Factory to SE Compensator Swap: Part 2 - Reassembly
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- Опубліковано 28 сер 2024
- How to put the inner primary back together after changing over to the Screamin Eagle unit, plus torque specs. Re-uploaded with corrected inch pound conversions. Using 2011 Service Manual torque specs to swap factory compensator with a Screamin Eagle unit, which I slightly modified. Here is my video on what a noisy compensator sounds like: • Harley Compensator Noise
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35:00 The way I read it, The 45oz dry is if you took the outer primary cover off. Wet is if you just drain and service, so I guess the next time you drain and service the level will correct.
Based on the amount that spills out when the outer cover is removed, this could very well be true. I checked the wording of the shop manual and it does not explain what 'wet and 'dry' condition is. I assumed it was the clutch plates. Thanks for pointing this out.
@@contact4mwy7 after watching your videos I'm going to install the Hayden tensioner....and I might as well upgrade my compensator
@@08StreetGlide it will cost you more money, but should be worth it for the long haul. If you have the flat disc compensator it is likely a matter of time before the springs wear out, giving you troubles on hot bike startups. The newer compensator is definitely made better and stronger. Hayden or factory automatic is up to you. My factory automatic was not giving me issues, but I read the posts and saw the videos on some having issues with them. Good luck to you!
@@contact4mwy7looks like it can use a chain tensioner on the top as well.
@@tax905972 Yes, but once the engine is under load, the chain would be tight on the top and it would be a direct pull between the sprockets anyway.
You know, Mr.Mark...the msg says this vid is 3 years ago !! I'm doing this chore as we speak, on an '06 Wide Glide. It's amazing how timely the information remains ! Thanks for the post !
I would change one thing about it now, use a 7 inch piece of flatstock metal about an inch wide to lock between the teeth of the compensator and the clutch, instead of pinching a wooden block like I show in the video. Harley Davidson sells a tool like this and there are videos showing how to wedge it diagonally between the two in order to torque the compensator and clutch fasteners.
I gotta tell ya man. This video is done exceptionally well. Nice work! Fellow firefighter from Canada. I’ve never seen your channel before but you’ve earned a subscriber from this gear head. Great job.
You may be too generous about the video, but great to have another friend and brother firefighter!
Excellent video only thing I would recommend is using assembly lube.
Great job quick tip if you zip tie the chain tensionor it's easy in and out, just make room between the chain & tensonor with a pry bar or putty knife and slip the zip tie thru. Thanks for showing this is very informative. I'm having trouble finding tourque specs for my 99 Softail with a 120 ultima motor. Your guidance helped, thank you.
Thanks for the comments, and thanks for the tips! Good luck to you!
Excellent, informative and very helpful video! You pointed out the inner bolts should not be used because they will not seal again! I watched another video they did not point that out, i will tell them about it. Love the video always nice to do it yourself.
Thank you!
I'm getting ready to replace the compensator on my 2014 CVO Ultra. This video is extremely helpful. Thank you for taking the time to do this!!
Keep the shiny side up!
You shouldn't have to remove the whole inner primary to change out the compensator. I had to in this video because the magnet rotor had to be swapped for the newer version. Yours already has this version.
@@contact4mwy7 You're correct, mine should be a lot easier. 🙂
Did you end up going back to the 'factory' spring setup or did you leave it with the extra medium spring?
@@cannonskier1 I'm still running with the extra spring. It's up to you whether you go extra or not. My spring pack was not new, so it needed a little extra pressure.
@@contact4mwy7 Thank you for the quick response and great feedback!
@@contact4mwy7 Sorry, one more question. Are you still running the Hayden and did you notice any difference between that and the factory Harley auto adjust tensioner?
Love this video series. Concise, easy to see, very well explained. Thanks for such a helpful video on this topic!
Thank you, Eric! As always, I hope I didn't miss anything, so always consult your shop manual for all the details! Ride safe!
Great job Eric , I hope you’re still doing those seals correctly , second time I did on a 1998 evo . Time for a replacement seal , being so vague in the manuals, thanks for the vid
Great video , will be saving these and re-watching when tackling this job soon 👍
All that work to get inside, I definitely would have been putting a new clutch in after seeing those damaged splines.
4 sure he probably been back in there by now 4 that looked bad
May 2024, same bike, same clutch, still going.
Wow. Great videos (1&2). Very detailed. Very helpful. Good job, Mark.
thanks for your help I had a real problem when reassembling because I lost the horden of the pieces greetings from Mexico
Thank you, glad it helped!
I particularly like the clunk, no bike does that and it let's you know you didnt miss a gear
you forgot to torque the clutch basket nut. but very informative. loved it
Excellente vidéo. Bien expliquée MERCI beaucoup pour ce partage.
Un passionné de HARLEY DAVIDSON de FRANCE 🇫🇷🇫🇷
Toutes mes amitiés 👍👏👏
My first screaming eagle compensator in my 2009 FLH lasted about 30,000 miles. My next one is still going strong . I’ll have to take a look at it this winter .I’ve got about 50,000 on this one I have found that if you add more than the recommended oil it seems to help saturate the compensator no drag on the clutch plates from extra oil 😀
mot ikswelborw that's good to know, thanks for sharing. I have noticed that the recommended oil capacity is a quart plus 4 more ounces for an already wet clutch. Makes sense.
mot ikswelborw
Instead of the recommended primary oil, i use 1 Ltr. ATF2 (automatic tranny fluid) Now the ‘klunk’ to first gear is almost gone, i can find my neutral again, and it shifts, sorry😒like a metric bike. My buddy uses ATF2 for over 8 years now, and has no more klunkedy klunk or missing neutral. Right from the start (oil change) i feld the differance in a possitive way.
