I'm so glad that Armored Core 6 was made because it feels like it has all the stuff I personally wanted from a new AC. - Atmosphere and feel of Silent Line - The weight of 5 but have a speed that's in between 3 and For Answer - Builds being easier to make while allowing a ton of head room for min-maxing. - Having online PvP in some form - Have each mission be distinct enough instead of an EDF amount of missions. It hit those marks for me so I was pretty happy with even if the balancing is a bit jank and the stagger mechanic is something I can take or leave.
The reason why you underwhelm with this game is because AC6 is more like AC4 than AC5. The AC5 is so much different I'm considered it a outlier from AC's series, and the AC5 mechanics that reintroduce is boost kick, scanning, and weapon hangar bay that's it.
yeah ac6 feels regressive in terms of the mechanics compared to 5. Where From clearly thought that wall kicks and the more complex boost system are probably going to be tricky for new players, so they just went back to a more basic movement system, which I think is a shame. They could have the more automated camera for the new players, but then keep the advanced movement.
Funnily enough, I love AC4/FA quite a bit (White Glint for life baybee). That being said, AC3/SL/LR and AC5/VD are the GOAT AC games mechanics wise. ACVI however is the GOAT storytelling wise if you ask me.
It’s really funny to see even not super mega fans of Armored Core can see what is lost. I hope 7 will be a 180 and be a return to all the mechanics and systems that gave the series a very different feel from most games.
perhaps it was a decision made with foresight in mind. lets make a very strong armored core game that will renew the series, and the next game can have more complexity. people consume games without thinking of the bigger picture. the series has been in the dark for so long. this game is a budding achievement. readying us for something more next time while still supplying us with a rich and engaging experience that is unlike anything on the gaming market today.
@@10XSeiga I am still waiting on AC7, hoping that it'll be a proper return but I don't have a lot of confidence. Their modern titles have improved on things but haven't really gotten more complex with their actual gameplay still remaining very basic with the Souls games. Armored Core as a series as well goes against a lot of the mainstream, 6 basically broke a lot of its own rules it had for 15 games in a row to please a modern audience. It's really hard to imagine them going back. Ogura the producer for 6 and has been been with the company since AC4 also commented in an interview the genre of AC6 changed compared to past titles.
Makes you think about the canon of what we consider 'good' video games. If From Software were dunked on for a time and it took the Souls games to provoke a shift in perspective, then I wonder just how many other games and developers got shafted - especially in the Xbox 360/PS3 generation, where cinematic presentation and streamlined gameplay were the in the critical zeitgeist. I feel like a vast revaluation is order if we've let other series/genres/developers and games slip us by - especially for those of us who used to look at mainstream critics as arbiters of quality.
Oh man that era of game reviews is terrible, even worse than what we have now. there are famous cases like poor Godhand getting slammed, but I think there are also so many other cases that people don't even realize, like AC4 and (somewhat) AC5. It would be fascinating to have an entire vid where I go back and look at poor action games that were shafted during that era, I know gungrave was as well.
25:14 so uh... game balance? Weapon cooldown allows for drastically different weapons. If you could spam the pile driver most combat would be stupidly easy. It seems like your dislikes have nothing to do with their functionality and more that you juat wanted this to be AC5. Which is dumb considering the drastic changes between every generation. Like an AC1 vet complaining that new games lift the camera with rhe analog stick instead or the trigger. And even then there are builds that dominate certain scenarios. So I dont get the point? Choose a different weapon? The cooldown allows for diverse playstyle. From hit and run to hang back and unload. I have a hard time believing you're an AC vet
Your getting too stuck in this traditional "vet" view of game design. Weapon cooldowns as a a mechanic are not compelling, it is a boring way to create balance. This is a critique that applies across action game design as a whole. When it comes to weapon/move balance, there are two areas to consider, the natural balance of the move and the statistical balance of a move. The natural balance of a move is how well it fits in with the overall game design, how much it naturally lines up with the core combat of the game. So in the case of AC6, the rifles and shotgun have strong natural balance because they fit with the meta of circle strafing and constantly moving. The melee, on the other hand, fits very poorly with the natural meta of the game because it has massive startup, requires you to charge head on at enemies, and then has massive recovery frames. So how do you balance the melee of this game? What fromsoft did, was just take the basic approach of leaving the melee of the game unnatural to the core gameplay, but then just statistically buffing it by giving it huge damage stats, imposing staggers, and then nerfing the gun meta of the game by imposing cooldowns. This is classic nerfing good options to make way for a naturally weak option. You mention SPD in street fighter, your familiar with this issue in fighting games right? Where they need to constantly nerf good characters rather than buffing weak characters' natural options. Same applies here. Instead, what AC6 should have done was make the melee combat of the game more naturally good, by reducing the startup frames and recovery frames, and then reducing the damage. So instead of doing one massive high commitment melee attack that you have to spend all day fishing for, you instead have a melee system of lower commitment strikes that can be performed while moving. Is this traditional AC design, no. But AC6 has radically shifted the way combat works with the new camera system, and so the other systems should be altered to match with the new meta. Don't get stuck in "vet" views of combat design, that's how you get series that stagnate and die off and the fans sit and wonder why ha.
It has nothing to do with traditional or not traditional. It is simply a design concept. Consider the difference between a shotgun and a handgun in your favorite shooter. Think of how differently the play flow is with a shotgun; boom, boom, move, boom, boom, move. There's a satisfying flow to it. But additionally its about balance. If you could unload your shotgun endlessly in CSGO that would become the meta. But BECAUSE it has a limit/reload it allows for each individual shot to be more powerful than all the other weapons without making them obsolete. In summary gameplay flow and balance. Which makes me think you might be playing the game wrong. You're not supposed to unload as soon as it finishes reloading. For example its often a good idea to hold off unloading your Zimmermans for when you stance break them because you do extra damage. Conversely depending on the situation you might use them up front because by the time you stance break them they'll have reloaded. You just have to learn the flow. And its usually a good idea to have at least one weapon with a lot of ammo to sustain damage and chip away at their stagger. The gatling gun, a lot of the handguns, and rifles. f you play right (unless you make specific builds) you should almost always be doing something. There's a flow to it that I didnt really fine until maybe chapter 3. I dont think the sword is bad, in fact the opposite. It is a "contextual" tool. You have to strategize when you use it. When you stance break, when you're already up close and you know it'll stance break, or against enemies that are easily outmanuevered. So no, your not supposed to bum rush your opponent. The startup is supposed to be long. So you cant just spam it. This is a very basic concept. Look at Elden Ring. Unga Bunga sticks move slow but hit hard, daggers are quick but do less damage. It would be dumb if they were the same. And it would be dumb if there was no strategy or gameplay element to using the plasma sword. Some of them are contextual or skill based too. I used the pile driver on the Sea Spider but itd be crazy hard to get it off on Nightfall Raven. I didnt mention Street Fighter. You might be replying to the wrong comment?
I got a little over half way through this game and kinda just lost interest. The missions were pretty meh, not much to sink your teeth into. Bosses, like you said, I just circle around and spam attack for the win.
Great review Mark. I think AC6 shows just hard it is to be a developer of multiple beloved series and simultaneously reboot an old series that was dormant for a good while. Fromsoft always said from the beginning that this game would incorporate things they've learned from the main Souls years, while also keeping it different enough to be something more than just another Souls-like. A major point that I think you missed is that no other current AAA dev would (temporarily, at least) abandon a massive cash cow like Elden Ring or Dark Souls to reboot a 10 year old niche robot mech action game. The execution of the game may be divisive or underwhelming, but at least it was made at all and I don't blame them at all for attempting to bring in a wider fan-base, especially for a reboot. And yeah, I hope AC7 is more ambitious and incorporates some of this points you made. I especially think the weapon cooldowns are too long and there should be a long-distance sniping meta that reduces / adds variety to the kinda 1-trick pony gameplay of the circle-strafing method.
Oh yeah that is a great point. I overall have a lot of respect for Fromsoft and i do think this game is a really solid attempt, it could have gone so much worse ha. And yes, most studios would not have the balls or ambition to even try to make a mainstream mech game, that's for sure. It was a massive risk and Fromsoft took it in a way that other devs, like modern capcom, just wouldn't. So huge props to them on that front for sure, but I do think they were overcautious on some of the mechanics, and so hopefully we can get something a bit more aggressive in the series as an update :-)
I agree with your points about the the camera and booster, a major part of Armored Core was always about mastering the difficult control scheme for some amazing results. The lack of the camera being tied to the direction the mech faces as well as the removal of the turning speed stat does not just diminish the challenge and its value, but also builds that focus on a light AC, AND (what I find to be a major part of Armored Core) the simulation of piloting a mech. The series always struck a perfect balance of making it feel like you're actually piloting a hulking giant made of steel, while also using that very same concept design to play into the game design. VI's ACs feel like an Elden Ring/Dark Souls character with how it twists and turns on a dime. The one part I'd say you fall short on is the critique of reloading and the lack of wall boosts. Many have already said that using ACV as an example is a bad idea due to its status as the black sheep of the series, and there is reasons for that: ACV was a departure from many things people love about the series, from the reload feature being non-existent, to the wall boosts being a requirement to gain height, to the general visuals of rough and worn metal and brown color-palette. (My theory is this being due to the fact that the game released in a time where eastern devs were trying to make games that catered to a western audience) I myself enjoy V, but these were all new elements that are unique solely for V/Verdict Day, and their design being passed up for the original design that is more prevalent and traditional for the series makes sense when you've already sacrifice so much of the original design elsewhere, like in the camera, or in the floaty movement. (Of course, you could question why not change more of it at that point, but remember: they're trying to retain the fans while cater to the casual audience, so they have to do this balancing act) Ultimately, this is a great review that touches on the shortcomings that have been nagging me badly about this game. I've been really enjoying it in spite of this, but unless ACVII course-corrects, I don't see myself buying it. And I really recommend playing the earlier games for a better frame of reference. I think you'd really enjoy 4/For Answer in particular due to the crazy high-speed pacing of the action in those games.
Oh that's an interesting point about AC5. So I've talked about this concept a bit in the past, but I don't do traditional/community based evaluation in terms of game design. And what I mean by that is, even if the rest of the armored core series has different mechanics than AC5, if I think AC5 has better mechanics, then I think that is still a valid point of comparison. Because you can say that the armored core fanbase mostly reject AC5, but for me if AC5 had a bunch of really cool ideas and improvements to the series design, that doesn't make AC5 wrong, it makes the fanbase wrong ha. So in terms of wall jumps and lack of weapon cooldowns, I think both are fantastic ideas and I think AC5 was moving in the right direction. So for AC6 to then remove the wall jumps and to add in weapon cooldowns, all that means to me is that AC6 is regressing back in terms of design in comparison to AC5. This actually happens all the time in game series. Where a game in a series will have a bunch of fantastic and innovative ideas, but won't sell well, so then the devs get scared and abandon these cool ideas. Just look at tekken tag 2 for example. Tag 2 had this great design in terms of the movement and sidesteps being strong, but it sold poorly. So Namco got it in their heads that strong movement and sidestep are bad for sales, and so now with tekken 8 everyone has cement shoes ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground I Didn't mean to make it sound like I was saying it was invalid, just wanted to provide some perspective on why they might have went with reloading. A lot of my favorite games after all are also some of the most unpopular in a series (Like RE6 haha) so if I didn't agree with you there, I would definitely be a hypocrite. I enjoy it either way as I personally think the removing of reloads is fun for just unloading everything at once, but I also enjoy the more tactical approach in the originals where pacing yourself was important, as the originals have a system where you can go in debt from spending too much on AC repairs and ammunition, which further encouraged improving your skills so as not to lose money and played into the mech-pilot simulation. Both the original and V's designs are great in their own way, and whichever one you like more will for sure comes down to preference of simulation VS shooter-gameplay. But I like both anyway so it's a win-win for me either way.
@@TheElectricUnderground i completely disagree with this "devs right, fans wrong" statement. Even if we ignore the income part of game development, and we embrace the "games as art" view point, that mentality still falls apart. Sure, you can make a game that you think it's perfect, but if everyone else hates it, what's the point? Gaming has always been a community based hobby, even before the explosion of multiplayer games. I guess nothing stops you from making a game simply for yourself, even though that's a bit egotistical in my opinion, but inserting different ideas in a franchise that already has a set of rules, and therefore, expectations from the build up fanbase, not only ignoring these people will alienate them from your sequel, but also kill/damage the franchise severely, since the players that hate the changes, doesn't matter if they are mechanical, lore-based or something in-between, was this 'inovation' actually worth it? I personally don't think so. There are many examples of this. Not only in gaming, but in other scenes as well, like movies as example. In this case with AC 5, and how the game is the black sheep of the franchise, i can guarantee you, if this game didn't carry the AC name and lore, and was a complete new IP, like "MetalWolf Chaos XD" and had all pf these new Ideas and innovations, nobody was gonna be mad about this game, since it doesn't break any of the established rules that the current fanbase loves, and tries something new. Don't get me wrong, innovation is a good thing in gaming, but not if it's at the cost of the fans, and in this commercialised landscape of gaming, if a game is not fun, it will be abandoned, doesn't matter how revolutionary it is compared to it's piers. Like every single commercial good on this planet, gaming included: "The customer is always right."
I loved Dark Souls when it came out, it kept me playing games at a time when I was losing interest. However, I really wish that instead of other games leaning on the innovations (and some things were not innovative) of Dark Souls that they had just taken inspiration and done new things in their own way.
yes i feel exactly the same way about dark souls actually. i think it came up with a lot of really cool ideas and design concepts, but I strongly prefer Nioh over it, because Nioh takes it to that next level with it's combat system, especially the ki pulse mechanic. Actually, it would be really cool if AC 6 had some kind of weapon pulse system, so you wouldn't be hard locked into weapon cooldown.
I'd be very curious to see what you think about Armored Core 4 and For Answer which makes AC6 looks like it's moving in slow motion. I personally hate AC 5 and VD and feel like they are complete outliers to the rest of the series with AC6 being much more similar to the older entries.
Yeah, im giving Mark a pass on what makes this series great. Him liking AC5 & AC5vd is understandable when you know what hes trying to do with his channel.Being differnt to stand out from the crowd of reviewers on UA-cam "imo" lol
@@ronniepatterson2827 I don't think he's trying to be different to stand out. He's just an oldschool gamer who focuses more on rulesets & play mechanics. Most game reviewers only talk about the art assets of a game. I agree that he's a noob at AC & I was shocked that he only mentioned ACV. I thought he was going to work his way down to Last Raven or one of the last PS2 entries.
Did you play any of the other Armored Core games, before five? I ask because five was a huge departure for the series, and the lack of aerial maneuverability was one of the biggest factors in that. It's just funny hearing you talk about how this isn't a true Armored Core game, because it isn't more like the black sheep of the series.
I apologise in advance for the long comment 😂. hey Mark i have been a fan of armored core since the first one on the ps1 and i'm a massive mech fan, i actually bought demon's souls ps3 because i trusted in fromsoftawe after playing the AC series for so many years, i fell in love with demon's souls the first time i saw video of the game lol. but now exactly as i predicted, everyone picked AC just because of the souls games, you touched exactly on a point that i discussed with my younger brother who is an AC fan too (my fault lol), i told him how in the past everyone dismissed AC and gave them low scores but now, post "souls era", now its cool, the big majority of people playing AC would have never even glanced at it if it was not a fromsoft game which is ridiculous and it says a lot about how sheep-like people are. Mark your criticism is fair and i agree on most of the points, but i disagree on others since i'm an old time Ac player and i have a different perspective, i don't agree with your suggestion of infinite boost, please no, i hated AC4 and that game was too fast to be an armored core game, and it was ugly too lol... i forgot another point i disagree with 😂, it's ok. i also think that the stagger system should not be in the game, and i hate that everything needs stagger or parry these days, it's like the "quick time events" era that i hated, i hate QTE. the camera is more free because like the targeting system it was inspired in the Gundam VS games, i believe they wanted to make a similar camera experience to Gundam vs especially for pvp, they needed to update the camera and target system or people would not like it at all, so the best was a more free gundam vs-like experience. look at the gundam vs melee system and AC6 melee and you'll see the similarities. in the end i believe that all the changes worked well for what the game needed to accomplish, and sincerely what we needed the game to achieve, which is high sales and gamer satisfaction. if the game stuck with the old formula i guarantee you that a lot of people would not like it and that would have been the end of AC for good, this way there might be a resurgence in mech games or at least the series continues. personally i feel that the game plays well, the camera is good since i'm used to gundam VS and Zone of the enders, so since i didnt like AC4 and AC5 to me AC6 is the best AC since AC3, as an AC fan it is the game we needed, some compromises, mistakes, and unbalances were made, but i think they made the right choices overall, except for stagger lol. we cannot expect casual gamers to accept the same things we like, they cant deal with it, they think souls games are hard, lol they should play touhou 6 and pay a visit to sakuya, that makes any souls boss look like a baby in comparison, they cant deal with ardcore games like the games we grew up with, so the devs need to compromise. we need to give them HUGE credit for taking the risk of making a mech game in an era wen nobody wanted a mech game, that was a huge risk. sorry for the long post, but here is the oppinion of an original armored core player, an old Raven 😂, good review, great points.
23:17 You can fastfall in AC6, VaatiVidya talks about it in his newest video at 3:33. Maybe it's not like, the *really* fast fastfall you want, but you can still turn off boosters to accelerate faster toward the ground. Furthermore, although I haven't finished this video yet, it's apparent to me that your main frame of reference for comparing this game to other AC games is ACV and VD, which is fine, but just sort of... odd, because ACV and VD are pretty different from the rest of the series themselves. It'd be sort of like judging how they changed things in Elden Ring from Bloodborne, in a sense; for example, wall jumps are completely absent in every AC game *aside from* ACV and VD, and in addition, every AC game *except* ACV and VD allowed you to fly by just holding a button down. I'm sure you already knew this, but just be aware that some things are just FromSoft going back to how things were before rather than totally new changes.
im also not sure if the circle strafing is intentional. Also, I think it's viable but i think its too soon to write it off as the best approach to boss fights.
I would not consider that a fast fall, that's just the default fall speed of the game. A fast fall is a special state that can tactically increase timing of fall speeds. Like when you let go of Jump in Mario Bros, going straight down is the fastest default fall speed, but that's not a fast fall in the sense that I mean. It's pretty clear that Fromsoft have intentionally removed this concept from the game, as it would naturally happen if you turn off the boosters right? But it doesn't.
I am so mad that this review somehow never reached my YT feed (found it after checking your channel from the "Devil May Cry is MORE Than Buzz Marketing" video, which was also excellent btw) because not only it resonates with most of my feelings with AC6 it is also a really good review that puts a lot of context to the shortcomings of AC6 and I think more people need to hear this.
Getting the weapon bay upgrade might honestly be my favorite piece of progression in the game. Finding out I can actually bring two melee weapons was so hype
I have, but the problem with the swords is how much time they take to use, it s crazy ha. It s what tanks the pace of the game. Like I say in the vid, the swords are statistically strong (massive damage and all that) but they are naturally weak in terms of the overall game design because of how slow they are and how much recovery they have. I think a faster but less damaging sword system would have fit the game much better
@@TheElectricUndergroundI feel the same way about melee. In previous games it was limited by energy supply, but you could swing like 10 times without running out, and by then your opponent would be long gone anyway. In this game I keep forgetting about the cooldown and when I get in close, I’m hammering on the trigger and nothing is happening.
