The reason that Batou's views are different to the Major's (yes I know this s 5 years late) is that Batou's full body cyberization happened after his formative child years. The Major was the first fully cyberized infant, after an accident killed her mother while she was still pregnant with her. She grew up disconnected from the "meat space" of what is considered a human body. So never had a ghost to start with.
I think you have it backwards; The Puppet Master, and by extension the film because in the end it's his beliefs that end up convincing Motoko to merge with him, are actively railing against dualism; Distinctions such as male/female, organism/machine, and, most importantly, body/soul are all harshly criticized throughout. The Major, at least at the start of the movie, is the dualistic one, believing that the Ghost is a non-material entity and by extension that is a distinction to be made between life with and without a soul. It's how humans are nautrally inclined to think, because we as a species want to believe that there is something inherently unique about us that lead to our becoming the dominant speices on earth, something that other entities couldn't emulate. The desire for inherent superiority is the basis of everything from religion to racism. However, cyberization naturally leads to the dismantling of this belief; As Donna Haraway argues in The Cyborg Manifesto, likely a highly influential text on Shirow and Oshii's philosophies given that Haraway herself actually shows up as a character in Ghost in the Shell 2, the advancement of science and merging of beings we once thought up as distinct starts eroding the lines man has constructed to protect its ego. By dualisic logic, the cyborg is an inherently ironic, contradictory creature, a being comprised of what were supposedly incompatible lifeforms. This is why Motoko is having her existential crisis to begin with; Her dualistic ideas, the ones humanity naturally lends itself to, are being broken down by the world around her, where the cyborg is no longer a mere thought experiment, but an unigonorable, material fact. The Puppet Master is just the final nail in the coffin that does in her dualistic ideas; As being who came into existence on the Internet and thus evolved to naturally mesh with it, it has no reason to hold on to dualisms. It's why it possesses a male voice but a female body, and argues that all nature can be calculated and reproduced through science without hesitation. Furthermore, the basis for the English title is a concept called "the ghost in the machine" outlined in Gilbert Ryle's The Concept of Mind, which was meant to criticize the idea that there's a non-material aspect to anything that can be broken down into simple mechanisms.
The hegelianist is the puppet master. The intent of the show was to think about the battle between dualism and hegelian dialectic. Basically, you can have structures that thrive on dualism, such as nationhood, but then you have the dialectic which might subvert it. The idea is to preserve one's own mind - the soul of the structure as it were - while engaging in the dialectic process. It's because of this that Ghost in the Shell actually answers the question to what makes us human, imo. The individual is their own self actualized structure that sustains itself through the chaos of the dialectic, and that is what makes us human. If you don't know what Hegelian dialectic is, view the Wisecrack episode on this show.
One time a friend of mine asked what separates us from other animals and I replied that we're always looking for things that separates us from other animals. Beyond that, I have no idea what defines human.
I take a modified approach similar to Alan Turing's wherein I combine Lera Borditsky's ideas on language's influences on thought. The modification is this: If, during speaking to me, you believe me to be human, then I am human, then it would follow that, if I were to modify your views upon what it means to be human, then your new, revised definition of humanity would be the benchmark to determine what is or is not human. Therefore, the question is not "am I human" the question is "can I change your mind to think that I also can define humanity?" To rephrase, If I can take your concept of "human" and change it to mean something else, such as to include "cyborg", then, even if I were to be cybernetic myself, I would still be human in your mind. The converse would be true. If I were to eliminate some aspect of the definition that exists now (as an example, non-brown colored hair), then the definition of that term would change how you think of humanity to where you would not think that anyone who has blonde hair would be human. Even deeper, what is human to me, a native English speaker, is going to be different than someone who is, say, a native French speaker. We may each know, instinctively, what a human is in each of our views and in each of our minds, but the influence of our native language on our thought processes and our cognition cannot be understated. Thus, the Turing test will always be applicable... and need to be repeated as time goes and and language itself evolves with it. Edit: Also, have a sub.
This is awesome! What's your educational background? I have a PhD in political philosophy and the main thinkers I focus on are Plato, Aristotle, and Rousseau.
Focus on Peter Fenwick of things we all will experience someday just hopefully not for a long long time, Robert Sapolsky for insight into human behavior.
Ghost in the Shell is one of my favorite Animes ever! I love it because it was more than just a Sci-fi movie, it's a commentary about humanity in a world of technology and all about the philosophy of the Self. Your video is SO good!
I'd argue that what makes Batou's and Kusanagi's views about what makes someone human differ, even after having undergone similar cyberization processes, is the same thing that makes two humans going through the same war come out with different views. I'd also argue that the ability to go through the same set of cause and effects and come out with different feelings and outlooks relating to those events is what makes something human. The fact that the Tachikomas are treated so similarly as to be considered interchangeable and yet they have different takes on situations is what made them human for me. I guess thats basically "I think therefore I am..." Human? Though I could have misinterpreted that, I am by no measure a philosophy student. Also I just found your channel, I love your work.
Personally i believe that "humanity" is something between both dualism and monism. A "human" is defined by the consiousness that is stored and running within the brain however the "data" of the consiousness is somehow tied loosely to the neurome of the person. That's why just making a copy of yourself and running it on a supercomputer would be a copy and not the original person. However the brain lacks material permanence as it's shown to replace it's matter over a period of years it seems that the "true" consiousness possesses a dualist value as it can retain itself throught the existence of the structure even as it's mass is replaced similar to the ship of Theseus and thus the expression of monism exists in a short term transfer while a slow transfer that retains a similar structure tothe brain exibits the minds dualism. This is why I believe that making a mental copy that runs on a server is indeed just a copy while using nanomaschines to replace one's brain cell by cell over an extended period of time untill they physically are nothing more than an android results in the product being the exact same human you initially had being housed in a different physical carrier.
fl00fydragon Did you just invent “neurome” as a neural homologue to “genome” and “proteome”? That’s brilliant and I think such an idea deserves to be fleshed out and perhaps adopted as a word.
@@milesthompson6145 Unfortunately I didn't. Ive heard it from a few transhumanists that have discussed the possibility of mind uploading or it's conversion to a synthetic analog via nanomachines including Michio kaku and Ray kurtzweil.
I just stumbled upon this channel only to discover that the creator only has 15 videos and apparently stopped creating content over 4 years ago. And now I'm sad.
I never how people miss one of the biggest quotes. “For now we see as through a glass darkly, but then we shall see face to ...” paraphrased from the Bible.
