Are u sure you’re not having a mite problem? My plants look a like this when spider mites attack them. Maybe you can give them mit ici de and plant antibiotics, bleach your pots and repot them. I think.
@@SVKLOrchids well, that would have been my question to you :) It seems that manual clean up with water and alcohol and spray up of soapy water is efficient on the plants I treated 2 weeks ago (draculas), so I'm expanding it to the other plants. Let me know if you have any success with this or another method.
Maybe a small circulating fan for them, I think the light is too hot for the summer blooming phals, I find that the leaves are usually lighter and thinner and don't seem to need intense close light. Good luck.
Hi Steve, don't give up on phals, they are wonderful! Your light in that cabinet is too high for phals without air movement and low humidity. I think if you turn only top lamp and move your phals on the second shelf without the light , they should be ok. Move all the cattleyas up and phals and bulbos down with only the top light on,and see if that works. Good luck 👍
Well Stephen it looks like they definitely need air movement to cool the leaves, Ghigabell looks dehydrated and the lights are way to hot and strong...warmth and no air movement is a bacterial and funus factory looks like a combination of both to me....even in the greenhouse with 65% shade cloth in winter here mine bloom...thrive and it's cooler lots of air flow and less light....also you should be feeding calmag and tiny dabs of epsom salts with your fertilizer. Phals love it! The leaves should be thick and almost plastic like for optimum health and strength....😊 you could put a chunk of shade cloth under the light for phals only and definitely put 2 tiny fans in cabinet to cool the plants and keep air movement....
I think your conclusion is right. As a disclaimer, I have a very limited experience. I began interested in the hobby in the winter of 2024. Following your videos, I created two Rudsta cabinets with a very similar setup. My first Rudsta cabinet has 4 Barrina lights on the top and Carnivero much stronger lights for the lower section. The second cabinet has two Carnivero lights on the top and two Carnivero lights on the bottom. Novelty phals seem to be doing more or less ok on the top shelf with much weaker light. The strong Carnivero light turned out to be two strong. They burnt my compact cattleyas. In the end I had to turn off one Carnivero light on the top and bottom shelves. It seems that the cattleyas started feeling better. It can be too early for any conclusions, but this is my experience for what it is worth.
Those brown spots look like bacterial/fungal infection. What is your setup? Do you not have a fan? The stagnant air plus the water on the leaves makes perfect conditions for fungus and bacteria to thrive
I grow orchids in southern Finland - quite different 😇 I also think there's a multitude of 'issues'. I think you have some infection - fungal, bacteria or both. Other people have suggested it already and I have to agree. I'm having fungal infections on some of my plants, too, as I was happily misting them every morning. Though - maybe due to the generally cool climate here - I haven't lost any orchids. It's not very fast progressing for me. Second thing is you potting media. Personally, I usually grow Phalaenopsis in medium sized bark. The young ones I have in an young orchid bark mix - retains significantly more moisture. But I do indeed have a few struggling ones in sphagnum moss. But I really only use it for the Phals that have (almost) no roots left. Small, young Phals I may water daily or twice a week. Most of my big ones are fine with being watered (I soaked every orchid once a week for ~10min) once a week. I check the colour of the roots. If they are green, no watering, if they are silverish-white, I'll water in between the weekly soaking. Personally, I love the clear plastic pots that have holes around the sides. It really drys the media more evenly - but again, I'm in a rather cool and damp climate (the Masdevallia love it here 😂)! Personally , I report almost every orchid after purchase. I want to know how the roots look and I want them to be in a setup that I know works for me in my environment. That also applies to orchids I purchased from good nurseries. Because my home isn't a greenhouse. Phalaenopsis are being these days very often grown and sold with those moss plugs. You can't see them unless you take the plant really out of the pot because there's often bark all around fooling you into thinking you have an orchid growing in bark and treating it that way while you are actually having a darn sponge sitting right under the stem of the plant! I know it is possible to grow orchids with that moss plug. Personally, I remove those moss plugs because I'll have two vastly different conditions in the same pot and I don't think that does any good. Lastly, the lights. I grow whole year under lights (surprise, surprise, at a place where there's a whooping max of 6h daylight at some time of thr year). I don't have fancy lights but they seem to do the trick. I have them year round 12h a day on - in the winter that's all the light my plants get - in the summer they get as many extra hours of daylight as there is. I don't have my Phals under grow lights but rather in the approximity of them. I have my Cattleyas and Vandas etc under the lights and the Phals, Bulbos, Paphs etc in the area around it where they still get the light but I isn't shining straight on them. I don't know your reasons for keeping the plants inside zhe cupboard - I don't have any of my plants in closed cupboards. That might be one contributing factor to the potential infection of your Phals. But what I'm actually trying to say is, if you really want to keep your phals in that cupboard, I would suggest lowering the light intensity. If your lights aren't dimmable and they don't get terribly hot, some parchment paper over them should do the trick 😎 good luck with your Phals 😊 maybe you can also find a person in your area who knows about Phals and has figured out how to grow them in your environment to ask for their setup or even have them taking a look at yours 😊
BTW the fungi/bacteria can be treated by removing infected leaves and if that's not an option 3% Hydrogenperoxid on and around the infected areas should be safe for the plants and take care of the issue. But then of course you have to figure out the cause of the infection an probably adjust growing conditions to avoid it from happening again and again 😊
@@pepperdrahthaar8522 I found out that I've got a serious mite infection, but didn't recognize it because the effects to the plants were much different than anything I've seen before. I'll definitely be checking for mites more often now!
I do not believe that is a light issue. My indoor Phals are under intensely bright light (enough to flower Cattleya) and the leaves are paler than is normal, but they are not doing that. I would suspect a pest, perhaps mites. Check with Dustin or Dimitri, they grow a lot of Phals and they might be able to give you a more definite yay or nay on the light.
