"Tali is so cute. You're all she talks about in that sweet rainbows and butterflys kind of way. She loves you Shepard. Be good to her." I love that line from Kasumi, one of my favourites in the trilogy by far.
It’s that line that set me on the path to falling in love with tali, if not for that line id never had known she liked me and i never would have thought about her that way so thanks kasumi
@@TheotherTempestfox they basically made it known with mass effect 4 that laira is canon romance so tali and garrus is also canon. I find it cute my 3 best friends got a decent happy ending.
Rules of Mass effect. 1. Save David Archer or you are a monster. 2. Hug Tali for all she's worth cause she is the best girl ever and those hips don't lie.
@@9manny99 I actually liked reading that stat. It told me that many of the new players actually experienced the game on their terms instead of minmaxing it with guides. Getting the quarians and the geth while playing blind and probably going paragade isn’t all that easy.
I don't think I can romance her anymore... Tali is best girl. However, that line literally killed what was left of my soul. I don't know if I can handle hearing that line again.
@@spookymacchiato5503 Just don't bring her along for the final push to the beam. Bring Javik or James or someone who is objectively less soul crushing with the final line delivery.
Yo I'm kinda sad I didn't see that part and a fair bit of talis dialogue cuz I was so scared to death of her dying somehow by story shit I basically never took her on dangerous missions🤣
Considering the fact she was there for you from the beginning. She is the best girl. She was even down for you when you even had to work with cerberus. Tali is my dream ride or die bae. DX
Tali in ME- when i help my race, i will instant help you! Liara in ME 2 - DONT CARE. IM NOW AVANGER. IF YOU WANT ME BUY DLC BIT>CH... Ash - YOU ARE EVIL NOW... Shepard - ... TALI >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest
You know, between the fact that Tali specifically gets Turians alcohol, the way its 300 years on the flotilla with limited resources, combined with how weak quarian immune systems are, it's possible that quarian culture hasn't really had easy access to alcohol in centuries, so it's a very real possibility that nobody in several generations have had any real exposure to alcohol. In conclusion, Tali is almost certainly a lightweight, and probably got super drunk on the turian equivalent of half a glass of wine
I think it's a priority system. I know that Wrex always advocates abandoning the Council, and Liara always advocates saving them, so Tali's position would depend on the other squadmate. (My hunch is that she's more renegade than Kaidan only)
Gollum'Zorah: "We should holds back the fleetses, Precious! What did the Ascension ever do for us?" Smeagol'Zorah: "But the Ascension is our friend!" Gollum'Zorah: "We don't have any friends." Smeagol'Zorah: "Not listening. Not listening!"
@raylast3873 I have an addendum: you can push Kaidan to be so Renegade that WREX of all people has to defend the Council's lives from his Imperium-level pragmatism.
I always loved that non-verbal cue on Rannoch. Tali (looking over the horizon): "It's beautiful isn't it?" Shepard (never taking eyes off Tali): "It is"
@@ktfcrusader1952 Laughs in clunky PC Mods. Personally I wish they did what they did in ME3. Some characters are Bi some are straight and others like Sam and Kelly. Be free but that also means some characters are locked out and that’s okay. Don’t need to feel like the Dragon Born who is invited to every group.
@@9manny99 I mean, technically they did... It's just that Liara is the only "bi" in ME1. Only put that in quotes because it's more to do with how Asari culture and biology work than sexual preference in the way we understand/view it. ... I do wish though that more characters were romanceable from either Fem/Male Shep in all 3 games, though. I don't see why they aren't, since it's really only a couple characters who's personalities/beliefs are laid out to be particularly socially conservative, so it really wouldn't be stepping on any of the writing/character development to do so.
Yeah, I didn’t actually have any interest in liara or Ashley as I already liked Tali loads more then them. Imagine my surprise when I finally got to romance her in two
@@jfelton3583 I hate how ME3 punishes you for not playing ME2. So many players killed the Quarian’s because they had no alternatives. The reapers are killing harvesting so many worlds and this is how they act.
Han'Gerrel was the real problem when we had to decide between the Quarians or the Geth. He was the one who, unreasonably, started the invasion on the Geth and he was the only one who still wanted to fight when Tali told him to back off. That being said, though, I didn't like that Tali didn't even try to talk Gerrel out of it. Bioware forced the "Hero of the Day" role on Shepard a bit too strongly there, imo. Anyway, Gerrel should have been demoted back when he opened fire on the Geth Dreadnought even though Shepard and Tali( another ADMIRAL) were still on the ship, despite the other admirals telling him not to. If it weren't for him, it would have not come this far.
I agree with Gerral needing to be punished for nearly killing Tali and Shepard in ME3 - but as Tali stated earlier, public disagreements between the quarian's leadership would divide the fleet. the renegade interrupt was enough for me lmao ( I AM NOW KICKING MYSELF FOR NOT INCLUDING THE INTERRUPT IN THE VIDEO HOW THE HELL DID I FORGET THAT?!!!)
It's weird because mass effect 2 seemed to try and promote him as the good admiral. When the admiral who wanted peace with geth (I can't remember his name) was eager to continue the trail before tali could return it was Gerral who was upset and fought against it. In me2 he was presented as the decent admiral vs the psychotic dr Frankenstein, father of the year, or a treacherous idealist. In me3, he is the dogmatic war hawk who cares only about crushing the geth. I'm not saying the transition doesn't make sense, but I noticed the change in direction.
@@JP-rf8rr Agreed! Gerrel was definitely redesigned to be hated by the so the player has more reason to be sceptical about Quarians. I think that counts for Xen as well. She was at least a very intelligent person in ME2, despite her extremes when it comes to Geth. But in ME3 she was constantly on her psychopath trip. One should remember that the Quarian admirals are the ones who give the Quarian people their faces. While Tali and Koris give them a good name, Gerrel and Xen sour them. I assume the reason they did that was to equalize the odds when it comes to choosing between the Quarians and the Geth, in case you can't choose the peace option. Because a lot of people would assume that many Quarians are just like Gerrel or Xen. But I don't think it's equal at all because the Geth, through Legion, are constantly written as good and likable guys and there aren't any Geth that would be make the player doubt their species. To their mind, all Geth are like Legion so obviously the odds are not equal. Generally, it felt like Bioware was pushing the idea of accepting AIs as a true life form a lot and barely gave the player a choice about that.
@@tyrayentali7041 Not really though. Legion himself said that geth arent really that great. Shepard:How did we get to this....the geth are better than this! Legion:No....based on history,they are not. They werent actually pushing it,they made it as gray as possible.
@@aleksamilosevic8792 That was hardly the same as how much the Quarians have been villainized. Especially because Legion was already so likable that the player would just instantly forgive him, also because of his "emotional" reaction to it made him look "adorable" and "innocent". Meanwhile the Quarian leaders were dumbed down in ME3 to only ever show their worst character traits and annoy the player. It's not difficult to see which side will be judged harder for their shortcomings.
Just putting this out there, Shepard gives her an entire home planet. Beats hell out of a ring. Seriously, dude solos a reaper on foot for her. I'm just surprised she doesn't rip his armor off right then and there.
It's ironic since I tend to go for women like Tali IRL. But I can't ever bring myself to romance her. There's too much of a little sister vibe given the circumstances of you meeting her on her adulthood rite of passage.
@@chainsawsubtlety9828 for male shep I agree (can't discount best boy Garrus) I'm partial to Jack's romance personally. It's something more....mature which fits Shepard's age and experience I feel. But obviously the drawback with the ME2 romances is the characters are less present in the finale.
I love how when Tali says," It's beautiful, though, isn't it?" And Shepard replies that it is, he's looking at her. Bioware really wanted the players to fall in love with Liara, but for whatever reason, I never felt the connection to Liara or anyone else that I felt to Tali and Garrus.
tali and garrus form a actual companionship with shepherd like there people you want to just hang out with for fun Liara not so much she is more a close work friend
@@yami122 Not really. It's obvious the romantic choice is Liara from Game one. It fits with this game aesthetics. She even is more forward with you in the first game and you in ME2 you as a player wonder why she is so cold if you pursue a romantic relationship with her. By Mass effect 3 I noticed it every time they are in a scene together that their clearly was to be more to it. To be clear I go for Tali or Garrus every time as romantic choices. They are both more interesting to me.
I think Liara loves Shepard no matter Shepard's feelings, but Bioware wasn't great at handling the romance portion in the first game; none of the romance options felt very natural to me, and this may be because they were still finding their sea legs. Jennifer Hale once mentioned how even for voice acting, it was different with the first ME game; less organic, more "get the lines across as clear as possible" instead of infusing acting and nuance, so everything felt more speech-like. A lot of people felt that the romances in the first game were less convincing across the board compared to ME2. In a way I think Bioware did both Garrus and Tali a favor when they waited until the second game to make them romance-able. I felt closer to Liara in ME2, ironically, due to the voice-acting approach and the writing style, but by then I had dismissed her as an option for all of ME1 and that was one reason I still regarded Liara as just a good asari friend. Furthermore, I think there really is that element where we tend to yearn for things that are harder to get. Liara was kind of too easy, as she loves you no matter what. There was even some dialogue in ME1 where if you romanced Ashley or Kaidan, you're asked if you knew that Liara had feelings for you too. I didn't interpret this as the writers necessarily wanting me to go with her as much as them trying to create a character that fell in love with you first, rather than a reactionary character that only loves you if you proceed with the romance dialogue. Still, as a consequence, Liara's love almost didn't have as much value because of how unconditional it was; you don't have to earn it, and so you appreciate her less as a person. Tali and Garrus would hook up with each other if you don't romance either of them, suggesting that they didn't really need you by default. You have to put in the effort to win their hearts, and even if it's not to the point of slaving away for them, that still makes them feel like they have more inherent value as people.
Just imagine if we had gotten an Epilogue/timeskip after the game where, depending on your choices, you experienced a "Earned your happy ending" moment with an older Shepherd & a now maskless Tali living on a now livable Rannoch with a kid of their own & the last scene is of the two of them sitting by the cliff, Tali's head on Shepherd's shoulder, watching the sunset before the screen fade to black
While it is definitely unfortunate that the devs went with a "bittersweet endings for tragic tales" approach (whether for time constraint, rushed development/publisher pressure, or simply choice of writing reasons), I am probably one of the few people that feel I can both understand and appreciate the story ending in this way. From a purely story-based perspective, having the ability to achieve a perfect happy ending would cheapen the conflict you spent hours struggling against in gameplay (years in in-universe time), and retroactively lessen the emotional impact of the story and it's conclusion. Yes, you spent countless hours and made countless decisions as a player that you might feel SHOULD make an impact on the ending of your story, but the sheer scale of the conflict you are engaged in really prevents that from making sense (again) from a purely story based perspective... You're fighting a war at the scale of an entire galaxy, so while the decisions you make along the way make an impact and ultimately you can convince the people of that galaxy to come together to prevent the worst, the decisions of a single man can't logically/realistically guarantee his perfect conclusion, especially when he goes out of his way to put himself at the tip of the spear. Doubly so when, again, the raw scale of the conflict (in universe) is considered. For the writing to make sense as the ending of a story, --this story--, a final sacrifice has to be made for the tragedy to conclude. The only thing that is truly regrettable in all of this is how anti-climatic Shepard's final moments come across the the player due to either the rush to finish the game, or a lack of experience of the writer's team in how to craft a climax for not just a single game, but the story of an entire series. Had more emotion been able to be conveyed in these final moments (everything after Shepard goes into the beam), had there been more of a feeling of weight, and sacrifice conveyed to the player... a more appropriate mixture of the swirling, conflicting feelings of both relief for the end of the tragedy, and the regret and hopelessness of knowing no perfect ending lies in front of you, the feelings that Shepard's character MUST have felt, that any hero would feel if placed in these circumstances, I doubt there would have been nearly as much backlash (if any) to the ending of this tale. But again, regrettably, after the final scene with your chosen partner, all of the emotion of this story fades away from the writing, and we (as the player) are left feeling ultimately robbed of the final emotional climax and conclusion we were all undoubtedly expecting. Instead replaced by a superficial choice between three (four) conclusions which when presented together hold no weight as an actual choice... Perhaps it would have been better if this choice was not presented and instead you were simply and suddenly confronted with the repercussions of the totality of your actions/choices leading into this scene and throughout the series, them being calculated and represented to you to produce an ending, even one of these which is already in the game, would have been superior in emotional payoff. Alas, I suppose we can only be left to imagine... ... Unless some absolute mad lad mods this into the game, that is.
