If this is the same Ed Soph I'm thinking of, then thank you for what you do. Your methodologies have helped my playing tremendously. Hope you have a good day.
Ed Soph! I was literally looking for some of your grip technique videos yesterday to show to a student. I've been using them for a number of years to help explain relaxed grip concepts but it looks like they've been taken down as I couldn't find them and the old links I had didn't work. Thankyou for the words and demonstrations, they have helped both me and my students for years.
This is great! As an Alexander Technique teacher, I am always thinking of the full range across a tension spectrum - sometimes I see that the word "tension" increases my students' tension because of their deep desire to relax! Sometimes it can be helpful to think of tension as "muscular tone" rather than tension--it can feel easier to work with it, rather than something to "deal" with it.
This is an excellent video and I am glad you addressed the fallacy of playing with absolutely no tension at all. I can only speak as a percussionist but we need certain degrees of tension, as you say, to execute certain things. A super important thing I have found that helps as a teacher (and performer) is stressing the difference between forearm, wrist, and fingers. A solid understanding of when to use what and in what combination really goes a long way in finding the minimum amount of tension required to get the best sound.
My drum teacher of the great Freddie GRUBER Always used to tell me you’re just hanging onto the sticks let the sticks do the work! you control the pressure and the rhythmic phrase but you’re just Allowing the sticks to interact with the drum head by just loosening your muscles you literally have to consciously tell your arms hands fingers etc. to relax and they will! Also one’s personality Has a lot to do with if they play with a lot of tension or not!
Great job, Rob. Thank you for all the content you upload here! For me, the key element is to avoid all unnecessary tension. As the great cellist Emanuel Feuermann used to say: "If a muscle doesn't make music, don't use it." Best regards from a Brazilian fan.
Here’s my contribution to drummers… The stick I’m using is a maple tapered neck stick with a fat bead. I’ve found that thicker sticks relax my hand and maple is a lighter wood. For me, the heavier the stick, the more force I need to grip and that then pulls me away from relaxing my grip. The grip I use (matched) is over hand, ultimately full stick contact with my thumb. For warm up I have a fundamental grip that could considered like a long tone grip. I return to this fundamental grip if things are getting too tight during practice. I rest the stick loosely at the base of my middle finger and turn the wrist for singles that rebound the wrist for each strike. I don’t use a metronome but allow the speed of the singles rebounding to flow in speed according I’m experiencing. I do this warm up while seated. While seated, I begin on other transitions, singles to doubles and rudiments (Gaddiments are good). The more relaxed my hands and arms are while playing the more I find my legs, shoulders and hips tense. I have found that centering tension away from my limbs is possible by focusing on my abdomen, pulling it in. This then supports my upper body and allows my hips and shoulders to relax. So, here’s the idea I’m heading towards, I’m looking for a base line of of relaxation that is clear to me whenever I play. One more thing... When I do the fundamental grip singles warm up, I've noticed that the sticks resonate with a pitch or sing so to speak. This "singing" from my sticks confirms to me that I'm gripping the sticks with the right amount of tension.
There is a video lesson by Ed Soph in which he uses the term, “degrees of looseness” instead of “degrees of tension,” just because the very thought of the word “tension” can cause students to tighten up. But to think of the word “looseness” causes the mind and body to lean in a more relaxed direction, so to speak. I work a lot on getting students to grasp the four main stroke types (rebound, down, tap, up) and to move between them. Each of these requires a different rebound and therefore a different amount of tension/looseness, which also varies by dynamic level. The exercise John Riley shares from Joe Morello is a great step toward it, I think. Focusing on the motion and sound resulting from our muscle action can be a good indicator of what our tension is doing, and the sound is the goal anyway. But your tension transition exercise really puts a microscope on the action and that’s fantastic!
This is a great lesson! I’ve touched on this concept as well, but the way you go about explaining it and presenting solutions is as well-honed and finessed as good tension control can make a performance! Thanks very much for sharing this!
