Music Venue Security Is Really Getting Out of Hand
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- Опубліковано 27 тра 2024
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To add onto an already alarming trend of aggressive security staffs at venues, We Came As Romans recently had to cancel one of their tour dates before they even took the stage due to how security was handling their fans. In this video we discuss the incident as well as how this has become a problem and what needs to change.
00:00 Intro / Story Background
00:46 The Statement from the Band
02:56 Nord VPN's GOOD Security Issue
05:18 Was Bodysnatcher Music The Issue?
06:55 The Problems With Security At Venues
08:29 A Statement From The Band's Crew
11:03 My Experience With Violent Staff On Tour
12:08 Every Security Crew Is Different
14:45 Banning Heavy Bands & Moshing At Shows
17:34 Final Thoughts / Outro
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Great video buddy! I've done show security for over 10 years now! It really is getting out of hand! I do my best to stay completely professional for bands and the fans! Luckily I've never had any issues while I'm on the clock.
Quick suggestion from my side:
I always appreciated you as someone that was straight forward with everything he said. I know, that this might just be a speaking habit, but I see more and more UA-camrs saying, that they want to talk "a few seconds about their sponsor" and then they continue talking for 2 or 3 minutes about said topic. I have nothing against UA-cam creators being sponsored and usually even watch those sponsor parts, but I would really appreciate if you could be as honest with the time you are going to talk about those topics as you are with everything else. It does not have to be the exact time, but just stating "a few minutes" instead of seconds would be way more genuine in my opinion.
@@L0rdArthas I agree, thats been my issue watching other channels.
I actually appreciate that kind of feedback and will absolutely remember that for the future. Sponsored ads are kind of a new thing for me so I appreciate the input to help me make them more bearable in the future.
@@TankTheTech atta boy tank! Lol
At our club, security gets canned if they’re too aggressive. Our job is to throw a party, and if our employees are hindering that, it’s bad business.
Bad for business
It can be both bad business and bad for business. Haha
Yeah, man, there it is. Its bad for business.
Very well said!
Honestly private security must be such a hard line to tow.
I went to a punk show a couple years ago and there was a very mild mosh pit going (basically just people jumping around and slightly pushing each other). The security person decided to pull a couple of my friends away and start interrogating them on why they were "being violent". Luckily they explained the situation and got to go back to the show. How does a security person at a venue that regularly hosts rock and metal show not know what a mosh pit is?!
Prolly got security team FOB gen z's who know nothing about Metal or Punk and don't know what moshing is. That is managements fault as well as the security company. They did not teach them their job as usual before they went in and simply were not qualified to do security at a metal show.
Being a security person at a venue, this shit makes me sick. Power tripping security is insane. Most venues have no idea what “moshing” actually is, and take anything that looks aggressive as a violent act.
How in 2023 do venues not know what's normal at metal shows, like wtf? Do they have their heads up there ass for the last 40 years
Don't venues have google?
@@grievuspwn4g3 most book things and never ask questions. Very few are actually in the know of what they’re booking or have staff that deal specifically with music events. It’s usually a security company they hire out.
Tbh, given the fact that nowadays metal is more mainstream than ever before, I don't think security guards at live music venues have any excuse for not knowing what moshing is. It is their literal job to know.
@@Tigermaster1986 most security is hired to stand and guard a door and have zero interest in being there except to make money.
As a metal-head working festival/consert security in norway, me and my guys LOVE metal shows. They're the absolute best to work at - yes, some new-comers always need to be explained the culture and how moshing works beforehand and stuff, but everyone always goes home with a smile on their face.
Catching a crowd surfer, asking if they're alright only for them to scream "FUCK YEAAAH!!!" with their horns up, and then letting them back into the crowd is fucking amazing. Love it. Love it to death and i'll never quit this job.
Hip hop shows on the other hand can die a slow firey death in the pits of hell where they belong, hahah
Worked as a venue bartender years ago, and tbh, WORST shows was (and always will be) rap/hiphop shows
If it was not fights breaking out ppl were high as kites (not as high as our techno parties tho) and ALWAYS flashing big wads of cash
Always more about showing off than whoever was on stage.
And DONT get me started on their orders in the bar.
Like, it was not the super posh venue or anything but still some ok known artiests coming, but damn if people (at rap shows) had some OUTRAGEOUS whish's for what the bar HAD to have.
Not like drinking regular beer or drinks, hell nah, HAD to be them brands and fancy shit, and they did spend MORE time snapping and instagramming than enjoying the music.
And then there was ALWAYS the fights (beefs)
They (the hiphop audience) was ALWAYS on edge (again, technoheads was also always wasted on keta or some, but rap audience.. Coke was oh so common and damn that made fuses SHORT)
Best crowd always have been the metal heads.
Its been said before and can be said 1000 times more.
There are no better customer than a (drunk) metal head, they hug you (LOTS) and always want to share a shot (or offer to buy you a beer "after your shift is over" .. (most properly forgot it during the evening, but it was always a Nice gesture)
And yes, now i work at festivals
(COPENHELL, Jailbreak, and such)
Not in bar tho, but more in the construction (stage hand or decoration)
@@SortenRavn I saw good stoner rock band in StL recently at a venue that does rap as well. Jesus the security to get in looking for weapons is like nothing I've seen. And while other genres really don't have a weapon problem, they pretty much have to use the same security at all events, otherwise, it is pretty racist. at least they didn't take my weed.
@@teewhy6994 I allways apreciate when security at venues is cool with weed
Not only that but I’ve seen video footage of a Drake show where the tickets were pretty expensive. Only to see Drake way off tune just kind of talking his lyrics not singing or trying very hard. As well as taking shots and telling the crowd how they spent there hard earned money on him over and over.
I was at this show that security was very unprofessional. They walked in the middle of the pit with flashlights and began to shine them into people's eyes very close to the face where you couldn't see anything but the light. When people continued to mosh, they began to drag people out of the venue by the throat and fight people outside the venue. Security even pounded a guys head into the pavement multiple times and dislocated someone's jaw as well. They also deleted all negative reviews on Google. The security imo were very very hostile that night. When waiting to see if the show would continue, they went into bathrooms and told people not to gossip in bathrooms. When people began to sit cause of the waiting security, they would very aggressively tell them to stand up and get off the floor.
I like the Fete a lot so this news was a surprise. Thanks for sharing this.
This is why in the UK they've actually started implementing body cams for a lot of venue security companies. That's the kinda shit that'd have you never working security in that town again, and rightfully so.
Holy shit man that’s so fucked up thanks for sharing that. That shit absolutely cannot happen and it’s important that people like you who were present, share their experience. If what you’re saying is true, those guys should literally be arrested and charged for assault. They could of seriously hurt someone and there’s precedence for this happening. Fans have been killed by security in the past, I believe it was a Rolling Stones or The Who show back in the day.
I hate when aggro meat heads use their job to justify assaulting people to feed their half witted ego
I would be calling the cops on the security for assault and battery...
@@EwanMarshall cool
I've had a lot of issues with Fete's security over the ~6 years my band consistently played there. We only came back because it was the only mid-size venue in Providence, RI that actively booked solid tour dates and we had enough pull to get the offers. From witnessing other local bands get bullied into paying for unsold tickets out of pocket or even get removed from a show the day-of because of unsold tickets, to having one of our fill-in drummers get racially profiled every time he walked through the doors with the rest of the band during load-in, to personally getting in two separate nose-to-nose shouting match confrontations when security refused to let us back into the venue in order to GET. OUR. OWN. GEAR out of the building during our DESIGNATED LOAD-OUT time. Performers are forced to adhere to the No Re-entry policy for attendees, which means if you want to eat during the 10 hours you're at the venue, you either have to sneak in your food right at the start or be forced to eat nothing but venue pizza, which isn't always even available, despite Olneyville NY System (a legendary weiner joint) literally around the back of the building. I've also watched the security bitch slap a kid from behind because he started moving around in the pit area without having even thrown a kick or an elbow or anything akin to crowd killing.
Over the years, there have been multiple alleged "turnovers" with security where they claimed they got a new team and fixed the issue, but over the span of at least 10 shows played there over 6 years, at least half of my experiences involved heinous interactions with security or at the very least witnessing heinous interactions with security. Absolute shit-heel staff. Venue's got so much potential and they squander it on roided out assholes that outright abuse performers.
I interviewed to work there and within minutes realized they were all some shitty people, especially that fat dude who thinks he's in the mob or something.
yup i have witnessed those shouting matches
I've played Fete a couple of times as well. Just note that in their Instagram response, comments are disabled. That's all you need to see. Their re-entry policy is moronic, I just told their security it was stupid and I'd be coming and going throughout the night, because that's part of my job and also I like to eat food.
They at least used to have a gyro guy in fhe parking lot sometimes. But yea it sucks considering there's a lot of good food in the neighborhood. I used to live in a factory behind thr venue
Does that same retard still own it?
I remember bands like letlive would actively fight security if they got too out of hand with audience members that moshed, crowd surfed or jumped on stage. There's plenty of videos out there of them doing it
Ayeee Letlive. isn't talked about enough. I played with them back in like 2011 in Lemoyne PA. I had no idea who they were at the time but goddamn that show changed my life ngl lol. Best live performance I've seen to date.
