Objectively, I’d get 9Velo because the hubs are smoother than my pickup lines and the wheels are more balanced than my life. Let’s be real, most people worrying about aerodynamics are still getting passed by 5 year olds on scooters.
I really love their gravel wheels, but wish their road wheels had a wider inner width and omitted the need for rim tape. 21mm internal width is pretty narrow by modern standards in my opinion. Their gravel wheels don't have internal spoke holes, but the road ones still require rim tape. I suspect that they should be updating this product line soon!
in within 1year these boys went from hanging out with Durian Rider and loving rim brakes to disc and wider wheels , i have a pair of Hollowgram Knot RS-L 50 , 21 internal, 32 external, DT Swiss ratchet , 29mm Conti III front and 30mm STR rear, i would welcome anyone to challenge this set uo for Fast, comfort, stability and durability
Hi boys, As a new dad of two, i appreciate to hear your take on training with small kids and admitting, the regret in regards to training load when you chris got your second child. This was nice to hear from others that the time spent with the small ones is more valuable than trying to get that extra few miles in and that its okay to drop of as long as one doenst stop completly.
I've got two kids under two and have consistently hit 6 hours a week over the past year by: 1) putting roots down near in laws; 2) setting a weekly schedule with my wife way ahead of time; 3) short rides 2-3 times on weekdays after work; 4) one long, 3+ hour ride on weekend; and 5) almost always riding solo. I am happier and healthier as a result and don't feel like I've missed anything at all. In fact, it's created opportunities to bring the extended family in closer to my kids and that's absolutely a net positive.
Super points mate … 1000000% agree about the in-laws situation. However I have seen this a few times and the said in-laws have backed out of being involved after a couple of months. Great points though!
Great strategies to achieve some ride time and unlike others who shall remain nameless, you have mentioned sitting down with your wife and having a discussion. No wife no life 😂😂
As a Dad in his early 50's now with 3 adult kids, just let it go until they're old enough so you can fit in more training. Kids aren't young forever, and before you know it they'll be at high school and then moved out. Honestly you'll never look back and say "gee I wish I trained 5 more hours a week and came 30th instead of 60th or 100th in that mass start event" . What you will remember is that you missed time spent with your kids that you can never get back. You'll remember how your relationship got strained etc etc etc. I've only been able to train 5 to 8hrs a week the last 30yrs ,but I've still had fun competing in my grade, with others at aroundmy level, and trying to get the best out of myself with the time I've got.
I love it. I made the show again. You gotta read the next line on some of those. The weight is so tricky. I could call it a draw and I could call SRAM as the winner but I'd have to guess. I weighed both, one was lighter. That's it. Then there's the power meter. If I ignore the rest of the market and say SRAM has it and Shimano doesn't then SRAM definitely wins. There's a catch though and the catch is that there's far more Shimano cranks out there and tons of choices. As an example, 4III makes a really innovative power meter crank for Shimano. The oinly place where this is an issue is at the OEM level. Since SRAM has a power meter they show up on factory builds far more often. Overall though, I completely agree that they are pretty much even. A big point of the article is the experience of riding them on two amazing bikes. Both awesome choices, lets enjoy cool bikes. Side note, you should check out the SRAM AXS WEB portion of the AXS app. It gives some incredible analysis that you'd probably find useful for the show.
Great to support you Chris on an epic day on gravel in the Otways. A fantastic result for you and hopefully a lot to learn for both of us in the lead up to Dirty Warrny 2025! 😉 Thanks for your coverage and looking forward to the standalone "best event video ever"!
Really liked the perspective about training with kids. Flexibility and acceptance of reduced fitness is key to balancing fitness and family through that period of your life.
For riding with small kids, riding at 6:00am, or even earlier. I get out before the daily stress and craziness builds up. I can get a 1 hour ride before work, and before anybody wakes up. On the weekend, I can get a long ride in, and still be home in time to do a big family outing, so long as I'm careful about how much effort I put into the ride. It's caught on with other dads in the area too. I'm getting Pre-6am group rides now.
@@scottpardy990 unfortunately for me the nights are completely broken - last night was up from 2am to 4am - early starts just can't work for me. I also plan ahead with my partner for the full week, agreeing slots - but the best laid plans of mice and men...
He said the internal widths of the Zipp's incorrectly. I have a set of 303 hookless firecrest and 404 hookless firecrest. 303 internal is 25mm , 404's have 23mm internal.
I've got a 3 year old and have been able to hit > 10 hours a week since he was 2 - these hours are all riding to work early in the morning and back home from the station in the evening (z2) and riding on the trainer at night on weekends or work from home days (z4 / z5), I splice some strength training in during my work from home days. It will be different for everyone. but you have to design it in a way that puts time with your significant others first, that way it's sustainable, which means you can do it every week, which means you can maintain a semblance of training and thus progress :) I'd recommend avoiding the weekend group rides entirely, weekend mornings are for breaky and snuggles, or a crit once in a while for a training goal.
Can’t agree more on the talk about training with kids. For me with 2 littles it’s 4-6 hrs a week and a few CX races in the fall because it’s a fun and interactive event (high fives!) for the family and a race around 45mins (also feels less dangerous than doing crits anymore). As the growing kids are getting into more weekend activities I won’t be able to race anymore and that’s perfectly ok as they are the priority. I try to schedule any cycling in a way that doesn’t take time away from the family (early morning or nap time). The occasional zwift race or a KOM pursuit will be good alternatives to real races going forward. I’ve really enjoyed the comments here about others with kids as well as what Chris and Jesse say. Nice job on the top 10 finish Chris
On training with kids; I struggled through getting to 8 hours a week whilst my second was under 3, but since he turned 3 and stopped getting sick all the time etc. I've been able to get back into things a little more. I've found that going deep on investing in the indoor set up has really helped me to rack up the hours when needed, and then starting at 5:30/6am on Saturdays is the go. My kids sleep super well, though - so we've been lucky in that respect.