Nicely done video. Was very helpful 👍👍
Thank you so much! Part 1 to 3 was a great help! Keep up the great work!
Understand that the FT LBS changes when there is any liquid on the bolt. Because it is more slippery with the liquid, the you may actually be tightening the bolts tighter than spec. There are charts on web that give you dry bolt or wet bolt tightening specs. Danger to stripping threads in an aluminum casing with wet bolt.
I had an early version SE compensator put on my 2008 ultra on warranty and it was crap. It sounded like rocks in a coffee can after 10,000 KLM. Replaced it myself with a Baker Drive Line job and no more problems.
I haven't been around a Baker compensator yet, but have always heard good things about them. Thanks for commenting.
@@contact4mwy7 I do believe that SE made some upgrades to the oiling of later offerings but can not speak to how well they worked.
This was an excellent video. Thank you Mark. Keep them coming...
Thank you, Colin! Happy and safe biking to you and yours!
Thank you.Excellent Footage!Didn't have one problem seeing.😊
There's a reason why they put a hex head on the outer part of that hub retainer. The block of wood isn't necessary, and the crank end would be better supported when tightening the bolt.
If you continue to have compensator issues, you should look into a Darkhorse Crankworks Compensator.
Thanks for the tip, Robert. Worth a look, and they have a 32 teeth version that ups the rpm's about 300 making 6th gear more useable.
Glad I found you... Great informative videos :-)
Excellent video, well done
I always coat the seal with oil before installation. I have seen many of those where you just push them in with your fingers, without having to drive them in place. I think I would have used some blue locktight on the bolts for the inner primary cover.
The inner primary bolts came with thread locker pre applied.
Very good videos. Learning a lot !
Thanks 💪
Also I found that using a painted menu flyer serves as a better funnel, you can dump a quart instantly.
Excellent videos!! Want to take a peak inside my '09 UC, getting hard restarts & odd sounds during hot idling. Probably all original, 41k miles. Considering the manowar as I saw you install in another video. I didnt notice you check alignment with a straight edge, comp to clutch?
These parts "should" align themselves. The springs compress until the inner shaft bottoms out. That's what keeps the chain alignment in specs.
Finally got into mine & was happy to see my '09 already had a screamin eagle compensator! Everything looked great, hard restarts still a mystery. Feels better with new primary fluid anyway (Lucas). Possibly starter clutch?
@@icecreamsikeyuhasz5689 or spring pack is losing its tension? That's what happened to my original spring pack, and to some extent the used one I replaced it with. I ended up adding a single spring washer to the pack to help stiffen it up. I may look into changing the spring pack up a bit this Spring.
boy did i learn alot from your video"s ----- i know i could do the same thing on my super glide if needed thanks to you......
Thank you for saying so, Mike, much appreciated!
Good video, professional done, thanks
Great video. Well done !
Well done 👍🏼
Thanks man Good stuff Helpful.
Do not know if you missed it or if you were not aware of it or if your bike does not require it but, Harley does provide an oil deflector that is epoxied into the primary cover to defect oil into the sprocket. Just a FYI and further FYI for those youtubers that watch these DIY video so they can double check the parts inventory necessary for the upgrade. Good job otherwise.
Thank you. Yes, I was aware of the plastic oil deflector, but it is utilized with the newer version SE compensator with the Allen head bolt. There are grooves and holes drilled to channel the oil from the deflector to the inside of the compensator. The compensator I installed does not have these grooves and holes and uses a hex head bolt. The Allen head bolt has a beveled edge if you really give it a look, for helping with the oil flow into the outer edges of inner compensator. It may help to reduce wear by using the new oiler system, but it seems that the spring packs wear out first.
@@contact4mwy7 Hi I'm back - I have a friend that needs to address his compensator in his 2016 which is essentially the SE compensator - I told him about your experiment with the extra 'spring/washer' and he asked, "How did it work out?" I had to say I don't know so, how did that extra medium spring/washer/spacer work out for you? On a side note, I upgraded mine to the Man-O-War compensator and I can tell you that product is miraculous! Looking forward to hearing from you. Thanks.
@@WaxMeister I would like to give that Man O War compensator a try myself. I am still running the added medium spring washer. I tried running without it and it just felt too loose, so it went back in. So far no issues.
@@contact4mwy7 When I installed the S&S 585 Cam my bike has a dead-start torque lag which could be seen on the Dyno papers. It was very upsetting to have the bike bog from a stop light. I ran the bike like that for a couple years and finally, the compensator started to rattle and give the old clack-clack when it was shut down. I'm happy to report that with the Man-O-War compensator that lag is absolutely gone and the bike is once again an absolute pleasure to ride - go for it I say, I have nothing but rave reviews on the Man-O-War compensator upgrade!
Hello Mark. Thank you very much for the detailed video on this project. I will need to do my 09' Electra Glide with a 96. My Question? How Long did it take you to do the entire compensator swap (hours) ? I would like to start and finish it in one day. ???