The guy throws his guitar and just jumps off stage to help, its pretty amazing.
Sounds like a good way to get banned from venues
Elysia was one of the best bands ever, but they can't play anymore bc they've been banned from so many establishments
There are plenty of stupid security guys. However, there are plenty of dumb band guys as well. Most of the time a band member going after a security guard isn't a fair fight. Most security guys will beat the snot out of your average band member. I've been on both sides of this equation.
I got manhandled by security at a Ozzfest as a kid, and almost immediately got to watch Riggs from Rob Zombie puke whatever he drank from his guitar all over one of the guys who did it to me.
During my five years as a local promoter, I always brought my own security team. They were all part of the culture. We never had a single problem with unmeasured security response.
At a Ghost show recently security was telling people who painted their face like papa had to remove it. They also said that that request came from the band which was a lie. The security at the show didn’t like Ghost or what they represented so they tried to sabotage the show. Tobias commented on it and was very upset about that. Security and venue need to understand who they are booking and what the band represents. If you don’t like that then don’t book them but if you do understand and be accepting of the culture. Us fans we aren’t aholes or anything for the most part we are all respectful towards one another. If one of us gets knocked down we pick them right back up. We just want to have fun and support the bands we love.
This has happened at kiss events too. Citing ‘homeland security act’ or whatever.
That's interesting. I never heard of security actively trying to sabotage a show they were hired to work at. That's still awful, though.
a lot of security are part of megachurches in the US now so I'm not surprised. Christians ruin everything always
I went to an emo show last week at the same venue bodysnatcher's set was at and even with light moshing and crowd surfing the security was threatening to kick people out super aggressively. It was painful to witness. Total buzzkill.
Yeah, the more comments I read it seems like this is a problem with the management and security staff as a whole, and nothing to do with them not knowing the culture or having training.
I was not expecting to see you here Cue!
What club put them on blast.
This happened around 20years ago at a One Minute Silence gig where the security were being really rough with the crowd. The band got so pissed off with the security they said "wreck this place". The venue got trashed and the band were banned from there!
Worth it. 😂
So basically both parties were in the wrong, then. 😂
Yeah, that was a bit much, but security seemed to have poor situational awareness. Basic rules apply in certain situations: You dont anger the guy making your food, and you dont piss off a person with a microphone that has hundreds/thousands of fans that will more than likely do whatever the frontman tells them to do lol Its like going up to a biker bar and deciding that urinating on one of their bikes is a good idea.
@TankTheTech yeh pretty much! Great band back then in the nu-metal era, you should check them out!
hahah! i remember that! there was a pic in kerrang! mag with someone hanging off the ceiling fan unit before it came tumbling down hahaha
I was at this show, and have been regularly attending & playing shows at Fete for the past 10-ish years. Security there (it has been the same security team for as long as I can remember) has always been overly aggressive, whether its towards the bands and crew or the fans. After doors were open, they were walking around taping pieces of paper to the walls that said "no moshing". They actively cause issues for bands loading in and out, have tried to kick me out of my own shows for not allowing them to search through my gear for "items" that should not be brought into shows, but will look the other way when someone is being harassed / SA'd to where my band had to step in, then blame us for what was happening. Even when there was an in-house promoter who regularly booked heavy shows, there were issues, but never to this extent. When Bowery took over, they stopped booking heavy all together besides this show. Venue security & management have always been rude & aggressive, and this was the last straw for me ever going to Fete.
Yeah the fete is trash. The providence metal scene is a sad shell of its former self. Take me back to club bell and firehouse 13
I was at the gig too (i live in boston, so usually we go to the Palladium, cuz that place is cool AF. but not this time).
i was in the back near the exit doors/merch, and i watched them drag a guy out of the crowd, shove him up against a wall, shine bright ass lights right in his face, then ultimately drag him (literally) out the back doors. and he wasn't even trying to fight them or anything.
security there was being insanely aggressive for no freaking reason
@@bottomofastairwell the palladium is my go to venue. Nothing but good times there.
@@Hip-Gnosis1134 right? it's always a great time, and the staff there is amazing. I joke that i should just set up a cot in the basement cuz i practically live there. (side note: i'm the girl with the light up shoes, so like, a bunch of people genuinely do recognize me, cuz i really am there that often. but it's always so much fun.)
WeCaR should have called the cops on that security staff. All of that stuff described is assault/battery.
100%. If that behaviour is even remotely legal, I'd probably be afraid to go to clubs & shows at all, even as a white man.
What’s calling the pigs gonna do, the crowd can settle it. Seen it before
I was at that show and there was actually a cop that came, just to keep an eye on things while the bands packed up for safety
Evan as a white man? WTF does that mean? Let me guess, “white privilege”?
Yep. In most states security has as many enforcements rights as any law abiding civilian. please note if moshing in a venue is not allowed you are not breaking any law; just a venue rule/toc. So if you remove someone moshing you escort them out; and don’t use any violence
Last month, I went with my sis to see Queens of the Stone Age. Josh Homme repeatedly told security to chill tf out. Finally the 3rd time he stopped the music and told security, "You work for me" and to chill out and let his people have fun! The crowd cheered him on, and security actually did calm down 🤘🏾.
Good on Josh being aware of what was going on and acting in the moment.
You think if someone sues because of security the band is going to step up and say "They work for us"? That is silly.
@@zachansen8293 Maybe America can go fuck itself and stop forcing their shitty culture down everyones throat? Y'all are bitches and cowards anyway.
Were you at the nashville show? I was on the lawn and couldn't see what was going on. I had never seen a band react like that before, but thought it was great of them to look out for their fans like that.
Josh Homme is WELL known for not having any patience for over aggressive buzzkill staffers/security. He's a big dude and has an "assertive" personality let's say lol, and I've seen him stop whole ass festival sized shows to verbally make the manhandling gorillas his bitch, or physically make them his bitch lol. Either or is always hilarious because Josh is old school and doesn't give a fvck about their feelings, he calls em as he sees em and always has.
Fete Music Hall (yes, pronounced "fett", it's French for "party") was my hometown venue for years. They are absolutely a metal venue and have been for as long as I can remember. They used to host local metal shows in the lounge room every week, and they used to host huge metal tours in the ballroom all the time. I saw the Summer Slaughter Tour there in 2019.
Bowery does do metal shows often, and they work with Fete VERY often. They venue used to have an in-house promoter who is a notorious New England pay-to-play scammer. He made a lot of very controversial political comments in the early pandemic and was ousted. They have a new amateur townie in-house promoter who has no online presence whatsoever.
So what you're saying is that this is nothing new and their staff should be well versed with metal and hardcore shows.
is it pronounced "fett", cuz i thought it was like "feet or feat"
anyway, i was at the show, and security was indeed wildly aggressive and hostile
@@bottomofastairwell it is def “fett”, it’s a French word. Bon fête is a common French phrase
@@TankTheTech 100%, I’ve been to and played a bunch of metal and hardcore shows there. I admittedly haven’t had issues with security there personally but have heard a lot of horror stories from friends.
@@DanSaillant well thanks. good to learn something new
Stories like these make me super appreciate security at my local venue. They're all super cool guys, they'll chat and hang out with fans while doing their jobs. The venue also has a specific security crew for heavy music that know how to handle these types of crowds, and those guys are just as cool and actively ensure people are safe while enjoying heavy music.
Was on the barricade for Baby Metal and Dethklok here in Arizona. The guard was super chill. Before the show he walked up and down and told everyone up front, I'll ask once nicely, second time not so much, third your out. Between sets he handed out water unprovoked and made sure nobody was overheating, check on people when a surge would happen, chatted cracked jokes. Would give us heads up if a crowd surfer was coming, did what he could to make sure people weren't dropped on their head.
That's how it should be everywhere. Us the fans are there to have fun, and security is there to make sure everyone stays safe.
I was at that gig and security was indeed being really heavy handed. Like dragging people away and shoving them against walls and shining bright ass lights in their faces like the freaking police.
And it's not like anyone was truly out of hand. There wasn't even really a big pit, it was just people kind of jumping around into each other. But no one was throwing crowd killers or being wild or anything like that. so there was no reason for that shit.
I go to a TON of metal shows. I was just at Currents and Polaris at the Palladium in Worcester, and people were going nuts. Literally hundreds of crowd surfers, a pit going on even during set break to the random house music. And security was cool, coz they always are there. They just let the pit handle itself, cuz pits police themselves pretty well, and they stand at the front to pull down the tons of crowd surfers. Security doesn't need to be a problem if they know how to handle heavy shows and know what to expect. and then obviously, do their job well without escalating things for no reason.
But it's clear that the security team in RI (at Fete, pronounced "fet" like Boba Fett), had no freaking clue how to deal with a heavier show. not just that, but they seemed to be interested in being intense as hell.
And yeah, Bodysnatcher is pretty heavy. but hey got about 2 and a half songs in before waking off set, coz they'd even said hey, were not gonna keep playing if you won't let people just have fun.
But like I said, no one was even crowd killing or being wild. It was just your average moshing, and not even a lot at that. Honestly, compared to plenty of other shit I've been to, it was pretty freaking tame. So I just don't feel like there was a reason for that.