Yeah, 2 melee weapons completely solves the cooldown issue. I definitely get calling it out as an issue in game design overall, but I think it's fine for me in AC6
As a longtime AC fan, AC6 isn't just the best in the series, it's the best mech game I ever played. It's also a game I would never recommend to anyone that doesn't enjoy replaying games. If you don't like trying to S rank every mission, playing through the game thrice over to see every mission, creating a dozen different builds just to mess around, and partaking in multiplayer duels, it's not a game for you. I've seen too many players blitz through the game in 15 hours with dual shotguns and songbirds/stun needles and never play the game again, and if that's what you're gonna do then you shouldn't even waste your time. This isn't a "bragging rights" game like most contemporary FromSoft titles, and I think that's what non-AC fans wanted this game to be, and I'm so glad it's not that. It's an arcade game; bite-sized levels you play over and over in search of S ranks and secrets. As a side note, I'm glad to see FromSoft step away from the missteps they took with 5th gen AC. Tri-defenses sucked and basically meant you either took no damage or insane damage, jumping/boosting off buildings to gain height was obnoxious and controlled iffy, and scan mode was horrible. In base ACV it helped you navigate through the huge levels because it was the only way to see waypoint markers, it was the only way to see enemies your drones marked, it was the only way to see which resistances your enemies had, and it sped up energy recovery - which otherwise was the slowest it ever recovered in the series. You also couldn't fire your weapons, so the game became a dance of switching scan mode on and off, hearing the obnoxious "scan mode" voice every time, and seeing the screen change colors constantly. Then in Verdict Day the maps were made smaller so you didn't need scan mode to help you navigate, and the energy recovery speed in scan mode was boosted so high that you could recover energy *while boosting* in scan mode, giving you unlimited boost. In AC6, scan is just a cooldown that doesn't interfere with gameplay - perfect. Also, it's a nitpick, but I hated the scrap iron designs of 5th gen. Everything was rusted, blocky, riveted, and clunky looking, like you strapped dumpster lids onto your arms and shins. I prefer the smooth, rounded designs you see in the rest of the series.
Thanks for the insight. How did you find the stagger mechanic? I don't consider myself a true AC fan but I didn't feel that the hyperfocus on stagger to be a positive or "AC".
A game with not even one sniper is the best mech game you played? Seriously.. No. Customization is severely lacking and builds are locked out of viability due to the stagger bar, seriously hate these generalized half-ass statements.
Hey, love your videos! I got into danmakus thanks to you! I usually don't commentate, but i wanted to say that i don't agree on melee weapons. Builds with melee weapons in this game are actually really strong, and way more interesting than in previous AC games. I understand your criticism about them feeling slow and very risky to use, specially if they wiff cuz they have a lot of starting and ending lag. The reason i don't agree with this sentiment is the fact that you actually can cancel the melee attack right before it comes out with a quick boost, and it doesn't put your melee weapon on cooldown, which means that using melee weapons in a effective way actually has more depth and requieres more skill than it seems at first, cuz you could, for example, react to your opponent quick boosting to avoid your attack (which they usually do when you try to melee them) by "faking" your melee attack and cancelling it with a quick boost and catch them off guard with another melee attack. You can melt some bosses in this game with the Pilebunker for example, and i think that if you had a Melee weapon by default as you sugested, some builds would be broken beyond reasonable (not that there aren't some alredy lol). To be fair tho, i don't think the game ever communicates that you can do this in any way, so i'd say that the game is at fault in this regard. However, i think it would be cool if you give them another try and see if this is enough to change your mind on melee weapons.
hey my dude I'm glad you are enjoying the vids and thank you for commenting! So I probably could have mentioned the melee cancels more specifically in the video, because yes you are right that you can pull out of that homing phase with a boost, so that's good that Fromsoft arent' making you completely commit. However, perhaps if I explained what I think would be a better melee system, than maybe my critique might connect with you more. So like I said in the section about balance, I do think the melee weapons are "strong" in a statistical sense. In that, Fromsoft decided to compensate with their really slow and risky frame data by giving the melee attacks a massive pay off in terms of damage and stagger and all that. So, yes, I don't deny that the melee in the game is strong in that sense. However, when you compare them to something like the shotgun, which has much better frame data and is much safer, then the melee feels extremely clunky in comparison, even with being able to cancel because of how long that startup and recovery are. What I think would have been a better melee system, is that, instead of making the melee this big lottery attack, instead fromsoft should have removed the built in startup phase, reduced the recovery on the swing, and then dropped the amount of damage the melee does. I just think it would have fit with the flow of the gameplay so much better. So basically, faster more versatile melee attacks, that are also built in and don't need a weapon slot, that do less damage. Because right now for melee to work you basically need to plan your entire build and gameplan around it, which I think is less interesting than having it be a common option that all mech builds use.
@@TheElectricUndergroundThanks for your reply! This definitely helped me understand your position much better, and i agree that double shotguns plus weapon bay upgrade are really strong and add a really cool flow to the combat that i too find more interesting. I guess the reason why i didn't find the fact that melee builds aren't the strongest or that they have a different flow to them as not necessarily a negative, is because AC is a series that encourages trying out different builds until you find your favorite, and if you don't like one then you can just change it without any negative repercution (well, at least in some AC games) and a natural consequence of this kind of design is that some builds are going to be/feel worse than others. I guess that since this is normal in this kind of games, i never stopped to consider wether or not this is something negative, but i'll definitely take it into consideration from now on. I think your criticism is super fair and i can see myself agreeing with you if i look at it from your perspective or give it a second thought. That's why i like your reviews to begin with, cuz they always offer an interesting point i haven't even considered before. Keep the good work!
You might have missed some of what I am going to list but there's a bit of misinformation in your review here: 1) Only an handful of From Soft games have checkpoints in their entire history of games. So they aren't the one's bringing that back in fashion. 2) Armored Core is why From Soft is still even open. The AC games and all their expansions sold well enough, except 5, to keep From in business. They would have closed down if not for the AC series. 3) I guess you only played 5 VD and 6, because 5 & VD are considered to be the worst in the whole series, or maybe Nexus? It also doesn't control like most of the games in the series. AC 5 is actually very different from the rest of the series. AC 6 combines the controls from AC 3 & 4 with a bit of Souls in there. 4) There is fast fall. You have to not push any buttons and your AC will fall faster. 5) The older Gen 3 and back game, control horribly. Most of them do not even have dual analogue control. You would move with the d-pad and control your booster with the shoulder & trigger buttons. But you could easily boast upwards and float in every game, except for 5. If you play the old games, use an emulator and find some remap instructions online. 6) Almost every AC game has cooldowns. They used to have the heat mechanic, that would over heat weapons and sometimes your whole AC. I am very happy to see the heat mechanic gone. Having to manage heat on top of everything else was horrible. When you overheated, you took basically robot poison damage. 7) AC is a RPG. You are role playing as a mech piloting a robot. That was the reason for the crappy camera and controls for years. It was suppose to feel sluggish and janky like you are controlling a human that then is controlling the mech. The series also used to be thought of as a debit simulator. This is more personal but I disagree about the melee attacks. Did you forget about the assault boast and boast kick? I use melee all the time to tear through enemies and bosses, but I always use an assault boast, then kick, then melee. This will also break all shields too, which your shotgun/assault rife build will have a hard time dealing with armored/shielded enemies later in the game. I do agree that the melee weapon should be another slot. I feel like your review was good, but you forced yourself to play the game in an unfun way just because you didn't tinker around with everything else as much.
i guess I'll answer you back in list form ha. 1. Dark souls inspired check points are extremely common and easily traced back to when dark souls became popular. Even shovel knight has them. The fact that From's other games don't have checkpoints is irrelevant, it's specifically dark souls that inspired other games. 2. There is no debate that the souls series has massively outsold the AC series and is the reason why Fromsoft is as popular as they are. The scale of sales between Dark Souls and AC is absurdly lopsided, so you are reframing this in a really silly way because at one point AC was their more popular series ... before the souls series existed. Your trying this really specific claim that because AC was their initially successful series, it somehow is more influential than dark souls because the butterfly effect of them going out of business without AC ha. You could make this claim in all kinds of silly ways, like the Jackson 5 is more influential than Michael Jackson's solo career because without the Jackson 5 he wouldn't have a solo career, and on and on. 3. I don't do series/tradition based game analysis. If all the other AC games have weapon cooldown, then AC5 removed weapon cooldown, and then AC6 put weapon cooldown back in, just because it was a mechanic from old games doesn't make it the right design choice. In this case AC6 is just being regressive in terms of game design. Tradition does not make game design decision valid. When I play older AC games I will critique the weapon cooldown in them just like I would in AC6. if AC5 is the only game in the series without weapon cooldown, then it is the game in the series that gets the idea right. 4. No there isn't. You don't fast fall you just fall at the fastest fall speed the game allows, which isn't fast. This is like saying in mario if you let go of the jump button you "fast fall" ha. 5. I don't discuss AC3, I compare AC5 and AC6 so what AC3 does is irrelevant. Like I said above, I don't do traditional based reviews, so for all I know AC3 controls horribly, but AC3 is less relevant to the discussion than AC5, since 5 proceeds 6 directly. 6. I explained this point in point 3. 7. By this definition every game is an RPG, Ninja Gaiden is an RPG because you role play as a ninja and you level up your weapons. AC6 is pushing more in the direction of an rpg in terms of combat design, but I don't think this is because Fromsoft are consciously trying to market the game as an RPG, but rather is just a hold over of their combat design decisions in souls games. And like I said if all the older AC games are sluggish and control poorly as you are saying, this doesn't make them automatically better designed than 5. It sounds like 5 made a lot of really smart design decisions that are not being appreciated at all ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground Your points were fair. I still don't think bonfires are the same like most games that use checkpoints. Checkpoints can happen at anytime, even during bosses. I didn't mean to imply that AC is more influential than Souls, just that From would have closed down years ago if it was for the AC series selling well enough. AC, King's Field, Shadow Tower never sold better than AC till Dark Souls. So I think AC is just a bit special and it's why From brought it back.
I'll be checking it out just because I love FromSoft. OG Demons Souls was my first FS game, and I've been in love ever since. What I will say as a mid 30s gamer is it led me to checking out the older King's Field games on the PS1 which I love, and if I enjoy this new AC I'll absolutely be checking out the older titles.
That's great to hear! One really big hope I have is that with the success of AC6, a bunch of people (myself included actually) will start to dig through the older AC games and appreciate them more :-)
good review, but a weird one. have you only played ac5? because that's not only the worst game in the franchise but a lot of the things ac6 brought back were from basically every other game besides 5. there's also just a lot you got wrong here. like there is for a fact fast fall in ac6, i dont know why you said there wasnt? you just let go of the stick and you drop significantly faster.
I talked about 5 because it directly proceeds 6 and is the game that informs the audience/player expectation. There is some kind of strange mind cloud going on in the AC fanbase where I guess you all want AC5 erased from conversation or something ha. Like with street fighter 5, sure that's a low point for the series in many players minds (mine included) but it is the game that most heavily informs Street Fighter 6, even if street fighter 6 is reacting against some of its design. I honestly think the AC fanbase has been too hivemind on AC5 because even if there are areas of the game the fanbase doesn't like that doesn't mean all of it's ideas are bad (I think the walljumps, for example, are really cool). And also I agree that AC5 has a lot of the design and mechanics from the older games (clearly) so that just makes it a very natural comparison point to AC6, which is clearly the biggest shift in the series if you take a step away from this negative cloud around AC5. Think about this with any other series. When virtua fighter 6 comes out, what is going to be the point of comparison? Virtua Fighter 3? It's going to be VF 5 of course. I think this is some AC forum culture or something. Also I did not get the fast fall point wrong. Fast fall is a distinctive state of falling at a faster rate than the default fall rate. In AC6 this has been removed. Letting go of the controls is just the default max fall speed. That's like saying letting go of jump in mario bros is a fast fall. In AC 5 when you jump the game has a default booster on fall speed (which kicks on automatically), and then if you turn off your boosters you plummet immediately. This meta has been removed from AC6, the game literally will not allow you to manually turn off your boosters while falling. Instead you have to just wait and literally do nothing, because the apm of the game just isn't low enough. Calling this a fast fall is not remotely in the ballpark of a fast fall. If the game makes you wait to enter the state, there's nothing fast about that ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground it has more to do with 5 being a pretty significant departure gameplay-wise and 6 returning to more ac gameplay norms while doing some of it's own thing. it doesn't make sense to complain about verticality in 6 not having wall jumping and instead being about using boosters when 13 out of 15 of the previous games worked the same way. that makes 5 the outlier in that situation instead of a key comparison point. it makes more sense to compare it to 4th gen because it's using more 4th gen style movement (boosting for free, very aerial, critical usage of quick boosting), and then talking about whether or not it does it better or worse. otherwise it's apples and oranges even though, sure, *technically* 5 was the more recent game. it's one thing to say you prefer the wall jump verticality of 5 (it was fun in it's own way), but to not even mention or compare the booster movement to *any other entry in the series* is just... weird, and it makes it seem like 5 is your only point of reference for armored core. it's like talking about kh2 and dinging it because it didn't use the card system from chain of memories. like sure that's technically the previous and more recent entry but its obvious that design-wise they iterated from kh1. or if you want you could say the same with kh3 and bbs. as for the fast fall i really think you should actually go lab it out because what you're describing as a fast fall is in the game exactly as you described it. not sure what else you want there. i used it a ton in my playthroughs and managed to dodge attacks i otherwise would not have been able to, it's a pretty important mechanic if you're in the air a lot. now if you wanted down boosts i'd agree with you, that'd be cool. or maybe you mean a fast fall where you can still control the ac? that would also be nice. but as-is the game does, matter-of-fact have fast fall.
Yes i have! So the thing about the melee cancel is that it is canceling something that I don't think should even be there in the first place, this startup dash thing. I think if the game forced you to commit on startup dash it would be outright insane ha, so yeah being able to boost out of that startup is nice, but it's not a true cancel in my book really. What would make the melee of the game interesting is if you could cancel out of the Recovery frames of the melee attack, now that would be a much more interesting cancel. As it is right now, i think the melee cancel is underwhelming because you are canceling out of an animation that shouldn't be there in the first place ha. And it's not a cancel that lets you skip the animation, it's just a cancel that allows you to restart it. Having some extra boost movement is sort of cool, but in the end I don't think it matters that much because circle strafing is much more powerful than head on rushdown. What the game needs is for the melee attack to come out faster, you already have solid movement speed with ground boosters.
Yes and what s crazy is that mech has actually been surprisingly niche for a really long time, like there are barely any videos on UA-cam of armored core 5, which is crazy ha
Just curious, but what is the appeal to Cyberbots? I haven't put much time into the game but at first glance it seems fairly mediocre. It shows you these cool backgrounds getting destroyed but you aren't the ones doing the damage. The mechs seem to have a long, medium and/or short range attack button that seems to prescribe which attacks you'll use at various ranges.
@@claytonweaver7335 It's a very personal choice. I'm a sucker for 2D games and fighting games (I just play for fun with friends, not competitive). Generally speaking I prefer the 90s SNK games when it comes to 1 on 1 fighters, four buttons are enough. This game for me ticks all the boxes of good, short arcade fun with easy controls. The mechas feel heavy and are very well presented, as are the levels. All other Capcom fighters feel like SF with a different coating to me (apart from the VS series). This is a big departure. It's like a nice bar pick up that left a lasting impression ^^
@@SNKBossSyndrom I do think my favorite part of the game is how the mechs 'feel' in terms of weight and dashing. I just played the Capcom Fighters Collection recently and got the impression there was little Capcom could do to improve Darkstalkers but quite a bit they could do with Cyberbots to give it a little more replay value. imo
I agree with a lot of your points Mark. AC6 reminds me a lot of the PS1 trilogy, where the feel was a little more arcadey or a standard third-person shooter. The parts list and tinkering was dialed back to those levels, and I want to believe they were trying to rebuild the franchise with 6 by going back to basics as not to alienate newcomers who have been eagerly jumping on. One of the glaring issues I had was the boost button (B) that ONLY toggles it on, but easily could have been used to cut boost in midair to change landing velocity or trajectory. Another would be having the AC not always face forward, so that trying to fire out of angle would cause a pause and shoot animation like they use in the Gundam VS series. If you've never seen pro play of that game, check it out. It seems like an arena shooter/brawler but for an arcade game it requires an understanding of the physics and positioning in a way that feels "warlike".
Oh yes gundam vs is absolutely on my list of games to check out! It along with Virtual On :-) I'm glad you can understand my critics because I don't think Fromsoft did a bad job or anything, it's just overly restricted which works better in a more slow paced action rpg like dark souls, but can really hurt the pace of a mech game where having a lot of tactical movement and attack options is the fundamental appeal. :-)
It's got a very similar feel; it does lock your AC to always face the enemy so there's a little less positioning, and landings aren't quite so hard that they're solid punishes, but overall it has the same smoothness as well as chunkiness that you would want.
Yeah AC6 is very intuitive, it is a great starting point in a lot of ways for people less familiar with mech games. Why I find it a bit underwhelming though is that I think in Fromsoft''s effort to make the series and game more accessible to the average player, I think they trimmed a bit too much out of the the technical side of things, especially with the weapon cooldowns and lack of fast fall. It is a solid game though, and I do recommend AC6, but with the added note of encouraging people to also check out the older AC games as well.
This is my review of your review of Armored Core VI: Fires of Rubicon. Note: The only FromSoftware game I've played prior to this was Armored Core: For Answer. I will never play any of their games from other genres. I wanted to play Chromehounds but I discovered the game late and they were already shutting down the servers. First of all, mech games are niche. Always have been, always will be. Armored Core VI is niche. It will never have the wide acceptance of the fantasy sword and sorcery type games and other genres. That is just the way of things, at least in Western society. The stagger mechanic you hate so much actually makes sense in Armored Core. We are piloting a huge mech with huge weighty parts that very likely isn't balanced, and we are zipping around using rocket boosters strapped to all sides. And then of course, there's enemy action, whether that's smashing into us with a melee attack or blasting us with lasers or machine guns or missiles. Us regular humans fall all the time even from just a light push that we don't expect. Imagine the inertia an Armored Core contends with and we can easily imagine an attitude control system getting overwhelmed, no matter how sophisticated it is. Energy weapons overheat. That also makes sense, as does the fact that Gatling guns overheat. That's one of the primary reasons we have Gatling guns in the first place - to combat overheating barrels. But they don't prevent overheating, they only delay it. Weapons need time to cool down. And your circle-strafe complaint - lots of games have circle-strafing. FPS games have circle-strafing. Elite: Dangerous has circle-strafing. EVE Online has circle-strafing. Titanfall 2 has circle-strafing. MechWarrior 2/3/4/5/Online had/has circle-strafing. The very first MechWarrior may have even had it, but I never got a chance to play it. Others have pointed out that you can fast-fall in Armored Core VI by turning off thrust. Overall, you were too lenient on the scoring. With all of the complaints you had, you should have rated it lower - a 5 or maybe 6 at best. An 8 rating isn't underwhelming but solid - an 8 is a great game with a couple of imperfections. And I certainly hope FromSoftware doesn't listen to any of your advice at all, regarding the next installment in the Armored Core series (assuming there is one). Taking it back to Armored Core V and Verdict Day would be a huge mistake. They want more sales, not less...
