Is the 5.56 weak or a bad combat round?
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- Опубліковано 14 жов 2024
- There is some controversy over whether or not the 5.56 is effective in combat or self defense. This short video will get into some of the talking points about why and how those opinions were formed and why the round as a whole got an unfair reputation.
It can't compare to the 9mm which can blow the lungs OUT of the body.
😂😂😂
FACTS!
When I was an Armored Courier, we had a picture posted with the statement "30 plus rounds of 9mm fired, it took the .357 Magnum round to put him down"
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All rounds are underpowered compared to those heatseeking ones that can shoot 30 rounds/second due to a bump stock making a rifle into a gun.
Speaking from firsthand experience, the 5.56 is a killer, no doubt about that. However, it's stopping or knockdown power is lacking due to it's lightweigt bullets. Most times, especially in high energy or combat situations, it takes mulitiple body shots to stop the threat. I have seen on numerous occasions it take three, or four or more shots from a 5.56 to stop the threat, except headshots of course. Even with four or five rounds center mass the threat is not always neutralized. It takes quite a few seconds for the damage to take full effect, whereas with larger calibers like 7.62 with heavier bullets, usually one shot to the body will put the threat down. Mass does matter. I'm not trashing the 5.56 or touting one above the other, just relating my experience. All claibers have their strong and weak points and excell in some areas above others.
yea so round for round the 5.56 is NOT a killer than with your own admission...Have you seen the sig 716i or the SFAR (the reliable ones at least)? Those are sexy rifles that don't fire peashooter rounds
I wondered about that until I watched the video of Travis Haley dumping insurgents in Najaf at 700-800 meters. More than adequate for my urban needs.
He dumped them at that range with 5.56? I know alot of people tease me for running 5.56 lol
Stop glazing and fangirling for the sociopaths in the US globohomo empire that lose every war
It's not a good look homie
This bullet is going something like 1600 ft per second at over 500 yd!
The AR platform is a genius invention. It's a rock hard barrel, bolted too. A rock hard receiver, with a recoil device. Sticking out the back that you can just bolt the stock to making the gun is rigid as a crowbar! The rounds are small but very powerful, the guns are very accurate, so it's even better to carry into battle in a larger weapons that have poorer ballistics like the AK-47! You can short stock it in a heartbeat, attach anything to it to make it even more effective, including a suppressor. And it's relatively easy to hit an 8-in wide target at 500 yards with an open sight on a young person set of eyes! It might not be the hunting round you need. Although you could kill everything up too. A whitetail with it relatively easy and they are legal and whole numbers of states for killing mule deer. It's got a low recoil, and with the optics available it's so easy. Put the thing on semi-auto as opposed to full auto and just pop one target after another! Not a thing wrong for what it was intended for.
I have a 450 yard range and because 223 is generally a little less expensive than %.56 I shoot 223. At that distance its very accurate and very deadly, nothing wrong with it. A 90 grain bullet would help with stability but changing to another round would bugger up logistics.
That would be cool, but is there a 90 gr .223 or 5.56 that can fit into a standard 5.56 magazine? I know there are some bolt action.233 rifles out there that have heavier and longer projectiles than the 77gr, but they don’t feed from a standard magazine.
When I was in service we used 7.62 and it always took the enemy out of the fight. 5.56 not so good in my opinion
Afghanistan? Was it as accurate? How do you feel?
The barrels in the early M-16's had a 1/12 twist. Barely enough spin to make it stable. Making it very easy for the bullet to tumble on impact.
My SHTF Setup is my BCM 11.5" QRF chambered in 5.56. It has a 1/7 Twist Rate so I try to maintain and shoot a healthy stock of 77gr OTM and SMK. Still don't have a dynamic enough range where I can really push the limits of shooting, at least beyond 200yds where my 14.5" would shine but my BCM is what I know will give me the best chance in a SHTF situation. I still want to eventually get me a rifle chambered in .308 or 6.5 Creedmore on up to a 6.8 or 30-06.
I'm just an average Joe.... but, I'd like to know what to stock up on for SHTF.... I'd love to see a video that compares (3) barrel lengths (10.5, 16" and 18") shooting at 200 yards with 55gr fmj, 77gr otm, and 62 soft point..
It'd be nice to see what each barrel length would do at each target with each ammo.... targets would be ham shoulders.