Seemed like a both issue with security. They didn't know what to do, but ALSO they seemed just really overly intense about wanting to check people. Like they were itching to start some crap.
On the plus side, the show got refunded, so I basically to see Archetypes Collide for free.
edited: One for spelling, but also to combine my additional reply with this main comment, which was as follows:
As a quick addition, no, they didn't announce the rules. At all. Not once. They had a sign. But by "sign," I mean a piece of paper with the words "No moshing. No stage diving/crowd surfing" printed on it, that they had taped to a metal pole in the center of the room. (they probably had more taped up, but that was the only one i saw personally)
But they didn't announce the rules once. no announcements at all.
And that was actually part of my discussion about the situation with boyfriend on the way home. Coz like, how many people are realistically gonna read or even see that sign? Especially coz they're not gonna start the pit around the one structural pole in the room.
And I feel like at least, they should've announced it at the beginning of the show, and then again in between set break for late comers.
But they did none of that.
Also, I was just one person there, but feel free to ask if you have questions or want more info. Coz I'm definitely never going there again.
Additionally, the venue has apparently also been deleting bad reviews that people have been leaving because of this incident.
Oh, and one final note. I did see a cop car in the lot after the show. According to a bartender (that I spoke to while outside), the cops came just to keep an eye on things and keep everyone safe as the bands packed up. [which from a personal/fan standpoint, kinda sucked. Cuz it meant that unlike usual, the smaller bands like Archetypes Collide weren't doing their typical hang at the merch booth so you can swing by and say hello after their set thing. They had to immediately pack up and get out of there for their safety and the safety of their crew. Which meant that all us fans had to just leave as well without getting to interact with the bands at all. And while I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND that, especially given it wasn't any of the bands' fault, it was the venue's, it still sucked, cuz i was looking forward to chatting with the guys again.]
As a quick addition, no, they didn't announce the rules.
They had a sign. But by sign, I mean a piece of paper with the words "no moshing. No stage diving/ crowd surfing" printed on it, that they had trapped to a metal pole in the center of the room.
But they didn't announce it once.
And that was actually part of my discussion about the situation with boyfriend on the way home. Coz like, how many people are realistically gonna read or even see that sign. Especially coz they're not gonna start the pit around the one structural pole in the room.
And I feel like at least, they should've announced it at the beginning of the show, and then again in between set break for late comers.
But they did none of that.
Also, I was just one person there, but feel free to ask if you have questions or want more info. Coz I'm definitely never going there again.
Oh, and spareribs the venue has also been deleting bad reviews that people have been leaving because of this incident.
Oh, and forget note. I did see a cop car in the lot after the show. According to the bartender, the cops came just to keep an eye on things as the bands packed up to keep everyone safe
I hope the bands got paid (though I bet they didn't)
@@lindasubias8067 don't know either way about that, but I hope so. At the very least the first opener, coz they actually did their whole set. Archetypes Collide is excellent and I mostly went to see them (since I've already seen WCAR like 2 or 3 times now. They're always a great time though, so it was still a bummer)
I'm a security manager at several different venues where the company I work for is contracted.
When we have our security meeting with the tour, we specifically ask what the demographic is and if they've had any issues at previous shows on the tour. We then communicate this info to our team in our pre-show meeting.
As a manager, we are also expected to research the bands that are playing beforehand, so we aren't going in blind.
This type of behavior would NEVER be tolerated by my company or any venue we work. This just puts a black eye on the good security teams out there.
I 100% agree with your last statement, and I am happy to hear how you handle your security team. I feel like most of the venues I've been to over the years operate the way you do as well. As a Tour Manager, I can confirm that we always have those meetings with you guys and I always explain the demographic and what to expect as well. So hearing stuff like what happened at this specific venue blows my mind.
I'm 52 & a US Army veteran: 4yr MP, 1990s. I'm a licensed security D-G, Florida FDACS.gov . I've done all types of EP, estate security, event-party-concert details. 🕶 I avoid crowd/alcohol-music posts. 90-95% of the time, Orlando.gov area the security, venue security mgrs are awful. They do NOT schedule, plan or are set up for 🚑🚒🚓. They over serve patrons 🥃🍹🍺 or allow club-illegal drugs. Orlando PD gets $90/hr for club & venue details.
I remember seeing Bring Me The Horizon at the Roundhouse in Sydney. It was a stacked lineup, Finch and The Amity Affliction were supporting. Because of this the crowd was huge when the doors opened. Just before they opened up the head of security got up in front of anyone and said “You guys are here for a good night. You can do your moshing but if you fuck with my guys we’re going to fuck with you.” Everyone knew where they stood going into the show and there was 0 problems.
That security staff should get arrested, that's completely insane.
This is absolutely crazy. I've been to tons of metal shows, almost every venue has signs that say no moshing, no crowd surfing, etc. It NEVER gets enforced. I couldn't tell you how many interactions I've had with security and they've almost always just been like, this is awesome. I saw Gwar recently and the security was getting COVERED in fake blood. And they were just laughing their asses off. I went up afterwards and asked them if they had any idea what they were getting into and they were just like, yeah man we've been doing this shit for years, nothing surprises us anymore.
Yeah most venues only enforce the no crowd surfing rule
The rest of the stuff is just listed to protect them if someone gets hurt moshing
That and they can kick you out easily if you become a problem
Bad security can really kill a show. I remember back in '07 I went to BB King's in NYC to see Summer Slaughter and the overly aggressive security killed the experience.
Glad Summer Slaughter moved to Irvington the following years. My GF and I at the time went and we talked to the chillest security guard, he passed out bottled water to people too.
Later that night during Morbid Angel some dude who I guess showed up just for them (we'd been moshing all day and never saw him) started to try and get in cheap shots on me, he reeked of cheap beer. I'd even be off to the sides and in between a song he tried coming from the other side of a pit to hit me like a line backer. That security guy saw it and intercepted him before he could ring my bell and they escorted him out.
It's a shame great security guys aren't recognized by their managers or bosses for better pay or promotions. Venue security in NY has been slowly getting worse as I get older.
My issue was with the sheriff's dept at BBT in Camden, NJ during the Godsmack and Shinedown in 2018. Live Nation was the security with the sheriff's dept. We ( my husband, 16 yr old son and I) had an issue with some local drunks that wanted our spot ( on the grounds - grass) and my son and I were physically assaulted and were kicked out due to the locals who knew the sheriff's dept. Btw my father was a police officer. But they didn't want to hear the fact that a minor was punched in the face, which his glasses were knocked off his face.
We will never go to New Jersey for anything. We have been going to concerts as a family since 2015, still to this day as a family.
I called the next day and was told " too bad" basically. I had no one who could help us.
I'm so sorry to hear that.
The most violent acts I’ve ever witnessed at a concert have always been perpetrated by security staff. One very memorable example was a show many years ago at the Sound Academy in Toronto. Cant remember exactly which band was headlining (I think it was Protest the Hero). Myself and a friend had just exited the venue following the end of the last set and we witnessed multiple people being dragged out and thrown out of the venue by security guards. One individual who was being restrained by two guards and not struggling or resisting was sucker-punched in the face by a third security guard before also being thrown out. This all happened within the stretch of maybe 30 seconds and was shocking to witness. Don’t know what prompted security to act in this way, we did not witness what led to all of these people being removed from the venue this way, but seeing this kind of violence out of context was definitely eye opening.
That’s insane! In recent years the security crews at pretty much every show I’ve been to in Toronto have been fantastic from what I’ve seen, usually the same crew of people. Very glad that’s all changed!
Back in the early/mid 80's, Slayer played the Concert Hall. It was fucking mayhem and security was pretty aggressive with stage divers until Tom at some point between songs just said, "leave them the fuck alone." and that was that. Sanctioned chaos.
My friends went to a local show and absolutely got walloped by the security. One of them even ended up hospitalized overnight. Just a bunch of meatheads wanting to outgymbro everyone else.
The way you know for sure that it went too far is that there was a confrontation backstage afterwards. That removes any doubt that security was out of line. I have run security at clubs from 400 to 2k cap.
I think they had to schedule last minute newbie/unexperienced/unprofesional crew/crewmembers. Or did the venue switch security company? That would explain this too. security companies contracts get switched out all the time.
@@walterm2618 Here is the way I look at it. The crew members getting involved and confronting security outside is questionable. Security then going backstage afterwards and confronting the crew is not, it's way out of line. I did this stuff from the security side for almost 10 years, that is out of line.
From what everybody else is saying, its the same security as it's always been@@walterm2618
Remember kids. There are more of us than them. This happened once at an unnamed venue in Ontario during an unnamed band. The crowd destroyed the venue, beat up the security and swat got called on the venue. Normalize security finding out when they choose to fuck around.
My brother was at that show and he was beyond upset about this. This has people not going to this venue ever again. I live in Rhode Island and this is beyond close to home for me and it is a huge deal. This event will change a lot. Canceled 2 sets in. Imagine that guys.
Shout out to the metal head security team at the o2 Academy in Bristol 🤘They perfectly straddle the line between being badass and lovely. Particular mention to the bald glasses wearing dude who leads the crowd in singalongs during intervals 😂 They were awesome at Electric Callboy last night 💪
Also, for years I was terrified of security after being randomly assaulted (punched in the head from behind at full force and I landed face first in the road, subsequently hospitalised) by a bouncer at a student pub. He was prosecuted. These people can ruin lives.