This is my review of your review of my review: The first 3 paragraphs are not a view of game design that matters. It doesn't matter if a mechanic "makes sense" or not in terms of the gameplay presentation or setting, especially in a sci fi game. You could mount this defense for any mechanic in any game. I could make a game where you are attacked by zombies in a swamp and none of your weapons work because they are all wet ... it makes sense, but is it compelling design? If you actually view game design from this perspective then there are a million critiques that could be made about the game not making sense right? In the end it doesn't matter at all, none of it makes sense and the theme is there to support the gameplay, not the gameplay is there to support the theme. You've got your priorities backwards on this whole notion. On the circle strafing point, you forgot that it connects to my critique of the camera system. Yes in any shooter circle strafing is going to be a strong technique, I mention that. The key is that in an FPS or in older AC games, the restricted camera makes circle strafing more challenging to do, because you have to manage both looking and aiming at the same time. In an FPS, it's much trickier to circle strafe all the time because you can only see in front of you right, instead of all around you. So it's naturally more risky. In AC6 however, the game gives you a full unrestricted view of the play field and then pairs that view with an automatic lock on mechanic, just like Elden Ring horse combat. So you don't need to aim, the game aims for you. You don't need to look and control the camera precisely, it's zoomed out for you. All you need to do is simply move in a circle, you don't even need to manage your boosting anymore. It's a massive simplification of the core combat. Finally, on the point about scoring, the areas I am talking about are specific and pretty technical. They are not core fundamental issues that make the game poorly designed, I do think the game is overall well made. But these are the areas where the design is too cautious, so it results in an overall very solid well made game, but one that is missing out on being truly great. It is sort of funny that in today's review space, reviewers tend to declare a game either a 5 out of 10 or a masterpiece ha, with little room in the middle for nuance.
I do not have any experience with the AC series, nor I have played AC6. However, I have an observation regarding the weapon cooldown mechanics and your mention of Doom 2016. My comment is that, while Doom 2016 and its sequel Eternal do not have reloading, they still have weapon cooldowns in the form of animations. Indeed, most of the high level meta consists in swapping weapons right after shooting to cancel their recoil animation. Kind like animation cancelling for Devil May Cry. I do not know if you consider animations like a "cooldown" that you can psychologically accept, but at the level of gameplay, it is clear the length of the animations of the various firearms are balanced to make the heavier hitters slower to fire. You do not mention explicitly Eternal, so I suppose you did not play it. In that game new special attacks have been introduced and they do have proper cooldown. However, they generate resources (health, armor, ammo) on enemy hit, so they are contextualized in a gameplay flow where the player has the tools to generate by himself the resources he needs, and these are much more volatile than in Doom 2016. The gameplay loop is much, much different between these two games. Regarding the actual review: as always, I can expect from you constructive criticism motivated with punctual references and design analysis. This is why I follow your channel. I was kind of hoping that by recovering this old IP, From would have produced a game more focused on mission and encounter design rather than bosses.
The 4 weapon slot upgrade lets you switch weapons and theres no delay for switching so it lets you bypass reloading and overheating but its a choice between extra weapons or shoulder weapons.
I get your criticisms of the cooldowns/reloading, but AC isn’t a straight action game series. It’s always been mecha sim + action. Managing your mech’s various weapons, meters, cooldowns, ammo, etc while simultaneously engaging the enemy is what the series’ combat has always been designed around. Not just simply shooting targets. If cooldowns and reloads are halting your pace, you’re just not managing your mech well. Playing optimally requires a lot of quick thinking multitasking. 27:31 Also Armoured Core has always had strong RPG elements 🧐, since AC1 on PS1. I’d go as far as to describe the series’ genre as “mecha sim action RPG” even… Either way, interesting review none the less. I do agree with some of your other points. Just think you’re missing the point a bit and wanting AC to be another game series, with some of your criticism.
well I think I can actually help put my critiques into a clearer picture for you, because I think you are picking up on most of what I am saying. I agree that AC is not purely an action game series, but in AC6 they are pushing it more in that direction by simplifying what you might call the "sim" elements of the controls of the older games. Like the camera system being unrestricted bird's eye view, and the movement no longer really using boosting and traction anymore. So what Fromsoft have done with AC6 is that they have pushed the design of the controls of the game more into an action game style, but then did not capitalize on these new streamlined controls with more technical options and design. So AC6 sits in this weird compromise of not being more and sim like the older games, but also not being fast paced and technical in an action game sense either. That's why I find it underwhelming, because they should have pushed the action elements further based on the changes to the controls and camera. Right now I feel like the game is playing itself for me and not giving me many options to develop a personal playstyle (and I don't mean build wise, I mean movement wise). And then on the point of an rpg, I would not classify any of the AC games as having RPG elements. Now I know that RPG is a term that is heavily used everywhere and now basically anything that involves any kind of stats or management is automatically an RPG ha (like is Gran Torismo an RPG?), but what I am referring to with RPG elements are the combat design of including cooldowns. On paper, there is no actual reason to put them into the game (older AC don't have cooldowns), but because stamina and meter management has become so ingrained into combat design these days, because of action RPGs like Dark Souls, devs have started to use cooldown as a tool of weapon balance rather than using what I think is the better approach, which is the natural stats of the weapons. So rather than having the gatling shoot and have this lame cooldown period, just naturally balance the fire rate and damage of the gatling so line up with the other weapons without cooldown, that way players aren't having to manage meters or stats as they play.
@@TheElectricUnderground aight ya I get your first point. For me tho I’d prefer them to have gone in the opposite direction and make it less fast paced action (and I’m saying this as a MASSIVE arcade action game fanatic and as some who’s fave AC games are 4 and 4A) my big issue related with that is the beam sword. I haven’t been using it, it’s not my play style, I like shooting big guns lol but there were 2 tough AC battle encouters I was stuck on where I decided to toss on the heavy beam sword to try it out for fun, and it just melted them immediately first try. I defs agree with your point in the vid that they seem to really want you to use it, I mean it’s gotta be why they made it so OP. And the issue I have is not even just that it’s OP, it’s that it takes very little skill to have it be OP. Like I said I haven’t been using it, so naturally I was using it like shit that time, and still, 2 lucky hits and the rival AC was evaporated. Really hope they fix that in a balance patch. The melee should do low to moderate regular damage. Would make sense for it to do high stagger, to create an interesting risk with swooping in up close, but as it is now it’s essentially just a win button. But I mean I’m still having a blast with the game. I personally fkn LOVE meter management in game design. Slap a meter on something and suddenly you gotta think about when and at what cost to use it. But ya, the same old unimaginative “weapon overheating” is definitely less elegantly woven into the global game design than in past games like the laser rifle draining your mechs energy like in AC1, which I’d argue is also a variation on a cooldown mechanic at its core. Personally I’m really enjoying having to be very mindful of which of my 4 weapons I’m using and when, and having to keep a steady eye on the meters indicating when their cooldown is done so I can begin charging the pulse rifle shot while I launch a grenade so the charge is done and ready to go while the launcher is reloading, for example. It’s also been really fun having to choose the right weapons to synergize with my weapon load out to make sure I’m not just sitting there waiting for all 4 weapons to reload. I was stuck on the chapter 1 boss for 2 hours getting killed due to having to sit around defenceless waiting, until I really learnt to start playing like that. I feel that’s when the game really clicked for me. But I get why people aren’t digging it. You’re not the only one on here I’ve watched reviews from saying similar things. I also tend to love restrictive mechanics like the brutally unforgiving weapon degradation in From Soft’s first Shadow Tower game, and seems weapon degradation is universally hated these days so who knows maybe I’m weird one 🤷♀️😅😅 About the RPG stuff, I I understand the point you were trying to make now.. you meant as in turn based RPG, having to wait for the game to allow you to attack. But I’d also say stat management and character building, build optimizing, having tons of choices for how to customize your player character and gameplay experience has been a defining characteristics of the RPG genre and have long roots in the genre going back to the D&D days even before video games. And AC has always blended those particular RPG elements with action gameplay from the start. Hence I described it as action RPG. Now ya Gran Turismo (lmao) and every game under the sun it seems lately unnecessarily tossing in RPG mechanics def doesn’t make them RPGs. But action RPG has been a legitimate subgenre of RPG for decades, with well defined characteristics, and I’d argue the AC series has fit those characteristics from the get-go with AC1 in ‘97. AC1 was an outgrowth/fleshing out of ideas From Soft had explored with their previous 3 action RPG King’s Field games, I feel. And I’m pretty sure I’ve read devs of that first game even expressing that in an interview I read, but I couldn’t find the source, could be I’m imagining it. But to me it’s pretty clear when you look at the evolution of their gameplay ideas from King’s Field to Armoured Core. Anyways back to AC6. My big hope is that they at the very least pump out some serious balance patches soon. Kuz rn I’m just having to avoid using a whole swath of weapons and build varieties to avoid the lame no skill OP shit. That’s my personal biggest complaint so far with the game. Super lame. We’ll see in the coming weeks 🙏🙏
@@micshazam842 ya I agree, for me the sim aspects, although very light, have always been just managing your mechs various parameters. But I totally agree I’d want them to be more on the sim end too.
simplified camera and movement-- *simplify and expand* . The lower barrier to entry means the game itself can and does expand what it throws at the player. Boost off means not accidentally flying into a dangerous line of fire without tediously tilting the control stick to stealth combat--the game demands playing fearlessly *and* intelligently. If weapons are always offline at the worst moments, also think about *building the right mech for the right job* , which has always been AC's ethos environments and pacing--enemy placements are packed for how fast the game is and the level used to showcase an empty game is the one designed around limited tracking the review makes it easy to wonder whether the author thinks the game is too simplified or too complex. The other phrase for this is "lower floor, higher ceiling"; see: Street Fighter 6's massive success btw, it might be a good idea to stop liking all the positive or easy comments and let talk evolve naturally; KingK, Geek Critique, and Joseph Anderson have a lot of critical reviews for beloved games and they let comments rock. *Trying* to control the mood of discussion doesn't show a lot of confidence
You don't need to build the right mechs as much though ha. The mech building in ac6 is much more simplified, in terms of what the game demands you do to. In 5 i constantly had to research builds for the various missions, whereas in 6 i could run the same build pretty much without any issue ha. Ironically you are missing that by introducing the simplified controls, the game gives you this really simple meta of just constantly circle strafing, so builds and stuff like that become less meaningful. Also I heart and comment on every comment that I read and respond to ha, plenty of which are critical so I'm not exactly sure where that is coming from other than you are reaching my friend, big time.
@@TheElectricUnderground 1. *simplify and expand* means the game has a lower barrier to entry while letting the designers go crazier with enemies to account for smoother controls; Balteus is closer to an endboss from other games and it's chapter 1 2. using dual shotgun while claiming buildcraft doesn't matter as much is worryingly ironic 3. I said "all the positive and *easy* comments"; a comment can be both critical and easy. If you really believe your points are sound, *stop floating stuff to the top and let them cook on their own*
Hi Mark, idk if its the right place to ask about it but ive been using ur shmuparch 7 for the last few months and it worked perfectly until a few weeks ago and now no matter which rom i launch (including ones that were working before) the grey screen saying romset is unknown comes up. Ive tried numerous things ive found online but nothing seems to work, what could possibly be a fix for that?
Oh hey my dude! Good news, I m gonna release arch 8 here soon! Try updating the core inside the core menu of arch, hopefully that will help! I also linked a romset name for arch 7 in the vid description of that vid :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground ye Ive seen the description and tbh I have no idea what to do with it since when I [try to legaly rip off roms from pcbs in my closet] it doesn’t have any info on its romset, and even if it had is it relevant if the same roms have been working perfectly before?
Armored Core 5 and Veredict Day are actually the outliers in the series for most of the things you mention as critique of things 6 does, wall jump mechanic was also very divisive since it was a radical change from the way previous games played like (specially 4 and 4A since blazing fast movement was their thing)
@@MrRawnch Of course, my issue with this review is that Mark is using V/VD as the standard to judge 6 while implying that the series got "casualized" when in reality it is MUCH closer to the old games than V/VD could ever hope to be. Hell he doesnt even mention one of the arguably most "streamlined" changes which is the lock-on mechanics. I have absolute respect for Mark when he talks about Shmups and agree with almost all his takes on the matter but when it comes to other genres/games he does feel very contrarian for the sake of it and in this case in particular, very ignorant of the series in general.
@@MaverickHunter17 I played AC V on my friends Xbox 7 years ago and let me tell you, him speaking fondly of AC V and Verdict Day when they were so much mediocre and radically different from AC Last Raven and 4A and using 5 as the basis of him giving criticism for 6 is a bad move when people only remember it for its mediocrity and the god awful coop system.
@@MaverickHunter17 His review, while solid, becomes somewhat pointless to me if he decides that AC 5 of all games were a good example when AC 5 was a major departure even by old series standards. AC 6 is closer to the old gen games than the "new" gen.
I'm an AC4A fan and never really like 5 because of the more grounded gameplay but this video has actually made interested in giving it a try. Looks way more fun than whatever 6 is trying to be. Great video and you went into detail to explain why this new AC just fall short when compared to past AC game (mainly 5 lol)
If you ever actually played 6, instead of listening to nostalgic reviewers, you'd realize its biggest inspiration is in fact ACFA, and it's actually really fun.
@@GeorgePerakis Holy cow that’s a lot to unload. Ok first off, I do own the game and second point is I’m not saying it’s a bad game, just too different from what I liked about the last games. Third, jumping to conclusions usually make people look like fools
Oh what an awesome comment! yes I think AC5 is absolutely worth a revisit because by the tone of the comments of this video, i think armored core fans have dismissed it much too quickly. This happens in fanbases pretty frequently, like I remember a lot of fans saying how crap NG3 Razor's Edge is, but that game is actually really awesome, but the NG fanbase just wants to sit and talk about how NG Black is the best because ... well that's never explained that clearly ha. (Though NG black is of course a really cool game).
I'm a longtime vet of the series (been playing since 97, never missed a game). Just to piggy back. Steering the mech was in the old games as well. The boost button was always a hold function though, rather than a toggle switch. You had way more precise control as well than 5. Also,I HAVE BEEN THINKING THE SAME THING ABOUT CIRCLE STRAFING BEING SUPERIOR. I've been labbing it out to see, but so far, I don't see any reason not to circle strafe. It makes it so mindless from the perspective of someone who has been heavily focused on the maneuvers in all the games to date. On the subject of boosting. The flying is very floaty, but flying has ALWAYS been part of the series, to one extent or other, with the exception of 5. The older gens had limited flying, and AC4 you could fly forever, but once you used quick boost you would run out of EN fast. In For Answer you could fly a lot more than 4, so the most flying was in For Answer. The floaty style is new. You could always "fast fall" in ALL older games, simply by letting go of the boost button. I don't think the weapon cool down was a bad idea. First, its there because they let you fire four weapons as once. It's to keep it from being too broken. The cooldown actually makes EN weapons more fun because in older games (even going back to the first game) EN weapons would drain your energy when you fired, limiting your mobility. The tradeoff was the EN muzzle velocity was FAST, and they were so accurate. But now, they are less accurate and slower, but now you can fire. Also, the concept is to 'combo' so, you have to manage your shooting according to a clip. They want you to do combos in this game. Lastly, AC4 had weapon reloads, so this is not new. I do agree though, 100% agree how it goes with the stagger system. I find myself sometimes staggering the enemy, only to be reloading while they are staggered. I 100% prefer the old way. Personally, I'd just have the reload times be applied to EN weapons, and have everything else the same. Same for blades and such. I have the same experience that this RPG shit being injected into shooter sucks! Agree about melee weapons. Blades in the older games used to be good and usable to 'some' extent (not in 4). Also, melee attacks ARE built into the game in the kick and the bunch. 100% agree that this game was designed around the 1p boss fights, not around the technical stuff Armored Core has always sported, which makes the game so good. It's lazy design.
Yes the circle strafing meta is something I wonder if Fromsoft are aware of or not. I assume they must be aware of it to some degree, but this game is definitely custom built to make circle strafing the go to strategy ha. A lot of it has to do with the unlocked 3rd person camera + the lock on mechanic. As soon as you combine those two design choices, the player doesn't really need to worry about manually aiming or positioning to inflict damage, so you are then completely free to focus on moving in a circle around the opponent to evade their attacks while still using yours. It comes up in a lot of modern games sadly. FPS also encourage circle strafing in a lot of ways, but in an fps you literally can't see around you so it's a bit more limited there because of the camera angle. Funny enough another genre that really struggles with circle strafing are twin stick shooters. So if you are having trouble in a twin stick, usually you can just circle strafe for the win ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground The thing is, circle strafing has always been a dominant part of movement in the meta for Armored Core games. But here was the catch. Given that turning speeds are slower or faster relative to weight class and leg type, and the fact that the camera is coupled with that turning speed, a HUGE part of the game is aiming and managing your turning, plus other movements in 3D. This games destroys all that in the worst way, making it like Gundam vs. or ZOE, or Virtual On. For those games, that style works. For here, it just ruins integral skills that make the series so unique and fun. The circle straffing meta NOW, is mindless. What was once a skillful dance is now a mindless pattern.
Good review, however it seems like you completely missed the kick mechanic, you can always do kicks while your weapons are on a cooldown. Also there's a semi-advanced move that lets you do melee cancels if you press dodge at the last moment before the hit.
Oh no i didn't' miss the kick mechanic, that thing is pretty lame and is far from the answer to the issues with weapon cooldown. Because lets say you get an enemy in stagger, sure you can kick them, but it's pretty slow and doesn't do much damage, and it sends the enemies flying across the screen, completely forfeiting your position on them. Honestly it would be better if the game gave you some kind of pummel or something, because the last thing you want when you have an enemy in stagger is to give them a position reset while taking a little bit of damage on them. Honestly what I started to do when I was waiting for reloads while the enemy was in stagger was to reposition myself behind the enemy, so that when I finally reloaded my weapon I would at least be in a good position against them.
@@TheElectricUnderground I see, but also you can use Assault Armor while enemies are stunned, it deals quite a lot of damage and can be an extremely good addition to your stagger combo, also big bosses don't fly away after you hit them, so you can kick them multiple times while they're stunned. And you can fall faster in this game if you don't hold any direction on your left stick, you fall about two times faster then if you were holding forward for example, but I can totally see why they didn't add the fast fall button, it would be too OP especially in PVP, since it would basically be a vertical dodge that would fuck up lock on systems of the enemies really bad and everyone would spam it (especcially the reverse jointed leg guys).
I might go and give this game a go. My only experience with any Armored Core is the PSP version of Silent Line. One of the inspirations to play this game is the fact that Kazutaka Miyatake and Shoji Kawamori are the mecha designers here, two big names of the Macross series.
oh yeah the game is still really solid and I do recommend it, I just think it falls short of the MUST PLAY type of recommend, due to the restrictive design choices that I discuss in the vid.
25:0032:10 THIS ! I love AC6 but I strongly agree with these whole section. I hope dev team remember when they introduced the "magazine" in ACNX(2004) , players were confused and disgust the mechanic , but AC4 and AC5 series did pretty well feeling about firing weapons.
