Tucker Carlson has become an avatar of the people who raised me. I grew up with a lot of privilege. The adults around me were hard-working people who promised me that if I played by the rules and worked harder than anyone else, I would win the brass ring. Now I'm 52, and these folks who raised me are simultaneously very comfortably retired and so, so angry. I can't figure out if their anger is the result of feeling unfairly critiqued by younger, poorer and more ethnically diverse Americans, or if they realized that money really can't buy everything. They can't seem to lift their gaze from their own navels long enough to look at the world around them and really ask if our economy can continue to grow when so many young people spend more of their their paychecks on housing and healthcare, while carrying crazy debt from doing the right thing and going to college. Now, the same people who insisted that I had to go to college to live a good life accuse colleges of promoting socialism. They don't want to confront the reality that college is where some of us got our first credit cards before it became illegal for banks to set up tables outside of the college bookstore. They're doing well financially. Their grandchildren are not. And instead of asking why, it seems like they're training their guns onto their grandkids. I don't understand it.
It's called the shame/honor response. They feel ashamed that they let things get this way. But instead of reacting with the emotion of shame, which would require introspection, they react by doing everything they can to protect their honor - no matter how ridiculous the arguments are.
It's almost as if they have disassociated with the reality of the situation. It's like they have been tuned into a media that plays on their hopes and fears. They are unhappy with the world and have been handed scapegoats, the left, the youth, immigrants, urban poverty, etc. At least you are awake and not buying into a lazy mindset full of fear and anger.
My daughter and I are both Stewart & Colbert fans, and we attended this rally. The most memorable trip we ever made for many reasons. The costumes & signs that people carried were hilarious. The size of the crowd on the mall was unbelievable, and phone signals were being jammed. No one had phone service and we got separated trying to walk thru the crowd. Then our phone batteries died, and we couldn't find each other. We finally met at the Washington Monument, and went to eat dinner, not knowing the trains did not stop at Arlington after 6 pm, and took us to a far stop in Virginia. We had to taxi back to Arlington, and discovered the car was locked inside the Cemetery for the night. We ended up in the ER lobby at George Washington hospital and people were coming in dressed in Halloween costumes ,covered in fake blood. One rally attendee got 120 stitches in his head from a fall on a train escalator. In the morning we walked back across the Potomac bridge only to find it blocked by buses & Homeland Security wearing masks & holding machine guns, because a sniper was loose . There were helicopters overhead, police boats patrolling the area, and the gate was still locked and we were told that "no one can go in or out". Then, Curtis, a parking attendant drove through the far back arch in a big, beat up car , and he drove up to the gate, and unlocked it. He gave us a ride to our car, and then walked beside our car as he directed my daughter to drive up onto the patio and weave between the tables outside the Visitor Center to reach the back road. He gave us instructions and directed us to the guy down at the back gate of the cemetery. With helicopters and Homeland Security , we expected to be stopped, but no one bothered us. Just as Curtis said, there was one lone man at the back gate, and he let us out. That long ordeal over, and not having slept in over 24 hrs, we drove to Mount Vernon and took the tour. Everyone should try to visit Mount Vernon , if they can. I now see D. C. rallies on the television, and I am happy to just be watching on my tv or youtube.
Today is November 4th. It is the eve of the election between Kamala Harris & Donald Trump. I am exhausted! I am also grateful for this pallet cleanser of a conversation. Your interview helped to answer the question, "How did we get here?" Thank you for also "bringing the receipts" with clips illustrating how long Jon Stewart has been sounding the alarm. This should prove to my children we were not all complicit! 🥺
American decline: proof that demography is destiny. And what demographics are these two from? Oh, yes, THAT demographic, the one that pays to run the nation into h*ll.
precisely! Jon and then Colbert saved our souls and minds in those early dark years of around '05ish iirc onward, even '04? Many of us knew shiete was possibly on the way and then during Obama the neo-reactionaries started sounding off & apparently successfully getting organized. We have no choice now but to oppose it with all our energy, namely if DJT win's this election, in which case i predict a need for some historic unprecedented peaceful civil disobedience which is the only tool free ppl have when the courts don't stop a tramping on core and inalienable rights, ie rights are self-evident.
Great discussion. As a person who has lived into their eighth decade, I’m struck by the differences I experienced pre-Reagan. I guess one always felt the “us against them” disparity, but it didn’t consume every day life. Now that money is the upfront, displayed proudly motivation behind so much of life, I have become less hopeful decade by decade. For me, the major problem with our presidential campaigns, is the lack of money and lack of time limits for campaigning. The problem with our legislature comes from electing the people who spent the most money, and then, having our elected officials spend hours a day, fundraising! Why not spend hours a day working on helping the people of the country?
As soon as the Cold War ended we had no enemy and our focus started shifting inward. Then 911 happened and we had an enemy but he didn't wear a uniform or own a country and his ideology was that he hated us. It wasn't enough to keep us focused on the someone outside despite Afghanistan being the longest war in our history. Our search for the enemy is once again focused within. We should be focused externally on Putin, Kim Jong Un, and anti-democratic authoritarians at large but half our nation seems to be embracing them.
