Me again, for those who don't know SDM stands for 'sub datum'. Basically used in absolute mode to store a suite of numbered co-ordinates. Eg Co-ord #1, Co-ord #2 etc. with each one the having the absolute X, Y and Z co-ordinates of that point. Some DRO displays can hold up to 199 such references. Very useful for multiple operations at a number of locations. Also there is usually the separate DRO ability to build a tool library giving tool lengths for each tool and holder. By using this feature Absolute zero on the Z axis can be used to place the tool tips at a pre-defined point in space - for example flush with the table top. All Z measurements are then referenced from there regardless of which tool has been selected in the library. Rather like a manual version of a CNC controlled machine. Usually referenced with the quill fully retracted. Just don't go negative!
Mark as you already know I had to turn my head when you drilled the holes. LOL One of the reasons I love Touch DRO. Being wireless I can use my Samsung Tablet on multiple machines. I just finished calibrating the X axis on they Bridgeport clone mill of mine. BTW I love that Wells Index mill she is a real beauty and a great example of workmanship before us and also a great example of your own craftsmanship.
Welcome to the wonderful world of DROs. In no time you'll wonder how you ever got by without one! For your xyz cables, if theyre too long, I just looped mine and tie- wrapped them to keep the tidy. Oh, and I didn't bother with the PE...
Just a bit of information about the "earthing wire" Make sure you indeed ground that wire as static discharge can travel from you and damage the DRO. Most electronic design these days isolate components internally to prevent a possible shock hazard however this leaves those same components susceptible to static discharge. As long as your mill is grounded properly just make sure the "earthing wire" is grounded to the mill Great videos by the way. I enjoy it when you resurrect older iron and get it operating again.
thank you winky maybe you could do a video on each of the on some of the functions of the DRO and maybe two functions per video or maybe just one video on on hold drilling allocating alright thanks buddy hope to see it 2023 summer bash I'm not sure if you're going or not but I'm going and I'm very excited alright good day to you
I know... going by dials would be time consuming. This mill also moves .200" per turn which makes the dials harder to read. I guess .200 is common but I like .100 better.
Hello Winky, the DRO color matches the mill, look forward to seeing you machining parts using the DRO, great job completed, thanks for sharing, cheers from me. 😷👍👍👍
PE: the protective earth connection doesn't serve the same purpose as the ground wire in the cord. It is there to insure that all parts you could be reasonably anticipated to touch at the same time are at the SAME ground potential (and may also, as a side, help protect the bushings n the arm from electrical damage). Different wiring paths and circuit feeds can lead to differences in potential at physically close points, and they can be significant if any of the earth ground connections or wires has significant resistance. The arm really won't do it, as it may have plastic bushings in it that insulate, or metal bushings/bearings you don't want to carry current.
Hi Mark, that really is a beautiful looking old milling machine brought nicely up to date. I recall some folks having problems with display jitter if they left the 'PE' lead off. I agree with you though, there really should be only one earth connector to avoid the dreaded ground loops messing up the signals. Maybe something to do with the internal display wiring or noise on the supply earth lead?
This is a perfect project, and you're doing GREAT job. I heard a comment you were thinking of a VSD drive and there was a concern about running at a slow speed. That shouldn't happen since you have the belt drive also. You'll just find a belt setup that will give you the cutting speed range with the VSD (min to max speed) and you will rarely have to change the belts. You will want a VSD that has the braking resistor for the motor. Just some thoughts. I went down this road recently with a bandsaw. You have outdone yourself on this project. It's the best one yet.
As already mentioned, most put our displays on the right. Did you go left because you have only one X crank handle, on the left? You may still want to put a separate, battery powered DRO on the quill. On my BP I use the quill feed a lot because it's much easier than the knee, especially for drilling and boring, and milling with small end mills where lost rigidity from quill extension isn't an issue. You have a movable quill. Might as well use it.
Mark, some power cords have a separate braided or foil shield for LCDI power cords for air conditioning, but what you are working with shouldn't need that.
Just wait until you machine a bolt circle (like say 5 holes on a 3.237" radius) and then machine them exactly where they need to be by just following the display. That's when the light came on for me.
Are you Left Handed ? Usually they are mounted on the right hand side. DO NOT shorten the cables. Wind the surplus up and use cable ties. Regards from Australia.