@@CurtDegree I disagree with your original statement, there 100% should be an ending where Shepard lives. Now please do not think I’m trying to be mean or anything, I’m merely saying I disagree and here is why. You mention that having a perfect and happy ending would cheapen the conflict, I have to disagree. With ALL the shit Shepard has gone through, I think he could do it. BUT, I would say you’d need to really, REALLY work for it. Because yes, as you mentioned, this is literally a galactic threat of unbelievable proportions. You should choose a route to go, either full paragon or full renegade which once you do absolutely EVERYTHING in every game, you must complete them and have the best possible outcome for them. Between that and the fleet strength at the end of 3 being as high as it can go, you could choose a certain pathway that will allow Shepard to win and survive. I personally do not believe one ending like that where you work hard enough to achieve it would be a detriment in any way. But that is my opinion, and I respect yours.
@@realsupercobble idk why i keep finding this comments that even now, so many years later, dont know that SHEPARD CAN SURVIVE ME3 SINCE VANILLA. pick survivor background (may or may not be needed) make sure galactic readiness is at max, chose destroy ending. done, shepard is alive
1:06:28 Legion's final moment is one of the best scenes in the series. And when you contrast it with the reconstructed Legion, you see just how much he learned from his time on the Normandy. Not-Legion's dialogue when he attacks Shepard at this stage is full of venom and hatred for organics, saying he was right not to trust you. And Tali will bitterly spit that the real Legion would have understood. And I think he did. While Legion's actions remain the same as his VI reconstruction, his dialogue is very different. He doesn't blame organics, or say that he was wrong to trust you. He just wants to know, at the end, if he was a person. He did understand their decision, even if he couldn't accept it. Because Legion cared for Tali, and the Normandy crew, and the other organics he met on his journey. He knows why you'd pick them over his people because he saw it for himself.
Only the coolest person could ever claim that Chrisjen Avaserala is their aunt. Also as much as I usually always go for paragon runs, I can never resist using the renegade persuade option in Talis loyalty mission. Because "it's fun watching you shout down the admiralty board." I also think Tali has some of the most rewarding and quality writing around her. "I got better. I got you."
Totally agree with this. I like to at the very least take the "you spring this on her in the middle of a damn trial?!" option after they tell her about her father. Cuz thats my girl. You don't mess with my girl. 😆
There's something i want to say about Shepard relationship with Tali. I'm not sure if you can feel the same thing if you romanced someone else. I feel like during the whole trilogy Shepard always was doing things for the others, never for himself (the only exception might be if you played the whole renegade, but who the hell would cared about that kind of person anyway). Everything he did during the trilogy was to help the others, even the random people he could find on the Citadel. You can clearly see that all of your crew mates got their own personal problems, and Shepard are always willing to help them. However, have you caught that he actually never did anything for himself? I think for both of them their relationship is something far more important than everything they experienced. For Tali, because she's quarian, and quarians are basically the most vulnerable to racism of all of the species. She can even tell you that before she met Shepard, she was injured and when she went to the Turian council ask for help, he threw her out and called her "a rat in the suit". Also, because of quarians weak immune system they have a huge problem to get into relationships with their own species, don't even talking about the other ones. For Shepard that never was a problem. He just felt in love with her personality. He put her own personality over knowing how even her face might looks like. However, he would never put her health over his desires. The fact that she decided to take off her mask before him, risking her life, is probably one of the biggest gestures of trust you can possible imagine. For Shepard. I feel like for him Tali was something more than just a partner. He finally found his own reason to fight. Like i said, before their romance, everything he ever did was for someone else. He didn't have his own purpose in this war. Until he fell in love with Tali. She's his home. Just like Shepard is Tali home. He can finally fight with mind in the back of his head that when all of this will be over, he would be able to go back to her, move out to Rannoch, build her a house and just enjoy his life with a woman he love. He finally have a personal purpose to fight. He knows, that if he survived, he will not be alone when probably everybody will go back to their own planets to help rebuild them. I had that feeling that Shepard was so lonely before he met Tali again in ME2, and she's the only reason why he can keep his mental health steady.
slight correction; she did not went to the turian councilor, she went to the ambassador and talk to the turian clerk. that aside great analysis! p/s: If she went to the councilor she would have been dismissed like the reaper 😂
When Tali apologizes for her emotions upon finding her father dead, I think she might not actually be apologizing for her emotions. It always came off to me as her apologizing for her father's recklessness. She believed that he was a good man her whole life, idolized him, almost worshiped him to a point where, when all the evidence started pointing towards him making stupid mistakes that cost the crew their lives, which also put her in this ridiculous position and made Shepard witness this ugly side of her people, she still believed that he wasn't capable of any of this, that it must have been some sort of mistake, and that he surely must still be alive. I think that's what she was apologizing for. Apologizing for blindly believing in her father. For not seeing through any of this earlier. Because he claims he did all of this for her sake, and he says as much. She feels responsible for all of this because I feel that in her reasoning, she somehow thinks she enabled her father's actions by sending all the parts to him, for never questioning why he needs so many and what he does with them. She apologizes for being naive and gullible. She refused to see things for what they are and refused to accept the truth. She put Shepard in danger by dragging him along to the research vessel, and there were geth there. Geth that have killed quarians. Geth there would be less of if she hadn't sent the parts back to her father. Less quarians may have died if she hadn't sent those parts. Her father may have still lived. And she is sorry still because even after all of that, after the sickening betrayal she suffered at the hands of her father, she still finds the compassion in her to preserve his name and his memory, even at the risk of her own exile. That's who Tali is and that's who she always will be. A trusting, even naive, girl who strives to find and see the best in others. To always give them a chance, whether those people are arrogant, human, a turian who treated her like garbage during her pilgrimage, geth, the illusive man who runs a terrorist organization, or even a war criminal. She may be neutral in her stances and flipflops on her decisions, but deep down she is the embodiment of a realist with ideals, the exact way I happen to play this game every time. Extract the most good out of everyone around you, even against their own will, good or otherwise. Give them every chance to do the right thing, but still smite the shit out of them if they refuse your good will in the end. And if you need to make a tough decision that has no good outcome, be a pragmatist who chooses the greater good, even at the cost of innocent lives. I think that's how the game wishes everyone played it, because it seems to support those kinds of decisions the most and reward them the most. And it just so happens that Tali, while young and impressionable, witnesses you have this attitude, and it is only natural that she sees the value in it, and later assumes a similar position herself. I too, am naive like Tali. I too choose to believe in the good in people and give them the chance to show it. And I often pay for it by being tricked and taken advantage of. But it takes strength to be vulnerable for the sake of others. It takes courage to believe in people while fully expecting them to betray you. Even still, a true paragon is willing to make those stupid decisions because they are strong enough to take the hits that go with them. "Sure, I'll believe you. I'll give you a chance. I'll show you weakness and allow you to potentially exploit it if you choose to betray me, because I know that I am strong enough to beat you even with that handicap. Stab me in the back all you want, I'll just turn around and stab you in the face instead." That's the attitude that gets things done. You have to give people a chance to be good, but that also has a price, and you're the one footing the bill. For them. That is what it takes to consider peace between the quarians and the geth. Without this attitude, you have endless war and destruction. And it's not just them. Turians, Salarians, and Krogan too. This is the attitude that is required to save the galaxy from the reapers and retain your humanity. Wrex would kill the reapers himself and wouldn't bother asking for help. Garrus would die fighting them, sacrificing everything to avenge as many as he can. In that way he isn't much different from Javik, but perhaps only a bit more hopeful. Liara would gather all information available and hide it out as a backup plan for the next cycle to have a chance. I don't know about Kaidan and Ashley. They would just accept their fate I think? But Tali? Tali would get shit done. Not because of her strength, skill or intelligence, but because she has hope. And she has that hope because she is a hopeless idealist. She dreams of a happy ending knowing full well its implausibility. Because in order to save the galaxy, every living being MUST be the better person and do the right thing. The literal best case scenario is required. A person simply has to first even see that such a scenario exists and believe in it. And she may not have what it takes to put it all together herself, but neither does Shepard. It definitely takes more than one person to unite the galaxy, but it also takes an idealist to do it. Both Shepard and Tali are those idealists. Gullible, naive, and willing to give even the worst of the worst a chance to do the right thing, against their better judgment and all the evidence to the contrary. Running on nothing but hope, blind faith, and friendship. Uniting the galaxy with all the wrath and terror of hugs and handshakes, and an occasional gut punch to a foolhardy quarian admiral. In a way, your crew attempts to emulate you in their own way. Garrus channels Shepard's pragmatism and efficiency. Wrex and Grunt channel his ruthlessness and courage. Kaidan and Ashley channel his leadership and command. Liara channels his cunning Tali channels his compassion. She takes the good in Shepard, potentially, his most powerful tool. Though she always had that in her. Her time on the Normandy simply taught her how to use it.
This man's out here casually writing better character analysis in a UA-cam comment than GameInformer, IGN and Co. have put to the page in the 8+ years since this series concluded.
She god damned better be alive in ME4 and not force us to be stuck with the blue parasitic sex squid. If they leave only Liara alive that makes it so that the only way to get the complex story interactions with the romanced character in ME4, it would absolutely butcher player agency and also Tali is way to fucking adorable to not include.
@@atashgallagher5139 This is what I think will happen, and it is between 2 options: The first and most viable option (for me to leave the fans pleased) is that they do it as with Andromeda that is to say that it is many years later, there the reason that only see Liara, why do you wonder? because it is much easier for a script to build a new base taking into account a mass effect much later, so that it is even easier to bypass all the choices of the players during the original trilogy. An example would easily be bringing in a new threat that was out of the galaxy making the three decisions of destroy, synthesis and control have no impact. It is for me the easiest way and with more possibilities to create new stories The second is almost an immediate continuation of a couple of years at most, but this would have a couple of problems, the first and most important would be to return to canon events of the original trilogy and completely breaking with the idea that decisions mattered, since With this option, I would make both the first and the second not matter; Unless they use the same save game method from 1 to 2 to 3 to count the decisions, but that could make them make the decision to officially make the final destroy the canon because it is the easiest to continue already. that between the 3 endings could not be taken as canon since they are very different between them and making a continuation for the 3 endings is impossible, unless they do something extreme and make a different game for each end (which I think would be the most epic and great what they could do) but it would be very expensive and not to mention that we are talking about EA. I think that will happen, so I am almost sure not to anger the mass effect fanbase and respect their decisions in the original trilogy as something important I do not think it is a direct continuation in terms of the end of years. So even if I would like to see tali again, I doubt that for this mass effect she is still alive
If, like me, you had a controller that sometimes decided not to listen to my frantic clicking on the paragon prompt, Tali's full quote over her father's body ends with her sobbing "You wouldn't leave me to clean up your mess!" And your companion actually comments on your failure to hug her. I, of course, immediately restarted the mission to make sure I got that prompt.