Ha, I’m literally sat here with my notepad and pen trying to figure out which wheels to buy for black friday when this video pops up. Perfect timing. The Yoeleo C60 is winning the race for me, so let’s see if we agree. 🍿 Although you’ve started with ‘if money was no object…’, so maybe not!
Yep, 60mm deep rims with 32 external, 23 internal, all for $839. I wish i could upgrade the hubs to dt350s or even exp 240, but like you say, they are a very solid brand, along with Light Bicycle, and Farsports, so I’m willing to bite the bullet. They also come with 3 year warranty and 30% crash replacement for good measure.
Yo gents let's not forget they sell 15x more Honda Civic's than all ferrari's. How about a comparison of sub 1000 AUS wheelsets. Love the coaching segment Chris and Jesse
I am really looking forward to the Dirty Warrny video Chris. Your footage here looks unreal. Might have to put it on the bucket list for the back end of next year's big challenge. Plus it was a nice review from Jesse.
When Hambini, Peak Torque and Trace Velo recommend 9Velo, I buy 9Velo! Actually already did in April. The only downsides I have so far are that they are not UCI approved and seem to scratch quite easily. But maybe the latter is just standard matte carbon issues? But I do have to think about money. I don't know what I would buy if money wasn't a factor.
Pretty sure Peak Torques go to seems to be the Ascent Polaris for events like the Fred Whitten. They are reasonably light but use for easily obtained Sapim spokes. Not sure what his road bike TT favoured wheels are but I seem to remember his local course is in poor surfaces so again the Sapim spokes have advantages over the lighter bladed carbon spokes. Not sure if there is a measurable difference to wheels like the CRW's that utilise the carbon spokes to with fewer spokes.
The Yoeleo c60 now have stock in Europe and they were on sale just recently for 840€, which is crazy for the spec. Pretty sure they will go back on sale for black friday
Any thoughts on Caden decadence wheels? There is now a wide (34.4mm ext, 24.2mm int) 45mm deep carbon spoke set @ AUD $2108 with a claimed weight of 1110 grams for the set.
Hi thanks for a great show! Could you give some tips on what to look for when strava stalking competitors during a racing season? What are the most important metrics or areas to see if im im way behind or if I can keep up/ beat them?
Do they allow backup bike swaps at the feed zone? Cause depending on the location of the feed zone and the route type before and after, I could see scenarios where it might be worth it to run two different bikes for each sector
Feed zone issue as it being apart of the race: There was a MTB event called the highland fling that had timing matts setup at the entrance and exit of a feed zone, everyone got a free 5min's to do what you needed to, any longer it came out of your race time. This could work but then tactics came into play as people could still leave early and get a jump and attack etc, and into the finish no one really knows who won till the timing caught up and gave the results. The sprint at the end could be a difference of when they entered or left the feed zone if you know what I mean, but it does fix the racing feed issue.
Absolutely loved both your responses to training with kids. It put things back in perspective for me, with 2 kids under 2 and hardly being able to get on the bike. Thank you!! Could I put a subscriber question on here as I don’t have IG. ‘The only riding I am able to do at the moment is a commute 3 times a week (35 mins each way). What intervals or other sessions could I do in this time to maximise my time in the saddle?’ Thanks in advance! Steve
In the expensive department, I personally love the new Campagnolo Bora Ultra WTO wheels, now available with an inner width of 23mm, and for all purpose a 45mm depth would be the ideal. I know that Jesse has used Campagnolo wheels before and commented that the bearings didn't last but I am convinced that he did not have them adjusted correctly. Note: these wheels use a sophisticated open bearing system, and the proper way to adjust them is do so with the wheels IN THE FRAME, and then removing the play in the bearings by loosening the locking screw on the preload collar, rotating it until it the play is gone out of the wheel then locking the collar in place with the adjustment screw. If you are making this adjustment with the wheels off the bike, you are not accounting for the clamping force created by the threw axle! When these wheels are properly adjusted the bearing are faster than anything else on the market. The rest of the wheel is extremely aerodynamic, reasonably light weight, very durable, and have excellent ride qualities. Super bling to boot! One other super bling, almost unheard of wheel set I have inspected but never ridden are the Partington wheels. They look very cool, but look really dangerous should they fail. One final note: Any wheels that are hookless would not get any consideration in my book. I really would like this marketing gimmick die!
I run Dura Ace C50 at the moment with kind of the same cup and cone system. I have never heard of adjusting them while mounted. Any more insights on that? Would like to try it as they are sometimes running not as smooth as regular sealed ones I am also running (DTS Arc 1400).
@@zuffweiss pretty sure that the Campagnolo system is entirely different from how Shimano does it, but I haven’t looked at the design of the Shimano ones. Campagnolo uses a 2.5mm allen screw to lock the cone adjustment in place, and is the only tool needed to do a bearing adjustment. I wouldn’t be surprised if this was a patented system.
Ha remind me of a 200k race where I had issues fueling so lights went out with 40k's to go. Funny thing was we reccy'd the last 300m high climb at easy Z2 the day before. And on race day doing a max effort fighting with everything I had, I was 10secs slower than the day before easily spinning the legs and enjoying the sights. Never been more wrecked lol
It would be quite easy to enforce a mandatory stop time at Gravel Race feedzones. Trathlons give time splits for transitions, so the tech is easy. It would make the races way more approachable but I guess it's only really an issue at the pointy end of the race.
