The fact that Katniss was another name for swamp potato was kinda hilarious. It probably annoyed snow so much that he ended up losing to a swamp potato
A girl from district 12 writes a song for him. A girl from district 12 sing that song as an anthem to lead a rebellion against him. That's more ironic from Snow's prespective.
In my opinion, Casca Highbottoms did not simply « hate » Coriolanus, but was scared of him. He knew the kind of person his father was, and he could probably recognize him in Coriolanus. He tried discouraging Snow not by hate, but because he knew , rightfully so, what he was capable of.
Yeah 100% the discussion at the end felt like he was implying he was intentionally sabotaging the games or enjoyed that they were doing poorly, and he knew snow’s ideas were going to revive them so he wanted to stop him in his tracks.
Thats what I've thought too. In a way, didn't Casca then kinda pull a Voldemort? in the sense that he gave Snow an enemy to work against, to be more motivated in his ambitions against. He kind of helped make Snow more of a monster in his effort to keep him down?
Anyone who's sceptical about seeing this movie due to critics please go and see it yourselves and decide for yourselves. I just got back from the movies and thought it was amazing!
i think that the scene with snow and the mockingjays is actually so important for catching fire. Snow is being haunted by lucy gray's voice and her song. We know that katniss is a reminder to snow of lucy gray. In the 75th hunger games, jaybjays were used in the hunger games, copying the screams of the ones that they love. I feel that this is snow's revenge to lucy gray. Doing to katniss what lucy gray did to him
yes! She was the only person he ever loved besides his family. He almost gave up everything by running away with her. She's also so special because she's a "mystery" and he never really knew where she ended up or if she's dead, but she knew all his secrets! He doubted the games because of her and he only ever had empathy for her! But he's nuts so he will always blame her for almost leading him away from the path to becoming president; Snow resents Lucy Gray for almost taking away his power because of their love. He never loved any of his wives. Of course he thinks about her all the time. @@Gaia_Seraphina
@@Gaia_Seraphina Yes. He fell in love with Lucy. He deliberately did not marry for love. And plenty of people remember their first love, even decades later. Not to mention that, imo, Lucy Gray is not someone that Snow would easily forget. He was still sharp and spry in his 80s. There was nothing wrong with his memory.
it was defo a hallucination of Lucy Gray running in the forest, because she was wearing the dress from the hunger games and not the one she was wearing when she left the house to get some Katniss. However whether she was still nearby is a mystery, but the one he actively shot at I think was a hallucination. But also considering that he found an earring contradicts that idea, so really its all just an interpretation.
I think thats rigth, every thing was an hallucynation. She was scaping, not trying to make him mad. She didnt sang he hallucinated she sanging and birds repeating...
Agreed. Also how would it be possible that she gets shot, falls and screams, but when Snow walks over while aiming the entire time at the place he shot her, she’s somehow gone? Like maybe the trees could’ve hidden her temporarily but Snow 100% would’ve seen or heard her get up and run away. Not to mention it’s hard to do so with a bullet wound, and she was running in the wrong direction. Had to be a hallucination. Snow’s eyes looked unfocused and the whole scene seemed dream-like.
The one scene I wish they had that was in the book was the peacekeeper party where Lucy Gray sang the hanging tree for the first and only time out loud. It would help explain why it was forbidden to be heard in district 12 and how eventually they ban singing and dancing in the district period.
@@itsshaninaQuestions like what happened to Lucy Gray Baird? And I just finished seeing the movie and thought it was 5 out of 5 or 10 out of 10 it was an amazing movie!
I think the snake thereby coincidence and it just emphasizes his paranoia, we learn in the book when he runs freaking outback to the doctor that the snake wasn’t even poisonous at all. Which shows his paranoia is at an all time high because he assumes Lucy is trying to kill him.
@@henryilderton3254 She for sure tried to kill him. The way she's acting before she leaves, how she hides to watch his reactions before sprinting off. Why did she drop the scarf and never pick it up? Why did she not call out to him when he was looking for her? Why did she not try to explain herself after he was bit? There's too many loose ends that show she always meant to kill him. Another one is katniss grows by the lake because it is an aquatic plant. She claimed to be heading out to pick some, so why wasn't she by the lake and why was her scarf in the forest?
@@vladdracula8103so, in the book, as he reaches for the orange scarf he gets bitten and believes that Lucy Gray planted it because she knows how to deal with snakes. The whole town he’s heading back to the peacekeeper bank he thinks he is dying because of the snake. When he makes it back to the nurse she takes one look at the bite and tells him what snake it was and it is not venomous and to just let the bite feel, additionally she tells him that the RAIN brings those snakes out, they only come out during the rain. So Lucy Gray didn’t plant the snake but his delusions made up a different story at the moment. However, in the movie because the whole books story has to be so compacted they use this scene as a way to hunt towards her cleverness and survivalist persona which is showed in different ways throughout the book. Its also a better connection to the other movie adaptations because of the whole idea that Lucy Grays legacies come back to haunt him 64 years later by Katniss
The reason why Snow went after Katniss so much is because unlike Lucy Gray Katniss is real and can resist him. Ironically everything Snow suggested for future Hunger Games backfired and made sure Katniss' actions are never forgotten
Also loved the movie, the only thing I wish they did differently was their romance. In the book there was much more progression ( I.e the kiss before the games, snow bringing her food not because she asked, different moments together) I wish they would’ve built this up a little more so it makes the ending more strong when they both go their separate ways
And the fact that when Lucy sings the song about snow in the book, snow cries and stays and listens, whereas in the movie he’s already walking away not even listening to the song.
Couldn’t agree more, some of those parts of the book were crucial to their story. I do wish we got to see more of ‘life in district 12’ namely the covey’s performances, the Captain’s birthday and as you say, the song about Snow and him staying to listen.
@@cd2_ I know, I really hated the way that they scripted that scene. I don't know what the director was thinking. Actually, several scenes could have been better fleshed out, although the film was very good overall.
One incredible detail that Rachel Zegler brought up in an interview (and was also in the book) is that the katniss root picked by the Covey "wasn't ready yet." It was such a clever nod to the original trilogy and further proof of Lucy Gray's ghost coming back to haunt Coriolanus in time.
It could also imply it's too soon to start the rebellion against the Capitol. Also, remember the rebels planned to go North. North of District 12 is District 13. District 13 already planned the next rebellion the moment they lost during the First Rebellion. Recruiting District 12 people into District 13 like what they did with Gale is not a challenge considering how anyone can disappear from District 12 like Lucy Gray Baird.
Olivia's song goes SO well with the ending of the movie I also do believe that Lucy placed the snake under the shawl. Before leaving the hut, Lucy says "Well I'm not made of sugar" which to me has a double meaning. Number one is her telling him that she'll be fine because it's just rain. Number two is that she isn't as sweet as Snow views her to be.
Yes the “ I am not sugar” comment instantly gave me a sour patch kid vibe. Sour then sweet. I was very nervous that she had set him up and had ratted him out when he was searching for her following that comment.
Facts!!! Thats the first thing that came too my head was her letting him know…… watch who you mess with i aint the one to be played with hahaha. I loved it.
The first thing that came to my mind when I heard this was the scene in arena before the jar holding the snakes broke and it was revealed that there were actually a snakes inside, the presenter said wouldn't it be funny if there was candy in it? it is a strech but it is fun to think Lucy gray is not a sweet candy but a jar holding snakes inside
One core element in Coriolanus' character development is his relation with power. From the very beginning, Snow likes to control his appearance and to be very purposeful with everything he says. Everything he does is calculated, Sejanus, too, mentions it late in the movie (and book). I believe in the movie there is less emphasis put on Dr. Gaul's assignment that is given to Snow than in the book. That assignment is about connecting chaos, control, and contract, the third one which he often forgets about in the book. Every time Coriolanus is confronted with chaos, he's struck by deep fear. That fear reminds him of the war days, which deeply traumatized him. I feel like whatever happens, to him, is better than another war, in which he lost everything. Killing a few kids in The Games, then, becomes little in his eyes, in comparison. All throughout the story, Snow loves things he can control. He loved Lucy Gray in a cage. Not so much in the arena, when she was with Jessup. But very much when Jessup died and Lucy Gray relied only on Snow to survive. He never liked unpredictable people like Dean Highbottom, and, at the beginning, Dr. Gaul. He liked jabberjays alright because they could be controlled, but he absolutely despised mockingjays, which could sing as they liked, free. He liked Sejanus when he could keep him in control, but whenever he acted by himself, not at all. There are so many more things to point out. When he felt he didn't have control over Lucy Gray, he didn't like her anymore. Sure, he probably still loved her, but he despised how free she wanted to be. To him, freedom allowed chaos.
This is such a brilliant viewpoint. Makes me realize that his interpretation of love is skewed, because he was overly obsessed with his need to control everything
The film really surprised me in the most positive way. The last five minutes literally gave me goosebumps. Amazingly shot and written movie! Exceeds the book and the first four movies, in my opinion.
Catching fire and ballad of songbirds and snakes are definitely my two favorite hunger games movies and books. I LOVE villain origin stories and this is one of the best villain origin movies I’ve ever seen along with Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith. SOOOO well made and thooght through🤭
I don't like how in the hunger games they were making Lucy unrealistically dodge all those weapons 😭 and how they rushed Lucy's and snow's relationship
I think Lucy Gray put that snake under the scarf, she saw how snow was acting from the moment they left together, between his slip up, they way he reacted to the guns, and in general the way he looked at her and their new life. She had every reason to leave without him seeing as he didn't want nor needed to go. The snake is a message of her mistrust and a clear sign that she left him behind.
This film is a solid installment of the Hunger Games franchise I'm convinced Dr Gaul was made for Viola Davis. Her presence was always there ;even if only in the background. Very menacing and that laugh! She deserves an award of some sort for this role.
@@libert11347 thank you at least someone gets it. The movie wasn’t absolutely horrible but it’s nowhere near as phenomenal as the book. So many necessary character relationship scenes are just left out
Reviewers have a nasty habit of panning movies that explore ideas they find personally distasteful. Think Sylvester Stallone's Rocky movie, which was despised by the intelligentsia even as it firmly resonated with the American public.
I think this is the best stance to take things. It's a huge stretch to say that the movie was terrible when it isn't really nad, but the book is definitely superior overall.
The book elucidates Lucy Gray's desire to escape to the north, aligning with the plans of rebels such as Sejanus Plinth, Billy Taupe, and Spruce. Adding intrigue is the revelation that north of District 12 lies District 13, where rebel activity was most concentrated. I believe District 13 planned the rebellion years before the 10th Hunger Games and have been recruiting and "disappearing" District 12 citizens into their ranks. However, it seems improbable that Lucy lingered in District 13 for long, given its isolated environment. Instead, she likely continued her journey further north, venturing into the Wilds. There, she may have stumbled upon a community existing beyond the borders of Panem. Despite Lucy's unknown whereabouts, her impact on Panem endures through her songs, the people she inspired, and her historical connection with Snow. Regarding District 13, the hints that the rebels actually knew that traveling north was helpful for the rebellion shows how District 13 is already scheming from the very beginning and District 12 is a fresh recruiting ground for soldiers and people to help with rebellion work since people can easily "disappear" and "escape." I doubt Lucy perished, especially since Katniss did not find a corpse in the forest. If she had, it's unlikely she would return to a place where a person was murdered. Overall, I believe Lucy escaped Panem into the Wilds to break free from the cycle of hatred, by walking away from the chessboard. Unlike Lucy, Snow does not escape, which ultimately leads to his demise and loneliness in the end. Snow did not join Lucy because he could not find peace in leaving the chessboard but by controlling and tormenting the chess pieces. In the case of Snow, I believe that deep down, he harbored a profound resentment towards the Districts, stemming from the First Rebellion that robbed him of his childhood happiness, his mother, his family's power, and his innocence. Snow's desire for retribution likely manifested a desire to turn Panem into a living hell for all the districts, a vengeance that would persist until his eventual overthrow. Initially, he suppressed his animosity, but over the years, it festered within him until Dr. Gaul unleashed the beast from its cage. As a Peacemaker, he likely relocated to District 12 to probe into why he felt drawn to Lucy Gray and sought to comprehend how she found peace despite growing up in the poorest district. He also wanted to know if Dr. Gaul was right that human beings are animals no matter how innocent or guilty they are. Despite his experiences, Snow recognized that he couldn't escape his inherent nature of selfishness and hatred. Consequently, he succumbed to Dr. Gaul's teachings, transforming into the living embodiment of a tyrant and a devil. Why Coin hates Snow? Coriolanus' father, Crassus Snow, made most of his family wealth from District 13, and I do not doubt Coin inherited her family's hatred of the Snow family since the Snow Family monopolized the suffering of District 13 for their own power, wealth, and influence.
@@leafyveins4985 Fair enough. To be honest, I'm fine with all possibilities. She could've died in the forest, stumbled into Thirteen, or maybe even left Panem altogether. What I have taken from BOSAS is that the probability of there being other countries increased exponentially. Why would the Capitol have a Navy otherwise? Who knows?
