Completion Of The Fixture For the Mazak
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- Опубліковано 4 вер 2024
- Finish machining of the special fixture for the Mazak Integrex. I show in this video the real life in the machine shop. Its not just all fancy tools and everything is ready to just push the start and let it run. To make one part you never have the tool in the changer you want. You have to set new tools.
Note !!!!!! In the video I saw and called out some numbers wrong. The distance with the Haimer probe to the centerline on the center, That should have been 1.2475 but actually read 1.2457 with the probe. I reversed the 5 & 7. This caused a error of .0018" to high (fortunately). I have gone back and shaved off the .0018" to the proper depth. I didn't realize this till I reviewed the video clips.
In this video I saw and called out the height from center with the Haimer Probe. It was really 1.2457 but should have been 1.2475, I reversed the 5 & 7. This caused a error of .0018" to high on the -.1875 target dimension I was shooting for. I have gone back and faced the .0018" to the proper location. I didn't realize my error until I reviewed the video clips.
Very common human error. I hate when I mean to come down .001 on a bearing fit and punch in -.01 lol there’s one machine in our shop that has a sticky 0 key that you really have to pay attention to make sure it took the zero on the screen because probably 30% of the time you have to redo it because it doesn’t take. I hate when that happens!
I was going to ask what the tool you were using to rough the fixture was. Looked like it ran pretty quiet even though you were taking a decent cut. I also noticed your Haimer doesn't retract right to zero or maybe this is just the camera angle. I was getting a bit of an error on mine after using it for a couple years and had to adjust it so it returned to zero. I also, like you, do not like using them as indicators. I have had them either break or unthread and throw the Z off. Even with only 5 thou preload I have seen the ceramic stem break.
@@norandavis856 Too expensive to replace the keypad pcb?
@@maxvillemachine652 I didn’t say I didn’t like the Haimer. What I was referring to is. I see people using them to sweep in things like a test indicator. What I said is I don’t think they are good for this purpose. I do like the tool for its intended purpose. It isn’t necessary that the Haimer reads zero in the relaxed state. It has to be aligned with centerline when reading to the deflected zero. In the Z axis you measure it’s length in the depressed zero state. I have never had trouble with it this way.
Can you show exactly how you zero your tools on this? Are you just checking offset, or setting the offset?.. I notice that you will bring the milling tool down to the part, and then you'll reach your hand in and use some choice of gauge block; But how are you progressing the machine? Is there a dial that you're turning manually, or is there a button that is simply adding small step increments? Please show the zero process a little closer when you get time, if you would please.
And here i was making vise jaw blanks today. Talk about feeling insignificant lol impressive fixture.
its all relevant. and they your jaws came out good, you should feel accomplished!
@@mtraven23 oh i know i was just poking fun at myself a bit. I've worked on some big impressive difficult stuff. Just so happened the day this video posted with his rather impressive fixture i was just plinking out some soft jaw blanks to have on hand.
Peter, I'm so glad you've chosen to release long form videos. These are still SO GOOD. I feel so luckly that someone with your experience is generous enough to share your proccess with me.
This fixture will still make a fine coffee table, just as long as you can get some glass cast to fill the hole.
eee
arabler
He could probably mill some 1/2" plexiglass to fit the top. Lol
You are getting really creative with the camera angles there. Too bad we won't get to see the finished product.
Having spent almost all my time building one of a kind parts with manual machines, I still marvel at how completely "integrated" you and these machines are. Thank you again for letting us watch you go this far on this job.
It will always amaze me that the machine knows where the end of the tool is, especially considering the complex geometry of all those axis's
Fantastic work Peter. That fixture is very impressive 👍👍👍
Your tail stock was 2.495. Half that is 1.2475. But the read out was 1.2457.
Yes I didn’t realize this error until I reviewed the video. .0018” fortunately not enough to matter. But I will go back and correct it.
Ya he just said it backwards, no big deal
@@EdgePrecision Dyslexia rules K O !!!
@@EdgePrecision okay...I make mistakes like that all the time. I was just trying to figure out if I was thinking wrong.... Awesome work though. Love the videos!!
Thanks for taking us along. As cool and interesting as the parts themselves would be to see, I'm grateful you shared (and were able to) this fixturing setup and how you're approaching the workholding
Being able to watch the making of the fixture has been a joy. You camera takes were perfect. Now we respect the limitations and imagine the finished part. Thank you.
Thank you for your time & dedication to the trade.