Been at gigs all over the UK and the security by and large have been awesome
As a former bouncer at a lot of concerts in the UK, I have seen my fair share of aggressive security officers and had the horrible part of being someone who is good at his job, but was part of the crew that got removed because of them. I even played a part in restraining the officer who literally started a bust up with a fan claiming he was overly entoxicated, the fan had had a few but he was more than compliant. After I restrained the officer and got backup to remove him, I took the fan aside and gave him a bottle of water and he was speaking perfectly coherent and was a nice person. We got him medical attention and once he was cleared as fine he went back in and enjoyed the night. He came up to me at the end of the night and was grateful that I was respectful but unsurprisingly he complained about the officer. The venue basically removed our security company entirely as a result for the rest of that event, although we were brought back (minus that officer who was fired) for later events.
I think another issue is some venues not having enough security staff to handle large crowds.
I saw invent animate at the Brooklyn monarch beginning of October and there were only 2 security guards for the entire show. The band had to cut their show 2 songs short bc some crowd surfer (which there were far too many) landed on the back of his neck and went unconscious for a few minutes.
One of them tried his best to get to everyone, the main guy in charge made it clear he didn't wanna be there, I heard him whisper to himself "they don't pay me enough for this".
So outside of aggressive security I think a lack of security or security staff not caring about their jobs is another problem that venues have to deal with.
That's definitely a lack of communication between the band/tour and venue. A Tour Manager should prep every venue with what their crowd will be like and how many security staff they would like. On the flip side, venues should know what kind of shows they having coming and and should be prepared.
Fete always has a massive amount of security for the size of the venue. Its a pretty small venue
I'm surprised that happened at the Monarch. I was there for Incendiary a few months ago and it was a great time
@@xmiketragedyx oh don't get me wrong, the show was still amazing, just stating my observations
I do security, since the 1990s. I'm a veteran 4yr Army. Some people are not set up for protection or security posts. Some people are risk adverse, not able to deal with situations. MOAB; mgmt of aggressive behavior. Some do not learn or understand laws, ordinances, policy. Florida, uses FS493. 📂 Security are licensed. Required to be trained. $$$ & good business standards, due dillagence are part of it.
also "be aware of the kind of shows your booking" is a huge point here. I once saw GWAR and GHOUL play in a literal country square dance bar before; nice floors, expensive taxidermy on the walls, the whole nine yards. However, they were beyond prepared for the band, had no crowd complaints, we all had a blast, and they still occasionally have giant metal shows now to this day. It can go great!
I can't WAIT for this. Most security i've met are super cool, especially at smaller venues and they tend to be the usual crews, but I've seen some downright horrible shit, especially from the larger contracted security companies at larger shows and festivals that act like they're roman emperors, the bullies really pick who to get overzealous with too, EDM shows, metal shows, jam band shows, you're not going to see 3 security guards chest bumping someone a Celion Dion show trying to provoke a reaction so they can give a beatdown. I've chatted up a few that downright brag about it.
One fucker seemed to take pride in denying me alcohol because my ID was still vertical (but valid) at a local ZZ TOP concert.
I was 23.
Reminds me of a cat used to run in NOLA, would go to metal shows in head to toe deadhead apparel. His dad had been a pro kickboxer in the 80s and dude had grown up on the mats, he was slick he had good footwork. His logic behind his apparel choice was someone was going to smoke him out or he was going to get to piece up a bully.
The big security companies have a lot of turnover; and if additional crew is requested by a client they will A. schedule experienced and mature officers. B. If A fails they will schedule any officer available to them as to meet the clients request. So sometimes you get the very inexperienced; ‘wannabe cops’; ‘I’m just here to pay my rent’ officers. Option B appears what happened at this specific event
It's awful that some security abuse their power and those stories need to be told. But it's good to know they're not all bad. I want to shout out the AMAZING security we have in Philly (mostly shows at the TLA, the fillmore, and the foundry) for being so fun but not putting up with any shit. They've saved my crowdsurfing ass countless times and are always there for a good time. So props to them, especially Eric, Quan, Mike, Sinay, and Brandon 👏
Had a great time at the TLA when I came into town to see Parkway years ago, security and staff were great there. Admittedly felt like a venue that was one pyro accident from triple digit deaths, but the staff were great haha.
@@Xynth25yeah TLA definitely violates some fire codes (and their plumping has issues all the time) but it's one of my favorite venues
Most venues in Huntsville, AL are super strict like this. One of the more popular venues, Mars Music Hall, has a sign at the doors for any show that might actually have a moving crowd that says something like "Absolutely no moshing, no crowd surfing, no circle pits, no slamdancing, no walls of death." Can't help but wonder why they even book a metal show. Once I saw Sevendust there and Lajon tried to get a circle pit to open. We wanted to but we also wanted to see the rest of the show. So only about 3 people tried and failed (they were yelled at by security). When Sevendust was doing the encore a lot of people said screw it and started moshing. Security came rushing in immediately. It was embarrassing.
Now, up the road in Nashville, TN? The security is more likely to participate in the most pits and even lift people up to crowd surf.
I have never worked a show where the security was over the top aggressive. Most of the time the security has been good and seem focused on keeping people safe. I have had a few times where security was a bit too soft and we had fans backstage and we had to ask them to leave. Worst of those was an outdoor show and a person had crossed the barricades and got under the stage to get out of a rain shower. We found her leaning against the power distro with her bag sitting on the cam locks.
One thing I will say about this before even hopping into watching the video is Fete is notorious for horrible security and shows. I grew up only 30 minutes from that venue and I refuse to go to shows there if a band plays there. I also get both sides of the spectrum (former touring musician here) so not bashing venues or security.... but that place sucks
I was there that night [I love in Boston so I've only been there once before for until I Wake and it was so small that it was fine)
But security was indeed being really heavy handed and too much that night.
great video. Just recently saw Parkway Drive in Detroit. Great security staff there. They were clearly fans of the music (i saw them mouthing the words of the songs while catching crowdsurfers, lol), and they encouraged the surfing, moshing, and pits in general. They also handed out probably 15 cases worth of water bottles throughout the show. IDK if it was the venue's (masonic temple, Detroit, MI) own security or a contractor, but they were awesome. Its amazing how much better a good security team can make a show.
I've been to a couple shows where security would get "out of hand," not anywhere near as bad as this though. The first one was back in May of '05, in Jacksonville, NC at an In Flames show, with Throwdown. There was no "beat down dancing" because the venue didn't allow it then. But there were some personnel that were going around sucker punching people, and kicking them for no reason. Anders wound up calling one of them out when In Flames was playing; didn't happen again.
Second time was October of '16, in Idaho Falls, ID, at a Whitechapel show with Oceano. Now this issue for security was purely out of zero experience with the hardcore ninjas; these type of shows would usually get booked in Pocatello with a different security team. Anyways, as soon as any breakdown would hit with any band, the hardcore ninjas started doing their thing. As soon as that happened, the security would start freaking out grabbing these kids up, and pulling them out of the pit. Most of the time, the security personnel were, nicely asking these kids to cool it with that, but since most of these kids were 18/19 year olds, with chips on their shoulders, they'd be giving security attitude, to the point that they'd get booted. But with some security, the attitudes from the kids, would just piss them off that they'd be trying to yank these kids outside to beat them down; probably would've succeeded if there weren't more level headed personnel there. Kinda pissed off the promoter enough to not hire them on for any future shows.
One of the most terrifying things i have ever seen at a show is the entire crowd turn on the security...all can stop one but one can not stop all.
Worst security experience I ever had was BTS at Soldier Field. The girls next to me kept shoving me out of my seat into the isle and I kept getting yelled at to go back to my seat🙄
mine came down to politics , in eastern ky expo . dude went crazy on me because I made political joke his way. never touched me though just verbal beatdown
A number of years ago, I worked private security for several venues in Cleveland, Ohio. The one constant was that the places I worked with stressed safety. They didn't what us getting into bad situations, so we generally paired up with someone else if we needed to remove someone, and the only time things would get interesting would be push out at the end of the night.
The Mission Ballroom in Denver literally had the best security crew I’ve ever seen. For the Motionless In White concert between each set they handed out FREE water to the people in the mosh pits. I was honestly caught off guard. But I’m convinced they had just as much fun as us haha
It seems like all the venues in Colorado are pretty good about stuff. Black sheep in Springs seems to be staffed by metal heads, so they understand where the line is.
I've seen that! I'm too old to mosh now, but I thought that was way cool!!
Can confirm, Mission Ballroom rules
@@celica49 I can confirm that the Black Sheep is basically run by metal heads, hardcore dudes, and old school punks. Haven't been there in years, but have enjoyed every time I've ever been there.
@TankTheTech it's the closest real venue to me. I've never had a bad time there. The crew there is always awesome, and they are able to bring in some huge acts for such a small venue. I love it.
Big shoutout to the security team at the Vibes/Rock box event center in SATX. They check the barricades for safety, handle crowd surfers with respect, and are solid dudes that care about the fans!