The other party member should have hugged her. (Maybe except Morinth.) All with the unspoken acceptance that whoever isn't hugging is watching for evil robots.
I think you did a great job! One thing you didn’t discuss in relation to Tali and her father though: In Mass Effect 1, you can ask Tali about her mother. She explains that a sickness went through the ship, and she died from exposure to it. While tali doesn’t open up much about it made her feel, she says her father buried himself in work after it to deal with his grief. It’s another layer of his (poorly shown) affection for tali. He couldn’t do anything to keep her mother alive. But now he’ll do everything in his power to win her home world back. It’s a misguided ideology and a tragic one, but it’s poignant for his character I think.
I feel like a big indicator of Tali's growth was after Ranmoch, on the citadel, where she was helping the turian who preME1 called her suit rat and threatened to have her thrown off the station. It might be passed off as a throw away scene that lasts less than a minute but it spoke volumes of the amount of influence Shepard had on her throughout the trilogy.
The good bye scene in ME3 with Tali ripped my heart out, crushed it into paste and blasted into oblivion. Masterfully done and deep emotions though out the whole series
I actually prefer Rallying the Crowd to the Paragon/Renegade options in Tali’s loyalty mission, mostly because of Kal Reegar and Veetor standing up for Tali.
I always love imagining what is going on in Tali's head while she's talking to Shepard after the Trial. Shepard is literally the only person in the Galaxy she would trust and who has always been there for her, and she's standing in front of him, nervously blathering out things she didn't intend to. But then Shepard keeps going along with it, and so it's probably sending her to even higher levels of panic and nervousness as she keeps walking, in her mind, a razor-thin line with the only person she would _never, ever_ want to mess anything up with, and it just keeps getting her more and more in deep. I imagine her taking more than a couple shots with a shaky hand afterwards, overwhelmed with relief that he literally reciprocated everything she said when she expected absolutely none of that. _BUT THEN AFTERWARDS SHE REMEMBERS SHE'S ACTUALLY GOING TO DO STUFF WITH HIM THAT WASN'T JUST AN EMPTY CONVERSATION SHE ACTUALLY GOT IN WITH SHEPARD _*_AND OH FUCK OH SHIT_*
Even better when you realise that Tali in particular is a massive, raging xenophile. Thane had a drell wife. Garrus makes moves on female turians. Asari don't count, they can reproduce that way so it's not a fetish. Tali never once makes a move on another quarian, or even an asari. It's all Fleet and Flotilla and Human Mating Guides with her. Tali considers Shepard to be "dashing" BECAUSE he's not a quarian, and is aware of how strange she is. Then Shepard is at the very minimum okay with such a relationship.
"Or I take off this mask, and breathe germs all over your nice clean ship." That is one of my top three lines in the whole series. Cracks me up every time.
Tali: Come back to me. Me: Red ending it is then... I hate bioware for doing this. The endings in general are a disaster, but given that geth and quarian story arc and Tali's arc are the arcs most impacted by the ending, there is no win here. No good end here. You set back the quarian people centuries by destroying the geth... or you don't grant her wish. I always pick the red ending because it is the only one where you live. I didn't spend hundreds of hours of gameplay and years of my childhood and growing up into an adult playing across all 3 games to settle for a glorious death. No death is glorious. Nothing in the galaxy is worth you giving up your own life for. But the price is so high. Too high. I know people are sick of cliche happy endings, but for fuck's sake, if I put so much time and effort into a series, by god I fucking demand a happy ending. Fuck reason and consequences. I did not bust my ass shouting at everyone in the galaxy to stop fighting and help me to NOT walk away with a win.
@@robertharris6092 that's your headcanon, just like it's headcanon that control ending preserves you and let's you inhabit a robot or something and go do whatever. Red ending by game canon shows you a scene at the end where you live. I don't need or want your own take on the endings. I'm going off what the game says here.
I think you forget they could easily reactivate the Geth. As far as we can tell, the Reapers (and by extension the rest of synthetic life) were put in more of a stasis rather than deletion. Plus, knowing the Geth I’d assume they saw the use of the Crucible to destroy the reapers as a possible threat to themselves, and likely prepared accordingly.
@@Mike23443 technically it isn’t head canon. The kid (I can’t believe I’m actually using his statements) we talk to at the end of ME3 tells us that we can destroy much of the technology we currently have, but it would also be easy to repair afterwards. It also mentions that it would wipe out synthetic life. Going off of that, it’d be easy to reactivate the Geth, although they would be the same as they were when 01 was created. The Geth would probably find it easy to rediscover what upgrades the Reapers gave them, although what’d happen afterwards is a whole other question.
It's possibly one of the most painful deaths in a Game I've ever known. At the very least when he sacrificed himself in the Quarian - Geth alliance ending that pain could be tempered with pride in what he achieved
Oh dang. I've always wanted character analysis videos of this depth and length on Mass Effect characters! As someone who just stumbled into this video by accident, it's hard for me to truly appreciate the time, effort, determination, and energy that went into this. All I can say is thank you for making this!
That's the part that's REALLY funny to me. They have the exact same character arcs - the difference Ashley able to move on from her father's death as she already 'in exile;.
Another great video essay, well done! For me, Tali has the best voice acting I have ever experienced in a game. Plus she has some of the best dialogue/lines that are absolute gut punches if she is the romantic interest. The way she says at the end "I want more time" with the raw emotion is just so true, and it's just delivered in such a way that you have to be a sociopath not to feel anything. But it's when she's wounded and being evacuated and she's begging for Shepard not to go, "I have a home"... that is devastating. Quite honestly it's perfect. In that one line she's shown how much her heart is breaking and the impact that has on us, the gamer, is probably profound for most of us. Never before have I felt so moved by ingame dialogue which means the writer & the voice actor did something amazing. It's the perfect example of brevity, less being more to achieve the greatest emotional impact. It's utterly bittersweet, beautiful and believable. I watch many films and TV shows and I am struggling to find any that have this level of emotional impact. That's just how good this is.
When I first played ME2 I turned in the evidence of her father's crime, thinking it was the right thing to do. She was the only squadmate on that save for whom I didn't earn their loyalty. And also the only squadmate I lost on the suicide mission. I was absolutely devastated at the time, it felt like judgment had thrown it's hammer in defiance of my sense of justice. But I will right that wrong in the Legendary Edition, I owe Tali that much.
Awesome video dude. Tali is the best character in mass effect bar none and one of the best written characters in and medium out there. Bravo to everyone involved
In real life, it would be the best thing to do and Tali should realise that too. In a videogame, you need that Tali_Is_Loyal boolean. It's one of the most important flags.
I do not care how much of a Renegade your, or anyone else's Shepard is - when the Paragon prompt to hug her appears, you will hit that prompt and give her a hug!
I just recently went through the Legendary Edition, and it was the first time I've played Mass Effect since the 2010s. I never knew you could romance Tali, and I always had my little fireteam composition be Garrus and Tali. When it came to the final push, seeing my ride or die, Garrus motherfucking Vakarian, and the best Space Gypsy, Tali'Zorah, getting evac'd by the Normandy kinda hurt. I defeated Saren and the Proto-Reaper with them, stopped Project Overlord with them, and discovered the Leviathan with her and Javik. Tali will probably always be my squadmate in whatever playthrough I do (even any renegade playthroughs I'd still gain her loyalty and hug her on the Alerai), simply because she's one of the best characters I've played with in all the games I've played.
I'm not much of a crier. I get emotional, but it's very rare for actual tears to flow . . . I dead ass sobbed from the moment Tali said "I have a home" until like an hour after I finished the rest of the game . . . I just couldn't help it . . . The voice acting, the weight, the way Tali connects with you. It's just perfect . . . Thanks Tali . . . *cries more
Amazing analysis! Tali is the most grounded and relatable character in the entire series. She is so absurdly well written, masterfully voiced by Liz, and has the most satisfying character arc and development. She became my favorite character right off the bat in the first game, and I was really sad she couldn't be romanced there; on the other hand, this was for the better, as it gave her character time to mature and watch Shepard from afar, slowly becoming infatuated by him, eventually falling in love. *SHE IS WAY TOO PRECIOUS GODDAMNIT.* I think my biggest peeve with Tali is how she progressively takes longer to recruit in each game. In Mass Effect 2 she only becomes available after completing three dossiers, while in Mass Effect 3 she is the very last character to join the squad.
I know this video is 4 months old just saw it for the first time. She's is almost perfect in my book. Great content great work agreed with everything you said. Especially the part about the hug. Take care and stay safe.
To be honest when I first came across this channel I didn't give you the time of day, I thought it was a joke, and would say as much. But after seeing this video and saw just how thought-provoking, well written, and passionate it was, I can safely say you are among the best essayist youtubers I've seen. You are exceptional at storytelling and delivering concise yet uniquely informative dictation. Also, the moments of levity are well timed and welcomed when things can get emotionally heavy. I was hooked from beginning to end. I am now looking forward to, and dare i say excited to watching your other videos. I was wrong about you, and I'm sorry.
I love this video, this was perfect in every way possible. I love Tali with all my heart and I really enjoyed the lessons you presented when learning about Tali. Great job and keep up the good work. Hope to see more Mass Effect Content when the remastered version comes out.
I'm surprised you skipped over her "Thank you... Captain" line. THIS is the moment Tali realizes who is truly looking out for her best interests, even if she still puts the fleet ahead of herself. I don't know. To me, this is the hardest hitting line of her loyalty mission. Captain isn't just some rank to quarians. It's a symbol of something greater. They put great expectation on captains. It's one of the first things that's discussed after boarding the Rayya. So her calling you "Captain" in the end....significant symbolism there.
@@XBadgerKnightX maybe I just missed it. Unless you absolutely know you omitted it. But it speaks out to me so much I figured I'd have noticed if it was there or not.
I also only ever pick the destroy ending. The reasons are: 1) control is a fallacy and is what started the whole cycle of harvest by the reapers in the first place. 2) synthesis is FORCING your will upon a galaxy, changing everyone and everything thing to YOUR wishes, on the advice of a millenia old AI of EXTREMELY suspicious origins. And it is a form, YET AGAIN, of CONTROL. Destroy puts an end to a VERY bad idea and returns the Great Experiment known as Life back on track. Plus, and here's the truly creepy thought, if you choose synthesis that means sentience is given back to EVERYTHING including husks; talk about a living nightmare! Or how's about being a reaper made up of a long dead harvested species and now hey, you get ALLLL that agency back. All those memories. No. Destroy is the MERCIFUL ending to what the Leviathans started.
Please make more videos like this! I love your deep analysis of Mass Effect characters. I've watched this and the Liara video like 10 times each, thank you so much for this contribution to the fandom.
Currently working on an episode involving Garrus. It's a bit hectic after I released a psudo DoC episode looking at Ann Takamaki of Persona 5 fame. Took me most of December to start and the project persisted through the holidays, then into January when I started up school again. I just need to talk about ME3 and Garrus' romance in the video. It should take a another week or two.
The first time I played ME3 I got the bad ending with the Quarians. Immediately after Tali killed herself, I started over with a new game of ME2 to make sure I could make peace with the Geth and the Quarians the next time. I've beaten the entire series more than half a dozen times since then and I've saved them every time.
