This is a well articulated lecture on a PA200 Wheel Alignment Machine. I once used a Microline PC 3000 Machine, Hunter D1111 Machine and Hunter PA100 Machine. Currently I am using the PA200 Hunter Aligner. Thank you, Sir for the lecture.
I bought an old hunter machine, had to replace the batteries with some different ones on the heads (had to mount them on the exterior) and managed to get the program to work on a old laptop (pc that was running the program died). Very handy to have at home in my shed for adjusting alignment on my race car.
I'm in a hunter class right now and my instructor is so loud, and speaks so quickly, whilst mumbling. And he's reading from the book and skipping words and not explaining new terms. And just, I really appreciate this.
I’m sorry you’re dealing with that. It must be frustrating. I’m glad my video works for you. Be sure and watch my “Alignment Settings 1and 2” videos to help you understand how to match up settings to symptoms.
You gained a subscriber. Keep making how to videos. You are clearly knowledgeable and a great instructor. Keep making videos and eventually you'll gain a ton of followers/views and make it worth it. Don't give up if people aren't watching at first! Thanks again
A few lil tips. Start the car before depressing brake pedal and let the power brakes help you. Make sure the arms on the heads dont hit the lift when you roll the car for runout. If customer has sterring wheel cover then remove it before locking steering wheel. Check for worn steering parts and air psi beforehand
It was really helpful in order to understand what is being aligned during the process as a customer. I wish you could`ve included rear axles too. Thanks!
There are very few that are adjustable. Hell my 1990 isn't . You have to hammer out a hub, shove plastic shims, test, kick the wall, do it again. One pot hole and it's worse.
Great Video for regular car user like me. Mr. Bruce, it's very hard to find a good alignment shop that does the right way. where are you located? I have 2017 forester 2.5i premium with lane departure warning. do you have any instruction for this model, and does it have adjustments on all 4 wheels or just rear wheels? thank you....Jay
I took my Stinger gt in just because it's been over a year and had new winter tires put on, so figured just get it done, but more car was not pulling left or right and holding the wheel center was fine. After the alignment I have to hold a wee bit left to go straight, or it would pull to the right. I take it back 2 days later, didn't drive it the one day, and they re-do it and its tiny bit better, but still not straight. He showed me the toe is 0 and my rear are in the green, and my front, both camber are just in the red both -1.2 and -1.1 for the right side. but they weren't perfect in the last alignment, but it still rode straight before i brought it in. I'm gonna take it back one more time and see if they'll get it right, or ask for my money back and take it elsewhere. Oh, I don't recall if I saw if he put the brake thing or the steering wheel lock support when he was doing the alignment. if he didn't, I assume this would cause it to be off a bit ?
So just about every time I do an alignment, i do it step by step like in this video. Including the caster sweep after adjusting the rear. But I seem to have the steering off the the left about 11 o’clock. I have the steering wheel locked with the tool. And still the same. A coworker showed me Win Toe and did not use the hold down tool for the steering wheel and seemed to get it straight. I tried and the same result as before. Maybe the way I tighten down the jam nut. When I tighten down the nut I usually have it almost tight but loose enough to make adjustment, then hold the outer tie rod and snug it down. Any tips on keeping the steering wheel straight? I’d like to have my alignments done the first time and not have to roll it back and recheck/ pull it back onto the rack😅
So much easier to stop the vehicle just before the turn plates mount the sensors then do your roll compensation going forward. If you back up off the plates to do the roll compensation then you have to redo your roll compensation and pull forward onto the plates. Which is just a extra un needed step. When you mount your sensors onto the wheel at 9 and 3 you can rotate the head so the reflectors are angled up and then when you roll forward onto the plates the arms end up at 10-11 ish and 4-5 ish and the reflectors will be squared up with the eyes on the head. Just a few tips I’ve learnt in my many years running the same machine Definitely easier and more efficient to stop just off the plate bridges mount sensors and do the roll forward onto the plates. And when doing the castor sweep you’re correct when you do it outside the vehicle cause you should never do the sweep while in the vehicle you want the suspension at full relaxed vehicle weight only . Your weight will make the vehicle lean to that side and throw out your readings. Great video very educational!
I agree the roll-forward-only compensation is easier, but I have not found it to be quicker overall. In a busy alignment shop (like the shops I have operated) the variety of vehicles necessitated a learning curve to get the head positioned just right. Having to readjust the head and then back up and go forward again happened too often, so I just set the machine up to do a rolling back-and-forth compensation. File it under "operator preference." Thanks for the complement and pointing out a different method of compensation.
Hi. Thanks for the excellent teaching. You are saying that you can play with the toe to get the caster below half degree as long as the toe is in the tolerance specifications?
Thanks for the compliment. The toe setting is the most critical for tire wear. It should be adjusted as close to specification as possible. Caster affects pulling and tracking, which are usually secondary concerns to tire wear. When toe is far out of specification, correcting it can have an affect on camber and caster, but you would not normally adjust toe out of specification just to get camber or caster in.
@@bruceo1987 Happy New Year. Hopefully, one day, you will make a video on how to adjust caster and camber. I cannot get to do one to completion at work.
Вы упомянули корректировку рулевой рейки с помощью диагностического оборудования , но не показали это. Интересно было бы посмотреть на этот процесс. Еще интересует момент, если в базе отсутствуют допуски на конкретный автомобиль, если какая-то новая модель. Оборудование позволяет проводить регулировку? П.с. Спасибо за отличное видео)
I am an auto instructor and I will be sharing this video with my students. Do you have a part number for that training tool to manipulated the readings? I would love to use one with my students. Thanks for making this video!!