Triathlons do give splits but they don’t stop and wait for everyone, it’s part of the sport and known as the forth discipline. If you have to stop make it fast or start prepared. Simple. If we make a compulsory stop for everyone that’s like saying ok we will wait for everyone who can’t climb!
a friend had a set of the farsports wheels for a week and they blew 2 spokes, written off wheels and damaged his frame just from casual riding. Also gravel race for Jesse could be Backroads gravel in WA, very road racey style gravel race. 160km but 35ish avg speed and good competition here
For training with kids. For the last 3month I been waking up at 4am on my bike by 4:45 ride for an hour 15-18miles and get home to wake up my 5yr & 8yr kids and take them on my cool down ride for 20mins. Then off to get ready for the day as a family. I love the routine I got my kids on. It makes them more efficient in the morning. Now the goal is to go to sleep earlier which seems to be the hardest part as a parent lol
Love this I'm gonna start getting back into riding after a fews years off with having kids. Very unfit and trying to figure out ways I can ride again but still be there and do things with the kids. Little rides in the morning with them is a great idea. Cheers
That FSD58 hyper seems so familiar…..oh it’s just another farsports 😂😂😂 , and no.6 is also apparently another farsports. So out of all your options more than half are actually different farsports😂
Disagree about the brake fluid in the shimano vs sram debate. Was one of the things that swayed me to stay with shimano when changing to disc brakes. DOT fluid goes bad and should be changed once a year. CBA with that hassle.
Hunt SUB50 Litmitless UD carbon spoke with ceramicspeed has to be taken into consideration with all the categories mentioned. Not only that it's one of the few wheels out there with data and white paper.
I’m out the door by 5a most days since my daughter’s been born (she’s just turned 4). I’ve come to enjoy being up before the rest of the world. Sucks when it’s cold and dark in the winter but it builds character I guess lol
My experience is 2 rides, 1 race. A little too soon to make any conclusions, though I did appreciate the 28mm internals. I will say my concerns an about carbon spokes for a gravel race remain, especially when flying to a race.
As to whether it's worth shops having their own wheels, I'm buying the exact same wheels as the CCACHE FSD 50 direct from Farsports with ceramic bearings and both the 36t and 54t ratchets delivered for about $1,600. Given the quantity CCACHE are buying they would be getting them cheaper. So yes, it would be worth it
I’m frigging 105kg and not a millionaire so the “money no object” scope of the wheel section was of no interest to me until I heard Edwin mention Fix n Ride in Sydney. I’ve recently commissioned Rheical of Fix n Ride for new wheels. The brief was simple, comfort, longevity & serviceability with weight saving & aerodynamic improvements secondary so I can ride longer and longer. I’m now riding 30mm internal rims, CX spokes, brass nipples, Zip hubs. Perfect (for my needs). I’ve also saved some weight & the increased size of my tires means I could probably save more weight if I dropped down a tire size. I couldn’t be more happier. Please don’t focus only on the big brands & dismiss the small local guys like Fix n Ride, they can represent the local point of trust for the Chinese market disruptors. Whilst Melbourne appears to have many wheel building brands, Sydney does not & is lucky to have FixnRide.
Mike's Bikes does not have a company branded wheel set. I've never seen a local shop have their own branded Chinese wheels. I live in the SF Bay Area where Mike's is located.
Updates have been a big improvement. It is a super stable device as for Nov 2024 … HOWEVER … it is still missing a few features I would regard as deal breakers; custom data fields on the climbing page, naming sensors etc etc. More updates coming in Dec I am told.
@@ChrisMillerCycling Thanks for the info as have used their watch for a couple years and works great so figure they will get the unit for the bike right much faster than others as they know something about the tech and at some point would like to have both my watch and bike use the same ecosystem
Congratulations Chris! I’m actually really interested on what you think of the No6 wheels. How did they hold up? Would you use them for road bikes as well? It would be nice to get Jesse‘s take on them. Wide internal with super light.
UpVine do some pretty good wheels. My favourite are the Pro+ D60. 60mm depth. 23mm internal width. 35mm external front and 31mm external rear. 1500g. Hooked.
One thing I noticed about the feed zones is that they looked fairly slow and not practiced. Triathletes put quite a bit of prep into their transitions to make sure that they’re as fast as possible. Things that might be a bit quicker could be already removing the camera/ in pockets, bottles in pockets so helper can slide new bottles in straight away, camelback undone or 1 strapping or straps loosened to take it off quicker.
Great episode guys. Great to hear Jesse's analysis skills at work, to reveal that 2 hour bonk Chris, but 8th, congrats! No commentary on your equipment's performance though but perhaps that means it all went as planned. When you talk wheels, I want to know how much clearance these 'ideal wheels' will have inside your framesets? I'd go 3T Discus 40/45 wheels myself, if I just had 10/14mm more F/R clearances. Surely the bike industry will continue to slowly drip feed us wider & wider wheels/tyres/framesets until they've created the next biggest thing we all must have!
I've got the Farsports Evo 5 (front) and 6 (rear) and I really love them. Maybe there are wheels out there with similar or slightly better specs, but not in the price range of the Farsports I suppose. The acceleration is out of this world for wheels with this depth and they feel super fast. With 30 mm tubeless tyres I can also live with the stiff carbon spokes. I would recommend these wheels to everyone who can afford them.