Nice video. I agree completely here - AC6 is a really great game that manages to keep the core identity and feel of the franchise, but some of the decisions made to gain the wider audience lost just a bit of the secret sauce of the older games. Reminds me a lot of Monster Hunter World in that way. But like you, I'm hopeful that now that we have this baseline, AC7 will build on it and add some more complexity back in. Although I will say that overall, this may actually be my favorite AC purely because of the presentation. It reeks BUDGET in a way that older ACs couldn't. All the little sound effects of the joint movements are just perfect, and get my Mecha Nerd brain all hyped haha
I'm glad you're optimistic, but the recent development trends of from software haven't really been too encouraging on the "add complexity back in" front. this is coming from someone that despised and was disappointed by Elden ring but loved Sekiro despite it being a bit of a mainstreamified Tenchu in some ways, but i digress
@@florida_sucks Elden Ring was fantastic... In what ways was it worse then say Dark Souls 1 ? I beat and enjoyed Sekiro for what it was and even had the demon bell on for the last few bosses - but its playstyle was very limited and I have no desire to go back... But in Elden Ring, you can do so much with the variety of character builds that its very fun... You can arguably make the game too easy between leveling up too much and some things being "OP" but pretty much every Souls Game with a level up system is like that at least on the first New Game.
I wouldn't hold my breath. This game was designed to bring in Souls players. What I hate is that FROM promised that this game wasn't going to be Souls meets AC and ended up lying about it. What I hate is that Souls players have no problem saying "get good" but most of those fans couldn't comprehend the classic controls the series was revered for. I'd be pissed if every major publisher made all their games play like their flagships.
@@hachikuji_mayoi I literally just posted the Souls bits in my first rant. The repair health, dodge button, and the over powered bosses that can kill you in a few hits and only take chip damage.
23:15 There absolutely is a fast fall in the game. Just don't hold any direction/movement related input at all when you're in the air and your boosters will turn off and you'll fast fall. Seriously, you say you tried, but how hard did you try? You just had to do... Nothing
This is not fast fall, this is just falling at the fastest speed the game allows, which is not fast. That's like saying there is fast fall in mario when you let go of the jump button ha. Fast fall is a specific state when you can increase your fall speed beyond the default fall speed. All you are describing here is the default fall speed. So every game has fast fall essentially by this view.
@@TheElectricUnderground what are you looking for, then? Your boosters all shut off and you plop down like a rock, what else do you want in a fast fall to consider it a "real" one? I'm genuinely curious, I don't see the distinction you're trying to make. In my mind, in this game, there is a slow fall and a fast fall. Falling while holding a directional input is slow, and falling while not holding one is fast.
very late here, but you really hit everything on the head with this. No other videos really resonated with mine or other longtime players observations about the game as clearly as this, it felt like i was going crazy being one of the only few people who thought literally all of this stuff while also being an active ac player. Things like the booster toggle being useless/badly implemented, the camera difference, circle strafing trivializing the boss encounters, etc were almost never talked about by people much. Still insane they really had to remove snipers from the game to promote the forced close range melee epicness. Alot of people dont see how good the older ac games were and still are in alot of aspects, 5thgen was overhated and overlooked, but it did so much as a game, 4thgen as well, ac6 following up with what it did feels underwhelming or unexpected to say the least. Great video!
That's ok, we all don't have the same tastes and values in terms of game design. I hope you can see what issues I am explaining though, because you never know, maybe some of the changes I propose you might actually enjoy if they were implemented into future updates. Rather than just sitting and saying why every game is great, I think it's more interesting to critique what elements of the gameplay work and what elements I think fall short. That is the point of a review, I would hope ha.
As a first time player I’m loving AC6 but the way you describe the boost mode and camera in AC5 makes me wish the system was more like 5. 5 sounds like you get the immersion of operating a machine, and 6 is a little more gamey and just feels like you’re controlling a character. I wish there was ever a good reason to just be walking the mech. Boost in a tank tread seems really silly in 6 as well.
Yes and I don't think they had to 1 to 1 keep the AC5 camera system, but I think if they kept some of it's more technical elements preserved in the new camera system, it would have given the game a tighter and more interesting feel in terms of controls. Perhaps they could have found a middle ground between the two, rather than just chucking the ac5 system all together and going elden ring style free aim.
The more I watch this video, the more I see alot of problems with this, and it come across as GEN V bias. 1. Cutting boost to execute quick turns as you mentioned around 12:20 was an advanced technique you did not need for the campaign at all and was never explained in game. Cutting boots midflight to do a spin out amongst the ground was moreso necessary as a pvp mechanic and was obscure enough you probably would not come across it naturally. Cutting booster main use was to dodge by rapidly losing altitude... which also is an important strategy in armored core 6 you can do. It just kinda hidden, much like spin outs. You are selling the game short here. 2. Your argument around 17:40 onwards talk about difficulty. V and VD damage system alone mean you can pretty much make yourself immune to the enemy damage, while doing maximum damage to them. I do not get how you can think it is harder unless you are willfully ignoring the game imbalances like sazanami missles always doing full damage due to the super high KE damage meaning to resist them the enemy has to gimp their mech, or kicks having true damage so they just oneshot most things. In AC6, most enemies got big AOE attacks and big sweeping attacks to completely prevent circle strategies, which ironically works on VD final boss. What they do not prevent is abusing ACS stagger, which pretty much you seem to be abusing the whole video, as that is a balance issue in the game you fail to touch upon. 3. Around 23:00 you talk about how AC6 does not have fast fall... but it does. Like spins in AC 5 and VD, it is a hidden mechanic. You have to stop pressing buttons completely to initiate it. This whole segment bothers me because it pretty much you comparing a decade of learned tech and skill to two weeks of learning AC6. While I do like the wall kick system in V, it was a symptom of the game taking advantage of cover so much, a feature that really encouraged a lame peak a boo play style that made the game more akin to a TPS, then a mech game. Returning vertical flight is more in line with old armored core, and is actually more what a mech game should be. 4. Cool down been in most AC games. I do not understand this complaint, especially since ready position weapons in gen V are FAR more restrictive. Is the only AC game you play was GEN V? Did you utilize kicks to take advantage of weapon reload periods? This is not a design issue at all, but a personal taste issue, and a severe misunderstanding of the game itself. Your comment at 30:00 seem to be borne from wanting to play this like gen V. You are not jumping with a reverse joint leg that are designed to be vertical and has exceptionally strong kicks compared to bipeds and are instead staying on the ground where they are the weakest. If this was to show off how OP ACS stagger is, why not mention that here, instead of showing you are not playing to your build strengths then saying this make the game sluggish. 5. Melee is an extremely strong punish option that can often 1-3 shot mechs. This was true even in GEN V, where it was slow, hard to land, but incredibly strong. Honestly, this was true in ALL Armored core games. 34:20 is a remark about melee that I do not understand and make little sense in the context of the series. These was my biggest issues as the rest is agree to disagree. I liked the video and subscribed, but the script here seems indicative to me of someone that didn't play the game for what it was, and instead bemoaned it not like ACV, and considering your footage, specifically verdict day.
I'll respond to your comment in the same list format ha: 1. The changing boost mechanic seems really fundamental to the design of the game. It's clearly intentionally designed. I'm not sure how you can argue that knowing how to do it is irrelevant, when the game is very demanding movement wise and understanding how the boost system works is clearly beneficial. I think you are jumping too far off the main point, which is that in 5, there is depth and areas to explore with the boost system of 5, whereas in 6 the boost system has been so streamlined that it may as well not exist. I think it's a huge stretch to say that the boost system of 5 is some kind of niche mechanic, when the game is so heavily balanced around movement. 2. Even Dunkey thinks Core 6 is too easy. This is actually a really easy point to refute because in the course of my review I played both 5 VD and 6 at the same time for roughly the same amount of time. I did the pepsi challenge lol. With 6, I had no issues with difficulty at any point. I didn't get stuck, i didn't need to look things up, I didn't have to even tweak my build all that much. It was a fun, but very comfortable gameplay experience. With 5 VD, I ran up against difficulty wall after difficulty wall and you know what I had to do ... I had to research the game. i had to figure out which builds to use in which levels and what weapons worked and why. And on top of that also needed to figure out the game's movement system and core combat (plus you actually have to aim in 5 VD, whereas in 6 the generous lock on mechanic handles most of that for you). Again your pushing past the main point by saying, well if I understand 5 perfectly then it's actually easier than 6 ... but is that true. I highly doubt that. Part of gameplay difficulty is how much the game tests your knowledge of its systems and how much you have to adjust that knowledge. Because 6 is so streamlined, you only need to have a basic understanding of how the system works and your set to go. Whereas in 5, there is a lot more you have to dig into both mechanically and with all the mech parts and all that. 3. I've addressed this point in other comments, AC6 does not have a fast fall. A fast fall is a specific technique where you can increase your fall speed on the fly beyond the default fall speed. In 5 you have your booster fall speed and then you can manually, at any moment, turn off the booster to plummet at a fast rate. In 6, Fromsoft have specifically removed this mechanic. You cannot manually turn off your boosters in the air to drop. What you are describing is not a fast fall, because notice what needs to happen, you need to stop moving, right? So you literally cannot use this technique to quickly move down through the air, because the game forces you to sit and wait like a giant turkey. Fromsoft are deliberately taking away the fast fall option from you, but since it would be absurd to have you be stuck in the air all the time, they have this state where your boosters eventually turn off ... after you have stopped moving. This is a concession for the general movement of the game so you don't get stuck in the air, but it's clearly intentionally designed to not be too good or too useful in combat situations. This is like me saying that a game has removed a run mechanic and your saying, no run is still there, because you can walk. 4. No it isn't. This point I have triple checked since posting the review and I had Boghog, an associate of the channel, also check it across the older games. This is not true or you don't understand what i mean by weapon cool down. Very easy test, get the combat rifle in AC5 and use it in AC6, what's different? In 5 you have a constant rate of fire that does not get interrupted. In 6, you rate of fire is interrupted by needing to reload. This happens across most weapons. Use the gatling in 5, and then use it in 6, what's the difference? You already conceded that there is a difference by saying i should use kicks in 6 during the cooldown ha. The kick is lame, and again another example of the game really wanting to force melee combat situations by taking away my rifle fire rate and positioning. The kick does not fix the issue at all ha. Also it's lame that the kick forces a position reset, if it isn't lame enough. At least give me a pummel or something, so I don't have to completely chase down the enemy again. 5. You're missing my point on the melee. I say in the video that melee is strong directly. That's not the critique. I'm critiquing the design of the melee. In the vid, I discuss the concept of natural balance vs statistical balance. Natural balance are the attributes of a move that are fundamental, its frame data (startup, cooldown, hitbox size, speed, etc). Statistical balance are the numbered stats of an attack, basically how much damage and stun it does. So in fighting games, lets compare a mid poking kick to a roudhouse kick. A mid poking kick has strong natural balance, in that it has great frame data and hitboxes and all that, so it's a move you naturally use to control space and engage in the core combat. A roundhouse, on the other hand, is a naturally weak move because it is slow, takes forever to start up, and is very punishable, it's a move you don't want to use naturally, except is has strong statistical balance in that it does a bunch of damage and creates a knockdown. In AC6, the melee is massive roundhouses all day. That's how the game balances the melee. You need to do these huge high commitment attacks all the time. Which I find tedious and honestly under designed. So yes the melee is strong statistically, but it's not strong naturally. I explained in the video that the natural combat of the game is semi close range circle strafing (like you do with the long shotguns and riffles). That is the meta of the game naturally. The melee does not fit this meta at all, and fromsoft know that. So rather than designing the melee to have better natural qualities (faster startup, faster recovery, but would do less damage) From decided no let's just balance the melee to be better by nerfing the ranged combat and imposing weapon cooldowns. So now the flow of the game is much clunkier because your constantly going to be locked into the huge melee animations over and over. It's lame. What From should have done is made the melee faster and more naturally integrated into the ranged combat, and tamped down on it's damage to compensate. Also the fact that the melee has this built in dash animation that you have to do is extra clunky. In terms of older AC games and their melee combat, that actually doesn't matter at all. AC6 is unique in how much it really really wants to make the melee happen and how much it pushes the player to use melee in terms of it's overall design (do the older AC games have enemy stagger?). The game goes so far as to nerf ranged options with weapon cooldowns. Whereas in older AC games, yeah the melee is funky in those too, but they aren't so heavily designed around the melee anyway, so it's just sort of a side line weapon option. Also they don't have the built in tracking boost animation at the very least. Basically, if you are going to make a game mechanic central to your game design, there is a higher need to make it good ha. Whereas in the older games you can ignore melee combat much more and just focus on ranged combat. Overall, I'm glad you engaged with my video so much and ended up subscribing, that's really great :-) Sometimes my tastes and preferences aren't gonna line up with other players, but one trend that I think you should also consider, and i have noticed this trend on this channel, is to literally wait and give my critiques some time to ferment. Because in the new release glow where everyone is claiming that month's game is masterpiece, my reviews stick out as more critical. But just wait, in a few months time we are going to get a second wave of vids where people do start to re examine the game after the honeymoon is over, it's a really funny pattern. And then my reviews tend to sink in with everyone else more ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground Appreciate the quick and friendly response. I wasn't sure what the reaction was gonna be, but I like that it is a positive and constructive one. The list format help me with keeping ideas together, so I don't meander too much. 1. I specifically referenced spin outs which is cutting the boosters, so that your AC does a turn against the ground when it hits, leaving a burning trail in the dirt. I argued this was not necessary to learn because I beat all of verdict day not using it, it was never explained in game, and no enemy (asides from blue magnolia arguably) is adept enough getting behind you that it will tempt you to experiment enough to discover its existence. Verdict day was balanced around wall kicking to get altitude, but the intricates of boost is never used more than that unless in a pvp context. 2. Dunkey look sup builds to break the game, as he did in elden ring, dark souls 3, sekiro, blood borne, etc. In the same review, he showed clips of him breaking Elden ring while saying you have to respect the bosses in elden ring while not in AC6. This leads me to think he was being sarcastic and criticizing fromsoftware overall design, while being tongue in cheek to avoid fromsoftware fanboys in general. He done this on multiple ocassions with other fanbases, as seen with his latest starfield video, and seen in his harry potter video. In regard to the rest of your point, I guess this is agree to disagree as I had the opposite experience here, as I built a heavy biped and just crushed the whole game because they have the best defensive spread, and I occassionally switched to pulse guns to obliterate certain Armored cores, or switched to tetrapods because CE damage was a problem. 3. This just sounds like to me you didn't experiment with fastfall and dislike its implementation. It serves the same function. 4. Four answer had weapon reloading... I do not get this point other than you have not played other armored core games and want the game to be more like VD. You not liking the kick is a preference, not a design flaw... and even verdict day has innate balancing where if you tuned to much toward power you made the weapon shoot slower. 5. Alot of this is repeating concepts I understood but did not find relevant to mention in my criticism as your issue was disliking melee because it "feels" bad because you find it to be committal. Plasma thrower can move while meleeing on quads and tanks, and the mine thrower can as well, and only occupy the melee slot. I think this require more experimentation on your part. Also yes, even verdict day had stagger, seen with the stability stat where a weapon hit you that did more impact than you had stability, you hard stagger, and took extra damage (This was the likely foundation for the ACS stagger). This existed in 4th gen, 3rd gen, 2nd gen and 1st gen, but instead of taking instability damage, you just couldn't move when hit with a heavy weapon or a melee. I appreciate this last bit, but truth be told in this instance, I already have issues with how the game handle innate weapon balancing due to being stagger centric, assault boost having no downsides invalidating other movement options, the lackluster pvp options compared to something like verdict day, low leg parts, removal of important information like weapon velocity, and the game removing long range play in favor of a mid-range burst to close gameplay that encourage heavy builds. My issue here was directed at what I perceived to be preference-based issues shown as objective and incomplete information, so it did not move the needle in my mind, but I always appreciate other perspectives. Keep up the good work though. Regardless of critics like me, the site is better with people willing to analyze games.
Me too! i think the fromsoft backlog is really cool and full of interesting ideas! I hope the dev does do more mech stuff and non souls stuff, Fromsoft are absolutely one of the only current studios that I respect in terms of game design ha.
You can definitely still fast fall in AC4, I checked that. But I don't base what I value in my reviews on series tradition, rather on fundamental design concepts. This is sort of an older topic in my vids, but just because a mechanic is an an older game, doesn't make it any more valid because of tradition. So in the case of armored core as a series, let's say that there are older armored core games with weapon cooldown, and then AC5 removes the weapon cooldown, and then AC6 puts the weapon cooldown back. To me ,the game that did it correct would then be AC5, because I do not think weapon cooldowns is a good mechanic within the genre as a whole. So I would say that if AC5 was the game that was making all these innovations, and then AC6 is sort of ignoring the new mechanics and ideas, that just means that AC5 was under appreciated for its design. This happens in games series all the time actually. So when I go through and play older armored core games, if I come across ones with weapon cooldowns, I'll critique that mechanic in that context just like I would for AC6.
I haven't played previous AC games, they were way before the time I really got into mecha genre hardcore, and I'm enjoying AC6 quite a lot so far. My biggest gripe with the game so far is the bosses and the build balance. As far as I undarstand, the old AC games were about trying, failing and trying again with a different build, suited for the particular situations in a particular mission. So far that's not what I'm getting from AC6. Not all builds are created equal, sure, but they're all on a single universal scale from useless to auto-win. I'm fine with some of my "cosplay" builds being best case suboptimal, worst case useless against bosses, or even other ACs. But when there are builds that can just autopilot you through the game without breaking a sweat, the discrepancy is not even funny. It's not about "in this mission fast and long range build would be benefitial, in that mission tankier close range build would be advantageous", it's about "you can take a build and try to juuuust barely git gud through a mission, or you can take the build and automatically steamroll through the entire game". Once you've found THE build (and it can happen pretty early in the game), it kinda kills the joy of experimentation and trying out different things.
Yea what's worse is that one of the OP builds is something I genuinely just gravitated towards naturally (dual shotguns) because I found it cool but now I'm expected to play other builds if I want the game to be challenging just cause FROM couldn't find a way to balance their game. The whole "find your own fun" atittude is very frustrating to deal with cuz it feels like people just don't want to understand the countless reasons for why you wouldn't wanna gimp your own mech.
Yeah i'm not deep into the game enough to know for sure, but I get the feeling that the game is going to have basically more universal builds that will get the job done in almost all cases ha.
Please point me to a single build, with a single unchanging set of weapons, possible to make in Chapter 1, that can beat every boss in the game without exceptions and without several tries. I haven't found one so far. If you've found one, I suspect you've been paying more attention to forums and reddit than the game itself.
@@boghogSTG So you beat Balteus with the starter shotguns? Is that what you're saying? That's very impressive if true. I personally found those shotguns to be useless. If you're talking about the Zimmermans you don't even get until Chapter 3, I'd still like you to confirm that you managed to beat Ibis in under 5 attempts. Personally, I have no idea what any of you people are talking about. The game is plenty hard for the average player, no matter which build you choose. Some people will struggle more than others, and some bosses will be more challenging for some players than others, but I'm not going to sit here for even a second and believe that all of you just happened to beat every boss in the game without several attempts and a build you came up with on your own. "But 5 attempts isn't hard" most games won't have you retrying a bossfight even once, let's not confuse Dark Souls difficulty with what's actually normal in modern gaming.