When the camber is out of adjustment on a car that they say is non-adjustable. Take the through bolt out that holds the strut to the knuckle and use an air tool with a rotary file to open up the holes in the strut so you have some movement. Be careful not to open up the hole in the aluminum or steel steering knuckle. Loosen the bottom bolt, then you have enough movement so you can adjust the camber. If you are in a hurry and only interested in making money because you are working by the job, then you might want to forget about it and run the car outside. Another thing is when you are finished with adjustments, you could move the car around a little on the turn plates and recheck the adjustments. Just doing that might relieve enough stress on the suspension to show a need to fine-tune the adjustments.
Hi Great video! With the front toe you said for the customer benefit you want to match the left and the right. Why is that? When adjusting toe shouldn't you be aiming for the total toe to be equally split for the left and right ?
Yes, And I think we’re saying the same thing. When I say “for the customer” I’m talking about the printout. Even if the customer doesn’t understand alignment printouts, it’s easier for us to explain them when the numbers match from left to right.
Thank you for this video. Did you have the car past the turn plates and then rolled it backwards when you did the rolling compensation? I've seen people have it parked before the turn plates with the sensors on before rolling onto the turn plates. What is correct?
The settings menu and the program allows you to set up rolling compensation in one of two ways: You can line it up on the turn plates, roll it back and then roll it forward back to the turn plates, or you can position it behind the turn plates and just roll it forward onto the turn plates. I believe the back-and-forth method is more accurate.
Thanks for a great video! Do you have any more videos with different types of steering systems? Would like to see more about the interpretations of specs and first screen after compensation. After adjustments is it good to start car and turn steering wheel left and right and recenter steering and checking screen to see if anything changes?
Regardless of the steering system type--most of the basics of alignment interpretation apply. Be sure and catch my two videos "Part 1 Basic Alignment Angles and Effects" and "Part 2 Basic Alignment Settings and Symptoms" for further details. Thanks for the complement.
hi Bruce and thank you for the vid.. how can it not matter @10:03 that the target is centered on the wheel? if the spokes are tapered and the target is below the 'centerline', would throw off the camber for example ? thanks again : )
Hi Jimmy. When you perform the rolling in compensation, it picks up the positions of the sensors and adjusts them automatically. It would be unreasonable to think the technician would put each target perfectly in the center of each wheel, so the machine needs to compensate for that.
Здравствуйте ! Хотел бы добавить к этому видео один совет из своего многолетнего опыта работы. С таким плохим начальным схождением передних колес, после регулировки нужно обязательно делать повторную компенсацию с последующей корректировкой схождения. При большом отклонении начального схождения от нулевого значения компенсация идет с погрешностью.
In most cases, customers will think that performing an alignment makes the car go straight regardless if they have caster issues or not. At the end of the day, the customer is paying to make the car drive straight, and , in most cases, won't understand what's happening. I've had a lot of cases where everything is in the green, Steer Ahead is 0, Thrust angle is 0, and it still pulls left or right. Is there a formula for to adjustments to compensate for the difference in caster to make the vehicle drive straight nonetheless?
so many shops are unable to do this job. If the mechanic locks the steering wheel wrongly all is going to be messed up. Is there supposed to be a level?
I'm looking into purchasing one of these machines- would you possibly be able to tell me the exact model number of the lift & the computer system used in this video?
1) Throughout the alignment process the shop used the lift to raise the car sometimes higher and sometimes lower, does this effects the results or the software knows the height of the lift at all times to compensate? How many shops calibrate the actual machine and how often, or does it self calibrate?
Good morning: How about doing a video of doing an alignment for an old pre 2008 Mercedes E class having a toe out value & shot camber reading?. Regards.
I'd love to, but that takes time and a bunch of vehicles. If I were you I'd cruise UA-cam videos for other who have demonstrated various adjustments as they work through their jobs.
It depends on the number of adjustments provided on the car, how far out the alignment is, and how competent the technician is. An alignment can be as quick as 20 minutes or take an hour or more.
Camber is not adjustable on this car. Sometimes you can get a tiny bit of movement by loosening the lower strut bolts and pulling or pushing on the spindle. That said, .4° is so minor (remember there’s 360° in a circle and this is less than 1°) that there’s probably no symptoms.
Sorry, I see now that your question was about caster, not camber. Caster is also not adjustable on this vehicle. The difference from right to left is less than 1 degree (.7), so may or may not cause a pull. If it did pull, it would be to the lower number (right), and would not wear tires. Since the Camber angles are angled slightly toward a pull to the left, they may offset. To diagnose the caster issue, there are additional measurements that can be made with this machine that can identify other suspension issues. Ultimately though, I doubt a customer would want to spend additional dollars to replace suspension parts for such a slight pull. Thanks for the question.
@bruceo1987 I'm that customer you speak of! I WANT MY ALIGNMENT NEARLY PERFECT! Lol. I deserve it, my whole suspension is fully adjustable. One would think that this is an easy job but nooooo most shops are incompetent and have been use to dealing with customers who just look at the green and so "OK. Thank you for taking my money"
What if I do an alignment take it for a spin and it stills pulls after I made adjustments in the green? Alignment machine needs to be calibrated or any ideas? Just do another alignment lol?
I've been doing alignments for 8 years now. I've only ever adjusted rear camber if adjustable, same with rear toe. Never adjusted front camber or caster, only toe and nobody has ever said anything until I started working at a new shop. Now they want perfect alignments. I was never trained so idk what to do :( are my alignments supposed to be perfect without adding shims or adding aftermarket parts ? Otherwise I'm just going to play around with the sensors.
J JJJ - Doing a correct (not perfect, but correct) is about addressing customer symptoms and reducing tire wear. There are no perfect settings, there is a range of angles that can be adjusted to address a symptom. I would suggest that you ask your employer to invest in you by sending you to training. The best shops do just that.