@@WinkysWorkshop I mounted my DRO on the left side of my model 645. I'm both handed (but favor left). Standing to the right front of the machine seems having the display to the left was natural, so I could watch the spindle, and control the power feed which is mounted on the right side of the mill. Seems that's installed on the opposite side on the long axis, where the left side has the thrust bearings, and the kit is designed for the opposite end to the thrust bearings. Standing in that position made sense for the lateral Y axis feed, as well the Z axis power feed.
@@f.hababorbitz My lead screw has fiber thrust washers on the handle side. I need to replace them with thrust bearings. I think I also have a lead screw alignment problem. It gets tight on one end of the travel. i need to fix this before I get a power feed.
@@WinkysWorkshop I recently tightened my gibs in all three axis. Now on the cross axis it's tight on both ends where the lease wear is. Unless when you had that table off, you measured using precision pins the width of the way Vee, and found zero wear, I'm guessing this is the issue. I know on my Y axis, the scraping is worn off on the right side. Fixing that sort of issue is beyond my tools, as I don't have a scraping straight edge to do the blueing markup to see the high spot. Learning how to do that, and do it correctly would be a whole new area of the hobby. I'm surprised your mill has fiber washers for thrust bearings, but maybe that's what they did before increasing the size of the mill. I will say that even the lowest price power feeds off eBay will run perfect on your mill. I got a few from Harbor Freight mail order 25 years ago, Align branded. But they are perfect copies of the Servo brand that I got from Enco that's on my W-I-645, down to the mounting stand that fit on the right side of the table. These low cost power feeds have the mounting stand that's made for a Bridge Port. Probably have to copy the mounting bolt holes to the table end. I've seen some of these table kits have a shaft extension that screws onto the threads that the crank handle keeper nut uses, so the length is increased for the drive bevel gear and support needle bearing. Memory was I was seeing these around $110 a few months ago (power feed on eBay).
@@f.hababorbitz I was thinking about making a power feed but that's probably not logical if I can buy one for less that $120. Yeah, my table is a little tight on the ends but not super bad. I made it where it's just barely a noticeable drag at the ends. Most the time the slight looseness in the middle is tolerable but if not I snug the table lock a little. I'm not getting into the scraping... really mine is not very bad.
Looks like you purchased the 5 micron scales. Oddly, the inches should have been 0.0002, not the 0.0001 (where you pressed the mm/inch conversion button), as 5 micro converted to inches is 0.00019685, I would have guessed it would have rounded that up. I know, on a mill you're lucking to hold one thou hole placement. It's always interesting as when you're machining, the display will change from the zero here and there. I'm wanting the 1 micron scale for my surface grinder down feed, as there it does make sense. My mill DRO is .0005" inch resolution, and that digit is always flickering to zero and back again. I did find I had to watch some youtube videos as the manual for these displays are horrible, especially if you change the mode from mill to lathe or grinding machine, not exactly clear, but maybe your newer display has an improved manual.
I'm not sure on the accuracy but the manual seems to be well written and translated. which actually surprised me. Of course I have not learned a lot of the functions yet but the bolt circle, hole spacing and finding center options were easy to figure out.
i may actually have enough room the mechanism is below that x table plane plane farther than i thought. I spent some time looking it over, how hard is your table lock to use? does it need to be extended?
Very nice - that would sure be a nice addition for any mill. Its on my list, ...right after the mill, ...and the bits, ...and the... LOL
You'll get there!
Me again, for those who don't know SDM stands for 'sub datum'. Basically used in absolute mode to store a suite of numbered co-ordinates. Eg Co-ord #1, Co-ord #2 etc. with each one the having the absolute X, Y and Z co-ordinates of that point. Some DRO displays can hold up to 199 such references. Very useful for multiple operations at a number of locations. Also there is usually the separate DRO ability to build a tool library giving tool lengths for each tool and holder. By using this feature Absolute zero on the Z axis can be used to place the tool tips at a pre-defined point in space - for example flush with the table top. All Z measurements are then referenced from there regardless of which tool has been selected in the library. Rather like a manual version of a CNC controlled machine. Usually referenced with the quill fully retracted. Just don't go negative!
Thanks for the info. I have a lot to learn.
👍👍
Mark as you already know I had to turn my head when you drilled the holes. LOL One of the reasons I love Touch DRO. Being wireless I can use my Samsung Tablet on multiple machines. I just finished calibrating the X axis on they Bridgeport clone mill of mine. BTW I love that Wells Index mill she is a real beauty and a great example of workmanship before us and also a great example of your own craftsmanship.