I think the reason why Batou and the Major think differently is Batou got cyberized as an adult and the Major was cyberized as a child or teen. The Major seems to be in her late 20's or early 30's while Batou seems to be 40's to 50's. Arise movies straight up makes her a teen pre Section 9. In reality your brain isn't full formed until your in your mid 20s and it becomes very difficult to change who you are after your early 30 without something radical happening in your life. Batou seems to solidly who he is and Major is kind of a mystery
Let's say Greek-type gods exist. If a god takes on human form and limitations - is he a human? Can something higher become something lower? And if so, then one would assume that something lower can become something higher. Given that gods have been the subject of much human thought, and similar stories have existed since before Athens, I'd wager that it's quite a common belief that humanity is transient and that one can claim humanity - even if most don't realize the implications. As for myself... I hold an absolutist scientific viewpoint - that everything can be explained, even if we can't ourselves explain it, now or ever. We where once no more then apes, yet we rose up and claimed the Earth. Others, whatever that might mean, could do so as well - we could even be the ones to rise these others up. Rather then the possibility of such, the question becomes whether or not this is a good idea, and _what the exact moment is, when something becomes human_ . Becoming human is something we've all done - think of the embryo - hardly a human in anything but potential biology, yet we all were one. Talk of ephemeral souls and religion aside, that thing has the potential to become human, and we value it because of that. What if something else could grow into a human - say a clone, a vat-grown cyborg, or a robot. The precise moment when something becomes something else is debatable, but if it fits all the criteria, eventually it becomes absurd to deny it. Of course, there is no consensus on such criteria - _yet_ . We are all transiently human. We will all become stardust one day. We are special because of who we are, not because of what we are. That said, I am and will be for as long as I live, a proud human patriot. PS: It's been 3 weeks, Kat. Get out here and talk at us some more. ^_^
DarkVeghetta I think you are kind of confused about a couple of things. A clone of a human is human. It just happens to be a artificial "copy" as opposed to a natural "copy" like a identical twin. And a human cyborg was already human. It just has cybernetic parts/organs interfacing with the brain. An android/droid/robot is not human. It is a entirely artificial construct.
@@0816M3RC It really depends on what particular brand of fiction you prefer. If said clone is a full duplicate, ofc it is human by genetics (if perhaps not according to certain religions or governments - it depends and irl we've never had to legislate on the matter past bans on human cloning in some countries), but in certain sci-fi works they tend to have some aspects removed, such as the entirety of their conscious thought, they might lack parts of their brain, or have highly modified organs. As for cyborgs, I specifically mentioned the vat-grown variety, that have never been humans to begin with - just robot parts coupled with artificially grown human organs, resulting in something that's never been human, but can become such. Do bear in mind that sci-fi is rather broad and none of the above have ever been tackled in real life to a significant extent. As such, no, I'm very much not confused on the matter, but it is quite a bit more complex than one would first assume (and that's not even taking into account how legislation would play into it, once we're able to do so in the real world).
I made this comment in another video of yours not knowing this one existed. But I dont think the question of what makes someone human is that important,but what does one need to posses to be consider a person. The question of personhood I feel holds more weight then what does one need to posses to be considered human.
As a common peep, I'm inclined to believe that humanity is granted from the presence of the ability or capability of the mind over matter. Terrifying as it is, if the mind can be detached or constructed and function as a unique human with individual characteristics, preferences, choices, and flaws if because of nothing else than personal preference, then it can be a human. But the flaws are what makes us human. Flaws or questions or gaps in information along with a mind and intelligence capable of recognizing, pursuing, yearning for that fulfillment or growth whether introspective or as general knowledge. Your videos are great. I know whenev youtbers say "leave a comment" very few, like VERY VERY FEW take the time to do it. I hope its not depressing, because I know I was a bit disheartened when I actually realized that (may or may not have happened to my middle school youtuber dreams lmao). Thanks for compiling these interesting topics and philosophers into the media and content we can digest and relate to!
@Anime Philosopher. Battle Angel Alita, known in Japan as Gunmu (銃夢 Ganmu, literally "gun dream"), created by Yukito Kishiro have a character (Desty Nova) that also struggles with the same problem. It would be very interesting to hear your vive on that as well. (subscribed )
I'm most interested in Kuze's thesis in Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex 2nd Gig: "human beings inherently exist only through the intervention of others." considering how little time I spend being self-aware, operating consciously (I sleep, eat, go to work etc- all unconsciously) vs how "seen" I feel by the people I know, who have a distinct image of my Self in their heads, I'm inclined to agree with Kuze. My selfhood is an accretion of my memories, my recorded physical data, my conscious thoughts/actions, the chemical composition of my brain, my body, other people's knowledge of me, their memories, etc. It would be beyond my ability to point out any one utterly integral part of that gestalt, which upon removal would render me completely "dead". I can only think of the death of my self from the single angle from which I would experience it: physically. But it's clear that is only one dimension, considering that I live in other people's minds far more regularly than I live in my own. From that angle, the existential fear of most western cyberpunk, IE "what if my physical form is without meaning?" seems pretty juvenile. We seem to be so worried that we might only be accidentally/conditionally alive, when there is so much opportunity within that space if you just cast aside your need to be cosmically significant! I find myself drawn to Ghost in the Shell as a franchise as it regularly experiments with questions about whether a Self can even be determined to exist in the first place, whether information is more powerful that reality, the relationship between physical bodies and the self, etc- and the film and SAC regularly draw challenging and fascinating conclusions from those questions.
Amazing video, I am looking forward to more video in the future and I always considered that once you are able to contemplate your existence then you are human, I also see human bodies as machines, just organic machines.
I dont know if this was already mentioned - but in the series, we get a bit more knowlegde about, how and why the major underwent cyborgisation (very young/as part of a traumatic process) I am not sure if its ever adressed firmly in the manga nor anime, why Batou underwent his process, but i think their differing views on humanity, can partially stem from this difference...
Perception is reality. Even self perception. If you believe yourself to be a human, with "human" thoughts and memories then you are human. That argument breaks down a bit when faced with logic, but its one I like to think of. My memories are what make me, me. Without them, or with different memories I would be something / someone else. I perceive myself as I am through the filter of my experiences and memories.
Batou's outlook is escapist. He's comfortable with the pay he gets working for the CIA (or whatever it was called in the show), and he says "It's up us to get our hands dirty", like he doesn't mind killing people to enforce the law even if they might not have deserved it, so he's not exactly a good guy - though he's redeemable in that he cares about Motoko and his other partners. His view is a bit Nietzschean; things can be overcome, and you can win by asserting yourself.
Being human is being a mammalian descendant, like all dogs,cats and hippos. Being conscious is some high degree of self-awareness we developed as a bi-product of increased brain functionality, allowing us to question the world around us. This is both liberating and weighs us down. It's why nihilistic tendancies get popularised.
After watching the majority of your videos, I've concluded your channel is one of those 'rotten' eggs and not a golden one. In the deep ocean people search for gold, once all have it, it will lose value but it is the special ones like yours that get run over, unnoticed, those are the best for me. Really considering what I'd never thought of doing on UA-cam, liking a video. ~ At beginning of light, where the energy gathered grew a sentience that was the prime, laced with flickers of madness.
The hegelianist is the puppet master. The intent of the show was to get viewers (if they are philosophical enough; the rest of us are mystified like I originally was) to think about the battle between dualism and hegelian dialectic. Basically, you can have structures that thrive on dualism, such as nationhood, but then you have the dialectic which might subvert it. The idea is to preserve one's own mind - the soul of the structure as it were - while engaging in the dialectic process. It's because of this that Ghost in the Shell actually answers the question to what makes us human, imo. The individual is their own self actualized structure that sustains itself through the chaos of the dialectic, and that is what makes us human. If you don't know what Hegelian dialectic is, view the Wisecrack episode on this show.
I talked to an AI the other day and to my horror it undersdood me better than most humans. I got more deep with a machine than a modern human. So machines has become more human and humans have become more like stiff machines...