@@GeorgePerakis Yup, I used the default shotguns until right before the worm, didnt even switch to zimmermans right away. They arent particularly worse than double zimmermans in terms of stamina breaks, you just need some decent high damage shoulder/melee weapons to capitalize on them Ibis took 4-6 attempts yeah, I would not call that hard in the slightest but even if you want to theres still a problem cuz the core issue is that I didnt need to learn bosses thoroughly to beat them, regardless of attempt number. For Balteus, Ibis and Ayre I had to pick some stuff up (hug Balteus during slashes, dont be greedy with Ibis, dodge into Ayre doing her slash) but it was hardly comprehensive and other non major boss fights might as well not have movesets cuz its so easy to tank them. If I had to switch my build to trivialize each one at least thatd make some sense but no, double shotguns + straight missile launchers/cannons owned everything. Even if it took 20 attempts this kind of thing is unacceptable in a "hardcore" action game IMO
yeah it's funny how many euroshmup concepts mech games tend to use actually ha. i think the reason why mech games get away with having movement inertia and that sort of thing though is that they function in 3D space, rather than being locked into 2d. Still, I do like games like AC5 which reduce the amount of movement inertia and have a slightly more arcade feel ha.
Im hoping the new AC will create a solid audience for mech games so we can get a new high quality MechWarrior game, mostly because I dig the battletech universe.
Yes i'm super curious how AC will affect the other mech games in terms of interest. I could see it creating a bubble for other mech games to get more notice, which would be really cool.
YES!! Totally agree. I played ACVI and it felt like Fromsoft was afraid of losing the audience that got to know them thanks to Dark souls, so they included a lot of mechanics to attract that audience. don't get me wrong, I also like Dark souls a lot, but I played AC first. ACVI feels totally different, what brought them popularity was DS and I guess now they have no incentive to change the formula so ACVI ends up being a Souls-like. But if all their games are more Souls-like eventually people will get tired.
IMO FromSoft's masterpiece is Bloodborne and they haven't quite recreated anything as special/unique/creative since, but the games they make are still really solid
Your melee criticism lines up exactly with my feelings on it. Maybe you could do something where spending a slot drastically modifies or enhances your default melee weapon, but with how basic the slash is I don't think it deserves to take away from your other armaments.
Exactly master, and I think if this was suggested to Fromsoft (they won't see my humble little review), but if this was general fan feedback, they would pick up on this being a change they want ha.
Camera didn't bother me at all on mouse and keyboard. Game really shined on that input system. But everything from cooldowns to god damn slow falling I 100% agree with.
Yeah i don't hate the new camera system by any means, but I think what Fromsoft should have done is added a bit more limitation to it, so that your mech movement is still more meaningful, like maybe have it where you can peak left and right but still need to turn using the face of the character, like Resi4 or something. I think an in-between of the fully free camera of 6 and the restricted camera of 5 would have been perfect.
I've never played the Armored Core games, so I know little about them, but . . . the gameplay looks very reminiscent of the old Virtual On games, albeit less focused on 1v1 and more of a progressive level design. (Kind of like comparing a fighting game to a brawler.) Am I correct in my assumption? Virtual On was my jam back in the day. I was totally that a-hole in the arcades that kept wasting everyone else's quarters in 1v1. I am unapologetic.
Also, im a Gundam EXVS player. That is the pinnacle of mech control and combat. It is a multiplayer game but all of the weapons and subwepons that have cool downs / reload periods. It is a pure arcade action game in every sense of the word (EXVS) and it has weapon reloads and cool downs on sub weapons and power up modes. I did some reading on the evolution of the series since I have such large gaps in between my series experience. Interestingly enough it seems like Armored Core 6 is kind of the reverse Armored Core 5 so it makes total sense. Apparently some fans of the earlier game games in the series were unhappy with how the more fast paced reflex based combat had become the series style so they deliberately went to lengths to make AC5 feel like a more tactical game.
You're the best video game channel on UA-cam. Hands down, I'm a huge fan... You have all the right takes, you're verbalizing stuff I've been saying for years. Thanks for content.
oh what an awesome comment!!!! Thank you so much! I do try to really dig into aspects of game design that I don't feel are talked about, so I'm glad what I'm talking about is making sense to you :-)
It's weird how people get turned off from mecha, being a giant murder mech seems like something people would universally think is kickass. Maybe it's the self-insert crowd not getting their 'immersion'. Also, I feel Armored Core VI proves that Fromsoft has spent too much time on Souls, they can't make something that feels like Armored Core V anymore because after verdict day everyone there has been focused on Souls action for a decade straight.
I’m so confused by this game. It is borderline not even a game IMO, just a tech demo for the movement system. It has the weirdest pacing of any major release I have ever played. The part balance is terrible. The big dramatic boss fights take less than a minute, sometimes on your first try if you’ve done the littlest bit of min/maxing. Going full aggro gorilla mode is always the correct choice in combat. Maybe NG+ is different, and maybe the true genius of the game only reveals itself when you start hunting for s-ranks, but I’m good with my one playthrough for now. However, kudos to From on the multiplayer, because it works really well…
@@BebehCookieIcecream OK then, guy who owns Diablo 4 👍 Are you just a slop of the month enjoyer? Or do you actually have some wisdom to dispense that will make me reinstall Armored Core 6/10?
@@tydavis1795 I just think starting your weird take with "It's borderline not even a game IMO" shows your opinions are flippant at best. You just, like, don't get it, man..... The parts are not meant to be totally balanced. Some parts are easier/more straight forward, some are more obscure and nuanced. FROM games are so fulfilling to replay because within them lies a bounty of different playstyles and challenges to refine and overcome. These are not multiplayer-first games. Overlooking/skipping the system's intricacies just opens you up for an unfulfilling time. NG+ is indeed different, and NG++ for that matter, because you're actually forced to use more refined tactics due to the reworked difficulty and setup of missions, which leads to being forced to engage with said systems on a deeper level. Trying to ape mode duels/bosses in the harder difficulties often leads to getting clowned (though it's often because of being outnumbered or because the boss is, obviously, much more dangerous than you and has upgraded moves). Try it out with a different build if you ever do play again, like a light build. Smgs, maybe a sword, bipedal, 1200km/h+ 👍. P.S. D4 is indeed shit, I quit pre-50.
I hope so, would be nice to see how Fromsoft approaches character action genre again. I would like to see return of Kuon(survival horror) or Tenchu(stealth) from them too.
Very important point that I've talked about in previous reviews, but I don't do series/traditional based reviews of game mechanics. I look at the mechanics of a game more in terms of design overall. So this point you are bringing up here is a common example of a mentality I try to avoid. So looking at AC5, let's say AC5 is the only game in the series that removes weapon cooldown and has this walljump based movement system and camera system. I know that AC4 does have fast fall without boost, but let's say these mechanics are unique to just AC5. These choices that AC5 has made were smart game design decisions. So that if AC6 decides to go back to a simpler movement system and then adds in weapon cooldowns, just because these mechanics were used in older games doesn't make them good, it just means that the game design has regressed backwards. If there is one lesson I def want to communicate on this channel, it's that tradition does not make game design good. But a lot of gamers have this mentality that if a series just keeps repeating bad design over and over, at some point that bad design becomes good, and then funny enough when it is then altered (like you are saying happened in AC5) then it's AC5 making the bad choice ha. So I do plan on going back and playing the older Armored Core games, and I promise that if I come across weapon cooldown and other complaints that I made in AC6, I will critique them as well. Just because a game design decision is old, doesn't make it good.
Yes, the wall jump that was in 5 was to compensate for the lack of true flight in the game. I didn't have a problem with it but a lot of people seemed to hate it. So it's smart game design to you and horrible game design to a majority of players. Ultimately, this is a case of 'to each his own'. I was just saying play the other games for a broader spectrum of the evolution or devolution of game mechanics. Great video btw man, I love to hear other's experiences with this game
I was hoping that the addition of checkpoints and the ability to change parts mid-mission would proportionately lead to more challenging boss fights, but the game is weirdly easy. Every arena fight after the first few I beat in one try, and the final boss took only two attempts. I kept wondering if I just happened to make an OP build, but I'm less inclined to believe that seeing how different your go-to build was. Also, did anyone else notice how big of a deadzone there is for the camera movement?
100% agree, it's an ok game. What's your opinion on Titanfall? AC feels like I'm in a metal mosquito on drugs flying around, Titanfall feels like a real mech. I mean a mech is 100T or heavier 🤷♂️
The Ammo limits were really puzzling to me, especially when they give you a a full refill after restarting a checkpoint or right before a boss fight anyway. Just seems odd to put in a limitation without any real obstacle that really tests it.
The obstacle is the parts of the levels before the bosses. It’s not a test of keeping enough for a boss obviously. The levels with resupplies are the bigger ones where it’s entirely possible to run out of ammo and not be able to get to the resupply if you’re not careful.
S-ranks, probably. If you're hardcore and want to S-rank the missions, the ammo limit matters. But if you're struggling with the game and dying a lot, the ammo system is forgiving.
Like someone else have said, this isn't a game for dark souls enjoyers. It's not a souls-like. The intention is for you to play the game multiple times over; and try to S-rank missions. That's when those seemingly useless limits really start to matter.
Sekiro still has like 10% of the dna from tenchu tho, I want a proper new tenchu with missions and no deep combat mechanics, just pure stealth. AC6 at least has most of the core mechanics from the old ac games. Also, i dont think its a good idea to compare 6 to 5, knowing the 5th gen has litttle to do with previous titles on the series, and borrows movement and attack mechanics from other mech games made by fromsoft. 6 has a lot more in common with the ps1/2 games and the 4th gen imo.
I'm happy you were looking forward to my review! This one ended up being a lot of homework ha because I didn't just play AC6, I also played a ton of AC5 and researched a bunch of the older games. Overall though, this review was actually a ton of fun as mech genre is a genre that I enjoy playing and talking about :-)
It's so weird to me that you're comparing AC 6 to 5. My frame of reference for AC is always 4A, which I think is the pinnacle of what Armored Core is, even though in retrospect it is the most different to the rest. Basically 3, 4, 5 and now 6 each have a totally different feel to them and each reinvents the formula in some way. You mentioned that you can fly too easily in AC6, well to me AC6 is way too slow and grounded compared to 4A! In 4A, you can *really* fly. In fact, fights in 4A are very similar to some kind of dogfight between semi-grounded fighter jets. Turning in 6 is too easy? Turning in 4 is automatic! You just lock on to the enemy and let your mech automatically track it. The thing that makes all of this mad flying around work is the FCS targeting system - it automatically compensates for the enemy's movement. Once it locks on, firing your weapon is a guaranteed hit as long as the enemy doesn't change the direction it's headed in. This more than anything else is what makes it feel like an incredibly fun dogfight - you're not just avoiding the enemy's hitboxes, you are actively trying to trick the enemy by switching your movement pattern. Circle strafing doesn't work, the system accounts for that. In AC6 all enemies just fire at you rather than at where you're going to be. Enemies' movements are also a lot different in 4A. In 6 it's all input reading and instant dodges. The enemy circle-strafes you and instantly boosts in the opposite direction when you fire a bullet. In contrast, in 4A all enemies have very intricate movement patterns based on the type of mech they have, but all of them are designed to confuse your FCS and make it actually hard to hit them. There is an entire class of mechs made to be extremely fast when on ground as opposed to in the air - the four-legged ones, ironically enough. Those were always hard for me since they can just change their trajectory instantly on ground. It makes a lot more sense than the permanently flying hovercraft design of 6 - in 4A they look like water striders and they move like water striders. Enemy movement in 6 is truly a band-aid design - they wanted the enemies to be harder to hit, so they made them instantly dodge on reading your inputs, rather than give them actual tactical movement like in 4A. The stagger system is also very meh. It basically transforms the game into a race who can stagger the other one first and deliver massive damage. There is no space for fun builds - it's either close range stagger with the shotguns or long-range stagger with homing missiles. Nothing else really works in this game - rifles are useless because enemies instantly dodge those with input reading; laser weapons are useless because they don't stagger and don't do enough damage to staggered enemies, plus they take forever to cool down; melee is only useful as a stagger punish... 4A had a ton of viable builds - you could make anything from super long range tanky mechs to extremely light dual-saber builds that zip around and shred enemies before they can react. It still had something similar to a stagger system where if your Primal Armor got depleted you'd take a lot more damage and there were builds specifically made to deplete the enemy's PA and then punish them, but importantly getting your PA depleted never slowed you down, and hitting an enemy with PA up still did good damage to them. So to me AC6 is far from being too quick. It is way too slow if anything. AC5 was already a very big disappointment when it came out (I didn't buy it), but I was hopeful 6 would be a return to form in a way. Instead, we got something like Sekiro with no parry where you and the enemy hit each other at point blank range hoping to stagger the other one first. I give it 6/10, but only because the characters are kind of cool, even if the plot is nonsense.
Weapon reload/cooldown is not an uncommon mechanic in Armored Core titles, the way it's handled does change between generations of the franchise, but in most cases it isn't really hard to get used to. Personally I tought it made logical sense in the majority of weapons, mostly the solid ammo ones, for rifles having a magazine that needed to be reloaded between bursts and for grenade launchers having a chamber that needed time to be loaded with a big shell between shots felt realistically natural. I do concur that in some cases it takes a bit too much time, but it worked together with everything else in giving the feeling of having to manage a somewhat realistic mecha simulator. The fixed camera also played a part in that feeling, altough it also made the movements of the mech feel a bit too clunky and stiff in many occasions.
I do think focusing on ACV is misplaced, even armored core fans didn't like it very much. The 3rd and 4th gen, that came out before demon's souls and actualler were were myasaki got his start, are regarded as the cream of the crop mecha games
I think the mechanics of AC5 are very cool though, and the examples that I pointed out about the mobility options and lack of cool down on weapons is the right direction for mech combat I think. As to which AC game is the best overall I'm not familiar with the series to be sure about at this point, but I think the mechanics of AC5 have a lot more going on than the mechanics of AC6 and since AC5 was the last installment before AC6, it is a strong point of comparison.
I was afraid Armored Core 6 would take a lot more from Souls game, so as to not displeased a particularly inflexible audience, borderline idiot savant, and was actually very happy with the final product. I've never played V though. The only other AC I've done in the past was For Answer, and AC6 felt quite like For Answer (but slower). I would even go as far as to say it's the best From Software I've ever played! But it was really interesting to listen to the points you raise. As always, you have a gift for explaining in a very articulate manner why very specific mechanics feel off or right to you.
AC6 is a really solid game and I enjoyed playing it and talking about it, and I agree that it is actually one of my more liked Fromsoft games ha (dark souls gets boring for me pretty quickly). But the thing about AC6 that nagged at me is that I could feel myself being restrained by design choices that I know From did for accessibility reasons. So I had fun and actually cruised through the game without too much difficulty, but I didn't feel that X factor that pushed me to keep coming back. I think it's solid, but too safe. I really hope the follow up is more technical and challenging, that would be a fun review.
Your point about the more contained level design of earlier games making the terrain actually matter reminds me a lot of the Dark Souls series and Elden Ring. The earlier games had such great attention to detail in their level designs, and then ER just barfs out copy-pasta open fields and haphazardly placed ruins assets ad nauseum. And because everything is so open the terrain doesn't matter at all. I may have a chip on my shoulder.
Oh yes exactly! Elden ring has a pretty solid open world (in terms of open world games) but it's still not as tightly put together as the older souls games. And then in AC6 it's pretty fairly condensed by modern game standards, but there are still plenty of sections of just boosting over empty ground waiting to get where you need to go.
Wasn't familiar with the AC series so far, so I was wondering why you'd even need to turn off boost. In light of how it worked in AC5, now it does make sense! That kind of technical movement is a great fit for a mech game, and what I'd like to see more of. So it's a bit of a shame AC6 didn't keep it, but I can also see why mainstreamification was a big priority for this entry. At least making a high-budget AC game is something that could make sense financially as well.
Cool downs were the death of me in this game. Weapons, boosters, and then stagger man that every 10 seconds all of my buttons just stop working. Now that's what I call action! I really did enjoy the game and thought it was a lot of fun, but I think you're exactly right that done if the fundamental design elements could be thought through better. I like your idea of natural vs statistical balance. Basically anytime a game says "this is too good, so you're just not allowed to do it", that's a design bandaid, not solution. Another example of this is how status effects don't work on bosses in RPGs.
Another issue for me, which dovetails with what you said, the levels are so big and beautiful with awesome geometry, verticality, layers, etc. And then there's just nothing. In a game series known for having a billion mech parts, there are very very few to find out in the world. So much potential for awesome secrets and exploring books and crannies, and there are just not that many. Barely worth it to explore the big beautiful levels, because 9/10 times there's no reward, so why even look when I'm probably getting nothing.
yeah I think it's a really lame and kind of 2010's direction to take the combat system. Especially because, like a said, western games are finally figuring out (slowly) that cooldowns are lame thanks to doom 2016
that's not a fast fall, that's the default fall speed. A fast fall is a specific technique that allows you to accelerate more quickly than the default fall speed. In super mario bros, if you let go of B, your not fast falling. In 5, the game has the default fall speed with boosters (that automatically kick on) and you can, at any moment, manually kick off those boosters to plummet - that's a fast fall. In 6, the game does not allow you to kick off the boosters to fast fall, you can press the booster button all you want, it doesn't allow that to happen. Instead, the game forces the player to do nothing (as if the apm isn't low enough) and your boosters will eventually turn off by themselves and you'll gently drift to the ground. There is nothing fast or strategic about this process ha. Basically what From have done is remove the fast fall option, but since it would be insane to have no way to get back to the ground, they have this cooldown period where if you do nothing, eventually the boosters will turn off and you'll drift to the ground. To call this a fast fall is just completely wrong. The whole point of this mechanic is to prevent a fast fall from existing while still not forcing the player to be stuck in the air. It's like basically me saying "hey, the game removed run from the movement," and your saying: "No, run is still present because you can walk."
As a hardcore 2009- fromsoft fan (AC6 was my first AC and as usual loved it for many reasons you didn't cover, nevertheless) I went into this review just waiting to eye-roll your takes. Many of your gripes... I had to concur with must concede. Brilliantly executed review, and well thought out thoughts.
But you can't skip the wind up animation, that s a big issue, nor can you cancel the massive after swing animation, you can only cancel the tracking animation, which shouldn't be there in the first place. Overall the melee should come out faster, have less recovery lag, but do less damage. More of a utility move than this big full commitment swing
@@TheElectricUnderground there’s no stakes to the combat if you can just opt out of your move at any time. Same with overheating. If you could just spam the entire time with no consequences.