I didn't follow up with you. Dimitri immediately asked me to wipe the plants with a tissue. Sure enough, the red streaks showed a massive mite infection was the issue. I've since nuked everything.
Had a longer more thorough comment typed up, but it kept being instantly deleted when I post. I grow under very strong lights, doubt it's that. Looks fungal to me and I see what looks like mesophyll collapse. Could be viral, but unlikely due to simultaneous symptoms across plants. My guess is airflow, which I've found essential indoors. Does the light put out a lot of heat? Could be a contributing factor.
The cabinet gets up to about 85 degrees and is not sealed, so it does get airflow. However, there's no fan! The plants have been virus tested, so that's mostly eliminated. I might try some physan.
Stephen, I have found that Phals & Bulbos like the same light (around 1500 foot candle- bought a light meter on ebay). Phals especially like good air movement. I moved my phals from my main shadehouse last year as they were not doing well. I now have them on my front entertainment area where they get only reflected light. I live in the sub tropics where summer day temps can be mid 30C and winter night temps 6-10C. The difference was amazing. Shiny leaves and so many spikes now (Autumn here).I also gave them Mn & Ca every week.
Hey hon, I think its something else Going on. I think its possible pest like spider mite spreading fungus or bacterial issue. If humidity is high in that cabinet may be part of the problem. Phals in situations like that dont handle the high humidity. Your phals would honestly do better on your window sill. If it is light. I hope you get it figured out.
I probably should have posted a screenshot of the temp/humidity in the cabinet. I didn't seal the cabinet at all so the whole thing could breath. My sensorpush usually goes between 50-70% for humidity, so it's not to bad. I'll have to figure out if its just the lights or if there's a pathogen in there too.
I’m thinking air movement would help and maybe a humidifier of some sort. I haven’t grown orchids under lights, although I have been investigating it a bit as I want to overwinter catasetum seedlings under lights. I really like the look of the Vivosun system as you seem to be able to control the lights, fans and extraction systems via an app
I have a phalaenopsis Ying Yang Blueberry Heaven Sent that loves being under my very strong barrina lights, but I have it at least 10-12 inches above it. It thrived this last winter this way compared to last winter under weaker lights
Definitely cooking them!! Take the lower light out and leave all the phals on lower shelf. Increase sure movement. I did the same thing with many of mine on a led strip light I though was okay.
My suspect actually might be too hot/bright/and humid based on your conditions. I don't see a fan in that cabinet and I find that the summer blooming phals are extremely susceptible to rot due to the thinner leaves. Also, in my conditions, I have always ended up killing every phal grown in pure sphagnum if I leave them in there for long enough (especially if the media is packed down. I grow mine with my cattleyas on the same rack in plastic pots with smaller grade bark, ~30% average humidity (which is why I don't use air circulation), warm in the summer, intermediate-cool in the winter, similar to my multifloral paphiopedilums. I have not had any issues in the years that I've grown them.
Steve, I have phals under lights and some in east facing and west facing windows. It looks you are letting them get too dry and you need to water them more often.
I grow on a west facing porch with supplemental light in NC. I turn my lights off in the hottest part of the day starting in April. I saw a big improvement. Temperature reached 110 degrees under the lights ! Try Vanda luckinow for a smaller fragrant orchid that likes high light and hot temps. It has the very light scent of expensive perform and my plant had 4 flower spikes. I grow mine on an east facing porch in the summer.
You shouldn’t give up on them even if they die you can learn from them. I started my phalaenopsis species journey on march 14 with no past experience with them before other than regular phals. I keep all of my phals on my front porch where they can feel that air circulation around them to prevent fungus and other nasty stuff from forming and I check on them almost daily for mites or other pets I also lightly spray them with neem oil just in case. Your issue definitely reminds me of mites when they attacked my succulents. Edit: I forgot to mention i live in Puerto Rico so my growing conditions are a little different from yours
I found out that I've got a serious mite infection, but didn't recognize it because the effects to the plants were much different than anything I've seen before. I'll definitely be checking for mites more often now!
All of my phals are under lights, and I've never had these issues. I believe your issue may be water. I exclusively grow/prefer Polychilos Phals, and they are NEVER allowed to dry out. I custom mix something open and chunky (similar to my cattleya but with rockwool mixed in for dampness without the risk of rot like moss), but which stays moist consistently. There is a small reservoir as well, and they have always done well for me. I think as another commenter noted, the lights are forcing their metabolic rate, but without the bulbs to support, they can't keep up without input. They look really dry to me. I recommend just upping the water if not letting them sit in a small dish to see how it goes.
I’m going to add another day of water for these plants, for sure! I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
Agree that it’s a ventilation issue. I grow my phals on my patio for most of the year (South TX). They receive loads of light but no direct sun. Do you water with plain RO water between fertilizing?
I have 25ppm of fertilizer at every water, inside RO water. I definitely didn’t want to water with our liquid rock since I’m not using a hose on them anymore.
@@SVKLOrchids I stopped using my tap water on them too but I add Cal Mag to the water at 1/2 strength, every feed. I’ve not measured the ppm, I figured it can’t be much but they love it and I have seen a difference.
