Hoo boy, here we go. May I just say, you made several good points for both the support and opposition to the Rumbling, and I appreciate it when people try to see both sides! However, I think that there's one very important fact that a lot of people don't acknowledge: it's not just Marley that hates the Subjects of Ymir. It's the ENTIRE WORLD. One of Gabi's friends in Marley even said that compared to the other countries in that world, Marley treats Eldians better. And that is horrifying to think about. The entire world would seemingly rejoice if all Eldians were just slaughtered. And yes, there are innocent people that would be willing to work with Eldians and treat them fairly, but like Eren himself said before leaving for Marley, for every Marleyan willing to cast aside their prejudice and truly see Eldians as actual people, there were dozens more that still hated them and "glare at them from their prison cells". And in those various political climates across that world, where the oppression and hatred for ALL Subjects of Ymir have been entrenched and engrained for at least a hundred years but probably longer, how many people in those governments would be willing to work with Paradise? Not many. Eldians are used as sacrifices in war, as free labor and second class beings, and as scapegoats. Why would any of those governments, undoubtedly as corrupt as governments are in the real world, want to change any of that? Realistically, they wouldn't. And there's no guarantee that the people who want to change how the world sees Eldians would be able to get jobs high enough in those governments to effect change without being killed themselves. And boy do I have something to say about Zeke's euthanasia plan!! It is a horrible thing to do to an entire race (because it ALSO counts as genocide, just to Eldians rather than the outside world), but it also buys into the idea that all Subjects of Ymir DESERVE to die. Eren would essentially be saying that none of them should have been allowed to live simply because of what race they are born as. And whether in the real world or fiction, whether you're Caucasian or other various ethnic groups, that's not true. We also have to consider Eren's time limit. By Season 4, he has...what, five years? Less? And he wants to make sure that his friends and the people on Paradis can be safe even after he's gone. Those countries could make all the peace treaties and agreements they please, there is NO guarantee they'll honor their word, especially not with hatred for all Subjects of Ymir so prevalent across the world. If those countries just decide to break those treaties once their technology surpasses the Titans and attack Paradis anyway, Paradis is screwed. Paradis is 100 years behind Marley technology-wise, after all, and Marley is said to have fallen behind the rest of the world because of their reliance on the Power of the Titans. That's why Marley wanted the Founding Titan and Paradis' resources so badly, after all. Commander McGath even says that early in Season 4. So yeah, while the Rumbling is a horrible thing in any universe, with all these depressing factors all combined into one, is there any option to avoid the destruction of Paradis and the Eldians as a whole without pulling a Deus ex machina out of your butt? Wasn't that the point of Eren and Hange's conversation in Eren's prison cell? He literally asked her if she had any other options for him, and, if she did, to tell him what they were. And in the English Dub, she just told him to grow up and stormed out. And unlike in AtLA, there is no lion turtle that'll show up and hand Eren the solution to this fucked-up situation with a nice red bow. AoT is a really dark and depressing universe; I have never wanted to throttle a fictional character like I wanted to throttle the Coward King of Eldia. Good job Karl Fritz, you piece of flaming garbage, because of your wholly inadequate half-measure of a solution, you were a big reason as to why any of this even happened!! Vow Renouncing War my ass! And no, I absolutely do not have strong feelings about fictional worlds and fictional characters, why do you ask?
lmao @the lion turtle shade. and yeah, I can see why Eren thought he had no other option. I just feel like there had to be SOME other way tho, idk- i feel like genociding the entire planet is always gonna be the worst possible option, and he should've at least tried something different. maybe a more limited rumbling to make an example out of a few places and re-assess then? idk
@@monkfruit Yeah, I can agree with wanting a different way. I don't think Eren wanted to become a mass-murderer, after all. But I think the reason that Eren decided to do a full Rumbling rather than just a partial one is because of Zeke. Zeke has about a year before he dies from the Curse, maybe less, and once he's gone, the only person Eren could use to activate the Founder's power is Historia, and Eren doesn't want to sacrifice her or her children. If Dina hadn't been killed off in the previous seasons, there would've been another option. Time is the greatest enemy of the Shifters in AoT, and because of being kept in the dark for so long, they all didn't have enough time to fix any of it. Or if there was a way to just get rid of the Curse of Ymir entirely, Eren probably wouldn't have resorted to such a drastic measure. However, in AoT, we have no idea if it's possible to lift it somehow.