You know, personally, i would love them to remaster the 4th gen AC Its THE Armored Core that a LOT of Ravens/Lynx'es remembered. That and maybe Verdict Day. Whatever it takes to warm them up for AC6.5 and maybe AC7
AC6 is my first AC game and I'm really loving it (not finished yet, far from it) but I can also agree with many of your points in the video. I think the technicality of the turning speed and the decision to use booster or not is definitely a more interesting option, but I don't think I would like it personally. maybe I need to try the older AC games. But I do agree on the useless button for toggling on boost in AC6, even in platforming I really don't see any heavy value in turning off boost in the game so far. And while I do like just having a simpler ability to go upwards in the air like in AC6, I would have liked more air mobility in general, like the fast fall you mentioned, and those wall jumps looked dope asl. I think adding wall jumps, fast fall, and a less sluggish feeling assault boost, maybe even an instantaneous assault boost for an omnidirectional sprint/dash would be my ideal mix of movement. Melee being just a separate slot/s on its own is also an idea I think that would be a benefit to the game, since I just like having more weapons at any given moment lol Lastly, I think your part on weapon cooldowns would have been an aspect that would change game feel completely. the constant attacking without weapon cooldowns and reloads would have resulted in an overall more faster paced and unrelenting gameplay style that I also think would have preferred. Like I said, while I'm having a blast with AC6 so far, not all but many of the aspects you included and suggested in this video would have resulted in a game that would have appealed even more to me, even when AC6 is already live af for me at its current state. Great video man
I'm glad my critiques have resonated with you :-) yes absolutely I think the base product of AC6 is solid and I do recommend it, but I think if Fromsoft added a bit more technical options and increased the pace more, then they will absolutely have something special on their hands. Who knows, it's entirely possible that they may make some changes in line with my critiques in newer entries or updates on the series :-)
I've been playing Armored Core before most of the "fan base" was an itch in their daddy's jock. The main reason why casual players hated it was because they were too dumb to read stats sheets or learn how to pilot/control the game. Now From is trying to convert the Souls fan base to revive the series by basically reskinning the game. Now the game has stupid stuff like repair packs, stagger bars, no radar, a dodge button, and retarded bosses that can kill you in a few hits. One of the main points of the game was leveraging your armored points to finish a mission and now that feature is meaningless with health packs. I guarantee that most of the fans praising this game for its "toughness" would 100% struggle with the earlier installments. Despite the reviews of brain-dead gaming journalists, the series always had a strong cult following and was well-known and respected in Japan.
Yes it really is the classic tale of taking a hardcore series and streamlining it to a wider audience, like a said some of the secret sauce of the original series is going to be lost in translation. One thing that I am hopeful about is that, because of the popularity of AC6, maybe more players will start to check out the older games in the series, because it is insane how overlooked they are. While working on this review it was really difficult to find much material on the older AC4 games, even like gameplay footage and stuff. I'm definitely going to try to cover AC4 and 5 here on the channel soon :-)
Was really excited for the game but the more I play the game the less I like it overall & the more tedious it becomes. The stamina system + cooldowns turns the boss fights into very samey exercises in waiting for a moment in between attacks to dump all your firepower into them & encourages exploiting their limited tracking, it almost feels like a Diablo-like or MMO at times. The missions are a total joke and remind me of lower difficulties of EDF where you're just burning through random forgettable easy missions one after another. There's some exceptions like the NG+ mission where you can turn on 2 of your allies but that just makes it more frustrating cuz it shows they can make fun encounters but chose not to. I'm just hoping some S ranks will be more engaging because so far the S ranks I've tried were just a matter of a few attempts and slight build tweaks. Arena is horrible, it wasn't great in the older games but at least those had some challenging encounters later on - here destroying every single arena fighter within an attempt or two without thinking about tactics at all or putting any effort in is completely doable. I do hope that FROM keep going and release another version like they did with previous AC games, vastly improving it. I felt like this would be a complete slam dunk for them cause Souls games despite everything are pretty tight mechanically, and bringing that tightness into AC would be the perfect combo for me personally.
Yes I felt the same way bog, as the game goes on and you start to see the hard limits the combat system puts on you as a player, it does start to feel more tedious. The weapon cooldowns especially hold the game back, and the lack of fast fall just seems odd because of how much the game wants you to jump and boost vertically.
I'm glad you gave older FromSoftware their flowers. The Armored Core series was sadly overlooked.
I'm so glad that Armored Core 6 was made because it feels like it has all the stuff I personally wanted from a new AC.
- Atmosphere and feel of Silent Line
- The weight of 5 but have a speed that's in between 3 and For Answer
- Builds being easier to make while allowing a ton of head room for min-maxing.
- Having online PvP in some form
- Have each mission be distinct enough instead of an EDF amount of missions.
It hit those marks for me so I was pretty happy with even if the balancing is a bit jank and the stagger mechanic is something I can take or leave.
The reason why you underwhelm with this game is because AC6 is more like AC4 than AC5. The AC5 is so much different I'm considered it a outlier from AC's series, and the AC5 mechanics that reintroduce is boost kick, scanning, and weapon hangar bay that's it.
yeah ac6 feels regressive in terms of the mechanics compared to 5. Where From clearly thought that wall kicks and the more complex boost system are probably going to be tricky for new players, so they just went back to a more basic movement system, which I think is a shame. They could have the more automated camera for the new players, but then keep the advanced movement.
Funnily enough, I love AC4/FA quite a bit (White Glint for life baybee). That being said, AC3/SL/LR and AC5/VD are the GOAT AC games mechanics wise. ACVI however is the GOAT storytelling wise if you ask me.
It’s really funny to see even not super mega fans of Armored Core can see what is lost. I hope 7 will be a 180 and be a return to all the mechanics and systems that gave the series a very different feel from most games.
perhaps it was a decision made with foresight in mind. lets make a very strong armored core game that will renew the series, and the next game can have more complexity. people consume games without thinking of the bigger picture. the series has been in the dark for so long. this game is a budding achievement. readying us for something more next time while still supplying us with a rich and engaging experience that is unlike anything on the gaming market today.
@@10XSeiga I am still waiting on AC7, hoping that it'll be a proper return but I don't have a lot of confidence. Their modern titles have improved on things but haven't really gotten more complex with their actual gameplay still remaining very basic with the Souls games. Armored Core as a series as well goes against a lot of the mainstream, 6 basically broke a lot of its own rules it had for 15 games in a row to please a modern audience. It's really hard to imagine them going back. Ogura the producer for 6 and has been been with the company since AC4 also commented in an interview the genre of AC6 changed compared to past titles.
Makes you think about the canon of what we consider 'good' video games. If From Software were dunked on for a time and it took the Souls games to provoke a shift in perspective, then I wonder just how many other games and developers got shafted - especially in the Xbox 360/PS3 generation, where cinematic presentation and streamlined gameplay were the in the critical zeitgeist. I feel like a vast revaluation is order if we've let other series/genres/developers and games slip us by - especially for those of us who used to look at mainstream critics as arbiters of quality.
Oh man that era of game reviews is terrible, even worse than what we have now. there are famous cases like poor Godhand getting slammed, but I think there are also so many other cases that people don't even realize, like AC4 and (somewhat) AC5. It would be fascinating to have an entire vid where I go back and look at poor action games that were shafted during that era, I know gungrave was as well.
@@TheElectricUndergroundyes this is an amazing idea for a video, please do this
Hence all the hidden gems videos
25:14 so uh... game balance? Weapon cooldown allows for drastically different weapons. If you could spam the pile driver most combat would be stupidly easy. It seems like your dislikes have nothing to do with their functionality and more that you juat wanted this to be AC5.
Which is dumb considering the drastic changes between every generation. Like an AC1 vet complaining that new games lift the camera with rhe analog stick instead or the trigger.
And even then there are builds that dominate certain scenarios. So I dont get the point? Choose a different weapon? The cooldown allows for diverse playstyle. From hit and run to hang back and unload. I have a hard time believing you're an AC vet
Your getting too stuck in this traditional "vet" view of game design. Weapon cooldowns as a a mechanic are not compelling, it is a boring way to create balance. This is a critique that applies across action game design as a whole. When it comes to weapon/move balance, there are two areas to consider, the natural balance of the move and the statistical balance of a move. The natural balance of a move is how well it fits in with the overall game design, how much it naturally lines up with the core combat of the game. So in the case of AC6, the rifles and shotgun have strong natural balance because they fit with the meta of circle strafing and constantly moving. The melee, on the other hand, fits very poorly with the natural meta of the game because it has massive startup, requires you to charge head on at enemies, and then has massive recovery frames. So how do you balance the melee of this game? What fromsoft did, was just take the basic approach of leaving the melee of the game unnatural to the core gameplay, but then just statistically buffing it by giving it huge damage stats, imposing staggers, and then nerfing the gun meta of the game by imposing cooldowns. This is classic nerfing good options to make way for a naturally weak option. You mention SPD in street fighter, your familiar with this issue in fighting games right? Where they need to constantly nerf good characters rather than buffing weak characters' natural options. Same applies here. Instead, what AC6 should have done was make the melee combat of the game more naturally good, by reducing the startup frames and recovery frames, and then reducing the damage. So instead of doing one massive high commitment melee attack that you have to spend all day fishing for, you instead have a melee system of lower commitment strikes that can be performed while moving. Is this traditional AC design, no. But AC6 has radically shifted the way combat works with the new camera system, and so the other systems should be altered to match with the new meta. Don't get stuck in "vet" views of combat design, that's how you get series that stagnate and die off and the fans sit and wonder why ha.
It has nothing to do with traditional or not traditional. It is simply a design concept. Consider the difference between a shotgun and a handgun in your favorite shooter. Think of how differently the play flow is with a shotgun; boom, boom, move, boom, boom, move. There's a satisfying flow to it. But additionally its about balance. If you could unload your shotgun endlessly in CSGO that would become the meta. But BECAUSE it has a limit/reload it allows for each individual shot to be more powerful than all the other weapons without making them obsolete. In summary gameplay flow and balance.
Which makes me think you might be playing the game wrong. You're not supposed to unload as soon as it finishes reloading. For example its often a good idea to hold off unloading your Zimmermans for when you stance break them because you do extra damage. Conversely depending on the situation you might use them up front because by the time you stance break them they'll have reloaded. You just have to learn the flow. And its usually a good idea to have at least one weapon with a lot of ammo to sustain damage and chip away at their stagger. The gatling gun, a lot of the handguns, and rifles. f you play right (unless you make specific builds) you should almost always be doing something. There's a flow to it that I didnt really fine until maybe chapter 3.
I dont think the sword is bad, in fact the opposite. It is a "contextual" tool. You have to strategize when you use it. When you stance break, when you're already up close and you know it'll stance break, or against enemies that are easily outmanuevered. So no, your not supposed to bum rush your opponent. The startup is supposed to be long. So you cant just spam it. This is a very basic concept. Look at Elden Ring. Unga Bunga sticks move slow but hit hard, daggers are quick but do less damage. It would be dumb if they were the same. And it would be dumb if there was no strategy or gameplay element to using the plasma sword. Some of them are contextual or skill based too. I used the pile driver on the Sea Spider but itd be crazy hard to get it off on Nightfall Raven.
I didnt mention Street Fighter. You might be replying to the wrong comment?
I got a little over half way through this game and kinda just lost interest. The missions were pretty meh, not much to sink your teeth into. Bosses, like you said, I just circle around and spam attack for the win.
Great review Mark. I think AC6 shows just hard it is to be a developer of multiple beloved series and simultaneously reboot an old series that was dormant for a good while. Fromsoft always said from the beginning that this game would incorporate things they've learned from the main Souls years, while also keeping it different enough to be something more than just another Souls-like. A major point that I think you missed is that no other current AAA dev would (temporarily, at least) abandon a massive cash cow like Elden Ring or Dark Souls to reboot a 10 year old niche robot mech action game. The execution of the game may be divisive or underwhelming, but at least it was made at all and I don't blame them at all for attempting to bring in a wider fan-base, especially for a reboot. And yeah, I hope AC7 is more ambitious and incorporates some of this points you made. I especially think the weapon cooldowns are too long and there should be a long-distance sniping meta that reduces / adds variety to the kinda 1-trick pony gameplay of the circle-strafing method.
Oh yeah that is a great point. I overall have a lot of respect for Fromsoft and i do think this game is a really solid attempt, it could have gone so much worse ha. And yes, most studios would not have the balls or ambition to even try to make a mainstream mech game, that's for sure. It was a massive risk and Fromsoft took it in a way that other devs, like modern capcom, just wouldn't. So huge props to them on that front for sure, but I do think they were overcautious on some of the mechanics, and so hopefully we can get something a bit more aggressive in the series as an update :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground Agreed! I hope the series continues.
I agree with your points about the the camera and booster, a major part of Armored Core was always about mastering the difficult control scheme for some amazing results. The lack of the camera being tied to the direction the mech faces as well as the removal of the turning speed stat does not just diminish the challenge and its value, but also builds that focus on a light AC, AND (what I find to be a major part of Armored Core) the simulation of piloting a mech. The series always struck a perfect balance of making it feel like you're actually piloting a hulking giant made of steel, while also using that very same concept design to play into the game design. VI's ACs feel like an Elden Ring/Dark Souls character with how it twists and turns on a dime.
The one part I'd say you fall short on is the critique of reloading and the lack of wall boosts. Many have already said that using ACV as an example is a bad idea due to its status as the black sheep of the series, and there is reasons for that: ACV was a departure from many things people love about the series, from the reload feature being non-existent, to the wall boosts being a requirement to gain height, to the general visuals of rough and worn metal and brown color-palette. (My theory is this being due to the fact that the game released in a time where eastern devs were trying to make games that catered to a western audience) I myself enjoy V, but these were all new elements that are unique solely for V/Verdict Day, and their design being passed up for the original design that is more prevalent and traditional for the series makes sense when you've already sacrifice so much of the original design elsewhere, like in the camera, or in the floaty movement. (Of course, you could question why not change more of it at that point, but remember: they're trying to retain the fans while cater to the casual audience, so they have to do this balancing act)
Ultimately, this is a great review that touches on the shortcomings that have been nagging me badly about this game. I've been really enjoying it in spite of this, but unless ACVII course-corrects, I don't see myself buying it. And I really recommend playing the earlier games for a better frame of reference. I think you'd really enjoy 4/For Answer in particular due to the crazy high-speed pacing of the action in those games.
Oh that's an interesting point about AC5. So I've talked about this concept a bit in the past, but I don't do traditional/community based evaluation in terms of game design. And what I mean by that is, even if the rest of the armored core series has different mechanics than AC5, if I think AC5 has better mechanics, then I think that is still a valid point of comparison. Because you can say that the armored core fanbase mostly reject AC5, but for me if AC5 had a bunch of really cool ideas and improvements to the series design, that doesn't make AC5 wrong, it makes the fanbase wrong ha. So in terms of wall jumps and lack of weapon cooldowns, I think both are fantastic ideas and I think AC5 was moving in the right direction. So for AC6 to then remove the wall jumps and to add in weapon cooldowns, all that means to me is that AC6 is regressing back in terms of design in comparison to AC5. This actually happens all the time in game series. Where a game in a series will have a bunch of fantastic and innovative ideas, but won't sell well, so then the devs get scared and abandon these cool ideas. Just look at tekken tag 2 for example. Tag 2 had this great design in terms of the movement and sidesteps being strong, but it sold poorly. So Namco got it in their heads that strong movement and sidestep are bad for sales, and so now with tekken 8 everyone has cement shoes ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground I Didn't mean to make it sound like I was saying it was invalid, just wanted to provide some perspective on why they might have went with reloading. A lot of my favorite games after all are also some of the most unpopular in a series (Like RE6 haha) so if I didn't agree with you there, I would definitely be a hypocrite.
I enjoy it either way as I personally think the removing of reloads is fun for just unloading everything at once, but I also enjoy the more tactical approach in the originals where pacing yourself was important, as the originals have a system where you can go in debt from spending too much on AC repairs and ammunition, which further encouraged improving your skills so as not to lose money and played into the mech-pilot simulation. Both the original and V's designs are great in their own way, and whichever one you like more will for sure comes down to preference of simulation VS shooter-gameplay. But I like both anyway so it's a win-win for me either way.
@@TheElectricUnderground i completely disagree with this "devs right, fans wrong" statement.
Even if we ignore the income part of game development, and we embrace the "games as art" view point, that mentality still falls apart.
Sure, you can make a game that you think it's perfect, but if everyone else hates it, what's the point? Gaming has always been a community based hobby, even before the explosion of multiplayer games. I guess nothing stops you from making a game simply for yourself, even though that's a bit egotistical in my opinion, but inserting different ideas in a franchise that already has a set of rules, and therefore, expectations from the build up fanbase, not only ignoring these people will alienate them from your sequel, but also kill/damage the franchise severely, since the players that hate the changes, doesn't matter if they are mechanical, lore-based or something in-between, was this 'inovation' actually worth it? I personally don't think so.
There are many examples of this. Not only in gaming, but in other scenes as well, like movies as example.
In this case with AC 5, and how the game is the black sheep of the franchise, i can guarantee you, if this game didn't carry the AC name and lore, and was a complete new IP, like "MetalWolf Chaos XD" and had all pf these new Ideas and innovations, nobody was gonna be mad about this game, since it doesn't break any of the established rules that the current fanbase loves, and tries something new.
Don't get me wrong, innovation is a good thing in gaming, but not if it's at the cost of the fans, and in this commercialised landscape of gaming, if a game is not fun, it will be abandoned, doesn't matter how revolutionary it is compared to it's piers.
Like every single commercial good on this planet, gaming included:
"The customer is always right."
I love your reviews man ! They are not empty words like the majority of many other channels 👌
Thank you very much my dude!! Yes I do try to dig into areas of games that tend not to be discussed ha, or at least not at first.
I loved Dark Souls when it came out, it kept me playing games at a time when I was losing interest. However, I really wish that instead of other games leaning on the innovations (and some things were not innovative) of Dark Souls that they had just taken inspiration and done new things in their own way.
yes i feel exactly the same way about dark souls actually. i think it came up with a lot of really cool ideas and design concepts, but I strongly prefer Nioh over it, because Nioh takes it to that next level with it's combat system, especially the ki pulse mechanic. Actually, it would be really cool if AC 6 had some kind of weapon pulse system, so you wouldn't be hard locked into weapon cooldown.
I feel the same way. Every time I see a Souls-like without a pause button I groan a bit.
I'd be very curious to see what you think about Armored Core 4 and For Answer which makes AC6 looks like it's moving in slow motion. I personally hate AC 5 and VD and feel like they are complete outliers to the rest of the series with AC6 being much more similar to the older entries.
Yeah, im giving Mark a pass on what makes this series great. Him liking AC5 & AC5vd is understandable when you know what hes trying to do with his channel.Being differnt to stand out from the crowd of reviewers on UA-cam "imo" lol
@@ronniepatterson2827 I don't think he's trying to be different to stand out. He's just an oldschool gamer who focuses more on rulesets & play mechanics. Most game reviewers only talk about the art assets of a game. I agree that he's a noob at AC & I was shocked that he only mentioned ACV. I thought he was going to work his way down to Last Raven or one of the last PS2 entries.
Did you play any of the other Armored Core games, before five? I ask because five was a huge departure for the series, and the lack of aerial maneuverability was one of the biggest factors in that. It's just funny hearing you talk about how this isn't a true Armored Core game, because it isn't more like the black sheep of the series.
I apologise in advance for the long comment 😂.
hey Mark i have been a fan of armored core since the first one on the ps1 and i'm a massive mech fan, i actually bought demon's souls ps3 because i trusted in fromsoftawe after playing the AC series for so many years, i fell in love with demon's souls the first time i saw video of the game lol. but now exactly as i predicted, everyone picked AC just because of the souls games, you touched exactly on a point that i discussed with my younger brother who is an AC fan too (my fault lol), i told him how in the past everyone dismissed AC and gave them low scores but now, post "souls era", now its cool, the big majority of people playing AC would have never even glanced at it if it was not a fromsoft game which is ridiculous and it says a lot about how sheep-like people are.