I was at the premiere and I was MINDBLOWN. I am a very big Hunger Games fan. I read all the books, watched all your hunger games videos, and I couldn’t be happier with the movie I would even say I personally preferred more to the original three movies. I’m not sure if it’s because of the style filmed or what, but i’m kinda shocked it didn’t get great reviews from critics. May the odds be ever in your favor, y’all! ❤
I went into the cinema not expecting too much but the film was amazing! I was so pleasantly surprised! I want to watch it again to completely make up my mind, but as of watching it once last night, I prefer it to the other 4 films - and this also coming from a huge hunger games fan 😊
When I finished the book, my first thought was that Dr. Gaul was involved in everything step by step making these 2 be together, either for love or survival. Maybe she gave Lucy some immunity and protection from the capitol, that’s why she had to leave because she did not have the courage to tell Coryo of her betrayal. Exactly the same as Coryo did not tell Lucy about his betrayal towards Sejanus. And from that moment on, Dr. Gaul accomplish her goal of not only manipulating Coryo for becoming president, but have the same vision of why the games needed to exist in first place. A broken heart can be manipulated in every single way and aspect, Dr. Gaul took advantage of that.
I think Dr. Gaul planted the explosions in the arena to justify her attack with the snakes later on And also she wanted to make Felix Ravenstill, the "son" of President Ravenstill, disappear so that Snow can succeed him as President Dr. Gaul wants Snow to become president so that the games continue after her death Dr. Gaul was responsible for everything from the beginning
@@edra2005Yes! I thought of that too because she was like an omnipotent figure all throughout the book always asking Coryo what where the games for and he at first seemed hesitant on answering, but later you see him more secure of his answers.
@@edra2005 My thoughts exactly. Further, maybe she carried out such exercises of ensuring loyalty towards the continuance of the games with other students earlier in secrecy. When they failed to concur with her, they were eliminated such as Clemensia. Snow would be the last once to undergo such an exercise, reflecting the decline in the Snow name.
@@hrishikeshharitas2456Exactly! You know, I missed that part in the film where she became for a moment a snake 😂. I wanted to see her scaly transformation.
Saw this movie yesterday. Had very low expectations because of the reviews but this was a solid 10/10 for me. Came very close to the book, which is surprising since the book was quite long. Despite the critics, I think Rachel was the best one to cast for Lucy Gray. This was how I imagined her to be. I only wished for them to have SOME romantic buildup, considering how fast they fell in love. But overall, I loved it.
I read somewhere that the book was written with the movie in mind, I’m guessing that had to do with how well adapted it was (I haven’t read the book tho, but the movie sure made me wanna do it now)
@@agme8045I read the book when the movie was being made and I noticed there are details that the book doesn't mention, like physical descriptions of some characters, which makes it easier to cast actors without people complaining they don't match the characters' description. I'm sure there's a lot more book details that keep the movie adaptation in mind. Very clever. I'm dying to see the movie, even though I don't like Rachel Zegler 😅
@@Falconer22 Oh.. :( I wish I was being paid for it honestly. I just have a different view on the movie than a lot of you. Sure, there were some aspects of this movie that were a little out of context, but I liked it and that's just my opinion. There are people who like it, and people who don't like it. Not that hard, isn't it?
The very first thing ı wanna say about this film is that they should have definetely split it into two seperate films."The Peacekeeper" part felt so disturbingly rushed.So many important and necessary points went missed.
This thought just struck me randomly, but what if Dr. Gaul killed/kidnapped Lucy Gray to get Snow to fully abandon what was left of his humanity and go back to the Capitol to be her mentoree, after finally losing both his best friend and girlfriend? We know she had Sejanus hung after receiving the bird’s message from Snow, so why couldn’t she also then plant those guns to make Snow suspicious and have people kill/kidnap Lucy Gray to fully alienate Snow from anyone who brings out his empathy? I didn’t read the book, so I can only describe clues to this in the movie, but I kept thinking: where did Lucy Gray get that blood from to stain the scarf? Also, she knew how important it was to him. It didn’t make sense that she would maliciously destroy it like that, even if she was going to abandon him. She of all people, who wears her late mother’s dress, knows how sentimental that scarf was to Snow. And she just happened to have a snake with her to hide in the scarf? Even if she didn’t trust Snow, this seemed pretty out of character for her, the girl who tries not to harm anyone. And she was so outspoken, so why wouldn’t she just confront him about her doubts instead of running away? And how could her footprints disappear to nowhere? I know this is part of the mystery and her name’s story, but what if it’s more than that? There was a rainstorm happening, which could have covered up the sound of a helicopter. Could she have been singing Hanging Tree when they killed/kidnapped her, which is why the Mockingjays were singing it? And why were the guns stored in that cabin? Lucy Gray says Spruce must have know about the hideout…or…Dr. Gaul had people put them there after hanging Spruce and Sejanus and finding the guns. Who else was the only other person who’s had eyes on Snow the whole time and wanted him to be her mentoree? Dr. Gaul. I would need to rewatch the film to see if this theory makes any sense, but honestly, I kind of believe it. It was all too perfect. Snow was running off with Lucy Gray, after contacting Dr. Gaul through the bird message that killed Sejanus. Dr. Gaul had Sejanus hung and expected Snow would come back to Captiol, but the only thing keeping him from that was Lucy Gray. Dr. Gaul could have known that by sending people to kill/kidnap Lucky Gray and stage the scene to make it look like she abandoned him (which was a bit sudden honestly), it would send Snow over the edge. It would make sense that it was all her grand plan to have Snow become her mentoree back at the Capitol. She kept stressing that she was watching him and that he passed her test. What test? Betraying his only friend? Or maybe, getting bit by that snake was the test. What was his response to that bite? Immediately trying to hunt down the love of his life after going into a rage, thinking she abandoned him. When he answers Dr. Gaul’s question again, about what the hunger games are really for, he says “it shows us who we really are,” just like his true character was shown when he tried to kill Lucy Gray. Plus, Dr. Gaul is the only character other than Lucy Gray who is associated with snakes, so it would make sense that she used a snake to put in Lucy Gray’s scarf. It could have been one that makes people hallucinate, which would explain Snow seeing Lucy Gray running through the forest when he “shoots” her. Maybe he imagined the Mockingjays’ singing too. And that earring he found could have fallen off in a struggle. Or maybe Dr. Gaul soaked that scarf in tracker jacker venom, which he inhaled when he smelled the scarf, causing hallucinations. I’d definitely like to read the book now through this theory’s lens to see if it has any weight. I’d love to hear others’ opinions on this, along with anything that supports or challenges this theory. :)
@@That_AboElHamd Thanks for the feedback :) I also believe it after revisiting certain movie scenes. If Dr. Gaul had made Snow her mentoree right away, he would have always wondered: “What if a peaceful life with the love of my life and my best friend would have been a more worthwhile and happier existence than a life orchestrating violence through The Games? What if a life in a district without wealth - but with music, friendship, and love - was the right path instead of staying in the Capitol and following in the footsteps of my father?” Dr. Gaul “tested” Snow by letting him live out his fantasy of peace, only to push him to choose violence in the end by taking away the people who reminded him of his humanity, completing the dark transformation of his character. At the end of the movie, Snow answers Dr. Gaul’s question by saying The Games shows us “who we really are.” Just like how The Games alienates the tributes from their loved ones and forces them to watch their friends in the games die while turning them into killers, Snow believes he was shown who HE really was after being alienated from his family after leaving the Capitol, watching his best friend be hung, and trying to kill the only girl he’s ever loved after he believes she abandoned him, leaving him all alone. But it didn’t have to go that way. He could have ran off with Lucy Gray, which is why I believe Dr. Gaul got rid of her one way or another, just like she got rid of Sejanus. I haven’t seen anyone else suggest this theory, but I think it would be consistent with the movie’s message.
This was exact theory everything was too perfect and controlled and I feel like the other theory miss a lot of symbolism. I find it interesting that we both share the same theory and we both haven’t read the book so I wonder if our theories will change when we read the book
🤔 Interesting... Very interesting. Now I gotta go rewatch it. I’ve never read the books either. I’ve only seen the movies. Personally I really enjoyed this movie. I’ve always rooted for Snow. Yeah even in the original trilogy. 😂
Has anyone noticed that when Snow shot Lucy Gray in the forest she was wearing her original rainbow dress but when they ran away together she was wearing something different? Maybe Snow was hallucinating everything going on but ofc the scarf and the earring is something left on.
In the movie I was a little confused with if he actually had killed her when he took that shot while she was running or as if like you stated, he was hallucinating.
The book confirmed that the snake wasn't poisonous. Snow went to the nurse who told him it was just a harmless snake bite. So he most likely was being paranoid@@sinisiren6992
What I really love about what they did is how they showed Snow’s internal conflict on screen without stating it. Just simply watching Tom Blyth act the internal struggle he’s dealing inside. Showing us that at the end Snow will always choose what benefits him more that will usher him to his ambitions.
I honestly think that Lucy Gray survived because I don't think that Snow would be very likely to hit her when he was shooting in all directions and also shooting at the Mockingjays.
I think Lucy Gray died of exposure. I don't think Snow hit her when he shot at her. There was no way she would make it to a district that no one believe even still existed, and she couldn't go back to 12 because Mayor Lipp would have killed her.
@@sparingpickle4918 Not a chance Lucy Gray was Coin. In Mockingjay, Coin was 50 years old. Lucy Gray would have been 80. And her name is Lucy Gray, not just Lucy.
SPOILERS!!! This movie was incredible! The scene of the arena blowing up and the 360 view was so cool! I was hoping for a bit more from the snake scene I kept waiting for her to stand up while she was singing but other than that it was perfection!
Especially when in the book, the snake bite makes the tributes skin and eyes turn different colours 😢 I wish that gory scene would’ve made it in the movie
Something I noticed was how Clemensia trying to turn in snows’ ideas for the hunger games to Dr.Gaul, it was extremely similar to how snows’ father had turned in the Deans papers. When clemensia gets caught lying, she even gets bitten by a snake 😅
I'd like to see an Lucy Gray appearance if Suzanne Collins write a Haymitch Hunger Games book. Seems like that's the one most people would like to see.
I loved this movie, despite the differences and how the fans feel, Dr. Gaul alone made this film worth it. Viola Davis absolutely nailed the role, she freaking killed it! Her performance was just amazing. She was evil. She was dark. She was cynical. But she was also charismatic and had this beautiful charm. I loved her outfits as well and seeing a more rustic-young Panem was amazing. It was cool to see how the arena once was, the drones, the old technology, it was brilliant. When you watch the older films, we now understand how much the capital has changed and how much more punished the districts become. Dr. Gaul also said something in the beginning of the film that caught my interest at the end, Dr. Gaul said she wasn’t gunna last for ever. So she wanted to try something different with the 10th reaping. Dr Gaul was a scientist, geneticist, researcher, and head game maker. She has a crazy amount of value to the capital. Her last project was to make sure Snow would become the exact person to lead the way, she was a monster, but she created an even better one for the future. Snow became a monster, just like she envisioned. I’m baffled and blown away, I love it though.
Personally, I think Lucy gray stopped loving snow after Seamus’s death, after she heard the audio and saw how he had not even a little reaction to his best friends death probably made her realize how evil he is and how easy it could be for him to hurt or betray her, so when she went to get Katniss she was actually trying to flee and escape from him. I think she escaped and went on to live with her band friends, married and had children with one of those band members and her granddaughter is katniss.
I wouldn’t say there was no reaction to Sejanus’ death, because Snow was initially guilt ridden for his role in Sejanus’ death. Here’s my interpretation of Lucy Gray’s realization of Snow indirectly killing Sejanus: by Snow recording Sejanus, it showed he was undoubtedly loyal to the Capitol and he wanted his old life back. He would’ve never been happy being on the run with Lucy Gray, and she (sadly) came to that realization. So you’re right about Lucy Gray believing Snow would’ve betrayed her because he definitely would’ve done so if it meant him returning to the Capitol. Ironically, it was Lucy Gray’s abandonment of him which helped begin his transformation into the tyrant Katniss would fight against decades later. In a way, he felt betrayed by Lucy Gray because he was subjected to a life as a Peacemaker because he was punished for ensuring she survived in the Games. In Snow’s eyes, Lucy Gray cemented what Dr. Gaul was trying to tell him, as well as his hatred for the districts. “It’s the things we love most that destroys us.” Snow’s love for Lucy Gray and her abandonment of him destroyed Coryo… and began the rise of the future President Snow.