I'm pretty new to machining. Only about 2.5 years out of school but I do have my own little shop, A Smithy mill/lathe with a 13 or 14" swing, & a cheepo desktop cnc mill that can do aluminum, an old Atlas mini-lathe, horizontal bandsaw & all the tooling to do the basics ...rotary table, boring head & such.
Watching this channel is almost pornographic by comparison. But it's nice to see what I might accomplish eventually. It's truly awesome to watch. Thank you once again, for making this content.
Sir, I want you to know that I respect you. I can relate to your intelligence, I wait and I wait for a video from you. You Sir are very unique. You are well above the rest of society, you are truly special. Thank you Sir for letting me relate and tag along.
Great Work, super well designed fixture, I can relate with the satisfaction of seeing something well done, but here you can see a true master , thank you for sharing Pete!
Imagine making the best CNC videos and having fans in Romania!
i thought i saw the position screen on the haimer from the live center measurement was 1.2457 not 1.2475.. stopped video to comment while i had it in mind. great video as always though. hope i am wrong on what i saw.
You know I think your correct. I will need to check this. .0018” difference. Not really enough to give me a problem on the parts tolerances but it might be worth checking and correcting. I’m reversing my numbers. I have already made the setup parts and they were in tolerance but it might be better if this off to correct the small error. Thanks I just didn’t see it! I bet I’ll get a lot of comments on this.
I noticed that too, glad it's not a problem!
I was yelling at the screen :-) Glad it's not enough to be an issue.
I've inverted numbers more times than I care to admit, a few with bad results, yikes. Glad it's not enough to hurt your process flow. Always look forward to your videos. Hope it remains worth your while to keep them coming. Nice job.
I get all caught up in the making of the jig, and when it's finished... nothingness... emptiness. 😪
Peter, once again beautiful work, love hearing the thought process.
That series of videos was really good. I liked the way you made the brackets and side supports to hold your work during the machining process. Another great series of projects you have showed us. Great work and I really enjoyed watching and listing to the way you do different things. The brackets and side supports really came into focus during the last video.
I agree with the below comments. I like these long videos that have lots of details. Excellent as usual Peter!
YES! my favorite video to date! awesome to see your full process. keep them coming guys
amigo peter..tu profesionalidad es sin duda muy grande..gracias por compartir tu forma de trabajar la cual me gusta mucho..un saludo y gracias por tu tiempo
Someone once told me that the customer may not always be right, but the customer is always the customer.
It's a shame you couldn't take us along for the rest of the job, but this was still interesting, so thanks for showing us what you were able.
Thank you very much for the video and all those running steps , very helpful and educational
Damn I really wish we could see the part made on this fixture! Nice work!
It is amazing how much effort and thought you put into that fixture! It feels like it is a lot more than the real product. Could you please give a little comparison on the time&effort spent for a) construction&CAM of the fixture, b) machining of the fixture, and c) actual machining of the product?
Thanks, Hansi
That roughing tool for making the large window has a seriously high MRR! What kind of DOC and stepover is that thing taking??
I” depth of cut and .450” step over. Or radial cut depth.
The beauty of an insert end mill.
That was impressive! Did you get Spielberg to direct all of those cool camera shots and editing? Excellent work.
Even the fixture looks so freaking damn good. I can’t even imagine what the final part gonna look like. It’s a pity that we can’t see that
I learn so much just from sitting back and watching your videos, Peter. I'm using the gauge pin setting trick even on my manual mill.
The old way was using fag ( cigarette ) paper, it was always a thou thick, so you'd just nip it between the tool and work piece and know that you were still 1 thou away, but not many people smoke at work anymore...
Whoever does not follow your channel.. will drown in ignorance .With respect to all .
i completed a fixture.. then put the 316 material in to cut and broke all my tools! lets go brandon!
This is my favorite machining channel. Camera angles, machining, oops!.. blacksmithing (did anyone see that?) This guy's got talent all over the place. A frickin showoff. I like it.
I would like to do more blacksmithing. But it's not really what this channel is about. I can and have done quite a bit of wood working in my past. I use to build boats for a living. I worked for Gulf Coast Sailboats when I was 18 years old for about 5 years. I built three boats for the owner and also did Pattern making (Molds) for the fiberglass components and boats they made.
More and different camera angles than usual, nice!
Also that second tool really is a chipmaker, love it.
You said 1.2475 but display said 1.2457 at 16:15. Source of error?