hm I guess that's fair. do you think that Eren could just destroy the military again if they were rebuilt? Or if he dies, then the next Founder could do it?
This man really said for Eren, a soldier that swore to defend Paradis, to just abandon his nation to death just because he doesn’t personally know/love everyone in the walls. This is the crazy stuff people say when they break down right and wrong to just which number of people is more than the other. Sorry innocent people of paradis, you don’t have the right to defend yourself in the only way you can, your killers are a bigger number than you. The other alternative solutions to the rumbling are no solutions at all. You expect Eren to leave the fate of his people to chance? The world was already threatened with the rumbling before they ever attacked paradis, they ignored it. You think the 50 year plan is gunna stop them when technology is advancing and titans are already becoming a non threat? The entire world is teaming up to wipe out paradis, the island stands no chance
I see Eren acting in self defense. Taking out military facilities can’t solve the problem. You would still have a bunch of people who wanted to take out Eldia probably even more emboldened. They would probably just build up their military again and then attack. There is no solution but the full extermination or steam cleaning in my opinion.
Sure, let's not talk about what Eldia did for thousands of years. The context of WHY Eldia is hated and what brought them to that point in the first place.
As a Jew, I understand why Even started the rumbling….Sure, the WHOLE world may not hate us, but we were still hated enough for 6 million of us to be genocided (and MANY more before that). If the Rumbling is what it takes to protect my people and my loved ones, I’d do it without hesitation too….
I believe he's justified. If you murder someone for self defense, you won't be charged for it. If you kill someone by accident, you might go to jail sure, but you'll have the option of parole and won't be held at a murderers standard by society. Add those 2 factor together and you get Eren Yeager. In his case, instead of the innocent people being accidental death, they are deemed necessary sacrifice to eliminate the risk of Erens own nation dying (which once again ties back into self defense). At the end of the day, genocide is the only option Eren has which won't end with Eldians getting wiped out. That's why I believe Eren in justified. Thx for reading my Ted Talk.
very well thought out comment! I guess I disagree with the idea that he needed to go as far as he did to eliminate the risk of his own people dying. imo Eren is so much more powerful than the rest of the world that he find a better solution- but I definitely see your point of view as well
@@monkfruit But Eren didn't have long to live either. In addition, the technology was getting better and better, there were already weapons in Eren's time that could kill Titans or even the armored Titans. So Eren couldn't threaten the world with it forever. He only had this one option.
where were you when the said that outside world was making weapons that where against the Titians. I Eren when with the fifty years and just destroyed all the world military forces they would rebuild and eventually and the rumbling would be treat anymore and then the outside world would destroy the inland. Every other solution would only work in the short term and the rumbling is thing that work in the long term and I think Eren was right to do it.
It was much deeper than how you've laid it out in the beginning here, but I suppose that's because you did this video mid season? It was the right thing to do as it was the only action that could draw out the coordinate, get the combined efforts of survivors to fight and kill it, ending titans for GOOD. Also freeing Ymir from her servitude.
Hoo boy, here we go. May I just say, you made several good points for both the support and opposition to the Rumbling, and I appreciate it when people try to see both sides!