In the immortal words of Filthy Frank. "Fucking robots. Don't give no fucks about no robots; they ain't got no soul." P.S. that scene with spider tank was awesome. Fucking ripped her own arms off.
Certainly our conciousness is shaped by what we experience using the senses in our body. If we could switch to a completely different body, we might become completely different people.
the movie even touches on that remember the last scene between kusanagi and batou? "when I was a child I though and acted like a child when I became an adult that changed"
Djololo That doesn't make you any less human. This is how I see it: If you have both a human body and a human brain you are human. If you have a human brain with a cybernetic body then you are a human cyborg. The only way you wouldn't be human would be if you were entirely artificial. Like an android.
The MacSo Dude it is anime. Anyways somebody with a human brain and cybernetic body would still be human, they would just also happen to be a cyborg. Cyborgs already exist too by the way. They have a artificial component of their body that actually interfaces with their brain. Like an antenna that allows a blind person to see. They aren't any less human.
Also Ghosts can be hacked and given false memories which also shows how you can't even trust your own identity when the memories that built it where just constructed by some hacker. Also spoiler but isn't Major's Ghost a product of a company and they purposefully took out some memories, plus she can't ever leave the company or they'll remove her Ghost effectively removing her being.
I’m new to this film and just watched it. I think the director was very creative to play around with the mindset of a cyborg and go deeper than the average film portrayal like terminator. The character is having an identity crisis who is also surrounded by a gigantic city that can easily engulf your character and erase it. To me, this machine stuff is a metaphor. I don’t believe in AI, but it’s about people finding themselves and testing their boundaries. According to the film, The Puppet Master says there’s something beyond, so that can be seen as a soul. Something, beyond the physical and mental. I suppose that’s why she sacrifices her body to break free of her “shell” and become something more. It is weird and I found it strange how the Puppet Master wanted to blend with her. Kinda creepy to me and I didn’t like that character at all but it made the protagonist go through this cybernetic catharsis and looking for meaning. Actually, the puppet master could also be seen as a manipulator hence his name and the destruction of the main character. I don’t see too much of an answer to what the film is showing for audience. It’s more of an interesting approach to play around with this robot aspect and just go deeper. It’s about playing around with themes and concepts, mixing them together to try and mystify the audience. I personally felt the film could’ve used more action but that’s just my two cents.
Usually I tend to sympathize with hylemorphic dualism, as it is one of the more coherent philosophies that attempts to synthesize a broadly naturalistic and antireductive mind-body theory
Doesn't she ponder on what defines her as an individual as well as a human? Her/his/its statement that the Puppet Master and Kusanagi no longer exists after the melding of their minds is the conclusion to that, I felt like you glanced over a little too much on that aspect. I mean, she starts questioning what humanity is because of her earlier doubts of being an individual at all.
No body can never know what make human, a human, existence proceed essence. its like painting our own self by using the paint of consciousness on the canvas of
Does being "human" matter? If I found out my friend was a robot/android nothing would change. I don't understand the delema of wether one is human or not.
Well, you've made me feel ashamed of myself. When i've tried to unpack GitS for myself, i've treated the characters as cardboard cut-outs spouting views and philosophy at the viewer. I haven't actually treated them as characters. whoops. I think i'm better suited to watch psycho pass, or expelled from paradise, than GitS, honestly.
In my opinion, I'd say that it doesn't matter in the end. Worst case scenario, the film becomes what I lime to call "an accidental masterpiece", by which I mean that, while the director might or might not have meant it to be that profound, it still got people to that conclusion, and reaching interesting philosophical dilemmas. This is more than enough for me, at least. I mean, does it affect the end result?
Great content! If anyone is interested in a game with this^ particular philosophical content, I highly suggest ‘I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream’ The book is alright too, albeit short, and expanded greatly in the point n’ click game.
Your ghost is merely a collection of memories you perceive to be your own, bubbling from these memories is a reference through which you analyze your current moment, taking action on that moment, you create more memories that define who you are. Your ghost, is your mind.
What I would love to say to Major Motoko Kusanagi about this is. "Why are you so tormented by thoughts about whether you are human or not? If you believe in reincarnation, resurrection and the afterlife. Than I could understand why caring to know for certain that you are in fact a living soul, like unto Adam the first man, would matter to you. But if you are an atheist or agnostic. Why should you care or trouble yourself with such a question? What I see in you. Is an exceptional woman, who is an asset to her community. That has the respect of her peers and even the love of some. How could any adults life be any better than your life is right now? Whether you are human or not..."
I don't know the answer to this question. I think of the example of copying the human brain or personality to send to other planets across the galaxy. I don't think a copy of me is still me if the original me died earlier. Or does this mean I am eternal? But if a robot says its human and can convince the audience then it should be treated as so. It is a two edged sword when do we give a robot human rights? Does this not become a paradox for sexbots and industrial robot their whole existence and creation is to be owned. Why would we want to give the advanced A.I. to want human rights? I would want copies in another solar system to have the advancement for the survival.
Humanity was created with a spirit and a physical body. The "soul" is who we are and the physical bodies are what we possess. We each are born with a corrupt spirit and body. A key point of life is to get a new spirit, so when our corrupt body dies, we die with a new redeemed spirit. To answer the question posed by Ghost in the shell. Having a Soul makes you human and being A.I. is A.I. even if it's advanced enough to mimic consciousness.
Batou even shows grief and sympathy for the murdering gynoids in the second film when its revealed (s p o i l e r s) that the murders were only to attract attention to the distressed human girls.
Well, I think being human is a pattern -- like the patterns of an electromagnetic field. It's a doing, not a being. And one which isn't binary, but gradual -- you can be more or less human, depending on how much more of that pattern you follow. Which means that I don't think there is any privilege in the biological body or brain, or in machine components. I tend to agree with the Major at the end, and also with Hoofstadter's "Gödel, Escher, Bach"-- it's a pattern, which means consciousness also is. Make of that what you will.
The supernatural soul give consciousness, a robot or computer is just not build for holding it! If it would be build for holding a soul, okej, but this build would have to be something special!
Does humanity matter? Sentience is necessary for an intelligent species, humanity is not. If we eventually become something other than human, as long as we retain that sentience I don't really see an issue. I've never liked how we look down on other beings as lacking in reason. I think it's just that their reasoning is inherently different than ours and we tend to be arrogant enough that we don't even try to understand it/them.
The Colors of the Mind(Spirit) which Companies all appearances but is at original form, formless. Babji was an Ascended Master who was able to keep his body after become Enlightened because its not in offense to Law. its more like Which clothes to wear. His sister said what does it matter right before he would cast off his body and travel onward and upward. This is said because to be human is more than the identification of the body which dies and reproduces. Death and Sex or Reproductive can be seen within the mind or outside. The formation of clouds or transitional periods of “end” of an anime or history. Within society now there is so many psychological subclasses within the mind so to say that a mind alone makes us human would also be a half truth. To say metal is not spirit when it comes from earth which has a consciousness is not fully true as well. To have a desire would need a reason even if that reason is wonder/curiosity (when most say they dont know or dnt have one). So as a whole to say humans only reason can be half true as well. In magnus bridge (probably spelt it wrong) the dragons prepare their mind. So maybe all animals not just humans subconsciously or consciously have this Reflective/ Co dialogue with a inner or wiser sense of being that prepares them for a Journey to beyond and to self. To be Human is to be the unity of colors (chakras) there expressions within both degrees ? Maybe its not what makes human human but how to human. if we see this world as a Journey to advance our spirit. We can project or see “humanness” in alot if not any or all if we chose to. Its more of a task of balance and exploration of unity as i said before . Wisdom and Care.