Here’s my theory it’s a bit long SPOILER I believe they did truly love each other but once Lucy found out that snow killed 3 people she realized he killed Sajuans (can’t spell it) she couldn’t trust the Snow wouldn’t turn on her too and got scared of him and ran. I do believe she still loved him but didn’t wanna risk anything and didn’t want to get hurt she even wrote a song about him so that can help prove she loved him With Snow idk if he still loved her or not bc she did shoot her and kinda hunted her so idk about him but he was really upset that she left soo I wish snow didn’t turn evil wish they were endgame they were cute and perfect but bc snow turned on his bff what would stop him from Turing on Lucy Snow he turned on Lucy and made Lucy lose trust after mentions he killed 3 people and not just the two she knew of. She was able to figure out that he killed Sejeanus, his friend, so if her turned on his friend what stops him from Turing on Lucy. Also I believe the snake wasn’t poisonous to me I think it was meant to symbolize that Snow was a snake and Lucy knew everything
She realized he was loyal to the capitol and that he cant be trusted. She said trust is the most thing for her so she left since he lied to her about the 3 murders
@@heheingbc how how Rachel was talking about her Snow White role She an amazing actress and singer but she is treating her Snow White role horrible which is gaining her hate
Just finished seeing it and personally I am very satisfied. The thing I appreciated most about the film is how Snow's slow journey towards madness was constructed. I always found it very ironic how Snow said he didn't lie when he himself did nothing but lie to himself for years, telling himself that Lucy wasn't in love with him and that she had hidden the snake specifically to kill him. He repeated it so many times that in the end he didn't really believe it and even created the belief that love was a weakness that had pushed him to behave in an absurd and stupid way and as a result of this belief he ended up pushing Tigris away. the only other person he had left who cared about him. In doing so, Snow ended up remaining alone in a golden prison of self-delusion of his own making, he continued to live there for years but then his illusion began to dissolve the exact moment he saw Katniss and Peeta together because they are exactly what Lucy and Coryo could have been if the latter had chosen love over power. In Catching Fire, when Snow sees Katniss and Peeta hugging, it's written all over his face that he's thinking about Lucy and the life they could have. But instead of finally admitting to himself that he had done everything wrong and that having restored his family's wealth did not make him happy, it made him emptier and more alone, he preferred to continue lying to himself, telling himself that the only way to stop the uprising of the districts and also its doubts was to kill Katniss and the other winners of the previous Hunger Games And Coin, seeing this mental decline in Snow, took advantage of it to put him in check and thus cause his fall and when Coryo noticed it it was too late to fix it. Love wasn't the cause of Snow's destruction, it was his salvation because love wasn't making him weak, it was just making him more human, it was making him a better person
Also I think that fact that Lucy named the plant Katniss and the fact that Katniss has a similar vibe to lucy. In a way I think Katniss really triggered snow from the jump
Because of his childhood indoctrination Snow sincerely believed that the survival of his nation depended on a brutal apartheid system where the Capitol elite maintained harsh control over the rest of the population. He was literally unable to imagine any alternatives.
It is interesting to in Catching Fire Snow told Katniss that she had to convince him of the love she had for Peeta was true. Again, that doubt and previous experience making him believe love is a weakness/show.
@@libnip104 better for the masses to believe Katniss was a silly young woman in love than that she'd found a way to say "Screw you" to the system. Snow cared about what the masses thought because he didn't want to go through yet another armed uprising.
I just watched the movie last night and here are my takeaways: 1. This movie actually does a good job with empathizing with Snows' turn to evil. Anyone can remember being young and in love, only to have the sting from the heartbreak. 2. Even though the books are supposed to be set in the future, there is an eloquent 20s parallel tragedy that's in play here. For example, you see a rise and fall of the decade, similarly how you see a rise and fall of both Snow and Lucy Grey ( reminds me of the lost movies and performances of that decade). 3. Lastly, the acting and singing from Lucy was excellent. You can see and feel how charming and enticing she is. You understand why the mayor's daughter was jealous and how she caught Snows affections. It truly sends a chill down my spine when you realize the parallels to Lucy and Katniss (which leads me to believe that all of those years later, Snow is still traumatized by that heartbreak). All in all, I do think it was a pretty good move to wait nearly decade from the first movie to do this one because it gives us time to reflect back to how the events played out to the mockingjay trilogy.
I loved to movie, it was incredibly made, although I do feel like the jump from Snow being good to being evil is rushed and not very well explained. I kind of understand why, but I also don’t. I feel like he switched really fast from being okay with breaking the rules and risking his life for Lucy Gray to ratting out his best friend and almost killing Lucy Gray for trying to break the rules and “hold him back” or whatever. I just feel like they could’ve done a better job in that part.
I’m not sure if you’ve read the book - but the jump from good to evil isn’t necessarily that it was fast paced. In the book, Snow (whilst he is definitely decent) already demonstrated a lot of red flags in his behaviour and narcissistic tendencies. I don’t think in any universe the good would’ve won him over, he was already walking the path that came naturally to him which was unfortunately evil. Lucy Gray may have provided him incentive to stray more towards his own decency, but I’d say ‘good’ is a stretch even then
If you've read the book, he's never really 'good.' His inner monologue shows this. He teeters the line, always picking the bad decision that's self serving and morally corrupt 💀
Right, in the book it’s more obvious from the start that he’s really more self focused and is already leaning towards the capital side. I was talking specifically about the movie though, if you’ve seen it you’d see that the transition in the movie isn’t as obvious and doesn’t make as much sense. They paint him to be almost completely good in the movie and don’t play any into the side of him that is evil.
i just find this plot soo fascinating and completely enriches the original series. throughout the series, it was apparent snow always had a strange fascination/connection to katniss that was very creepy and offputting. now seeing the similarities between katniss and lucy gray, it makes it all the more interesting because I'm sure snow saw so much of lucy gray in katniss. one scene I found very captivating was when (spoilers maybe?) lucy gray was hiding above those kids while they were trying to kill her, and how they decided to wait until she came down. it paralleled so much with the scene in the first book/movie when katniss is hiding in the tree while the careers are waiting for her to come down. thinking about how snow must've felt watching that moment is just mindblowing to me
On the other hand Snow displayed much more insight into the psychology of District residents than Effie Trinket, the supposed Capitol liaison to Distract 12 who presented as a pampered child of the upper classes with little insight into the stresses on her tribute wards. Snow recognised that Katniss's desperate gamble for survival could be interpreted as massive upraised finger to the system; Effie was delighted to be showering frightened kids with rich food and nice clothes, ignoring the fact that she was shepherding them to their deaths.
I haven't seen the movie yet, but I've read the book. And it's pretty clear from the book that Snow, seeing the weapon he'd been looking for for so long, afraid that his fingerprints would be found, immediately started thinking about what was left to "erase" so that the story of his crime would no longer exist. And that was Lucy. And I think when she saw him find that gun, she thought the same thing. That's why she said she is going to look for Katniss. And she did put the scarf where the snake was. But I also think she knew the snake wasn't poisonous because she didn't want to kill him. It was to delay him so she could get away.
Before Snow leaves the fancy new apartment to see Highbottom, Tigris says “You look just like your father, Coriolanus”. Don’t know if the assessment is accurate, but it’s been pointed out that this is the only time she actually refers to him by his full name, not his nickname of Coryo.
I really want to believe in a bittersweet ending for Lucy, untill the moment of snow finding the scarf i feel she really was looking for Katniss.. (the small holes in the ground) but when she heard his screams she knew it wad time to leave... I think she did get shot but not fatally.. And somehow survived to go to the north.. Where she found more people who escaped long before and lived out a long life..
I feel like snow was never good just calculating. Even sejanus noticed. He said something along the lines of how snow would always be quiet and would only speak up at strategic times.
I read the book when it came out, I saw the film with my dad today and I loved it so much, explaining little details that they didn’t mention was so fun, I think the portrayal of the games was perfect and the way you can tell when ‘cornyo’ becomes ‘president snow’ and how Tigris can tell is so amazing
I think he was so delusional he didnt even shoot lucy grey, when he shot her in the woods.. she was wearing her flower dress and boots from the arena and not the clothes she left the cabin in.
A detail that I noticed in the movie is that one of the tributes that were selected was a girl with the last name Heavensbee. It made me think that is why Plutarch had such motivations for the rebellion later on. And since that broadcasting of the Hunger Games was erased, he was able to become a head game maker without anyone realizing his true motivations. I’m sure Snow forgot too since he had killed so many people since then.
Yeah and snow went after Katniss so much because her symbol was the mockingjay and that was also Lucy’s symbol. I remember how in the end, Lucy sent out dozens of mocking jays to mock her voice and Snow was shooting them all. When district 11 did the mocking jay sign, he got angry and shot them.
In the movie it's heavily implied that she survived, but in the books it's not as clear, Coriolanus knew that he hit her but she escaped, we know that katniss knows the songs that Lucy wrote especially hanging tree which she sung in private, though her friend in the covey wad the only other one who knew her songs so in the books either Lucy escaped and is katniss' grandmother or she died and her friend is
In my mind Lucy was already gone when before he started shooting. It couls have been a venom induced illusion since we see bear tracks where he saw Lucy originally. Additionally, what people may not realize in the movie is that Gall was probably spying on Snow in District 12 so him not coming back with Lucy could have been what helped him in his career.
It makes me wonder that just like Highbottom would Snow kill Gall too? I would probably say yes due to his cruel streak but it would probably be much later if a death ever does come out as far as I am aware. I could see Gall’s death being a karmic demise where she gets killed be her creations which she loved just how much Highbottom died from the morphine that he was addicted to.
@@KL-ki8db I could definitely see it. His mentality of being a victor pushing him to take her down once he learned what he can or she shows a weakness. It would most likely end with her being used in a experiment or against an experiment but she would probably just feel pride for him doing it. Heck I would see her saying "You are my greatest experiment, don't let it all go to waste" and die laughing.
1. I don’t believe both of them truly loved each other, it was all relied on trust. Both of them had a goal, a type of survival, and both of them wouldn’t really be a good pair, because they had so many differences. Even though as an audience, we truly want them together, they were each other’s downfall at the end. 2. I believe C.Snow shooting at the mocking birds in that forest, was him trying to kill Lucy, she became the mocking bird, hovering over him, “mocking him”, leaving him, and looking down upon him. He felt used, betrayed, not powerful, yet is quite contradictory to what he did to her, in which he doesn’t realise. The moment in the movie, where she asks him about those three people he killed, and he directly looked her in the eye, lying to her face, when he knew, that she could throw love away, just so she could trust her, became his own downfall as well. Lucy was just the catalyst in this situation, but he also took advantage of her trust in the beginning when his entire goal, was to get back to his previous luxuries life, in which he got in the end. 3. How I interpret the ending is, Snow became the one caged in, while Lucy became free. Katniss later on those years, is the one who’s haunting him, she reminds him of Lucy. I think Lucy carried on the songs, the person who she was, how she became the “mocking bird” and Snow never became free of Lucy. 4. The snake should have recognised the smell from the mothers scarf, even Snow’s own smell, so, I believe its just a symbol to, that Lucy was the snake. (I haven’t read the book yet)
I wish they would continue making some more prequel books and show the games becoming more about entertainment maybe even have a few books about the other victors from catching fire.
I actually think it’s because Snow actually wanted some type of control over Lucy Gray just like Gale wanted over Katniss if they actually got together but Peeta was the opposite he’d never make her do anything that she didn’t want to do like have kids
@@nmoney6655Katniss does imply though that she had kids for Peeta’s sake though. “It took me five, ten, fifteen years for me to agree. But Peeta wanted them so badly.”
Lucy Gray is a real performer who train to be a hero Katniss is a real hero who train to be a performer. This is why Coriolanus Snow is scare of Katniss. He saw himself as the 'real' Victor of The 'real' Hunger Games because of Lucy, and Katniss will become the next Victor because of Peeta.
The first time Snow hears the name Katniss, he's met with a strong sense of foreboding. I love how the series dabbles in fate and the choices we make. I think Snow becomes paranoid simply because he's an untrustworthy person. He then projects this onto Lucy once they both make the loose end connection. Haunted by the lives he's taken and doubts of Lucy's loyalty begin to seep, which ultimately drives him mad. I don't blame Lucy for getting spooked. He actually lies to her twice, once about the 3rd killing and not mentioning the promotion to District 2. I think the snake was metaphor, he felt as though she'd bitten him after abandoning him in the woods. You can see the deep affection leave his body and turn to pure venom for Lucy.
This movie is a brilliant adaptation of the book and is an amazing prequel to the original hunger games movies. There were critics who said it didn't hit the mark but i think it really did. It truly captures the essence of the book and the character development was equally great. Like the hunger games the thing i like most about Suzan's writing is that the ending is not the same cliched happy ending and that it has twist making the viewer think as to what actually happened. The actors especially viola davis, peter dinklage and tom blyth brought out the depth of character i was expecting. Another plus point was that in the entire movie it never felt rushed, nor did it diverge from the main text which made the experience more enjoyable. Overall a great film....................also i read this theory............lucy gray goes on to become president coin........imagine that.............Feel free to leave thoughts on that
9:50 Casca doesnt hate him because his dad turned his paper in 😭 lmao it's because he was DRUNK and wrote that paper as a joke and now Snow actually started and WILL continue a generation of murderers, so much more than turning in a paper
I loved it really.. the production is amazing and even the story is unexpected .. at the beginning of the movie you would assume that snow is the good guy and you will love him but suddenly he is doing a suspicious things and becoming evail .. unexpected and entresting .. I did not realize that he is the same old man from the original movie
Not to mention - Lucys' song Hanging Tree (or, just, the song she sings, maybe not hers) - lines up with what happened in the movie - they escape first by going to the hanging tree - and Snow escapes being hung, who did kill 3 people - strange things happened, the rebels, and all the craziness our characters have gone thru.
The parallels to Katniss were absolutely brilliant! There was one moment that a lot missed: when Snow goes into the arena after Sejanus and it cuts to a scene displaying the bow and arrows that no tributes grabbed to use as weapons. It's so fascinating how the movie carefully foreshadowed the person who would bring Snow to his demise.
one of the aspects that the movie added that wasn’t in the book was how the relationship between tigris and snow changed. in the book it is implied that they still get along with each other and still mantain their sibling-like relationship, while in the movie we can see the very first blow their relationship takes when tigris says “i think you look just like your father, coriolanius”, making her disappointment of who he’d become be known in a very subtle, but painful way to snow. i think the movie’s take makes it much more interesting because, for once, snow is facing a real consequence of his actions and evil change in character through the relationship that he probably valued most.
