How to Make SF6 Mechanics Even Better [Daigo] [Daigo Umehara]
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- Опубліковано 22 сер 2023
- Daigo Umehara
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/ fgctranslated - Ігри
I think normals dealing gray life during burnout would be a good change to reward burning the opponent out without breaking too much. It would essentially reward you for pressuring more with normals and then cashing out with a special, but you’d still need to make sure to cancel into something safe in order to get your chip damage in. This would overall be healthy since not many top tiers have specials that you can just throw out in block strings and be safe: Guile has Sonic Boom but outside of the corner you aren’t looping that, Luke has heavy charged Flash Knuckle but there’s a pretty big gap, JP has safe specials but not at the range where he’s doing normal strings, Dee Jay has M.Sobat but jury’s still out on whether he’s even considered top tier anymore…
…then you have Cammy and Ken who both have pressure loops that involve a special in blockstun in Spin Knuckle and Jinrai respectively, so that’d be a fun issue for the dev team to solve. I imagine at that point they’d give Ken some nerfs to his pokes since his pressure somehow became even better and he doesn’t need as good of a neutral presence to be good. I’m thinking a frame less hitstun on st.MK, 2 more frames of recovery on st.HP and a bit less range on cr.MK. As for Cammy… they’d probably just take away 500 health and call it a day tbh
That's really high praise for SF6 form a Alpha fanatic like daigo. Dayum.
The last thing this game needs if more offensive tools. Daigo even said this game is offence heavy.
One thing i want to see is drive rush be punish counterable. Its so prevalent by the top tiers and the risk reward is not in the defenders favor right now.
Personally i think that there is enough tools to actually be used against drive rush but the window to utilize them is so small (imo), its just not as viable especially for lower level
just check it bro lol
Definitely, right now DR is too good. If you get it, its huge reward. Even if you block, its also a bad because of the plus frames from DR, you are basically dealing with an Oki situation. On top of that, blocking a DR means you lose Drive meter, and you have to block a few more hits, you could lose up to a bar of Drive meter or more. The person doing the DR and block strings would have gained half a bar back, or more. So the cost of DR is really just half a bar, and for that insanely cheap cost, you get oki pressure and drain opponent's Drive meter. You can parry against DR but you are still at risk for a punish counter throw, which deals 20% and its a hard knockdown and puts you back in oki situation. The only real way to win against DR is to check it, however, checking it is really hard especially against DJ and Juri, there is a great risk of failing the check and get hit by a big combo. You could also trade when checking, but because DR gives +4 frames, even if you trade, you are still actually open for opponent to convert into a combo off the trade hit.
DR definitely needs some nerf, either by reducing its rewards or increasing its risks. Making DR a punish counter state when hit is a good change, it keeps the rewards the same but make it risker. By contrast, its more rewarding for the defender to check DR, especially with heavy buttons. Higher risk but also higher reward for checking DR. If not, we could reduce the reward of DR by making the DR enhanced attack not drain any Drive meter if blocked and also not make DR user gain meter when hitting a blocking opponent. This should keep the overall DR meter cost and meter drain on a blocking opponent slightly fairer.
I think it should just add a single plus frame, maybe two, but 4!? That’s wild
Will never happen bad idea
Hm a drive option mid-screen against burnout would be cool. Although like he says some characters play a lot better in/against burnout than others. JP for instance does not need help ending the round via burnout. They could even make mid-screen DI against a burnout opponent guarantee a knockdown, although then you're still ending the round with throws. Even just giving more plus frames on midscreen DI, but, it could feel cheesy if it's too guaranteed.
全キャラにJP並のバーンアウトさせたときの優位性持たせられれば面白いだろうけど、
うまくバランス取ってそれを実現させる方法が全く思い浮かばない
drive crush would give character like ken even more offensive power , pressure and d impact kinda gard crush so no need.
He addresses this. At a high level, specially if your opponent playing modern, you can't really DI if they have a super bar.
@@RenanRF77right I missed that i'm still not into guard crush you die so quickly, jauge go up fast in this game and surviving a pressing can be quite hard so if you have to worry about a guard crush even more + the throw you won't get your turn and will get a perfect pressing more easily. I don't know about you but I am ok with a 50/50.😊
I think maybe DI midscreen on block in burnout leading into a different reel animation where you're close enough to blockstring at +1 or 2 advantage could be an elegant solution. I think an outright guard crush would be far too lethal and only serve to exasperate the gap of characters who can punish burnout effectively vs those who can't
SF6 is great, I want like 10 years of DLC characters, 32 characters should be nice.