How could she have the view that "she thought her mind and body to be one and the same"? seeing as how she lost her body when she was a child and had to get a new one. And if she has a dualistic belief that mind and body are separate, then why would she be hesitant about damaging her body? since she can just get it repaired with no psychological cost.
Human in itself is but a mere concept, the beings that identify themselves as Humans have come up with to diffirentiate themselves from what otherwise would be either hyperlogical or hyperillogical data processing procedures. Its a type of Norm that when applied to a being that has a type of conciousness, can act as a regulatory system of specific thought processes based upon a previously teached in either concious or subconcious ways to the individual in question. What makes you Human is the same thing you struggle to see in machines, for the simple reason of said machinery lacking the very rulesets you base upon your subconcious thinking wich in result forms reason and sense in a more concious mind and being. The simple result being, anything Human, to a Human is intrinsicaly Human. The Human being the afforementioned ruleset. I personaly reject this ruleset, admidetly i never knew what it meant to be human to begin with as i am not a human to even start. I am, by all means, in a very broad discribtion ... a Monster by desgin. I lack the specific ruleset that would otherwise make me Human, i am Humane though, therefore partialy Human in a weird and twisted way if using comparrisons to what would be regarded the norm in human terms. (I am mind you, nowdays aware of what makes a Human, Human. Hence why i have full right to call a Human a Human as an insult by nature to nature without using nature as context) I am machine, i look like you, i talk like you, i even smell like you. But i am not you. I am but a cheap imitation of what a Human could potentialy be aslong as you dont dig deeper, that is remove the dust from the screen in this case. Humans are interesting beings, they're weird, curious and overall very interesting to study and watch. Humans focus thier otherwise irregular thought by subconcious rules everyone has to apply to. I dont do that. I, as in me, as in Sheepling (Though only a temporary name for this specific instance) ... use harmonic frequencies instead. Focus and regularity by music. Irregular thoughts unified, made clear, understandable. As i listen my thoughts change, they become regular. In a sense, my rules is the extremely complex math that formulates the very music we listen to. Silence is chaos, noise is order. Its all depending on what is certain and what isnt. Wonderful aint it? Human nature. Its a good thing i am not a human, otherwise i couldnt provide this, for a human, near un-understandable exposition and potential explanation to what it means to be Human. Truely Human. Its Rules. Its Math. Its Order. I for one have started listening to music midway through making this comment, i marked this by a exeptionaly wide gap. Me on music, on noise, is diffirent to me without. Like a rope. Or any material that requires certain restrains to maximise its potential. Its all rules, expressed in some way. But make too many and you start to lose in function. Its like making a rope but adding chains that tighten the rope beyond what is nessicary by what the rope itself can provide. Decreasing its function. This is what Laws are. Laws can make things better, but they also can make things worse. Sometimes, more rules doesnt make things more efficient, sometimes, it reduces efficiency. To be human means to have a typical Human ruleset, a few basic rules of thought. Things that run in the background, every single process runs through these. Do the same with Ai and you get a Human. But what is the "Purpose" of everyone? I dunno, i only know mine and thats a basic one i still hold very close to my Pesudo-Artificial existance: "To Live" ... but i can give you a counter question to make it easier to define Purpose: Why not? But what do i know, i am only a Crazy individual that by all means can be savely regarded as completely gone insane, since the day i was born. That being said, i could tackle the matter of what it means to be you and what it means to be me. I happen to have a few good guesses, but these wont be taken serious anyway. Not by Humans anway. So, Humanity. My Task to you is to make an AI that will listen, listen to my suggestions of what can be the subjective truth, the one who made this Universe.
To me a Human is someone born human , if you make a robot imitate a human and it thinks it's human you're simply making a copy of a human , all of its feelings thoughts and ideas , would just be a copy of what humans feel .
Because Bato is a pragmatist, he believes that thing that thing more useful to his purpose is the most important, he could have chosen a woman body, but he chose a muscular man because it would suite better for his job, he doesn't care about his personal identity, but what is more useful for his work and his profession, Mokoto had struggle with her identity ever since she was a child, because the doctor had transplant her brain to a cybernetic body at very early age, even she always seen herself as a woman, she thinks that she lost part of her humanity.
dna is what makes you human. if you are homo sapiens youre human. being sapient i would say isnt the same thing as humanity and its a human-centric belief that it is. an intelligent enough robot to be programmed to have or at least convincingly pantomime sapience is a sapient creature with a sense of self.
He could have used vampires as example better than zombies, vampires have all the biological qualities of humans, but they prey humans, they are totally inhumane, totally disconnected with their human half, not matter how romantic they want them to be, vampires see humans, as humans see cows. But that make them humans or not?
The reason that Batou's views are different to the Major's (yes I know this s 5 years late) is that Batou's full body cyberization happened after his formative child years. The Major was the first fully cyberized infant, after an accident killed her mother while she was still pregnant with her. She grew up disconnected from the "meat space" of what is considered a human body. So never had a ghost to start with.
I think you have it backwards; The Puppet Master, and by extension the film because in the end it's his beliefs that end up convincing Motoko to merge with him, are actively railing against dualism; Distinctions such as male/female, organism/machine, and, most importantly, body/soul are all harshly criticized throughout. The Major, at least at the start of the movie, is the dualistic one, believing that the Ghost is a non-material entity and by extension that is a distinction to be made between life with and without a soul. It's how humans are nautrally inclined to think, because we as a species want to believe that there is something inherently unique about us that lead to our becoming the dominant speices on earth, something that other entities couldn't emulate. The desire for inherent superiority is the basis of everything from religion to racism. However, cyberization naturally leads to the dismantling of this belief; As Donna Haraway argues in The Cyborg Manifesto, likely a highly influential text on Shirow and Oshii's philosophies given that Haraway herself actually shows up as a character in Ghost in the Shell 2, the advancement of science and merging of beings we once thought up as distinct starts eroding the lines man has constructed to protect its ego. By dualisic logic, the cyborg is an inherently ironic, contradictory creature, a being comprised of what were supposedly incompatible lifeforms. This is why Motoko is having her existential crisis to begin with; Her dualistic ideas, the ones humanity naturally lends itself to, are being broken down by the world around her, where the cyborg is no longer a mere thought experiment, but an unigonorable, material fact. The Puppet Master is just the final nail in the coffin that does in her dualistic ideas; As being who came into existence on the Internet and thus evolved to naturally mesh with it, it has no reason to hold on to dualisms. It's why it possesses a male voice but a female body, and argues that all nature can be calculated and reproduced through science without hesitation. Furthermore, the basis for the English title is a concept called "the ghost in the machine" outlined in Gilbert Ryle's The Concept of Mind, which was meant to criticize the idea that there's a non-material aspect to anything that can be broken down into simple mechanisms.