I always adjust rear camber and toe to be in the middle on bargraphs, or best i can if seized or partially stuck. On most car front ends, from the factory only toe is adjustable. On toyotas, newer honda accords/civics, and many subarus you can adjust the front camber. You click on the little box near the camber and select jack up axle. Carefully lift the front by the subframe and lower to locks if you have space, then let the computer know youve jacked it up. One side at a time, loosen the 2 strut bolts to get the camber better, when you loosen them the wheel will want to fall outwards and will become as positive as it can be. To adjust it negative and dial it in where i want it, i place a pad or something else under the outer half of the tread and partially lower the front end till its where i want it, then tighten bolts, i use my 1/2 impact on a midlevel torque setting, with swivel adaptor and 22mm socket, sometimes 19mm on toyotas anyway, with a same size wrench to tighten. After both sides are set and tight, hit the same small box under camber section again and select lower axle. Lower it and pull down a few times on the front to settle the suspension and tell the machine its lowered. Then finish with the toe. If you dont have a steering wheel level i recommend it, just search amazon for it, saves a lot of stress and time for me, gets steering wheel perfect everytime. The solid axles im not so great at, they are the trickiest to get right.
The gm full size trucks/suvs are easy to adjust camber and caster if they arent seized up, just need patience. You dont want the vehicle that high when you adjust camber and caster because after jacking up front you adjust when standing and access over the tire in wheelwell. you hit the small box under camber and select jack up axle, jack up front end by lifting under lower control arms with rubber pads. Tell machine you lifted it. They have plastic inserts on the alignment cams from the factory, these need to be removed, prybar and hammer does the trick. Then i use my snapon ratcheting swivel head breaker bar and 21mm socket and wrench, loosen up both top nuts and use wrench to turn cams, its a balancing act to dial in camber and caster. Then tighten bolts down TIGHT, i make them as tight as i can im sure i get over 100-150ftlb. Then hit lower axle on screen, lower and bounce front end and tell machine, finalize toe. On durangos/grandcherokees/ram 1500s you lift by subframe/frame like toyota car, loosen 3 bolts on each side on lower control arms and use a massive prybar to pry the lower arm in and out. Im not a fan of this design because you often cant get the camber AND caster where you want, usually a compromise, though i suppose it is much less likely to have adjustments become seized. I tighten arm bolts snug, hit vertical bolt quick with impact, then I torque the vertical bolts and front lower arm bolts to 100lb ft after lowering, the rear arm bolts dont have good access to torque. Im sure theres a official torque spec to look up, i dont know it.
I went to a tire shop that did my alignment.. my steering wheel was slightly to the left and the car pulled a little bit to the right if i remember correctly. The technican did some odd stuff and pushed on the cars four corners to settle the suspension.. that couldnt be correct? After the alignment i did not get the before measurements because something went wrong with the computer or what it was. So i got the after adjustment.. but... now my steering wheel is slightly to the right. Opposite as before :) When i center my steering wheel car turns a little bit to the left. What can cause this? something bad with the suspension or steering components? if so.. what are the most common with this symptoms? I hope the guy that did the alignment had spoken up if the steering ends or anything with that was bad/play. But he might not checked it. He didnt even test drive or check the suspenson/steering. As many other shops do. They test drive and also do some checks of the suspension and steering to see if something is bad. To see if its worth continuing or now with the alignment.
@@bruceo1987 i just looked at my alignment results paper. Ive told you wrong. I have the before parameters and not after :( Dont know if i want to take it bake to that tire shop.. i guess there very competent and all but.. it did not turn out well on my car. If any component are bad steering wheel should be straigt? if isnt that bad components are so bad with play that the steering wheel center line somewat dynamically adjusts as i drive. Dont know if calibrating the BCM/DSTC system are required on my car. In the diagnostic software on computer i can calibrate it but it tells me its only if any components in the brakes or steering are replaced.. like clock spring or brake hydraulic unit.. Can you please check in your software if thats the case? Volvo S40 1.8 2006 maybe its possible to save the specifications from the settings database to a PDF? Would be nice.
@@bruceo1987 booked new alignment at another tire shop for a second try. At least getting my steering wheel center and not to the right slightly. Told them to check suspension and steering parts also for any play or issues. I needs to go to the bottom with this. It's only possible to adjust toe on my car I believe. Camber are fixed with lower control arm. Caster are fixed as well.. I believe. Not sure about camber and caster
@@bruceo1987 alignment are finished now.. Caster are way off. Diffs 1.5 degree. Toe was slightly off front and rear. But not much. Overall ok. But the big concern was the Caster diff front. He said that the lower control arms are the usual component especially when they're not same manufacture and replaced one at the time. 4 degree on the left and about 2 on the right. He said it can be a tweaked subframe also.. who knows. Steering wheel are straight now and that's good. :) he used a level at the steering wheel to achieve a more accurate reading.
I had a really bad alignment the mechanic was using a impact gun to adjust the eccentric bolts. The front tires wore 1/2 down on the sides. The garage verbally agreed to replace tires then the next day said they would not replace them.
Depending on the car, that angle may or may not be adjustable. I’m assuming this is a front wheel drive car. -2° on the rear will likely wear the inside of that tire, however it should be very slow wear, as it’s not a drive tire.
I turn the wheel back and forth (with the engine running) and try to pick the middle as much as possible. Too much play and the vehicle will wander. I report too much play to the customer and recommend a repair.
@@jjjj2411 any bad or wear out front end Suspensions can cause problems. I always lift up the vehicle and inspect all that before I aligned vehicle so customers won’t lose a dime. Not every car will be perfect especially lifted truck with big tires, I’ve been having issue to put on the laser.
I'm not sure of the model number of the machine, but the software that is used on various Hunter machines is called WinAlign. The versions numbers advance as they modify and perfect the process, but the software works on many machines that they have supplied shops over the last 10 years or so.
Yes, actually! A couple of things happen when tightening the tie rods: The tires move and the tie rods move. If you try not to let the tie rods tilt when tightening this will help stabilize the readings. After tightening, you may need to push the tires a tiny bit one way or another to get the screen to show perfected readings for the customer. Do this just prior to printing your report.