Oh heck yeah, one day is plenty of time. With recording the video it took between two and three hours. I've had that primary cover off so many times I've got it down to NASCAR quick. Lol. Even though some cringe at the thought, grinding away enough of the aluminum inner primary was not that intrusive and made disassembly and reassembly that much easier and quicker. If the stator system ever fails you can swap that out that much quicker too. Just clean up the filings after real good. I have a video on the actual grinding if it's not in this video. As always, if you feel like you are getting in over your head bring it to a qualified technician. Good luck to you!
@@contact4mwy7 Thank you for your quick reply Mark. It's my first HD and big job for this bike. I'm thinking of swapping it out for Baker. Its $780 with rotor. Baker chain tensioner too ($249!) I really do not want to remove the inner primary and I've heard that you maybe able to get that part out without dremel if you pull hard. Your thoughts?
@@HealthvsWealth4me I did the job a couple of years ago and removed the inner primary. Used the latest SE version with glue in oil diverter. One benefit of doing the inner removal is easy access to the socket head allen on the transmission shift arm. This routinely loosens, and strips the splines shaft. A real PIA to get to when the primary is in place. Replacing the splined shaft requires going in to the tranny. The Baker was 2 - 3 months from release when I had to do my '09 FLHTCU. All good since with SE, but only about 12k miles. I have heard good things about Baker.
I believe It's a good thing that you noticed the clutch splines were punched, I feel like they were caused by someone hitting the basket back on the shaft, at an earlier assembly time, possibly before you owned the bike.
I'm hoping that's the case Randy and not from too much horsepower. It's still going strong, just got back from riding two-up to Laconia Bike Week. About 730 miles total.
Whew.... I would not have been so fearless starting that without oil in the primary. Probably just my ignorance but I surely cringed when I saw that.
Excellent, informative and very helpful video!!!! Thank you
Thank you for saying so!
GDAY!! I AM GUESSING YOU HAVE A FEW MILES SINCE YOU DID THE ADJUSTMENT TO THE COMPENSATOR. HOW DID HOLD UP? ANY UPDATES? DID YOU RAN INTO ANY PROBLEMS DOWN THE ROAD?
PRIOR TO SEEN YOUR VIDEO I HAD REPLACED THE ORIGINAL COMPENSATOR TO THE SE VERSION WITH THE PLASTIC THINGYMAGIENY, TO FIND OUT IT ONLY WORK OK WITHOUT THE CLINK CLANK CLUNK FOR A FEW HUNDRED MILES. I REMEMBER HAVING THE FRUSTRATING SOUND (BEFORE REPLACEMENT) ONLY AT SHUT DOWN. NOW, I HAD IT AT LOW RPM'S OR TAKING OFF FROM A LIGHT. AND MORE RECENTLY HAVING THE CLINK CLANK CLUNK AT START UP AND NOW... WELL YOU GET THE PICTURE. I KNOW I SHOULD HAVE CHOSEN THE BAKER AS MANY HAD SUGGESTED BUT I WAS ANXIOUS TO GET SOME WIND THERAPY AND THE BAKER WAS BACK ORDER FOR LONGER THAN MY SHORT PATIENT WAS.
I HAVE TAKEN IT APART TWICE SINCE THEN, I HAVE LOOKED AT IT, I WENT OVER EVERY STEP, EVERY TORQUE... WITH THE SAME RESULTS. UPON FRUSTRATION AT THIS POINT I MORE THAT DECIDED TO WIN THE WRESTLE MATCH WITH THIS BAG OF NUTS. SO... YOUR ANSWER TO THOSE QUESTIONS WILL BE GREATLY APPRECIATED. BUENAS RUTAS!
HYDEN TENSIONER
103 CI ROAD KING
I was waiting for him to use a stick and a rock to put this together lol
I will use whatever it takes! Watch out!
@@contact4mwy7 lol
Nice video. You just removed a good portion of shock absorbing ability of compensator to the drive train. Inner primary bolts can be reused. Put a bead of sealant on bolts. Way yours was crushed I think the bolts may have been over torqued. Mine looked like new when I took it apart ( Factory). Outer primary gasket can be used 3 times. Put a slight amount of sealant ensure a good seal I use Castrol 10-40 motorcycle oil safe for wet clutches.
If the spring pack was brand new, yes, it would be a lot tighter than factory spec, but these aren't brand new. As they are it may be slightly more firm than factory spec but hardly noticeable. As for the inner primary bolts, yes, you could reuse them by adding sealant and crossing your fingers that they won't leak oil down the back side of your primary, but I would rather squish new bolts as recommended. I like your choice of oil as I believe thinner is better for the clutch plates, less stiction helps for smoother shifting. Thanks for commenting.
@@contact4mwy7 Thanks for the reply and decent conversation on things. Too many butt hurt people around these days. I like the Castrol oil in primary gives good feel during low speed maneuvers. Our American Legion Post does some parades, nice friction zone is handy. Ride safe
@Mark Young what a great job ! I am changing out my 2011 Heritage and this is the most comprehensive video on this repair in the whole youtube content world. I can't even tell you how many times I've watched the video. I even had it playing in the background when I was gluing up the plastic funnel on the outer primary of the FLSTC. One question I have is why the auto trans fluid ? It seems to work for you so I can't find anything wrong with it. I had Mobil1 20w50 synthetic in it and my compensator failed with the 96 cu in motor. I work in aviation maintenance and we have issues with seals using different fluids. An "O" ring made for the landing gear can not be used in the flight controls. So when you found rubber in the oil supply hole I was wondering if the trans fluid was compatible with the material the "O" ring or the main clutch basket seal is made of.