The first few times I went to The Rave in Milwaukee, they gave out little cards that said "no moshing, crowd surfing" etc, but I didn't get any for Motionless in White or Bad Omens or any show since. That was nice to see.
I'm pretty sure that's just for insurance purposes.
Both the shows I saw there had moshing.
Most venues will say „no moshing or crowd surfing“ more to cover their ass for liability reasons, like it was said above. So if someone moshed and gets hurt, the venue can say „we said no moshing“.
I actually got assaulted by a security guard at The Rave back in like 2008 for crowd surfing… And I was IN one of the bands playing. 😂
@@TankTheTechwas it a short guy in his upper 40’s with a mullet? THAT dude was a piece of 💩 who used to harass homeless people who weren’t even on the property, and were on the sidewalk.
@@TankTheTech I figured it was more for insurance/liability than anything. The first few times I went there it seemed no one wanted to mosh or anything though. The pit opened up but people just kinda stood there. but every show since then has been great!
Seen a security guy at a small venue Lorna Shore went to that grabbed down the women that were crowd surfing with ease, but absolutely man handled the guys when they got to the front and pulled them in to whisper shit in their ears. No idea why, but he had little man syndrome
I saw the opposite a few months ago when I saw Beast in Black. The security guards were more than polite with me, but were downright horrible with women. I guess the fact that I am rather tall, big and scary looking had something to do with it.
Honestly, though, I've met my share of rude security guards. I don't know what they get from acting like this.
@@Tigermaster1986 Part of it is the type of people these kinds of gigs (security details) attract. Other half is the feeling of immunity to consequence. Put those together, add in a bit of big city attitude, and yeah, its a sh*tstorm
@@goldenhate6649 then venues and security companies should make it VERY VERY clear to those shits, that they'll get fired when they behave to aggressive or there are too many complaints by fans. If they have a feeling of immunity to consequence, make them fear consequence.
@@Tigermaster1986 that’s the third concert I been too. Only one that had that issue. Most venues I think have nice guards.
There’s three Security company’s i frequently worked with 98% of the people completely fine. There was one incident where the Personal Security of ,let’s say a famous big butted Rapper, got way out of hand cause the head security had to rush to the Infield from downstairs to a help call and slightly had to brush (by no means with any force) her to the side in the narrow Hallway downstairs. They found him severely beaten in the parking lot after the show and he never really came back opting to stay in Office and do planning from then on.
Worst Security at a show I attended was probably during an Open Air AC/DC Concert, with 6 Guys severely threatening an Old Man cause he fell while drunk and spilled some beer on one of them. He apologized right away before even trying to get up and was by no means a threat or too wasted to reason with just a 60+ year old that had one too much. Along with a bunch of people we got them to just let him leave as the concert was already over but everyone was quite baffled as to how a Group of „professionals“ can go that overboard.
This is why I go to the Worcester Palladium exclusively. The staff at the venue are as knowledgeable as it gets to the scene and encourage the fans to let loose and have a good time. They hand out free waters between sets to the people in the pit, and do an outstanding job keeping everyone safe while crowd surfers are coming, etc. Only time I’ve seen someone get thrown out was when they climbed the speaker cables up to the balcony from the pit, so, understandable 😆
I can’t even count the amount of drunk tough guys I’ve seen thrown out of the palladium in the last 20 years. I wouldn’t be surprised if crowd punching was invented there
Why? So ypu can pay way more than justified for a show and hav3 to go out to Worcester. Sorry but almost every venue except great woods is better
@@therecalcitrantseditionist3613 you think $20-50/ ticket is paying “way more”?? Than what?!
This venue has a very bad reputation for even allowing people to jump around and headbang. Big “stand around with your arms crossed” venue with little tolerance for the smallest of movement. The local scene there seems to unanimously agree and hate this venue for how controlling the security is across many shows, not just this one.
I have had too many bad experiences with security at shows with the exception of a 2001 TOOL show where the security guard I was talking to...realized we had a mutual friend and found out I was seated alone up in the nose bleeds, he somehow took me to the floor GA section 2 songs into the show. FUCKING EPIC!!! That dude is on my xmas card list now.. no joke!!! There are good ones ,, but the bad ones overshadow them.
When I saw knocked loose I had to buy a seat, GA was sold out. Of course I didn't want to sit down for that, the security guy let me onto the floor even though I didn't have a bracelet. Thanks dude whoever you are I had so much fun.
Fillmore... Was there last night for Static-X and Sevendust.. I'm a larger dude who is having trouble with my back. So I sat down on the stairs leading down to the floor. Security came over. Asked if everything was okay.. I said yes.. I just needed to sit down for a second. Guy then offered.. "would you like a place to sit down?" To which me and my brother in law said "yes" and then brought us to the area they've got marked out for those who are disabled who also use a wheelchair. Had a blast. And thank you to that security guy.
The same concert, guy was meeting a friend who was in this section and this dude was standing. Security guard came over and said "hey man you can't stand here this is for people to sit"... standing guy got all indignant and offended that security came over.
So from my eyes... had a great time.. From the guy who got told to sit down.. Didn't even tell the guy to leave. Just told him he had to sit down. That guy had a shitty time with security.
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Went to a KSE show at the same venue. Best friend's daughter got kicked in the head by someone crowd surfing. She had a concussion. From what I was told. Security immediately checked on her... was able to pull her, my friend, and his wife out of the crowd immediately and escort them to the exit so she could go get checked out by a doctor.
So YMMV...
Having grown up in the industry I didn't have to worry about security much. I had my working pass and did my thing. Post grad school I started going to festivals with friends as a punter. Holy Sh!t. I can't believe people even go to shows. The number of times I have had a guard stick his hand down my pants and grab my junk during a pat down is ridiculous. Obviously I have contacted festival runners after this happened. Coachella dressed it directly and it didn't happen again (to me), but others have completely blown me off even after pointing out in California that is sexual assault. And that is using industry contact to get ahold of the right person. Luckily there are still some old school BGP staff at some of the SF Bay Area venues that are awesome, but how much longer will those people be there?
I appreciate all these videos that open up more of what goes on behind a show besides the bands playing. I've been trying to make a better effort of saying thanks to all the hands that make it work. Saying thanks to the sound guys, security, venue staff, just saying thanks and appreciating the hard work they do.
Being a CO native, I've been to the Fillmore many times. Their security staff is hit and miss. Earlier this year I saw Skinny Puppy there, and the security staff was great. A few years back I saw Slayer there, and the security staff was horrible. I've seen shows there where the crowd was treated like prison inmates and shows where security was non-existant.
Facts been to fillmore for past 20 years and it is indeed hit and miss
I think this is a scheduling issue w/t security provider. According to the contract they get a request from the venue for an X number of officers; maybe stipulating concert/crowd control/maturity experience. if the scheduler can’t find any experienced/crowd control/mature officers he/she will schedule any he can find to honor the request. (Bc you know they otherwise might loose the client/contract.
@@walterm2618 yeah, most venues staff security through a third party firm.
Certain acts will require X amount of barricade personnel, X amount of floor personnel etc. so you can definitely get inexperienced people working in spots they have no business working in which in my experience usually results in a problem with them either being too aggressive or too soft.
I got two venues I avoid here in Orlando. Saw Circle Jerks and Municipal Waste at Plaza Live. Municipal Waste called for crowd surfers for one of their songs. Security grabbed crowd surfers and shoved them out the side door like they were getting arrested. One serious problem "security" guy was grabbing merch from people's hands at the rail and throwing it across the floor in front of the stage and stood in cop pose while people yelled at him for it. Keith Morris had to stop and yell at security when 2-3 of them grabbed a crowd surfer off the top of the crowd and threw him on the ground. Thankfully their next Orlando show is at the House Of Blues.
The Henao had Loathe, several crowd surfers were pulled down and pushed out the door, no warning, nothing, until security made one of the opening bands tell everyone to not crowd surf. Still saw people getting pushed out the door for the most minor typical rock crowd stuff. Completely killed the excitement of seeing Loathe in a small venue.
On the flipside, I've seen crazy death/metalcore at The Abbey and security has been great there. Seen shows at the House Of Blues, Hard Rock Live, The Beacham, The Conduit, and the Orlando Fairgrounds Amphitheater, all of them have been decent. No need to support meathead staffed venues with them around.
Oh man, I’m in Sydney, Australia (notorious nanny state) and out of hundreds of heavy shows I’ve attended I’ve had one seemingly bad experience. A security guard pulled me aside for a “bag check” in a mid-sized venue, she then discretely asked me if I was okay, if I knew the guy I was with well, and if I’d left my drink unattended with him. I’d left the mosh clinging to my boyfriend, stumbling and drowsy, she’d seen it go down and had discretely pulled me aside because she thought my drink had been spiked. Explained I’m narcoleptic, was having a sleep attack and the guy was my boyfriend of many years, I got how it must’ve looked but really I was okay, thanked her profusely, and emailed the venue the following day to commend her efforts and how she handled it. Had I been in trouble her actions would’ve saved me. Our security lads and ladies are absolute legends!