You tighten the lock nuts, then you notice it's no longer within spec. so you go back a few times and work out how to set it so that once the lock nuts are done up it's spot on.
The entire reason there is an "acceptable range" is because parts wear differently on each car due to all the moving parts and differences in how people drive. Because of those same moving parts, it is also really difficult to hit EXACT specification numbers while doing an alignment. Moving Caster will change your Camber. Changing Camber will change your Toe. Changing Toe can change your Caster, as you see in the video (Though he didn't remeasure Caster, so his numbers are not accurate). The two main goals while doing an alignment are 1) Keep the tires from wearing out prematurely and 2) have the vehicle drive as straight as possible. Sometimes, you can only achieve one of those things, and you need to discuss it with the customer.
Has hunter never designed a machine where you don't have to move the car after it's racked? At my old job we would just roll them by hand but it's annoying as shit
I went to my dealer today with my Rav 4 with 17k miles on it and they said this system stated that my car is out of alignment. They wanted to charge me $100 for it. I told them no and brought it to another Toyota dealer who put it on their alignment rack and my alignment was perfect. My car was NOT out of alignment. Some Toyota dealers are screwing people out of money because we don't need an alignment.
Some dealers use drive-over equipment that can tell if the toe setting is off. They drive almost every car coming into the shop which generates additional alignment sales. I'm not sure of the accuracy of such equipment but I know the driver needs to be really careful driving over it for it to work.
It’s virtually impossible to get the same results alignment machine to alignment machine. You could have one shop do an alignment drive it couple blocks to another shop have them check the alignment and have their machine say it’s not within spec. And just cause the bars are all green on the alignment printout doesn’t mean the alignment is actually good lol
So in this example, since there is no camber or caster adjustment and only toe, a customer is charged $129.00 for a mechanic to loosen a nut, then turn the spindle to the tie rod a few times, and then retighten the nut. What a racket $$$.
Salve, visto che ritengo Hunter la migliore in assoluto... Come mai la concorrenza ha sul mercato Assetti no contact... È Hunter no... Avendo una tecnologia di accettazione in officina no contact!! 🤔
@@bruceo1987 I figured as much but other than that great video, as someone that’s learning the steps and each car being different in its own way, any new advice I take. Newer cars requiring alignment mode. Had one yesterday.
@15:44 That ride height measurement is wrong and shouldn't be used. Ride Height should be measured from the middle of the front lower control arm bolt attached to the frame/subframe to the ground/lift and from the lowest point of the wheel spindle to the ground/lift. Then subtract the two numbers and you will get your ride height. The vehicles workshop manual will tell you what the correct ride height should be with new/old parts on the vehicle. The ride height should be checked and fixed and entered into the machine correctly before the alignment is done as it will effect the alignment if the ride height is adjusted/fixed afterwards. Measuring the ride height as shown in the video can give bad measurements because the body could be damaged. Always check ride height via the vehicles workshop service manual instructions. And is should be explained to the customer that if there is something that needs to be fixed that will effect ride height, that they should have it done before the alignment to save them $ on having the alignment done again after it is fixed.
This is a well articulated lecture on a PA200 Wheel Alignment Machine. I once used a Microline PC 3000 Machine, Hunter D1111 Machine and Hunter PA100 Machine. Currently I am using the PA200 Hunter Aligner. Thank you, Sir for the lecture.
This is by far one of the best alignment instructional videos on UA-cam thank you
Wow, thanks!
@@bruceo1987 do I have to pay to get the software updated ?
I've been searching for a clear explanation of alignment with the Hunter equipment. Yours is by far and away the best... Thanks very much!
You're very welcome!
Excellent video! I appreciate a clear and informative video! Helped me get my used alignment machine usable
I bought an old hunter machine, had to replace the batteries with some different ones on the heads (had to mount them on the exterior) and managed to get the program to work on a old laptop (pc that was running the program died). Very handy to have at home in my shed for adjusting alignment on my race car.
Nice! I’m sure it’s spot on.
I'm in a hunter class right now and my instructor is so loud, and speaks so quickly, whilst mumbling. And he's reading from the book and skipping words and not explaining new terms. And just, I really appreciate this.
I’m sorry you’re dealing with that. It must be frustrating. I’m glad my video works for you. Be sure and watch my “Alignment Settings 1and 2” videos to help you understand how to match up settings to symptoms.
Thanks Bruce appreciate the video switch jobs to the trades and trying to learn. aloha from hawaii 🤙🤙
Very good explaining and clear. I was having trouble with Chevy S10.
Glad it helped
Great Explanation!
You gained a subscriber. Keep making how to videos. You are clearly knowledgeable and a great instructor. Keep making videos and eventually you'll gain a ton of followers/views and make it worth it. Don't give up if people aren't watching at first! Thanks again
I appreciate that!
Than you very much for your explanation.its was really helpful.
A few lil tips. Start the car before depressing brake pedal and let the power brakes help you. Make sure the arms on the heads dont hit the lift when you roll the car for runout. If customer has sterring wheel cover then remove it before locking steering wheel. Check for worn steering parts and air psi beforehand
I have this same equipment. Love this thing. So fast and accurate. Using WinToe is really up to the technician. I don't care for it myself.
Nor do I.
best alignment video in youtube thanks
very educative. thank you Regards
is very helpful thank you for this video
Great video
It was really helpful in order to understand what is being aligned during the process as a customer. I wish you could`ve included rear axles too. Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
There are very few that are adjustable. Hell my 1990 isn't . You have to hammer out a hub, shove plastic shims, test, kick the wall, do it again. One pot hole and it's worse.