These movies are all genuinely wonderful. I was deeply impressed with "The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes", and sooooo much of Snow's actions, and his hatred of Katniss herself, suddenly make so much sense. Out of all book-to-film adaptations, this series has to cap off the cake. Although I do think Mockingjay could have been a single movie.
I went to the movie today. First of all generally I liked it but they cut off so much scene from the books that it harms the main point. Movie is like book's summarized version's another summerized version. Visiually it's everything I wanted but pacing was too fast. Without actually understanding one scene they changed it to another scene. They cut off Valley,Deep in The Meadow, I'll Sell You For A Song and Crawling to you songs. Songs that made to cut were Reaping Song, When I Was A Babe, Old Therebefore, Hanging Tree and Pure as the driven snow. All of them were very beautiful. But I really hoped they would put more songs specially Deep in the Meadow because triology started and ended with that song. Because they cut off so much parts from the book I think they failed to capture complexity of the relationships specially between Lucy and Snow. Movie really feels like they are in a rush. I think the book should have been made into a TV series rather than a movie adaptation. As a book reader I filled the gaps yes but even for me gaps were too messy. That's why splitting Mockingjay to 2 different parts was a good decision now they didn't do that with ballad of songbirds and snakes this messy result came out. 6.5/10 for me. Such a pity they had the closest visiual to the book but pacing and cutting too much parts from the books made it so messy.
Perhaps it felt that way to you because you already had read the book? I mean, you know what’s missing from the movie, what plot holes there are. For me, coming to the cinema without having read a single page of the book, it didn’t seem that way. The story made perfect sense, and I didn’t feel like anything was missing, as some other people said, yes, maybe it was a bit rushed, but I feel like that’s because we like the series, and would love to have much more watch time (at least me)
@@agme8045 My younger brother didn't read the book my sister and I did. My brother also said lots of things were lacking for the plot and movie was rushing. My sister also said the same. Snow's reasons of being evil, making those decisions aren't fully explored. Lucy and Snow's relationship is always so distant in the movie it doesn't have the complexity that book has. Maybe they decided to do it like that for people not to romanticize their relationship. Because it's quite common for toxic unhealthy relationship to be romanticize in our current young media. Lucy also has very a important line in the book. "The show isn't over until Mockingjay sings." which is a very important line to this world. The fact that they didn't add this is dissappinting.
I didn’t understand Snows thought process of killing Serjanus. He could have just ignored Serjanus’ plans and moved on with his business. But why whispering it to the Capitol? What caused him to be evil at that stage? He was a friend that trusted him.
Because everyone would think snow had a part in it they would kill him too, and he wouldn’t be able to escape out of it due to him being poor and serjanus rich. Snow wanted to go back to capital to become his wealthy self again
I believe he thought Serjanus would get him in trouble if he went through with any of his plans. He wanted to get rid of him so there was no chance snow would be in trouble for being associated with him.
It’s what everyone else said-Snow would’ve been guilty by association in the eyes of the Capitol. However, I’ll add in the fact that Snow also saw this as a way to regain favor with the powers that be so he could return to the Capitol.
I went to go see it ASAP yesterday after rereading the entire series. I thought it was really good despite all the changes from the book. I assume you’ll be making a differences between the book and movie, but just wanted to come here and say again I hope you do make one please! My boyfriend has no interest in reading and I need him to know all the differences.
Snow had genuine feelings for Lucy Gray, but his paranoia didn’t exactly get to him. Lucy Gray did leave him and that was because she deduced Snow played a role in his best friend’s death; she even laid a trap for him. As far as your next question, I think Snow would’ve still ended up back at the Capitol. Remember, everything that happened in Snow’s exile, Dr. Gaul had a hand in it, or she was, at the very least, aware of it. Also, by him recording Sejanus and ultimately leading him to death, it showed where Snow’s true loyalties lied - with the Capitol and ultimately himself. I just think he would’ve found a way to betray Lucy Gray to get there.
I think it would have been a better choice for Snow to tell Lucy Gray that the 3rd person he killed was Jessup. Because technically he did convince his classmate to send Jessup water so that it would scare him, make him fall and die. Saving Lucy Gray. Although the blood wouldn’t be “on his hand” he was still responsible for it. I’m sure if Coryo had told Lucy that it was Jessup, the ending wouldn’t be the same and the 2 would’ve gone one and lived alone together. For however long it would’ve lasted till Snow would realized that living a life in the woods wasn’t a life for him.
"Lucy Gray" is a poem written by William Wordsworth in 1799. It ends with a Lucy Gray walking through a snow storm and her fate being unknown because her foot steps had disappeared when people were searching for her. The "Ballad..." book and film therefore recreate the ambiguous vanishing of Lucy Gray.
This is what I think happened: I think she went to District 12 or 13 because her hanging tree song had to pass down somehow. I doubt she would go to 12 because she dosen’t know whether or not there are guards looking for her. I think she went to 13, passed down her songs, her mocking jay symbol, and had a life.
i had a realisation whilst watching this movie, The Hunger Games is a microcosm of Panem. (microcosm: a small version that represents the bigger version in some ways) Think, it’s an arena, people from each district fighting for themselves to the death, getting there own food and water, all being provoked and controlled by the capitol, just like Panem itself, all the districts controlled by the capital. Exept,they all work together, they may not know it or like it. But they all work for the capitol instead of against eachother, but even then, in the hunger games alliances form and betrayals happen
Just came from the theater, I loved it. I love the smalle little clues about katniss being his downfall in the future. The plant to the arrows being seen in the arena.
In the book on page 7 (cause I reread some of it before seeing the film) Snow mentions how fixating on something (like an enemy) would lead to his downfall which is what he mentions to Katniss about Coin in Mockingjay. Not relevant here but still interesting 😊
I really liked it. I just expected that last part to be longer (Snow's training and relationship with Lucy and her band), cause i think one of the theories is that the little girl with blonde hair will pass those songs to Katniss generation. Other than that I loved the soundtrack. It's also funny to me that i was so sad at the end of the book, but i was angry with the film ending 😅, good job.
I like the thought of Lucy Grey being Katniss’s grandmother. It’s makes lots of sense especially with the scene that she shows Snow the Katniss plant as a subtle nod.
i watched the movie today and LOVED it!!!! i haven't read the books but i am so excited too! this film was well done, and i loved the quote from older snow at the end. this movie was so well done! great explanation! the details from the book that were left out of the movie really make the story that much more interesting and intriguing! edit: after reading some comments, i want to mention how interesting it was that the white roses were featured. and when snow is older in the triology, there are white roses that sit on his desk.
I loved the references, the Katniss ones were great but I actually caught the Finnick ones as well 1. snow meets lucy Gray at the train and he gives her a white flower, she tears a bit off and eats it confidently/cocky. this is just like Finnick and the sugar cubes in catching fire. 2. the district 4 female was dying to the snakes and lucy was above, and she called out for help but lucy couldn't do anything. this is just like when Finnick died in mocking jay part 2 and he called out screaming but Katniss couldn't do anything. i think the directors added these details in so we wouldn't cry about Finnick in the cinema LOL
I was skeptical of the movie at first, but as it went on, perfectly done, great job by everyone! Not how I imagined Lucy in the book but loved it! Felt very real life, like small town girl and city boy
I just saw the movie tonight and I’m so incredibly happy with the movie, they did such a wonderful job! I also read the book, yes not everything is in it or they changed a couple things to move the story along but it’s so well done!! I loved it! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
I would like to highlight what Lucy said to Snow on the lake about how she values trust over love. When she caught Snow about him murdering three, not knowing who the third person was, I think she immediately knew she had to leave him.
SPOILER I believe they did truly love each other but once Lucy found out that snow killed 3 people she realized he killed Sajuans (can’t spell it) she couldn’t trust the Snow wouldn’t turn on her too and got scared of him and ran. I do believe she still loved him but didn’t wanna risk anything and didn’t want to get hurt she even wrote a song about him so that can help prove she loved him With Snow idk if he still loved her or not bc she did shoot her and kinda hunted her so idk about him but he was really upset that she left soo I wish snow didn’t turn evil wish they were endgame they were cute and perfect but bc snow turned on his bff what would stop him from Turing on Lucy Snow he turned on Lucy and made Lucy lose trust after mentions he killed 3 people and not just the two she knew of. She was able to figure out that he killed Sejeanus, his friend, so if her turned on his friend what stops him from Turing on Lucy. Also I believe the snake wasn’t poisonous to me I think it was meant to symbolize that Snow was a snake and Lucy knew everything
also side fact: when they anounce which mentor gets which tribute one of the mentor‘s last name is heavensbee and in the original movies starting in catching fire there‘s the new head gamemaker called plutarch heavensbee. Since plutarch seems to be younger than snow i would say this old class mate of snow/other mentor is the parent of plutarch which would make sense when you see how plutarch has enough influence to become the gamemaker when his parents are influential people in the capitol. so someone in the capitol 65 years later with the same last name would be too much of a coincidence to them not being related which would make more sense why snow trusts plutarch bc he knows his parents. It doesn‘t really add anything to the story but it‘s just sth that came to my mind when i heard that name
Thank you for the fantastic breakdown! I really liked the old hunger game movies so I was really excited to watch this one! Man was I not disappointed! Great film!
I thought the ending of the movie missed the reflection of the book in Snows character and his struggle but a good ending that ties the movie universe together
The fact that Katniss was another name for swamp potato was kinda hilarious. It probably annoyed snow so much that he ended up losing to a swamp potato
It made me LOL in the cinema
Damn Yam
I think it’s ironic how Snows uprising happens because of a girl from district 12 and his downfall because of a girl from district 12. Unreal writing
Parallels are one of the most simple forms of writing
and also that Snow was paranoid he was going to die the same way his father did , in the woods in 12.
A girl from district 12 writes a song for him.
A girl from district 12 sing that song as an anthem to lead a rebellion against him.
That's more ironic from Snow's prespective.
It's called a bookend. Everything that happened for Snow happens within the bookends.
@@parashit2181Yeah
In my opinion, Casca Highbottoms did not simply « hate » Coriolanus, but was scared of him. He knew the kind of person his father was, and he could probably recognize him in Coriolanus. He tried discouraging Snow not by hate, but because he knew , rightfully so, what he was capable of.
Yeah 100% the discussion at the end felt like he was implying he was intentionally sabotaging the games or enjoyed that they were doing poorly, and he knew snow’s ideas were going to revive them so he wanted to stop him in his tracks.
@@danieldelrey8798Ik highbottom never thought the games would come to life but he probably has to act like to like them or else he’d be killed
Thats what I've thought too. In a way, didn't Casca then kinda pull a Voldemort? in the sense that he gave Snow an enemy to work against, to be more motivated in his ambitions against. He kind of helped make Snow more of a monster in his effort to keep him down?
I thought he hated him for no reason but that last dialogue exchange revealed the true meaning behind him. He truly wanted the games to end 😭
It's ironic that his name is Highbottom, when he is actually Lowbottom.
Anyone who's sceptical about seeing this movie due to critics please go and see it yourselves and decide for yourselves. I just got back from the movies and thought it was amazing!
Audience score is over 90% too last time I checked
@@chag7616 Yup. Love to see the critics be owned by the audience
They did the same for the fnaf movie. People should know by now a movie’s quality doesn’t have to line up with the critic ratings.
@@andpegwell tbh fnaf movie wasn’t great
@@honeymoon1115 yes it was
i think that the scene with snow and the mockingjays is actually so important for catching fire. Snow is being haunted by lucy gray's voice and her song. We know that katniss is a reminder to snow of lucy gray. In the 75th hunger games, jaybjays were used in the hunger games, copying the screams of the ones that they love. I feel that this is snow's revenge to lucy gray. Doing to katniss what lucy gray did to him
Rachel was literally made for this role. And yeah even though there was really no build up, they had such great chemistry.
You really think that Lucy Grey is still in his mind after 65 years and a few wives?
yes! She was the only person he ever loved besides his family. He almost gave up everything by running away with her. She's also so special because she's a "mystery" and he never really knew where she ended up or if she's dead, but she knew all his secrets! He doubted the games because of her and he only ever had empathy for her! But he's nuts so he will always blame her for almost leading him away from the path to becoming president; Snow resents Lucy Gray for almost taking away his power because of their love. He never loved any of his wives. Of course he thinks about her all the time. @@Gaia_Seraphina
@@Gaia_Seraphina Yes. He fell in love with Lucy. He deliberately did not marry for love. And plenty of people remember their first love, even decades later. Not to mention that, imo, Lucy Gray is not someone that Snow would easily forget. He was still sharp and spry in his 80s. There was nothing wrong with his memory.
@@Gaia_Seraphina uhh absolutely
it was defo a hallucination of Lucy Gray running in the forest, because she was wearing the dress from the hunger games and not the one she was wearing when she left the house to get some Katniss. However whether she was still nearby is a mystery, but the one he actively shot at I think was a hallucination. But also considering that he found an earring contradicts that idea, so really its all just an interpretation.
the earring could be when she actually was fleeing away it fell, and while hallucinating he incidentally found it
I think thats rigth, every thing was an hallucynation. She was scaping, not trying to make him mad. She didnt sang he hallucinated she sanging and birds repeating...
Agreed. Also how would it be possible that she gets shot, falls and screams, but when Snow walks over while aiming the entire time at the place he shot her, she’s somehow gone? Like maybe the trees could’ve hidden her temporarily but Snow 100% would’ve seen or heard her get up and run away. Not to mention it’s hard to do so with a bullet wound, and she was running in the wrong direction.