This is difficult because high light/over exposure, high *salts and thrips damage all result in dropped leaves. My first guess is actually thrips attack, because your Blue Ridge plant is still looking fine and probably still has systemic pesticide on board, where the plants you have had longer or repotted might have run out of systemic. Your new growths look like they took the worst damage and the rhizomes got attacked. That outer leaf stippling is often thrips work. The repotted plants probably dont have any orthene or Safari in the medium and the new growths are unprotected and getting abused. If its thrips, use a systemic and don't throw out the plants with good roots, the summer blooming class can regrow from the roots if they are still healthy, surprisingly enough. Thrips pressure trends to ramp up after pollen season and the things are tiny and can hike in on anything. Possibility two is the salts have built up and the plants are having difficulty drawing water. I know you are well aware Austin and San Antonio have hard water. The winter blooming phals usually are ok with it. But not the summer blooming crosses in my experience. I have about ninety of this type, and I have to use RO and not more than 50-100ppm total(all the stuff, not just N) to avoid burns and pest issues. Without 70-90% humidity overnight and Borneo level heavy dew they get salt stressed very easily. Not all of them are so weak in the presence of fertilizer and salt, but a Id probably be down to twelve or so if I didn't get an RO unit and adjust when they all started crashing out. Even with great humidity is in the grow chamber, its not a dew event/clean water(20ppm) irrigation. Those roots still look quite good, so I dont really think this is the issue here, but it can add stress. If you had a wet wall situation, you could probably ignore this advice completely, but inside without the constant mineral free water/humidity delivery on the wind its more important to control for. Over exposure tends to slowly bleach. Lime green, to yellow blotches to white blotches to leaf on the ground. They are very lime green, but I don't see bleaching. My guess is thrips are ruining your otherwise nice setup. If you have any yellow sticky traps, put a few in the chamber to see if there are any nasties flying around
I actually use RO water with these ones since the tap water is like liquid rock! Since filming this video, I found out it was mites. They have such a different method of attack than what I’m used to, I couldn’t diagnose it earlier!
One indiication whether light you have used is too much is photo bleaching leaves turning yellow . Under ideal light conditions leaves would be light green . If light is too low leaves would be dark green on a relative scale
For sure! The leaves are a wonderful shade of green until they turn yellow. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
Oh my... that looks really bad. 🥺 I've no idea, never seen that before, sunburn looks different.... Hope s.o. will have a clue what's going on in your cabinet. 🤞🍀🙏
Hi Stephen I am good with phals I might have about 50 of them. Phals are not good with humidity. I know in their nature they are living in really humid regions but in home conditions they can get fungal infection really easily. I can see you have a kind of shelf look like filter. I would try to leave the door open and I would turn light of in the phal shelf. They might still get enough light from shelf on above. Also I would clean leaf residue from the stem because new roots sometimes get stuck between the stem and dry leaf ends. I would also repot that big phal gigabel because plant end up too high in the pot but first clean that leaf ends. If you separate them from middle than you can peel them down. And most important thing they look like get water in between the leafs or extreme humidity. I don’t think this is light burn.
Sorry about your Phals. I agree on the light intensity, unless the leaves feel hot to the touch then it may just be a heat burn. I think if it's simply too much light, pushing the leaves to photorespiration or beyond, a fan may not help as much; but if it's getting too hot, a fan is definitely helpful. Just my two cents :) I have my Phal. violacea under the same light as my C. schilleriana and C. aclandiae seedlings, only because of space constraints, with the same distance, but I turned the leaves vertical and away from the light. I think the angel of how the leaves are exposed to the light seems to make a difference as well. Mine have really light green leaves so I suspect it's on the high spectrum of the light they need. On the smaller and fragrant orchids, I'll follow to see what people suggest/you end up having! I recently got a Neofinetia/Vanda falcata that the grower said she grew under Cattleya lights. I haven't had it long enough but I put it with my Catts and it seems to be happy (pushing out new roots and "fans").
hey man, don't give up on the phals :) while i wish i had some advice for you, your experience is way more than ours. so my advice would be to follow your instincts!! its worth mentioning that once we got our little cabinets/tents set up, i was surprised by how much difference in temp there was between the top shelf and the bottom. around 2.5-3 C regularly. maybe some needed a little cooler winter cool down than the top shelf with high light and low air mvmt was giving them? totally spitballing...go with your gut!!!
This is odd, I could have sword I responded to you comment! Anyway, I spoke to Dimitri and he immediately asked me to wipe the plant with a white tissue. Sure enough, there were tons of mites! It was a massive mite infection that I didn't recognize due to the way the plants were effected, which was different than anything I've seen before.
@@SVKLOrchids no worries, and sorry to hear about the mites. at least they seem to be fairly easy to eradicate! are they the red ones or the ones that don't leave wispy threads? have you found the source of the outbreak? with mites we have usually been able to track it back to a source and the outbreaks followed a radial spread pattern. perhaps if all of them are infected then its too late for such intervention. but there always seems to be one or two plants that feed the outbreak and we just throw those away and treat the ones that aren't so heavily infected. maybe time for a second cabinet to serve as infirmary?!
I find monopodial orchids so difficult as well. For me, the get stem rot, drop buds and roots, ... I have some Angraecoids and I killed at least 3 Angraecium didieri. The one I have now seems to be doing ok. My Angraecum leonis finally bloomed after four years of having it. Two spike, a total of six buds and only one came to fruition.
You’re one step closer to Phals!!! lol I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
@@SVKLOrchids Haha. I've liked Angraeciods for a while and Michael McCarthy has called me out on it... I suppose the only Phalaenopsis I could own is a schilleriana because of the leaves. Hope you can eliminate the mites!!!
I believe they are getting too much light. I have grow lights but I do not put my Phals under them. I have my Phals about 5 feet from a west facing window in moss. They seem to be doing very well. I live in zone 10 in California. I also wonder about air flow in your cabinet? Don’t give up just move them.
Hey lovely video , I'm afraid your lights are very bright for your phals, I grow all my phals under lights and they do very well , maybe change the lights and you will be okay , best of luck
Question: Do you have a ventilation source? I had a few of my orchids in a grow tent for a bit more than half a year, with a ventilator running 15 minutes each hour, humidity around 80 % and many of those orchids got fungal issues; especially the "novelty" Phals. Now I have them in a normal room and all those fungal issues disappeared... I also did not wanted the ventilator to run 24/7. - On the other hand, if you think it might be a light issue, try to hang a shade cloth inbetween. Also pure glas seems to reduce the light intensity by 50 %. - But, if you don't have a ventilation source, I would check for fungal issues. And move those plants on a normal window sill. (Btw.: My ambient room humidity is almost always at 60 % - Göttingen, Germany)
I didn't seal the cabinet so it could breath and there is probably a nearly centimeter gap between the glass panels and the cabinet. I might a small fan though!