Keep up the good work You saved me a lot of time with this job.
Thank you, Wayne, I really appreciate your comments. I assume your factory original compensator wore out. To answer your question about using transmission fluid in the primary, I used 20w-50 for a few years, but I started reading up on what everyone else was using and their reasons why. Some mentioned that the Red Line brand is very similar to transmission fluid and asked about using tranny fluid. "As long as it doesn't contain any friction modifiers" was said. In automatic transmissions the fluid coexists with clutch packs, electrical wiring, seals, bearings, etc., similar to what's inside the Harley Davidson primary. An actual 'advantage' I wanted to explore was a claimed reduction in 'stiction' between the clutch plates, which can contribute to the 'clunk' often heard when shifting from neutral into gear while the motor is running. Even with the clutch lever pulled, the fluid between the plates tends to continue spinning the clutch basket and when the transmission is put into gear the clutch basket comes to a halt with a clunk/thud sound. The thought is with a thinner oil the stiction is reduced. I have not noticed this to be the case, yet. As for the question of whether it provides enough lubrication for the chain parts, it was submitted that transmission fluid is what is used in most transfer cases for 4 wheel drive vehicles, and they are chain driven. So to sum up, I'd say choose what you think is right for your bike?
You Rock! Thank you for your service and great work
Thank you for saying so, Darren! Happy riding!
enjoyed the video. your a great teacher. keep it up
'Great' teacher might be too much, but I'll accept 'good.' Thanks.
Thank you
Good Job ‘ that help me a lot
Good job very helpful would like to know if you noticed a big difference, thanks again
If you're asking if I noticed a difference in the Screamin Eagle compensator the answer is yes. Every 96 cubic inch engine or higher should be using this compensator or one of the aftermarket kits made for it. The factory compensator was not engineered to handle that much horsepower and torque. That's my two cents for you. Thanks for asking!
Hey Mark, I didn't see the two plastic oil deflectors which are to be epoxied to the inner primary cover. They splash oil on the trust washer inside the compensator assembly, to lube it. Nonetheless, good stuff and well explained. Thanks.
That is correct as this is the earlier version of the Screamin Eagle compensator before that setup was manufactured. The later version uses an Allen head type bolt with channels drilled into the bearings area for the lube to go through.
What adhesive did you use?
My compensator version is older, it does not require the plastic scoop to be glued inside.
There are 32 oz. In a quart
That extra washer is eating up space that you need, not enough spline surface
@@jackmurphy9371 the number of washers doesn't affect the spline surface used. The bolt compresses the spring pack until it bottoms out. If the bolt can't bottom out, then yes that could be bad.
@@contact4mwy7 oh I see, thanks for the heads up, the extra washer means more exerting tension, the bolt is the key.
I got the infamous Dyna 06 - and my alternator rotor's got those little bolts that screw into the sprocket spring cup.
Not only do the screws back out, they snap inside!
It's my second time digging into the primary case in one month (not good - 2 alternators, not good either!).
I read about the tack welding fix and whatnot, but I'd rather bypass the whole screws in the alternator rotor completely.
I'm looking into the Screaming Eagle upgrade/ Twin Power Compensator Sprocket Kit - but the kit says it requires OEM parts.
Now, I'm stuck in the Middle East right now - and Harley here is a no bueno when it comes to reliable information. They just don't get it!
I need some sort of guidance to what I parts I need to purchase and have shipped here to get the bike up and running again.
(Anybody's input would be appreciated.)
That is a good question. I am not familiar with those compensator types. I hope someone who is familiar with them can comment on suggestions for you.
Awesome vid Mark. I believe you mentioned this is for a 2011 96ci cruiser. I have a stock 2011 96ci fatboy lo that only has about 8k miles on it. I do plan performance mods on the 96, and I hear a “clunk” at most starts. No issues finding neutral and no operational issues. Bike is new to me. I do have the spring (non ratcheting) chain tensioner that I picked up, and plan to take the cover off for a look as soon as I have a gasket. Would you still recommend the screaming eagles, let’s say I plan up to a stage 2 or 3? Or some of those others on the market? Also how did the 3rd Belleville washer end up working. Thanks
This is actually a 2009, but bikes from 2007 up to 2011 we're equipped with the non-Screamin Eagle compensator that wasn't strong enough to handle the bigger engine. I'm still running mine with the extra spring washer and there haven't been any issues with it so far. I ended up grinding away some of the aluminum primary housing to replace the magnet rotor again as this one has some broken magnets on arrival and was out of balance. Not much material had to be removed, and only enough to slide the magnet rotor past it.
Excellent video the best of youtube, big hug from brazil .
Thank you, Eduardo! Happy and safe riding to you my brother!
in 70,000 miles all my suzuki cruiser needed was tyres and oil :)
Can you just put a little glue lock tight inside of the old screws for the inner primary where the factory sealent was?
Great video!
My kit had a plastic oil feeder to be glued into the outer primary cover. This plastic oil feeder catches some oil flinging off the chain and drip feeds it to the thin grooved washer in the compensator assembly. Does your primary cover already have the cast in oil drip feeder or did you not fit one ?
Ron Powell My compensator is the model prior to the oiling holes drilled through the compensator innards like the one you have, so the oiling spout was not necessary for my setup. I can see how the newer compensator benefits from the extra oil. Thanks for commenting.
Ron Powell, what year bike do you have that you changed over to this SE comp? What kit did you purchase and from whom?