You know I didn’t realize this until I reviewed the video. I reversed the 5 and 7 a .0018” error. It won’t cause a problem with the part. But I think I will correct it anyway. Or maybe I read the mic wrong in the video. Now you got me thinking. Because I checked this a couple of times. This is one thing working by yourself. You can be thinking one thing and not realizing a mistake.
@@EdgePrecision Transposition errors were a pain in the butt, back in the day when I worked for a bank and did the proof processing of all the tellers' transactions.
You make some pretty impressive fixtures and always give me ideas of better ways to fixture parts. Thanks for posting stuff like this.
I like the spindle mounted cam. First time I've seen out of the Mazak.
1:20 this move stopped my heart for a second :D
That's one hell of a nice fixture to make keychains.
I wonder did you check flatness after clamping and re clamping the tailstock a few times to see if force variance bowed it any?
I’m sure there is a influence because it is above the edge of the plate. I don’t want to do that now. But if I ever remount the fixture I can adjust the pressure until the fixture indicates flat as possible. I did turn the pressure down when I first mounted in anticipation of this issue. Thanks.
Dang ..... locked out of some wide viewing 5 axis milling. Maybe next time. Thanks for sharing the fixture. She's a beauty!
Thanks for taking us along the journey. I really appreciate the explanations you provide along the way. Great job!
great work pete, that fixture had the same work put into that some actual works would take, nice job
Measuring on rough and adjusting is one of nicer tips out there. I used to do that many times.
Really enjoyable series. Too bad we don't get to see part, but then that is very common at where I used to work at. Many confidential designs.
Bloody marvellous, cheers from Australia
Great work if i lived near would never be away thanks for all the videos
thanks for the insight into some of your work, It is always fascinating for me. I hope to able to apply some of what you have showed here on your channel one day at my work.
Great job Pete. Thank you for sharing your great work experience with us. You are a passionate teacher. Keep it up!!
Helluva fixture. Thank you for showing it. Doesn't matter you can't show the actual part. Fixture is more important.
I wish I had a 1/4 of the talent this man does.
Very interesting series. Thanks for letting us see what you could.
What a gorgeous fixture. Great work.
Completely insane the amount of work going into the fixture. Not quite sure they won't let you show the rest of the rudder fin being made though. ;)
Love your videos, thanks for all the work to share with us. Oh man I’d love to see that machine doing some fancy 5-axis dancing
First word out of my mouth when you held that indexable mill to the camera? “PHHAAAWWWW”
You could tell we were about to see some truly mega hogging of material. 😂
Excellent work as always. You get to make some interesting parts. Looking forward to the next series!
I like all the different camera angles. I know it takes a lot of stopping to keep moving it around like that.
Great fixture !
I hope that one day I will have the opportunity to do the same on my I200
Awesome video camera work 👌
A lot of work getting all those camera angles, thanks for sharing. Charles
That is some really complicated and cool part .
you're like the "silent place" of machining channels...and I love it! not that I don't appreciate the occasional verbal explanation you give.
Is that because I don't say Boom every third sentence?
@@EdgePrecision i just like that you are comfortable with silence and instead "rely" on creative camera angles & good workmanship.
totally agree on the 3D taster usage! running it on the surface especially on milled surface compared to ground surface cus the stylus wears out and gets a flat spot on it, when i must use it like this to sweep over a surface i only tension the indicator as little as i can by only pressing it into the surface by 0,1mm that way the spring forces aren't that high on the stylus so in theory less wear, but the spring is pretty thin inside the taster so it isn't making a ton of difference cus the spring force is pretty much the same when pressed in -4mm or -0,1m. it is best to avoid at all indeed.
My main objection is when I see people indicating a vise in for instance. It lakes sensitivity because of the high stylus pressure it has. It is good for what it was designed for and really useful for that. But say a Interapid indicator is so much better for checking alignment of things.
Some fancy camera work! My compliments.
You're getting pretty fancy with those camera angles, Peter! Keep up the good work, I always enjoy your videos!
Beautiful work of machining , thank you for sharing with us!
I love how this machine keeps discarding its tool through that little window and you have to keep feeding it new ones.
It’s putting them in the tool magazine. I’m just changing them as the program calls them. It’s just the way I do it on a new setup. It would be possible to set up all the tools beforehand than run them. Just two different ways.
@@EdgePrecision Oh I know, just a daft joke lol. What happened at 8:55? bad cutter or just no coolant?
I thought it would run for the video with no coolant. I don't really have any endmills for aluminum. These endmills have a coating for steel and the aluminum welds itself to it at high temperatures. It would have been OK with coolant.
@@EdgePrecision Thanks for the reply! It's amazing how much different it makes.