Hey Rob! Good to see you again! I usually replace "tension" with "pressure" to avoid negative associations. As Alexandros Fragiskatos said, addressing the load taken by fingers, wrist, elbow, etc. (or whatever mechanics are relevant to other instruments) is really helpful. I find my students who have this tension issue ALSO have an over/under-use issue in their joints and muscle groups. Good news, this method will also identify that as well, and allow people to experiment with different mechanical combinations while they calibrate tension/pressure. Can't wait to see more, Rob! Congrats on getting back on stage after so long!
Great video Rob, needed this after just practicing quiet rolls and my RH fingers screaming at me after 10 minutes! One of my undergrad teachers taught the same thing RE pausing over the scary/adjusting bits, that really worked for me but since no other teacher did that I started doubting it! Inventing new rhythms to replace the written ones always helps me come back to the written part with less tension. It'd be interesting to see the Slo Mo Guys or someone else do a reeeally slo-mo video of the actual drumhead/note bar vibrations with this kind of tension/relaxation experiment.
glad to hear this supports something that's helped before! and yes, would be great to have a real slo mo video. i recorded in 120fps (which is 25% speed) but then had final cut pro artificially slow it down to 10%. still looks pretty cool though i though
This is great Rob! In my own practice, and with students I have practiced putting a number on my current level of tension. For example I may suddenly say “freeze” during a play through and ask the student what their current level of tension is in a particular phrase they might say a “7”, we’ll try to find out where the tension is and I may suggest tuning the tension down to a “5”. (Important too is to find out what the least amount of tension should be according to both me and the student, but better if the student feels it). The student then repeats the phrase and stops when I say freeze and tells me again what their current tension level is. Then we repeat until the student feels they have reached the tension level I suggested (or they think they should have).
Fantastic video as usual, Rob! I’ve discussed the idea of MVP with my students (although not using that literal term) and this video will be a great addition to our discussions.
If you have students who play way too loose, just refer them to me! I can teach ANY student, on ANY instrument, to play way the heck too tightly on any instrument!!😝😝
This is my 3rd semester taking private lessons and I have a hard time getting my hands to match each other. My joints and fingers just feel different and I’m able to get more bounce out of my right than left. Also what is that you use to muffle? Is it just a towel?
This video must be one of the most important when you try to learn to play an instrument. UA-cam has a ton of videos on how to play single stroke rolls, double stroke rolls, paradidlles etc., but on one teaches about tension. And you cannot play these figures if you do not know about changing tension. Thank you.
Hello Rob, I would like to ask you how you define “tension.” I think this word is confusing because as an athlete and musician, these words have very different meanings. Tension in weightlifting is whenever a muscle activated, whether it’s 10% or 100%. I believe the way musicians use the word tension is to describe excess amounts of tension within muscles. As a woodwind player, a certain amount of “tension” (athletic definition) is required to hold the instrument (in my case, an oboe) up. Do you have any advice on how to rid pain caused solely by holding the weight of the instrument up?
good points here and a great question! you should check out the book “playing less hurt” by janet horvath. she talks about things like using motion and awareness to lessen the impact of tension and solve the problems caused by it.
If you want to get a better sound out of that snare drum, the first thing you Gotta do is get that stupid black cloth off of that head! Talk about muting a musical instrument!
Oh yeah hey rob thank you by the way your videos are excellent! Maybe one on the late great Billy Gladstone and his technique would be a great subject you’d have to get Morris Lang though who studied with Billy to talk you through that! Just a suggestion!
This should be required viewing for all university/college Percussion Method classes!!!
If this is the same Ed Soph I'm thinking of, then thank you for what you do. Your methodologies have helped my playing tremendously. Hope you have a good day.
@@aaronmerry Thank you. You have a good day, too.
@@edsoph7006 wow, thank you so much for your kind words, professor!
Ed Soph! I was literally looking for some of your grip technique videos yesterday to show to a student. I've been using them for a number of years to help explain relaxed grip concepts but it looks like they've been taken down as I couldn't find them and the old links I had didn't work. Thankyou for the words and demonstrations, they have helped both me and my students for years.