ZIPP Dimentions ZIPP 303 ext 30.0mm int 25mm depth 40mm ZIPP 404 ext 27.9mm int 23mm depth 58mm ZIPP 808 ext 27.5mm int 23mm depth 82mm Brake Fluid Its less about environment stuff but more the general properties; The dot fluid in the SRAMs is better at taking heat but is more hydrophile, while the shimano fluid is getting less water content over same timespan while dealing worse with heating. Its just the fluids properties, not taking into account Calliper Design and Brake Hose Design, which when done well can mitigate some of the heat issues that shimanos could run into.
I think the UCI rule is overblown. I think. HOPEFULLY, this will mean more patterns and shapes and wacky stuff instead of boring single tones. Jumbo could go heavy on the hexagons (France shape, Beehive), Quickstep could have a howling wolf shouting the invective Remco throws to non-cooperating escapees, UAE could be made of literal dollar bills and so on...
I think Jesse is correct in labeling the enve's as overhyped - too expensive for what you get. I don't think the price comparison to the other wheelsets is fair because of the tech enve gives you for the price. I would label the enve wheels as a (to steal automotive terms) 'super wheel' (steel spokes) when compared to a one-piece carbon system that is more of a 'hyper wheel'.
Easy win if you can do it for juggling family and training, bike commute. I do it and if I take the long way in, I can get an hour. If I take the long way home, I can get 80 minutes. Shortest is 30 mins. I've had over 10 hours after my Friday ride home with zero time away from life since I'd be on a train anyway. It's a lot of descending in, and a lot of climbing home. It's tough to figure out with logistics but if you can do it, do it. My biggest issue is carrying food, I just hate it. I luckily have a spot for bike and I can shower.
Young kids? Go to sleep with them at 7pm. Wake up at 3am, ride on the trainer. Early morning, while everyone is asleep is the only time you'll consistently get without disruption.
Jesse should switch completely to running and lifting instead of cycling until he has time to ride more since running has higher aerobic stress. I've been experimenting with running instead of riding while I don't have time to ride during school. It could be a cool thing to report on in a few episodes.
Training for new dads. Commute if you can. I was able to stay b-grade fit until child 4. 20-30km each way 5 days a week. Now if Jesse can just tell us the best way to structure them.
I have to disagree with Chris re the Shimano software - particularly the older systems without blue tooth connectivity ( if you don't fit a dongle). It's not analogous to Windows 95 - it's more like MS Dos. That ages me, and it ages Chris who has probably never heard of it.
jesse's review of this race data is awesome insight
Really enjoyed the race breakdown from a coaching perspective. More please!
SHOUTOUT FROM THE TRAINER LETS GO BOYS!!
Up Up Up!!!!
Objectively, I’d get 9Velo because the hubs are smoother than my pickup lines and the wheels are more balanced than my life. Let’s be real, most people worrying about aerodynamics are still getting passed by 5 year olds on scooters.
I really love their gravel wheels, but wish their road wheels had a wider inner width and omitted the need for rim tape. 21mm internal width is pretty narrow by modern standards in my opinion. Their gravel wheels don't have internal spoke holes, but the road ones still require rim tape. I suspect that they should be updating this product line soon!
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 re: getting passed by 5 year olds…
in within 1year these boys went from hanging out with Durian Rider and loving rim brakes to disc and wider wheels , i have a pair of Hollowgram Knot RS-L 50 , 21 internal, 32 external, DT Swiss ratchet , 29mm Conti III front and 30mm STR rear, i would welcome anyone to challenge this set uo for Fast, comfort, stability and durability
@@chrishophoto I have their road wheels and they don't have spoke holes. No rim tape needed. But sure 21mm internal is bit outdated
… but really pretty 3D printed hubs that are as light as a unicorns mane 😂
Hi boys,
As a new dad of two, i appreciate to hear your take on training with small kids and admitting, the regret in regards to training load when you chris got your second child. This was nice to hear from others that the time spent with the small ones is more valuable than trying to get that extra few miles in and that its okay to drop of as long as one doenst stop completly.
I've got two kids under two and have consistently hit 6 hours a week over the past year by: 1) putting roots down near in laws; 2) setting a weekly schedule with my wife way ahead of time; 3) short rides 2-3 times on weekdays after work; 4) one long, 3+ hour ride on weekend; and 5) almost always riding solo. I am happier and healthier as a result and don't feel like I've missed anything at all. In fact, it's created opportunities to bring the extended family in closer to my kids and that's absolutely a net positive.
Super points mate … 1000000% agree about the in-laws situation. However I have seen this a few times and the said in-laws have backed out of being involved after a couple of months. Great points though!
Great strategies to achieve some ride time and unlike others who shall remain nameless, you have mentioned sitting down with your wife and having a discussion. No wife no life 😂😂
As a Dad in his early 50's now with 3 adult kids, just let it go until they're old enough so you can fit in more training. Kids aren't young forever, and before you know it they'll be at high school and then moved out. Honestly you'll never look back and say "gee I wish I trained 5 more hours a week and came 30th instead of 60th or 100th in that mass start event" . What you will remember is that you missed time spent with your kids that you can never get back. You'll remember how your relationship got strained etc etc etc. I've only been able to train 5 to 8hrs a week the last 30yrs ,but I've still had fun competing in my grade, with others at aroundmy level, and trying to get the best out of myself with the time I've got.
as a dad with a 9 week old daughter, thanks for the perspective!