Had to be a hallucination. Snow’s eyes looked unfocused and the whole scene seemed dream-like.
She didnt have the reaping dress on
Im sorry but watch it again she wasnt wearing the dress from the games…its hard to see as its so fast
The one scene I wish they had that was in the book was the peacekeeper party where Lucy Gray sang the hanging tree for the first and only time out loud. It would help explain why it was forbidden to be heard in district 12 and how eventually they ban singing and dancing in the district period.
I won’t be surprised if that’s a deleted scene. That’s so many deleted scenes from BTS photos I’ve seen so far lol
that's very interesting!
Which chapter was that?
Happening
Hunger Games
It’s water game now 😢
Literally just walked out of the cinema hall. The movie was honestly 11/10.
same
Same! I didn’t want it to end!
SAMEEEEE. I have so many questions!
@@itsshaninaQuestions like what happened to Lucy Gray Baird? And I just finished seeing the movie and thought it was 5 out of 5 or 10 out of 10 it was an amazing movie!
@@josephkelley8297 yeahhh. Like where did she go? HAHAHAH
I think the snake thereby coincidence and it just emphasizes his paranoia, we learn in the book when he runs freaking outback to the doctor that the snake wasn’t even poisonous at all. Which shows his paranoia is at an all time high because he assumes Lucy is trying to kill him.
No I’ve literally been thinking the same thing. Like we really can’t prove that she actually tried to kill him
@@henryilderton3254she didn’t, that was a garter snake she definitely knew that did not kill him.
@@henryilderton3254 She for sure tried to kill him. The way she's acting before she leaves, how she hides to watch his reactions before sprinting off. Why did she drop the scarf and never pick it up? Why did she not call out to him when he was looking for her? Why did she not try to explain herself after he was bit? There's too many loose ends that show she always meant to kill him. Another one is katniss grows by the lake because it is an aquatic plant. She claimed to be heading out to pick some, so why wasn't she by the lake and why was her scarf in the forest?
@@vladdracula8103 i don't think she was trying to kill him i think he was trying to flee him.
@@vladdracula8103so, in the book, as he reaches for the orange scarf he gets bitten and believes that Lucy Gray planted it because she knows how to deal with snakes. The whole town he’s heading back to the peacekeeper bank he thinks he is dying because of the snake. When he makes it back to the nurse she takes one look at the bite and tells him what snake it was and it is not venomous and to just let the bite feel, additionally she tells him that the RAIN brings those snakes out, they only come out during the rain. So Lucy Gray didn’t plant the snake but his delusions made up a different story at the moment. However, in the movie because the whole books story has to be so compacted they use this scene as a way to hunt towards her cleverness and survivalist persona which is showed in different ways throughout the book. Its also a better connection to the other movie adaptations because of the whole idea that Lucy Grays legacies come back to haunt him 64 years later by Katniss
The reason why Snow went after Katniss so much is because unlike Lucy Gray Katniss is real and can resist him. Ironically everything Snow suggested for future Hunger Games backfired and made sure Katniss' actions are never forgotten
didnt President Snow have an affair with Katniss Everdeen and Primrose Everdeen towards the 8th chapter?
@@chaddenningno?
@@chaddenningMaybe u read a different book…
@@chaddenningwhat?! In what book?! Lol
Lucy Gray wasn’t real? You’re telling she was just a figment of Snowms imagination that whole time?!
Also loved the movie, the only thing I wish they did differently was their romance. In the book there was much more progression ( I.e the kiss before the games, snow bringing her food not because she asked, different moments together) I wish they would’ve built this up a little more so it makes the ending more strong when they both go their separate ways
And the fact that when Lucy sings the song about snow in the book, snow cries and stays and listens, whereas in the movie he’s already walking away not even listening to the song.
Agree!
I had the exact same opinion when watching the movie!
Couldn’t agree more, some of those parts of the book were crucial to their story. I do wish we got to see more of ‘life in district 12’ namely the covey’s performances, the Captain’s birthday and as you say, the song about Snow and him staying to listen.
@@cd2_ I know, I really hated the way that they scripted that scene. I don't know what the director was thinking. Actually, several scenes could have been better fleshed out, although the film was very good overall.
One incredible detail that Rachel Zegler brought up in an interview (and was also in the book) is that the katniss root picked by the Covey "wasn't ready yet." It was such a clever nod to the original trilogy and further proof of Lucy Gray's ghost coming back to haunt Coriolanus in time.
wow!!!!!!
It could also imply it's too soon to start the rebellion against the Capitol. Also, remember the rebels planned to go North. North of District 12 is District 13. District 13 already planned the next rebellion the moment they lost during the First Rebellion. Recruiting District 12 people into District 13 like what they did with Gale is not a challenge considering how anyone can disappear from District 12 like Lucy Gray Baird.
This is how I saw it@@ryankwon8785
Olivia's song goes SO well with the ending of the movie
I also do believe that Lucy placed the snake under the shawl. Before leaving the hut, Lucy says "Well I'm not made of sugar" which to me has a double meaning. Number one is her telling him that she'll be fine because it's just rain. Number two is that she isn't as sweet as Snow views her to be.
Yes the “ I am not sugar” comment instantly gave me a sour patch kid vibe. Sour then sweet. I was very nervous that she had set him up and had ratted him out when he was searching for her following that comment.
Facts!!! Thats the first thing that came too my head was her letting him know…… watch who you mess with i aint the one to be played with hahaha. I loved it.
The first thing that came to my mind when I heard this was the scene in arena before the jar holding the snakes broke and it was revealed that there were actually a snakes inside, the presenter said wouldn't it be funny if there was candy in it? it is a strech but it is fun to think Lucy gray is not a sweet candy but a jar holding snakes inside
One core element in Coriolanus' character development is his relation with power. From the very beginning, Snow likes to control his appearance and to be very purposeful with everything he says. Everything he does is calculated, Sejanus, too, mentions it late in the movie (and book). I believe in the movie there is less emphasis put on Dr. Gaul's assignment that is given to Snow than in the book. That assignment is about connecting chaos, control, and contract, the third one which he often forgets about in the book.
Every time Coriolanus is confronted with chaos, he's struck by deep fear. That fear reminds him of the war days, which deeply traumatized him. I feel like whatever happens, to him, is better than another war, in which he lost everything. Killing a few kids in The Games, then, becomes little in his eyes, in comparison.
All throughout the story, Snow loves things he can control. He loved Lucy Gray in a cage. Not so much in the arena, when she was with Jessup. But very much when Jessup died and Lucy Gray relied only on Snow to survive. He never liked unpredictable people like Dean Highbottom, and, at the beginning, Dr. Gaul. He liked jabberjays alright because they could be controlled, but he absolutely despised mockingjays, which could sing as they liked, free. He liked Sejanus when he could keep him in control, but whenever he acted by himself, not at all. There are so many more things to point out. When he felt he didn't have control over Lucy Gray, he didn't like her anymore. Sure, he probably still loved her, but he despised how free she wanted to be. To him, freedom allowed chaos.
Damn this is a good comment. Great thoughts, thank you for sharing them!
This is such a brilliant viewpoint.
Makes me realize that his interpretation of love is skewed, because he was overly obsessed with his need to control everything
The film really surprised me in the most positive way. The last five minutes literally gave me goosebumps. Amazingly shot and written movie! Exceeds the book and the first four movies, in my opinion.
I know right! I literally almost cried even though I didn’t cry in the book.
Catching fire and ballad of songbirds and snakes are definitely my two favorite hunger games movies and books. I LOVE villain origin stories and this is one of the best villain origin movies I’ve ever seen along with Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith. SOOOO well made and thooght through🤭
@@noelle_reads_alot I cried during the first scene when lucy gray sang. Like damn. Yes ghurl !! nothing you can take from me is ever worth keeping.
I don't like how in the hunger games they were making Lucy unrealistically dodge all those weapons 😭 and how they rushed Lucy's and snow's relationship
I think Lucy Gray put that snake under the scarf, she saw how snow was acting from the moment they left together, between his slip up, they way he reacted to the guns, and in general the way he looked at her and their new life. She had every reason to leave without him seeing as he didn't want nor needed to go. The snake is a message of her mistrust and a clear sign that she left him behind.
My idea with that
Also I believe the snake wasn’t poisonous to me I think it was meant to symbolize that Snow was a snake and Lucy knew everything
This film is a solid installment of the Hunger Games franchise
I'm convinced Dr Gaul was made for Viola Davis. Her presence was always there ;even if only in the background. Very menacing and that laugh! She deserves an award of some sort for this role.
I agree I never saw her blink in any scene !! lol I couldn’t take my eyes off of her one blue eye.
She’s such a legend it’s scary lot of actors bodied this especially her and sejanus
Actor who played Snow was great. Very surprised there is negative critical reception to this movie
He was, but the movie did a disservice to the book.
Its billy the kid
@@libert11347 thank you at least someone gets it. The movie wasn’t absolutely horrible but it’s nowhere near as phenomenal as the book. So many necessary character relationship scenes are just left out
Reviewers have a nasty habit of panning movies that explore ideas they find personally distasteful. Think Sylvester Stallone's Rocky movie, which was despised by the intelligentsia even as it firmly resonated with the American public.
I think this is the best stance to take things. It's a huge stretch to say that the movie was terrible when it isn't really nad, but the book is definitely superior overall.
The book elucidates Lucy Gray's desire to escape to the north, aligning with the plans of rebels such as Sejanus Plinth, Billy Taupe, and Spruce. Adding intrigue is the revelation that north of District 12 lies District 13, where rebel activity was most concentrated. I believe District 13 planned the rebellion years before the 10th Hunger Games and have been recruiting and "disappearing" District 12 citizens into their ranks. However, it seems improbable that Lucy lingered in District 13 for long, given its isolated environment. Instead, she likely continued her journey further north, venturing into the Wilds. There, she may have stumbled upon a community existing beyond the borders of Panem. Despite Lucy's unknown whereabouts, her impact on Panem endures through her songs, the people she inspired, and her historical connection with Snow. Regarding District 13, the hints that the rebels actually knew that traveling north was helpful for the rebellion shows how District 13 is already scheming from the very beginning and District 12 is a fresh recruiting ground for soldiers and people to help with rebellion work since people can easily "disappear" and "escape."
I doubt Lucy perished, especially since Katniss did not find a corpse in the forest. If she had, it's unlikely she would return to a place where a person was murdered. Overall, I believe Lucy escaped Panem into the Wilds to break free from the cycle of hatred, by walking away from the chessboard. Unlike Lucy, Snow does not escape, which ultimately leads to his demise and loneliness in the end. Snow did not join Lucy because he could not find peace in leaving the chessboard but by controlling and tormenting the chess pieces.
In the case of Snow, I believe that deep down, he harbored a profound resentment towards the Districts, stemming from the First Rebellion that robbed him of his childhood happiness, his mother, his family's power, and his innocence. Snow's desire for retribution likely manifested a desire to turn Panem into a living hell for all the districts, a vengeance that would persist until his eventual overthrow. Initially, he suppressed his animosity, but over the years, it festered within him until Dr. Gaul unleashed the beast from its cage. As a Peacemaker, he likely relocated to District 12 to probe into why he felt drawn to Lucy Gray and sought to comprehend how she found peace despite growing up in the poorest district. He also wanted to know if Dr. Gaul was right that human beings are animals no matter how innocent or guilty they are. Despite his experiences, Snow recognized that he couldn't escape his inherent nature of selfishness and hatred. Consequently, he succumbed to Dr. Gaul's teachings, transforming into the living embodiment of a tyrant and a devil.
Why Coin hates Snow? Coriolanus' father, Crassus Snow, made most of his family wealth from District 13, and I do not doubt Coin inherited her family's hatred of the Snow family since the Snow Family monopolized the suffering of District 13 for their own power, wealth, and influence.
Sixty years past. If she died, her body would have decomposed
@@lykos..I just looked it up and apparently, after 60 years, skin would still remain so take that as you will.
@@riskopalfi801Probably not in the forest. Lots of rain, snow, and animals
@@leafyveins4985 Fair enough. To be honest, I'm fine with all possibilities. She could've died in the forest, stumbled into Thirteen, or maybe even left Panem altogether. What I have taken from BOSAS is that the probability of there being other countries increased exponentially. Why would the Capitol have a Navy otherwise? Who knows?
Lucy migrated to Canada.
I was at the premiere and I was MINDBLOWN. I am a very big Hunger Games fan. I read all the books, watched all your hunger games videos, and I couldn’t be happier with the movie I would even say I personally preferred more to the original three movies. I’m not sure if it’s because of the style filmed or what, but i’m kinda shocked it didn’t get great reviews from critics. May the odds be ever in your favor, y’all! ❤
I went into the cinema not expecting too much but the film was amazing! I was so pleasantly surprised! I want to watch it again to completely make up my mind, but as of watching it once last night, I prefer it to the other 4 films - and this also coming from a huge hunger games fan 😊
When I finished the book, my first thought was that Dr. Gaul was involved in everything step by step making these 2 be together, either for love or survival. Maybe she gave Lucy some immunity and protection from the capitol, that’s why she had to leave because she did not have the courage to tell Coryo of her betrayal. Exactly the same as Coryo did not tell Lucy about his betrayal towards Sejanus. And from that moment on, Dr. Gaul accomplish her goal of not only manipulating Coryo for becoming president, but have the same vision of why the games needed to exist in first place.