This is great! As an Alexander Technique teacher, I am always thinking of the full range across a tension spectrum - sometimes I see that the word "tension" increases my students' tension because of their deep desire to relax! Sometimes it can be helpful to think of tension as "muscular tone" rather than tension--it can feel easier to work with it, rather than something to "deal" with it.
This is an excellent video and I am glad you addressed the fallacy of playing with absolutely no tension at all. I can only speak as a percussionist but we need certain degrees of tension, as you say, to execute certain things. A super important thing I have found that helps as a teacher (and performer) is stressing the difference between forearm, wrist, and fingers. A solid understanding of when to use what and in what combination really goes a long way in finding the minimum amount of tension required to get the best sound.
good point!!
Been saying this on loop all semester. Excited to share this with my students so they can hear it from someone else!
This is awesome stuff! Greetings from Finland.
A great quote from Tommy Igoe (renowned drummer, educator): "Relaxation is based on healthy tension"
was not expecting the nathan cole shoutout 😍. i play violin so i came across MVP before this
My drum teacher of the great Freddie GRUBER Always used to tell me you’re just hanging onto the sticks let the sticks do the work! you control the pressure and the rhythmic phrase but you’re just Allowing the sticks to interact with the drum head by just loosening your muscles you literally have to consciously tell your arms hands fingers etc. to relax and they will! Also one’s personality Has a lot to do with if they play with a lot of tension or not!
Great job, Rob. Thank you for all the content you upload here!
For me, the key element is to avoid all unnecessary tension. As the great cellist Emanuel Feuermann used to say: "If a muscle doesn't make music, don't use it."
Best regards from a Brazilian fan.
Here’s my contribution to drummers…
The stick I’m using is a maple tapered neck stick with a fat bead. I’ve found that thicker sticks relax my hand and maple is a lighter wood. For me, the heavier the stick, the more force I need to grip and that then pulls me away from relaxing my grip.
The grip I use (matched) is over hand, ultimately full stick contact with my thumb. For warm up I have a fundamental grip that could considered like a long tone grip. I return to this fundamental grip if things are getting too tight during practice. I rest the stick loosely at the base of my middle finger and turn the wrist for singles that rebound the wrist for each strike. I don’t use a metronome but allow the speed of the singles rebounding to flow in speed according I’m experiencing. I do this warm up while seated.
While seated, I begin on other transitions, singles to doubles and rudiments (Gaddiments are good). The more relaxed my hands and arms are while playing the more I find my legs, shoulders and hips tense. I have found that centering tension away from my limbs is possible by focusing on my abdomen, pulling it in. This then supports my upper body and allows my hips and shoulders to relax. So, here’s the idea I’m heading towards, I’m looking for a base line of of relaxation that is clear to me whenever I play.
One more thing... When I do the fundamental grip singles warm up, I've noticed that the sticks resonate with a pitch or sing so to speak. This "singing" from my sticks confirms to me that I'm gripping the sticks with the right amount of tension.
There is a video lesson by Ed Soph in which he uses the term, “degrees of looseness” instead of “degrees of tension,” just because the very thought of the word “tension” can cause students to tighten up. But to think of the word “looseness” causes the mind and body to lean in a more relaxed direction, so to speak.
I work a lot on getting students to grasp the four main stroke types (rebound, down, tap, up) and to move between them. Each of these requires a different rebound and therefore a different amount of tension/looseness, which also varies by dynamic level.
The exercise John Riley shares from Joe Morello is a great step toward it, I think. Focusing on the motion and sound resulting from our muscle action can be a good indicator of what our tension is doing, and the sound is the goal anyway.
But your tension transition exercise really puts a microscope on the action and that’s fantastic!
awesome, thank you so much for sharing!
This is fantastic Rob! Love it...and love the set. Has some Grandma's LakeHouse vibes.
thanks eric! it's just another prop from an opera production that i found downstairs at the Met 🤣
Great video! Already tried some of this with my students and it has helped a lot. Thanks Rob!
