love the way you close your eyes to see where the bolt is. I've done that for years and it seems to enhance my vision. Love the videos sir. This actually Craig Rinehart not Lois. She's not the mechanical unit.
Ray has risen to the task, deservedly experiencing the thrill of victory rather than the agony of defeat . I shared you joy and satisfaction again all the way from the frozen fringe of civilization in Northern Canada .
Excellent video Ray. The long ones are always good to watch too Ray.
what about using never size on the EGR threads and nut/sleeve?
Another Job done well. Thanks for all your effort Ray!
4:43 when Ray pulled up the Rear Oxygen Sensor socket which was the grey connector. The new grey oxygen sensor connector that was boxed inside of the upstream Part Number and now Ray has a FREE Downstream Oxygen Sensor for that Hyundai Santa Fe.
Once again another good job. You are amazing in the skill level you possess.
OH man,
You are bad ass. This video was exactly what I needed to see for my Hyundai. I have the same damn one with the same amount of miles. Your video on this thing was more than helpful. Just watching you run into the issues you were running into. You saved ne a lot od grief . Well I havent done the EGR yet so I will let you know on that one.
Sincerely
Chris
Ray, did you remember to tighten the exhaust connection to the EGR ?
If it wasnt on video... didnt happen 😜
I thought the same.. lol
Boxed wrong parts! Some shops have a problem if there are two possibilities "Just send both of them!". Ultimately it's the Counterman's responsibility to make sure the unused part(s) are in the correct boxes with correct part numbers.
I’d almost guarantee that the “wrong” sensor was a returned part that went into the wrong box. When you pulled it out of the box it didn’t have the plastic cover on the sensor, or a twist tie on the folded wire.
Matched set.
5:02 I usually wipe some lubricant on the threads so it will be much more easier to unscrew it again on the next replacement. I always add little lubricant on the o2sensor and sparkplug threads. Because heat and some rust or carbon buildups can make it hard to unscrew it. Well already done this method since 4year so far everything was easy to remove.
Hey ray, loving the content. Lunchtime video here in a freezing uk. It was so cold my gearbox was like thick syrup. (Manual gearbox) I couldn’t tell if it as in neutral as the stick stopped wherever I left it. 20 minutes of engine warm up seemed to thaw it out a bit. Must have radiated some heat. The gearbox fluid is sealed (sort of, there is a vent under the battery tray) and not usually changed that often.
It was -35 C here 2 days ago, so I “feel” your pain 🥶
Greetings from Chicago!
Try Amsoil (or other brand)synthetic gear oil.
Much more resistant to vuscisity increase due to cold.
I appreciate your diligence Ray. You are one Mechanic to be trusted. And that means a lot, to me, and I'm sure others as well!
Thank you for going beyond and doing what's right... Even if it isn't easy!
Those type of repairs are seriously hard on the body! Good job Ray.
You should try doing it on the floor, and be 69 years old, with 2 artificial knees. Lol
Oddly enough though I still get immense satisfaction when I back the car out knowing that a good job was done well. I hope I never lose that feeling.
especially the older you get, the harder it is....
Definitely liking the new intro. It fits in perfectly with the tone of your channel. The videos on this repair were definitely enlightening and entertaining. Even though it was long, I watched the entire first video and even rewound a couple of spots. I am glad you were able to eventually get this one completed and it appears that the vehicle drives a lot better now. It is good to see you busy in your new shop.
I'm not a fan, he looks toothless.
Darn tough repair, great job man.
9:30 - 10:15 Did you give a final tighten to the EGR retention nut? Did the other bank get a new O2 sensor?
I was wondering the same! I sure hope that he did.
Disappointed that I didn’t hear a “click” on the exhaust side of the EGR valve around the 19 minute point…LOL… GREAT video, keep it up!
Well done 👍 However, is the Pipe on the EGR (the rusted one) tightened again? You let it loose to first mount the EGR to the Intake MF…🤔
I had the same question. I kept waiting for him to tighten it down. I assume Ray just didn't show that operation. That vehicle was a real beast.
@@hankharty9673 Absolutely - but now it´s tamed and ready to reliably serve his owner 👍
As a tech in another field I'm surprised you wear a metal wedding band and not a silicone one for work. Nice to keep all your phalanges forever!
Love the new intro to the videos Ray! Keep up the good work. 🇺🇸✌️
My Santa Fe needed new plugs and wires. My mechanic didn’t want to do it. I did the plugs first and got the wires later. Took it apart a second time to install wires and intake gasket. I remember the back pain from leaning over the engine.
Hi Ray, love your videos. Your patience is amazing!! I am sorry for the question, but did you remember to tighten the nut for the EGR? I do not recall seeing it in the video.
Neither did I.
My future son-in-law picked up a part at O'Reilly's and drove 200 miles to fix my daughter's car. It was to be an easy fix. He had researched on UA-cam how to do the repair. Removed the failed sensor. When he removed the new sensor from the box, it was totally different. He went to the local O'Reilly's to get the "right" sensor. O'Reilly's clerk looked up the part number and the box had the right part number but the sensor inside was not the correct one. Clerk went thru his stock of the same part numbered boxes and finally found the correct sensor (looked like the old sensor, at least).
I personally have had this experience at O'Reilly's and have heard from co-workers that they've had the same experience at O'Reilly's.
Did you tighten the lock nut on the EGR tube?
@27:00... Hey, we can't read the PID when you highlight it. It washes out because it's too bright for the camera. Also, don't use the light on your phone when filming the screen. It reflects off the screen.
No anti seize on the o2 sensor threads?
They usually come precoated but it did look bare ???
This was a heck of a job, like removing the dash and seats on the Ford pickup some months ago only to replace a sensor.
Good morning Ray. Another great video on the way.
I saw the EGR gasket drop, and I was like “Oooohh!!!!” The same reaction when you see someone take a hard fall.
Hey Ray! Nice job and great attitude. I didn't see you tighten the pipe to the EGR... you went right to plugs and brackets after securing the valve to the intake.
Did that happen?
I use a couple drops of super glue to hold the gasket in place for installation. It helps when you can't really see but you don't have to worry about dropping the gasket. It's a little trick my auto mechanics instructor taught me my 11th grade year
I keep a bottle of Elmers rubber cement around for that purpose, it cleans off really easy, just rub it. Whatever it takes though!
Wow that was a tough one Ray, did you tighten that gland nut on the egr valve ?
I did not see it in the vid I went back to see. Not trying to be a pita I personally have replaced cylinder heads on one of these. Took me an entire week after work in the winter in Michigan in the dark. But car lasted me 10years after.
In my shop, I work on Lawn Mower Sale. I had to put all my tools away or I can’t find them in the next day if you know what I mean is the statement.!
And clean out surfaces, wash hands before test driving customer verhicles..Guessing that he after cleaning engine, cleaned down steering wheel and handles..
Great video, Ray. How did you end up attaching the heat shield?
Respect! Nothing like swimming in an engine compartment to get those bolts in. Wish I'd listened more in School. LMAO Remember old school cars you could nearly throw an arm chair in an engine compartment and have a nap lol
Did you remember to tighten the line on the EGR ? Did I miss it ?
If I had to guess on the o2 sensors, normally the grey and black is so you can visually see the difference between upstream and downstream on a car (connectors are color coded) someone probably ordered both sensors, didn’t use one of them and then returned it in the wrong box. Seen it happen a few times