Pt 4010061 + 11100088. My bike is a 2007 Softail Deluxe. You also need the gaskets, O rings etc. Note the glue HD supply/specify comes in a PITA to use tube mixer system.
@@jamesfaller5680 I bought a kit online (ebay?) that included replacement o-rings, inner primary bolts, clutch c-clip, and inner primary gasket. Basically everything you need to reseal the inner primary.
My bike is 2007 Softail Deluxe. I have to get my parts(if I want new) from a HD dealer as no other country's HD dealerships will ship to Australia. But buying from HD Australia adds a monster markup compared to the USA, even allowing for shipping costs. I ordered the parts by description over the phone, and I don't have the invoice nearby so I don't have any part numbers sorry. But the HD spares (for the Australian people, I went through Sy's HD at Campbelltown) team did all the O rings, SE kit, gaskets, oils etc sorting and ordered for me in about 20 minutes.
The best vídeo to tech how to dix my harley.
Good informative video. Wont adding the 2nd spring washer, 14:00 mark, only make the single washer spring work harder, possibly wearing out faster - loosing spring action, because it will compress much easier and more then the doubled up spring washers. And since the added spring washer is thicker then the removed flat washer, it will add more tension, same as using a thicker flat washer. Seems like simply adding a thicker flat washer would be good. Just thoughts from a diy'er, not an expert analysis...
I believe you are correct on all points. If the single spring washer loses its tension it will still act like a shim and hold some strength off the remaining spring washers? I've been thinking it's time to replace my primary chain and in the process I might remove the extra spring to see what that feels like through the bike.
@@contact4mwy7 It will be a thicker shim then the thinner bevel washer you removed. I read those larger bevels are very robust. If its quiet, no clunking clanking, maybe call it good until it says otherwise.
This may be interesting to read. Some very knowledgeable people in this thread.
harleytechtalk.com/htt/index.php?topic=82010.msg917659#msg917659
You should of done your drive belt while you where that far in.
I agree. I'll probably be stranded one of these days.
Doesn't the factory service manual say to use a new compensator bolt? Is that bolt a TTY (torque-to-yield) fastener?
It comes with a new bolt if you buy a new kit from the stealership.
Hello I know you did this project long ago but do you happen to have the part number for the stator rotor I bought a se comp went to install before watching your video and did not realize I need different one don’t want to get wrong one thanks
I don't have a part number, but what you want is a Harley Davidson Alternator Stator Rotor for 2011-2016. If you buy one to be shipped to you, make sure it is padded well in it's shipping box. The first one I bought arrived with broken magnets which made it a total paper weight.
Watched the whole thing. Never done this job before BUT...I can tell you this...if you use any sort of an extension on a torque wrench you NEED TO DO THE MATH TO GET THE RIGHT TORQUE!!! The extra length changes it!! It is pretty easy so just google it before you proceed with an extension!
The only time you need to change anything and add a math problem is if you add extra length to the handle of the torque wrench. If you add an extension to the right angle no compensation is needed unless you for some reason have a universal joint. The video is fine. The technique is fine.
Where do these misconceptions come from? I guess someone may have referred to something like a crow's foot as an extension at one time. Use a CF on a torque wrench and it is math time. Although the increase in length would be marginal.
There’s a plastic oil deflector that is epoxied to the primary cover did u get one of those my new kit had one with it it causes the oil to spray on the compensator keeping down heat , there was an SE in my flats when I got it and didn’t have the deflector in it so I had to put another one in(Han to buy whole kit ) as they don’t sell the springs by them seal
I have an earlier compensator that doesn't use the plastic funnel. The funnel is used on the newer 'allen head bolt' compensator as it has oil channels drilled into it.
Thank u I have the Allen bolt
I'm a bit confused. You don't need to remove the stator flywheel to change the compensator? Could you change the compensator without removing the inner primary? Why were you changing the flywheel?
The Screamin Eagle compensator cannot be used with the factory stator rotor (or flywheel as you call it). Generally the stator rotor cannot be removed past the inner primary due to a clearance problem, unless some of the inner primary is ground down a bit. The only way to replace the compensator without removing the inner primary is to grind part of the inner primary away until the stator rotor will clear it and slide out completely, which I later decided to do because the stator rotor I used was out of balance.
Maybe I missed it, but why did you remove the stator cover and inner primary housing just to change out your compensator assembly?
I was upgrading to a SE compensator, which had broken magnets in the cover, which I tried to change out with epoxy, which threw it out of balance, which meant that I had to put the original back in until I could source a replacement. The next time around, I ground away just enough of the inner primary with a Dremel to slide the original cover out and the SE cover in.
Bikebender
Very informative videos Mark. I am going for the 32T Dark Horse comp. for my 07 FLH (90K kms). I need the reliability. Other than the spring can what is the difference between the SE and the 07 rotor assembly? are the splined pieces the same axial length? Why not cut off the can on the older version?
Hank, if you look at the stator rotor of the SE compensator it has a noticable increase in thickness at the center where the spring pack presses against it. It's beefier than the original stator rotor to put up with the tension of the spring pack. They do have the same spline cut and size. Also the outer SE compensator assembly is made to stack up against the SE stator rotor to maintain alignment of the chain with the clutch. I wish it were different as I probably would have gone that route too. I will say the SE compensator upgrade was worth the trouble however. I'm glad I did it. Thank you for asking me.