However, I think that there's one very important fact that a lot of people don't acknowledge: it's not just Marley that hates the Subjects of Ymir. It's the ENTIRE WORLD. One of Gabi's friends in Marley even said that compared to the other countries in that world, Marley treats Eldians better. And that is horrifying to think about. The entire world would seemingly rejoice if all Eldians were just slaughtered. And yes, there are innocent people that would be willing to work with Eldians and treat them fairly, but like Eren himself said before leaving for Marley, for every Marleyan willing to cast aside their prejudice and truly see Eldians as actual people, there were dozens more that still hated them and "glare at them from their prison cells". And in those various political climates across that world, where the oppression and hatred for ALL Subjects of Ymir have been entrenched and engrained for at least a hundred years but probably longer, how many people in those governments would be willing to work with Paradise? Not many. Eldians are used as sacrifices in war, as free labor and second class beings, and as scapegoats. Why would any of those governments, undoubtedly as corrupt as governments are in the real world, want to change any of that? Realistically, they wouldn't. And there's no guarantee that the people who want to change how the world sees Eldians would be able to get jobs high enough in those governments to effect change without being killed themselves.
And boy do I have something to say about Zeke's euthanasia plan!! It is a horrible thing to do to an entire race (because it ALSO counts as genocide, just to Eldians rather than the outside world), but it also buys into the idea that all Subjects of Ymir DESERVE to die. Eren would essentially be saying that none of them should have been allowed to live simply because of what race they are born as. And whether in the real world or fiction, whether you're Caucasian or other various ethnic groups, that's not true.
We also have to consider Eren's time limit. By Season 4, he has...what, five years? Less? And he wants to make sure that his friends and the people on Paradis can be safe even after he's gone. Those countries could make all the peace treaties and agreements they please, there is NO guarantee they'll honor their word, especially not with hatred for all Subjects of Ymir so prevalent across the world. If those countries just decide to break those treaties once their technology surpasses the Titans and attack Paradis anyway, Paradis is screwed. Paradis is 100 years behind Marley technology-wise, after all, and Marley is said to have fallen behind the rest of the world because of their reliance on the Power of the Titans. That's why Marley wanted the Founding Titan and Paradis' resources so badly, after all. Commander McGath even says that early in Season 4.
So yeah, while the Rumbling is a horrible thing in any universe, with all these depressing factors all combined into one, is there any option to avoid the destruction of Paradis and the Eldians as a whole without pulling a Deus ex machina out of your butt? Wasn't that the point of Eren and Hange's conversation in Eren's prison cell? He literally asked her if she had any other options for him, and, if she did, to tell him what they were. And in the English Dub, she just told him to grow up and stormed out. And unlike in AtLA, there is no lion turtle that'll show up and hand Eren the solution to this fucked-up situation with a nice red bow.
AoT is a really dark and depressing universe; I have never wanted to throttle a fictional character like I wanted to throttle the Coward King of Eldia. Good job Karl Fritz, you piece of flaming garbage, because of your wholly inadequate half-measure of a solution, you were a big reason as to why any of this even happened!! Vow Renouncing War my ass!
And no, I absolutely do not have strong feelings about fictional worlds and fictional characters, why do you ask?
lmao @the lion turtle shade. and yeah, I can see why Eren thought he had no other option. I just feel like there had to be SOME other way tho, idk- i feel like genociding the entire planet is always gonna be the worst possible option, and he should've at least tried something different. maybe a more limited rumbling to make an example out of a few places and re-assess then? idk
@@monkfruit Yeah, I can agree with wanting a different way. I don't think Eren wanted to become a mass-murderer, after all. But I think the reason that Eren decided to do a full Rumbling rather than just a partial one is because of Zeke. Zeke has about a year before he dies from the Curse, maybe less, and once he's gone, the only person Eren could use to activate the Founder's power is Historia, and Eren doesn't want to sacrifice her or her children. If Dina hadn't been killed off in the previous seasons, there would've been another option. Time is the greatest enemy of the Shifters in AoT, and because of being kept in the dark for so long, they all didn't have enough time to fix any of it. Or if there was a way to just get rid of the Curse of Ymir entirely, Eren probably wouldn't have resorted to such a drastic measure. However, in AoT, we have no idea if it's possible to lift it somehow.