I'd recommend 300 blk, 7.62x39, maybe 6.5 grendel, 6mm arc or 6.8 spc if you can afford if you want a somewhat common nato round go .308 or 7.62NATO but i generally wouldn't recommend 308 due to shortened life of the rifle higher pressures. Stock up on those ammos I would strongly recommend 30 cal for its increased performance in not only shorter barrels 300/7.62x39 but longer ones too 6.5 6.8 6 arc and energy retention at distance
I still don't understand how the US military jumped from 7.62mm NATO straight to 5.56mm NATO without even considering the 6mm range of caliber, until now with their 6.8mm NGSW program.
That’s a great question
I've read about the problems of the M855 5.56×45mm NATO green tips in the book Black Hawk Down. Delta Force and U.S. Army Rangers fighting hard in Somali 1993. Some of the Delta and Rangers reported hitting combatants in the body. However, they believed the M855 was ineffective because the Somalis were so thin, underweight, and skinny that the bullets literally just zip right through them. If you look at the reports of the 1986 Maimi shootout. Rank Robber Michael Platt used a Mini-14 with .223 Ammunition to deadly effect against 8 FBI agents trying to arrest him in a 4 min gunbattle that resulted in 2 Federal Agents killed and 3-4 seriously wounded. Depends on where to get your source. I still perfer and will go to the 5.56mm for any SHTF scenario.
One thing I learned after years of seeing a lot of GSWs, projectiles can be unpredictable when it comes to terminal ballistics, ballistic gelatin is not always a fortune teller.
I am fairly certain all 556 are measured with a 20 inch barrel and 223 with a 24. Every reloading manual I've read is that way, not 100% sure on factory standards.
Jesse Allerdings Stoner designed that cartridge for the AR and that rifle for that cartridge. It is very effective. Then folks began to shorten the barrel and we know the round loses muzzle velocity and muzzle energy but they still did it and then complain about it being weak. They began to use anti-material rounds like the M855 and then complain about it not being an effective anti-personnel round. So they are shooting an anti-material round in a short barrel and complaining about it being weak and ineffective and not stopping threats. They did everything they could to weaken the effectiveness of the round and then complain about it. The original round is effective as it was designed for the original rifle it was designed for.
I love .223/5.56 but I have always loved .308 a touch more and its been my favorite and go to for many years.
I can tell with the screen name. Not a bad round if one can haul the weight.
@@Duty2Domicileyou don’t need to haul the same amount of cartridges as a 5.56 because it isn’t a suppressive round when used in anything other than a machine gun.
This is a great video man
Thank you, I’m glad you liked it.
With the 77 grain OTBT projectile 5.56 is an excellent round. Only problem is the cost.
You ain’t kidding, sometimes you can find the Israeli stuff or Atlanta arms stuff for a good deal but the cost does make me focus on my fundamentals for the price 😂
Do you think these heavier otm rounds are better than m855a1 against armored enemies like the russians?
Considering their body armor was extremely faulty and most contained egg cartons instead of actual plates, yes.
How does the military get around hollow point rules with the M17/M18 which are now used exclusively with 9mm JHP+P ?
So for stateside use, it is completely legal as it’s not for war. Unfortunately, we can easily justify using it on a stateside threats but not against enemies in the theater of war.
@@Duty2Domicile Yes there is a difference between signatory foreign enemies of war and domestic enemies that are not signatories of the Hague. Rule 77 of the Hague Convention. The 1899 Hague Declaration concerning Expanding Bullets states: The Contracting Parties agree to abstain from the use of bullets which expand or flatten easily in the human body, such as bullets with a hard envelope which does not entirely cover the core or is pierced with incisions.
556 id good but can be improved. A 92 grains bullet moving at 960 mts would be the best for 556.
Do not underestimate the power of 5.56 out of a 20 inch barrel
I run m855 and heavier, 1/7 twist rate. I'm not too worried about over pen, know your target and what's beyond it...most of my targets would trend at a downard angle, fairly non issue for me personally.
Also it's sighted to m855 so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The military should’ve never switched over to a faster twist rate and heavier bullet weight they should’ve stayed with what worked a 1in12 twist barrel and a 55grain bullet using the 20 inch barrel or a 16 inch nothing shorter or longer and the 5.56 is deadlier
Good point. I do believe how the bullet is constructed is another major factor however. I don’t believe the green tip helps anything other than going through a little more material. In the case of GWAT, this was not needed as the enemy did not have body armor and penetrating through regular cars could be done using just about any regular rounds. IMO, a 75-77gr OTM would have been the best option for most engagements and probably would have been cheaper to mass produce for the military than the M855 or the M855A1.
I think that a 6mm projectile would improve the round substantially. Other than suppression, I don’t really understand the short barrel craze.