So many camera angles :O Thank you.
Thank you Peter!
That's some seriously interesting machining!
Too bad we can't see the finished product in use.....
Very awesome fixture
Great set of videos. Really wish we could see the finish part, but I do get it we have NDA’s at work not allowing us to show any parts on social media
That's cool thanks very interesting
master class nothing less
You're a legend!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
fabulous work by the way
Very interesting. Stout fixture, indeed.💪👊👍
Looks like a piece of art. :-) Love your videos
That was a fun watch series.
Says right on the box for the Haimer that it's designed to measure flatness as well as everything else. No worries there.
Just the thing for a Friday evening!
.... super, Spitzensfacharbeit👏👏, ein Gruß von Tschechien 🙋
That's the trouble with all this top secret sh1t it always ends on a cliff hanger :-(
You should feel lucky he shows you this much. Most shops are very secretive.
PETER PETER PETER
Hey buddy, many of us are still avidly curious about how much pressure is applied by the compound threads in your custom toe clamps!
We're very curious!
Please do something - anything - to compare your compound screws to normal ones.
Thank you Peter!
We all love your stuff!
Art. :)
I’m working on a setup to compare my clamp to the others.
@@EdgePrecision THANK YOU! :)
You make the coolest stuff.
so is this fixture for a specific part, or general purpose?
not saying I know better by any means, but why aluminum? on such a big machine, i would have thought you'd go with steel or cast iron? was there a need for it to be light?
Yes it's for a specific part but I can't go into what the part is or does. Customer wont allow it. As far as the aluminum. It is plenty strong enough for this part. It's only real purpose is to allow machining from both sides all in the same setup with all the different angles this part has. This setup will require some 5 axis positional movements to face certain areas on both sides of the part.
@@EdgePrecision thanks you, and great work per usual!
Another awesome video thk u ...so is the customer responsible for the fixture or would that be down to u for making the part 🤔 thks
The cost is covered in the cost of the parts.
Nice work, Pete!!!!
Seems a lot of work for 10 pieces, but they're likely high value items so worth it. Curious if the client paid separately for the fixture, or was that absorbed in the margin for the 10 pieces?
Is it not the same thing regardless?
I do primarily small quantity work. Anything over 10 parts is a large run for me. The customer is always paying for my fixturing work. Sometimes I will itemize it on a quote, other times it gets rolled into the per part price. At the end of the day, the total bill is the same regardless of how its itemized.
@@siraig not the same thing if the client expects the fixture to be delivered with the 10 pieces. If the shop owns the fixture it could be repurposed for other projects if there were no repeat orders.
@@paulhammond7489 well yes, if they expect it to be delivered I see your point. Your original question was vague and did not specify that part.
I regularly charge my customers a line item for fixturing, they do not get said fixture at the end. But then again, no one has ever asked!
@@siraig I've seen a couple of 'battles' over fixtures in the distant past regarding ownership of a fixture when the customer wanted access to 'his fixture' as 'he'd paid for it'. That was so he could use a different workshop for repeat work. You can probably imagine neither party really won the argument. I've also seen workshop stores stuffed with fixtures that haven't been used in years.
Not a machinist, but been involved in a few projects with really expensive fixtures. The customer in that case paid a separate machine shop to make the fixture. I am pretty sure once all the machining is done the customer will take the fixture back and probably scrap it.
beautiful works!!
Dam good job young man !!
When you have such a giant hole like that (in the first 5 minutes).. It sure seems like it would make more sense to roughly mill the outline of the hole (leaving room for fishes passes); leaving only a few tabs holding the center plug, and just cutting them with a hacksaw, and saving that huge piece of material in the center for other projects, and you save wear on the tool.. and also reduce some of the chip waste disposal. Idk, maybe there's a reason you don't, but I would not like having to mill out that much material, if it's possible to save the center waste.. Any thoughts on this?
I guess when you're getting though as much material as he does, saving a odd shaped piece of scrap isn't so important, but to hobby machinist a lump like that would be a prized find at a scrap dealer.
Bravo! Maestro
It's an aluminum shoe insert for the Jolly Green Giant.
How do you avoid sine errors when touching off each tool with a round pin on round surface of the fixture? Also the centre of most endmills is usually concave so I touch off on the corner? Thanks.