I want Twelve, Oro and Hugo again but the original SFIII not the posterior versions.
dunno about you but I mained Twelve in 3s and I sure as hell don't want that version again. I can't bear to have him be that bad for another 20 years lol
Makes sense. With parry essentially being an auto block shield and DI having 2 points of armor a lot of the time you have no choice but to throw or shimmy in order to win.
I think more offensive options would be terrible, especially to end the game, one of the things i like about sf6 more than other games is this stalemate at the end of a round, the lack of chip unless in burn out is a main key for that
HAIL LORD DAIGO
SF6 is really good. I want to spend many years on it.
The beast yearns for Sol Badguy
Modern controls is an amazing addition to Street Fighter and has done wonderful things for its accessibility, but I truly do not enjoy fighting opponents with 1 button invincible reversals. I don't think it's fair to use nor fun to fight, nor do I like the idea of the "accessible controls" being on equal or higher footing than the traditional ones.
very true, specially against characters with really good supers like Luke's lvl1 that can just snipe everything you do and beat fireballs quite consistently
also, I think it's messed up that you can do supers with the classic input and get full damage as well, you get the best of both worlds
Spoken like a salty classic player
@@vbby That is very visibly what I am, yes.
@@vbby Why are modern players physically incapable of addressing criticism of modern controls? Are they scared?
maybe the issue is 1 button modern supers instead of di being too weak
Just a random thought: Do you guys think it'd be cool to have aerial perfect parries or drive airdashes in SF6?
@@rleften5788 Yeah, you're probably right. We've got GG and animu fighters to scratch that airdashing itch.
You should just play 3rd Strike if you want air parry or Guilty Gear, BlazBlue, DBFZ if you want drive airdash.
Absolutely not. I must say I'm very open minded and pro changes in fgs, but imo there are limits to some changes. Air dashes is unacceptable in SF. Also I never liked air parry, it's a good thing its out this time.
@@carlosaugusto9821 I've actually always wondered how FG people in general feel about air parrying, can you explain your distaste for it? Does it make jump-ins too safe?
What if? If the could add the option to choose a type of mechanic parry just like 3rd strike. Tbh I didn’t feel like using auto parry bc it’s reaction is slow.
Sorry but that's sounds like too much sweaty hardcore battle design. Not a good idea for this game. I even like some "custom options" ideas like choice of super in SF3, battle mode or groove in CvS, assist type in MvC, Variations in MK, etc. But selection of parry type is crossing the line, getting into an absurd level of detail. Because that's just one simple mechanic among many, and it has no higher status in the whole design of mechanics. It's maybe more important to you because you love 3S, and that's it. I mean, there's no reason not to also add different selectable types of drive rush, drive impact, etc... And that would hurt SF's "simplicity".
Maybe one way to do it would have been make parrying in classic controls look very close to parrying in 3S, then make this standard auto parry the option for modern controls. That is totally doable and reasonable imo. But not creating an option to choose parry types.
バーンアウトしましたじゃあ下がります、ガード固めますって時間になってるのがなあ
ガード上から削ったところで地味なダメージしか入らないし
下がるより前に出たくなる感じで でもダメージ食らっちゃう感じのバランスが欲しい
相手に割られてピンチって感じより攻めに使い切ったから待機時間になってるだけだし
Respect for Daigo but if there's more offensive options when in burnout then there's no point of burnout. Players will just brainlessly spend drive gauge without any fear of burnout since they still have plenty of offensive options in burnout. I mean, last time i check people HATED offensive mechanic like Ultra or V-trigger that give big rewards for the one who almost lost the match or doing wrong. Hence why Capcom implemented burnout and chip damage / kill in SF 6. With burnout, it's a reward for the offense side but it's a punishment for the other side who didn't manage their drive meter carefully / too defensive and also a reminder there's no easy comeback mechanic that will help them to get around. For now, i don't think Capcom should change Drive mechanic or burnout. Just buff / nerf character and let the meta grow.
To me it depends on the "change"... I agree if it's the kind of change discussed in the video, because it's too early for that...