Mine did the same under strong grow lights. At first they appeared to do fine, but after a few months problems begin to show - lots of yellow leaves I ended up switching to cheap grow lights that i found on Amazon (the ones with clip ons) just for my Phals - they are doing great now. My spider farmer lights are simply too strong even at 50% brightness they can still burn my cattleya and vanda leaves if I am not careful. So, yeah, grow phals only under cheap lights now 😂
@@SVKLOrchids many different brands, one in particular is called Gooing Top clip LED grow lights - but honestly they all look and function about the same, cheap looking with clip on base, bendable gooseneck-like bars to point the lights in any direction. Usually sells on Amazon for less than $25. I’ve had mine for 3 years now, still works, I use strictly on my Phal bellinas that sit on open shelves - I like that the lights are cheap, zero chance of leaf burns and my bellinas still bloom regularly. Hope you find a solution for your phals. They are beautiful, just need to try another low maintenance way to grow them 👍
@@lliu25 I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it. The cabinet has now been nuked!!
@@SVKLOrchids oh wow that’s interesting, i had thought mites’ MO is attack the freshest leaves first before going after older leaves. So glad you found the root cause!
Are you using the same water as outside? Outside mine get irrigation water, but inside they got tap and did the same thing. So I switched to RO water and they recovered. Too much light as well. Can they come into the house in a bright shady spot near a window?
The length of exposure does make a difference in my experience, perhaps you could try reduce the number of hours of light exposure to 3 hours and see how they respond. On longer exposure like 12 hours light filtering through from the upper cabinet might even be sufficient?
I’ve got the timer set to turn on are sunrise and off at sunset! I love the automatic seasonal variation. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
I got 3 fragrant phals and they all died ( 2 baby phals and 1 matured). I find them just not as tough as the typical flower shop phals. I found a video from a Chinese grower and he had the same complaint as well.
Hi Stephen😌🤲The Phalaenopsis only require very mild light, so think of a North facing window with bright, but no sun on the leaves, and they ideal like cool temperatures 60/75℃. And let them appoach dryness and water thoroughly. Does this help you?
Unfortunately, I don’t have any good windows. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
The lighting may not be the entire problem but I would venture to say that it is contributing to the Phals demise. I would buy a cheap LED light (such as the ones you can find at Home Depot) and try that, as an experiment. My phals are in an eastern facing window and are supplemented with an LED light. But the light is like 18" above the plant.
I grow indoors with light levels at about 200 foot candles at around 70 degrees in summer and as low as 60 during winter and I grow species and hybrids in bark and sphagnum I think you may be cooking the pals they don’t take a lot of light if you have a email I can send some picks I don’t know how on this platform
Maybe too much light but no real sunburn? 🤔 Well, maybe what I know as sunburn is heat damage... I haven't had these crispy edges, but very yellow leafs one summer in my new home without shading my east facing window.
Lights are not the problem. You seem to have fungal/bacterial infection, or a pest problem like mites or thrips. Check your phals closely, inspect them well!
I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
@@SVKLOrchids its definitely mites. red spider mites wiped out hundreds of my phal over the years and they look like your plants in this video. They leave my oncidium and cattleya alone and seem to love the phals.
I'm almost 100% sure it's NOT the light!! I grew phals under too strong light a few times and they reacted the same way every single time(!!): the leaves get dark and take up a purple-y color too!! I think you don't have just the one problem but you have different problems with a couple of the plants! I'd check the roots first of all, maybe you'll have rootrot... the smaller ones looks like rotting to me... The big one looks like lacking of nutrients!! The leaf structure is too fragile and bright + the plant sacrificing the lower leaves! ...
I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
Are u sure you’re not having a mite problem? My plants look a like this when spider mites attack them. Maybe you can give them mit ici de and plant antibiotics, bleach your pots and repot them. I think.
Yes! Since this video, my Phal expert friend in France told me it’s mites and I agree. I wiped the leaves with a tissue and it was very red.
@@SVKLOrchids I was about to say the same thing, i'm having a mite outburst and the plants look the same.
@@yohannvallee7938 What treatment are you giving your plants?
@@SVKLOrchids well, that would have been my question to you :) It seems that manual clean up with water and alcohol and spray up of soapy water is efficient on the plants I treated 2 weeks ago (draculas), so I'm expanding it to the other plants. Let me know if you have any success with this or another method.
@@yohannvallee7938 I nuked mine with bifenthrin! Its my first time using that particular chemical.
Maybe a small circulating fan for them, I think the light is too hot for the summer blooming phals, I find that the leaves are usually lighter and thinner and don't seem to need intense close light. Good luck.
Ya, I have to grab a fan!
Hi Steve, don't give up on phals, they are wonderful! Your light in that cabinet is too high for phals without air movement and low humidity. I think if you turn only top lamp and move your phals on the second shelf without the light , they should be ok. Move all the cattleyas up and phals and bulbos down with only the top light on,and see if that works. Good luck 👍
Thanks! I’ll definitely make some changes
Well Stephen it looks like they definitely need air movement to cool the leaves, Ghigabell looks dehydrated and the lights are way to hot and strong...warmth and no air movement is a bacterial and funus factory looks like a combination of both to me....even in the greenhouse with 65% shade cloth in winter here mine bloom...thrive and it's cooler lots of air flow and less light....also you should be feeding calmag and tiny dabs of epsom salts with your fertilizer. Phals love it! The leaves should be thick and almost plastic like for optimum health and strength....😊 you could put a chunk of shade cloth under the light for phals only and definitely put 2 tiny fans in cabinet to cool the plants and keep air movement....