Mark your criticism is fair and i agree on most of the points, but i disagree on others since i'm an old time Ac player and i have a different perspective, i don't agree with your suggestion of infinite boost, please no, i hated AC4 and that game was too fast to be an armored core game, and it was ugly too lol... i forgot another point i disagree with 😂, it's ok. i also think that the stagger system should not be in the game, and i hate that everything needs stagger or parry these days, it's like the "quick time events" era that i hated, i hate QTE. the camera is more free because like the targeting system it was inspired in the Gundam VS games, i believe they wanted to make a similar camera experience to Gundam vs especially for pvp, they needed to update the camera and target system or people would not like it at all, so the best was a more free gundam vs-like experience. look at the gundam vs melee system and AC6 melee and you'll see the similarities.
in the end i believe that all the changes worked well for what the game needed to accomplish, and sincerely what we needed the game to achieve, which is high sales and gamer satisfaction. if the game stuck with the old formula i guarantee you that a lot of people would not like it and that would have been the end of AC for good, this way there might be a resurgence in mech games or at least the series continues. personally i feel that the game plays well, the camera is good since i'm used to gundam VS and Zone of the enders, so since i didnt like AC4 and AC5 to me AC6 is the best AC since AC3, as an AC fan it is the game we needed, some compromises, mistakes, and unbalances were made, but i think they made the right choices overall, except for stagger lol. we cannot expect casual gamers to accept the same things we like, they cant deal with it, they think souls games are hard, lol they should play touhou 6 and pay a visit to sakuya, that makes any souls boss look like a baby in comparison, they cant deal with ardcore games like the games we grew up with, so the devs need to compromise. we need to give them HUGE credit for taking the risk of making a mech game in an era wen nobody wanted a mech game, that was a huge risk.
sorry for the long post, but here is the oppinion of an original armored core player, an old Raven 😂, good review, great points.
critics are political and don't express their own opinions. I don't pay too much attention to professional critics because they are just puppets.
23:17 You can fastfall in AC6, VaatiVidya talks about it in his newest video at 3:33. Maybe it's not like, the *really* fast fastfall you want, but you can still turn off boosters to accelerate faster toward the ground.
Furthermore, although I haven't finished this video yet, it's apparent to me that your main frame of reference for comparing this game to other AC games is ACV and VD, which is fine, but just sort of... odd, because ACV and VD are pretty different from the rest of the series themselves. It'd be sort of like judging how they changed things in Elden Ring from Bloodborne, in a sense; for example, wall jumps are completely absent in every AC game *aside from* ACV and VD, and in addition, every AC game *except* ACV and VD allowed you to fly by just holding a button down. I'm sure you already knew this, but just be aware that some things are just FromSoft going back to how things were before rather than totally new changes.
im also not sure if the circle strafing is intentional. Also, I think it's viable but i think its too soon to write it off as the best approach to boss fights.
I would not consider that a fast fall, that's just the default fall speed of the game. A fast fall is a special state that can tactically increase timing of fall speeds. Like when you let go of Jump in Mario Bros, going straight down is the fastest default fall speed, but that's not a fast fall in the sense that I mean. It's pretty clear that Fromsoft have intentionally removed this concept from the game, as it would naturally happen if you turn off the boosters right? But it doesn't.
uh no, fast fall in 6 is still slow as molasses, you can't even turn off booster mid air then wtf is the point? Standing still to fast fall is stupid.
I am so mad that this review somehow never reached my YT feed (found it after checking your channel from the "Devil May Cry is MORE Than Buzz Marketing" video, which was also excellent btw) because not only it resonates with most of my feelings with AC6 it is also a really good review that puts a lot of context to the shortcomings of AC6 and I think more people need to hear this.
The melee is the best part dude. You try rocking 2 swords? You never have cooldown
Getting the weapon bay upgrade might honestly be my favorite piece of progression in the game. Finding out I can actually bring two melee weapons was so hype
I have, but the problem with the swords is how much time they take to use, it s crazy ha. It s what tanks the pace of the game. Like I say in the vid, the swords are statistically strong (massive damage and all that) but they are naturally weak in terms of the overall game design because of how slow they are and how much recovery they have. I think a faster but less damaging sword system would have fit the game much better
@@TheElectricUndergroundI feel the same way about melee. In previous games it was limited by energy supply, but you could swing like 10 times without running out, and by then your opponent would be long gone anyway. In this game I keep forgetting about the cooldown and when I get in close, I’m hammering on the trigger and nothing is happening.
@@TheElectricUndergroundthe dagger and stun baton are way faster and have a massively short cool down comparatively
Yeah, 2 melee weapons completely solves the cooldown issue. I definitely get calling it out as an issue in game design overall, but I think it's fine for me in AC6
As a longtime AC fan, AC6 isn't just the best in the series, it's the best mech game I ever played. It's also a game I would never recommend to anyone that doesn't enjoy replaying games. If you don't like trying to S rank every mission, playing through the game thrice over to see every mission, creating a dozen different builds just to mess around, and partaking in multiplayer duels, it's not a game for you. I've seen too many players blitz through the game in 15 hours with dual shotguns and songbirds/stun needles and never play the game again, and if that's what you're gonna do then you shouldn't even waste your time. This isn't a "bragging rights" game like most contemporary FromSoft titles, and I think that's what non-AC fans wanted this game to be, and I'm so glad it's not that. It's an arcade game; bite-sized levels you play over and over in search of S ranks and secrets.
As a side note, I'm glad to see FromSoft step away from the missteps they took with 5th gen AC. Tri-defenses sucked and basically meant you either took no damage or insane damage, jumping/boosting off buildings to gain height was obnoxious and controlled iffy, and scan mode was horrible. In base ACV it helped you navigate through the huge levels because it was the only way to see waypoint markers, it was the only way to see enemies your drones marked, it was the only way to see which resistances your enemies had, and it sped up energy recovery - which otherwise was the slowest it ever recovered in the series. You also couldn't fire your weapons, so the game became a dance of switching scan mode on and off, hearing the obnoxious "scan mode" voice every time, and seeing the screen change colors constantly. Then in Verdict Day the maps were made smaller so you didn't need scan mode to help you navigate, and the energy recovery speed in scan mode was boosted so high that you could recover energy *while boosting* in scan mode, giving you unlimited boost. In AC6, scan is just a cooldown that doesn't interfere with gameplay - perfect.
Also, it's a nitpick, but I hated the scrap iron designs of 5th gen. Everything was rusted, blocky, riveted, and clunky looking, like you strapped dumpster lids onto your arms and shins. I prefer the smooth, rounded designs you see in the rest of the series.
Thanks for the insight. How did you find the stagger mechanic? I don't consider myself a true AC fan but I didn't feel that the hyperfocus on stagger to be a positive or "AC".
A game with not even one sniper is the best mech game you played? Seriously.. No. Customization is severely lacking and builds are locked out of viability due to the stagger bar, seriously hate these generalized half-ass statements.
Man, that footage of AC5 makes me wanna play it so bad... it looks so sick
Hey, love your videos! I got into danmakus thanks to you! I usually don't commentate, but i wanted to say that i don't agree on melee weapons. Builds with melee weapons in this game are actually really strong, and way more interesting than in previous AC games. I understand your criticism about them feeling slow and very risky to use, specially if they wiff cuz they have a lot of starting and ending lag. The reason i don't agree with this sentiment is the fact that you actually can cancel the melee attack right before it comes out with a quick boost, and it doesn't put your melee weapon on cooldown, which means that using melee weapons in a effective way actually has more depth and requieres more skill than it seems at first, cuz you could, for example, react to your opponent quick boosting to avoid your attack (which they usually do when you try to melee them) by "faking" your melee attack and cancelling it with a quick boost and catch them off guard with another melee attack. You can melt some bosses in this game with the Pilebunker for example, and i think that if you had a Melee weapon by default as you sugested, some builds would be broken beyond reasonable (not that there aren't some alredy lol). To be fair tho, i don't think the game ever communicates that you can do this in any way, so i'd say that the game is at fault in this regard. However, i think it would be cool if you give them another try and see if this is enough to change your mind on melee weapons.
hey my dude I'm glad you are enjoying the vids and thank you for commenting! So I probably could have mentioned the melee cancels more specifically in the video, because yes you are right that you can pull out of that homing phase with a boost, so that's good that Fromsoft arent' making you completely commit. However, perhaps if I explained what I think would be a better melee system, than maybe my critique might connect with you more. So like I said in the section about balance, I do think the melee weapons are "strong" in a statistical sense. In that, Fromsoft decided to compensate with their really slow and risky frame data by giving the melee attacks a massive pay off in terms of damage and stagger and all that. So, yes, I don't deny that the melee in the game is strong in that sense. However, when you compare them to something like the shotgun, which has much better frame data and is much safer, then the melee feels extremely clunky in comparison, even with being able to cancel because of how long that startup and recovery are. What I think would have been a better melee system, is that, instead of making the melee this big lottery attack, instead fromsoft should have removed the built in startup phase, reduced the recovery on the swing, and then dropped the amount of damage the melee does. I just think it would have fit with the flow of the gameplay so much better. So basically, faster more versatile melee attacks, that are also built in and don't need a weapon slot, that do less damage. Because right now for melee to work you basically need to plan your entire build and gameplan around it, which I think is less interesting than having it be a common option that all mech builds use.
@@TheElectricUndergroundThanks for your reply! This definitely helped me understand your position much better, and i agree that double shotguns plus weapon bay upgrade are really strong and add a really cool flow to the combat that i too find more interesting. I guess the reason why i didn't find the fact that melee builds aren't the strongest or that they have a different flow to them as not necessarily a negative, is because AC is a series that encourages trying out different builds until you find your favorite, and if you don't like one then you can just change it without any negative repercution (well, at least in some AC games) and a natural consequence of this kind of design is that some builds are going to be/feel worse than others. I guess that since this is normal in this kind of games, i never stopped to consider wether or not this is something negative, but i'll definitely take it into consideration from now on. I think your criticism is super fair and i can see myself agreeing with you if i look at it from your perspective or give it a second thought. That's why i like your reviews to begin with, cuz they always offer an interesting point i haven't even considered before. Keep the good work!
You might have missed some of what I am going to list but there's a bit of misinformation in your review here:
1) Only an handful of From Soft games have checkpoints in their entire history of games. So they aren't the one's bringing that back in fashion.
2) Armored Core is why From Soft is still even open. The AC games and all their expansions sold well enough, except 5, to keep From in business. They would have closed down if not for the AC series.
3) I guess you only played 5 VD and 6, because 5 & VD are considered to be the worst in the whole series, or maybe Nexus? It also doesn't control like most of the games in the series. AC 5 is actually very different from the rest of the series. AC 6 combines the controls from AC 3 & 4 with a bit of Souls in there.
4) There is fast fall. You have to not push any buttons and your AC will fall faster.
5) The older Gen 3 and back game, control horribly. Most of them do not even have dual analogue control. You would move with the d-pad and control your booster with the shoulder & trigger buttons. But you could easily boast upwards and float in every game, except for 5. If you play the old games, use an emulator and find some remap instructions online.
6) Almost every AC game has cooldowns. They used to have the heat mechanic, that would over heat weapons and sometimes your whole AC. I am very happy to see the heat mechanic gone. Having to manage heat on top of everything else was horrible. When you overheated, you took basically robot poison damage.
7) AC is a RPG. You are role playing as a mech piloting a robot. That was the reason for the crappy camera and controls for years. It was suppose to feel sluggish and janky like you are controlling a human that then is controlling the mech. The series also used to be thought of as a debit simulator.
This is more personal but I disagree about the melee attacks. Did you forget about the assault boast and boast kick? I use melee all the time to tear through enemies and bosses, but I always use an assault boast, then kick, then melee. This will also break all shields too, which your shotgun/assault rife build will have a hard time dealing with armored/shielded enemies later in the game. I do agree that the melee weapon should be another slot.
I feel like your review was good, but you forced yourself to play the game in an unfun way just because you didn't tinker around with everything else as much.
i guess I'll answer you back in list form ha.
1. Dark souls inspired check points are extremely common and easily traced back to when dark souls became popular. Even shovel knight has them. The fact that From's other games don't have checkpoints is irrelevant, it's specifically dark souls that inspired other games.
2. There is no debate that the souls series has massively outsold the AC series and is the reason why Fromsoft is as popular as they are. The scale of sales between Dark Souls and AC is absurdly lopsided, so you are reframing this in a really silly way because at one point AC was their more popular series ... before the souls series existed. Your trying this really specific claim that because AC was their initially successful series, it somehow is more influential than dark souls because the butterfly effect of them going out of business without AC ha. You could make this claim in all kinds of silly ways, like the Jackson 5 is more influential than Michael Jackson's solo career because without the Jackson 5 he wouldn't have a solo career, and on and on.
3. I don't do series/tradition based game analysis. If all the other AC games have weapon cooldown, then AC5 removed weapon cooldown, and then AC6 put weapon cooldown back in, just because it was a mechanic from old games doesn't make it the right design choice. In this case AC6 is just being regressive in terms of game design. Tradition does not make game design decision valid. When I play older AC games I will critique the weapon cooldown in them just like I would in AC6. if AC5 is the only game in the series without weapon cooldown, then it is the game in the series that gets the idea right.
4. No there isn't. You don't fast fall you just fall at the fastest fall speed the game allows, which isn't fast. This is like saying in mario if you let go of the jump button you "fast fall" ha.
5. I don't discuss AC3, I compare AC5 and AC6 so what AC3 does is irrelevant. Like I said above, I don't do traditional based reviews, so for all I know AC3 controls horribly, but AC3 is less relevant to the discussion than AC5, since 5 proceeds 6 directly.
6. I explained this point in point 3.
7. By this definition every game is an RPG, Ninja Gaiden is an RPG because you role play as a ninja and you level up your weapons. AC6 is pushing more in the direction of an rpg in terms of combat design, but I don't think this is because Fromsoft are consciously trying to market the game as an RPG, but rather is just a hold over of their combat design decisions in souls games. And like I said if all the older AC games are sluggish and control poorly as you are saying, this doesn't make them automatically better designed than 5. It sounds like 5 made a lot of really smart design decisions that are not being appreciated at all ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground
Your points were fair.
I still don't think bonfires are the same like most games that use checkpoints. Checkpoints can happen at anytime, even during bosses.
I didn't mean to imply that AC is more influential than Souls, just that From would have closed down years ago if it was for the AC series selling well enough. AC, King's Field, Shadow Tower never sold better than AC till Dark Souls. So I think AC is just a bit special and it's why From brought it back.
I'll be checking it out just because I love FromSoft. OG Demons Souls was my first FS game, and I've been in love ever since. What I will say as a mid 30s gamer is it led me to checking out the older King's Field games on the PS1 which I love, and if I enjoy this new AC I'll absolutely be checking out the older titles.
That's great to hear! One really big hope I have is that with the success of AC6, a bunch of people (myself included actually) will start to dig through the older AC games and appreciate them more :-)
good review, but a weird one. have you only played ac5? because that's not only the worst game in the franchise but a lot of the things ac6 brought back were from basically every other game besides 5.
there's also just a lot you got wrong here. like there is for a fact fast fall in ac6, i dont know why you said there wasnt? you just let go of the stick and you drop significantly faster.
I talked about 5 because it directly proceeds 6 and is the game that informs the audience/player expectation. There is some kind of strange mind cloud going on in the AC fanbase where I guess you all want AC5 erased from conversation or something ha. Like with street fighter 5, sure that's a low point for the series in many players minds (mine included) but it is the game that most heavily informs Street Fighter 6, even if street fighter 6 is reacting against some of its design. I honestly think the AC fanbase has been too hivemind on AC5 because even if there are areas of the game the fanbase doesn't like that doesn't mean all of it's ideas are bad (I think the walljumps, for example, are really cool). And also I agree that AC5 has a lot of the design and mechanics from the older games (clearly) so that just makes it a very natural comparison point to AC6, which is clearly the biggest shift in the series if you take a step away from this negative cloud around AC5. Think about this with any other series. When virtua fighter 6 comes out, what is going to be the point of comparison? Virtua Fighter 3? It's going to be VF 5 of course. I think this is some AC forum culture or something.
Also I did not get the fast fall point wrong. Fast fall is a distinctive state of falling at a faster rate than the default fall rate. In AC6 this has been removed. Letting go of the controls is just the default max fall speed. That's like saying letting go of jump in mario bros is a fast fall. In AC 5 when you jump the game has a default booster on fall speed (which kicks on automatically), and then if you turn off your boosters you plummet immediately. This meta has been removed from AC6, the game literally will not allow you to manually turn off your boosters while falling. Instead you have to just wait and literally do nothing, because the apm of the game just isn't low enough. Calling this a fast fall is not remotely in the ballpark of a fast fall. If the game makes you wait to enter the state, there's nothing fast about that ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground
it has more to do with 5 being a pretty significant departure gameplay-wise and 6 returning to more ac gameplay norms while doing some of it's own thing.
it doesn't make sense to complain about verticality in 6 not having wall jumping and instead being about using boosters when 13 out of 15 of the previous games worked the same way. that makes 5 the outlier in that situation instead of a key comparison point. it makes more sense to compare it to 4th gen because it's using more 4th gen style movement (boosting for free, very aerial, critical usage of quick boosting), and then talking about whether or not it does it better or worse. otherwise it's apples and oranges even though, sure, *technically* 5 was the more recent game. it's one thing to say you prefer the wall jump verticality of 5 (it was fun in it's own way), but to not even mention or compare the booster movement to *any other entry in the series* is just... weird, and it makes it seem like 5 is your only point of reference for armored core.
it's like talking about kh2 and dinging it because it didn't use the card system from chain of memories. like sure that's technically the previous and more recent entry but its obvious that design-wise they iterated from kh1. or if you want you could say the same with kh3 and bbs.
as for the fast fall i really think you should actually go lab it out because what you're describing as a fast fall is in the game exactly as you described it. not sure what else you want there. i used it a ton in my playthroughs and managed to dodge attacks i otherwise would not have been able to, it's a pretty important mechanic if you're in the air a lot.
now if you wanted down boosts i'd agree with you, that'd be cool. or maybe you mean a fast fall where you can still control the ac? that would also be nice. but as-is the game does, matter-of-fact have fast fall.
have you tried the melee cancel? it's some extra movement tech i didn't notice in your review. i use it to feint or to get up close to a target
Yes i have! So the thing about the melee cancel is that it is canceling something that I don't think should even be there in the first place, this startup dash thing. I think if the game forced you to commit on startup dash it would be outright insane ha, so yeah being able to boost out of that startup is nice, but it's not a true cancel in my book really. What would make the melee of the game interesting is if you could cancel out of the Recovery frames of the melee attack, now that would be a much more interesting cancel. As it is right now, i think the melee cancel is underwhelming because you are canceling out of an animation that shouldn't be there in the first place ha. And it's not a cancel that lets you skip the animation, it's just a cancel that allows you to restart it. Having some extra boost movement is sort of cool, but in the end I don't think it matters that much because circle strafing is much more powerful than head on rushdown. What the game needs is for the melee attack to come out faster, you already have solid movement speed with ground boosters.
Mecha was always cool. Different approach, but Cyberbots rocks ^^
Cyberbots is the goat
Yes and what s crazy is that mech has actually been surprisingly niche for a really long time, like there are barely any videos on UA-cam of armored core 5, which is crazy ha
Just curious, but what is the appeal to Cyberbots?