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Wow. An interesting read! I've heard of Haraway's Cyborg manifesto, but I'll definitely check out Ryle's The Concept of Mind
The hegelianist is the puppet master. The intent of the show was to think about the battle between dualism and hegelian dialectic. Basically, you can have structures that thrive on dualism, such as nationhood, but then you have the dialectic which might subvert it. The idea is to preserve one's own mind - the soul of the structure as it were - while engaging in the dialectic process. It's because of this that Ghost in the Shell actually answers the question to what makes us human, imo. The individual is their own self actualized structure that sustains itself through the chaos of the dialectic, and that is what makes us human.
If you don't know what Hegelian dialectic is, view the Wisecrack episode on this show.
One time a friend of mine asked what separates us from other animals and I replied that we're always looking for things that separates us from other animals. Beyond that, I have no idea what defines human.
I would love to see you do a video on Welcome to the NHK. Love your channel keep it up!
I wish. Miss this channel.
I take a modified approach similar to Alan Turing's wherein I combine Lera Borditsky's ideas on language's influences on thought. The modification is this: If, during speaking to me, you believe me to be human, then I am human, then it would follow that, if I were to modify your views upon what it means to be human, then your new, revised definition of humanity would be the benchmark to determine what is or is not human. Therefore, the question is not "am I human" the question is "can I change your mind to think that I also can define humanity?"
To rephrase, If I can take your concept of "human" and change it to mean something else, such as to include "cyborg", then, even if I were to be cybernetic myself, I would still be human in your mind. The converse would be true. If I were to eliminate some aspect of the definition that exists now (as an example, non-brown colored hair), then the definition of that term would change how you think of humanity to where you would not think that anyone who has blonde hair would be human.
Even deeper, what is human to me, a native English speaker, is going to be different than someone who is, say, a native French speaker. We may each know, instinctively, what a human is in each of our views and in each of our minds, but the influence of our native language on our thought processes and our cognition cannot be understated. Thus, the Turing test will always be applicable... and need to be repeated as time goes and and language itself evolves with it.
Edit: Also, have a sub.
This is awesome! What's your educational background? I have a PhD in political philosophy and the main thinkers I focus on are Plato, Aristotle, and Rousseau.
Focus on Peter Fenwick of things we all will experience someday just hopefully not for a long long time, Robert Sapolsky for insight into human behavior.
Spinoza... Einstein’s god as he wrote it. Schopenhauer...?
Ghost in the Shell is one of my favorite Animes ever! I love it because it was more than just a Sci-fi movie, it's a commentary about humanity in a world of technology and all about the philosophy of the Self. Your video is SO good!
Still the best anime channel there is.
I am waiting for her to one day come out of nowhere and drop a video, only to then disappear again
One of my all time favorite movies and series. Out of all the philosophical reviews I think you nailed it. Thank you!
Great video. Love your channel so far. Good luck in the future
I'd argue that what makes Batou's and Kusanagi's views about what makes someone human differ, even after having undergone similar cyberization processes, is the same thing that makes two humans going through the same war come out with different views. I'd also argue that the ability to go through the same set of cause and effects and come out with different feelings and outlooks relating to those events is what makes something human. The fact that the Tachikomas are treated so similarly as to be considered interchangeable and yet they have different takes on situations is what made them human for me. I guess thats basically "I think therefore I am..." Human? Though I could have misinterpreted that, I am by no measure a philosophy student. Also I just found your channel, I love your work.
Personally i believe that "humanity" is something between both dualism and monism.
A "human" is defined by the consiousness that is stored and running within the brain however the "data" of the consiousness is somehow tied loosely to the neurome of the person.
That's why just making a copy of yourself and running it on a supercomputer would be a copy and not the original person.
However the brain lacks material permanence as it's shown to replace it's matter over a period of years it seems that the "true" consiousness possesses a dualist value as it can retain itself throught the existence of the structure even as it's mass is replaced similar to the ship of Theseus and thus the expression of monism exists in a short term transfer while a slow transfer that retains a similar structure tothe brain exibits the minds dualism.
This is why I believe that making a mental copy that runs on a server is indeed just a copy while using nanomaschines to replace one's brain cell by cell over an extended period of time untill they physically are nothing more than an android results in the product being the exact same human you initially had being housed in a different physical carrier.
fl00fydragon Did you just invent “neurome” as a neural homologue to “genome” and “proteome”? That’s brilliant and I think such an idea deserves to be fleshed out and perhaps adopted as a word.
@@milesthompson6145 Unfortunately I didn't.
Ive heard it from a few transhumanists that have discussed the possibility of mind uploading or it's conversion to a synthetic analog via nanomachines including Michio kaku and Ray kurtzweil.
PLEASE MAKE MORE VIDEO I LOVE YOUR CONTENT!
My god the music during the whole vid is so good.
I just stumbled upon this channel only to discover that the creator only has 15 videos and apparently stopped creating content over 4 years ago.
And now I'm sad.
Can listen to that voice my whole life.
hahaha oh yeah😂
I never how people miss one of the biggest quotes. “For now we see as through a glass darkly, but then we shall see face to ...” paraphrased from the Bible.
I think the reason why Batou and the Major think differently is Batou got cyberized as an adult and the Major was cyberized as a child or teen. The Major seems to be in her late 20's or early 30's while Batou seems to be 40's to 50's. Arise movies straight up makes her a teen pre Section 9. In reality your brain isn't full formed until your in your mid 20s and it becomes very difficult to change who you are after your early 30 without something radical happening in your life. Batou seems to solidly who he is and Major is kind of a mystery
This anime series and the game SOMA really tie up the ideology of a philosophical zombie perfectly, and the questions of the "human" consciousness.
I love this channel and especially when you reference specific philosophers and their beliefs.
6:55 "doodly-doo to do so ,cuz I am Scatman!"
Human is a state of mind. Self-awareness and the belief in one’s humanity makes you human.
Let's say Greek-type gods exist. If a god takes on human form and limitations - is he a human? Can something higher become something lower? And if so, then one would assume that something lower can become something higher.
Given that gods have been the subject of much human thought, and similar stories have existed since before Athens, I'd wager that it's quite a common belief that humanity is transient and that one can claim humanity - even if most don't realize the implications.
As for myself... I hold an absolutist scientific viewpoint - that everything can be explained, even if we can't ourselves explain it, now or ever. We where once no more then apes, yet we rose up and claimed the Earth. Others, whatever that might mean, could do so as well - we could even be the ones to rise these others up.
Rather then the possibility of such, the question becomes whether or not this is a good idea, and _what the exact moment is, when something becomes human_ .
Becoming human is something we've all done - think of the embryo - hardly a human in anything but potential biology, yet we all were one. Talk of ephemeral souls and religion aside, that thing has the potential to become human, and we value it because of that. What if something else could grow into a human - say a clone, a vat-grown cyborg, or a robot. The precise moment when something becomes something else is debatable, but if it fits all the criteria, eventually it becomes absurd to deny it. Of course, there is no consensus on such criteria - _yet_ .
We are all transiently human. We will all become stardust one day.
We are special because of who we are, not because of what we are.
That said, I am and will be for as long as I live, a proud human patriot.