I might end up removing a light! Not sure yet.
I think your conclusion is right. As a disclaimer, I have a very limited experience. I began interested in the hobby in the winter of 2024. Following your videos, I created two Rudsta cabinets with a very similar setup. My first Rudsta cabinet has 4 Barrina lights on the top and Carnivero much stronger lights for the lower section. The second cabinet has two Carnivero lights on the top and two Carnivero lights on the bottom. Novelty phals seem to be doing more or less ok on the top shelf with much weaker light. The strong Carnivero light turned out to be two strong. They burnt my compact cattleyas. In the end I had to turn off one Carnivero light on the top and bottom shelves. It seems that the cattleyas started feeling better. It can be too early for any conclusions, but this is my experience for what it is worth.
Ah, that’s good to know!!
Those brown spots look like bacterial/fungal infection. What is your setup? Do you not have a fan? The stagnant air plus the water on the leaves makes perfect conditions for fungus and bacteria to thrive
No fan since I didn’t seal the cabinet
I grow orchids in southern Finland - quite different 😇 I also think there's a multitude of 'issues'. I think you have some infection - fungal, bacteria or both. Other people have suggested it already and I have to agree. I'm having fungal infections on some of my plants, too, as I was happily misting them every morning. Though - maybe due to the generally cool climate here - I haven't lost any orchids. It's not very fast progressing for me.
Second thing is you potting media. Personally, I usually grow Phalaenopsis in medium sized bark. The young ones I have in an young orchid bark mix - retains significantly more moisture. But I do indeed have a few struggling ones in sphagnum moss. But I really only use it for the Phals that have (almost) no roots left. Small, young Phals I may water daily or twice a week. Most of my big ones are fine with being watered (I soaked every orchid once a week for ~10min) once a week. I check the colour of the roots. If they are green, no watering, if they are silverish-white, I'll water in between the weekly soaking. Personally, I love the clear plastic pots that have holes around the sides. It really drys the media more evenly - but again, I'm in a rather cool and damp climate (the Masdevallia love it here 😂)! Personally , I report almost every orchid after purchase. I want to know how the roots look and I want them to be in a setup that I know works for me in my environment. That also applies to orchids I purchased from good nurseries. Because my home isn't a greenhouse. Phalaenopsis are being these days very often grown and sold with those moss plugs. You can't see them unless you take the plant really out of the pot because there's often bark all around fooling you into thinking you have an orchid growing in bark and treating it that way while you are actually having a darn sponge sitting right under the stem of the plant! I know it is possible to grow orchids with that moss plug. Personally, I remove those moss plugs because I'll have two vastly different conditions in the same pot and I don't think that does any good.
Lastly, the lights. I grow whole year under lights (surprise, surprise, at a place where there's a whooping max of 6h daylight at some time of thr year). I don't have fancy lights but they seem to do the trick. I have them year round 12h a day on - in the winter that's all the light my plants get - in the summer they get as many extra hours of daylight as there is. I don't have my Phals under grow lights but rather in the approximity of them. I have my Cattleyas and Vandas etc under the lights and the Phals, Bulbos, Paphs etc in the area around it where they still get the light but I isn't shining straight on them. I don't know your reasons for keeping the plants inside zhe cupboard - I don't have any of my plants in closed cupboards. That might be one contributing factor to the potential infection of your Phals. But what I'm actually trying to say is, if you really want to keep your phals in that cupboard, I would suggest lowering the light intensity. If your lights aren't dimmable and they don't get terribly hot, some parchment paper over them should do the trick 😎 good luck with your Phals 😊 maybe you can also find a person in your area who knows about Phals and has figured out how to grow them in your environment to ask for their setup or even have them taking a look at yours 😊
BTW the fungi/bacteria can be treated by removing infected leaves and if that's not an option 3% Hydrogenperoxid on and around the infected areas should be safe for the plants and take care of the issue. But then of course you have to figure out the cause of the infection an probably adjust growing conditions to avoid it from happening again and again 😊
@@pepperdrahthaar8522 I found out that I've got a serious mite infection, but didn't recognize it because the effects to the plants were much different than anything I've seen before. I'll definitely be checking for mites more often now!
@@SVKLOrchids oh damn it! I cross my fingers for you 🤞 at least you know what's going on - always the first step!
I do not believe that is a light issue. My indoor Phals are under intensely bright light (enough to flower Cattleya) and the leaves are paler than is normal, but they are not doing that. I would suspect a pest, perhaps mites. Check with Dustin or Dimitri, they grow a lot of Phals and they might be able to give you a more definite yay or nay on the light.
Ya, I need to send this video to Dimitri to check out!!
I didn't follow up with you. Dimitri immediately asked me to wipe the plants with a tissue. Sure enough, the red streaks showed a massive mite infection was the issue. I've since nuked everything.
@@SVKLOrchids you should have just checked with TomFumby or whatever name he goes by now🤣
Had a longer more thorough comment typed up, but it kept being instantly deleted when I post. I grow under very strong lights, doubt it's that. Looks fungal to me and I see what looks like mesophyll collapse. Could be viral, but unlikely due to simultaneous symptoms across plants. My guess is airflow, which I've found essential indoors. Does the light put out a lot of heat? Could be a contributing factor.
The cabinet gets up to about 85 degrees and is not sealed, so it does get airflow. However, there's no fan! The plants have been virus tested, so that's mostly eliminated. I might try some physan.