The rally to restore sanity and/or fear was one of the greatest events in my life!!! Went to the rally with hope and joy in my heart. Fell in love with a beautiful woman there and, instead of going back home 3 days later, lived with her in DC for 6 months!!! Please, please please John. Get the band back together and do this again!!! America NEEDS this!
@crashtestdummy2337 I moved 6,000 miles away to pursue a lifelong dream. Long distance relationships are hard. Even harder in a place with no internet when the mail is delivered every two months. Minor misunderstandings become catastrophic when communication is nearly impossible.
I wet to the rally. I flew in to DC for the day from Atlanta. I met a couple from California on the Metro ride down to the mall. We spent the afternoon together and are still friends to this day.
Comedy must be honest at its core in order to succeed, which is why conservative comedy generally fails. It’s always made sense to me that people trust comedians
This reminds me of a statement my undergrad History Professor made during class: “There are two types of people who will always tell you the truth: a Historian, and a Comedian.”
Best podcast yet. Thank you Ezra, you are both brilliant. Keeping up with Jon is no small feet while leading the context and flow, exceptionally well done and engaging.
I was there for that event. It was the largest, most enjoyable, entertaining and uplifting mass event I've ever seen or attended. If nothing else, I got to be present for Ozzy, The OJs and Kat Stevens playing on stage together for a "train" medley. That will never, ever happen again. And of course, Mythbusters having the thousands of us "laugh like a mad scientist" and then jump to test the seismic read from our combined hop. It was incredible. Only time I ever enjoyed being in DC.
There are no Republicans against Trump. No such person would have the indecency to vote for the party of mass baby murder and endless trans-mutilation. You are a liar.
Ezra, what a brilliant idea to revisit the Rally with Jon at this moment! The thing that I always felt most people didn't get about The Daily Show back then was that Jon Stewart was focused not on right vs left wing politics, but criticizing the media itself: the rise of flagrant propaganda through lying and hyperbole, punditry in the 24-hour news cycle substituting for investigative reporting, emotional manipulation to keep eyeballs glued to the screen for advertisers. Jon tried to explain this during some in-depth interviews with tone-deaf journalists on the left. They never saw that it was the MESSAGING he was frustrated with because he could see, as a student of political history, where irresponsible journalism, spectacle, and campaigns of disinformation might lead us. I had no trouble understanding the point of the Rally to Restore Sanity at the time. I think the most of his viewers got it, too. The media did not (or would not).
Wow! So great to listen to this. As you said a Rosetta Stone Moment. The political waters that we are all swimming in are not less perilous but at a minimum I feel less alone. So glad you came back for us Jon. We've really been missing you in this dark passage. Thank you and Ezra as always a thoughtful and thought provoking production. I love how you listen and let your guests be who they are. What you do is an art. Kudos!
I actually ran across my 'Sanity and/or Fear' bumper sticker last week! Ah, looking back, those were such (relatively) innocent times, n'est-ce pas? I never watched 'Crossfire' because I absolutely despise "all hollering, all the time" programs. Jon was exactly right, it was theater. Also agree about Novak. I have never forgiven him for exposing Valerie Plame. Finally, Vonnegut ... YES! kiss-kiss!
I loved this. It's been rough being a " free thinker" these last several years. When politics became about a personality cult I lost so many people in my life, including my adult children. At this point I am completely alone. My late husband fell for Shawn Hannity and became controlling and then angry . I had to leave and he took his life. I think Jon Stesart rally in 2010 was good intentioned but I'm learned people don't like to be told they are insane lol. I have blamed social media, which tells people how to think. Even some younger people on the " left" want to believe conspiracies. It's been hard to figure out what was happening because of the trauma I've been through and my adult children have been through. My adult children seem so selfish and self centered and I care passionately about inequality. It's been hard living in a deep red county and getting hateful nasty messages from strangers and have old friends lose their mind over pride parades. Lol.Hopefully we have a way forward. I never imagined in my life I'd see white supremist openly marching down street.
This. I don't have adult children, because I don't have children at all. But it is lonely sometimes. During covid, I marveled that so many of my friends and family were suddenly suspicious of public health policy that had managed and controlled infectious disease and lengthened our lifespans. Throughout covid, which I managed to contract once, I remember being shocked. I never thought the vaccine would be some sort of miracle. I knew that it would reduce deaths and blunt the more severe effects for a vulnerable people. I live in Texas, and I am gobsmacked at the people in my community who have adopted the fear and loathing of immigrant laborers, even as we are surrounded by those very same people quietly going about their business. I kid you not: I was once standing in my front yard chatting with a neighbor. She was wringing her hands, talking about how frightened she is of Latin American migrants. About 4 minutes into her monologue, one of the guys who works for the irrigation company that services and installs my sprinkler system repairs walked past us. She paused her speech about scary Latin American migrant laborers, smiled brightly at him, and said hi. It's frightening to see so many people co-opted by a well-funded political project so easily. They hit the talking points- this is an invasion!- but they do not live their lives like people who are being threatened or invaded.
Wait are you saying the genocide of Palestinians is just a conspiracy that stupid young people believe. Maybe it's time for you to vote RFK or even Big Bad Orange.
NiceyB - B strong - sending positive energy ur way. Same- have lost fam/acquaintances bc of maga. John & Ezra gave us intelligent insight & hope. We realists will prevail. peace 2 u.