Exellen explanation 😊 thank you
Great Video for regular car user like me. Mr. Bruce, it's very hard to find a good alignment shop that does the right way. where are you located? I have 2017 forester 2.5i premium with lane departure warning. do you have any instruction for this model, and does it have adjustments on all 4 wheels or just rear wheels? thank you....Jay
i love the wrench technique can you do that on a car with rust on the threads and no heat and use the same amount of force that would be splendid
Thank you for this video.
Glad it was helpful!
I took my Stinger gt in just because it's been over a year and had new winter tires put on, so figured just get it done, but more car was not pulling left or right and holding the wheel center was fine. After the alignment I have to hold a wee bit left to go straight, or it would pull to the right. I take it back 2 days later, didn't drive it the one day, and they re-do it and its tiny bit better, but still not straight. He showed me the toe is 0 and my rear are in the green, and my front, both camber are just in the red both -1.2 and -1.1 for the right side. but they weren't perfect in the last alignment, but it still rode straight before i brought it in. I'm gonna take it back one more time and see if they'll get it right, or ask for my money back and take it elsewhere. Oh, I don't recall if I saw if he put the brake thing or the steering wheel lock support when he was doing the alignment. if he didn't, I assume this would cause it to be off a bit ?
That tie rod technique is fantastic!
*rust enters the chat*
nice training easy to understand
Thank you!
Thank you for this vid!
My pleasure!
Does it matter where you go or machine they use at the garage as ive noticed some garages charge more or less 👍🏽
So just about every time I do an alignment, i do it step by step like in this video. Including the caster sweep after adjusting the rear. But I seem to have the steering off the the left about 11 o’clock. I have the steering wheel locked with the tool. And still the same. A coworker showed me Win Toe and did not use the hold down tool for the steering wheel and seemed to get it straight. I tried and the same result as before. Maybe the way I tighten down the jam nut. When I tighten down the nut I usually have it almost tight but loose enough to make adjustment, then hold the outer tie rod and snug it down. Any tips on keeping the steering wheel straight? I’d like to have my alignments done the first time and not have to roll it back and recheck/ pull it back onto the rack😅
Thank you
So much easier to stop the vehicle just before the turn plates mount the sensors then do your roll compensation going forward. If you back up off the plates to do the roll compensation then you have to redo your roll compensation and pull forward onto the plates. Which is just a extra un needed step. When you mount your sensors onto the wheel at 9 and 3 you can rotate the head so the reflectors are angled up and then when you roll forward onto the plates the arms end up at 10-11 ish and 4-5 ish and the reflectors will be squared up with the eyes on the head. Just a few tips I’ve learnt in my many years running the same machine
Definitely easier and more efficient to stop just off the plate bridges mount sensors and do the roll forward onto the plates.
And when doing the castor sweep you’re correct when you do it outside the vehicle cause you should never do the sweep while in the vehicle you want the suspension at full relaxed vehicle weight only . Your weight will make the vehicle lean to that side and throw out your readings.
Great video very educational!
I agree the roll-forward-only compensation is easier, but I have not found it to be quicker overall. In a busy alignment shop (like the shops I have operated) the variety of vehicles necessitated a learning curve to get the head positioned just right. Having to readjust the head and then back up and go forward again happened too often, so I just set the machine up to do a rolling back-and-forth compensation. File it under "operator preference." Thanks for the complement and pointing out a different method of compensation.
Hi. Thanks for the excellent teaching. You are saying that you can play with the toe to get the caster below half degree as long as the toe is in the tolerance specifications?
Thanks for the compliment. The toe setting is the most critical for tire wear. It should be adjusted as close to specification as possible. Caster affects pulling and tracking, which are usually secondary concerns to tire wear. When toe is far out of specification, correcting it can have an affect on camber and caster, but you would not normally adjust toe out of specification just to get camber or caster in.
@@bruceo1987 Happy New Year. Hopefully, one day, you will make a video on how to adjust caster and camber. I cannot get to do one to completion at work.
Вы упомянули корректировку рулевой рейки с помощью диагностического оборудования , но не показали это. Интересно было бы посмотреть на этот процесс.
Еще интересует момент, если в базе отсутствуют допуски на конкретный автомобиль, если какая-то новая модель. Оборудование позволяет проводить регулировку?
П.с. Спасибо за отличное видео)
I am an auto instructor and I will be sharing this video with my students. Do you have a part number for that training tool to manipulated the readings? I would love to use one with my students. Thanks for making this video!!
I was not able to locate it on Hunters website. You might try checking with a Hunter rep.
Thanks!
When the camber is out of adjustment on a car that they say is non-adjustable. Take the through bolt out that holds the strut to the knuckle and use an air tool with a rotary file to open up the holes in the strut so you have some movement. Be careful not to open up the hole in the aluminum or steel steering knuckle. Loosen the bottom bolt, then you have enough movement so you can adjust the camber. If you are in a hurry and only interested in making money because you are working by the job, then you might want to forget about it and run the car outside. Another thing is when you are finished with adjustments, you could move the car around a little on the turn plates and recheck the adjustments. Just doing that might relieve enough stress on the suspension to show a need to fine-tune the adjustments.
Thank you sir I am from India
Hi Great video! With the front toe you said for the customer benefit you want to match the left and the right. Why is that? When adjusting toe shouldn't you be aiming for the total toe to be equally split for the left and right ?
Yes, And I think we’re saying the same thing. When I say “for the customer” I’m talking about the printout. Even if the customer doesn’t understand alignment printouts, it’s easier for us to explain them when the numbers match from left to right.
Best explanation ever got with Hunter
I appreciate it.
For good measure add some copper anti seize to pads and rotors to prevent rusting
is the caster unadjustable for all cars?
Thank you for this video. Did you have the car past the turn plates and then rolled it backwards when you did the rolling compensation? I've seen people have it parked before the turn plates with the sensors on before rolling onto the turn plates. What is correct?
The settings menu and the program allows you to set up rolling compensation in one of two ways: You can line it up on the turn plates, roll it back and then roll it forward back to the turn plates, or you can position it behind the turn plates and just roll it forward onto the turn plates. I believe the back-and-forth method is more accurate.