Yeah... I should have looked closer at the Touch DRO system
Welcome to the wonderful world of DROs. In no time you'll wonder how you ever got by without one!
For your xyz cables, if theyre too long, I just looped mine and tie- wrapped them to keep the tidy.
Oh, and I didn't bother with the PE...
I may do that with the wires... Yeah, I can't imagine why the PE is needed.
Just a bit of information about the "earthing wire" Make sure you indeed ground that wire as static discharge can travel from you and damage the DRO. Most electronic design these days isolate components internally to prevent a possible shock hazard however this leaves those same components susceptible to static discharge. As long as your mill is grounded properly just make sure the "earthing wire" is grounded to the mill
Great videos by the way. I enjoy it when you resurrect older iron and get it operating again.
I still think it's redundant but static electricity is also weird. It's probably good insurance to have the extra ground.
Looking good. That's gonna be very handy.
I totally agree. Thanks
You really do excellent work and are very good at explaining in simple terms. I enjoy your videos. Thanks for sharing them.
Glad you like them! Thanks
thank you winky maybe you could do a video on each of the on some of the functions of the DRO and maybe two functions per video or maybe just one video on on hold drilling allocating alright thanks buddy hope to see it 2023 summer bash I'm not sure if you're going or not but I'm going and I'm very excited alright good day to you
Great idea! not going to the bash this year... maybe next.
Hi Mark, nice wrap up to the project...Looks like a nice unit 👍👍
Thanks! Yeah, definitely a step up from my drill mill.
Welcome to DRO’s. I can’t remember how I got any precision machining done before I installed my DRO. You’re gonna love it.
I know... going by dials would be time consuming. This mill also moves .200" per turn which makes the dials harder to read. I guess .200 is common but I like .100 better.
Hello Winky, the DRO color matches the mill, look forward to seeing you machining parts using the DRO, great job completed, thanks for sharing, cheers from me. 😷👍👍👍
Yeah the gray was very close to the same color. Thanks for watching.
TouchDRO is the way to go! More features, one display for multiple machines and unique feature display
I should have investigated this further... you are probably right
PE: the protective earth connection doesn't serve the same purpose as the ground wire in the cord. It is there to insure that all parts you could be reasonably anticipated to touch at the same time are at the SAME ground potential (and may also, as a side, help protect the bushings n the arm from electrical damage). Different wiring paths and circuit feeds can lead to differences in potential at physically close points, and they can be significant if any of the earth ground connections or wires has significant resistance. The arm really won't do it, as it may have plastic bushings in it that insulate, or metal bushings/bearings you don't want to carry current.
Interesting...
Very slick, you will love it for sure.
I think so, thanks
You will enjoy your DRO.
I agree.
Thanks for the video keep on keeping on.
Thanks Harold
Looks good 👍
Thanks 👍
Fitting a DRO changed my life, no idea how I ever managed without one.!
Oh for sure, they are incredible.
I love the moment @ 5:18 ..🤣😂 nice job of the install .. your going to love a DRO
Yeah... just goofing around! Thanks
I feel your pain drilling holes in your freshly restored machine.😢
Oh it was hard to do! ha
Hi Mark, that really is a beautiful looking old milling machine brought nicely up to date. I recall some folks having problems with display jitter if they left the 'PE' lead off. I agree with you though, there really should be only one earth connector to avoid the dreaded ground loops messing up the signals. Maybe something to do with the internal display wiring or noise on the supply earth lead?
Thanks on the mill. Yeah that ground is weird.
Hi Mark, that is one nice install and it looks great.
Thanks 👍
You got me with the ‘splosion 😂
Hhaha... thanks
This is a perfect project, and you're doing GREAT job. I heard a comment you were thinking of a VSD drive and there was a concern about running at a slow speed. That shouldn't happen since you have the belt drive also. You'll just find a belt setup that will give you the cutting speed range with the VSD (min to max speed) and you will rarely have to change the belts. You will want a VSD that has the braking resistor for the motor. Just some thoughts. I went down this road recently with a bandsaw. You have outdone yourself on this project. It's the best one yet.
Wow, thanks! I think you're right about the VFD
Great setup!
Thanks!
I like it! For the money it looks like a good unit.
Thanks, yes it seems to be so far.
As already mentioned, most put our displays on the right. Did you go left because you have only one X crank handle, on the left? You may still want to put a separate, battery powered DRO on the quill. On my BP I use the quill feed a lot because it's much easier than the knee, especially for drilling and boring, and milling with small end mills where lost rigidity from quill extension isn't an issue. You have a movable quill. Might as well use it.