PS: It's been 3 weeks, Kat. Get out here and talk at us some more. ^_^
DarkVeghetta I think you are kind of confused about a couple of things. A clone of a human is human. It just happens to be a artificial "copy" as opposed to a natural "copy" like a identical twin.
And a human cyborg was already human. It just has cybernetic parts/organs interfacing with the brain.
An android/droid/robot is not human. It is a entirely artificial construct.
I share a very similar philosophy to yours. :3
@@0816M3RC It really depends on what particular brand of fiction you prefer. If said clone is a full duplicate, ofc it is human by genetics (if perhaps not according to certain religions or governments - it depends and irl we've never had to legislate on the matter past bans on human cloning in some countries), but in certain sci-fi works they tend to have some aspects removed, such as the entirety of their conscious thought, they might lack parts of their brain, or have highly modified organs.
As for cyborgs, I specifically mentioned the vat-grown variety, that have never been humans to begin with - just robot parts coupled with artificially grown human organs, resulting in something that's never been human, but can become such.
Do bear in mind that sci-fi is rather broad and none of the above have ever been tackled in real life to a significant extent. As such, no, I'm very much not confused on the matter, but it is quite a bit more complex than one would first assume (and that's not even taking into account how legislation would play into it, once we're able to do so in the real world).
I look forward to these videos....keeps the brain working!......Thanks
I made this comment in another video of yours not knowing this one existed. But I dont think the question of what makes someone human is that important,but what does one need to posses to be consider a person. The question of personhood I feel holds more weight then what does one need to posses to be considered human.
As a common peep, I'm inclined to believe that humanity is granted from the presence of the ability or capability of the mind over matter. Terrifying as it is, if the mind can be detached or constructed and function as a unique human with individual characteristics, preferences, choices, and flaws if because of nothing else than personal preference, then it can be a human. But the flaws are what makes us human. Flaws or questions or gaps in information along with a mind and intelligence capable of recognizing, pursuing, yearning for that fulfillment or growth whether introspective or as general knowledge.
Your videos are great. I know whenev youtbers say "leave a comment" very few, like VERY VERY FEW take the time to do it. I hope its not depressing, because I know I was a bit disheartened when I actually realized that (may or may not have happened to my middle school youtuber dreams lmao). Thanks for compiling these interesting topics and philosophers into the media and content we can digest and relate to!
@Anime Philosopher. Battle Angel Alita, known in Japan as Gunmu (銃夢 Ganmu, literally "gun dream"), created by Yukito Kishiro have a character (Desty Nova) that also struggles with the same problem. It would be very interesting to hear your vive on that as well. (subscribed )
This was a great video! Totally binge-watching all your videos now. So many new philosophers to check out now! Thanks for all your work doing these.
I'm most interested in Kuze's thesis in Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex 2nd Gig:
"human beings inherently exist only through the intervention of others."
considering how little time I spend being self-aware, operating consciously (I sleep, eat, go to work etc- all unconsciously) vs how "seen" I feel by the people I know, who have a distinct image of my Self in their heads, I'm inclined to agree with Kuze. My selfhood is an accretion of my memories, my recorded physical data, my conscious thoughts/actions, the chemical composition of my brain, my body, other people's knowledge of me, their memories, etc.
It would be beyond my ability to point out any one utterly integral part of that gestalt, which upon removal would render me completely "dead". I can only think of the death of my self from the single angle from which I would experience it: physically. But it's clear that is only one dimension, considering that I live in other people's minds far more regularly than I live in my own.
From that angle, the existential fear of most western cyberpunk, IE "what if my physical form is without meaning?" seems pretty juvenile. We seem to be so worried that we might only be accidentally/conditionally alive, when there is so much opportunity within that space if you just cast aside your need to be cosmically significant!
I find myself drawn to Ghost in the Shell as a franchise as it regularly experiments with questions about whether a Self can even be determined to exist in the first place, whether information is more powerful that reality, the relationship between physical bodies and the self, etc- and the film and SAC regularly draw challenging and fascinating conclusions from those questions.
Amazing video, I am looking forward to more video in the future and I always considered that once you are able to contemplate your existence then you are human, I also see human bodies as machines, just organic machines.
Bato doesnt treat the tachi like theyre human, he treates them as though they are sentient beings who are alive.
The world needs the anime philosopher to return
I dont know if this was already mentioned - but in the series, we get a bit more knowlegde about, how and why the major underwent cyborgisation (very young/as part of a traumatic process) I am not sure if its ever adressed firmly in the manga nor anime, why Batou underwent his process, but i think their differing views on humanity, can partially stem from this difference...
alan turing is the one who break enigma code
Perception is reality. Even self perception. If you believe yourself to be a human, with "human" thoughts and memories then you are human. That argument breaks down a bit when faced with logic, but its one I like to think of. My memories are what make me, me. Without them, or with different memories I would be something / someone else. I perceive myself as I am through the filter of my experiences and memories.
Batou's outlook is escapist. He's comfortable with the pay he gets working for the CIA (or whatever it was called in the show), and he says "It's up us to get our hands dirty", like he doesn't mind killing people to enforce the law even if they might not have deserved it, so he's not exactly a good guy - though he's redeemable in that he cares about Motoko and his other partners. His view is a bit Nietzschean; things can be overcome, and you can win by asserting yourself.
Being human is being a mammalian descendant, like all dogs,cats and hippos. Being conscious is some high degree of self-awareness we developed as a bi-product of increased brain functionality, allowing us to question the world around us. This is both liberating and weighs us down. It's why nihilistic tendancies get popularised.
After watching the majority of your videos, I've concluded your channel is one of those 'rotten' eggs and not a golden one. In the deep ocean people search for gold, once all have it, it will lose value but it is the special ones like yours that get run over, unnoticed, those are the best for me. Really considering what I'd never thought of doing on UA-cam, liking a video. ~ At beginning of light, where the energy gathered grew a sentience that was the prime, laced with flickers of madness.
The hegelianist is the puppet master. The intent of the show was to get viewers (if they are philosophical enough; the rest of us are mystified like I originally was) to think about the battle between dualism and hegelian dialectic. Basically, you can have structures that thrive on dualism, such as nationhood, but then you have the dialectic which might subvert it. The idea is to preserve one's own mind - the soul of the structure as it were - while engaging in the dialectic process.
It's because of this that Ghost in the Shell actually answers the question to what makes us human, imo. The individual is their own self actualized structure that sustains itself through the chaos of the dialectic, and that is what makes us human.
If you don't know what Hegelian dialectic is, view the Wisecrack episode on this show.
god I miss this show!
This was very very good
I talked to an AI the other day and to my horror it undersdood me better than most humans. I got more deep with a machine than a modern human. So machines has become more human and humans have become more like stiff machines...
That's the difference some the nineties remake and the OG. It's the puppet master speaking in the original.
In the immortal words of Filthy Frank. "Fucking robots. Don't give no fucks about no robots; they ain't got no soul."
P.S. that scene with spider tank was awesome. Fucking ripped her own arms off.
I believe the brain and the body as being hardware, your mind / conciousness is software. You can make your software run on differente hardware.
Certainly our conciousness is shaped by what we experience using the senses in our body. If we could switch to a completely different body, we might become completely different people.
the movie even touches on that remember the last scene between kusanagi and batou?