This is why Stewart is so deliciously smart. Metaphorical 'orthogonality' can convey the idea of multiple directions or influences converging at a single point where each influence contributes something without directly overlapping the others. This interpretation captures a more nuanced kind of interaction - one where elements remain distinct but combine to produce a collective effect. And Stewart is smart enough to have recognized that nuance.
Best of show gentlemen. Gory as our history is, I believe we are optimists first, political animals second. Jon evidenced it with "80-90% of us sit down, together, figure it out and move to project B; the other 10%-20% run the show." Yes and yes to the first part, and not so fast on the second one part, or Jon and Ezra would not have successful lives and careers. You both know Margaret Meade's "what a few people can do" phrasing... 1995 to 1999 I was key part of legislation that made it to Clinton's desk: "The Ticket to Work and Work Incentives Improvement Act" , enhancing and improving (too modestly) employment access for Americans with a Disability, bipartisan co-authors Ted Kennedy, Moynihan, Jeffords and Grassley. It took passages through 5 Committees in Congress to get to the House and Senate floors. Clinton signed on Dec. 17, 1999, the very last US Legislation signed into law in the 20th Century. We had no lobbyist, we had no money, we did have connections and damn it we made more of them. We had grit, we had great ideas whose time had come. We were in the 80-90% crowd and we changed US Law in Medicare, Medicaid, Supplemental Security Income (SSA), Social Security Disability Insurance, and Vocational Rehabilitation Programming. It was a final two years backdrop of Monica Lewinski. Every day the sky was falling. WE GOT IT DONE, here, in the USA. Thanks Jon and Ezra you're smart cynically grounded optimists.
Give credit to Jon Stewart for being a man of great wealth and fame who's generally managed to do a really good job staying grounded and in-touch(ish) with regular people. The contrast is *STARK* when set against the bubble that the serviettes of wealth and power at NYT... Jon's eyes at @09:45 convey ALL our bafflement at the detached deluded island they speak to/for us from.
I was there with my 7 year old, it was very clear that it was a once in a lifetime event. It was perfect. We'd been to many protests and marches but this one was profound for many reasons, not the least because of the humor, soooo freaking funny.
This was the first political rally I ever went to. Today, I'm a constitutional law expert consulting in national political organizations and working in amending the constitution.
Jon Stewart is the elder statesmen in me. He speaks the language of my heart in this political world. So cool to learn about the behind the scenes understanding of media. Nothing is more interesting to me these days.
Around 21:26 Stewart hits Klein with harsh truth about the excuse he just made ("the media is not in control, it's not self-directed, it reflects the public") for the media to avoid responsibility. Stewart says I'm paraphrasing - "Rather than being engaged in battle in support of the truth, you're just part of the algorithm, chasing the clicks/money." As Klein tends to do when faced with his capability, he shifts to something else rather than addressing or even acknowledging that truth.
Great discussion. The other side of the coin on the Megyn Kelly situation at NBC is Pat McAfee on ESPN. Some executives absolutely hate him, but his show generates TONS of revenue and they are absolutely stuck and are sucking it up, even with Pat, who I like, reading an ESPN executive the riot act on air, although it may have been off-ESPN and in the third hour that isn't broadcast on the network, but was widely distributed on social media just the same. If executives cared about anything but money he would have been gone in a second. Instead, we're enjoying what he's producing, hopefully for the long term.
@@nancychandler3673 I still watch the daily show on mondays, plus late show monologues (colbert, meyers, kimmel) on youtube. I’ll watch all of last week tonight sometimes. last week tonight is my favorite now.
I like both these people. A lot. But it says a lot about the situation at The New York Times when Ezra abruptly shifts topics from the media being "self-directed" when Jon references their incentivized need to compete with an algorithm versus the duty to fight 10x harder for the truth. The recent shift towards political sanewashing alongside softer clickbait headlines at the NYT is appalling. Jon was calling it out, and he was definitely interested in discussing it in detail. Clearly, Ezra didn't want to spend a minute longer on the topic (whilst podcasting from the NYT newsroom), and that's a shame.
Don’t know if Jon Stewart remembers, but his and Colbert’s press conference after the rally was down the hall from my own wedding. Tell him we wished we could’ve said hi.
Politics should be about serving the people and improving the country. But every incentive in almost every structure in and around politics is about scoring political points and capturing attention. These are systemic issues that people like John Stewart highlights very well. But I also think that the lack of efforts towards reshaping these incentives are what promotes the frustration and nihilist throught process that threatens these institutions. We live in some dogmas about democracy and capitalism that seems to prevent us from actually being critical of their flaws in a way that ia constructive and appealing.
@@frankmalenfant2828 That’s why I really believe we need to have term limits in Congress. You can start out wanting to serve the country. But you stay there long enough and you start making friends and getting perks. And just like any other job, eventually it becomes more about helping you and your buddies than it is about serving the country.
Wow look how ezra immediately changes the topic when Stewart nails the culpability of the media (including nyt) in not being driven the promote truth over engagement. I like Ezra, he's a great interviewer, but I sense him avoiding certain uncomfortable deeper institutional truths.
Spot on about Carlson and Conway and why they were 'cancelled'. It's not political correctness or 'wokeism', it's plain old capitalism. Political correctness is a product of the media age, when the media turned to advertisers to make money.