UAE run the 4.5 not the 6.7. These can also be built on tactic racing hubs dropping the weight to close to 1300g
Exactly who runs 65mm deep wheels as the go to? 😂
@@harveykramer379868/75 here 😎
Not even, they run the 5.6 normally :)
This segment was extremely interesting. More of this please. Jesse going over the numbers and what they mean was amazing. 24:04
I love it. I made the show again. You gotta read the next line on some of those. The weight is so tricky. I could call it a draw and I could call SRAM as the winner but I'd have to guess. I weighed both, one was lighter. That's it.
Then there's the power meter. If I ignore the rest of the market and say SRAM has it and Shimano doesn't then SRAM definitely wins. There's a catch though and the catch is that there's far more Shimano cranks out there and tons of choices. As an example, 4III makes a really innovative power meter crank for Shimano. The oinly place where this is an issue is at the OEM level. Since SRAM has a power meter they show up on factory builds far more often.
Overall though, I completely agree that they are pretty much even. A big point of the article is the experience of riding them on two amazing bikes. Both awesome choices, lets enjoy cool bikes.
Side note, you should check out the SRAM AXS WEB portion of the AXS app. It gives some incredible analysis that you'd probably find useful for the show.
Slow is smooth, smooth is fast.
Extra five seconds in the feed zone properly stowing your sugar, gets you probably 3 positions at the end.
Great to support you Chris on an epic day on gravel in the Otways. A fantastic result for you and hopefully a lot to learn for both of us in the lead up to Dirty Warrny 2025! 😉 Thanks for your coverage and looking forward to the standalone "best event video ever"!
Really liked the perspective about training with kids. Flexibility and acceptance of reduced fitness is key to balancing fitness and family through that period of your life.
For riding with small kids, riding at 6:00am, or even earlier. I get out before the daily stress and craziness builds up.
I can get a 1 hour ride before work, and before anybody wakes up. On the weekend, I can get a long ride in, and still be home in time to do a big family outing, so long as I'm careful about how much effort I put into the ride.
It's caught on with other dads in the area too. I'm getting Pre-6am group rides now.
When you go to bed
@laurenz323 10pm at the latest.
Same here. Go to bed with the kids, Me time early morning 05:00-07:00
@@scottpardy990 unfortunately for me the nights are completely broken - last night was up from 2am to 4am - early starts just can't work for me. I also plan ahead with my partner for the full week, agreeing slots - but the best laid plans of mice and men...
@@jameseastwood402 yeah, important to note, early morning "dad time" only works once everybody is sleeping through the night.
He said the internal widths of the Zipp's incorrectly. I have a set of 303 hookless firecrest and 404 hookless firecrest. 303 internal is 25mm , 404's have 23mm internal.
I've got a 3 year old and have been able to hit > 10 hours a week since he was 2 - these hours are all riding to work early in the morning and back home from the station in the evening (z2) and riding on the trainer at night on weekends or work from home days (z4 / z5), I splice some strength training in during my work from home days. It will be different for everyone. but you have to design it in a way that puts time with your significant others first, that way it's sustainable, which means you can do it every week, which means you can maintain a semblance of training and thus progress :) I'd recommend avoiding the weekend group rides entirely, weekend mornings are for breaky and snuggles, or a crit once in a while for a training goal.
LightBicycle Turbos carbon spoke tick a lot of boxes for me. 25 internal, 32-34 external, 1246 grams at 50mm depth.
Oh nice, a shoutout to me on my trainer! Thanks guys 🥰
Laughing as I’m on the trainer listening to the lads! Thanks for a great show every week! Best wishes from middle of nowhere USA.
Glad you enjoyed it
Can’t agree more on the talk about training with kids. For me with 2 littles it’s 4-6 hrs a week and a few CX races in the fall because it’s a fun and interactive event (high fives!) for the family and a race around 45mins (also feels less dangerous than doing crits anymore). As the growing kids are getting into more weekend activities I won’t be able to race anymore and that’s perfectly ok as they are the priority. I try to schedule any cycling in a way that doesn’t take time away from the family (early morning or nap time). The occasional zwift race or a KOM pursuit will be good alternatives to real races going forward. I’ve really enjoyed the comments here about others with kids as well as what Chris and Jesse say. Nice job on the top 10 finish Chris
Shout out from the trainer. Every Thursday morning it’s the Nero Show distracting me what’s going on down below in the pain cave.
I got a set of ccache 40s recently. Mainly because of weight and cost. So far they have been unreal.
On training with kids; I struggled through getting to 8 hours a week whilst my second was under 3, but since he turned 3 and stopped getting sick all the time etc. I've been able to get back into things a little more. I've found that going deep on investing in the indoor set up has really helped me to rack up the hours when needed, and then starting at 5:30/6am on Saturdays is the go.
My kids sleep super well, though - so we've been lucky in that respect.
Ha, I’m literally sat here with my notepad and pen trying to figure out which wheels to buy for black friday when this video pops up. Perfect timing.
The Yoeleo C60 is winning the race for me, so let’s see if we agree. 🍿 Although you’ve started with ‘if money was no object…’, so maybe not!
They really are up there for the rim profile and more history than the other Chinese brandsb
Yep, 60mm deep rims with 32 external, 23 internal, all for $839.
I wish i could upgrade the hubs to dt350s or even exp 240, but like you say, they are a very solid brand, along with Light Bicycle, and Farsports, so I’m willing to bite the bullet.
They also come with 3 year warranty and 30% crash replacement for good measure.
These are the comparisons we NEED! nice find thanks.