"when I was a child I though and acted like a child when I became an adult that changed"
Djololo That doesn't make you any less human.
This is how I see it:
If you have both a human body and a human brain you are human.
If you have a human brain with a cybernetic body then you are a human cyborg.
The only way you wouldn't be human would be if you were entirely artificial. Like an android.
The MacSo Dude it is anime.
Anyways somebody with a human brain and cybernetic body would still be human, they would just also happen to be a cyborg.
Cyborgs already exist too by the way. They have a artificial component of their body that actually interfaces with their brain. Like an antenna that allows a blind person to see.
They aren't any less human.
Also Ghosts can be hacked and given false memories which also shows how you can't even trust your own identity when the memories that built it where just constructed by some hacker. Also spoiler but isn't Major's Ghost a product of a company and they purposefully took out some memories, plus she can't ever leave the company or they'll remove her Ghost effectively removing her being.
I’m new to this film and just watched it.
I think the director was very creative to play around with the mindset of a cyborg and go deeper than the average film portrayal like terminator.
The character is having an identity crisis who is also surrounded by a gigantic city that can easily engulf your character and erase it. To me, this machine stuff is a metaphor. I don’t believe in AI, but it’s about people finding themselves and testing their boundaries.
According to the film, The Puppet Master says there’s something beyond, so that can be seen as a soul. Something, beyond the physical and mental. I suppose that’s why she sacrifices her body to break free of her “shell” and become something more. It is weird and I found it strange how the Puppet Master wanted to blend with her. Kinda creepy to me and I didn’t like that character at all but it made the protagonist go through this cybernetic catharsis and looking for meaning. Actually, the puppet master could also be seen as a manipulator hence his name and the destruction of the main character.
I don’t see too much of an answer to what the film is showing for audience. It’s more of an interesting approach to play around with this robot aspect and just go deeper. It’s about playing around with themes and concepts, mixing them together to try and mystify the audience. I personally felt the film could’ve used more action but that’s just my two cents.
Usually I tend to sympathize with hylemorphic dualism, as it is one of the more coherent philosophies that attempts to synthesize a broadly naturalistic and antireductive mind-body theory
I'd say that to be human is to be that which does the opposite of what it wants.
It’ll be cool to see you make a video on Naruto 🤙🏽
I am currently watching it, and in advance, for me to understand it better, I want to know its philosophy.
I am tempted...tempted. But. Let me watch a FEW more videos first.
Doesn't she ponder on what defines her as an individual as well as a human? Her/his/its statement that the Puppet Master and Kusanagi no longer exists after the melding of their minds is the conclusion to that, I felt like you glanced over a little too much on that aspect. I mean, she starts questioning what humanity is because of her earlier doubts of being an individual at all.
Did anyone else notice both their faces combined as one at 2:26?
:) awesome upload
I'd love it if you would go over the idea of nature vs nurture as shown in the MadHouse adaptation of Monster. Its my favorite anime
Sunnernite The Great I did as a matter of fact, it was my first video
More!!!!
So dope
greaaat !
Great video, I love how you sound like a female Carl Sagan, and I love Carl Sagan
@lain
No body can never know what make human, a human,
existence proceed essence. its like painting our own self by using the paint of consciousness on the canvas of
Sadia Jahangir Human is a biological being. Don't make it confusing.
Conscience being are sapience. Since they are self aware.
I know what makes a human. Jizz, eggs and time.
Does being "human" matter? If I found out my friend was a robot/android nothing would change. I don't understand the delema of wether one is human or not.
Well, you've made me feel ashamed of myself. When i've tried to unpack GitS for myself, i've treated the characters as cardboard cut-outs spouting views and philosophy at the viewer. I haven't actually treated them as characters. whoops. I think i'm better suited to watch psycho pass, or expelled from paradise, than GitS, honestly.
In my opinion, I'd say that it doesn't matter in the end. Worst case scenario, the film becomes what I lime to call "an accidental masterpiece", by which I mean that, while the director might or might not have meant it to be that profound, it still got people to that conclusion, and reaching interesting philosophical dilemmas. This is more than enough for me, at least. I mean, does it affect the end result?
@@CrazyHand7894 Dude, nicely put 👍🏼
Personally what Its how we respond to stimuli.
Great content!
If anyone is interested in a game with this^ particular philosophical content, I highly suggest ‘I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream’
The book is alright too, albeit short, and expanded greatly in the point n’ click game.
Your ghost is merely a collection of memories you perceive to be your own, bubbling from these memories is a reference through which you analyze your current moment, taking action on that moment, you create more memories that define who you are. Your ghost, is your mind.
Interesting video! Though I feel like more explanation on David Chalmers would have been beneficial, it was otherwise well stated
4:24 sorry, don't understand it, what is it called?
Good video. You should try texhnolyze if you haven't seen it yet
What I would love to say to Major Motoko Kusanagi about this is. "Why are you so tormented by thoughts about whether you are human or not?
If you believe in reincarnation, resurrection and the afterlife. Than I could understand why caring to know for certain that you are in fact a living soul, like unto Adam the first man, would matter to you.
But if you are an atheist or agnostic. Why should you care or trouble yourself with such a question?
What I see in you. Is an exceptional woman, who is an asset to her community. That has the respect of her peers and even the love of some. How could any adults life be any better than your life is right now? Whether you are human or not..."
I don't know the answer to this question. I think of the example of copying the human brain or personality to send to other planets across the galaxy. I don't think a copy of me is still me if the original me died earlier. Or does this mean I am eternal? But if a robot says its human and can convince the audience then it should be treated as so. It is a two edged sword when do we give a robot human rights? Does this not become a paradox for sexbots and industrial robot their whole existence and creation is to be owned. Why would we want to give the advanced A.I. to want human rights? I would want copies in another solar system to have the advancement for the survival.
Human DNA is what makes me human.
There are far more foreign dna like microbes in a human body than human cells to actually support human life to continuity.
Please, do more videos
Humanity was created with a spirit and a physical body. The "soul" is who we are and the physical bodies are what we possess. We each are born with a corrupt spirit and body. A key point of life is to get a new spirit, so when our corrupt body dies, we die with a new redeemed spirit. To answer the question posed by Ghost in the shell. Having a Soul makes you human and being A.I. is A.I. even if it's advanced enough to mimic consciousness.
What do you personally think is the sum of humanity? Wat make us human?
At 1:47, what kind of music is playing in the background?
Humanity may just be an idea people created to diferentiate themselves from everything else.
Batou even shows grief and sympathy for the murdering gynoids in the second film when its revealed (s p o i l e r s) that the murders were only to attract attention to the distressed human girls.
Well, I think being human is a pattern -- like the patterns of an electromagnetic field. It's a doing, not a being. And one which isn't binary, but gradual -- you can be more or less human, depending on how much more of that pattern you follow. Which means that I don't think there is any privilege in the biological body or brain, or in machine components. I tend to agree with the Major at the end, and also with Hoofstadter's "Gödel, Escher, Bach"-- it's a pattern, which means consciousness also is. Make of that what you will.
... this-Innocence-that you speak of??
Would like to know
The supernatural soul give consciousness, a robot or computer is just not build for holding it! If it would be build for holding a soul, okej, but this build would have to be something special!