Nonsense. Big companies almost all need a good relationship with the evil American bio-communist regime. This is why Tucker was cancelled--it was a second order effect of communist orders. Never trust what Jews or communists tell you.
The thing that always makes me sad is when I look back to sometime in the early 2000's, when I heard that we were now living in a time called The Information Age. I thought surely that meant that we would become collectively _smarter,_ what with so much information at our fingertips, and that from smartness would come true enlightenment. Instead what we have seen is rampant growth in the Dunning Kruger effect, thanks to evil forces making a lot of stupid people think they're smart by feeding them lies that children would have sussed as such only a few decades ago.
Agree. I thought social media would bring people together as a good salon platform. It has become an exposee of self-servitude, deception, judgement and a frightening display of the desperate search for identity.
Yes, all of that floating on a foundation of GREED. The media and social media are siloing us in divisive groups to stop we the people from banding our larger numbers together against rising inequality and taking the 1% down off their ridiculously fabricated platforms. They aren’t better than anyone else they were just luckier in the life lottery. That and we really have so much in common but they try to obscure that to prevent us from banding together. Also, they are often sociopaths completely devoid of empathy and compassion.
@@kreek22 Calling me a little girl (I'm 50 btw) was clearly an intimidation attempt, so it would appear that you take issue with more than just my concept of Dunning Kruger. Why is that? What did I say that angered you to such an extent?
I was there. Came all the way from Phoenix. The green grass you see behind Jon Stewart that day is bizarre to see. I couldn't get close to the stage. It was so packed that day that you couldn't move. I had to watch it on the monitors.
This discussion about what the media is, how it responds and changes due to its audience, and the goal of editorialization is a fundamental and crucial one.
Tucker Carlson has become an avatar of the people who raised me.
I grew up with a lot of privilege. The adults around me were hard-working people who promised me that if I played by the rules and worked harder than anyone else, I would win the brass ring.
Now I'm 52, and these folks who raised me are simultaneously very comfortably retired and so, so angry.
I can't figure out if their anger is the result of feeling unfairly critiqued by younger, poorer and more ethnically diverse Americans, or if they realized that money really can't buy everything.
They can't seem to lift their gaze from their own navels long enough to look at the world around them and really ask if our economy can continue to grow when so many young people spend more of their their paychecks on housing and healthcare, while carrying crazy debt from doing the right thing and going to college.
Now, the same people who insisted that I had to go to college to live a good life accuse colleges of promoting socialism.
They don't want to confront the reality that college is where some of us got our first credit cards before it became illegal for banks to set up tables outside of the college bookstore.
They're doing well financially. Their grandchildren are not. And instead of asking why, it seems like they're training their guns onto their grandkids. I don't understand it.
Perfectly stated. I'm still a Gen X punk railing against the elders who have been slamming the door in our faces since Reagan and 'right to work.'
Poetic. Terribly Poetic.
It's called the shame/honor response. They feel ashamed that they let things get this way. But instead of reacting with the emotion of shame, which would require introspection, they react by doing everything they can to protect their honor - no matter how ridiculous the arguments are.
It's almost as if they have disassociated with the reality of the situation. It's like they have been tuned into a media that plays on their hopes and fears. They are unhappy with the world and have been handed scapegoats, the left, the youth, immigrants, urban poverty, etc. At least you are awake and not buying into a lazy mindset full of fear and anger.
@@freshbiscuit That's extremely interesting.
How refreshing! Two intelligent people having an intelligent conversation!
It's comforting to know even John Stewart, a guy who's been on TV for decades, hates hearing the sound of his own voice.
Humility and self-deprecation are attractive traits of his persona for sure.
Jon....no 'h'
My daughter and I are both Stewart & Colbert fans, and we attended this rally. The most memorable trip we ever made for many reasons. The costumes & signs that people carried were hilarious. The size of the crowd on the mall was unbelievable, and phone signals were being jammed. No one had phone service and we got separated trying to walk thru the crowd. Then our phone batteries died, and we couldn't find each other. We finally met at the Washington Monument, and went to eat dinner, not knowing the trains did not stop at Arlington after 6 pm, and took us to a far stop in Virginia. We had to taxi back to Arlington, and discovered the car was locked inside the Cemetery for the night. We ended up in the ER lobby at George Washington hospital and people were coming in dressed in Halloween costumes ,covered in fake blood. One rally attendee got 120 stitches in his head from a fall on a train escalator. In the morning we walked back across the Potomac bridge only to find it blocked by buses & Homeland Security wearing masks & holding machine guns, because a sniper was loose . There were helicopters overhead, police boats patrolling the area, and the gate was still locked and we were told that "no one can go in or out". Then, Curtis, a parking attendant drove through the far back arch in a big, beat up car , and he drove up to the gate, and unlocked it. He gave us a ride to our car, and then walked beside our car as he directed my daughter to drive up onto the patio and weave between the tables outside the Visitor Center to reach the back road. He gave us instructions and directed us to the guy down at the back gate of the cemetery. With helicopters and Homeland Security , we expected to be stopped, but no one bothered us. Just as Curtis said, there was one lone man at the back gate, and he let us out. That long ordeal over, and not having slept in over 24 hrs, we drove to Mount Vernon and took the tour. Everyone should try to visit Mount Vernon , if they can. I now see D. C. rallies on the television, and I am happy to just be watching on my tv or youtube.