@ 1:20:10 For my first play-through, Tali really did kill Robo-Saren (Saren has blown his brains out in every playthrough). It's actually a tradition now to take her to the final level and let her take the shot, if possible (in fact, it's always the same two: Garrus and Tali). She did it two more times, and one more was part of a fusillade with me, so it was technically a tie. So when I saw that, It was just perfect. Yeah, I figured this was going to be the dialogue in every case, but here it actually matched what really happened--especially the first play-through. Made the scene feel that much better. (so, for those wondering: first play-through, all my weapons overheated, and I'd just used the adrenaline rush and unity, so they needed to recharge; Saren was down to a sliver of life. Garrus was KO (knocked down almost as soon as he got back up). Thought I was screwed; armor had been shot up, no first aid, and I was wounded; Tali was too. Then I heard a shotgun blast, and Saren dropped dead. Tali had hit him with a Sledgehammer IV round IIRC.).
The "destroy" ending doesn't harm the Quarian at all, we can clearly see them rebuilding their civilization Rannoch, wether you allied with the Geth or not
Amazing video, dude. I wasn't expecting it to be THIS good. Tali is my favorite fictional character of all time and I absolutely love her. 10/10 video.
I'm so glad I found this video. I have always respected the Quarian people because they have always been determined to push forward, to try there hardest to survive even when it felt the universe didn't want them. I have always cared for Tail, but admit I couldn't point it into words why. This video wrapped it all in a bundle. I try not to cry, but so much of this video made me do just that. Furthermore, I appreciate what you did for Tali by making this video. Only thing I didn't like was repeating that damn suicide scene, you bosh'tet. I'd let you be the first to show that scene, because I had been dreading it, but while the first time hit me like a damn Brute, the second time had me sobbing, and the third had me feeling dead inside and wanting to kill something. A lotta something. Altogether, a very good video, and a very good analysis. I applaud you for your work, good sir. I even learned a few things I didn't know. If I ever was sent to another universe and met Tali, I'd be content. May your battles be glorious and your victories bring you honor. Keelah se'lai
Thank you! The next video is going to be covering Garrus and will be made public this week. The next video will either be covering you or Miranda before the legendary edition gets released. Stay tuned!
Next DoC Episode On Garrus Vakarian IS AVAILABLE NOW: ua-cam.com/video/z4mDN1PlboE/v-deo.html *- TIMESTAMPS -* 00:00-4:49: Intro, Ground Rules Shameless Plugs 4:50-11:05: Part 1: Context About Bioware Writing Female Leads 11:06 - 18:16: Part 2: A Caring Commander 18:17- 20:20: Part 3: Tali's Relationship to Normandy's Crew 20:21 - 1:01:08 - Part 4: Duty Vs. Family (Feat. Super Aunt Shala'Raan Vas Tonbay) 1:01:09 - 1:13:59 - Part 5: A Duty That Kills Family 1:14:00 - 1:40:19 - Part 6: Tali'Zorah & Shepard Vas Normandy 1:40:20 - 1:46:19 - Part 7: An End, Once and For All 1:46:20 - 1:48:44 - What Have We Learned? 1:48:45 - 1:51:00: Outro and A Thanks For Watching!
I bought Legendary Edition about 2 months ago. I've been playing nonstop and completed the trilogy 6 times now. I can tell Tali is the best girl just because her personality is great and she's so innocent. After I figured out how to romance people I went for Tali straight away. I've romanced Tali 5 times and Garrus once. And every time in ME3 final push when she says ''I have a home'' I start crying. Perfect game but I hoped that ending would be better for Tali's sake.
@@XBadgerKnightX Will you do an Analysis of (at least) some of the more important companions of ME? (Such as Ashley Wrex and Miranda, As opposed to the less relevant in my mind Jack, Thane and DLC Characters) And maybe even some new companions/updates on Tali & Liara in ME4 when it’s out whenever that is?
@@emperorvader283 I'm already working on a video involving Garrus at the moment, and more videos are planned. I might do a video on Ashley and Miranda in the future depending on how fast I can get that done before the Legendary Edition comes out.
As someone who played Mass Effect 2 and 3 at least 3 times, and just recently romanced Tali, I can officially say that Tali is indeed best girl, and actually shares number one best character spot beside Garrus because I just can't choose between best bro and best girl.
In all of my 10+ playthroughs of the trilogy. I've never even once been forced to choose between the geth and the quarians. Peace has always been an option. Plus, I could never choose the geth over Tali anyways. She's been there by your side since you began the journey. I've always liked Tali's character. She reminds me a lot of myself.
It's been years since I've played through and now I'm going through Legendary Edition without remembering all the correct decisions for the best outcomes. I've already lost Mordin and Zaeed during the suicide mission, and I'm terrified that I made a mistake somewhere and I'll have to choose.
My favorite analysis was the Geth destroying the Quarians and why Tali truly killed herself....not because of Shepard choosing the Geth but because it's true....she couldn't stop the sheer blinding hubris of the Admirals and Quarian leadership because of duty...it's the "Icarus paradox.". The very advantage, confidence, or factor you think supports you ends up being the thing that kills you by in essence your own hand.
XBadgerKnightX: Tali should not be so willing to be a sacrificial lamb, it's her flaw. But getting her there will ruin your chances of romancing her. Me: Guess I'll have to sacrifice our rel... Wait a second.
Thank you sooo much for letting me appreciate the awesome story telling and character building skill of Bioware in ME 1,2,3 again.... until it didn't T.T
It is possible to have Tali exiled, romance her and make peace between Geth and Quarians. You just have to do everything else right. By dumb luck, this happened to me on my first playthrough.
@@m0rtez713 Fair enough, but I call it luck because the whole peace between the Geth and Quarians situation is determined by a hidden reputation check. You need a certain score to pass the check and it’s not paragon or renegade that determine the check but your choices during the Geth/Quarian war that determine the check’s outcome. Tali being exiled in the biggest penalty to this check. A new player wouldn’t know about this hidden check which is why I call it luck.
@Jesup1204 There are three components. You need to have done several essential things and have enough peace points to unlock the Charm/Intimidate options, and you need enough charisma to Charm/Intimidate. Tali not being an admiral is a point loss, but not a dealbreaker if you destroyed the heretics.
First off this is a great analysis of a fantastic character. Second I feel like I gotta mention now how I was listening to this while on a drive back home from a trip...so you making that car crash analogy may have hit quite hard at that point, lol
Now obviously if there's a "most essential paragon interrupt" regardless of how renegade you are, there definitely is a most essential renegade interrupt regardless of how paragon you are. So shove that eclipse asshat in Thane's recruit mission out the 150th story window and ask "how about goodbye?"
I think not hugging tali is against the Geneva convention.
I agree, anyone who doesn't is hiding something and is likely an accessory to a war crime.
XBadgerKnightX agreed, also imo this deserves way more views. This vid was awesome.
@@coreyevans5734 Only you can make that possible! Spread the word! I can only do so much!
Pizza
True.
"Tali is so cute. You're all she talks about in that sweet rainbows and butterflys kind of way. She loves you Shepard. Be good to her." I love that line from Kasumi, one of my favourites in the trilogy by far.
Kadsumi is a strangely endearing character. Especially considering you cant even talk to her like the other crewmates.
@@justfriendly7676 I think mysteriousness and taciturness adds up to that.
It’s that line that set me on the path to falling in love with tali, if not for that line id never had known she liked me and i never would have thought about her that way so thanks kasumi
I always liked the fact that if you don't romance either Garrus or Tali they end up together in ME3.
@@TheotherTempestfox they basically made it known with mass effect 4 that laira is canon romance so tali and garrus is also canon. I find it cute my 3 best friends got a decent happy ending.
Rules of Mass effect.
1. Save David Archer or you are a monster.
2. Hug Tali for all she's worth cause she is the best girl ever and those hips don't lie.
Going by the stats BioWare put out post release. plenty of people couldn’t hug since they choose the Geth.
@@9manny99 monsters!
@@9manny99 I actually liked reading that stat. It told me that many of the new players actually experienced the game on their terms instead of minmaxing it with guides. Getting the quarians and the geth while playing blind and probably going paragade isn’t all that easy.
3. Make sure you handle Mass Effect 3 so the Quarians stand down.
@@digitalutopia1 Lol you have to Have legion and tali live in ME2. Otherwise Geth VI ruins your day
When she says "I have a home" it fucking melted my heart, Tali is truly the best girl in Mass Effect
I don't think I can romance her anymore... Tali is best girl. However, that line literally killed what was left of my soul. I don't know if I can handle hearing that line again.
@@spookymacchiato5503 Just don't bring her along for the final push to the beam. Bring Javik or James or someone who is objectively less soul crushing with the final line delivery.
Fucking destroyed me, like started to have tears which I don't think I've ever done for a game.
"I can't stay behind"
"Don't leave me behind"
"I have a home"
"come back to me"
Yo I'm kinda sad I didn't see that part and a fair bit of talis dialogue cuz I was so scared to death of her dying somehow by story shit I basically never took her on dangerous missions🤣
Considering the fact she was there for you from the beginning. She is the best girl. She was even down for you when you even had to work with cerberus. Tali is my dream ride or die bae. DX
meanwhile Ash in ME2 "I cant do that. Not even for you"
Well fuck me I guess
@@MetalGearBronya right? Screw the rest of them. XD
Tali in ME- when i help my race, i will instant help you!
Liara in ME 2 - DONT CARE. IM NOW AVANGER. IF YOU WANT ME BUY DLC BIT>CH...
Ash - YOU ARE EVIL NOW...
Shepard - ... TALI >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> rest
@@MetalGearBronyathats another thing that really hurts her character
You know, between the fact that Tali specifically gets Turians alcohol, the way its 300 years on the flotilla with limited resources, combined with how weak quarian immune systems are, it's possible that quarian culture hasn't really had easy access to alcohol in centuries, so it's a very real possibility that nobody in several generations have had any real exposure to alcohol. In conclusion, Tali is almost certainly a lightweight, and probably got super drunk on the turian equivalent of half a glass of wine
Or maybe a single beer, turians do drink a bit more than normal.
Wasn't it Brandy she was drinking?
"Turian brandy, triple filtered, introduced into the suit through an emergency induction port."
@@LORdREDSTOneNR1 “That’s a straw.”
@@xenon8117 "Emergency induction port. It's actually getting a little harder to get it into the slot, I think that means it's working..."
@@RustyMerc4Hire To you, you Cerberus cheerleading bosh'tet.
Tali: Save the council
Also Tali: fuck it, let them die
I think it's a priority system. I know that Wrex always advocates abandoning the Council, and Liara always advocates saving them, so Tali's position would depend on the other squadmate. (My hunch is that she's more renegade than Kaidan only)
@@KopperNeoman actually I‘m also kind of like that
Gollum'Zorah: "We should holds back the fleetses, Precious! What did the Ascension ever do for us?"
Smeagol'Zorah: "But the Ascension is our friend!"
Gollum'Zorah: "We don't have any friends."
Smeagol'Zorah: "Not listening. Not listening!"
@@jaffarebellion292 I am deceased 😂
@raylast3873 I have an addendum: you can push Kaidan to be so Renegade that WREX of all people has to defend the Council's lives from his Imperium-level pragmatism.
"I have a home". That will always break me now I need to punch a wall to feel manly again
If you don't cry at that line, you don't have a heart...
My ex and I used to tell each other "you're my home." She was a child of abuse, and I was a social reject.
We all need a home.
Feeling love is manly
Hits you right in the feels, the voice acting delivery is incredible
I always loved that non-verbal cue on Rannoch.
Tali (looking over the horizon): "It's beautiful isn't it?"
Shepard (never taking eyes off Tali): "It is"
Not being able to romance Tali in ME:1 was the biggest disappointment of that game.
Agreed
Not being able to romance Tali as FemShep was the biggest disappointment for me.
@@ktfcrusader1952 Laughs in clunky PC Mods. Personally I wish they did what they did in ME3. Some characters are Bi some are straight and others like Sam and Kelly. Be free but that also means some characters are locked out and that’s okay. Don’t need to feel like the Dragon Born who is invited to every group.