This is a great lesson! I’ve touched on this concept as well, but the way you go about explaining it and presenting solutions is as well-honed and finessed as good tension control can make a performance! Thanks very much for sharing this!
Hey Rob! Good to see you again!
I usually replace "tension" with "pressure" to avoid negative associations.
As Alexandros Fragiskatos said, addressing the load taken by fingers, wrist, elbow, etc. (or whatever mechanics are relevant to other instruments) is really helpful.
I find my students who have this tension issue ALSO have an over/under-use issue in their joints and muscle groups. Good news, this method will also identify that as well, and allow people to experiment with different mechanical combinations while they calibrate tension/pressure.
Can't wait to see more, Rob! Congrats on getting back on stage after so long!
good points dan, thanks for your input!
Great video Rob, needed this after just practicing quiet rolls and my RH fingers screaming at me after 10 minutes! One of my undergrad teachers taught the same thing RE pausing over the scary/adjusting bits, that really worked for me but since no other teacher did that I started doubting it! Inventing new rhythms to replace the written ones always helps me come back to the written part with less tension.
It'd be interesting to see the Slo Mo Guys or someone else do a reeeally slo-mo video of the actual drumhead/note bar vibrations with this kind of tension/relaxation experiment.
glad to hear this supports something that's helped before! and yes, would be great to have a real slo mo video. i recorded in 120fps (which is 25% speed) but then had final cut pro artificially slow it down to 10%. still looks pretty cool though i though
Excellent video, Rob! Thank you!
This is great Rob! In my own practice, and with students I have practiced putting a number on my current level of tension. For example I may suddenly say “freeze” during a play through and ask the student what their current level of tension is in a particular phrase they might say a “7”, we’ll try to find out where the tension is and I may suggest tuning the tension down to a “5”. (Important too is to find out what the least amount of tension should be according to both me and the student, but better if the student feels it). The student then repeats the phrase and stops when I say freeze and tells me again what their current tension level is. Then we repeat until the student feels they have reached the tension level I suggested (or they think they should have).
i love the connection between tension and numbers! a great mental tool for being deliberate about it.
Fantastic video as usual, Rob! I’ve discussed the idea of MVP with my students (although not using that literal term) and this video will be a great addition to our discussions.
If you have students who play way too loose, just refer them to me! I can teach ANY student, on ANY instrument, to play way the heck too tightly on any instrument!!😝😝
This is my 3rd semester taking private lessons and I have a hard time getting my hands to match each other. My joints and fingers just feel different and I’m able to get more bounce out of my right than left.
Also what is that you use to muffle? Is it just a towel?
This video must be one of the most important when you try to learn to play an instrument. UA-cam has a ton of videos on how to play single stroke rolls, double stroke rolls, paradidlles etc., but on one teaches about tension. And you cannot play these figures if you do not know about changing tension. Thank you.
Hello Rob, I would like to ask you how you define “tension.” I think this word is confusing because as an athlete and musician, these words have very different meanings. Tension in weightlifting is whenever a muscle activated, whether it’s 10% or 100%. I believe the way musicians use the word tension is to describe excess amounts of tension within muscles. As a woodwind player, a certain amount of “tension” (athletic definition) is required to hold the instrument (in my case, an oboe) up. Do you have any advice on how to rid pain caused solely by holding the weight of the instrument up?
good points here and a great question! you should check out the book “playing less hurt” by janet horvath. she talks about things like using motion and awareness to lessen the impact of tension and solve the problems caused by it.
that table is so relaxed it just floats...
haha yeah exactly
And that’s how an incredible guy I’ve never met saved my life
Control comes from degrees of looseness, not tightness!
stretch to wake up your senses. so you can feel and realize the tension
dropped out of music college since the last vid i saw
If you want to get a better sound out of that snare drum, the first thing you Gotta do is get that stupid black cloth off of that head! Talk about muting a musical instrument!
Oh yeah hey rob thank you by the way your videos are excellent! Maybe one on the late great Billy Gladstone and his technique would be a great subject you’d have to get Morris Lang though who studied with Billy to talk you through that!
Just a suggestion!