Of course!
Same painters tape on the wheel will prevent scratching wheels.
nice... thanks !!
Thanks for a great video! Do you have any more videos with different types of steering systems? Would like to see more about the interpretations of specs and first screen after compensation. After adjustments is it good to start car and turn steering wheel left and right and recenter steering and checking screen to see if anything changes?
Regardless of the steering system type--most of the basics of alignment interpretation apply. Be sure and catch my two videos "Part 1 Basic Alignment Angles and Effects" and "Part 2 Basic Alignment Settings and Symptoms" for further details. Thanks for the complement.
*You need to go NTB locations in Richmond, VA. They have Hunter Hawkeye Elites and they can't USE IT CORRECTLY!!!*
hi Bruce and thank you for the vid.. how can it not matter @10:03 that the target is centered on the wheel? if the spokes are tapered and the target is below the 'centerline', would throw off the camber for example ? thanks again : )
Hi Jimmy. When you perform the rolling in compensation, it picks up the positions of the sensors and adjusts them automatically. It would be unreasonable to think the technician would put each target perfectly in the center of each wheel, so the machine needs to compensate for that.
Do you need a lift to use the alignment machine?
Left rear tire seemed a bit flat? maybe that just me
included angle &SAi are out of speck but "camper & caster are within spec !!! What does that mean?
Здравствуйте ! Хотел бы добавить к этому видео один совет из своего многолетнего опыта работы.
С таким плохим начальным схождением передних колес, после регулировки нужно обязательно делать повторную компенсацию с последующей корректировкой схождения.
При большом отклонении начального схождения от нулевого значения компенсация идет с погрешностью.
Agree. I always follow a large adjustment with a tape measure verification.
In most cases, customers will think that performing an alignment makes the car go straight regardless if they have caster issues or not. At the end of the day, the customer is paying to make the car drive straight, and , in most cases, won't understand what's happening. I've had a lot of cases where everything is in the green, Steer Ahead is 0, Thrust angle is 0, and it still pulls left or right. Is there a formula for to adjustments to compensate for the difference in caster to make the vehicle drive straight nonetheless?
so many shops are unable to do this job. If the mechanic locks the steering wheel wrongly all is going to be messed up. Is there supposed to be a level?
Thanks 🙏
Welcome
how to do alignment on mercedes metris hunter alignment don't have specification
Wow. What a god level explanation. Thanks man. Searching for this.
I'm looking into purchasing one of these machines- would you possibly be able to tell me the exact model number of the lift & the computer system used in this video?
Very nice 👌
Thanks so much.
1) Throughout the alignment process the shop used the lift to raise the car sometimes higher and sometimes lower, does this effects the results or the software knows the height of the lift at all times to compensate?
How many shops calibrate the actual machine and how often, or does it self calibrate?
Calibration once per year usually. Plus updated spec libraries and general service.
Can you re print old alignments?
Good morning: How about doing a video of doing an alignment for an old pre 2008 Mercedes E class having a toe out value & shot camber reading?. Regards.
Can you do a video showing camber and caster adjustments in Chevy and dodge trucks ?
I'd love to, but that takes time and a bunch of vehicles. If I were you I'd cruise UA-cam videos for other who have demonstrated various adjustments as they work through their jobs.
show me how do you make alignment on mercedes metris thank you
Very helpful
Glad you think so!
Thx
Don't forget to set the tire pressures
You’re right of course.
Hi, great video..
Can you tell me how long it takes to do wheel alignment with that tool?
It depends on the number of adjustments provided on the car, how far out the alignment is, and how competent the technician is. An alignment can be as quick as 20 minutes or take an hour or more.
Is there a margin of error with Hunter wheel alignment?
Do you just eyeball the leveling of the steering wheel?
I start the car, move wheel back and forth, try to find the middle of the play.
How to I change my setting in my alignment machine to just show degrees, mime shows degrees and minutes and I don't want that, just degrees
Shift the subframe. It will fix caster.
Can anything be done/replaced to correct the right front caster?
Camber is not adjustable on this car. Sometimes you can get a tiny bit of movement by loosening the lower strut bolts and pulling or pushing on the spindle. That said, .4° is so minor (remember there’s 360° in a circle and this is less than 1°) that there’s probably no symptoms.
Sorry, I see now that your question was about caster, not camber. Caster is also not adjustable on this vehicle. The difference from right to left is less than 1 degree (.7), so may or may not cause a pull. If it did pull, it would be to the lower number (right), and would not wear tires. Since the Camber angles are angled slightly toward a pull to the left, they may offset. To diagnose the caster issue, there are additional measurements that can be made with this machine that can identify other suspension issues. Ultimately though, I doubt a customer would want to spend additional dollars to replace suspension parts for such a slight pull. Thanks for the question.
@bruceo1987 I'm that customer you speak of! I WANT MY ALIGNMENT NEARLY PERFECT! Lol. I deserve it, my whole suspension is fully adjustable. One would think that this is an easy job but nooooo most shops are incompetent and have been use to dealing with customers who just look at the green and so "OK. Thank you for taking my money"
When you adjust the wheel in is that positive toe in
Yes
What if I do an alignment take it for a spin and it stills pulls after I made adjustments in the green? Alignment machine needs to be calibrated or any ideas? Just do another alignment lol?
Please watch my other two videos about alignment settings and alignment adjustments. See if the answer isn’t there.
I've been doing alignments for 8 years now. I've only ever adjusted rear camber if adjustable, same with rear toe. Never adjusted front camber or caster, only toe and nobody has ever said anything until I started working at a new shop. Now they want perfect alignments. I was never trained so idk what to do :( are my alignments supposed to be perfect without adding shims or adding aftermarket parts ? Otherwise I'm just going to play around with the sensors.