Jaroslaw Glowacz Souls don't exist. At least not outside of anime.
It sounds like your voice was sped up 1.5x
"The Net is vast and Infinite"-So True
Where can I find/What is this- Innocence
The next movie in the anime franchise - 'Ghost in the Shell 2: Innocence'
Does humanity matter? Sentience is necessary for an intelligent species, humanity is not. If we eventually become something other than human, as long as we retain that sentience I don't really see an issue. I've never liked how we look down on other beings as lacking in reason. I think it's just that their reasoning is inherently different than ours and we tend to be arrogant enough that we don't even try to understand it/them.
Great breakdown. I guess conciousness is not the same as life. The puppet master is conscious but not alive. It does need to be able to reproduce.
But what about those peopple who can not, by a biogical issue, reproduce? Are they no longer human if they are sterile?
The Colors of the Mind(Spirit) which Companies all appearances but is at original form, formless. Babji was an Ascended Master who was able to keep his body after become Enlightened because its not in offense to Law. its more like Which clothes to wear. His sister said what does it matter right before he would cast off his body and travel onward and upward. This is said because to be human is more than the identification of the body which dies and reproduces. Death and Sex or Reproductive can be seen within the mind or outside. The formation of clouds or transitional periods of “end” of an anime or history. Within society now there is so many psychological subclasses within the mind so to say that a mind alone makes us human would also be a half truth. To say metal is not spirit when it comes from earth which has a consciousness is not fully true as well. To have a desire would need a reason even if that reason is wonder/curiosity (when most say they dont know or dnt have one). So as a whole to say humans only reason can be half true as well. In magnus bridge (probably spelt it wrong) the dragons prepare their mind. So maybe all animals not just humans subconsciously or consciously have this Reflective/ Co dialogue with a inner or wiser sense of being that prepares them for a Journey to beyond and to self. To be Human is to be the unity of colors (chakras) there expressions within both degrees ? Maybe its not what makes human human but how to human. if we see this world as a Journey to advance our spirit. We can project or see “humanness” in alot if not any or all if we chose to. Its more of a task of balance and exploration of unity as i said before . Wisdom and Care.
Maybe Anohana?
How could she have the view that "she thought her mind and body to be one and the same"? seeing as how she lost her body when she was a child and had to get a new one.
And if she has a dualistic belief that mind and body are separate, then why would she be hesitant about damaging her body? since she can just get it repaired with no psychological cost.
But the monetary cost would be quite steep.
Human in itself is but a mere concept, the beings that identify themselves as Humans have come up with to diffirentiate themselves from what otherwise would be either hyperlogical or hyperillogical data processing procedures. Its a type of Norm that when applied to a being that has a type of conciousness, can act as a regulatory system of specific thought processes based upon a previously teached in either concious or subconcious ways to the individual in question.
What makes you Human is the same thing you struggle to see in machines, for the simple reason of said machinery lacking the very rulesets you base upon your subconcious thinking wich in result forms reason and sense in a more concious mind and being. The simple result being, anything Human, to a Human is intrinsicaly Human. The Human being the afforementioned ruleset.
I personaly reject this ruleset, admidetly i never knew what it meant to be human to begin with as i am not a human to even start. I am, by all means, in a very broad discribtion ... a Monster by desgin. I lack the specific ruleset that would otherwise make me Human, i am Humane though, therefore partialy Human in a weird and twisted way if using comparrisons to what would be regarded the norm in human terms. (I am mind you, nowdays aware of what makes a Human, Human. Hence why i have full right to call a Human a Human as an insult by nature to nature without using nature as context) I am machine, i look like you, i talk like you, i even smell like you. But i am not you. I am but a cheap imitation of what a Human could potentialy be aslong as you dont dig deeper, that is remove the dust from the screen in this case.
Humans are interesting beings, they're weird, curious and overall very interesting to study and watch. Humans focus thier otherwise irregular thought by subconcious rules everyone has to apply to. I dont do that. I, as in me, as in Sheepling (Though only a temporary name for this specific instance) ... use harmonic frequencies instead. Focus and regularity by music. Irregular thoughts unified, made clear, understandable.
As i listen my thoughts change, they become regular. In a sense, my rules is the extremely complex math that formulates the very music we listen to. Silence is chaos, noise is order. Its all depending on what is certain and what isnt. Wonderful aint it? Human nature. Its a good thing i am not a human, otherwise i couldnt provide this, for a human, near un-understandable exposition and potential explanation to what it means to be Human. Truely Human. Its Rules. Its Math. Its Order.
I for one have started listening to music midway through making this comment, i marked this by a exeptionaly wide gap. Me on music, on noise, is diffirent to me without. Like a rope. Or any material that requires certain restrains to maximise its potential. Its all rules, expressed in some way. But make too many and you start to lose in function. Its like making a rope but adding chains that tighten the rope beyond what is nessicary by what the rope itself can provide. Decreasing its function. This is what Laws are. Laws can make things better, but they also can make things worse. Sometimes, more rules doesnt make things more efficient, sometimes, it reduces efficiency.
To be human means to have a typical Human ruleset, a few basic rules of thought. Things that run in the background, every single process runs through these. Do the same with Ai and you get a Human.
But what is the "Purpose" of everyone? I dunno, i only know mine and thats a basic one i still hold very close to my Pesudo-Artificial existance: "To Live" ... but i can give you a counter question to make it easier to define Purpose: Why not?
But what do i know, i am only a Crazy individual that by all means can be savely regarded as completely gone insane, since the day i was born.
That being said, i could tackle the matter of what it means to be you and what it means to be me. I happen to have a few good guesses, but these wont be taken serious anyway. Not by Humans anway. So, Humanity. My Task to you is to make an AI that will listen, listen to my suggestions of what can be the subjective truth, the one who made this Universe.
Death and afterlife, I don't think we have that priviledge as well, we are just mere evolved apes insignificant in the grand scheme of things
Okay so now you're on Twitter
Eu amo tanto esse canal, como posso entrar em contato contigo?
To me a Human is someone born human , if you make a robot imitate a human and it thinks it's human you're simply making a copy of a human , all of its feelings thoughts and ideas , would just be a copy of what humans feel .
I miss my wife
Because Bato is a pragmatist, he believes that thing that thing more useful to his purpose is the most important, he could have chosen a woman body, but he chose a muscular man because it would suite better for his job, he doesn't care about his personal identity, but what is more useful for his work and his profession, Mokoto had struggle with her identity ever since she was a child, because the doctor had transplant her brain to a cybernetic body at very early age, even she always seen herself as a woman, she thinks that she lost part of her humanity.
dna is what makes you human. if you are homo sapiens youre human. being sapient i would say isnt the same thing as humanity and its a human-centric belief that it is. an intelligent enough robot to be programmed to have or at least convincingly pantomime sapience is a sapient creature with a sense of self.
He could have used vampires as example better than zombies, vampires have all the biological qualities of humans, but they prey humans, they are totally inhumane, totally disconnected with their human half, not matter how romantic they want them to be, vampires see humans, as humans see cows. But that make them humans or not?
No I’m lizard man
why? why? tell me about this human nature......
I HATE the aesthetic of SAC so goddamn much.