@@9manny99 I mean, technically they did... It's just that Liara is the only "bi" in ME1. Only put that in quotes because it's more to do with how Asari culture and biology work than sexual preference in the way we understand/view it.
... I do wish though that more characters were romanceable from either Fem/Male Shep in all 3 games, though. I don't see why they aren't, since it's really only a couple characters who's personalities/beliefs are laid out to be particularly socially conservative, so it really wouldn't be stepping on any of the writing/character development to do so.
Yeah, I didn’t actually have any interest in liara or Ashley as I already liked Tali loads more then them. Imagine my surprise when I finally got to romance her in two
I sometimes forget how absolutely heartbreaking this game can be because I absolutely refuse to walk the Renegade path.
Watch on youtube Mass Effect 3 12 schocking moments of renegade path. That Shepard is a pure evil
Yeah mass effect 3 shit on the series but dont worry it was all a dream anyways
@@quarreneverett4767 lol it wasn't a dream. The incompetent writers said it's what happened
@@jfelton3583 I hate how ME3 punishes you for not playing ME2. So many players killed the Quarian’s because they had no alternatives. The reapers are killing harvesting so many worlds and this is how they act.
@@9manny99 I'm not entirely against giving players that played the first 2 games more options
Han'Gerrel was the real problem when we had to decide between the Quarians or the Geth. He was the one who, unreasonably, started the invasion on the Geth and he was the only one who still wanted to fight when Tali told him to back off. That being said, though, I didn't like that Tali didn't even try to talk Gerrel out of it. Bioware forced the "Hero of the Day" role on Shepard a bit too strongly there, imo.
Anyway, Gerrel should have been demoted back when he opened fire on the Geth Dreadnought even though Shepard and Tali( another ADMIRAL) were still on the ship, despite the other admirals telling him not to. If it weren't for him, it would have not come this far.
I agree with Gerral needing to be punished for nearly killing Tali and Shepard in ME3 - but as Tali stated earlier, public disagreements between the quarian's leadership would divide the fleet. the renegade interrupt was enough for me lmao
( I AM NOW KICKING MYSELF FOR NOT INCLUDING THE INTERRUPT IN THE VIDEO HOW THE HELL DID I FORGET THAT?!!!)
It's weird because mass effect 2 seemed to try and promote him as the good admiral. When the admiral who wanted peace with geth (I can't remember his name) was eager to continue the trail before tali could return it was Gerral who was upset and fought against it. In me2 he was presented as the decent admiral vs the psychotic dr Frankenstein, father of the year, or a treacherous idealist. In me3, he is the dogmatic war hawk who cares only about crushing the geth. I'm not saying the transition doesn't make sense, but I noticed the change in direction.
@@JP-rf8rr Agreed! Gerrel was definitely redesigned to be hated by the so the player has more reason to be sceptical about Quarians. I think that counts for Xen as well. She was at least a very intelligent person in ME2, despite her extremes when it comes to Geth. But in ME3 she was constantly on her psychopath trip.
One should remember that the Quarian admirals are the ones who give the Quarian people their faces. While Tali and Koris give them a good name, Gerrel and Xen sour them.
I assume the reason they did that was to equalize the odds when it comes to choosing between the Quarians and the Geth, in case you can't choose the peace option. Because a lot of people would assume that many Quarians are just like Gerrel or Xen. But I don't think it's equal at all because the Geth, through Legion, are constantly written as good and likable guys and there aren't any Geth that would be make the player doubt their species. To their mind, all Geth are like Legion so obviously the odds are not equal.
Generally, it felt like Bioware was pushing the idea of accepting AIs as a true life form a lot and barely gave the player a choice about that.
@@tyrayentali7041 Not really though.
Legion himself said that geth arent really that great.
Shepard:How did we get to this....the geth are better than this!
Legion:No....based on history,they are not.
They werent actually pushing it,they made it as gray as possible.
@@aleksamilosevic8792 That was hardly the same as how much the Quarians have been villainized. Especially because Legion was already so likable that the player would just instantly forgive him, also because of his "emotional" reaction to it made him look "adorable" and "innocent".
Meanwhile the Quarian leaders were dumbed down in ME3 to only ever show their worst character traits and annoy the player. It's not difficult to see which side will be judged harder for their shortcomings.
You made me watch that suicide scene 3 times. You sir are evil :p
I just realized I have an intense emotional attachment to a fictional digital character and I don't even feel weird about it.
Tali- space waifu, or best girl either one
She both my dude lmao
@@XBadgerKnightX your not wrong, like the tali face mod.
Just putting this out there, Shepard gives her an entire home planet. Beats hell out of a ring. Seriously, dude solos a reaper on foot for her. I'm just surprised she doesn't rip his armor off right then and there.
both
@@harpercronch2903 agreed
A fictional, alien girl in a game from nine-and-a-half years ago.
And, I'm still in love with her...just a little bit.
To quote a comment I saw someone make in another video:
_"In a world full of Ashleys, I'm just looking for a Tali."_
In the end we became the one with the crush.
It's ironic since I tend to go for women like Tali IRL. But I can't ever bring myself to romance her. There's too much of a little sister vibe given the circumstances of you meeting her on her adulthood rite of passage.
@@lololol924 I suppose that I can understand that. But, IMO, she's the only romance option who seems to care for you, back.
@@chainsawsubtlety9828 for male shep I agree (can't discount best boy Garrus)
I'm partial to Jack's romance personally. It's something more....mature which fits Shepard's age and experience I feel. But obviously the drawback with the ME2 romances is the characters are less present in the finale.
Wait Tail is best girl? Theres no "best" about it since she's the "only girl" as in I can never romance anyone but her now lmao
I like your words funny man
I can't romance her, assist for my bro Garrus, they are too good together (and vice versa as I mostly play the trilogy as Femshep)
@@kattharsismic this is a respectable choice - the best girl belongs with the best boy
Respectable, but i let Garrus win the shot out, so she's all my male shep lol
@@brycedavis8178 fair hahahaha
I love how when Tali says," It's beautiful, though, isn't it?" And Shepard replies that it is, he's looking at her.
Bioware really wanted the players to fall in love with Liara, but for whatever reason, I never felt the connection to Liara or anyone else that I felt to Tali and Garrus.
tali and garrus form a actual companionship with shepherd like there people you want to just hang out with for fun
Liara not so much she is more a close work friend
I hated Liara. I mean, legit hated her! I really wanted to be able to throw her off a cliff, or do something to make her throw herself off a cliff.
@@yami122
Not really. It's obvious the romantic choice is Liara from Game one. It fits with this game aesthetics. She even is more forward with you in the first game and you in ME2 you as a player wonder why she is so cold if you pursue a romantic relationship with her.
By Mass effect 3 I noticed it every time they are in a scene together that their clearly was to be more to it.
To be clear I go for Tali or Garrus every time as romantic choices. They are both more interesting to me.
Liara always struck me as Asari Garrus, as in regardless of gender, relationship, or circumstance they ‘ride or die’ for The Shepard.
I think Liara loves Shepard no matter Shepard's feelings, but Bioware wasn't great at handling the romance portion in the first game; none of the romance options felt very natural to me, and this may be because they were still finding their sea legs. Jennifer Hale once mentioned how even for voice acting, it was different with the first ME game; less organic, more "get the lines across as clear as possible" instead of infusing acting and nuance, so everything felt more speech-like. A lot of people felt that the romances in the first game were less convincing across the board compared to ME2. In a way I think Bioware did both Garrus and Tali a favor when they waited until the second game to make them romance-able. I felt closer to Liara in ME2, ironically, due to the voice-acting approach and the writing style, but by then I had dismissed her as an option for all of ME1 and that was one reason I still regarded Liara as just a good asari friend. Furthermore, I think there really is that element where we tend to yearn for things that are harder to get. Liara was kind of too easy, as she loves you no matter what. There was even some dialogue in ME1 where if you romanced Ashley or Kaidan, you're asked if you knew that Liara had feelings for you too. I didn't interpret this as the writers necessarily wanting me to go with her as much as them trying to create a character that fell in love with you first, rather than a reactionary character that only loves you if you proceed with the romance dialogue. Still, as a consequence, Liara's love almost didn't have as much value because of how unconditional it was; you don't have to earn it, and so you appreciate her less as a person. Tali and Garrus would hook up with each other if you don't romance either of them, suggesting that they didn't really need you by default. You have to put in the effort to win their hearts, and even if it's not to the point of slaving away for them, that still makes them feel like they have more inherent value as people.
Just imagine if we had gotten an Epilogue/timeskip after the game where, depending on your choices, you experienced a "Earned your happy ending" moment with an older Shepherd & a now maskless Tali living on a now livable Rannoch with a kid of their own & the last scene is of the two of them sitting by the cliff, Tali's head on Shepherd's shoulder, watching the sunset before the screen fade to black
While it is definitely unfortunate that the devs went with a "bittersweet endings for tragic tales" approach (whether for time constraint, rushed development/publisher pressure, or simply choice of writing reasons), I am probably one of the few people that feel I can both understand and appreciate the story ending in this way. From a purely story-based perspective, having the ability to achieve a perfect happy ending would cheapen the conflict you spent hours struggling against in gameplay (years in in-universe time), and retroactively lessen the emotional impact of the story and it's conclusion.
Yes, you spent countless hours and made countless decisions as a player that you might feel SHOULD make an impact on the ending of your story, but the sheer scale of the conflict you are engaged in really prevents that from making sense (again) from a purely story based perspective... You're fighting a war at the scale of an entire galaxy, so while the decisions you make along the way make an impact and ultimately you can convince the people of that galaxy to come together to prevent the worst, the decisions of a single man can't logically/realistically guarantee his perfect conclusion, especially when he goes out of his way to put himself at the tip of the spear. Doubly so when, again, the raw scale of the conflict (in universe) is considered.
For the writing to make sense as the ending of a story, --this story--, a final sacrifice has to be made for the tragedy to conclude. The only thing that is truly regrettable in all of this is how anti-climatic Shepard's final moments come across the the player due to either the rush to finish the game, or a lack of experience of the writer's team in how to craft a climax for not just a single game, but the story of an entire series.
Had more emotion been able to be conveyed in these final moments (everything after Shepard goes into the beam), had there been more of a feeling of weight, and sacrifice conveyed to the player... a more appropriate mixture of the swirling, conflicting feelings of both relief for the end of the tragedy, and the regret and hopelessness of knowing no perfect ending lies in front of you, the feelings that Shepard's character MUST have felt, that any hero would feel if placed in these circumstances, I doubt there would have been nearly as much backlash (if any) to the ending of this tale. But again, regrettably, after the final scene with your chosen partner, all of the emotion of this story fades away from the writing, and we (as the player) are left feeling ultimately robbed of the final emotional climax and conclusion we were all undoubtedly expecting. Instead replaced by a superficial choice between three (four) conclusions which when presented together hold no weight as an actual choice...
Perhaps it would have been better if this choice was not presented and instead you were simply and suddenly confronted with the repercussions of the totality of your actions/choices leading into this scene and throughout the series, them being calculated and represented to you to produce an ending, even one of these which is already in the game, would have been superior in emotional payoff. Alas, I suppose we can only be left to imagine...
... Unless some absolute mad lad mods this into the game, that is.
@@CurtDegree I disagree with your original statement, there 100% should be an ending where Shepard lives. Now please do not think I’m trying to be mean or anything, I’m merely saying I disagree and here is why. You mention that having a perfect and happy ending would cheapen the conflict, I have to disagree. With ALL the shit Shepard has gone through, I think he could do it.