Good for you! Best regards from Italy.
😂 epic trip! thanks for sharing! Greetings from over the pond!
What an amazing story... thank you for sharing!
Oh, what a night! Glad to hear you survived!
Thanks for sharing all this! I lived in DC 12 years and grew to avoid such events, and worked with folk heroes like Curtis.
Today is November 4th. It is the eve of the election between Kamala Harris & Donald Trump. I am exhausted! I am also grateful for this pallet cleanser of a conversation. Your interview helped to answer the question, "How did we get here?" Thank you for also "bringing the receipts" with clips illustrating how long Jon Stewart has been sounding the alarm. This should prove to my children we were not all complicit! 🥺
American decline: proof that demography is destiny. And what demographics are these two from? Oh, yes, THAT demographic, the one that pays to run the nation into h*ll.
precisely! Jon and then Colbert saved our souls and minds in those early dark years of around '05ish iirc onward, even '04? Many of us knew shiete was possibly on the way and then during Obama the neo-reactionaries started sounding off & apparently successfully getting organized. We have no choice now but to oppose it with all our energy, namely if DJT win's this election, in which case i predict a need for some historic unprecedented peaceful civil disobedience which is the only tool free ppl have when the courts don't stop a tramping on core and inalienable rights, ie rights are self-evident.
Wow. I have to hand it to Klein. He got Stewart to do what Stewart does best. And then he published it. Nice work, EK. Thanks.
He is great at denying the role he played in the decline of media while blaming everyone else.
Jon Stewart is so brilliant on multiple levels. He has such a deeep level of character, understanding and clarity time watching him is priceless.
Great discussion. As a person who has lived into their eighth decade, I’m struck by the differences I experienced pre-Reagan. I guess one always felt the “us against them” disparity, but it didn’t consume every day life. Now that money is the upfront, displayed proudly motivation behind so much of life, I have become less hopeful decade by decade. For me, the major problem with our presidential campaigns, is the lack of money and lack of time limits for campaigning. The problem with our legislature comes from electing the people who spent the most money, and then, having our elected officials spend hours a day, fundraising! Why not spend hours a day working on helping the people of the country?
As soon as the Cold War ended we had no enemy and our focus started shifting inward. Then 911 happened and we had an enemy but he didn't wear a uniform or own a country and his ideology was that he hated us. It wasn't enough to keep us focused on the someone outside despite Afghanistan being the longest war in our history. Our search for the enemy is once again focused within. We should be focused externally on Putin, Kim Jong Un, and anti-democratic authoritarians at large but half our nation seems to be embracing them.
This is it - this talk was a talk about the real problems of our day and age.
Thanks for it - and keep up this important work.
The real problems, according to elite Jews.
With a heavy focus on the irresponsible media. Amen.
The rally to restore sanity and/or fear was one of the greatest events in my life!!! Went to the rally with hope and joy in my heart. Fell in love with a beautiful woman there and, instead of going back home 3 days later, lived with her in DC for 6 months!!!
Please, please please John. Get the band back together and do this again!!! America NEEDS this!
Thsts a bit wierd. Why didn't you guys get married?
LoL! That is soo funny! You're exactly what Christian Nationalists fear most. Free, wanton, sexual revolutionary!
@crashtestdummy2337 I moved 6,000 miles away to pursue a lifelong dream. Long distance relationships are hard. Even harder in a place with no internet when the mail is delivered every two months. Minor misunderstandings become catastrophic when communication is nearly impossible.
Not everyone who meets and falls for each other gets married. Sounds like it might have been a blaze. Hope it left you with good memories.
@@crashtestdummy2337 if you think that anecdote is “weird”, I’d say you haven’t gotten out much.
I wet to the rally. I flew in to DC for the day from Atlanta. I met a couple from California on the Metro ride down to the mall. We spent the afternoon together and are still friends to this day.
Good for you.
You always give me things Jon Stewart ; for my heart, mind, and my soul. Thank you.
Such clarity! Thanks guys.
“How crazy is it when politicians are a joke and comedians are taken seriously?” - Will Rogers
Love Kurt, Von gets novels
I think of Jon as standup philosopher.
As crazy as it is getting politics from their religious leaders and religion from political leaders.
@@kidkong637 Politics and religion are kissing cousins. Both are meant to shape society through culture and morality.
Comedy must be honest at its core in order to succeed, which is why conservative comedy generally fails. It’s always made sense to me that people trust comedians
This reminds me of a statement my undergrad History Professor made during class:
“There are two types of people who will always tell you the truth: a Historian, and a Comedian.”
I love Jon Stewart. So brilliant.
Best podcast yet. Thank you Ezra, you are both brilliant. Keeping up with Jon is no small feet while leading the context and flow, exceptionally well done and engaging.
I LOVE watching these two perceptive and articulate minds share a camera up close! Great conversation!
Ezra is the opposite of perceptive if you listened to his interview with Ta-Nihisi Coates.
John Stewart talking about Kurt Vonnegut honestly just makes my day.
Vonnegut's essays are brilliant.