I like how you used the tq wrench.. im not sure but why would tq specs be between 2 different specks. id think its to compensate for tq wrench discrepancy's. put it in the center of the range and if your wrench is off you have less chance of being to tight or loose.
I don't know why there are ranges of 18 to 22 foot pounds for instance. Good question!
Should have replaced the rotor with the updated part from HD. The one in the video has been grooved out by old comp and will continue to ruin the new one also.
Yes, Taylor, it has grooves in it, but there is still plenty of metal for it to last a long time, maybe even the life of the bike. My thoughts are that some are mistaking those grooves as the cause of it sounding worn out. They all groove up over time, but still slide to cushion the motor pulses. I like that the Milwaukee Eight compensators have really beefy spokes on them.
If the compensator has no play means is to much pressure, is the same thing if you have installed a Compensator Eliminator and the risks and results are the same.
Are you referring to no play when I tried to rotate it by hand? I was making a comparison to the original spring pack which was so weak that I could rotate the sprocket back and forth by hand. On the road I could feel that it was stiffer than it would be from the factory, but not to the point it felt like a solid compensator sprocket. Does that explain it better?
@@contact4mwy7 Is no really to much information about this mechanical part, I been looking for more technical info and is a lot of people like us making they own opinions, in my opinion if you kill complete the free play you defeat the mechanical purpose of the compensator, what I agree is excessive play is no good either.
@@metatronmen2431 ok, yes, I agree solid is not good and too loose is not good. I was trying for something in between, which although it was not solid, the free play was still less than it should have been. It was still able to cushion the motor pulses, but not as much as a brand new setup would allow.
@@contact4mwy7 Yes makes sense, otherwise we have to pay $600 for a Baker conpensator group. Thank you.
Great vid, but you just exchanged a piece of rubber clogging your oil hole with wood chips.
To replace the compensator, can you not just take the springs off the stator rotor cup, making it so you don’t need to remove inner primary
Yes, if you are only replacing the compensator you will not need to remove the inner primary.
The ink when you shift isn’t because of the fluid you use, it’s a design detail purposely engineer by Harley in the shifter drum, people like the clunk so that’s why they kept it, has nothing to do with the fluid
Nope your so wrong!!!!!!! If it clunks that's because the clutch plates where not soaked over night before installing you fool!!!!!!! They r to dry and they must be soaked over night before installing you moron!!!!!
Your so wrong!!!! If you install clutch plates with out letting them soak over night in fluid they will make a clunk noise you fool!!!!
Michael, my clutch plates had 64,000 plus miles on them. If they weren't soaked by then, they never will be.
I only used Harley-Davidson lubricants. Transmission, primary and oil! It's not worth saving a few bucks and taking the chance!
I agree, James, good point.
Different philosophy here. Engine, primary, transmission - 3 incredibly different environments. So I went to Amsoil, RedLine Primary, Redline Transmission about 110,000 miles ago (an 88 CI and a 96 CI) and have been content. Definitely better shifting.
Thank you for chiming in, Bob!
Why didn't you use the star t70 screw the new compinsater came with?
This is the previous edition compensator that I bought from a salvage, not new.
You are missing a bearing behind the compensator nut
The dealer put a new compensator in my used Electra Police 103. But…..it still rattles at idle and when you turn the engine off?! They need to repair it again😮😢 (under warranty)
If another one doesn't fix it, check the clutch basket and chain tensioner for excessive play.
@@contact4mwy7 they showed me the worn parts,..so they renew the tensioner also... we shall see. Next Tursday i will go there again...(the iddle was also a bit low, they said). Beter way is to mount this kind of compensator,...but that would'nt do the dealer for garanty...ua-cam.com/video/J9wRQxOZP4s/v-deo.html
Your clutch hub splines were buggered in the first video. Did you replace the clutch hub?
Not yet.
Trans fluid? I always thought there was an application specific oil....thanks for the good video, mine is in the shop, gonna be spendy.
There are true "primary oils" to use, but I read a lot of message boards that compared those to trans fluid and found "some" to be very similar. I like how it has less stiction on the clutch plates from it's viscosity. It's used it automatic transmissions and four wheel drive transfer cases, so it's not all that bad for lubricating parts in my opinion.
I started to use synthetic motor oil in the primary. Should I switch to transmission oil?
As long as there are no "friction modifier additives" in it, I bet using synthetic motor oil would be ok as well.
That race on the inner primary bearing is toast. Which probably means the bearing is toast as well. For another $25 you could have replaced those while you were in there. I would imagine you will be tearing this bike apart again soon. Great tutorial otherwise 👍
Hey Mark, I've just fitted a Screaming Eagle HD compensator to my 07 Softail, and when I shut down the engine it Clunks pretty loud, I've stripped back down 3 times in an attempt to find the issue to no avail, now Ive gone and fitted 110 barrels and S&S 583 cams, I've had a remap done and now it clunks like mad cause the tick over is low to non existent, do you reckon I should try and fit another washer to compensator to see if the extra packing will tighten it even more and stop clunk, what do you think
Well, let's see. How is the chain tension? How is the tensioner? Is it the stock tensioner? When the primary cover was off, could you rotate the compensator chain sprocket back and forth with just your fingers? Are you shutting it off while in Neutral or in gear, and does that make a difference?
@@contact4mwy7 The tensioner seems ok, it is stock, I could not move the compensator once it was torqued up, however this time round I'm going to push the tensioner up an extra couple of notches to increase chain tension as the chain looks to have been touching the casing where it comes off the bottom of the compensator, thanks for your reply :-)
Mark, wouldn't just a touch of assembly grease here and there (e.g. seals and splines) help just a little?