BUT, I would say you’d need to really, REALLY work for it. Because yes, as you mentioned, this is literally a galactic threat of unbelievable proportions. You should choose a route to go, either full paragon or full renegade which once you do absolutely EVERYTHING in every game, you must complete them and have the best possible outcome for them. Between that and the fleet strength at the end of 3 being as high as it can go, you could choose a certain pathway that will allow Shepard to win and survive.
I personally do not believe one ending like that where you work hard enough to achieve it would be a detriment in any way. But that is my opinion, and I respect yours.
@@realsupercobble idk why i keep finding this comments that even now, so many years later, dont know that SHEPARD CAN SURVIVE ME3 SINCE VANILLA.
pick survivor background (may or may not be needed) make sure galactic readiness is at max, chose destroy ending. done, shepard is alive
@@lethos8811 you don't need the survivor background just need to max out galatic readiness and chose destroy
@@Ramund223 I did it with ruthless and synthesis.
1:06:28 Legion's final moment is one of the best scenes in the series. And when you contrast it with the reconstructed Legion, you see just how much he learned from his time on the Normandy. Not-Legion's dialogue when he attacks Shepard at this stage is full of venom and hatred for organics, saying he was right not to trust you. And Tali will bitterly spit that the real Legion would have understood. And I think he did.
While Legion's actions remain the same as his VI reconstruction, his dialogue is very different. He doesn't blame organics, or say that he was wrong to trust you. He just wants to know, at the end, if he was a person. He did understand their decision, even if he couldn't accept it. Because Legion cared for Tali, and the Normandy crew, and the other organics he met on his journey. He knows why you'd pick them over his people because he saw it for himself.
And that's why Gerrel is never willing to hold fire if Legion is dead.
Only the coolest person could ever claim that Chrisjen Avaserala is their aunt.
Also as much as I usually always go for paragon runs, I can never resist using the renegade persuade option in Talis loyalty mission. Because "it's fun watching you shout down the admiralty board."
I also think Tali has some of the most rewarding and quality writing around her.
"I got better. I got you."
Totally agree with this. I like to at the very least take the "you spring this on her in the middle of a damn trial?!" option after they tell her about her father. Cuz thats my girl. You don't mess with my girl. 😆
As someone who didn't see the renegade response until this video, completely agreed. It's FAR more satisfying here to do Renegade rather than Paragon.
It just connected with me that she was when I saw this video
Not just Crisjen, Jayne Cobb is loyal to her as well.
There's something i want to say about Shepard relationship with Tali. I'm not sure if you can feel the same thing if you romanced someone else.
I feel like during the whole trilogy Shepard always was doing things for the others, never for himself (the only exception might be if you played the whole renegade, but who the hell would cared about that kind of person anyway). Everything he did during the trilogy was to help the others, even the random people he could find on the Citadel. You can clearly see that all of your crew mates got their own personal problems, and Shepard are always willing to help them. However, have you caught that he actually never did anything for himself?
I think for both of them their relationship is something far more important than everything they experienced.
For Tali, because she's quarian, and quarians are basically the most vulnerable to racism of all of the species. She can even tell you that before she met Shepard, she was injured and when she went to the Turian council ask for help, he threw her out and called her "a rat in the suit". Also, because of quarians weak immune system they have a huge problem to get into relationships with their own species, don't even talking about the other ones. For Shepard that never was a problem. He just felt in love with her personality. He put her own personality over knowing how even her face might looks like. However, he would never put her health over his desires. The fact that she decided to take off her mask before him, risking her life, is probably one of the biggest gestures of trust you can possible imagine.
For Shepard. I feel like for him Tali was something more than just a partner. He finally found his own reason to fight. Like i said, before their romance, everything he ever did was for someone else. He didn't have his own purpose in this war. Until he fell in love with Tali. She's his home. Just like Shepard is Tali home. He can finally fight with mind in the back of his head that when all of this will be over, he would be able to go back to her, move out to Rannoch, build her a house and just enjoy his life with a woman he love. He finally have a personal purpose to fight. He knows, that if he survived, he will not be alone when probably everybody will go back to their own planets to help rebuild them. I had that feeling that Shepard was so lonely before he met Tali again in ME2, and she's the only reason why he can keep his mental health steady.
Wow
Just wow, that's some good analysis right here
slight correction; she did not went to the turian councilor, she went to the ambassador and talk to the turian clerk. that aside great analysis!
p/s: If she went to the councilor she would have been dismissed like the reaper 😂
Yeah Imma just take that for a fanfic lol
When you cry from a robot dying
He wasn't a robot... he was my friend😔
Even though legion was a robot he did show he had emotions emotions past his programming
1:16:56 I mean, MORDIN is the first. He straight up tells Shepard that he found a bunch of bugs, and gave the most expensive ones back to Miranda.
When Tali apologizes for her emotions upon finding her father dead, I think she might not actually be apologizing for her emotions. It always came off to me as her apologizing for her father's recklessness. She believed that he was a good man her whole life, idolized him, almost worshiped him to a point where, when all the evidence started pointing towards him making stupid mistakes that cost the crew their lives, which also put her in this ridiculous position and made Shepard witness this ugly side of her people, she still believed that he wasn't capable of any of this, that it must have been some sort of mistake, and that he surely must still be alive. I think that's what she was apologizing for. Apologizing for blindly believing in her father. For not seeing through any of this earlier. Because he claims he did all of this for her sake, and he says as much. She feels responsible for all of this because I feel that in her reasoning, she somehow thinks she enabled her father's actions by sending all the parts to him, for never questioning why he needs so many and what he does with them.
She apologizes for being naive and gullible. She refused to see things for what they are and refused to accept the truth. She put Shepard in danger by dragging him along to the research vessel, and there were geth there. Geth that have killed quarians. Geth there would be less of if she hadn't sent the parts back to her father. Less quarians may have died if she hadn't sent those parts. Her father may have still lived.
And she is sorry still because even after all of that, after the sickening betrayal she suffered at the hands of her father, she still finds the compassion in her to preserve his name and his memory, even at the risk of her own exile. That's who Tali is and that's who she always will be. A trusting, even naive, girl who strives to find and see the best in others. To always give them a chance, whether those people are arrogant, human, a turian who treated her like garbage during her pilgrimage, geth, the illusive man who runs a terrorist organization, or even a war criminal.
She may be neutral in her stances and flipflops on her decisions, but deep down she is the embodiment of a realist with ideals, the exact way I happen to play this game every time. Extract the most good out of everyone around you, even against their own will, good or otherwise. Give them every chance to do the right thing, but still smite the shit out of them if they refuse your good will in the end. And if you need to make a tough decision that has no good outcome, be a pragmatist who chooses the greater good, even at the cost of innocent lives.
I think that's how the game wishes everyone played it, because it seems to support those kinds of decisions the most and reward them the most. And it just so happens that Tali, while young and impressionable, witnesses you have this attitude, and it is only natural that she sees the value in it, and later assumes a similar position herself.
I too, am naive like Tali. I too choose to believe in the good in people and give them the chance to show it. And I often pay for it by being tricked and taken advantage of. But it takes strength to be vulnerable for the sake of others. It takes courage to believe in people while fully expecting them to betray you. Even still, a true paragon is willing to make those stupid decisions because they are strong enough to take the hits that go with them. "Sure, I'll believe you. I'll give you a chance. I'll show you weakness and allow you to potentially exploit it if you choose to betray me, because I know that I am strong enough to beat you even with that handicap. Stab me in the back all you want, I'll just turn around and stab you in the face instead." That's the attitude that gets things done. You have to give people a chance to be good, but that also has a price, and you're the one footing the bill. For them.
That is what it takes to consider peace between the quarians and the geth. Without this attitude, you have endless war and destruction. And it's not just them. Turians, Salarians, and Krogan too. This is the attitude that is required to save the galaxy from the reapers and retain your humanity.
Wrex would kill the reapers himself and wouldn't bother asking for help.
Garrus would die fighting them, sacrificing everything to avenge as many as he can.
In that way he isn't much different from Javik, but perhaps only a bit more hopeful.
Liara would gather all information available and hide it out as a backup plan for the next cycle to have a chance.
I don't know about Kaidan and Ashley. They would just accept their fate I think?
But Tali? Tali would get shit done. Not because of her strength, skill or intelligence, but because she has hope. And she has that hope because she is a hopeless idealist. She dreams of a happy ending knowing full well its implausibility. Because in order to save the galaxy, every living being MUST be the better person and do the right thing. The literal best case scenario is required. A person simply has to first even see that such a scenario exists and believe in it. And she may not have what it takes to put it all together herself, but neither does Shepard. It definitely takes more than one person to unite the galaxy, but it also takes an idealist to do it. Both Shepard and Tali are those idealists. Gullible, naive, and willing to give even the worst of the worst a chance to do the right thing, against their better judgment and all the evidence to the contrary. Running on nothing but hope, blind faith, and friendship. Uniting the galaxy with all the wrath and terror of hugs and handshakes, and an occasional gut punch to a foolhardy quarian admiral.
In a way, your crew attempts to emulate you in their own way.
Garrus channels Shepard's pragmatism and efficiency.
Wrex and Grunt channel his ruthlessness and courage.
Kaidan and Ashley channel his leadership and command.
Liara channels his cunning
Tali channels his compassion. She takes the good in Shepard, potentially, his most powerful tool. Though she always had that in her. Her time on the Normandy simply taught her how to use it.
Damn, that a really good analysis. Thank you !
dude what I just read was great. WTF
Perfectly put
This man's out here casually writing better character analysis in a UA-cam comment than GameInformer, IGN and Co. have put to the page in the 8+ years since this series concluded.
Nice analysis man! It warmed my heart.
"Somebody who is objectively the Mass Effect Trilogy's best girl?" You have earned my Sub :p
She god damned better be alive in ME4 and not force us to be stuck with the blue parasitic sex squid. If they leave only Liara alive that makes it so that the only way to get the complex story interactions with the romanced character in ME4, it would absolutely butcher player agency and also Tali is way to fucking adorable to not include.
@@atashgallagher5139 This is what I think will happen, and it is between 2 options: The first and most viable option (for me to leave the fans pleased) is that they do it as with Andromeda that is to say that it is many years later, there the reason that only see Liara, why do you wonder? because it is much easier for a script to build a new base taking into account a mass effect much later, so that it is even easier to bypass all the choices of the players during the original trilogy. An example would easily be bringing in a new threat that was out of the galaxy making the three decisions of destroy, synthesis and control have no impact. It is for me the easiest way and with more possibilities to create new stories
The second is almost an immediate continuation of a couple of years at most, but this would have a couple of problems, the first and most important would be to return to canon events of the original trilogy and completely breaking with the idea that decisions mattered, since With this option, I would make both the first and the second not matter; Unless they use the same save game method from 1 to 2 to 3 to count the decisions, but that could make them make the decision to officially make the final destroy the canon because it is the easiest to continue already. that between the 3 endings could not be taken as canon since they are very different between them and making a continuation for the 3 endings is impossible, unless they do something extreme and make a different game for each end (which I think would be the most epic and great what they could do) but it would be very expensive and not to mention that we are talking about EA.
I think that will happen, so I am almost sure not to anger the mass effect fanbase and respect their decisions in the original trilogy as something important I do not think it is a direct continuation in terms of the end of years. So even if I would like to see tali again, I doubt that for this mass effect she is still alive
"I don't give a vorcha's ass about the fleet"
After watching The Expanse, it's impossible to not hear Avasarala in that line
Fr, Avasarala is the GOAT 🤣
If, like me, you had a controller that sometimes decided not to listen to my frantic clicking on the paragon prompt, Tali's full quote over her father's body ends with her sobbing "You wouldn't leave me to clean up your mess!"