A shorter weapon is better suited for CQB. 5.56 is not a bad round for follow up shots you are quicker on target. However I would prefer the AR-10 platform over an AR-15 for knockdown if over penetration is not a concern.
@@rainman6080 never done any cqb , just figured the video was about ballistics.
Weight is the main reason. With the new round being made for the M7 now, the Army wanted the shortest package it could get for it’s mandated ballistic objectives. Even a M16A4 can get heavy after a while on long patrols being outside all day with all the gear on.
@@rainman6080 Barrel length is a training problem. Not a problem with the rifle. The velocity and energy effectiveness of any round is reduced with a shorter barrel. It is further reduced against soft targets by using an anti-material round rather than an anti-personnel round.
@@rbm6184 who said anything about barrel length being an issue with training? It’s a fact shorter weapons work best in CQB situations, however at a detriment of long range ballistics due to not using up all the powder. When your barrel is sticking out further prior to entering a room it gives the “bad guy” time to get on target faster. It is why you do weapons transition from rifle to handgun when in close quarters. Now if everyone had a flash bang or frag to throw into every room it wouldn’t matter much when you enter.
It's not the best, but it gets the job done! Many have tried to replace 5.56 for Military use, and many have failed. It's hard to beat within 300 yards, considering how light the ammo is, how low the recoil is, and how accurate it is.
6.8 x 51mm definitely isn't replacing it, I can tell you that much!
I agree, until there is a threat that uses more body armor than the US military does, I think the 5.56 is here to stay for a long while.
@Duty2Domicile I've actually done a bit more research since I've posted this comment. And while my opinion still mostly stays the same, I do have to say the closest runner up that I've come across is the new 6mm MAX Cartridge. The performance on it, while not as great as say 6mm ARC when you consider overall performance, specifically with higher grain weight bullets. It still has a good selection of grain weights from 55 up to 107 grain. And compared to 5.56, it outperforms it by 200-400 FPS, regardless of barrel length. Even the heavier 105 grain rounds I've seen are still faster than 77 grain 5.56 out of the same barrel length. Overall between a 14.5 to 24 inch barrel is producing 1,400 to 1,750 foot lbs of Energy. Considerbly higher than 5.56! Plus unlike other intermediate cartridges that have tried to replace 5.56, it only requires a barrel swap and different magazines due to it's slighlty higher OAL. I think this would be a lot more practical compared to other intermediate cartridges, and much more practical for standard infantry than .277 Fury. And on top of all this, the weight isn't that much more than 5.56, and the recoil is about the same as well.
But that's just my opinion. I still think 5.56 is a viable cartridge, but 6mm MAX seems like the most practical choice of 5.56 were to be replaced.
I found the 5.56 PPU to have the best price
Gwot years LoL, brother we're still in gwot years, that shit isn't ever going away seemingly.
Lol, you do have a point there😂.
@@Duty2Domicile i have medals for gwot...and frankly the threat is trending more toward domestic lately with leftists hurting kids, and current coup installment.
Comparing the 5.56 to a 308 NATO rifle is hilarious I’m just honest 5.56 is weak plus 308 has better capabilities.
I agree compared to the 308, the smaller 5.56 is weaker but with the right grain weight and barrel the 5.56 is very effective against soft targets. The problem is the military tried to make it a do all round that doesn’t make it do anything great. But the smaller round is more common to find and cheaper to train with which is a big factor. In a crazy situation it may be better to have more of the weaker rounds than just a handful of the full power rifle rounds. But since I can’t see into the future, you could be right on your choice depending on what situation you may find yourself in. Thank you for the comment!
Yes, it's no where near a 30cal anything.
That's why the military is looking to get away from it. Foot-pounds of energy counts. Even though gel test don't show you that.
Exactly a 30 cal round has a lot more umph when it hits you even with body armor you should expect a broken rib or two.
It’s designed to wound. It does that job pretty well. It will drop some varmints with the quickness though.
Nuisance with self defense legality. Home burglar will sue you for shooting him. Might as well get the job done with one bullet.
Fudd lore
If you have ever shot someone with a 5.56, this is a non issue. Armchair commando talk.
That’s what follow up shots and shot placement is for if they don’t go down with the first which is more often the case.
@@Duty2Domicile Seems like people are transferring the one shot M1911 knock-down mentality onto their rifles.
@@DeltaEchoGolf I think you may be correct in some ways about that.
Keep that Russian ammo it's not coming in the country no more I'm not shooting none of my tula or Barnaul ammo no more puting it to the side might be worth some $ one day.