Yo gents let's not forget they sell 15x more Honda Civic's than all ferrari's. How about a comparison of sub 1000 AUS wheelsets. Love the coaching segment Chris and Jesse
Congratulations Chris, fantastic ride mate
Thanks 👍
That route/footage looks amazing!
I am really looking forward to the Dirty Warrny video Chris. Your footage here looks unreal. Might have to put it on the bucket list for the back end of next year's big challenge. Plus it was a nice review from Jesse.
Thanks for the shoutout guys 🤩 I watch you guys on my daily 4:30am 2hr endurance rides from my house in Switzerland 🤣
Enjoyed the detailed race data from TP! Ty for going into some depth!
When Hambini, Peak Torque and Trace Velo recommend 9Velo, I buy 9Velo! Actually already did in April.
The only downsides I have so far are that they are not UCI approved and seem to scratch quite easily. But maybe the latter is just standard matte carbon issues?
But I do have to think about money. I don't know what I would buy if money wasn't a factor.
Pretty sure Peak Torques go to seems to be the Ascent Polaris for events like the Fred Whitten. They are reasonably light but use for easily obtained Sapim spokes. Not sure what his road bike TT favoured wheels are but I seem to remember his local course is in poor surfaces so again the Sapim spokes have advantages over the lighter bladed carbon spokes. Not sure if there is a measurable difference to wheels like the CRW's that utilise the carbon spokes to with fewer spokes.
Reading training peaks graphs like Neo reading the matrix
How often do we break our wheels?
The Yoeleo c60 now have stock in Europe and they were on sale just recently for 840€, which is crazy for the spec.
Pretty sure they will go back on sale for black friday
Great stuff Chris & Jesse! With kids and family some ride is definitely better than no ride.
Any thoughts on Caden decadence wheels? There is now a wide (34.4mm ext, 24.2mm int) 45mm deep carbon spoke set @ AUD $2108 with a claimed weight of 1110 grams for the set.
Craftworx is a local (qld) custom wheel builder using self-branded Chinese-made rims to build wheels.
Hi thanks for a great show! Could you give some tips on what to look for when strava stalking competitors during a racing season? What are the most important metrics or areas to see if im im way behind or if I can keep up/ beat them?
Maybe the heavier wheels are more durable and sturdy ? As a heavy rider strenght is more important than saving grams for me.
Do they allow backup bike swaps at the feed zone? Cause depending on the location of the feed zone and the route type before and after, I could see scenarios where it might be worth it to run two different bikes for each sector
Feed zone issue as it being apart of the race: There was a MTB event called the highland fling that had timing matts setup at the entrance and exit of a feed zone, everyone got a free 5min's to do what you needed to, any longer it came out of your race time. This could work but then tactics came into play as people could still leave early and get a jump and attack etc, and into the finish no one really knows who won till the timing caught up and gave the results. The sprint at the end could be a difference of when they entered or left the feed zone if you know what I mean, but it does fix the racing feed issue.
Absolutely loved both your responses to training with kids. It put things back in perspective for me, with 2 kids under 2 and hardly being able to get on the bike. Thank you!!
Could I put a subscriber question on here as I don’t have IG.
‘The only riding I am able to do at the moment is a commute 3 times a week (35 mins each way). What intervals or other sessions could I do in this time to maximise my time in the saddle?’ Thanks in advance! Steve
Awesome ride Chris and great analysis it's on my bucket list. Ps I watch your show usually on the trainer.
Well done Chris. Saw the Long and Winding video which featured a lot of your rear end leading the pack. Chapeau
In the expensive department, I personally love the new Campagnolo Bora Ultra WTO wheels, now available with an inner width of 23mm, and for all purpose a 45mm depth would be the ideal. I know that Jesse has used Campagnolo wheels before and commented that the bearings didn't last but I am convinced that he did not have them adjusted correctly. Note: these wheels use a sophisticated open bearing system, and the proper way to adjust them is do so with the wheels IN THE FRAME, and then removing the play in the bearings by loosening the locking screw on the preload collar, rotating it until it the play is gone out of the wheel then locking the collar in place with the adjustment screw. If you are making this adjustment with the wheels off the bike, you are not accounting for the clamping force created by the threw axle! When these wheels are properly adjusted the bearing are faster than anything else on the market. The rest of the wheel is extremely aerodynamic, reasonably light weight, very durable, and have excellent ride qualities. Super bling to boot!
One other super bling, almost unheard of wheel set I have inspected but never ridden are the Partington wheels. They look very cool, but look really dangerous should they fail.
One final note: Any wheels that are hookless would not get any consideration in my book. I really would like this marketing gimmick die!
I run Dura Ace C50 at the moment with kind of the same cup and cone system. I have never heard of adjusting them while mounted. Any more insights on that? Would like to try it as they are sometimes running not as smooth as regular sealed ones I am also running (DTS Arc 1400).
@@zuffweiss pretty sure that the Campagnolo system is entirely different from how Shimano does it, but I haven’t looked at the design of the Shimano ones. Campagnolo uses a 2.5mm allen screw to lock the cone adjustment in place, and is the only tool needed to do a bearing adjustment. I wouldn’t be surprised if this was a patented system.
Ha remind me of a 200k race where I had issues fueling so lights went out with 40k's to go. Funny thing was we reccy'd the last 300m high climb at easy Z2 the day before. And on race day doing a max effort fighting with everything I had, I was 10secs slower than the day before easily spinning the legs and enjoying the sights. Never been more wrecked lol
It would be quite easy to enforce a mandatory stop time at Gravel Race feedzones. Trathlons give time splits for transitions, so the tech is easy.