A broken heart can be manipulated in every single way and aspect, Dr. Gaul took advantage of that.
I think Dr. Gaul planted the explosions in the arena to justify her attack with the snakes later on And also she wanted to make Felix Ravenstill, the "son" of President Ravenstill, disappear so that Snow can succeed him as President
Dr. Gaul wants Snow to become president so that the games continue after her death
Dr. Gaul was responsible for everything from the beginning
@@edra2005Yes! I thought of that too because she was like an omnipotent figure all throughout the book always asking Coryo what where the games for and he at first seemed hesitant on answering, but later you see him more secure of his answers.
@@edra2005 My thoughts exactly. Further, maybe she carried out such exercises of ensuring loyalty towards the continuance of the games with other students earlier in secrecy. When they failed to concur with her, they were eliminated such as Clemensia. Snow would be the last once to undergo such an exercise, reflecting the decline in the Snow name.
@@hrishikeshharitas2456Exactly! You know, I missed that part in the film where she became for a moment a snake 😂. I wanted to see her scaly transformation.
@@edra2005rebel not gaul, like in the book
Saw this movie yesterday. Had very low expectations because of the reviews but this was a solid 10/10 for me. Came very close to the book, which is surprising since the book was quite long. Despite the critics, I think Rachel was the best one to cast for Lucy Gray. This was how I imagined her to be. I only wished for them to have SOME romantic buildup, considering how fast they fell in love. But overall, I loved it.
I read somewhere that the book was written with the movie in mind, I’m guessing that had to do with how well adapted it was (I haven’t read the book tho, but the movie sure made me wanna do it now)
Sameee Rachel was amazing! She’s a great actress and her voice is amazing! The movie was soo good
@@agme8045I read the book when the movie was being made and I noticed there are details that the book doesn't mention, like physical descriptions of some characters, which makes it easier to cast actors without people complaining they don't match the characters' description. I'm sure there's a lot more book details that keep the movie adaptation in mind. Very clever. I'm dying to see the movie, even though I don't like Rachel Zegler 😅
Yes, we know. We see the exact same paid-for comments everywhere. At least the production/PR company could be more realistic.
@@Falconer22 Oh.. :( I wish I was being paid for it honestly. I just have a different view on the movie than a lot of you. Sure, there were some aspects of this movie that were a little out of context, but I liked it and that's just my opinion. There are people who like it, and people who don't like it. Not that hard, isn't it?
This movie was honestly 10/10, they way it had me captivated for almost 3 long hours is beyond me.
Edit: just read the book lol, 1000/10
This!!! I agree I was nervous that I would fall asleep or lose focus lol.
Didn’t even feel like 3 hours that’s how good it was
Yeah the book was much better than the movie ... My favorite book in the hunger games franchise.
The very first thing ı wanna say about this film is that they should have definetely split it into two seperate films."The Peacekeeper" part felt so disturbingly rushed.So many important and necessary points went missed.
I agree it was SO MUCH in one movie. I wish the last 30 minutes had been explained a bit more.
This thought just struck me randomly, but what if Dr. Gaul killed/kidnapped Lucy Gray to get Snow to fully abandon what was left of his humanity and go back to the Capitol to be her mentoree, after finally losing both his best friend and girlfriend? We know she had Sejanus hung after receiving the bird’s message from Snow, so why couldn’t she also then plant those guns to make Snow suspicious and have people kill/kidnap Lucy Gray to fully alienate Snow from anyone who brings out his empathy? I didn’t read the book, so I can only describe clues to this in the movie, but I kept thinking: where did Lucy Gray get that blood from to stain the scarf? Also, she knew how important it was to him. It didn’t make sense that she would maliciously destroy it like that, even if she was going to abandon him. She of all people, who wears her late mother’s dress, knows how sentimental that scarf was to Snow. And she just happened to have a snake with her to hide in the scarf? Even if she didn’t trust Snow, this seemed pretty out of character for her, the girl who tries not to harm anyone. And she was so outspoken, so why wouldn’t she just confront him about her doubts instead of running away? And how could her footprints disappear to nowhere? I know this is part of the mystery and her name’s story, but what if it’s more than that? There was a rainstorm happening, which could have covered up the sound of a helicopter. Could she have been singing Hanging Tree when they killed/kidnapped her, which is why the Mockingjays were singing it? And why were the guns stored in that cabin? Lucy Gray says Spruce must have know about the hideout…or…Dr. Gaul had people put them there after hanging Spruce and Sejanus and finding the guns. Who else was the only other person who’s had eyes on Snow the whole time and wanted him to be her mentoree? Dr. Gaul. I would need to rewatch the film to see if this theory makes any sense, but honestly, I kind of believe it. It was all too perfect. Snow was running off with Lucy Gray, after contacting Dr. Gaul through the bird message that killed Sejanus. Dr. Gaul had Sejanus hung and expected Snow would come back to Captiol, but the only thing keeping him from that was Lucy Gray. Dr. Gaul could have known that by sending people to kill/kidnap Lucky Gray and stage the scene to make it look like she abandoned him (which was a bit sudden honestly), it would send Snow over the edge. It would make sense that it was all her grand plan to have Snow become her mentoree back at the Capitol. She kept stressing that she was watching him and that he passed her test. What test? Betraying his only friend? Or maybe, getting bit by that snake was the test. What was his response to that bite? Immediately trying to hunt down the love of his life after going into a rage, thinking she abandoned him. When he answers Dr. Gaul’s question again, about what the hunger games are really for, he says “it shows us who we really are,” just like his true character was shown when he tried to kill Lucy Gray. Plus, Dr. Gaul is the only character other than Lucy Gray who is associated with snakes, so it would make sense that she used a snake to put in Lucy Gray’s scarf. It could have been one that makes people hallucinate, which would explain Snow seeing Lucy Gray running through the forest when he “shoots” her. Maybe he imagined the Mockingjays’ singing too. And that earring he found could have fallen off in a struggle. Or maybe Dr. Gaul soaked that scarf in tracker jacker venom, which he inhaled when he smelled the scarf, causing hallucinations. I’d definitely like to read the book now through this theory’s lens to see if it has any weight. I’d love to hear others’ opinions on this, along with anything that supports or challenges this theory. :)
That totally checks out. There is also a theory that Coin is Lucy grey's daughter but i like yours more.
@@That_AboElHamd Thanks for the feedback :) I also believe it after revisiting certain movie scenes. If Dr. Gaul had made Snow her mentoree right away, he would have always wondered: “What if a peaceful life with the love of my life and my best friend would have been a more worthwhile and happier existence than a life orchestrating violence through The Games? What if a life in a district without wealth - but with music, friendship, and love - was the right path instead of staying in the Capitol and following in the footsteps of my father?”
Dr. Gaul “tested” Snow by letting him live out his fantasy of peace, only to push him to choose violence in the end by taking away the people who reminded him of his humanity, completing the dark transformation of his character.
At the end of the movie, Snow answers Dr. Gaul’s question by saying The Games shows us “who we really are.” Just like how The Games alienates the tributes from their loved ones and forces them to watch their friends in the games die while turning them into killers, Snow believes he was shown who HE really was after being alienated from his family after leaving the Capitol, watching his best friend be hung, and trying to kill the only girl he’s ever loved after he believes she abandoned him, leaving him all alone. But it didn’t have to go that way. He could have ran off with Lucy Gray, which is why I believe Dr. Gaul got rid of her one way or another, just like she got rid of Sejanus.
I haven’t seen anyone else suggest this theory, but I think it would be consistent with the movie’s message.
This was exact theory everything was too perfect and controlled and I feel like the other theory miss a lot of symbolism. I find it interesting that we both share the same theory and we both haven’t read the book so I wonder if our theories will change when we read the book
🤔 Interesting... Very interesting. Now I gotta go rewatch it. I’ve never read the books either. I’ve only seen the movies. Personally I really enjoyed this movie. I’ve always rooted for Snow. Yeah even in the original trilogy. 😂
You got a awesome brain 😮
Has anyone noticed that when Snow shot Lucy Gray in the forest she was wearing her original rainbow dress but when they ran away together she was wearing something different? Maybe Snow was hallucinating everything going on but ofc the scarf and the earring is something left on.
maybe the snale had poison that made hallucinatuon
In the movie I was a little confused with if he actually had killed her when he took that shot while she was running or as if like you stated, he was hallucinating.
The book confirmed that the snake wasn't poisonous. Snow went to the nurse who told him it was just a harmless snake bite. So he most likely was being paranoid@@sinisiren6992
i think he was hallucinating but she did actually leave (leaving behind the scarf and earring) and just headed north
What I really love about what they did is how they showed Snow’s internal conflict on screen without stating it. Just simply watching Tom Blyth act the internal struggle he’s dealing inside. Showing us that at the end Snow will always choose what benefits him more that will usher him to his ambitions.
I honestly think that Lucy Gray survived because I don't think that Snow would be very likely to hit her when he was shooting in all directions and also shooting at the Mockingjays.
but he did shoot her lol it was literally shown he shot her but she escaped
Theory: She escaped and probably going to the north where district 13 is, and with other rebels they creating district 13 to destroy the capitol
I think Lucy Gray died of exposure. I don't think Snow hit her when he shot at her. There was no way she would make it to a district that no one believe even still existed, and she couldn't go back to 12 because Mayor Lipp would have killed her.
Lucy is coin…….
@@sparingpickle4918 Not a chance Lucy Gray was Coin. In Mockingjay, Coin was 50 years old. Lucy Gray would have been 80.
And her name is Lucy Gray, not just Lucy.
SPOILERS!!! This movie was incredible! The scene of the arena blowing up and the 360 view was so cool! I was hoping for a bit more from the snake scene I kept waiting for her to stand up while she was singing but other than that it was perfection!
Especially when in the book, the snake bite makes the tributes skin and eyes turn different colours 😢 I wish that gory scene would’ve made it in the movie
@@briannabliss1530 YES! I was hoping to see that as well but man was it far beyond my expectations I loved it so much!
Something I noticed was how Clemensia trying to turn in snows’ ideas for the hunger games to Dr.Gaul, it was extremely similar to how snows’ father had turned in the Deans papers.
When clemensia gets caught lying, she even gets bitten by a snake 😅
I'd like to see an Lucy Gray appearance if Suzanne Collins write a Haymitch Hunger Games book. Seems like that's the one most people would like to see.
I really enjoy the part where one of the tributes put the blanket on top of the dead tributes.😢😢 it made me cry
It resembles the death of Palestinian children
@@NasyaDeana it does 🥺🥺🥺🥺
I loved this movie, despite the differences and how the fans feel, Dr. Gaul alone made this film worth it. Viola Davis absolutely nailed the role, she freaking killed it! Her performance was just amazing. She was evil. She was dark. She was cynical. But she was also charismatic and had this beautiful charm. I loved her outfits as well and seeing a more rustic-young Panem was amazing. It was cool to see how the arena once was, the drones, the old technology, it was brilliant. When you watch the older films, we now understand how much the capital has changed and how much more punished the districts become. Dr. Gaul also said something in the beginning of the film that caught my interest at the end, Dr. Gaul said she wasn’t gunna last for ever. So she wanted to try something different with the 10th reaping. Dr Gaul was a scientist, geneticist, researcher, and head game maker. She has a crazy amount of value to the capital. Her last project was to make sure Snow would become the exact person to lead the way, she was a monster, but she created an even better one for the future. Snow became a monster, just like she envisioned. I’m baffled and blown away, I love it though.
Personally, I think Lucy gray stopped loving snow after Seamus’s death, after she heard the audio and saw how he had not even a little reaction to his best friends death probably made her realize how evil he is and how easy it could be for him to hurt or betray her, so when she went to get Katniss she was actually trying to flee and escape from him. I think she escaped and went on to live with her band friends, married and had children with one of those band members and her granddaughter is katniss.
I wouldn’t say there was no reaction to Sejanus’ death, because Snow was initially guilt ridden for his role in Sejanus’ death.
Here’s my interpretation of Lucy Gray’s realization of Snow indirectly killing Sejanus: by Snow recording Sejanus, it showed he was undoubtedly loyal to the Capitol and he wanted his old life back. He would’ve never been happy being on the run with Lucy Gray, and she (sadly) came to that realization. So you’re right about Lucy Gray believing Snow would’ve betrayed her because he definitely would’ve done so if it meant him returning to the Capitol.
Ironically, it was Lucy Gray’s abandonment of him which helped begin his transformation into the tyrant Katniss would fight against decades later. In a way, he felt betrayed by Lucy Gray because he was subjected to a life as a Peacemaker because he was punished for ensuring she survived in the Games. In Snow’s eyes, Lucy Gray cemented what Dr. Gaul was trying to tell him, as well as his hatred for the districts.
“It’s the things we love most that destroys us.” Snow’s love for Lucy Gray and her abandonment of him destroyed Coryo… and began the rise of the future President Snow.
Here’s my theory it’s a bit long
SPOILER
I believe they did truly love each other but once Lucy found out that snow killed 3 people she realized he killed Sajuans (can’t spell it) she couldn’t trust the Snow wouldn’t turn on her too and got scared of him and ran.