J JJJ - Doing a correct (not perfect, but correct) is about addressing customer symptoms and reducing tire wear. There are no perfect settings, there is a range of angles that can be adjusted to address a symptom. I would suggest that you ask your employer to invest in you by sending you to training. The best shops do just that.
I always adjust rear camber and toe to be in the middle on bargraphs, or best i can if seized or partially stuck. On most car front ends, from the factory only toe is adjustable. On toyotas, newer honda accords/civics, and many subarus you can adjust the front camber. You click on the little box near the camber and select jack up axle. Carefully lift the front by the subframe and lower to locks if you have space, then let the computer know youve jacked it up. One side at a time, loosen the 2 strut bolts to get the camber better, when you loosen them the wheel will want to fall outwards and will become as positive as it can be. To adjust it negative and dial it in where i want it, i place a pad or something else under the outer half of the tread and partially lower the front end till its where i want it, then tighten bolts, i use my 1/2 impact on a midlevel torque setting, with swivel adaptor and 22mm socket, sometimes 19mm on toyotas anyway, with a same size wrench to tighten. After both sides are set and tight, hit the same small box under camber section again and select lower axle. Lower it and pull down a few times on the front to settle the suspension and tell the machine its lowered. Then finish with the toe. If you dont have a steering wheel level i recommend it, just search amazon for it, saves a lot of stress and time for me, gets steering wheel perfect everytime. The solid axles im not so great at, they are the trickiest to get right.
The gm full size trucks/suvs are easy to adjust camber and caster if they arent seized up, just need patience. You dont want the vehicle that high when you adjust camber and caster because after jacking up front you adjust when standing and access over the tire in wheelwell. you hit the small box under camber and select jack up axle, jack up front end by lifting under lower control arms with rubber pads. Tell machine you lifted it. They have plastic inserts on the alignment cams from the factory, these need to be removed, prybar and hammer does the trick. Then i use my snapon ratcheting swivel head breaker bar and 21mm socket and wrench, loosen up both top nuts and use wrench to turn cams, its a balancing act to dial in camber and caster. Then tighten bolts down TIGHT, i make them as tight as i can im sure i get over 100-150ftlb. Then hit lower axle on screen, lower and bounce front end and tell machine, finalize toe. On durangos/grandcherokees/ram 1500s you lift by subframe/frame like toyota car, loosen 3 bolts on each side on lower control arms and use a massive prybar to pry the lower arm in and out. Im not a fan of this design because you often cant get the camber AND caster where you want, usually a compromise, though i suppose it is much less likely to have adjustments become seized. I tighten arm bolts snug, hit vertical bolt quick with impact, then I torque the vertical bolts and front lower arm bolts to 100lb ft after lowering, the rear arm bolts dont have good access to torque. Im sure theres a official torque spec to look up, i dont know it.
My rear right camber read is -2.14 degrees and shows as red, even after the hunter mechanic was finished. Should this be cause for concern?
The tires look low on Pressure. That may have an effect?
Yes, definitely. This was kind of rushed during a COVID shutdown with no compressors.
I went to a tire shop that did my alignment.. my steering wheel was slightly to the left and the car pulled a little bit to the right if i remember correctly.
The technican did some odd stuff and pushed on the cars four corners to settle the suspension.. that couldnt be correct?
After the alignment i did not get the before measurements because something went wrong with the computer or what it was.
So i got the after adjustment.. but... now my steering wheel is slightly to the right. Opposite as before :)
When i center my steering wheel car turns a little bit to the left.
What can cause this? something bad with the suspension or steering components? if so.. what are the most common with this symptoms?
I hope the guy that did the alignment had spoken up if the steering ends or anything with that was bad/play. But he might not checked it. He didnt even test drive or check the suspenson/steering.
As many other shops do. They test drive and also do some checks of the suspension and steering to see if something is bad. To see if its worth continuing or now with the alignment.
You should take it back so they can correct it. The steering wheel should be straight and it’s totally adjustable.
@@bruceo1987 i just looked at my alignment results paper. Ive told you wrong. I have the before parameters and not after :(
Dont know if i want to take it bake to that tire shop.. i guess there very competent and all but.. it did not turn out well on my car. If any component are bad steering wheel should be straigt? if isnt that bad components are so bad with play that the steering wheel center line somewat dynamically adjusts as i drive.
Dont know if calibrating the BCM/DSTC system are required on my car. In the diagnostic software on computer i can calibrate it but it tells me its only if any components in the brakes or steering are replaced.. like clock spring or brake hydraulic unit..
Can you please check in your software if thats the case? Volvo S40 1.8 2006 maybe its possible to save the specifications from the settings database to a PDF? Would be nice.
@@bruceo1987 booked new alignment at another tire shop for a second try. At least getting my steering wheel center and not to the right slightly. Told them to check suspension and steering parts also for any play or issues. I needs to go to the bottom with this. It's only possible to adjust toe on my car I believe. Camber are fixed with lower control arm. Caster are fixed as well.. I believe. Not sure about camber and caster
@@bruceo1987 alignment are finished now.. Caster are way off. Diffs 1.5 degree. Toe was slightly off front and rear. But not much. Overall ok. But the big concern was the Caster diff front. He said that the lower control arms are the usual component especially when they're not same manufacture and replaced one at the time. 4 degree on the left and about 2 on the right.
He said it can be a tweaked subframe also.. who knows.
Steering wheel are straight now and that's good. :) he used a level at the steering wheel to achieve a more accurate reading.
My alignment guy used a impact gun on the adjustment bolts on a Ram pickup while doing a alignment. Is this a no no or is it ok.
Honestly it depends which bolts. You can snug bolts with an impact, then use a torque wrench to tighten. Adjust settings with an impact? Usually not.
I had a really bad alignment the mechanic was using a impact gun to adjust the eccentric bolts. The front tires wore 1/2 down on the sides. The garage verbally agreed to replace tires then the next day said they would not replace them.
what if the hunter machine doesn’t have a car’s dataset? does it still work?