So it goes.
Two greats speaking authentically and sanely, what a relief at this point.
Two bugmen.
Both of these men are obfuscating the truth about the role Jon played in the things he criticizes. How is that better than now?
I was there for that event. It was the largest, most enjoyable, entertaining and uplifting mass event I've ever seen or attended. If nothing else, I got to be present for Ozzy, The OJs and Kat Stevens playing on stage together for a "train" medley. That will never, ever happen again.
And of course, Mythbusters having the thousands of us "laugh like a mad scientist" and then jump to test the seismic read from our combined hop. It was incredible. Only time I ever enjoyed being in DC.
Awesome that we have Jon Stewart on team Blue 👏 🇺🇸 💙 Vote Harris/Walz. Republican against Trump here.
There are no Republicans against Trump. No such person would have the indecency to vote for the party of mass baby murder and endless trans-mutilation. You are a liar.
Ezra, what a brilliant idea to revisit the Rally with Jon at this moment! The thing that I always felt most people didn't get about The Daily Show back then was that Jon Stewart was focused not on right vs left wing politics, but criticizing the media itself: the rise of flagrant propaganda through lying and hyperbole, punditry in the 24-hour news cycle substituting for investigative reporting, emotional manipulation to keep eyeballs glued to the screen for advertisers. Jon tried to explain this during some in-depth interviews with tone-deaf journalists on the left. They never saw that it was the MESSAGING he was frustrated with because he could see, as a student of political history, where irresponsible journalism, spectacle, and campaigns of disinformation might lead us. I had no trouble understanding the point of the Rally to Restore Sanity at the time. I think the most of his viewers got it, too. The media did not (or would not).
Yes! There. Remember AM radio. The hatred and Tea Party hurt my sensibilities. Fabulous day. Conversations with compatriots
Rush Limbaugh was AM radio back then…
Wow! So great to listen to this. As you said a Rosetta Stone Moment. The political waters that we are all swimming in are not less perilous but at a minimum I feel less alone. So glad you came back for us Jon. We've really been missing you in this dark passage. Thank you and Ezra as always a thoughtful and thought provoking production. I love how you listen and let your guests be who they are. What you do is an art. Kudos!
Two of the best human beings on Earth. Thank you for sharing.
i usually save your podcast episodes for later when i have time. For this one I made time ❤ Thank you both! ❤
As an attendee, it was great. I keep a few photos of the other attendees, and their great humor, on my wall.
This interview is pure gold. GOLD!
Thank you John Stewart!
I love a Jon Stewart 💙 😍 ❤️
I actually ran across my 'Sanity and/or Fear' bumper sticker last week!
Ah, looking back, those were such (relatively) innocent times, n'est-ce pas?
I never watched 'Crossfire' because I absolutely despise "all hollering, all the time" programs. Jon was exactly right, it was theater. Also agree about Novak. I have never forgiven him for exposing Valerie Plame.
Finally, Vonnegut ... YES! kiss-kiss!
I attended this rally. It was sooooo crowded. Jon Stewart ❤
Jon Stewart is a treasure and humble hero💜 ..and professional fact-seeker, and clear, humorous communicator. Thank you!!!
I loved this. It's been rough being a " free thinker" these last several years. When politics became about a personality cult I lost so many people in my life, including my adult children. At this point I am completely alone. My late husband fell for Shawn Hannity and became controlling and then angry . I had to leave and he took his life. I think Jon Stesart rally in 2010 was good intentioned but I'm learned people don't like to be told they are insane lol. I have blamed social media, which tells people how to think. Even some younger people on the " left" want to believe conspiracies. It's been hard to figure out what was happening because of the trauma I've been through and my adult children have been through. My adult children seem so selfish and self centered and I care passionately about inequality. It's been hard living in a deep red county and getting hateful nasty messages from strangers and have old friends lose their mind over pride parades. Lol.Hopefully we have a way forward. I never imagined in my life I'd see white supremist openly marching down street.
This. I don't have adult children, because I don't have children at all.
But it is lonely sometimes. During covid, I marveled that so many of my friends and family were suddenly suspicious of public health policy that had managed and controlled infectious disease and lengthened our lifespans.
Throughout covid, which I managed to contract once, I remember being shocked. I never thought the vaccine would be some sort of miracle. I knew that it would reduce deaths and blunt the more severe effects for a vulnerable people.
I live in Texas, and I am gobsmacked at the people in my community who have adopted the fear and loathing of immigrant laborers, even as we are surrounded by those very same people quietly going about their business.
I kid you not: I was once standing in my front yard chatting with a neighbor. She was wringing her hands, talking about how frightened she is of Latin American migrants. About 4 minutes into her monologue, one of the guys who works for the irrigation company that services and installs my sprinkler system repairs walked past us. She paused her speech about scary Latin American migrant laborers, smiled brightly at him, and said hi.
It's frightening to see so many people co-opted by a well-funded political project so easily. They hit the talking points- this is an invasion!- but they do not live their lives like people who are being threatened or invaded.
@@lucindabreeding. Thank you.
Thanks for sharing. I hate what has happened and the cost to relationships that divisiveness has caused.
Wait are you saying the genocide of Palestinians is just a conspiracy that stupid young people believe. Maybe it's time for you to vote RFK or even Big Bad Orange.