I do believe she still loved him but didn’t wanna risk anything and didn’t want to get hurt she even wrote a song about him so that can help prove she loved him
With Snow idk if he still loved her or not bc she did shoot her and kinda hunted her so idk about him but he was really upset that she left soo
I wish snow didn’t turn evil wish they were endgame they were cute and perfect but bc snow turned on his bff what would stop him from Turing on Lucy
Snow he turned on Lucy and made Lucy lose trust after mentions he killed 3 people and not just the two she knew of. She was able to figure out that he killed Sejeanus, his friend, so if her turned on his friend what stops him from Turing on Lucy. Also I believe the snake wasn’t poisonous to me I think it was meant to symbolize that Snow was a snake and Lucy knew everything
She realized he was loyal to the capitol and that he cant be trusted. She said trust is the most thing for her so she left since he lied to her about the 3 murders
Or Lucy was already pregnant to Snow, another reason she ran away from him.
Rachel Zegler was amazing. People boycotting the movie are giving up on an amazing performance. Tom Blyth was phenomenal.
Wait why are people boycotting this movie?
@@heheingyou didn‘t know anything about Rachel Zegler? The very talented and entitled young actress who made multiple PR disasters ?
@@heheing Because the author of the books Suzanne collins supports the gen0cide happening in G@za
Because of Rachel's comments on Snow White @@heheing
@@heheingbc how how Rachel was talking about her Snow White role
She an amazing actress and singer but she is treating her Snow White role horrible which is gaining her hate
Just finished seeing it and personally I am very satisfied.
The thing I appreciated most about the film is how Snow's slow journey towards madness was constructed.
I always found it very ironic how Snow said he didn't lie when he himself did nothing but lie to himself for years, telling himself that Lucy wasn't in love with him and that she had hidden the snake specifically to kill him.
He repeated it so many times that in the end he didn't really believe it and even created the belief that love was a weakness that had pushed him to behave in an absurd and stupid way and as a result of this belief he ended up pushing Tigris away. the only other person he had left who cared about him.
In doing so, Snow ended up remaining alone in a golden prison of self-delusion of his own making, he continued to live there for years but then his illusion began to dissolve the exact moment he saw Katniss and Peeta together because they are exactly what Lucy and Coryo could have been if the latter had chosen love over power.
In Catching Fire, when Snow sees Katniss and Peeta hugging, it's written all over his face that he's thinking about Lucy and the life they could have. But instead of finally admitting to himself that he had done everything wrong and that having restored his family's wealth did not make him happy, it made him emptier and more alone, he preferred to continue lying to himself, telling himself that the only way to stop the uprising of the districts and also its doubts was to kill Katniss and the other winners of the previous Hunger Games
And Coin, seeing this mental decline in Snow, took advantage of it to put him in check and thus cause his fall and when Coryo noticed it it was too late to fix it.
Love wasn't the cause of Snow's destruction, it was his salvation because love wasn't making him weak, it was just making him more human, it was making him a better person
Also I think that fact that Lucy named the plant Katniss and the fact that Katniss has a similar vibe to lucy. In a way I think Katniss really triggered snow from the jump
Because of his childhood indoctrination Snow sincerely believed that the survival of his nation depended on a brutal apartheid system where the Capitol elite maintained harsh control over the rest of the population. He was literally unable to imagine any alternatives.
It is interesting to in Catching Fire Snow told Katniss that she had to convince him of the love she had for Peeta was true. Again, that doubt and previous experience making him believe love is a weakness/show.
@@libnip104 better for the masses to believe Katniss was a silly young woman in love than that she'd found a way to say "Screw you" to the system. Snow cared about what the masses thought because he didn't want to go through yet another armed uprising.
I just watched the movie last night and here are my takeaways:
1. This movie actually does a good job with empathizing with Snows' turn to evil. Anyone can remember being young and in love, only to have the sting from the heartbreak.
2. Even though the books are supposed to be set in the future, there is an eloquent 20s parallel tragedy that's in play here. For example, you see a rise and fall of the decade, similarly how you see a rise and fall of both Snow and Lucy Grey ( reminds me of the lost movies and performances of that decade).
3. Lastly, the acting and singing from Lucy was excellent. You can see and feel how charming and enticing she is. You understand why the mayor's daughter was jealous and how she caught Snows affections. It truly sends a chill down my spine when you realize the parallels to Lucy and Katniss (which leads me to believe that all of those years later, Snow is still traumatized by that heartbreak).
All in all, I do think it was a pretty good move to wait nearly decade from the first movie to do this one because it gives us time to reflect back to how the events played out to the mockingjay trilogy.
I loved to movie, it was incredibly made, although I do feel like the jump from Snow being good to being evil is rushed and not very well explained. I kind of understand why, but I also don’t. I feel like he switched really fast from being okay with breaking the rules and risking his life for Lucy Gray to ratting out his best friend and almost killing Lucy Gray for trying to break the rules and “hold him back” or whatever. I just feel like they could’ve done a better job in that part.
I definitely agree. The last 30 minutes threw me off a bit. The movie was still so great though
I’m not sure if you’ve read the book - but the jump from good to evil isn’t necessarily that it was fast paced. In the book, Snow (whilst he is definitely decent) already demonstrated a lot of red flags in his behaviour and narcissistic tendencies. I don’t think in any universe the good would’ve won him over, he was already walking the path that came naturally to him which was unfortunately evil. Lucy Gray may have provided him incentive to stray more towards his own decency, but I’d say ‘good’ is a stretch even then
If you've read the book, he's never really 'good.' His inner monologue shows this. He teeters the line, always picking the bad decision that's self serving and morally corrupt 💀
Right, in the book it’s more obvious from the start that he’s really more self focused and is already leaning towards the capital side. I was talking specifically about the movie though, if you’ve seen it you’d see that the transition in the movie isn’t as obvious and doesn’t make as much sense. They paint him to be almost completely good in the movie and don’t play any into the side of him that is evil.
Yes, but I was talking about the movie and I don’t think they portrayed that very well, they made him too overwhelmingly good in the beginning
i just find this plot soo fascinating and completely enriches the original series. throughout the series, it was apparent snow always had a strange fascination/connection to katniss that was very creepy and offputting. now seeing the similarities between katniss and lucy gray, it makes it all the more interesting because I'm sure snow saw so much of lucy gray in katniss. one scene I found very captivating was when (spoilers maybe?) lucy gray was hiding above those kids while they were trying to kill her, and how they decided to wait until she came down. it paralleled so much with the scene in the first book/movie when katniss is hiding in the tree while the careers are waiting for her to come down. thinking about how snow must've felt watching that moment is just mindblowing to me
On the other hand Snow displayed much more insight into the psychology of District residents than Effie Trinket, the supposed Capitol liaison to Distract 12 who presented as a pampered child of the upper classes with little insight into the stresses on her tribute wards. Snow recognised that Katniss's desperate gamble for survival could be interpreted as massive upraised finger to the system; Effie was delighted to be showering frightened kids with rich food and nice clothes, ignoring the fact that she was shepherding them to their deaths.
I haven't seen the movie yet, but I've read the book. And it's pretty clear from the book that Snow, seeing the weapon he'd been looking for for so long, afraid that his fingerprints would be found, immediately started thinking about what was left to "erase" so that the story of his crime would no longer exist. And that was Lucy. And I think when she saw him find that gun, she thought the same thing. That's why she said she is going to look for Katniss. And she did put the scarf where the snake was. But I also think she knew the snake wasn't poisonous because she didn't want to kill him. It was to delay him so she could get away.
Before Snow leaves the fancy new apartment to see Highbottom, Tigris says “You look just like your father, Coriolanus”. Don’t know if the assessment is accurate, but it’s been pointed out that this is the only time she actually refers to him by his full name, not his nickname of Coryo.
I really want to believe in a bittersweet ending for Lucy, untill the moment of snow finding the scarf i feel she really was looking for Katniss.. (the small holes in the ground) but when she heard his screams she knew it wad time to leave... I think she did get shot but not fatally.. And somehow survived to go to the north.. Where she found more people who escaped long before and lived out a long life..
I feel like snow was never good just calculating. Even sejanus noticed. He said something along the lines of how snow would always be quiet and would only speak up at strategic times.
I read the book when it came out, I saw the film with my dad today and I loved it so much, explaining little details that they didn’t mention was so fun, I think the portrayal of the games was perfect and the way you can tell when ‘cornyo’ becomes ‘president snow’ and how Tigris can tell is so amazing
I think he was so delusional he didnt even shoot lucy grey, when he shot her in the woods.. she was wearing her flower dress and boots from the arena and not the clothes she left the cabin in.
That’s a good pick up didn’t notice that
the hunger games during katniss's time all made sense bc of this film. very interesting to see how the hunger games progressed to its 75th year.
The symbolism in these movies is impeccable. I love this franchise, honestly.
A detail that I noticed in the movie is that one of the tributes that were selected was a girl with the last name Heavensbee. It made me think that is why Plutarch had such motivations for the rebellion later on. And since that broadcasting of the Hunger Games was erased, he was able to become a head game maker without anyone realizing his true motivations. I’m sure Snow forgot too since he had killed so many people since then.
Yeah and snow went after Katniss so much because her symbol was the mockingjay and that was also Lucy’s symbol. I remember how in the end, Lucy sent out dozens of mocking jays to mock her voice and Snow was shooting them all. When district 11 did the mocking jay sign, he got angry and shot them.
Literally just got back from the movies and it was fantastic, do NOT listen to the critics go watch it and decide for yourself!
In the movie it's heavily implied that she survived, but in the books it's not as clear, Coriolanus knew that he hit her but she escaped, we know that katniss knows the songs that Lucy wrote especially hanging tree which she sung in private, though her friend in the covey wad the only other one who knew her songs so in the books either Lucy escaped and is katniss' grandmother or she died and her friend is
In my mind Lucy was already gone when before he started shooting. It couls have been a venom induced illusion since we see bear tracks where he saw Lucy originally. Additionally, what people may not realize in the movie is that Gall was probably spying on Snow in District 12 so him not coming back with Lucy could have been what helped him in his career.
It makes me wonder that just like Highbottom would Snow kill Gall too? I would probably say yes due to his cruel streak but it would probably be much later if a death ever does come out as far as I am aware. I could see Gall’s death being a karmic demise where she gets killed be her creations which she loved just how much Highbottom died from the morphine that he was addicted to.
@@KL-ki8db I could definitely see it. His mentality of being a victor pushing him to take her down once he learned what he can or she shows a weakness. It would most likely end with her being used in a experiment or against an experiment but she would probably just feel pride for him doing it. Heck I would see her saying "You are my greatest experiment, don't let it all go to waste" and die laughing.
1. I don’t believe both of them truly loved each other, it was all relied on trust. Both of them had a goal, a type of survival, and both of them wouldn’t really be a good pair, because they had so many differences. Even though as an audience, we truly want them together, they were each other’s downfall at the end.
2. I believe C.Snow shooting at the mocking birds in that forest, was him trying to kill Lucy, she became the mocking bird, hovering over him, “mocking him”, leaving him, and looking down upon him. He felt used, betrayed, not powerful, yet is quite contradictory to what he did to her, in which he doesn’t realise. The moment in the movie, where she asks him about those three people he killed, and he directly looked her in the eye, lying to her face, when he knew, that she could throw love away, just so she could trust her, became his own downfall as well. Lucy was just the catalyst in this situation, but he also took advantage of her trust in the beginning when his entire goal, was to get back to his previous luxuries life, in which he got in the end.
3. How I interpret the ending is, Snow became the one caged in, while Lucy became free. Katniss later on those years, is the one who’s haunting him, she reminds him of Lucy. I think Lucy carried on the songs, the person who she was, how she became the “mocking bird” and Snow never became free of Lucy.
4. The snake should have recognised the smell from the mothers scarf, even Snow’s own smell, so, I believe its just a symbol to, that Lucy was the snake. (I haven’t read the book yet)
Yeah I wish they made out more in the movie. He's hot
@@Smarty2able Oh god, I would say Tom Blyth made him look hot.
*gosh
@@elisesaffo7920you can say “oh god” or “oh gosh” you know
the snake wasnt the mutt from the games tho, only the mutts did the smell thing, so the snake would simply bite him
I wish they would continue making some more prequel books and show the games becoming more about entertainment maybe even have a few books about the other victors from catching fire.
Isn’t it so cute how they went from loving each other to trying to kill each other 🥹
I actually think it’s because Snow actually wanted some type of control over Lucy Gray just like Gale wanted over Katniss if they actually got together but Peeta was the opposite he’d never make her do anything that she didn’t want to do like have kids
@@nmoney6655Katniss does imply though that she had kids for Peeta’s sake though. “It took me five, ten, fifteen years for me to agree. But Peeta wanted them so badly.”
Lucy Gray is a real performer who train to be a hero
Katniss is a real hero who train to be a performer.
This is why Coriolanus Snow is scare of Katniss. He saw himself as the 'real' Victor of The 'real' Hunger Games because of Lucy, and Katniss will become the next Victor because of Peeta.
Really enjoyed the film! Surprised with how well they did considering how long the book was and portraying the thoughts of Snow
The first time Snow hears the name Katniss, he's met with a strong sense of foreboding. I love how the series dabbles in fate and the choices we make. I think Snow becomes paranoid simply because he's an untrustworthy person. He then projects this onto Lucy once they both make the loose end connection. Haunted by the lives he's taken and doubts of Lucy's loyalty begin to seep, which ultimately drives him mad. I don't blame Lucy for getting spooked. He actually lies to her twice, once about the 3rd killing and not mentioning the promotion to District 2. I think the snake was metaphor, he felt as though she'd bitten him after abandoning him in the woods. You can see the deep affection leave his body and turn to pure venom for Lucy.