Stephen, I have found that Phals & Bulbos like the same light (around 1500 foot candle- bought a light meter on ebay). Phals especially like good air movement. I moved my phals from my main shadehouse last year as they were not doing well. I now have them on my front entertainment area where they get only reflected light. I live in the sub tropics where summer day temps can be mid 30C and winter night temps 6-10C. The difference was amazing. Shiny leaves and so many spikes now (Autumn here).I also gave them Mn & Ca every week.
I’m getting lots of comments about air movement! I might need a fan…
I might do a video of m setup soon and upload it to you tube
@@michaelpye5972 Tag me when you do!
@@SVKLOrchids will do
Hey hon, I think its something else Going on. I think its possible pest like spider mite spreading fungus or bacterial issue. If humidity is high in that cabinet may be part of the problem. Phals in situations like that dont handle the high humidity. Your phals would honestly do better on your window sill. If it is light. I hope you get it figured out.
I probably should have posted a screenshot of the temp/humidity in the cabinet. I didn't seal the cabinet at all so the whole thing could breath. My sensorpush usually goes between 50-70% for humidity, so it's not to bad. I'll have to figure out if its just the lights or if there's a pathogen in there too.
I’m thinking air movement would help and maybe a humidifier of some sort. I haven’t grown orchids under lights, although I have been investigating it a bit as I want to overwinter catasetum seedlings under lights. I really like the look of the Vivosun system as you seem to be able to control the lights, fans and extraction systems via an app
Having things on an app is definitely a cool feature!
I have a phalaenopsis Ying Yang Blueberry Heaven Sent that loves being under my very strong barrina lights, but I have it at least 10-12 inches above it. It thrived this last winter this way compared to last winter under weaker lights
Getting the lighting right is tricky!
Definitely cooking them!! Take the lower light out and leave all the phals on lower shelf. Increase sure movement. I did the same thing with many of mine on a led strip light I though was okay.
I might have to do that!
My suspect actually might be too hot/bright/and humid based on your conditions. I don't see a fan in that cabinet and I find that the summer blooming phals are extremely susceptible to rot due to the thinner leaves. Also, in my conditions, I have always ended up killing every phal grown in pure sphagnum if I leave them in there for long enough (especially if the media is packed down. I grow mine with my cattleyas on the same rack in plastic pots with smaller grade bark, ~30% average humidity (which is why I don't use air circulation), warm in the summer, intermediate-cool in the winter, similar to my multifloral paphiopedilums. I have not had any issues in the years that I've grown them.
My Phals potted in bark look the same 😢
Steve, I have phals under lights and some in east facing and west facing windows. It looks you are letting them get too dry and you need to water them more often.
I’m definitely adding another day of water to the schedule!
Try a few in the PET method! I have a few in PET and they are doing well!
Huh, I never thought about putting Phals in PET. Seems like it could work. How long have yours been in that method?
I just have a couple in PET... From seedling size to blooming... So probably 4 years plus. I used mostly broken clay bricks and charcoal.
@@Craigboodoo That’s really cool! Definitely a good idea.
I grow on a west facing porch with supplemental light in NC. I turn my lights off in the hottest part of the day starting in April. I saw a big improvement. Temperature reached 110 degrees under the lights ! Try Vanda luckinow for a smaller fragrant orchid that likes high light and hot temps. It has the very light scent of expensive perform and my plant had 4 flower spikes. I grow mine on an east facing porch in the summer.
Vanda luckinow is a new one to me! Any sources to buy?
@@SVKLOrchids I found mine on ebay. The seller does not have anything listed right now. I got lucky with excellent quality.
A google indicates it's a cross between Neofinetia (now Vanda?) falcata and Vanda tesellata, Picture looks like mine. It was listed as V. lucknow.
You shouldn’t give up on them even if they die you can learn from them. I started my phalaenopsis species journey on march 14 with no past experience with them before other than regular phals. I keep all of my phals on my front porch where they can feel that air circulation around them to prevent fungus and other nasty stuff from forming and I check on them almost daily for mites or other pets I also lightly spray them with neem oil just in case. Your issue definitely reminds me of mites when they attacked my succulents. Edit: I forgot to mention i live in Puerto Rico so my growing conditions are a little different from yours
I found out that I've got a serious mite infection, but didn't recognize it because the effects to the plants were much different than anything I've seen before. I'll definitely be checking for mites more often now!
All of my phals are under lights, and I've never had these issues. I believe your issue may be water. I exclusively grow/prefer Polychilos Phals, and they are NEVER allowed to dry out. I custom mix something open and chunky (similar to my cattleya but with rockwool mixed in for dampness without the risk of rot like moss), but which stays moist consistently. There is a small reservoir as well, and they have always done well for me.
I think as another commenter noted, the lights are forcing their metabolic rate, but without the bulbs to support, they can't keep up without input. They look really dry to me. I recommend just upping the water if not letting them sit in a small dish to see how it goes.
I’m going to add another day of water for these plants, for sure! I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
Agree that it’s a ventilation issue. I grow my phals on my patio for most of the year (South TX). They receive loads of light but no direct sun. Do you water with plain RO water between fertilizing?
I have 25ppm of fertilizer at every water, inside RO water. I definitely didn’t want to water with our liquid rock since I’m not using a hose on them anymore.
@@SVKLOrchids I stopped using my tap water on them too but I add Cal Mag to the water at 1/2 strength, every feed. I’ve not measured the ppm, I figured it can’t be much but they love it and I have seen a difference.
I think because the Poor ventilation. Try to set up the small fans in the cabinet see if they get better.
I might invest in a fan!
This is difficult because high light/over exposure, high *salts and thrips damage all result in dropped leaves.
My first guess is actually thrips attack, because your Blue Ridge plant is still looking fine and probably still has systemic pesticide on board, where the plants you have had longer or repotted might have run out of systemic.