Good question, it didn't say anything about using anything like that for assembly, but maybe it couldn't hurt as long as it wasn't something that would deteriorate the rubber seals?
the screaming eagle does not use the same bolt to hold it in place,it is actually a t70 torx,they are different lenght and you should not use the factory bolt!
I used the bolt that came with my unit. Yes, the newer units use the torx bolt, but my unit was designed to use the hex bolt. They are two different units. The torx bolt directs fluid around the cone into drilled passages that lead to the internal bearings and surfaces. Thanks for offering that up though.
Humm...I wonder if adding that thicker washer moves the sprocket further outward thus causing the sprocket/clutch sprockets to be misaligned. That will cause side wear on the chain and sprocket teeth
Yes it would, Mike, but the alignment is determined by the the inner stack, not how many springs are around it. Once the main bolt is torqued it compresses the spring pack until it bumps into the inner spindle and stops right there, aligned with the clutch, just as the factory engineers intended. Thanks for bringing that up to me. It's been mentioned before but I like to try to clear up some of the confusion.
OK good...I'm doing my SE comp right now and wanted to see how someone else did it . Great videos Mark, thanks. @@contact4mwy7
You're welcome. Take your time, double check that none of the springs or shims are slid down where they shouldn't be. If something doesn't feel right going back together check things over. I wish you good luck!
I wouldn't have installed that compensator into a bike.
Very help full video just i question I have a 2006 Low Rider and there is a washer on the inside of the rotor do i leave this out when upgrading to the Screaming Eagle model Cheers from Australia
Keith I don't know if the Screamin Eagle compensator installs on the twin cam 88 motor. I'm only familiar with it going on the 96 and 103. Can you check around to be sure if your bike takes the SE compensator? If it doesn't, than a replacement of an original compensator like what came with the bike might be in order?
@@contact4mwy7 thanks Mark yes its going to be a bit of a test its the first model with the six speed box its hard to find any information if this will all fit together it was making some serious clunking noises when starting especially when hot and still has the original compensator sprocket I have done a bit of research i am hoping the later model se compensator and rotor will work. I noticed when you put yours together there was no washer behind the rotor the 2006 has a washer behind the rotor is there a reference point to align compensator sprocket and clutch drive sprocket Regards
I don't have the answer on whether to use the washer or not, my friend. But here's what you can do. Place the compensator on without the chain, tighten it at least close to 100 foot pounds, and use a straight edge to see if the clutch and compensator sprockets line up perfectly, with or without the washer. You may find your answer there. 6 speed gearbox? Are you sure this is a 2006? Is it a Dyna? Is it a 96 cubic inch motor? I know what you are hearing because that's what mine did, especially after getting fuel. Clash bang clunk! People would turn to see what's that noise coming from!
Keith, after looking around on the internet I have answered some of my own questions. Yes, the 2006 Dyna Lowrider has a 6 speed gearbox and 88 cubic inch motor. I can't see anywhere online that a Screamin Eagle compensator will fit a twin cam 88 motor?
@@contact4mwy7 Hi Mark just letting you know I put it all together as you suggested without the primary chain and using the washer that was on the inside of the rotor then torqued the comp sprocket up to 100ft pounds tightened up the clutch basket lined it all up with a steel straight edge and both sprockets measured up perfectly from the inner primary case at 22mm with a steel ruler. I think the SE compensator will fit as long as you have a model with the six speed box my bike has had a 120R motor fitted so the compensator was in pretty bad shape. Did a test run about 20 miles stopped and started up just like new , awesome wont attract unwanted attention next time at the fuel station Just like to say thanks again for your help and merry xmas
Being you upgraded to se style comp.what did you do about the glue on comp oiler that goes inside outer primary cover? ThNks
Thanks for asking, Mark. There are two versions of SE comps. The latest one has a retooled Allen head shaft bolt and passageways that help drive lube inside the compensator parts, and needs the plastic funnel epoxied to the inside of the primary cover to feed lube into the center of it where the bolt is. I have the earlier version that has a hex bolt and does not have the lube passages, and does not require the plastic funnel.
I have an 08 flhtcu with the same compensator and making the spitting noises when cranking once in a while. I thought it was the starter until I ran across your video. What happens if you leave this compensator on? I have it off replacing the stator and regulator now. If you reccomend replacing, what should I go with and can I use the same stator?
I changed mine out to a Screamin Eagle unit. There are two sets for these 96 ci motors. One requires an oil funnel cup to be epoxied to the inside of the primary cover, the other (older) unit does not. I have the older unit. It fits over the stator coils, but comes with it's own magnet rotor (looks like a hubcap). I am happy with the results of making the change, even though I modified it just a bit by adding a spring washer to the original pack to try to make it last longer before needing those springs to be replaced. That flat style compensator spring system is just too weak for that size motor. That's why Harley started installing the SE Comp's in all models in... 2012? Up to you, but I recommend installing a SE Comp. Starting up the bike, especially when hot, is solid again with no issues.