This movie is a brilliant adaptation of the book and is an amazing prequel to the original hunger games movies. There were critics who said it didn't hit the mark but i think it really did. It truly captures the essence of the book and the character development was equally great. Like the hunger games the thing i like most about Suzan's writing is that the ending is not the same cliched happy ending and that it has twist making the viewer think as to what actually happened. The actors especially viola davis, peter dinklage and tom blyth brought out the depth of character i was expecting. Another plus point was that in the entire movie it never felt rushed, nor did it diverge from the main text which made the experience more enjoyable. Overall a great film....................also i read this theory............lucy gray goes on to become president coin........imagine that.............Feel free to leave thoughts on that
9:50 Casca doesnt hate him because his dad turned his paper in 😭 lmao it's because he was DRUNK and wrote that paper as a joke and now Snow actually started and WILL continue a generation of murderers, so much more than turning in a paper
I loved it really.. the production is amazing and even the story is unexpected .. at the beginning of the movie you would assume that snow is the good guy and you will love him but suddenly he is doing a suspicious things and becoming evail .. unexpected and entresting .. I did not realize that he is the same old man from the original movie
Not to mention - Lucys' song Hanging Tree (or, just, the song she sings, maybe not hers) - lines up with what happened in the movie - they escape first by going to the hanging tree - and Snow escapes being hung, who did kill 3 people - strange things happened, the rebels, and all the craziness our characters have gone thru.
Oh my goodness!! I literally JUST came back from the cinema. It was so so amazing and it made me cry!
The parallels to Katniss were absolutely brilliant! There was one moment that a lot missed: when Snow goes into the arena after Sejanus and it cuts to a scene displaying the bow and arrows that no tributes grabbed to use as weapons. It's so fascinating how the movie carefully foreshadowed the person who would bring Snow to his demise.
I absolutely LOVED the movie, the production is a work of art✨
I cannot form the words for how much I appreciate this channel! Such good analysis I love your content !
That's how it starts. The fever, the rage, the feeling of powerlessness that turns good men... cruel.
- C. Snow
one of the aspects that the movie added that wasn’t in the book was how the relationship between tigris and snow changed. in the book it is implied that they still get along with each other and still mantain their sibling-like relationship, while in the movie we can see the very first blow their relationship takes when tigris says “i think you look just like your father, coriolanius”, making her disappointment of who he’d become be known in a very subtle, but painful way to snow. i think the movie’s take makes it much more interesting because, for once, snow is facing a real consequence of his actions and evil change in character through the relationship that he probably valued most.
These movies are all genuinely wonderful. I was deeply impressed with "The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes", and sooooo much of Snow's actions, and his hatred of Katniss herself, suddenly make so much sense. Out of all book-to-film adaptations, this series has to cap off the cake. Although I do think Mockingjay could have been a single movie.
To anyone who hasn't seen this film I literally just watched it and it is amazing.
I went to the movie today. First of all generally I liked it but they cut off so much scene from the books that it harms the main point. Movie is like book's summarized version's another summerized version. Visiually it's everything I wanted but pacing was too fast. Without actually understanding one scene they changed it to another scene. They cut off Valley,Deep in The Meadow, I'll Sell You For A Song and Crawling to you songs. Songs that made to cut were Reaping Song, When I Was A Babe, Old Therebefore, Hanging Tree and Pure as the driven snow. All of them were very beautiful. But I really hoped they would put more songs specially Deep in the Meadow because triology started and ended with that song. Because they cut off so much parts from the book I think they failed to capture complexity of the relationships specially between Lucy and Snow. Movie really feels like they are in a rush. I think the book should have been made into a TV series rather than a movie adaptation. As a book reader I filled the gaps yes but even for me gaps were too messy. That's why splitting Mockingjay to 2 different parts was a good decision now they didn't do that with ballad of songbirds and snakes this messy result came out. 6.5/10 for me. Such a pity they had the closest visiual to the book but pacing and cutting too much parts from the books made it so messy.
Perhaps it felt that way to you because you already had read the book? I mean, you know what’s missing from the movie, what plot holes there are. For me, coming to the cinema without having read a single page of the book, it didn’t seem that way. The story made perfect sense, and I didn’t feel like anything was missing, as some other people said, yes, maybe it was a bit rushed, but I feel like that’s because we like the series, and would love to have much more watch time (at least me)
@@agme8045 My younger brother didn't read the book my sister and I did. My brother also said lots of things were lacking for the plot and movie was rushing. My sister also said the same. Snow's reasons of being evil, making those decisions aren't fully explored. Lucy and Snow's relationship is always so distant in the movie it doesn't have the complexity that book has. Maybe they decided to do it like that for people not to romanticize their relationship. Because it's quite common for toxic unhealthy relationship to be romanticize in our current young media. Lucy also has very a important line in the book. "The show isn't over until Mockingjay sings." which is a very important line to this world. The fact that they didn't add this is dissappinting.
Thank you for posting this video. It answered many questions I had after watching Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes.
I didn’t understand Snows thought process of killing Serjanus. He could have just ignored Serjanus’ plans and moved on with his business. But why whispering it to the Capitol? What caused him to be evil at that stage? He was a friend that trusted him.
Because everyone would think snow had a part in it they would kill him too, and he wouldn’t be able to escape out of it due to him being poor and serjanus rich. Snow wanted to go back to capital to become his wealthy self again
I believe he thought Serjanus would get him in trouble if he went through with any of his plans. He wanted to get rid of him so there was no chance snow would be in trouble for being associated with him.
That's exactly the reason. Because he was his friend. He would automatically be associated with whatever Sejanus did and planned.
It’s what everyone else said-Snow would’ve been guilty by association in the eyes of the Capitol. However, I’ll add in the fact that Snow also saw this as a way to regain favor with the powers that be so he could return to the Capitol.
He also thought Sejanus won't get into trouble, because dad would buy him out like always.
IM SO FRICKING HYPED FOR THIS!!! I'm watching it tomorrow with my friends and I'm super excited
I went to go see it ASAP yesterday after rereading the entire series. I thought it was really good despite all the changes from the book. I assume you’ll be making a differences between the book and movie, but just wanted to come here and say again I hope you do make one please! My boyfriend has no interest in reading and I need him to know all the differences.
Do you think Snow genuinely had feelings for Lucy and his paranoia got to him? What do you think would have happened if Lucy never left?
They would have gotten married, for sure 😂
I believe he had
He did, thats why he can tell that Peeta and Katniss are not in love. He knows how it feels to love a person inside the arena.
He definitely loved her but his paranoia got to him.
Snow had genuine feelings for Lucy Gray, but his paranoia didn’t exactly get to him. Lucy Gray did leave him and that was because she deduced Snow played a role in his best friend’s death; she even laid a trap for him.
As far as your next question, I think Snow would’ve still ended up back at the Capitol. Remember, everything that happened in Snow’s exile, Dr. Gaul had a hand in it, or she was, at the very least, aware of it. Also, by him recording Sejanus and ultimately leading him to death, it showed where Snow’s true loyalties lied - with the Capitol and ultimately himself. I just think he would’ve found a way to betray Lucy Gray to get there.
I think it would have been a better choice for Snow to tell Lucy Gray that the 3rd person he killed was Jessup. Because technically he did convince his classmate to send Jessup water so that it would scare him, make him fall and die. Saving Lucy Gray. Although the blood wouldn’t be “on his hand” he was still responsible for it. I’m sure if Coryo had told Lucy that it was Jessup, the ending wouldn’t be the same and the 2 would’ve gone one and lived alone together. For however long it would’ve lasted till Snow would realized that living a life in the woods wasn’t a life for him.
Or the girl from 11 cause he gave her the poison
"Lucy Gray" is a poem written by William Wordsworth in 1799. It ends with a Lucy Gray walking through a snow storm and her fate being unknown because her foot steps had disappeared when people were searching for her. The "Ballad..." book and film therefore recreate the ambiguous vanishing of Lucy Gray.
This is what I think happened: I think she went to District 12 or 13 because her hanging tree song had to pass down somehow. I doubt she would go to 12 because she dosen’t know whether or not there are guards looking for her. I think she went to 13, passed down her songs, her mocking jay symbol, and had a life.
i had a realisation whilst watching this movie, The Hunger Games is a microcosm of Panem. (microcosm: a small version that represents the bigger version in some ways) Think, it’s an arena, people from each district fighting for themselves to the death, getting there own food and water, all being provoked and controlled by the capitol, just like Panem itself, all the districts controlled by the capital. Exept,they all work together, they may not know it or like it. But they all work for the capitol instead of against eachother, but even then, in the hunger games alliances form and betrayals happen
Did any one else gasp when lucy named the plant katniss 🥺🥺🥺
Just came from the theater, I loved it. I love the smalle little clues about katniss being his downfall in the future. The plant to the arrows being seen in the arena.
In the book on page 7 (cause I reread some of it before seeing the film) Snow mentions how fixating on something (like an enemy) would lead to his downfall which is what he mentions to Katniss about Coin in Mockingjay. Not relevant here but still interesting 😊
I really liked it. I just expected that last part to be longer (Snow's training and relationship with Lucy and her band), cause i think one of the theories is that the little girl with blonde hair will pass those songs to Katniss generation.
Other than that I loved the soundtrack. It's also funny to me that i was so sad at the end of the book, but i was angry with the film ending 😅, good job.
I like the thought of Lucy Grey being Katniss’s grandmother. It’s makes lots of sense especially with the scene that she shows Snow the Katniss plant as a subtle nod.
i watched the movie today and LOVED it!!!! i haven't read the books but i am so excited too! this film was well done, and i loved the quote from older snow at the end. this movie was so well done! great explanation! the details from the book that were left out of the movie really make the story that much more interesting and intriguing!
edit: after reading some comments, i want to mention how interesting it was that the white roses were featured. and when snow is older in the triology, there are white roses that sit on his desk.
I loved the references, the Katniss ones were great but I actually caught the Finnick ones as well
1. snow meets lucy Gray at the train and he gives her a white flower, she tears a bit off and eats it confidently/cocky.
this is just like Finnick and the sugar cubes in catching fire.
2. the district 4 female was dying to the snakes and lucy was above, and she called out for help but lucy couldn't do anything.
this is just like when Finnick died in mocking jay part 2 and he called out screaming but Katniss couldn't do anything.
i think the directors added these details in so we wouldn't cry about Finnick in the cinema LOL
I was skeptical of the movie at first, but as it went on, perfectly done, great job by everyone! Not how I imagined Lucy in the book but loved it! Felt very real life, like small town girl and city boy
I just saw the movie tonight and I’m so incredibly happy with the movie, they did such a wonderful job! I also read the book, yes not everything is in it or they changed a couple things to move the story along but it’s so well done!! I loved it! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
I watched it on a first date and I was so into the film I even forgot she was next to me at one point. Honestly this film was soooooooo good
I would like to highlight what Lucy said to Snow on the lake about how she values trust over love. When she caught Snow about him murdering three, not knowing who the third person was, I think she immediately knew she had to leave him.
I just saw the movie in cinemas and it was amazing!! I loved it so much. It couldn't have been better in my opinion ❤
Spoilers!
The end of the book hits so hard! From Sejanus' death to the Epilogue, I f*ckin' love those last chapters!!
6:56 That makes sense now why in The Hunger Games Peeta said District 12 might finally have a winner.
SPOILER
I believe they did truly love each other but once Lucy found out that snow killed 3 people she realized he killed Sajuans (can’t spell it) she couldn’t trust the Snow wouldn’t turn on her too and got scared of him and ran.
I do believe she still loved him but didn’t wanna risk anything and didn’t want to get hurt she even wrote a song about him so that can help prove she loved him
With Snow idk if he still loved her or not bc she did shoot her and kinda hunted her so idk about him but he was really upset that she left soo
I wish snow didn’t turn evil wish they were endgame they were cute and perfect but bc snow turned on his bff what would stop him from Turing on Lucy
Snow he turned on Lucy and made Lucy lose trust after mentions he killed 3 people and not just the two she knew of. She was able to figure out that he killed Sejeanus, his friend, so if her turned on his friend what stops him from Turing on Lucy. Also I believe the snake wasn’t poisonous to me I think it was meant to symbolize that Snow was a snake and Lucy knew everything
also side fact: when they anounce which mentor gets which tribute one of the mentor‘s last name is heavensbee and in the original movies starting in catching fire there‘s the new head gamemaker called plutarch heavensbee. Since plutarch seems to be younger than snow i would say this old class mate of snow/other mentor is the parent of plutarch which would make sense when you see how plutarch has enough influence to become the gamemaker when his parents are influential people in the capitol. so someone in the capitol 65 years later with the same last name would be too much of a coincidence to them not being related which would make more sense why snow trusts plutarch bc he knows his parents. It doesn‘t really add anything to the story but it‘s just sth that came to my mind when i heard that name
Thank you for the fantastic breakdown! I really liked the old hunger game movies so I was really excited to watch this one! Man was I not disappointed! Great film!
It's kind of ironic that another comparison between snow and his father was when that girl turned in the paper claiming it as hers
I am resisting watching this to the end because i am going to see this tomorrow! I will come back and watch this soon. I can’t wait!!
I thought the ending of the movie missed the reflection of the book in Snows character and his struggle but a good ending that ties the movie universe together