I've heard the name before, but I don't think I ever listened to Bodysnatcher before... judging from that bit, that's gonna change 😅
To be honest, I've never come across incompetent security at a show as far as I can remember (different story for metalcore/hardcore parties). But having worked ~15 years as a barkeeper on the side 1-2 a month, I've seen way too many securities come and go that were probably doing more drugs than half of the guests and were looking for a fight later into the night. That said, MOST of the security guys (and girls) were fine, some great people, and we got some veterans that had already been there for 10+ years when I started and everybody loves them, including people who got kicked out by them repeatedly (and rightfully so) 🤷♂. Judging from personal experience, heresay and talking to the securities over all those years, two things: Mandatory background checks for security will go a long way, someone who has been convicted for battery/assault in recent years is probably NOT the right person to ensure the safety of others and mandatory unannounced drug tests. Those looking for trouble or escalating situations that could have been handled without violence were NEVER the sober ones, and never those that had a few beers or smoked a bit of weed.
As for the "banning heavy bands..." part towards the end... communication. Just. Fucking. TALK. in advance. Beatdown shows are weird, even when you're used to metal or metalcore in general. If the securities are send in there blind, a big part of the blame has to be on those who failed to instruct them properly. People stage diving feet first into the crowd, literally running straight of the stage into the crowd, kicking each other in the chest, grabbing the mic from the singer, if you're used to working for Green Day or Killswitch Engage or Carnifex, I can totally understand that people will be like "wtf is this shit?". And from my understanding, it's the job of whoever is in charge of security, to properly brief their crew on what to expect and how to handle it.
I was actually at this concert and was physically thrown out towards the end.
Can confirm that security was extremely agressive and out of hand. They were looking for reasons to throw people out and became way more dangerous than the small mosh that opened up.
It's been several years ago, but the staff at the norva in norfolk ca absolutely was there to throw people around. I was in one of the bands playing there and was thrown out and threatened with violence for what the security said was being in the wrong place. Problem with that was we all had all access passes and had personally cleared that we could be where we were at with the venue manager but apparently that wasn't conveyed to the security. I was handed through 3 levels of security managers and it escalated with each one until the promoter came out and told the head of security it was ok'd by the venue manager for us to be where we were. We even asked the head of security before that to check with management and he flatly refused. After the show the stage manager and venue manager apologized but the damage was done. I attended a show there maybe a year later and saw the security was still being very aggressive with the crowd so I just don't go to that venue.
I work as a security for over 15 years now. Not in the US and not at concerts, but i did lower class soccer games and folks festivals, private security in clubs and bars. So i've met a lot of different people on both sides. You can come to work with already a bad mood, it happens, we are just humans too but as soon as you are realizing your personal problems affecting your work and you begin to respond aggressively to situation not worth these kind of actions...just step back, let some other of the security take your place there and do something else out of the line to cool off.
Yes you sometimes get those guys as security who are either unexperienced and overreacting in such situations, these not really a big problem when you have experienced ones around, or those who are already hyper aggressive from the beginning and just out there to smash some one. But in case of the last, you as a fellow security, has to step in before there really loosing it.
Hearing this story, the security there basically bonds against everyone who said something against there behaviour, which sounds shitty af, just shows me that, not every one, but those who count (security teamleader, venue management) have kind of an attitude and don't know that security work is deescalating first and be able to just get physical when it's needed, not when it's wanted.
If i would have worked there as security and everything was like described, i would say f* off, don't call me again i won't work for you anymore.
Worst security i ve seen were on a smaller festival in germany..
They checked everyones stuff when u entered the location and the male security started to touch womans for this. We mentioned to him that he is simply not allowed to, specially if the person in front of him dont like it.
Behind this guy was a female security aswell.
Instead of realising his fault he started to go agressive on us and even send us home.
We told this to the manager, cuz it was just one of many mistakes they did. He sent us free tickets for the next show and fired the whole security company cuz there were a lot of persons reached out to the manager.
Yep, securitys can be damn shit... But besides that i went to around 300 shows, and 99% of the time the securitys were great!:)
Interestingly any show I've ever been to where a real security threat occurred in the pit the crowd always handled the issue themselves long before security even knew there was a problem. I've seen security do a wonderful job protecting the stage line and helping crowd surfers but people in the pit tend to take care of each other.
I think the best security story I can think of was when there was a kid at the stage gate in the pit at a Mushroomhead concert. Security was concerned for his safety because crowds at their shows tend to surge toward the stage but instead of insisting the parents take the kid farther from the stage they negotiated with Mushroomhead to let the kid come over the gate and watch from the stage.
THANK YOU! pits generally police themselves just fine. If someone gets out of line or starts a fight, the pit handles it, breaks them up and gets them out of there. if someone gets hurt, the pit handles it, and gets them out of there to safety/the staff.
you only really need security at the front to help pull down crowd surfers so no one flops on the floor.
Was this at the Inkcarnation in Ohio? If so my friends were the ones who picked up your kid and tossed him up onto the crowd to surf. Eddie told you that they were going to do bc your son wanted too but you thought it was to dangerous. I actually have video of it. The look on the kids face was something I'll never forget. He loved it although whenever saw the mom again but the kid stayed behind the barrier the rest of Mushroomheads performance. This was right before Slaughter to Prevail. Lmao!
@@davidmurray6176 Nope, this was at a show in Kentucky a few years ago. Nice to hear another story of security and Mushroomhead looking out for the kiddos though.
Used to have issues with local show security. The head of security was an older off duty police detective and his team were either off duty cops or just big dudes he hired on.
When the local promoter first introduced them there were issues because security wasn’t familiar with the culture. But over time we got to know the head of security because he worked all the shows and he got to know us because it was usually the same people moshing at every show. Security started relaxing on the aggressiveness once they realized we weren’t there to start trouble or hurt anyone. And for the most part already kept the floor/crowd in check (like most scenes do).
Every once in a while a new security guy would get touchy but the other security guys would pull’em back and explain.
There were even some shows where the head of security asked us to help because he understood his team wouldn’t be enough. (I think it was like Hatebreed and Terror on the same bill).
At the end of the day. Making sure the venue, security and other staff know what to expect and ensuring those expectations are kept in line is very important.
I've been concert security over 20 years now and with the new "CULTURE" of music many venues are enlisting the "HELP" of outlaw motorcycle clubs who are THUGS and is NOT typical for most PROFFESSIONAL SECURITY OUTFITS I love my job I love the music industry ect and the culture is EVER CHANGING some embrace it some hate it and are NOT EDUCATED!! I have come down on many guys about being over aggressive to fans we ofter let it go and let it play out until it gets SUPER ANGRY OR VINDICTIVE !!! WHEN THE MOOD GOES FROM HELP GUYS UP TO HELP BEAT THERE ASS OR START MOB MENTALLITY IE; 2 OR 3 ON 1 GUY WE let it play out and let the kids dance ect its DEF a culture thing some "SECURITY AND BOUNCERS" DO GET INTO THIS FOR THE WRONG REASONS!!! I PERSONALLY TRY TO self police and EDUCATE staff and often supervisors on the CULTURE of the new wave of trap metal ect THIS IS A "BAD APPLE" example of old school security VS new school it comes down to TRAINING AND CLEAR RULES unfortunately theres so much GREY AREA at venues with LIABILITY when kids get hurt short of signing a waiver of liability that relieves the venue of injury liability its a NO WIN SITUATION ALL AROUND !! It takes a certain temperment,training and good crew to help change this culture
Maybe someone needs to build a list of these places with bad security, so we as the paying customers, and the bands that they want to see, know not to book those venues.
A family friend of ours owns a security firm. He pulled out of a contract with a venue after they started allowing heavy bands to perform. To what he said "it's like every show there's a different standard that's accepted and we have no idea what is supposed to be acceptable and what is not." Which did lead to a few altercations. I don't know how many shows they did total, but to him it became too much of a hassle. Which I do understand where he's coming from. Especially giving he's not into heavy music himself. And there appeared to have been a serious lack in overall communication between all parties.
I guess I get where they're coming from, but this hasn't stopped hundreds and thousands of other venues from having no incidents at metal and hardcore shows over the years.
Thats a cop out excuse. 30 seconds on UA-cam is all you need to understand the standards of whats acceptable. Thats just someone who doesn't wanna put in any effort whatsoever. And fyi ive been to hip hop shows recently with moshing. Its not strictly a heavy music concept.
It's hard for him to understand his personnel shouldn't beat peoples heads off curbs? Sounds like a fucking idiot.
I watched a security guard at the Webster in Connecticut kick a kids teeth out of his face!!
I was at a third eye blind show and went outside to smoke a cigarette, I noticed this kid sitting on the ground leaning against the building next to the front doors, next thing I saw was a security guard come out the door and put his boot into the mouth of this kid with great force.
Apparently the kid was hitting on the security guards girlfriend and the kid didn't even know what he did wrong.
The crazy part is the tour manager was standing outside when it happened and told the Webster they would never come back, he also gave the kid free tickets and backstage passes for the next show on tour.
Nobody would call the police because apparently the Webster has so many problems that they pay off the Hartford Police officers not to show up so they don't lose their liquor license.
It's not just the security it can also be the venue!!
I still remember when amity affliction was playing one of my locals when they were still a new band.
Befor the show we were at the pub with a few of the band members since my friend knew them, but I didnt drink as I was to stressing about making a fool of myself in front of them sober let alone after drinking.