It would make the races way more approachable but I guess it's only really an issue at the pointy end of the race.
It’d probably be the most exciting part of any gravel race to watch. Except none of them have any live coverage anyway.
Triathlons do give splits but they don’t stop and wait for everyone, it’s part of the sport and known as the forth discipline. If you have to stop make it fast or start prepared. Simple. If we make a compulsory stop for everyone that’s like saying ok we will wait for everyone who can’t climb!
Thanks for the advice, I'm the James at the end. Not getting stressed about not hitting targets is definitely the big takeaway for me!
Well said! Great question James.
a friend had a set of the farsports wheels for a week and they blew 2 spokes, written off wheels and damaged his frame just from casual riding.
Also gravel race for Jesse could be Backroads gravel in WA, very road racey style gravel race. 160km but 35ish avg speed and good competition here
For training with kids. For the last 3month I been waking up at 4am on my bike by 4:45 ride for an hour 15-18miles and get home to wake up my 5yr & 8yr kids and take them on my cool down ride for 20mins. Then off to get ready for the day as a family.
I love the routine I got my kids on. It makes them more efficient in the morning.
Now the goal is to go to sleep earlier which seems to be the hardest part as a parent lol
Love this I'm gonna start getting back into riding after a fews years off with having kids. Very unfit and trying to figure out ways I can ride again but still be there and do things with the kids. Little rides in the morning with them is a great idea. Cheers
Princeton carbon works peak-4550 runnig tactti TRO1 Sapim CX-Ray spokes 1.275g. build quality is on point, super responsive and light
@Chris Miller What handlebars did you use in the Gravel Race? Look very useful to me because of the clamping area. Thanks.
That FSD58 hyper seems so familiar…..oh it’s just another farsports 😂😂😂 , and no.6 is also apparently another farsports. So out of all your options more than half are actually different farsports😂
yes, there is literally no reason to not simply buy farsports
Warranty period is different from memory
Amazing scenery. One for the bucket list.
Rheicel Reobaldo is the man behind Fix n Ride from North Ryde NSW
Disagree about the brake fluid in the shimano vs sram debate. Was one of the things that swayed me to stay with shimano when changing to disc brakes. DOT fluid goes bad and should be changed once a year. CBA with that hassle.
Hunt SUB50 Litmitless UD carbon spoke with ceramicspeed has to be taken into consideration with all the categories mentioned. Not only that it's one of the few wheels out there with data and white paper.
Got myself a ses4.5 with enve innerdrive 2 weeks ago, paired with michelin power protection 30c, just perfect for any sort of ride and terrain.
I’m out the door by 5a most days since my daughter’s been born (she’s just turned 4). I’ve come to enjoy being up before the rest of the world. Sucks when it’s cold and dark in the winter but it builds character I guess lol
Chris, what was your experience with the no 6 gravel wheels? Do you recomment them? I was hoping for a little report on how they performed in the race
My experience is 2 rides, 1 race. A little too soon to make any conclusions, though I did appreciate the 28mm internals. I will say my concerns an about carbon spokes for a gravel race remain, especially when flying to a race.
Ratling off wheel weights .... add 300g for rotors, not so light now 😅
As to whether it's worth shops having their own wheels, I'm buying the exact same wheels as the CCACHE FSD 50 direct from Farsports with ceramic bearings and both the 36t and 54t ratchets delivered for about $1,600. Given the quantity CCACHE are buying they would be getting them cheaper. So yes, it would be worth it
I’m frigging 105kg and not a millionaire so the “money no object” scope of the wheel section was of no interest to me until I heard Edwin mention Fix n Ride in Sydney. I’ve recently commissioned Rheical of Fix n Ride for new wheels. The brief was simple, comfort, longevity & serviceability with weight saving & aerodynamic improvements secondary so I can ride longer and longer. I’m now riding 30mm internal rims, CX spokes, brass nipples, Zip hubs. Perfect (for my needs). I’ve also saved some weight & the increased size of my tires means I could probably save more weight if I dropped down a tire size. I couldn’t be more happier. Please don’t focus only on the big brands & dismiss the small local guys like Fix n Ride, they can represent the local point of trust for the Chinese market disruptors. Whilst Melbourne appears to have many wheel building brands, Sydney does not & is lucky to have FixnRide.
If Dirty Warny is an essential race for all aussies, what other events fall into that category? The Down Under Monuments
Mike's Bikes does not have a company branded wheel set. I've never seen a local shop have their own branded Chinese wheels. I live in the SF Bay Area where Mike's is located.
Thanks for that info.
looks like you had the Coros Dura on the bike - how did it work after all the updates?
Updates have been a big improvement. It is a super stable device as for Nov 2024 … HOWEVER … it is still missing a few features I would regard as deal breakers; custom data fields on the climbing page, naming sensors etc etc. More updates coming in Dec I am told.
@@ChrisMillerCycling Thanks for the info as have used their watch for a couple years and works great so figure they will get the unit for the bike right much faster than others as they know something about the tech and at some point would like to have both my watch and bike use the same ecosystem
LOL that is me on the trainer with a new born!! perfect episode to me.
Even if budget is no hurdle, does that still mean Western wheel brands are inherently better than the Chinese?
Congratulations Chris! I’m actually really interested on what you think of the No6 wheels. How did they hold up? Would you use them for road bikes as well? It would be nice to get Jesse‘s take on them. Wide internal with super light.
UpVine do some pretty good wheels. My favourite are the Pro+ D60. 60mm depth. 23mm internal width. 35mm external front and 31mm external rear. 1500g. Hooked.