I’m am touching on the corners of the endmill. When doing it on a round OD you rotate the tool/endmill till when it’s touching the tips but the pin won’t quite go thru. You can feel when it’s hitting both tips. Now back the pin off a little and rotate the endmill. Keep trying the pin until it runs parallel to the OD your touching off on. Once you get the flutes aligned carefully jog up in the .0001 mode until the pin just passes thru. Don’t ever jog down with the pin under the tool. If you go to far move the pin away and jog down and try again. If the tool has a odd number of teeth you have to rotate the tool back and forth until you find the lowest point of the tool. You can in this video see me doing this on the inserted roughing tool with three flutes.
@@EdgePrecision Thanks, it's hard to see all that in the video.
Good lawd Mazak must be proud of you. May I please send you my resume ?
Hi. Tell me, wasn't it easier to handle inclined surfaces in five axes? it's much faster and cleaner than rolling out with a radius. Do you have the possibility of 5-axis machining, or are there some flaws and it does not always work?
From that side there are clearance issues with the B axis spindle and the head stock area of the machine cabinet. Now I could have come from the other side maybe. The B axis is tipped away but the C axis would have to be rotated. It would have required a tool extension. Because of the tip of the B axis to get the angle at the sharp end of the cutout. It might have made better video content. But I just didn’t do it. I wanted to keep things simple. Sort of just get the job done.
amazing......
After running a variety of Mazak machines for years I am wondering why the hand loading of tools and no measuring eye or even a Renishaw probe for that matter?
This machine has both a laser tool setter and a tool eye. The laser hasn't worked sense I bought the machine. And I haven't bothered to fix it. The tool eye on this machine is very difficult to use. The control doesn't have a jog pendent extension. With the control all the way forward to the chuck end of it's travel on the tracks. It is very difficult to reach the handle jog and be observing the location of the tool on the deployed tool eye. It is way up there where the tool change door is when deployed/folded down. It is actually easier and faster to manually touch off the tools. Also I get a verification of the tools actual position in relation to my setup, witch I like. I do have a Renishaw spindle probe. And have shown it in a few videos on this machine. I mostly us it in in process probing. For setup and things like I shoe in this video I prefer to us the Haimer probe. I don't feel on a mill turn machine like this there is much advantage to using the Renishaw probe to set a fixture offset in just the Z axis. As most all of the setups on this machine have the X and Y offset already a zero. Maybe there would be a use to set C zero if I was running a lot of parts that required that. But most all my work that isn't necessary. In the case of this setup once set it doesn't change for the next part. And I also prefer to run the indicator over things anyway. A probe only hits in a few points. It doesn't really give you a feeling of the actual shape of things like a dial indicator does. But that's just my preference. I always prefer a analog mechanical dial indicator to a digital device. And the batteries don't run down.
@@EdgePrecision Thanks for the reply. Only time I have ever used a manual dial in a Mazak is for setting up a part. It all goes off of the wpc I am currently running a very old H-800 and while not a true 4 or 5 axis machine it still runs pretty good. Mazak makes good machines for sure.
Do you keep all these fixtures for one-off jobs in storage in case the customer re-orders the parts?
Yes I keep all fixtures.
@@EdgePrecision Honestly I wouldn't mind paying an entrance fee just to tour the Edge Precision Museum of Fixtures.
I was thinking that would be a great piece of shop art to hang on the wall.....maybe add to the 50k subscriber giveaway....hint hint..... :)
When sneaking up on a final dimension with an endmill is there a minimum cut you should take, and is this different for side milling and facing? Great channel thank you.
In aluminum no you can pretty much do as you like. The cut depth has more to do with finish in mild steels. As you say the facing cuts are different than milling with the side of the tool. In mild or softer steels you want to take a deeper finish cut on the facing cuts to leave a better finish. Also possibly increase the speed as well. A tip radius if possible will help this too. I usually program around .010” on the face and .005” on the side for finish cuts.
I greatly enjoy watching your videos so this is by no means supposed to be criticism. Watching the video I came to thinking what could be done to improve video conditions when shooting with coolant. Your airblade seems to be effective in removing the coolant directly in front of the camera, but it can't do anything about the coolant droplets in the air reflecting the light back into the camera and creating a "white out" condition. Have you ever tried a polarization filter? It should be able to remove some of the reflections on the droplet surface when adjusted correctly. Just an idea. For this to have a chance of success the critical light sources would probably need to be the same type meaning emitting light with identical polarization.
There is actually very poor lighting inside the machine. The GoPro cameras I use aren't very good in low light. On top of that one of the LED light fixtures in the machine isn't working as well. If I could improve the lighting and figure a way to hold such a filter with my cameras enclosure it might be worth a try. Thanks.