About taking out the military point, military can just be rebuilt a few decades later. It isn't a permanent solution.
hm I guess that's fair. do you think that Eren could just destroy the military again if they were rebuilt? Or if he dies, then the next Founder could do it?
@@monkfruit that's basically an immortal war..
Bruh you deserve way more that 320 subs, keep up the good work man :)
thank you!!
I would rumble the world so my dog could live free
This man really said for Eren, a soldier that swore to defend Paradis, to just abandon his nation to death just because he doesn’t personally know/love everyone in the walls. This is the crazy stuff people say when they break down right and wrong to just which number of people is more than the other. Sorry innocent people of paradis, you don’t have the right to defend yourself in the only way you can, your killers are a bigger number than you.
The other alternative solutions to the rumbling are no solutions at all. You expect Eren to leave the fate of his people to chance? The world was already threatened with the rumbling before they ever attacked paradis, they ignored it. You think the 50 year plan is gunna stop them when technology is advancing and titans are already becoming a non threat? The entire world is teaming up to wipe out paradis, the island stands no chance
I see Eren acting in self defense. Taking out military facilities can’t solve the problem. You would still have a bunch of people who wanted to take out Eldia probably even more emboldened. They would probably just build up their military again and then attack. There is no solution but the full extermination or steam cleaning in my opinion.
I love the video
ty! :)
It's okay I'm not expecting humans to understand me
loll
Sure, let's not talk about what Eldia did for thousands of years. The context of WHY Eldia is hated and what brought them to that point in the first place.
As a Jew, I understand why Even started the rumbling….Sure, the WHOLE world may not hate us, but we were still hated enough for 6 million of us to be genocided (and MANY more before that).
If the Rumbling is what it takes to protect my people and my loved ones, I’d do it without hesitation too….
So I guess Palestine is justified in the rumbling too right? 😂
I believe he's justified. If you murder someone for self defense, you won't be charged for it. If you kill someone by accident, you might go to jail sure, but you'll have the option of parole and won't be held at a murderers standard by society. Add those 2 factor together and you get Eren Yeager. In his case, instead of the innocent people being accidental death, they are deemed necessary sacrifice to eliminate the risk of Erens own nation dying (which once again ties back into self defense). At the end of the day, genocide is the only option Eren has which won't end with Eldians getting wiped out. That's why I believe Eren in justified. Thx for reading my Ted Talk.
very well thought out comment! I guess I disagree with the idea that he needed to go as far as he did to eliminate the risk of his own people dying. imo Eren is so much more powerful than the rest of the world that he find a better solution- but I definitely see your point of view as well
@@monkfruit But Eren didn't have long to live either. In addition, the technology was getting better and better, there were already weapons in Eren's time that could kill Titans or even the armored Titans. So Eren couldn't threaten the world with it forever. He only had this one option.
@monkfruit Isayama wrote it so it was either a full Rumbling, or Paradis' destruction
Thank you so much for this❤
of course! it was a good idea :)
"No spoilers for anime S4 part 2 and manga" proceeds to show chapter 131😂😂🤣
OOP I literally just google image searched the rumbling my bad :o
But there is so much history behind this
where were you when the said that outside world was making weapons that where against the Titians. I Eren when with the fifty years and just destroyed all the world military forces they would rebuild and eventually and the rumbling would be treat anymore and then the outside world would destroy the inland. Every other solution would only work in the short term and the rumbling is thing that work in the long term and I think Eren was right to do it.
I’d 💯 drop the Rumbling
Fr
I think eren went a bit too far
yeah he went crazy fr
@@monkfruithe was just blowing off some steam, gosh 😤
It was much deeper than how you've laid it out in the beginning here, but I suppose that's because you did this video mid season?
It was the right thing to do as it was the only action that could draw out the coordinate, get the combined efforts of survivors to fight and kill it, ending titans for GOOD. Also freeing Ymir from her servitude.
Yes it was justice
Thanks for answering my request🫡