@@contact4mwy7 you bought yours on line if I remember correctly, part # ? With or without the oiler? And how can you tell if the starter gear is worn? Sorry I'm kinda knew at this. I have it torn down now and would really like to resolve this before I button it up. Thanks again
@@derekmcswain4190 the newer model with the oil funnel is part number 42200064A or kit 40100061. The first kit does not come with a stator magnet rotor, the second one does. Magnet rotor part number 30041-08. Adhesive epoxy is not included for the funnel attachment. The older version is not being sold anymore, so would have to purchase one taken off a bike, which is what I did. I don't have the part number for it. Make sure to check Years Fit for your bike.
Excellent video and by the way, where did you get the fire fighter shift linkage / Please let me know.
Thank you, Scott! I got the firefighter shifter linkage from a vendor at Laconia bike week a few years back.
Inner primary seal use seal driver. It will hit from the outside edge of seal. Which is proper. Adjust clutch, don't start that up dry. You did a good job but did silly things. Your 96 inch is not that powerful. Your inner primary bearing is weak point for those models, it will grind at low gears with clutch pulled in.
Hey Mark, What mileage should the HD Compensator be replaced? I can't seem find any info on this I have a 2007 HD Streetglide and I don't think the compensator has ever been replaced it has just shy of 70,000 miles on it.
Generally when the compensator starts making thrashing noises on startup is the most noticable. You're sure it hasn't been upgraded already? Chances are you've been easy on the throttle and provided good maintenance to where the springs in the compensator haven't worn out yet. I bought mine used and the problem appeared shortly after, so I don't know the driving habits of the previous owner, but there was no mistaking when the springs wear out and I would start the bike after filling up with gas that something wasn't right. Everyone nearby would look to see what that thrashing was coming from!
@@contact4mwy7 Mine has the same problem after I've been driving and I stop to fill up, it will make a horrible noise when i try to start it after that. usually sneezes and kicks back!!! when I heard you talk about the sneezing after it's hot. That got me to thinking about the compensator. I know the previous owner wasn't easy on the bike when riding it....Like he stole it lolz... and he was cheap so wouldn't have spent that kind of money on it other than oil changes and regular maintenance.
Yes, the "sneezing" out the intake, another sign that the compensator is not holding the sprocket to the crankshaft with the strength it should have. Sounds like your spring pack is getting weak.
@@contact4mwy7 Thanks Again for all the tech help Mark. Love the videos keep doing what your doing. Appreciate it.
Where is the plastic splash unit that gets glued into the outer primary cover?
This is the earlier model, before the oil holes were put into the body which the plastic funnel directs the lube into at the main shaft bolt head area. But good eye to notice that was not used here. If I upgrade to the newer model I will have to have one epoxied in for sure. Thanks for asking and watching.
Where's part 3? It says "to be continued" at the end. I want to make sure I see everything before starting this job. I have a 2009 Ultra Classic with 67K and was told by and expert and others that my compensator needs replacing.
Also, if I use the thin spring as to factory spec, would it generally last as long as the first?
I don't understand everything you're asking. Are you going to do a swap to a Screamin Eagle compensator from a factory flat style? If so, a brand new Screamin Eagle should last at least as long as your original did. The primary kit has new gaskets for the inner primary to motor and transmission, a new oil seal to go around the clutch shaft, and new bolts that are coated with sealant on the head ends to prevent leaking. It says in the manual not to reuse the inner primary bolts because the sealant will not reseal and you'll be looking at a leak of primary fluid. IF you want to grind away part of the inner primary to remove and replace the stator cover, you don't need to buy the primary kit. Only if you totally remove the inner primary. I removed it on mine to replace the compensator the first time, but I had to change out the stator cover AGAIN, so I used a Dremel tool to shave away just enough of the inner primary lip for it to slide off. In short, the cheapest way to swap it out would be the Dremel method, just use brake cleaner to flush away all of the aluminum filings.
@@contact4mwy7 gotcha. I was just wondering if I just replace the old with an oem new if it would last the same amount of time. I'm referring to the compensator..
Also, was there a part 3 to this video?
@@contact4mwy7 also, where do you get your parts?
I bought an inner primary kit (new sealed inner primary bolts because you're not supposed to reuse them as they would leak if you did, new gasket for the inner primary to motor seal, new seal for the clutch main shaft, new orings for starter, etc.) from eBay. I bought a harvested Screamin Eagle compensator from a salvage yard (from a 2012 bike with same motor).
There isn't a Part 3 so to speak, just more videos updating the progress and how it was holding up. It has held up very well, and I am still using one added medium spring washer (Belleville Spring Washer) inside the pack. Doesn't mean you have to use an extra spring. Now, if you can "find" a brand new OEM compensator the same as the flat disc type you have now, maybe it would last as long, yes. It's up to you if stay with the stock setup or upgrade to Screamin Eagle. It would be much cheaper and quicker to stay with the stock configuration. Totally up to you.
Is it necessary to change the rotor cover? Or can you just do the sprockets?
It is necessary to replace the rotor cover to do the upgrade to the SE compensator. The spring pack and spindle slide up against it which aligns the front sprocket with the clutch sprocket.
Very good, detailed video, but one thing bothers me: Your shop practice is dirty as hell; you don't clean components before reinstalling, you don't clean threads before you reapply loctite, etc. It was fun, tho.
Is that “Belleville” or “bevel”......as in a con-caved beveled washer........?
They're called Belleville Washers. They are concaved and made from Spring Steel. They act like a spring when stacked against each other. Thanks for asking.
You have a lot of debris to fall into that bearing setup, as your banging on it.
I could see dirt bouncing around, but I don't think any got into the bearing itself. This is the backside of the inner primary which does get exposed to dirt and dust, etc.