One thing I noticed about the feed zones is that they looked fairly slow and not practiced. Triathletes put quite a bit of prep into their transitions to make sure that they’re as fast as possible.
Things that might be a bit quicker could be already removing the camera/ in pockets, bottles in pockets so helper can slide new bottles in straight away, camelback undone or 1 strapping or straps loosened to take it off quicker.
Great episode guys. Great to hear Jesse's analysis skills at work, to reveal that 2 hour bonk Chris, but 8th, congrats! No commentary on your equipment's performance though but perhaps that means it all went as planned.
When you talk wheels, I want to know how much clearance these 'ideal wheels' will have inside your framesets? I'd go 3T Discus 40/45 wheels myself, if I just had 10/14mm more F/R clearances.
Surely the bike industry will continue to slowly drip feed us wider & wider wheels/tyres/framesets until they've created the next biggest thing we all must have!
I've got the Farsports Evo 5 (front) and 6 (rear) and I really love them. Maybe there are wheels out there with similar or slightly better specs, but not in the price range of the Farsports I suppose.
The acceleration is out of this world for wheels with this depth and they feel super fast. With 30 mm tubeless tyres I can also live with the stiff carbon spokes.
I would recommend these wheels to everyone who can afford them.
Can I ask how long these took to be delivered to you? (in Australia?)
@MatthewWJKong Sorry, I'm from Germany. It tooks 3 weeks...
@johannesteich478 thanks, anyway. Sounds like you're enjoying them!
ZIPP Dimentions
ZIPP 303 ext 30.0mm int 25mm depth 40mm
ZIPP 404 ext 27.9mm int 23mm depth 58mm
ZIPP 808 ext 27.5mm int 23mm depth 82mm
Brake Fluid
Its less about environment stuff but more the general properties; The dot fluid in the SRAMs is better at taking heat but is more hydrophile, while the shimano fluid is getting less water content over same timespan while dealing worse with heating. Its just the fluids properties, not taking into account Calliper Design and Brake Hose Design, which when done well can mitigate some of the heat issues that shimanos could run into.
Old Mate is the character that always yells at his screen. He’s fantastic
I think the UCI rule is overblown. I think. HOPEFULLY, this will mean more patterns and shapes and wacky stuff instead of boring single tones. Jumbo could go heavy on the hexagons (France shape, Beehive), Quickstep could have a howling wolf shouting the invective Remco throws to non-cooperating escapees, UAE could be made of literal dollar bills and so on...
Scope Artech is insane. Glad you guys showed them love ❤!!
That dirty Warnie segment was brilliant.
I think I want those Cache CC 50 wheels now! Bugger
Hilarious reading people in comments complaining about 100-200 grams 😅
Love the Artech 6s
Roval Team are 35mm (f) and 30.7 (r) external 21 internal.
Really pumped to hear you guys talk about training with kids, the wife and I are about to have our first and I’m curious how much my riding will drop.
I'm the guy who sent in the question, mine is 7 months old. AMA!
I think Jesse is correct in labeling the enve's as overhyped - too expensive for what you get. I don't think the price comparison to the other wheelsets is fair because of the tech enve gives you for the price. I would label the enve wheels as a (to steal automotive terms) 'super wheel' (steel spokes) when compared to a one-piece carbon system that is more of a 'hyper wheel'.
Easy win if you can do it for juggling family and training, bike commute. I do it and if I take the long way in, I can get an hour. If I take the long way home, I can get 80 minutes. Shortest is 30 mins. I've had over 10 hours after my Friday ride home with zero time away from life since I'd be on a train anyway. It's a lot of descending in, and a lot of climbing home.
It's tough to figure out with logistics but if you can do it, do it. My biggest issue is carrying food, I just hate it. I luckily have a spot for bike and I can shower.
You should try the Elite Leggero Carbon bottle cage with Elite water bottles.
hmmm? why SES6.7 instead of SES4.5? Because people want to run 28c tire? I do own SES6.7 and SES3.4 so just curious
Young kids? Go to sleep with them at 7pm. Wake up at 3am, ride on the trainer. Early morning, while everyone is asleep is the only time you'll consistently get without disruption.
link to the Cav video referenced?
My brother ran 9velo at unbound. Under a grand. No problems at all.
1457 grams
Chris and Jesse: "ouf"
🐖 😂
Jesse should switch completely to running and lifting instead of cycling until he has time to ride more since running has higher aerobic stress. I've been experimenting with running instead of riding while I don't have time to ride during school. It could be a cool thing to report on in a few episodes.
Agree, feed zones shouldnt be assisted.
CRW 50/60 vs No.6 50/58… Who would you pick?
Would come down to aftermarket service for me that one. I couldn’t choose based purely on the specs or the RIDE of those wheels.
I have to say jesse going on about xbox game pass was not on the bingo card
Training for new dads. Commute if you can. I was able to stay b-grade fit until child 4. 20-30km each way 5 days a week.
Now if Jesse can just tell us the best way to structure them.
Cadex 50 Ultra are 22.4IW 30ext.. yeah I wish they were 31 or 32ext. I'm sure. max40s are also 22.4 which is more then enough to run 28-30
I have to disagree with Chris re the Shimano software - particularly the older systems without blue tooth connectivity ( if you don't fit a dongle). It's not analogous to Windows 95 - it's more like MS Dos. That ages me, and it ages Chris who has probably never heard of it.
HAHA!!! I was going to say a Commodore 64 … but that’s probably a bit too advanced.
Why are ENVE wheels so heavy for their price?
Campa Boro Ultra