Your new growths look like they took the worst damage and the rhizomes got attacked. That outer leaf stippling is often thrips work. The repotted plants probably dont have any orthene or Safari in the medium and the new growths are unprotected and getting abused.
If its thrips, use a systemic and don't throw out the plants with good roots, the summer blooming class can regrow from the roots if they are still healthy, surprisingly enough. Thrips pressure trends to ramp up after pollen season and the things are tiny and can hike in on anything.
Possibility two is the salts have built up and the plants are having difficulty drawing water. I know you are well aware Austin and San Antonio have hard water. The winter blooming phals usually are ok with it. But not the summer blooming crosses in my experience.
I have about ninety of this type, and I have to use RO and not more than 50-100ppm total(all the stuff, not just N) to avoid burns and pest issues. Without 70-90% humidity overnight and Borneo level heavy dew they get salt stressed very easily. Not all of them are so weak in the presence of fertilizer and salt, but a Id probably be down to twelve or so if I didn't get an RO unit and adjust when they all started crashing out.
Even with great humidity is in the grow chamber, its not a dew event/clean water(20ppm) irrigation. Those roots still look quite good, so I dont really think this is the issue here, but it can add stress. If you had a wet wall situation, you could probably ignore this advice completely, but inside without the constant mineral free water/humidity delivery on the wind its more important to control for.
Over exposure tends to slowly bleach. Lime green, to yellow blotches to white blotches to leaf on the ground. They are very lime green, but I don't see bleaching.
My guess is thrips are ruining your otherwise nice setup.
If you have any yellow sticky traps, put a few in the chamber to see if there are any nasties flying around
I actually use RO water with these ones since the tap water is like liquid rock! Since filming this video, I found out it was mites. They have such a different method of attack than what I’m used to, I couldn’t diagnose it earlier!
One indiication whether light you have used is too much is photo bleaching leaves turning yellow . Under ideal light conditions leaves would be light green . If light is too low leaves would be dark green on a relative scale
For sure! The leaves are a wonderful shade of green until they turn yellow. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
Oh my... that looks really bad. 🥺
I've no idea, never seen that before, sunburn looks different....
Hope s.o. will have a clue what's going on in your cabinet. 🤞🍀🙏
Me too! I can only assume it’s the light
Hi Stephen I am good with phals I might have about 50 of them. Phals are not good with humidity. I know in their nature they are living in really humid regions but in home conditions they can get fungal infection really easily. I can see you have a kind of shelf look like filter. I would try to leave the door open and I would turn light of in the phal shelf. They might still get enough light from shelf on above. Also I would clean leaf residue from the stem because new roots sometimes get stuck between the stem and dry leaf ends. I would also repot that big phal gigabel because plant end up too high in the pot but first clean that leaf ends. If you separate them from middle than you can peel them down.
And most important thing they look like get water in between the leafs or extreme humidity. I don’t think this is light burn.
I might need to get some Physan, then
I watched video again and took some screenshots. I will point them and send via instagram.
@@pixie2488 much appreciated!
Sorry about your Phals. I agree on the light intensity, unless the leaves feel hot to the touch then it may just be a heat burn. I think if it's simply too much light, pushing the leaves to photorespiration or beyond, a fan may not help as much; but if it's getting too hot, a fan is definitely helpful. Just my two cents :)
I have my Phal. violacea under the same light as my C. schilleriana and C. aclandiae seedlings, only because of space constraints, with the same distance, but I turned the leaves vertical and away from the light. I think the angel of how the leaves are exposed to the light seems to make a difference as well. Mine have really light green leaves so I suspect it's on the high spectrum of the light they need.
On the smaller and fragrant orchids, I'll follow to see what people suggest/you end up having! I recently got a Neofinetia/Vanda falcata that the grower said she grew under Cattleya lights. I haven't had it long enough but I put it with my Catts and it seems to be happy (pushing out new roots and "fans").
I’ve gotten lots of feedback about Neos loving high light. I love the scent of those!
hey man, don't give up on the phals :) while i wish i had some advice for you, your experience is way more than ours. so my advice would be to follow your instincts!! its worth mentioning that once we got our little cabinets/tents set up, i was surprised by how much difference in temp there was between the top shelf and the bottom. around 2.5-3 C regularly. maybe some needed a little cooler winter cool down than the top shelf with high light and low air mvmt was giving them? totally spitballing...go with your gut!!!
This is odd, I could have sword I responded to you comment! Anyway, I spoke to Dimitri and he immediately asked me to wipe the plant with a white tissue. Sure enough, there were tons of mites! It was a massive mite infection that I didn't recognize due to the way the plants were effected, which was different than anything I've seen before.
@@SVKLOrchids no worries, and sorry to hear about the mites. at least they seem to be fairly easy to eradicate! are they the red ones or the ones that don't leave wispy threads? have you found the source of the outbreak? with mites we have usually been able to track it back to a source and the outbreaks followed a radial spread pattern. perhaps if all of them are infected then its too late for such intervention. but there always seems to be one or two plants that feed the outbreak and we just throw those away and treat the ones that aren't so heavily infected. maybe time for a second cabinet to serve as infirmary?!
I find monopodial orchids so difficult as well. For me, the get stem rot, drop buds and roots, ... I have some Angraecoids and I killed at least 3 Angraecium didieri. The one I have now seems to be doing ok. My Angraecum leonis finally bloomed after four years of having it. Two spike, a total of six buds and only one came to fruition.
You’re one step closer to Phals!!! lol I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
@@SVKLOrchids Haha. I've liked Angraeciods for a while and Michael McCarthy has called me out on it... I suppose the only Phalaenopsis I could own is a schilleriana because of the leaves.
Hope you can eliminate the mites!!!
@@MattbyNature You should get the schilleriana.....BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!