When we went to the hall for the show, the owner told me I was banned for "looking and acting drunk" which I wasnt. I was just extra excited while being undiagnosed for my ASD(Autism).
He refused to let me prove I was sober but the band told him "He didn't have a single sip but we have been drinking all day, so if he is banned, so are we".
To this day, they have my respect for that.
THe story of what happened at that show is absolutely shocking. I do however feel the need to add something to the general discussion regarding dealing with crowd surfers or moshers. Despite the difficulties I face with my autism, I love going to concerts and get near the front for the interaction with the band, and just headbanging and jumping to the music. To avoid getting crushed in a pit, I usually pick a spot on the side and not center stage, and that usually works pretty good. But still it's not uncommon that people just randomly start pushing me, or my girlfriend who has a bad back and walks with a stick as if being at a metal gig means you can just shove everyone around, and in situations like that I would fully support security being rough with people doing that, as we should have just as much right to enjoy the show despite not being able to take part in the moshing. Also fans who act entitled because they are short and think I should let them in front of me, even though I have been standing through several support acts in that very spot and unlike them not just moved forward when the headliner comes on. The number of times I've been kicked in the back of my legs for not letting someone take the space for which I came early is uncountable, and of course because that happens low to the ground, security doesn't see it, and if I react, I'm the one getting kicked out.
And for crowdsurfing, I can understand people enjoy it, and would hate to see a complete ban, but please don't try to push someone boots first into the head of a person who's taller than everyone else around them, as I have no interest in getting a broken neck from some idiot suddenly being on top of me from behind.
Thanks a lot for doing this videos. It is always interesting to get an insight of someone who is more involved in the backend side of concerts that is normally invisible to everyone else. One of the last metal concerts I visited had (at least) no visible security and it was very peaceful (and also no crowdsurfers). I was never at this venue before, but I assume they did know their audience.
So I've actually been in venues where they've done the "voice of god" thing to announce that. A few years ago at one of my favorite local spots (really small for the record), the MC for the night came out and told us that we could mosh as long as people weren't getting thrown around into walls (again really small venue), absolutely no slam or crowd killing, and obviously no crowd surfing as the venue is really small and the ceiling is really short. Usually not a problem, and folks handle it really well. One of the bands though didn't like that the crowd was being told to basically keep the aggressive stuff to a minimum. The frontman ended the whole 5 band showcase about 3 bands in by actively climbing onto and hanging off the rafters, then essentially daring the crowd or security to "put people up" to get him down. Wild night.
Point being, I've definitely seen pre-show announcements about the rules, but usually at much smaller venues with very little room and/or no stage and/or no real separation for the sound engineer.
I am old school on this and crowd surfing started as a way to get somebody to the front for medical aid, there is nearly always at least one professional trained medic behind the rails. On the flip side I was at the front of a concert and pressed hard against the rail (which was 1/8" radius square steel) I had the same person go over my head several times, on one occasion he landed hard on my shoulder forcing my chest hard onto the rail, I had extreme pain afterwards (which I later found to be a broken sternum and at least 2 ribs in the canter of my chest) They guy went over again I mouthed to the security I would punch out his kidney if he came over again (this was about the 6th time) sure enough he came over my head again security grabbed him a such a way as to allow them to drop him on a bracer to disuade him (it worked) I later found out security had put a Paramedic in the pit to keep an eye on me as I was obviously in a bad way but it would have been difficult to get me out unless critical, as the concert would have had to stop and medics with security brought in to create an exit.
I have been at some amazing gigs over the years and never had a problem with security, I have seen security have to get heavy handed to remove somebody being abusive to a woman I was stood next to and he then punched both her and me, he was actually charged with assault and the woman was returned to her place stood next to me after making a brief statement
Shoutout to the Wacken Security who just stood there and shrugged when Band asked us to storm the stage
There actually was an issue at the Murfreesboro, TN concert with Static X and Sevendust that they had to cancel the show because they had "inadequate security measures in place" I believe is what they called it. Do you have any input on that? Do you feel that is more of the venue's problem or the band? Personally, i believe it was because the venue didn't plan accordingly. I'd love to know your input on that.
Hey! Providence RI native here! Basically every local musician me included have a heavy dislike towards Fete Music Hall (pronounced 'feht'). The security has always been extremely aggressive to patrons and at times bands playing, and there's been many accusations of inappropriate/sketchy af conduct for years. I honestly have no idea how they're still in business. Me and most of my friends refuse to play at that disaster of a venue.
When I was an umpire for girls fast pitch softball, the most important thing I ever learned was that the people aren’t there to see the umpire, the people are there to watch their daughters and friends play ball.
I think a big problem with a lot of security companies and staff is that they think they’re the star of the show, when in reality it would be better if people didn’t even notice them.
I’m not saying we don’t need security but if its just a normal metal show, nothing is going wrong, I shouldn’t notice them at all.
When the police often treat the citizens like this, why should we expect anything different when they moonlight as security, or civilian security personnel let their authority as security staff go to their heads? This BS is on brand.
Holy fuck this hits way too close to home. I used to frequent fete music hall (the venue in providence) and it was amazing until it went under new management. I’ve been out of the music scene for years but wow. I never thought a RI staple would turn into such a disappointment
I've been a touring metal musician and engineer since I was a teenager, along with working club/venue security since 18 I partly own a music venue now.
I have seen full on riots destroy clubs due to asshole bouncers. I have physically fought co-worker bouncers when I was working certain clubs because they would beat up kids they throw out very badly. I literally fought one who was doing it because it's so wrong to treat people like this.
I actually made my own music venue in upstate NY because of how bad venues were around my area after moving back from Cali working tours on the production side.
Venues don't realize your bouncers SET THE TONE for your venue. If they treat people bad, that vibe spreads among the crowd. Venue owners need to realize how many problems are CAUSED by bad security attitudes alone.
Crews in my venue treat my customers appropriately or don't exist as employees.
Normally i do not do this but one of my companies is a security company mostly certain peoples houses but also certain venues. A friend of mine asked if we could help him out with a certain metal festival in Europe. We said no problem and asked for the rules and the names of the bands that played ( so we knew what the bands were like and what we could expect). those couple days were extremely fun and the only "trouble" we had was one guy who barfed into a womans handbag ( the "green beret express" did get the lady's new bag which was identical which made her really happy). Dude drank too much beer. It was a rather big venue and i am very proud of my security guys ( most of them are vets) and they always go the de-escalation road. Not always possible but when its an option first try that. After all people are there to have fun and escape the world a bit while listening to great music.
What i am also seeing in certain clients demands is that we have a zero tolerance to this or that behavior. That is not how we roll. Plus for whatever reason if one of the guys is getting worked up he calls for a "5 min cooldown ". Either you are a professional or you are some hick LARPing as security. then you have events like described where security stomps on venue go-ers for no reason.
We had one potential client that asked us to push away "any people with certain clothes and hats on" ( if you know what i mean) because of political reasons. We said no to that client.
Seattle used to have the shittiest security culture that was tied to crews to justify terrorizing specific people with misguided aggression. One dude that called me a pedo to justify a call to violence then joined a band with my ex's SAer and didn't do anything about it. I've had my life threatened to my face by someone I worked with who was in it and I just said "you know that won't change anything" and the dude has calmed down since after seeing someone for anger management. Security in some places just see red. Not reality, they're looking for somewhere to put their anger and pain and grow bitter, cold and malicious as the music exaggerates about. It's cornball with weapons shit
Paul DiAnno (ex Iron Maiden) played a small “venue” (restaurant/bar) in my hometown many years ago. Maybe 60 people there
They had two security guards in front of the “stage” the whole gig. They threatened to throw us out only for singing along and jumping a little.
Even DiAnno told them to calm down and eventually to fuck off because they were killing the mood.
But they kept being assholes and had us all standing still and quiet like at a funeral.
The last song was a cover of Blitzkrieg Bob.
The whole crowd decided to go crazy and all of a sudden the two guards was ripped into the middle of the mosh.
I will never forget the absolute fear in their eyes as they were about to unwillingly become one with the crowd.
Nothing violent. Only happy moshing. But such sweet revenge on these buttholes.
Spoke with the organizers a few days later and yeah they said that if the venue ever have security like that again their partnership is over.
Sucks when the wrong people are at the wrong place 😢
I spent years as a security supervisor at a music festival in Milwaukee. Only a select few were trained and allowed to put hands on, and at the main stage, the amp, most of the time we’d have to write out a report after a hands on incident or ejection. I will say though, the bands themselves aren’t always the innocent ones. I’ve personally dealt with bands telling patrons to rush the stage from the lawn area because they failed to sell reserved seats.
I spent a good 6 years taking vacation from my day job and working the fest, man those were good times.
I’ve done security for a live nation venue for a year and they always have a meeting about what kind of crowd to anticipate and we always had big guys upfront like myself over 6ft. Even when there’s a no moshing sign we still let them for as long as no one gets hurt.
We never kicked out crowd surfers. The only time we would kick out someone is if they were underage drinking, vaping, smoking, or trying to get on stage.
If someone got on stage they got kicked out and the security guard who didn’t stop it gets fired.