You maybe right about the quill... it has a depth stop which would be good in most cases. Yes... left handed and the left handle.
Mark, some power cords have a separate braided or foil shield for LCDI power cords for air conditioning, but what you are working with shouldn't need that.
I agree
I like it too
Thanks
Just wait until you machine a bolt circle (like say 5 holes on a 3.237" radius) and then machine them exactly where they need to be by just following the display. That's when the light came on for me.
Yeah... I've
played with this. Very cool!
Are you Left Handed ? Usually they are mounted on the right hand side. DO NOT shorten the cables. Wind the surplus up and use cable ties. Regards from Australia.
Yeah... LH plus the handle for the X is on the left side. I'll leave the cables I think.
@@WinkysWorkshop I mounted my DRO on the left side of my model 645. I'm both handed (but favor left). Standing to the right front of the machine seems having the display to the left was natural, so I could watch the spindle, and control the power feed which is mounted on the right side of the mill. Seems that's installed on the opposite side on the long axis, where the left side has the thrust bearings, and the kit is designed for the opposite end to the thrust bearings. Standing in that position made sense for the lateral Y axis feed, as well the Z axis power feed.
@@f.hababorbitz My lead screw has fiber thrust washers on the handle side. I need to replace them with thrust bearings. I think I also have a lead screw alignment problem. It gets tight on one end of the travel. i need to fix this before I get a power feed.
@@WinkysWorkshop I recently tightened my gibs in all three axis. Now on the cross axis it's tight on both ends where the lease wear is. Unless when you had that table off, you measured using precision pins the width of the way Vee, and found zero wear, I'm guessing this is the issue.
I know on my Y axis, the scraping is worn off on the right side. Fixing that sort of issue is beyond my tools, as I don't have a scraping straight edge to do the blueing markup to see the high spot. Learning how to do that, and do it correctly would be a whole new area of the hobby.
I'm surprised your mill has fiber washers for thrust bearings, but maybe that's what they did before increasing the size of the mill.
I will say that even the lowest price power feeds off eBay will run perfect on your mill. I got a few from Harbor Freight mail order 25 years ago, Align branded. But they are perfect copies of the Servo brand that I got from Enco that's on my W-I-645, down to the mounting stand that fit on the right side of the table. These low cost power feeds have the mounting stand that's made for a Bridge Port. Probably have to copy the mounting bolt holes to the table end.
I've seen some of these table kits have a shaft extension that screws onto the threads that the crank handle keeper nut uses, so the length is increased for the drive bevel gear and support needle bearing. Memory was I was seeing these around $110 a few months ago (power feed on eBay).
@@f.hababorbitz I was thinking about making a power feed but that's probably not logical if I can buy one for less that $120. Yeah, my table is a little tight on the ends but not super bad. I made it where it's just barely a noticeable drag at the ends. Most the time the slight looseness in the middle is tolerable but if not I snug the table lock a little. I'm not getting into the scraping... really mine is not very bad.
Looks like you purchased the 5 micron scales. Oddly, the inches should have been 0.0002, not the 0.0001 (where you pressed the mm/inch conversion button), as 5 micro converted to inches is 0.00019685, I would have guessed it would have rounded that up. I know, on a mill you're lucking to hold one thou hole placement. It's always interesting as when you're machining, the display will change from the zero here and there. I'm wanting the 1 micron scale for my surface grinder down feed, as there it does make sense. My mill DRO is .0005" inch resolution, and that digit is always flickering to zero and back again.
I did find I had to watch some youtube videos as the manual for these displays are horrible, especially if you change the mode from mill to lathe or grinding machine, not exactly clear, but maybe your newer display has an improved manual.
I'm not sure on the accuracy but the manual seems to be well written and translated. which actually surprised me. Of course I have not learned a lot of the functions yet but the bolt circle, hole spacing and finding center options were easy to figure out.
Hi Mark
Can you please tell me where you purchased this DRO please mate or provide the link for me
I put a link under the video
i will probably use your method on the Y and Z, My power feed is in the way of your x installation.
Interesting... You may be right about the power feed but I'm not sure how.
i may actually have enough room the mechanism is below that x table plane plane farther than i thought. I spent some time looking it over, how hard is your table lock to use? does it need to be extended?
Isn't PE permanent earth ?
Could be.