But simple adjustments and balancing of those drive mechanics must be considered for maybe 3 months from now. That's not urgent but it's reasonable enough based on the time span since launch and the amount of data of high level competition so far.
@@carlosaugusto9821 Any simple universal adjustments for drive mechanics say maybe raw DR cost 1.5 bar, DI deal less damage, or perfect parry have less damage scalling, the effect will be BIG and gonna change everything. Not just it will change how we play SF 6 forever but it could also change the balance and ruin the game. Example, Ryu can deal 5600 damage combos with full drive gauge and CA. But if they change raw drive rush from 1 to 1.5 gauge, it could change the combos and nerf the damage. Or imagine Gief who really needs drive rush to cover his slow walkspeed, but he will do less raw drive rush after it cost 1.5.
This is why i prefer just buff/nerf the character and don't change the universal mechanic until the meta really mature. But with how loud people want changes for drive mechanics, i guess Capcom gonna do it next year with the first big update.
Add heavy damage scaling to combos started with drive rush and drive impact and this game will be perfect
🧢
@@Uooooooooooooh you probably someone who spam DI
Drive Impact… already has extra scaling and already wasn’t a threat at high level and you think it needs MORE nerfs?
@@shieldlesscap6124 not a threat at high level?
@@shieldlesscap6124 Have you watched literally any events? lmao
You get to diamond… just to see people not use drive rush or drive impact, at a high level play where reactions and spacing is everything.
DI yes, but not DR. DR is still prevalent
DR is very very usable if not more so than the lower ranks
Nope. Even in high Diamond and Master people use DI and DR. It's just used smarter.
Sf6 is the best
I wish they nerfed or scaled SA damage. It's way too common to do over 50% damage from a single combo. Feels like playing Divekick.
🐑
バーンアウト中は攻撃半減、被ダメージUPとかピンチ度もっと上げればいいんやね
Personally I prefer guardcrush, simple, effective, to the point and immediately has ramifications. Often feel that burnout doesn't mean anything in SF6 people fight their way out of it very well and some characters are very oppressive in burnout and others it doesn't mean anything.
In terms of "most well designed game"...yea a lot of people dislike drive rush the way it's being used. I do think it should get looked at in some way, it's very scrubby.
still don't think 2 months is enough though. The meta still progressing ,let it cook for another half year would be fine.
バーンアウトのペナルティ増やしたら今の強キャラたちがさらに猛威を振るう未来しか見えないんだが
Parry being split to High and Low parry and requiring the appropriate block direction would be sick. This auto parry is whack and it kind of ruins cross-ups.
Buff Ryu.
ここで言ってもしゃーないけど、バーンアウト中はガードできないとかになったら流石に大味すぎるだろうか。
もしくはガードそのものはできるけど、ダメージ自体はガードしてない時と同じぐらい食らうとか。
I would absolutely loved this game if the entire drive system never existed. Of course by that, JP should not exist as well.
For over 30 years, I play SF to play a slower paced footie/fundamental game. I got plenty of other games to play if I want something at a faster pace. Drive Rush practically just skips neutral and +4 on moves is ridiculously rewarding especially for overheads.
Also I absolutely hate Drive Impact, P1 does DI (26 frame), P2 doesn't react in time - P1 get combo, P2 react in time - P2 get combo. Reacting to a 26 frame (less than half of a second) move in time or not makes too much of a difference.
SF6 really plays nothing like a SF game.
Buff Manon
D-System is a good mechanic? It finally happened. Daigo has lost his mind.
Its a great mechanic.
MだとSAゲージ1本あったらインパクト狙えないはおかし過ぎない？その他も諸々もMってだけでシステムに逆らい過ぎてない？
MがやりやすいってだけでCでも入れ込んでる人もいるし
ワンボタン昇竜も結局は読み合いの結果よ 文句あるならM使えってことになるし
@@xDOMIOx Mはいくらなんでもやる事簡単になり過ぎでしょ。ゲーム性がおかしくなってる。
モダンにワンボタンSAや昇竜なかったらただダメージ低い&一部の通常技や必殺技が出せないデメリットだけだから。
コマンド入力はレバーレスもかなりの速さだしクラシックでもDIは返せないことは無い。
@@AK-cg2qgそれお前クラシックでも同じ動きできるんだな？操作の体系で明らかに違う動きっておかしいよな？言ってること分かるか？
ウメハラもワンボタン無敵には苦言を呈してたよね