NiceyB - B strong - sending positive energy ur way. Same- have lost fam/acquaintances bc of maga. John & Ezra gave us intelligent insight & hope. We realists will prevail. peace 2 u.
Thank you for releasing this for the morning get ready
Wonderful. Thank you for the interview.
I want my politicians boring but boring politics doesn’t sell anymore.
FDR and LBJ made the Leftist America you love. They were far from boring.
I fell in love with Jon Stewart because of his reply to Carlson.
Salute to Jon🫡
Thank you for all your work to support veterans👏🏼
This is why Stewart is so deliciously smart. Metaphorical 'orthogonality' can convey the idea of multiple directions or influences converging at a single point where each influence contributes something without directly overlapping the others. This interpretation captures a more nuanced kind of interaction - one where elements remain distinct but combine to produce a collective effect. And Stewart is smart enough to have recognized that nuance.
Really enjoyed this one. It was orthogonal to a lot of other interviews. In a good way.
Very orthogonal indeed
@@gerym341 Completely orthogonal (quickly Googles the definition of orthogonal)
There is a lot to parse here. This is by far one of the best interviews I have seen in a LONG time.
A thoughtful and considered conversation. What's not to enjoy?
I hear crow with knife is a great book, best book
"I shouldn't be telling you this" shows Crow with knife $CAW $CAW!!💯🙌🏽
A joy to watch, thank you both.
Beautiful conversation. Enjoyed all of it.
This is so insightful thank you.
In a weird way, I enjoy watching people who make me feel dumb. Maybe that's why I hate fox news so much....
This crossfire moment is literally the best of Jon.💗💗💗💗
I remember watching Rally to Restore Sanity back in college on our tiny flatscreen. It really meant something for us.
Best of show gentlemen.
Gory as our history is, I believe we are optimists first, political animals second. Jon evidenced it with "80-90% of us sit down, together, figure it out and move to project B; the other 10%-20% run the show."
Yes and yes to the first part, and not so fast on the second one part, or Jon and Ezra would not have successful lives and careers. You both know Margaret Meade's "what a few people can do" phrasing... 1995 to 1999 I was key part of legislation that made it to Clinton's desk: "The Ticket to Work and Work Incentives Improvement Act" , enhancing and improving (too modestly) employment access for Americans with a Disability, bipartisan co-authors Ted Kennedy, Moynihan, Jeffords and Grassley. It took passages through 5 Committees in Congress to get to the House and Senate floors. Clinton signed on Dec. 17, 1999, the very last US Legislation signed into law in the 20th Century. We had no lobbyist, we had no money, we did have connections and damn it we made more of them. We had grit, we had great ideas whose time had come. We were in the 80-90% crowd and we changed US Law in Medicare, Medicaid, Supplemental Security Income (SSA), Social Security Disability Insurance, and Vocational Rehabilitation Programming. It was a final two years backdrop of Monica Lewinski. Every day the sky was falling. WE GOT IT DONE, here, in the USA.
Thanks Jon and Ezra you're smart cynically grounded optimists.
Thank you again Ezra!
Great conversation. Thank you both.
Great show. Well done EK!
And now I'm subscribing. 💙
Christ Almighty, I want these two talking in my ears every week, if not more.
Outstanding production design. Take a bow. Brilliant discourse. Proud to be alive to just witness this quality.
a great conversation
Smart interview. Excellent. Thanks
This was incredible. I
This was one great, and informative interview!
Give credit to Jon Stewart for being a man of great wealth and fame who's generally managed to do a really good job staying grounded and in-touch(ish) with regular people. The contrast is *STARK* when set against the bubble that the serviettes of wealth and power at NYT... Jon's eyes at @09:45 convey ALL our bafflement at the detached deluded island they speak to/for us from.
I was there with my 7 year old, it was very clear that it was a once in a lifetime event. It was perfect. We'd been to many protests and marches but this one was profound for many reasons, not the least because of the humor, soooo freaking funny.
This was the first political rally I ever went to. Today, I'm a constitutional law expert consulting in national political organizations and working in amending the constitution.
Jon Stewart is the elder statesmen in me. He speaks the language of my heart in this political world. So cool to learn about the behind the scenes understanding of media. Nothing is more interesting to me these days.
Whoever wrote/composed the music for this podcast deserves the accompanying award for this genre.
I agree 95% with Jon
gads i enjoyed this so much.
Hopeful, heartbroken man. ♥️♥️♥️
That was such a great day! We were so far back that we could barely see the screens, but it didn’t matter.
Around 21:26 Stewart hits Klein with harsh truth about the excuse he just made ("the media is not in control, it's not self-directed, it reflects the public") for the media to avoid responsibility. Stewart says I'm paraphrasing - "Rather than being engaged in battle in support of the truth, you're just part of the algorithm, chasing the clicks/money." As Klein tends to do when faced with his capability, he shifts to something else rather than addressing or even acknowledging that truth.
Jon Stewart!
Great discussion. The other side of the coin on the Megyn Kelly situation at NBC is Pat McAfee on ESPN. Some executives absolutely hate him, but his show generates TONS of revenue and they are absolutely stuck and are sucking it up, even with Pat, who I like, reading an ESPN executive the riot act on air, although it may have been off-ESPN and in the third hour that isn't broadcast on the network, but was widely distributed on social media just the same. If executives cared about anything but money he would have been gone in a second. Instead, we're enjoying what he's producing, hopefully for the long term.