And your companion actually comments on your failure to hug her.
I, of course, immediately restarted the mission to make sure I got that prompt.
The other party member should have hugged her. (Maybe except Morinth.) All with the unspoken acceptance that whoever isn't hugging is watching for evil robots.
“After time adrift among open stars, along tides of light and through shoals of dust, I will return to where I began.”
I think you did a great job! One thing you didn’t discuss in relation to Tali and her father though:
In Mass Effect 1, you can ask Tali about her mother. She explains that a sickness went through the ship, and she died from exposure to it. While tali doesn’t open up much about it made her feel, she says her father buried himself in work after it to deal with his grief. It’s another layer of his (poorly shown) affection for tali. He couldn’t do anything to keep her mother alive. But now he’ll do everything in his power to win her home world back. It’s a misguided ideology and a tragic one, but it’s poignant for his character I think.
Great assessment.
I feel like a big indicator of Tali's growth was after Ranmoch, on the citadel, where she was helping the turian who preME1 called her suit rat and threatened to have her thrown off the station. It might be passed off as a throw away scene that lasts less than a minute but it spoke volumes of the amount of influence Shepard had on her throughout the trilogy.
The good bye scene in ME3 with Tali ripped my heart out, crushed it into paste and blasted into oblivion. Masterfully done and deep emotions though out the whole series
Legion’s death scene is probably the most powerful moment in the entire series for me. It was so beautifully tragic and completely broke my soul.
Tragic, yet hopeful.
Why it's a machine. No matter hard bio tried to humanize the geth I never could. Watching legion die was so satisfying. Geth must die.
@@timesthree5757 damn, who hurt you?
@@supasoljas7824 Not an argument. Try again. You do not make an appeal to emotions.
@@timesthree5757 it was literally only a joke...
I actually prefer Rallying the Crowd to the Paragon/Renegade options in Tali’s loyalty mission, mostly because of Kal Reegar and Veetor standing up for Tali.
An absolutely underrated moment and dialogue choice! Especially considering that ME3 wastes their characters!
Tali is legitimately my favourite character in all of fiction.
It's gonna be a very long time before I get sick of hearing about her.
"It's illegal for families to have more than one child"
Immediately, like an instinct, the social credit song started playing in my head
I always love imagining what is going on in Tali's head while she's talking to Shepard after the Trial. Shepard is literally the only person in the Galaxy she would trust and who has always been there for her, and she's standing in front of him, nervously blathering out things she didn't intend to. But then Shepard keeps going along with it, and so it's probably sending her to even higher levels of panic and nervousness as she keeps walking, in her mind, a razor-thin line with the only person she would _never, ever_ want to mess anything up with, and it just keeps getting her more and more in deep.
I imagine her taking more than a couple shots with a shaky hand afterwards, overwhelmed with relief that he literally reciprocated everything she said when she expected absolutely none of that.
_BUT THEN AFTERWARDS SHE REMEMBERS SHE'S ACTUALLY GOING TO DO STUFF WITH HIM THAT WASN'T JUST AN EMPTY CONVERSATION SHE ACTUALLY GOT IN WITH SHEPARD _*_AND OH FUCK OH SHIT_*
Even better when you realise that Tali in particular is a massive, raging xenophile. Thane had a drell wife. Garrus makes moves on female turians. Asari don't count, they can reproduce that way so it's not a fetish.
Tali never once makes a move on another quarian, or even an asari. It's all Fleet and Flotilla and Human Mating Guides with her. Tali considers Shepard to be "dashing" BECAUSE he's not a quarian, and is aware of how strange she is.
Then Shepard is at the very minimum okay with such a relationship.
"Or I take off this mask, and breathe germs all over your nice clean ship."
That is one of my top three lines in the whole series. Cracks me up every time.
on the Shadow Broker Ship, you can read this is how Garrus once killed a Quarian serial killer, with a cough
Tali: Come back to me.
Me: Red ending it is then...
I hate bioware for doing this. The endings in general are a disaster, but given that geth and quarian story arc and Tali's arc are the arcs most impacted by the ending, there is no win here. No good end here. You set back the quarian people centuries by destroying the geth... or you don't grant her wish.
I always pick the red ending because it is the only one where you live. I didn't spend hundreds of hours of gameplay and years of my childhood and growing up into an adult playing across all 3 games to settle for a glorious death. No death is glorious. Nothing in the galaxy is worth you giving up your own life for.
But the price is so high. Too high. I know people are sick of cliche happy endings, but for fuck's sake, if I put so much time and effort into a series, by god I fucking demand a happy ending. Fuck reason and consequences. I did not bust my ass shouting at everyone in the galaxy to stop fighting and help me to NOT walk away with a win.
Not only is it not possible for Shepard to survive the destroy ending. All geth and quarians also die from the destroy ending.
@@robertharris6092 that's your headcanon, just like it's headcanon that control ending preserves you and let's you inhabit a robot or something and go do whatever. Red ending by game canon shows you a scene at the end where you live. I don't need or want your own take on the endings. I'm going off what the game says here.
I think you forget they could easily reactivate the Geth. As far as we can tell, the Reapers (and by extension the rest of synthetic life) were put in more of a stasis rather than deletion. Plus, knowing the Geth I’d assume they saw the use of the Crucible to destroy the reapers as a possible threat to themselves, and likely prepared accordingly.
@@comm154 I appreciate your headcanon, I wish that was the case, but that's clearly not how the game tells it.
@@Mike23443 technically it isn’t head canon. The kid (I can’t believe I’m actually using his statements) we talk to at the end of ME3 tells us that we can destroy much of the technology we currently have, but it would also be easy to repair afterwards. It also mentions that it would wipe out synthetic life. Going off of that, it’d be easy to reactivate the Geth, although they would be the same as they were when 01 was created. The Geth would probably find it easy to rediscover what upgrades the Reapers gave them, although what’d happen afterwards is a whole other question.
'that damned data better be worth it'...it's like she knew EA would piss it away...
Don't get me wrong EA is bad but you can blame who ever leaked the ending not EA
@@Kai-_- they panicked over nothing. Asshats.
@@Kai-_- I have my doubts
@@hansolav5924 it's not uncommon for companies to change the plot if it's leaked but maybe if EA give them more time
@@Kai-_- they could have held off on firing anybody until the game was done. wouldn't have cost them much, I should think. far from it, in fact.
Watching legion die was heartbreaking...
Why..... why.....
It's possibly one of the most painful deaths in a Game I've ever known.
At the very least when he sacrificed himself in the Quarian - Geth alliance ending that pain could be tempered with pride in what he achieved
Yeah... That sucked.... That sucked a lot... *wipes tear from eye*
Legion is legitimately Geth Jesus.
Watching Legion die hurt more than watching the flotilla get destroyed. Good lord
I pulled the Red trigger on that every single time.
Oh dang. I've always wanted character analysis videos of this depth and length on Mass Effect characters! As someone who just stumbled into this video by accident, it's hard for me to truly appreciate the time, effort, determination, and energy that went into this.
All I can say is thank you for making this!
ALL HAIL THE UA-cam ALGO
Actually makes me chuckle at the similarities between Ash and Tali when you consider the vast differences in their receptions by the fanbase
That's the part that's REALLY funny to me. They have the exact same character arcs - the difference Ashley able to move on from her father's death as she already 'in exile;.
Another great video essay, well done!
For me, Tali has the best voice acting I have ever experienced in a game. Plus she has some of the best dialogue/lines that are absolute gut punches if she is the romantic interest. The way she says at the end "I want more time" with the raw emotion is just so true, and it's just delivered in such a way that you have to be a sociopath not to feel anything. But it's when she's wounded and being evacuated and she's begging for Shepard not to go, "I have a home"... that is devastating. Quite honestly it's perfect. In that one line she's shown how much her heart is breaking and the impact that has on us, the gamer, is probably profound for most of us. Never before have I felt so moved by ingame dialogue which means the writer & the voice actor did something amazing. It's the perfect example of brevity, less being more to achieve the greatest emotional impact. It's utterly bittersweet, beautiful and believable.
I watch many films and TV shows and I am struggling to find any that have this level of emotional impact. That's just how good this is.
When I first played ME2 I turned in the evidence of her father's crime, thinking it was the right thing to do.
She was the only squadmate on that save for whom I didn't earn their loyalty. And also the only squadmate I lost on the suicide mission.
I was absolutely devastated at the time, it felt like judgment had thrown it's hammer in defiance of my sense of justice.
But I will right that wrong in the Legendary Edition, I owe Tali that much.
The "I have a Home." Crushes me, every. single. time.
Frankly, to me, peace between the Geth and Quarians is the only option. I love both races that much. I refuse to let either die.
0:54 *emergency induction port
Awesome video dude. Tali is the best character in mass effect bar none and one of the best written characters in and medium out there. Bravo to everyone involved
Hearing Shep share the evidence without Tali's consent makes me so uncomfortable...
In real life, it would be the best thing to do and Tali should realise that too.
In a videogame, you need that Tali_Is_Loyal boolean. It's one of the most important flags.
How does this channel only have 570 subscribers? For this quality content it deserves at least 100k.
Be the change you want to see in the world
I agree!!
I do not care how much of a Renegade your, or anyone else's Shepard is - when the Paragon prompt to hug her appears, you will hit that prompt and give her a hug!
Best waifu, better Hips
I just recently went through the Legendary Edition, and it was the first time I've played Mass Effect since the 2010s. I never knew you could romance Tali, and I always had my little fireteam composition be Garrus and Tali. When it came to the final push, seeing my ride or die, Garrus motherfucking Vakarian, and the best Space Gypsy, Tali'Zorah, getting evac'd by the Normandy kinda hurt. I defeated Saren and the Proto-Reaper with them, stopped Project Overlord with them, and discovered the Leviathan with her and Javik. Tali will probably always be my squadmate in whatever playthrough I do (even any renegade playthroughs I'd still gain her loyalty and hug her on the Alerai), simply because she's one of the best characters I've played with in all the games I've played.
I'm not much of a crier. I get emotional, but it's very rare for actual tears to flow . . . I dead ass sobbed from the moment Tali said "I have a home" until like an hour after I finished the rest of the game . . . I just couldn't help it . . . The voice acting, the weight, the way Tali connects with you. It's just perfect . . . Thanks Tali . . . *cries more
Amazing analysis! Tali is the most grounded and relatable character in the entire series. She is so absurdly well written, masterfully voiced by Liz, and has the most satisfying character arc and development. She became my favorite character right off the bat in the first game, and I was really sad she couldn't be romanced there; on the other hand, this was for the better, as it gave her character time to mature and watch Shepard from afar, slowly becoming infatuated by him, eventually falling in love. *SHE IS WAY TOO PRECIOUS GODDAMNIT.*
I think my biggest peeve with Tali is how she progressively takes longer to recruit in each game. In Mass Effect 2 she only becomes available after completing three dossiers, while in Mass Effect 3 she is the very last character to join the squad.
I know this video is 4 months old just saw it for the first time. She's is almost perfect in my book. Great content great work agreed with everything you said. Especially the part about the hug. Take care and stay safe.
To be honest when I first came across this channel I didn't give you the time of day, I thought it was a joke, and would say as much. But after seeing this video and saw just how thought-provoking, well written, and passionate it was, I can safely say you are among the best essayist youtubers I've seen. You are exceptional at storytelling and delivering concise yet uniquely informative dictation. Also, the moments of levity are well timed and welcomed when things can get emotionally heavy. I was hooked from beginning to end. I am now looking forward to, and dare i say excited to watching your other videos. I was wrong about you, and I'm sorry.
It's cool bro! I'm glad you enjoyed my content!