I believe they are getting too much light. I have grow lights but I do not put my Phals under them. I have my Phals about 5 feet from a west facing window in moss. They seem to be doing very well. I live in zone 10 in California. I also wonder about air flow in your cabinet? Don’t give up just move them.
I’m hoping having them in the bottom cabinet will work!
Hey lovely video , I'm afraid your lights are very bright for your phals, I grow all my phals under lights and they do very well , maybe change the lights and you will be okay , best of luck
Thanks!🙏
Question: Do you have a ventilation source? I had a few of my orchids in a grow tent for a bit more than half a year, with a ventilator running 15 minutes each hour, humidity around 80 % and many of those orchids got fungal issues; especially the "novelty" Phals. Now I have them in a normal room and all those fungal issues disappeared... I also did not wanted the ventilator to run 24/7. - On the other hand, if you think it might be a light issue, try to hang a shade cloth inbetween. Also pure glas seems to reduce the light intensity by 50 %. - But, if you don't have a ventilation source, I would check for fungal issues. And move those plants on a normal window sill. (Btw.: My ambient room humidity is almost always at 60 % - Göttingen, Germany)
I didn't seal the cabinet so it could breath and there is probably a nearly centimeter gap between the glass panels and the cabinet. I might a small fan though!
Mine did the same under strong grow lights. At first they appeared to do fine, but after a few months problems begin to show - lots of yellow leaves
I ended up switching to cheap grow lights that i found on Amazon (the ones with clip ons) just for my Phals - they are doing great now.
My spider farmer lights are simply too strong even at 50% brightness they can still burn my cattleya and vanda leaves if I am not careful.
So, yeah, grow phals only under cheap lights now 😂
Hmmmm…. Maybe that’s what I need to do. What are you cheap lights? Barrina?
@@SVKLOrchids many different brands, one in particular is called Gooing Top clip LED grow lights - but honestly they all look and function about the same, cheap looking with clip on base, bendable gooseneck-like bars to point the lights in any direction. Usually sells on Amazon for less than $25.
I’ve had mine for 3 years now, still works, I use strictly on my Phal bellinas that sit on open shelves - I like that the lights are cheap, zero chance of leaf burns and my bellinas still bloom regularly.
Hope you find a solution for your phals. They are beautiful, just need to try another low maintenance way to grow them 👍
@@lliu25 I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it. The cabinet has now been nuked!!
@@SVKLOrchids oh wow that’s interesting, i had thought mites’ MO is attack the freshest leaves first before going after older leaves. So glad you found the root cause!
Are you using the same water as outside? Outside mine get irrigation water, but inside they got tap and did the same thing. So I switched to RO water and they recovered. Too much light as well. Can they come into the house in a bright shady spot near a window?
They all getting RO water! 😢 No windows for them either.
The length of exposure does make a difference in my experience, perhaps you could try reduce the number of hours of light exposure to 3 hours and see how they respond. On longer exposure like 12 hours light filtering through from the upper cabinet might even be sufficient?
I’ve got the timer set to turn on are sunrise and off at sunset! I love the automatic seasonal variation. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
I got 3 fragrant phals and they all died ( 2 baby phals and 1 matured). I find them just not as tough as the typical flower shop phals. I found a video from a Chinese grower and he had the same complaint as well.
I might have to do complex hybrids, so I’ve got one as a test plant
Hi Stephen😌🤲The Phalaenopsis only require very mild light, so think of a North facing window with bright, but no sun on the leaves, and they ideal like cool temperatures 60/75℃. And let them appoach dryness and water thoroughly. Does this help you?
Unfortunately, I don’t have any good windows. I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
That's really terrible😥🙏I hope you can find a solution to the mite problem as soon as possible🙏
The lighting may not be the entire problem but I would venture to say that it is contributing to the Phals demise. I would buy a cheap LED light (such as the ones you can find at Home Depot) and try that, as an experiment. My phals are in an eastern facing window and are supplemented with an LED light. But the light is like 18" above the plant.
I might have to get some cheap, Barrinas or something similar for one of the shelves
Sorry I’m gun shy about social media not on Facebook or instagram just recently got on UA-cam
I grow indoors with light levels at about 200 foot candles at around 70 degrees in summer and as low as 60 during winter and I grow species and hybrids in bark and sphagnum I think you may be cooking the pals they don’t take a lot of light if you have a email I can send some picks I don’t know how on this platform
Ya, the lights are probably too strong! Do you have a facebook or instagram account? We could chat on one of those platforms.
Did you treat them for bugs? I about killed mine with neem oil spray.
I treated with bifenthrin
Maybe too much light but no real sunburn? 🤔 Well, maybe what I know as sunburn is heat damage...
I haven't had these crispy edges, but very yellow leafs one summer in my new home without shading my east facing window.
Ya, I think is persistent light stress instead of sunburn which happens quickly
what's your air circulation source? still air begets fungal growth,looks like some fungus issues...under 800 lumens for light for phals
Lights are not the problem. You seem to have fungal/bacterial infection, or a pest problem like mites or thrips. Check your phals closely, inspect them well!
I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.
@@SVKLOrchids its definitely mites. red spider mites wiped out hundreds of my phal over the years and they look like your plants in this video. They leave my oncidium and cattleya alone and seem to love the phals.
phals need air circulation .
Indeed they do!
I'm almost 100% sure it's NOT the light!!
I grew phals under too strong light a few times and they reacted the same way every single time(!!): the leaves get dark and take up a purple-y color too!!
I think you don't have just the one problem but you have different problems with a couple of the plants!
I'd check the roots first of all, maybe you'll have rootrot... the smaller ones looks like rotting to me...
The big one looks like lacking of nutrients!! The leaf structure is too fragile and bright + the plant sacrificing the lower leaves!
...
I’ve since found out I have an extraordinary mite infection causing a lot of the problems. The damage is different than other mite attacks I’ve seen, I didn’t recognize it.