1:02:58 Crow with knife caw caw
Jon’s the best 😊
I absolutely love learning that Jon Stewart adores Vonnegut as much as I do!! ✨💙✨
john stewart and stephen colbert… god, tv was good back then.
Are you aware that they still both have a show? On TV every week still!
@@michaelf8221 yes, but stewart is only on once a week and the late show just isnt half as funny as the colbert report.
I still watch them both. Colbert still helps many of us get through the insanity of Trump and Right-wing nutters.
@@nancychandler3673 I still watch the daily show on mondays, plus late show monologues (colbert, meyers, kimmel) on youtube. I’ll watch all of last week tonight sometimes.
last week tonight is my favorite now.
Two bugmen with no real humor. Pravda simply isn't funny.
1:02:58 crow with knife
CAW CAW
John Stewart is an Enlightened human being
This guy is great
I'm very grateful for this kind of discourse but a chance to be the 69th comment also draws me in like a 14 yr old boy.
I like both these people. A lot. But it says a lot about the situation at The New York Times when Ezra abruptly shifts topics from the media being "self-directed" when Jon references their incentivized need to compete with an algorithm versus the duty to fight 10x harder for the truth. The recent shift towards political sanewashing alongside softer clickbait headlines at the NYT is appalling. Jon was calling it out, and he was definitely interested in discussing it in detail. Clearly, Ezra didn't want to spend a minute longer on the topic (whilst podcasting from the NYT newsroom), and that's a shame.
Don’t know if Jon Stewart remembers, but his and Colbert’s press conference after the rally was down the hall from my own wedding. Tell him we wished we could’ve said hi.
💙💙💙
Politics should be about serving the people and improving the country. But every incentive in almost every structure in and around politics is about scoring political points and capturing attention.
These are systemic issues that people like John Stewart highlights very well. But I also think that the lack of efforts towards reshaping these incentives are what promotes the frustration and nihilist throught process that threatens these institutions.
We live in some dogmas about democracy and capitalism that seems to prevent us from actually being critical of their flaws in a way that ia constructive and appealing.
@@frankmalenfant2828 That’s why I really believe we need to have term limits in Congress. You can start out wanting to serve the country. But you stay there long enough and you start making friends and getting perks. And just like any other job, eventually it becomes more about helping you and your buddies than it is about serving the country.
Wow look how ezra immediately changes the topic when Stewart nails the culpability of the media (including nyt) in not being driven the promote truth over engagement. I like Ezra, he's a great interviewer, but I sense him avoiding certain uncomfortable deeper institutional truths.
Spot on about Carlson and Conway and why they were 'cancelled'. It's not political correctness or 'wokeism', it's plain old capitalism. Political correctness is a product of the media age, when the media turned to advertisers to make money.
Nonsense. Big companies almost all need a good relationship with the evil American bio-communist regime. This is why Tucker was cancelled--it was a second order effect of communist orders. Never trust what Jews or communists tell you.
The thing that always makes me sad is when I look back to sometime in the early 2000's, when I heard that we were now living in a time called The Information Age. I thought surely that meant that we would become collectively _smarter,_ what with so much information at our fingertips, and that from smartness would come true enlightenment. Instead what we have seen is rampant growth in the Dunning Kruger effect, thanks to evil forces making a lot of stupid people think they're smart by feeding them lies that children would have sussed as such only a few decades ago.
Agree. I thought social media would bring people together as a good salon platform. It has become an exposee of self-servitude, deception, judgement and a frightening display of the desperate search for identity.
Yes, all of that floating on a foundation of GREED. The media and social media are siloing us in divisive groups to stop we the people from banding our larger numbers together against rising inequality and taking the 1% down off their ridiculously fabricated platforms. They aren’t better than anyone else they were just luckier in the life lottery. That and we really have so much in common but they try to obscure that to prevent us from banding together. Also, they are often sociopaths completely devoid of empathy and compassion.
You don't know what Dunning Kruger means little girl.
@@kreek22 Calling me a little girl (I'm 50 btw) was clearly an intimidation attempt, so it would appear that you take issue with more than just my concept of Dunning Kruger.
Why is that? What did I say that angered you to such an extent?
Ezra Klein and Jon Stewart. What great symphony!
As Wagner noticed, the Jews have no real creativity, just criticism, a purely Talmudic frame of mind, petty and destructive.
that laptop stand was the third party in this interview lol.
Thank you!
We were naive that day but they were right and they still are. I was there and it was a wonderful day.
'Orthogonal' - lold so hard.
I was there. Came all the way from Phoenix. The green grass you see behind Jon Stewart that day is bizarre to see. I couldn't get close to the stage. It was so packed that day that you couldn't move. I had to watch it on the monitors.
This discussion about what the media is, how it responds and changes due to its audience, and the goal of editorialization is a fundamental and crucial one.
Two Jews...
"You go, then I'll go" is my mantra. Thank you for that Jon.
Jon Stewart for president!
Since we have succumb to the worst parts of ourselves to only survive it will take the best