Yes. You can look up the specs on most any vehicle and enter them manually. After that the machine will work from that dataset just as it were stored.
Thanks Freddie Roach
My rear right camber read is -2.14 degrees and shows as red, even after the hunter mechanic was finished. Should this be cause for concern?
Depending on the car, that angle may or may not be adjustable. I’m assuming this is a front wheel drive car. -2° on the rear will likely wear the inside of that tire, however it should be very slow wear, as it’s not a drive tire.
How do you address the slop in the Steering wheel when you are leveling it?
I turn the wheel back and forth (with the engine running) and try to pick the middle as much as possible. Too much play and the vehicle will wander. I report too much play to the customer and recommend a repair.
@@bruceo1987 what can cause too much play?
@@jjjj2411 Loose steering box/rack. Loose steering parts.
@@jjjj2411 any bad or wear out front end Suspensions can cause problems. I always lift up the vehicle and inspect all that before I aligned vehicle so customers won’t lose a dime. Not every car will be perfect especially lifted truck with big tires, I’ve been having issue to put on the laser.
Are you in new jersey
What hunter model are you using?
I'm not sure of the model number of the machine, but the software that is used on various Hunter machines is called WinAlign. The versions numbers advance as they modify and perfect the process, but the software works on many machines that they have supplied shops over the last 10 years or so.
Any tips on when ur locking down the nut to not throw off ur toe measurements lol?
Yes, actually! A couple of things happen when tightening the tie rods: The tires move and the tie rods move. If you try not to let the tie rods tilt when tightening this will help stabilize the readings. After tightening, you may need to push the tires a tiny bit one way or another to get the screen to show perfected readings for the customer. Do this just prior to printing your report.
Could you find out the model number of your hunter machine?
worn components like a ball joint effects the settings how?
Play in any part allows variance in the settings. You can adjust the settings, but when you drive down the road the settings will change.
👍👌👍👌👍👌👏👏
You tighten the lock nuts, then you notice it's no longer within spec. so you go back a few times and work out how to set it so that once the lock nuts are done up it's spot on.
can someone tell me why alignment shops don’t hit the zero mark on all wheels but they leave it at within the range?
Because they are lazy!!! Plain and simple.
The entire reason there is an "acceptable range" is because parts wear differently on each car due to all the moving parts and differences in how people drive. Because of those same moving parts, it is also really difficult to hit EXACT specification numbers while doing an alignment. Moving Caster will change your Camber. Changing Camber will change your Toe. Changing Toe can change your Caster, as you see in the video (Though he didn't remeasure Caster, so his numbers are not accurate). The two main goals while doing an alignment are 1) Keep the tires from wearing out prematurely and 2) have the vehicle drive as straight as possible. Sometimes, you can only achieve one of those things, and you need to discuss it with the customer.
@@TomFooleryGaming ah... I see. Thank you for sharing the information. Appreciate it.
Hi bud i got few questions anyway i can could contact you ?
If you want to comment on a video clip privately so that only you and the uploader can see the comment, use the UA-cam private message feature.
Has hunter never designed a machine where you don't have to move the car after it's racked? At my old job we would just roll them by hand but it's annoying as shit
Please,can you take someone on apprenticeship?
I went to my dealer today with my Rav 4 with 17k miles on it and they said this system stated that my car is out of alignment. They wanted to charge me $100 for it. I told them no and brought it to another Toyota dealer who put it on their alignment rack and my alignment was perfect. My car was NOT out of alignment. Some Toyota dealers are screwing people out of money because we don't need an alignment.
Some dealers use drive-over equipment that can tell if the toe setting is off. They drive almost every car coming into the shop which generates additional alignment sales. I'm not sure of the accuracy of such equipment but I know the driver needs to be really careful driving over it for it to work.
It’s virtually impossible to get the same results alignment machine to alignment machine. You could have one shop do an alignment drive it couple blocks to another shop have them check the alignment and have their machine say it’s not within spec. And just cause the bars are all green on the alignment printout doesn’t mean the alignment is actually good lol
You don't know who was wrong though
So in this example, since there is no camber or caster adjustment and only toe, a customer is charged $129.00 for a mechanic to loosen a nut, then turn the spindle to the tie rod a few times, and then retighten the nut. What a racket $$$.
Salve, visto che ritengo Hunter la migliore in assoluto... Come mai la concorrenza ha sul mercato Assetti no contact... È Hunter no... Avendo una tecnologia di accettazione in officina no contact!! 🤔
i done without nothing no measurement just guess it’s works buts it never perfectly correct
Looks like my auto class at chaffey
It is.
those tires look really flat, pretty sure that messes with the alignment as well. hence the tires not being at correct ride height or psi.
You are correct. Ride height via proper inflation is important in the process. This was a Covid-rushed video so I skipped some of the prep.
@@bruceo1987 I figured as much but other than that great video, as someone that’s learning the steps and each car being different in its own way, any new advice I take. Newer cars requiring alignment mode. Had one yesterday.
@15:44 That ride height measurement is wrong and shouldn't be used. Ride Height should be measured from the middle of the front lower control arm bolt attached to the frame/subframe to the ground/lift and from the lowest point of the wheel spindle to the ground/lift. Then subtract the two numbers and you will get your ride height. The vehicles workshop manual will tell you what the correct ride height should be with new/old parts on the vehicle. The ride height should be checked and fixed and entered into the machine correctly before the alignment is done as it will effect the alignment if the ride height is adjusted/fixed afterwards. Measuring the ride height as shown in the video can give bad measurements because the body could be damaged. Always check ride height via the vehicles workshop service manual instructions. And is should be explained to the customer that if there is something that needs to be fixed that will effect ride height, that they should have it done before the alignment to save them $ on having the alignment done again after it is fixed.