"Now for the choice that will really make you cry"
Me: But you already Killed Legion😥
I love this video, this was perfect in every way possible. I love Tali with all my heart and I really enjoyed the lessons you presented when learning about Tali. Great job and keep up the good work. Hope to see more Mass Effect Content when the remastered version comes out.
I'm surprised you skipped over her "Thank you... Captain" line. THIS is the moment Tali realizes who is truly looking out for her best interests, even if she still puts the fleet ahead of herself. I don't know. To me, this is the hardest hitting line of her loyalty mission. Captain isn't just some rank to quarians. It's a symbol of something greater. They put great expectation on captains. It's one of the first things that's discussed after boarding the Rayya. So her calling you "Captain" in the end....significant symbolism there.
Truthfully, I'm not sure why I omitted that. I was sure it made the cut, but I guess not. Oopsies!
@@XBadgerKnightX maybe I just missed it. Unless you absolutely know you omitted it. But it speaks out to me so much I figured I'd have noticed if it was there or not.
I also only ever pick the destroy ending. The reasons are:
1) control is a fallacy and is what started the whole cycle of harvest by the reapers in the first place.
2) synthesis is FORCING your will upon a galaxy, changing everyone and everything thing to YOUR wishes, on the advice of a millenia old AI of EXTREMELY suspicious origins. And it is a form, YET AGAIN, of CONTROL.
Destroy puts an end to a VERY bad idea and returns the Great Experiment known as Life back on track. Plus, and here's the truly creepy thought, if you choose synthesis that means sentience is given back to EVERYTHING including husks; talk about a living nightmare! Or how's about being a reaper made up of a long dead harvested species and now hey, you get ALLLL that agency back. All those memories.
No. Destroy is the MERCIFUL ending to what the Leviathans started.
Please make more videos like this! I love your deep analysis of Mass Effect characters. I've watched this and the Liara video like 10 times each, thank you so much for this contribution to the fandom.
Currently working on an episode involving Garrus. It's a bit hectic after I released a psudo DoC episode looking at Ann Takamaki of Persona 5 fame. Took me most of December to start and the project persisted through the holidays, then into January when I started up school again. I just need to talk about ME3 and Garrus' romance in the video. It should take a another week or two.
The first time I played ME3 I got the bad ending with the Quarians. Immediately after Tali killed herself, I started over with a new game of ME2 to make sure I could make peace with the Geth and the Quarians the next time. I've beaten the entire series more than half a dozen times since then and I've saved them every time.
@ 1:20:10
For my first play-through, Tali really did kill Robo-Saren (Saren has blown his brains out in every playthrough). It's actually a tradition now to take her to the final level and let her take the shot, if possible (in fact, it's always the same two: Garrus and Tali). She did it two more times, and one more was part of a fusillade with me, so it was technically a tie.
So when I saw that, It was just perfect. Yeah, I figured this was going to be the dialogue in every case, but here it actually matched what really happened--especially the first play-through. Made the scene feel that much better.
(so, for those wondering: first play-through, all my weapons overheated, and I'd just used the adrenaline rush and unity, so they needed to recharge; Saren was down to a sliver of life. Garrus was KO (knocked down almost as soon as he got back up). Thought I was screwed; armor had been shot up, no first aid, and I was wounded; Tali was too. Then I heard a shotgun blast, and Saren dropped dead. Tali had hit him with a Sledgehammer IV round IIRC.).
As someone who romances Ash and Tali, I am THRILLED someone else saw how they were the same.
The "destroy" ending doesn't harm the Quarian at all, we can clearly see them rebuilding their civilization Rannoch, wether you allied with the Geth or not
It was a "what-if" situation where Tali or Shepard wouldn't know the outcome of her choices, only her best guesses.
Amazing video, dude. I wasn't expecting it to be THIS good. Tali is my favorite fictional character of all time and I absolutely love her. 10/10 video.
I'm so glad I found this video. I have always respected the Quarian people because they have always been determined to push forward, to try there hardest to survive even when it felt the universe didn't want them.
I have always cared for Tail, but admit I couldn't point it into words why. This video wrapped it all in a bundle. I try not to cry, but so much of this video made me do just that. Furthermore, I appreciate what you did for Tali by making this video.
Only thing I didn't like was repeating that damn suicide scene, you bosh'tet. I'd let you be the first to show that scene, because I had been dreading it, but while the first time hit me like a damn Brute, the second time had me sobbing, and the third had me feeling dead inside and wanting to kill something. A lotta something.
Altogether, a very good video, and a very good analysis. I applaud you for your work, good sir. I even learned a few things I didn't know. If I ever was sent to another universe and met Tali, I'd be content.
May your battles be glorious and your victories bring you honor. Keelah se'lai
"This is the most essential paragon interruption in the whole series..." YA DAMN STRAIGHT IT IS!!!
Nice video. Tali has definitely grown on me!
Thank you! The next video is going to be covering Garrus and will be made public this week. The next video will either be covering you or Miranda before the legendary edition gets released. Stay tuned!
Yo the other best girl of the trilogy
I was listening to this while drifting to sleep. The Sonic springboard made me jump and squeeze out a surprise fart.
HAHAHAHAA
Every f*cking time I try to romance someboduy else I just can't. Tali forever.
I can relate.
"Okay. New experience this time. You can do this. Jack, Miranda, Ash, Liara, all good choices."
Tali Appears.
"Cure my weakness!"
Next DoC Episode On Garrus Vakarian IS AVAILABLE NOW: ua-cam.com/video/z4mDN1PlboE/v-deo.html
*- TIMESTAMPS -*
00:00-4:49: Intro, Ground Rules Shameless Plugs
4:50-11:05: Part 1: Context About Bioware Writing Female Leads
11:06 - 18:16: Part 2: A Caring Commander
18:17- 20:20: Part 3: Tali's Relationship to Normandy's Crew
20:21 - 1:01:08 - Part 4: Duty Vs. Family (Feat. Super Aunt Shala'Raan Vas Tonbay)
1:01:09 - 1:13:59 - Part 5: A Duty That Kills Family
1:14:00 - 1:40:19 - Part 6: Tali'Zorah & Shepard Vas Normandy
1:40:20 - 1:46:19 - Part 7: An End, Once and For All
1:46:20 - 1:48:44 - What Have We Learned?
1:48:45 - 1:51:00: Outro and A Thanks For Watching!
Paragade is also my Shep, 'cuz I hated restrictions in some situations so my saves were edited to have 9001 points of renegade and paragon.
Tali dying in a front end collision on her vacation to California is truly the darkest timeline :(
Great video! I watched it in like 7 separate parts and it was worth while
Outstanding video! Loved it! Easily one of my favorite characters in the series
I bought Legendary Edition about 2 months ago. I've been playing nonstop and completed the trilogy 6 times now. I can tell Tali is the best girl just because her personality is great and she's so innocent. After I figured out how to romance people I went for Tali straight away. I've romanced Tali 5 times and Garrus once. And every time in ME3 final push when she says ''I have a home'' I start crying. Perfect game but I hoped that ending would be better for Tali's sake.
You need an excuse to romance tali?
You're right lmao dont need one lmao
@@XBadgerKnightX Will you do an Analysis of (at least) some of the more important companions of ME? (Such as Ashley Wrex and Miranda, As opposed to the less relevant in my mind Jack, Thane and DLC Characters)
And maybe even some new companions/updates on Tali & Liara in ME4 when it’s out whenever that is?
@@emperorvader283 I'm already working on a video involving Garrus at the moment, and more videos are planned. I might do a video on Ashley and Miranda in the future depending on how fast I can get that done before the Legendary Edition comes out.
Only 15 more days...
Then ill get to see her once again.
The Legendary edition drops this Sunday; I know who I'm romancing my first play thru!
As someone who played Mass Effect 2 and 3 at least 3 times, and just recently romanced Tali, I can officially say that Tali is indeed best girl, and actually shares number one best character spot beside Garrus because I just can't choose between best bro and best girl.
I have them on my team as much as I can. Best girl for charging twits and best bri to pop heads at range!
In all of my 10+ playthroughs of the trilogy. I've never even once been forced to choose between the geth and the quarians.
Peace has always been an option.
Plus, I could never choose the geth over Tali anyways. She's been there by your side since you began the journey.
I've always liked Tali's character. She reminds me a lot of myself.
It's been years since I've played through and now I'm going through Legendary Edition without remembering all the correct decisions for the best outcomes. I've already lost Mordin and Zaeed during the suicide mission, and I'm terrified that I made a mistake somewhere and I'll have to choose.
My favorite analysis was the Geth destroying the Quarians and why Tali truly killed herself....not because of Shepard choosing the Geth but because it's true....she couldn't stop the sheer blinding hubris of the Admirals and Quarian leadership because of duty...it's the "Icarus paradox.". The very advantage, confidence, or factor you think supports you ends up being the thing that kills you by in essence your own hand.
XBadgerKnightX: Tali should not be so willing to be a sacrificial lamb, it's her flaw. But getting her there will ruin your chances of romancing her.
Me: Guess I'll have to sacrifice our rel... Wait a second.
Basically yeah lol
Thank you sooo much for letting me appreciate the awesome story telling and character building skill of Bioware in ME 1,2,3 again.... until it didn't T.T
It is possible to have Tali exiled, romance her and make peace between Geth and Quarians. You just have to do everything else right. By dumb luck, this happened to me on my first playthrough.
Me too.
Don't cheapen your achievement. For it was not luck, but your decisions and strength of your character that made it happen.
@@m0rtez713 Fair enough, but I call it luck because the whole peace between the Geth and Quarians situation is determined by a hidden reputation check. You need a certain score to pass the check and it’s not paragon or renegade that determine the check but your choices during the Geth/Quarian war that determine the check’s outcome. Tali being exiled in the biggest penalty to this check. A new player wouldn’t know about this hidden check which is why I call it luck.
@Jesup1204 There are three components. You need to have done several essential things and have enough peace points to unlock the Charm/Intimidate options, and you need enough charisma to Charm/Intimidate.
Tali not being an admiral is a point loss, but not a dealbreaker if you destroyed the heretics.
@@KopperNeoman I know and that’s what happened on my first playthrough.
So glad I found this video. Tali is for sure best girl.
I've never seen either of the Geth/Quarian only choices. And I usually bully the Council to let Tali remain a member of the fleet.
That bad end for Tali... is the most heart-wrenching scene in all ME Trilogy. PERIOD.
This video deserves way more likes than it has!!
6:12 Is there any Mass Effect player dedicated enough to Paragon to resist the urge to smash that Renegade Interrupt?
First off this is a great analysis of a fantastic character. Second I feel like I gotta mention now how I was listening to this while on a drive back home from a trip...so you making that car crash analogy may have hit quite hard at that point, lol
1:04:05 I can never do this to legion, even watching it is painful. Making peace between the quarians and the geth is the only way
Then do it to the Geth VI that replaces Legion if he wasn’t reactivated or died
Best Girl:Tali
Best Boy:Garrus
I love them both and it makes me so fucking happy that if you don't romance one of them they get together.
Mad respect for dedicating the time to make such videos! Subscribed :)
Thanks dude! Next video is going to be covering Garrus - watch those sub boxes!
Now obviously if there's a "most essential paragon interrupt" regardless of how renegade you are, there definitely is a most essential renegade interrupt regardless of how paragon you are. So shove that eclipse asshat in Thane's recruit mission out the 150th story window and ask "how about goodbye?"
I bought the legendary edition, like just now, bcuz I found your videos and have now binged your dichotomy’s. You’ve got talent my friend 😊
This is so very well done. Thanks for taking the time to make this video
Thanks dude! Currently working on a video for Garrus atm, so stay tuned!