Im super chill. As a concert goer I respect everyone and if I see someone smoking weed or doing something they aren’t supposed to I’ll say hey don’t do that or signal them to stop and it usually works.
I’ve only kicked out 3 people. 1 underage drinker, someone who got on stage, and a pervert who was trying to touch women without permission. There’s actually a video of me point out that last guy on YT lol.
No security guard should be spitting on anyone. They should press charges.
That is craaazy! I experienced the exact opposite recently: Security in Scotland: Edinburgh and Glasgow 02 Academy and in Germany: Full Force Festival, were SOOOO awesome!!!! They set each crowdsurfer down as softly as is humanly possible and made sure nobody ever drops on the floor even when handling 5 at a time.
But even the bad ones i experienced in the past were clearly just veeeery overwhelmed.
I was at a show in Copenhagen, at Amager Bio, with Heaven Shall Burn, Malevolence, Trivium and Obituary. A heavy show. But when we started moshing and crowd surfing we got to told off. On of my friends got In an altercation with the security staff, that if he surfed again he would be kicked out of the venue. Even though nobody knew of these rules. And they never told us or had a sign up! And even Trivium had to stop the show 2 times, because people were surfing and there was no security there to help them over the rails. And to my knowledge none of the bands knew moshing and crowd surfing wasn't allowed. And this venue is known for having so many heavy shows.Even Electric Callboy played at the same venue this year too.
I haven't really been in the scene all that much in the past 8 years or so, but I remember around 11 years ago, I noticed the hardcore dancing group of people in my area were being more violent than what I had learned about moshing. One thing I always learned was, NEVER swing, pull or shove people outside of the moshpit and never do anything that can harm others in the pit. Point of the pit is to have fun, not to punch people in the face or stomp on them. I remember performing at one venue where one of these hardcore dancing guys was swinging at people that were just standing around the put. This guy was actively trying to harm people and should have been kicked out, but it was a small local show, so there was no security for our show.
Not trying to defend the security guards, but it's not uncommon to see one dude being excessive and getting kicked out or beat by other fans that notice.
They got served. South Park. 😂
Its funny you mention the Fillmore. I used to live a block behind that venue off of Cofax ave. That venue is one of the best ive been to. Its vibe. The walls are lined with pictures of artists who played there spanning across decades, and the acoustics are fantastic in that building.
So I was OTR earlier this year. We had performed a show and everything went smoothly. That was until it didn’t. Apparently, my drummer had caught the eye of a girl. Now I never found out who she was to this security dude but that really doesn’t matter. My drummer is 5’4 maybe 120 lbs. This security guy was over 6’. and he started aggressively threatening my drummer with violence.
Luckily, the Head of Security was paying attention and intervened. He apologized profusely. I have mixed feelings about the matter. In the litigious environment that we live in, you are going to pay one way or the other. You can pay in the form of a lawsuit, where very likely everyone gets sued. The other option is pay for a highly trained staff. In either event, the trained staff might (heavy emphasis on might) prevent you from a lawsuit.
Yes, people are human and as such are flawed. They can have 364 days a year where they’re teddy bears. That day in particular though, something could have caused them snap. I for one am not looking to be judge and jury but if he had gone after my drummer, it would likely of lend to a different conversation.
I saw the New Titans on the Block Tour in 1991 in Dallas TX at the Longhorn Ballroom. Sepultura was playing their headlining set and there were these big giant Samoan or Pacific Islander security guys. One of them kicked a fan that had gotten on the stage, and Max stopped the show immediately. He got on the mic and dressed those dudes down. He was like, "next time I see one of my fans get kicked, we will stop playing completely, and then we will see how all these fans act!!" It was like he was giving us license to destroy the place. We sure would have, too!! I'll never forget that as long as I live. Max is the real deal.
For the story, about 30 years ago, we had the combo Infectious Grooves / Suicidal Tendencies at a small venue and one of the security staff was quite violent with the surfing people.
I remember Robert Trujillo pointing out the situation, Mike Muir yelling at the security staff, trying to tell him his job and seeing Robert Trujillo giving a bass head punch to him, which made us laugh. They stopped the show for a moment and asked the security guy to leave. I can't remember if the show started again with or without the staff security.
What a souvenir ! 😁
About 10 years ago I went on a music festival and I was so unhappy with the security.
For example they pushed back crowd surfers into the crowd. Where I was standing, we were almost only women, happy that we could get the (sometimes heavy) crowd surfers to the front only to then have them being pushed back down on us. Other surfers were handled unnesseccary rough. And you could kinda sense a racist behavoir there.
Another thing was that the camp site security ignored complaints about people "playing" with fire and grill lighter / spiritus. Of course that situation escaletd and a girl (not even involved) had to be flown to the hospital with severe burns.
I was so unhappy with the security that I avoided that festival for years! Even though my friends always asked me to join.
Only when I learned that some years ago they completely changed out the security people / provider I went to the festival again and it was great ever since!
Security staff is such an important thing. Those people are there to make others feel safe, not threatened / in danger...
Was at an Atilla show years back in Milwaukee where at an incredibly small show security was being rough with fans (apparently punching a fan) to the point that the guitarist while playing kicked the security guard, and they proceeded to PULL THE GUITARIST off the stage and the band and security got in a fight
I have never seen that venue have an artist like Atilla there, and I haven't heard about them having one since. Certain venues are just not suited for metal bands and it's best for all that they realize that.
In my hometown of Huntsville Alabama we used to have a large concert festival called the Big Spring Jam. The police presence was always a bit much. They had a large amount of undercover narcotics agents who would target minors. One of them tried to sell me weed when I was 17, & I looked really super young back then too. Things like that are absolutely unacceptable. Needless to say there were multiple lawsuits against the police department & city, which is one of the reasons that the festival no longer exists.
I personally have been very lucky to have never experienced bad security myself but I've heard a lot of horror stories from friends that go to shows and bands that play shows.
I usually go to really small shows where there isn't a barrier, the only time you see the security is at the entrance and the fate of crowd surfers is in the hands of the front row and a backline tech. But for bigger bands I'm now familiar with the larger venues around so if they play venues where I know security is good that is definitely a plus. I've also talked to a lot of security guys before shows since I live in the sticks so the few train connections to the bigger cities usually don't arrive right before doors and I think it humanises the crowd to security guards also you can see how they are so like when they're cool and joking around and that means you'll have a good time, when they're aggressive even when talking you know to better stay away from them
dingbatz in north jersey, i was doing photo for counterparts there years ago and they quite literally cut the audio from stage and voice of godded over the PA that if people kept moshing theyd throw everyone out. Then proceeded to argue with Brendan (counterparts front man) about it over the PA. Most unprofessional thing ive ever seen on a venues part. They also repeatedly kicked people out for literally moving any more then staring and slowly head nodding. If you moved at all more then that a security guard would evil eye you the rest of the song. It was insane.
Tank, just wanted to say I love your content. I've been in (local) bands and worked at venues most of my life and your perspective and knowledge is very refreshing and interesting. Keep up the great work. Subscribed.
About two months ago I saw Gojira and Mastodon in Syracuse NY, I have NEVER seen security act this way before. They surrounded the pit, creating a wall of bodies where no one could get out. I enjoy being in the pit, but sometimes I gotta take a break, I tried to get out and they pushed my back so hard my neck hurt, I smashed my face into someone's back. They made it almost impossible to get out, trying to get to the edge to stand and take a breath, they would SHOVE you back in. I saw so many people get pushed so hard they fell to the floor, smashed their noses, fell and hit their heads on the floor. These security guards were BRUTAL. My partner tried to make it back to me out of the pit and was shoved in, ripping my clothes and causing them a bloody cut lip. I was just so scared and shocked watching all of this. The pit essentially became a playground for the biggest guys in the venue to shove each other as hard as they possibly could. It was awful, absolutely awful, there was no feeling of safety, no feeling of solidarity, just pure brutal attacks. I've been to hundreds of metal shows and now I really don't think I'll ever go to another metal show at that venue again.
There’s this rock/metal festival by my house and they have a very weird setup. It’s the one Ronnie Radke was bitching about last year. All they have up front for about 300ft is permanent seats with a tiny standing area in front of that then behind that they have reserved lawn chairs. It’s out in rural Wisconsin so even the people out in the field are just chilling in lawn chairs. Which is weird as well. They have side stages that’s standing room only and security will rough up the fans to stop moshing. I saw jinjer there the one year and a pit broke out right in front of me and all of a sudden I get slammed from the side and I looked and this security guy was forcefully bulldozing his way through the crowd. And I looked and there were 4 security people standing in the pit throwing people into the edge of the pit and throwing them down on the ground to stop moshing. It was ridiculous! I don’t go there anymore. I saw beartooth on their most recent tour and during invent animate they told everyone to crowd surf so of course there were a shit ton of crowd surfers and so I got set down and I look and this security guy has this guy in a bear hug and is forcefully shoving him so I looked down and the crowd surfer lost his hat and was trying to grab it and I could hear him yelling my hat and the security guy was forcefully trying to push him away so I reached down real quick and grabbed his hat. I can partially understand why the security guy was like that because stress was high because there were so many crowd surfers. Plus I’ve been to that venue a few times and security has always been cool