I haven't put much time into the game but at first glance it seems fairly mediocre. It shows you these cool backgrounds getting destroyed but you aren't the ones doing the damage. The mechs seem to have a long, medium and/or short range attack button that seems to prescribe which attacks you'll use at various ranges.
@@claytonweaver7335 It's a very personal choice. I'm a sucker for 2D games and fighting games (I just play for fun with friends, not competitive). Generally speaking I prefer the 90s SNK games when it comes to 1 on 1 fighters, four buttons are enough. This game for me ticks all the boxes of good, short arcade fun with easy controls. The mechas feel heavy and are very well presented, as are the levels. All other Capcom fighters feel like SF with a different coating to me (apart from the VS series). This is a big departure. It's like a nice bar pick up that left a lasting impression ^^
@@SNKBossSyndrom I do think my favorite part of the game is how the mechs 'feel' in terms of weight and dashing. I just played the Capcom Fighters Collection recently and got the impression there was little Capcom could do to improve Darkstalkers but quite a bit they could do with Cyberbots to give it a little more replay value. imo
I agree with a lot of your points Mark. AC6 reminds me a lot of the PS1 trilogy, where the feel was a little more arcadey or a standard third-person shooter. The parts list and tinkering was dialed back to those levels, and I want to believe they were trying to rebuild the franchise with 6 by going back to basics as not to alienate newcomers who have been eagerly jumping on. One of the glaring issues I had was the boost button (B) that ONLY toggles it on, but easily could have been used to cut boost in midair to change landing velocity or trajectory. Another would be having the AC not always face forward, so that trying to fire out of angle would cause a pause and shoot animation like they use in the Gundam VS series. If you've never seen pro play of that game, check it out. It seems like an arena shooter/brawler but for an arcade game it requires an understanding of the physics and positioning in a way that feels "warlike".
Oh yes gundam vs is absolutely on my list of games to check out! It along with Virtual On :-) I'm glad you can understand my critics because I don't think Fromsoft did a bad job or anything, it's just overly restricted which works better in a more slow paced action rpg like dark souls, but can really hurt the pace of a mech game where having a lot of tactical movement and attack options is the fundamental appeal. :-)
Really looks like the gameplay is like the old Gundam Vs. games. I've yet to play the game, but it looks very intuitive.
It's got a very similar feel; it does lock your AC to always face the enemy so there's a little less positioning, and landings aren't quite so hard that they're solid punishes, but overall it has the same smoothness as well as chunkiness that you would want.
Yeah AC6 is very intuitive, it is a great starting point in a lot of ways for people less familiar with mech games. Why I find it a bit underwhelming though is that I think in Fromsoft''s effort to make the series and game more accessible to the average player, I think they trimmed a bit too much out of the the technical side of things, especially with the weapon cooldowns and lack of fast fall. It is a solid game though, and I do recommend AC6, but with the added note of encouraging people to also check out the older AC games as well.
This is my review of your review of Armored Core VI: Fires of Rubicon.
Note: The only FromSoftware game I've played prior to this was Armored Core: For Answer. I will never play any of their games from other genres. I wanted to play Chromehounds but I discovered the game late and they were already shutting down the servers.
First of all, mech games are niche. Always have been, always will be. Armored Core VI is niche. It will never have the wide acceptance of the fantasy sword and sorcery type games and other genres. That is just the way of things, at least in Western society.
The stagger mechanic you hate so much actually makes sense in Armored Core. We are piloting a huge mech with huge weighty parts that very likely isn't balanced, and we are zipping around using rocket boosters strapped to all sides. And then of course, there's enemy action, whether that's smashing into us with a melee attack or blasting us with lasers or machine guns or missiles. Us regular humans fall all the time even from just a light push that we don't expect. Imagine the inertia an Armored Core contends with and we can easily imagine an attitude control system getting overwhelmed, no matter how sophisticated it is.
Energy weapons overheat. That also makes sense, as does the fact that Gatling guns overheat. That's one of the primary reasons we have Gatling guns in the first place - to combat overheating barrels. But they don't prevent overheating, they only delay it. Weapons need time to cool down.
And your circle-strafe complaint - lots of games have circle-strafing. FPS games have circle-strafing. Elite: Dangerous has circle-strafing. EVE Online has circle-strafing. Titanfall 2 has circle-strafing. MechWarrior 2/3/4/5/Online had/has circle-strafing. The very first MechWarrior may have even had it, but I never got a chance to play it.
Others have pointed out that you can fast-fall in Armored Core VI by turning off thrust.
Overall, you were too lenient on the scoring. With all of the complaints you had, you should have rated it lower - a 5 or maybe 6 at best. An 8 rating isn't underwhelming but solid - an 8 is a great game with a couple of imperfections.
And I certainly hope FromSoftware doesn't listen to any of your advice at all, regarding the next installment in the Armored Core series (assuming there is one). Taking it back to Armored Core V and Verdict Day would be a huge mistake. They want more sales, not less...
This is my review of your review of my review:
The first 3 paragraphs are not a view of game design that matters. It doesn't matter if a mechanic "makes sense" or not in terms of the gameplay presentation or setting, especially in a sci fi game. You could mount this defense for any mechanic in any game. I could make a game where you are attacked by zombies in a swamp and none of your weapons work because they are all wet ... it makes sense, but is it compelling design? If you actually view game design from this perspective then there are a million critiques that could be made about the game not making sense right? In the end it doesn't matter at all, none of it makes sense and the theme is there to support the gameplay, not the gameplay is there to support the theme. You've got your priorities backwards on this whole notion.
On the circle strafing point, you forgot that it connects to my critique of the camera system. Yes in any shooter circle strafing is going to be a strong technique, I mention that. The key is that in an FPS or in older AC games, the restricted camera makes circle strafing more challenging to do, because you have to manage both looking and aiming at the same time. In an FPS, it's much trickier to circle strafe all the time because you can only see in front of you right, instead of all around you. So it's naturally more risky. In AC6 however, the game gives you a full unrestricted view of the play field and then pairs that view with an automatic lock on mechanic, just like Elden Ring horse combat. So you don't need to aim, the game aims for you. You don't need to look and control the camera precisely, it's zoomed out for you. All you need to do is simply move in a circle, you don't even need to manage your boosting anymore. It's a massive simplification of the core combat.
Finally, on the point about scoring, the areas I am talking about are specific and pretty technical. They are not core fundamental issues that make the game poorly designed, I do think the game is overall well made. But these are the areas where the design is too cautious, so it results in an overall very solid well made game, but one that is missing out on being truly great.
It is sort of funny that in today's review space, reviewers tend to declare a game either a 5 out of 10 or a masterpiece ha, with little room in the middle for nuance.
ur comment is why we have terrible
slop passing as games
I do not have any experience with the AC series, nor I have played AC6. However, I have an observation regarding the weapon cooldown mechanics and your mention of Doom 2016. My comment is that, while Doom 2016 and its sequel Eternal do not have reloading, they still have weapon cooldowns in the form of animations. Indeed, most of the high level meta consists in swapping weapons right after shooting to cancel their recoil animation. Kind like animation cancelling for Devil May Cry. I do not know if you consider animations like a "cooldown" that you can psychologically accept, but at the level of gameplay, it is clear the length of the animations of the various firearms are balanced to make the heavier hitters slower to fire.
You do not mention explicitly Eternal, so I suppose you did not play it. In that game new special attacks have been introduced and they do have proper cooldown. However, they generate resources (health, armor, ammo) on enemy hit, so they are contextualized in a gameplay flow where the player has the tools to generate by himself the resources he needs, and these are much more volatile than in Doom 2016. The gameplay loop is much, much different between these two games.
Regarding the actual review: as always, I can expect from you constructive criticism motivated with punctual references and design analysis. This is why I follow your channel. I was kind of hoping that by recovering this old IP, From would have produced a game more focused on mission and encounter design rather than bosses.
The 4 weapon slot upgrade lets you switch weapons and theres no delay for switching so it lets you bypass reloading and overheating but its a choice between extra weapons or shoulder weapons.
I get your criticisms of the cooldowns/reloading, but AC isn’t a straight action game series. It’s always been mecha sim + action. Managing your mech’s various weapons, meters, cooldowns, ammo, etc while simultaneously engaging the enemy is what the series’ combat has always been designed around. Not just simply shooting targets. If cooldowns and reloads are halting your pace, you’re just not managing your mech well. Playing optimally requires a lot of quick thinking multitasking.
27:31 Also Armoured Core has always had strong RPG elements 🧐, since AC1 on PS1. I’d go as far as to describe the series’ genre as “mecha sim action RPG” even…
Either way, interesting review none the less. I do agree with some of your other points. Just think you’re missing the point a bit and wanting AC to be another game series, with some of your criticism.
well I think I can actually help put my critiques into a clearer picture for you, because I think you are picking up on most of what I am saying. I agree that AC is not purely an action game series, but in AC6 they are pushing it more in that direction by simplifying what you might call the "sim" elements of the controls of the older games. Like the camera system being unrestricted bird's eye view, and the movement no longer really using boosting and traction anymore. So what Fromsoft have done with AC6 is that they have pushed the design of the controls of the game more into an action game style, but then did not capitalize on these new streamlined controls with more technical options and design. So AC6 sits in this weird compromise of not being more and sim like the older games, but also not being fast paced and technical in an action game sense either. That's why I find it underwhelming, because they should have pushed the action elements further based on the changes to the controls and camera. Right now I feel like the game is playing itself for me and not giving me many options to develop a personal playstyle (and I don't mean build wise, I mean movement wise). And then on the point of an rpg, I would not classify any of the AC games as having RPG elements. Now I know that RPG is a term that is heavily used everywhere and now basically anything that involves any kind of stats or management is automatically an RPG ha (like is Gran Torismo an RPG?), but what I am referring to with RPG elements are the combat design of including cooldowns. On paper, there is no actual reason to put them into the game (older AC don't have cooldowns), but because stamina and meter management has become so ingrained into combat design these days, because of action RPGs like Dark Souls, devs have started to use cooldown as a tool of weapon balance rather than using what I think is the better approach, which is the natural stats of the weapons. So rather than having the gatling shoot and have this lame cooldown period, just naturally balance the fire rate and damage of the gatling so line up with the other weapons without cooldown, that way players aren't having to manage meters or stats as they play.
@@TheElectricUnderground aight ya I get your first point. For me tho I’d prefer them to have gone in the opposite direction and make it less fast paced action (and I’m saying this as a MASSIVE arcade action game fanatic and as some who’s fave AC games are 4 and 4A) my big issue related with that is the beam sword. I haven’t been using it, it’s not my play style, I like shooting big guns lol but there were 2 tough AC battle encouters I was stuck on where I decided to toss on the heavy beam sword to try it out for fun, and it just melted them immediately first try. I defs agree with your point in the vid that they seem to really want you to use it, I mean it’s gotta be why they made it so OP. And the issue I have is not even just that it’s OP, it’s that it takes very little skill to have it be OP. Like I said I haven’t been using it, so naturally I was using it like shit that time, and still, 2 lucky hits and the rival AC was evaporated. Really hope they fix that in a balance patch. The melee should do low to moderate regular damage. Would make sense for it to do high stagger, to create an interesting risk with swooping in up close, but as it is now it’s essentially just a win button. But I mean I’m still having a blast with the game. I personally fkn LOVE meter management in game design. Slap a meter on something and suddenly you gotta think about when and at what cost to use it. But ya, the same old unimaginative “weapon overheating” is definitely less elegantly woven into the global game design than in past games like the laser rifle draining your mechs energy like in AC1, which I’d argue is also a variation on a cooldown mechanic at its core. Personally I’m really enjoying having to be very mindful of which of my 4 weapons I’m using and when, and having to keep a steady eye on the meters indicating when their cooldown is done so I can begin charging the pulse rifle shot while I launch a grenade so the charge is done and ready to go while the launcher is reloading, for example. It’s also been really fun having to choose the right weapons to synergize with my weapon load out to make sure I’m not just sitting there waiting for all 4 weapons to reload. I was stuck on the chapter 1 boss for 2 hours getting killed due to having to sit around defenceless waiting, until I really learnt to start playing like that. I feel that’s when the game really clicked for me. But I get why people aren’t digging it. You’re not the only one on here I’ve watched reviews from saying similar things. I also tend to love restrictive mechanics like the brutally unforgiving weapon degradation in From Soft’s first Shadow Tower game, and seems weapon degradation is universally hated these days so who knows maybe I’m weird one 🤷♀️😅😅
About the RPG stuff, I I understand the point you were trying to make now.. you meant as in turn based RPG, having to wait for the game to allow you to attack. But I’d also say stat management and character building, build optimizing, having tons of choices for how to customize your player character and gameplay experience has been a defining characteristics of the RPG genre and have long roots in the genre going back to the D&D days even before video games. And AC has always blended those particular RPG elements with action gameplay from the start. Hence I described it as action RPG. Now ya Gran Turismo (lmao) and every game under the sun it seems lately unnecessarily tossing in RPG mechanics def doesn’t make them RPGs. But action RPG has been a legitimate subgenre of RPG for decades, with well defined characteristics, and I’d argue the AC series has fit those characteristics from the get-go with AC1 in ‘97. AC1 was an outgrowth/fleshing out of ideas From Soft had explored with their previous 3 action RPG King’s Field games, I feel. And I’m pretty sure I’ve read devs of that first game even expressing that in an interview I read, but I couldn’t find the source, could be I’m imagining it. But to me it’s pretty clear when you look at the evolution of their gameplay ideas from King’s Field to Armoured Core.
Anyways back to AC6. My big hope is that they at the very least pump out some serious balance patches soon. Kuz rn I’m just having to avoid using a whole swath of weapons and build varieties to avoid the lame no skill OP shit. That’s my personal biggest complaint so far with the game. Super lame. We’ll see in the coming weeks 🙏🙏
@@micshazam842 ya I agree, for me the sim aspects, although very light, have always been just managing your mechs various parameters. But I totally agree I’d want them to be more on the sim end too.
What’s your opinion on arena fighters like Gundam Versus, Gundam Extreme Versus Maxiboost On and the new DBZ Sparking Zero…?
simplified camera and movement-- *simplify and expand* . The lower barrier to entry means the game itself can and does expand what it throws at the player. Boost off means not accidentally flying into a dangerous line of fire without tediously tilting the control stick to stealth
combat--the game demands playing fearlessly *and* intelligently. If weapons are always offline at the worst moments, also think about *building the right mech for the right job* , which has always been AC's ethos
environments and pacing--enemy placements are packed for how fast the game is and the level used to showcase an empty game is the one designed around limited tracking
the review makes it easy to wonder whether the author thinks the game is too simplified or too complex. The other phrase for this is "lower floor, higher ceiling"; see: Street Fighter 6's massive success
btw, it might be a good idea to stop liking all the positive or easy comments and let talk evolve naturally; KingK, Geek Critique, and Joseph Anderson have a lot of critical reviews for beloved games and they let comments rock. *Trying* to control the mood of discussion doesn't show a lot of confidence
You don't need to build the right mechs as much though ha. The mech building in ac6 is much more simplified, in terms of what the game demands you do to. In 5 i constantly had to research builds for the various missions, whereas in 6 i could run the same build pretty much without any issue ha. Ironically you are missing that by introducing the simplified controls, the game gives you this really simple meta of just constantly circle strafing, so builds and stuff like that become less meaningful. Also I heart and comment on every comment that I read and respond to ha, plenty of which are critical so I'm not exactly sure where that is coming from other than you are reaching my friend, big time.
@@TheElectricUnderground
1. *simplify and expand* means the game has a lower barrier to entry while letting the designers go crazier with enemies to account for smoother controls; Balteus is closer to an endboss from other games and it's chapter 1
2. using dual shotgun while claiming buildcraft doesn't matter as much is worryingly ironic
3. I said "all the positive and *easy* comments"; a comment can be both critical and easy. If you really believe your points are sound, *stop floating stuff to the top and let them cook on their own*
Hi Mark, idk if its the right place to ask about it but ive been using ur shmuparch 7 for the last few months and it worked perfectly until a few weeks ago and now no matter which rom i launch (including ones that were working before) the grey screen saying romset is unknown comes up. Ive tried numerous things ive found online but nothing seems to work, what could possibly be a fix for that?
Oh hey my dude! Good news, I m gonna release arch 8 here soon! Try updating the core inside the core menu of arch, hopefully that will help! I also linked a romset name for arch 7 in the vid description of that vid :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground ye Ive seen the description and tbh I have no idea what to do with it since when I [try to legaly rip off roms from pcbs in my closet] it doesn’t have any info on its romset, and even if it had is it relevant if the same roms have been working perfectly before?
Armored Core 5 and Veredict Day are actually the outliers in the series for most of the things you mention as critique of things 6 does, wall jump mechanic was also very divisive since it was a radical change from the way previous games played like (specially 4 and 4A since blazing fast movement was their thing)
The main draw of AC5 was the tank-like controls and multi-player. It was the same reason why Chrome Hounds had a nice following on the 360.
@@MrRawnch Of course, my issue with this review is that Mark is using V/VD as the standard to judge 6 while implying that the series got "casualized" when in reality it is MUCH closer to the old games than V/VD could ever hope to be. Hell he doesnt even mention one of the arguably most "streamlined" changes which is the lock-on mechanics. I have absolute respect for Mark when he talks about Shmups and agree with almost all his takes on the matter but when it comes to other genres/games he does feel very contrarian for the sake of it and in this case in particular, very ignorant of the series in general.
@@MaverickHunter17 I played AC V on my friends Xbox 7 years ago and let me tell you, him speaking fondly of AC V and Verdict Day when they were so much mediocre and radically different from AC Last Raven and 4A and using 5 as the basis of him giving criticism for 6 is a bad move when people only remember it for its mediocrity and the god awful coop system.
@@davidlanceescandor1310 Indeed, it'll be interesting to see his reactions if he does start playing older ACs
@@MaverickHunter17 His review, while solid, becomes somewhat pointless to me if he decides that AC 5 of all games were a good example when AC 5 was a major departure even by old series standards. AC 6 is closer to the old gen games than the "new" gen.
I like how mechas in shmups are well designed.
Yes I love mech based shmups, I hope we start to see more of them :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground More mech based shmups, the better I say, especially if they're designed by Shoji Kawamori.
It would be great to see your thoughts on zone of the enders 2
Is otomedius excellent a good shmup?
I'm an AC4A fan and never really like 5 because of the more grounded gameplay but this video has actually made interested in giving it a try. Looks way more fun than whatever 6 is trying to be. Great video and you went into detail to explain why this new AC just fall short when compared to past AC game (mainly 5 lol)
If you ever actually played 6, instead of listening to nostalgic reviewers, you'd realize its biggest inspiration is in fact ACFA, and it's actually really fun.
@@GeorgePerakis Holy cow that’s a lot to unload. Ok first off, I do own the game and second point is I’m not saying it’s a bad game, just too different from what I liked about the last games. Third, jumping to conclusions usually make people look like fools
Oh what an awesome comment! yes I think AC5 is absolutely worth a revisit because by the tone of the comments of this video, i think armored core fans have dismissed it much too quickly. This happens in fanbases pretty frequently, like I remember a lot of fans saying how crap NG3 Razor's Edge is, but that game is actually really awesome, but the NG fanbase just wants to sit and talk about how NG Black is the best because ... well that's never explained that clearly ha. (Though NG black is of course a really cool game).
I'm a longtime vet of the series (been playing since 97, never missed a game).
Just to piggy back. Steering the mech was in the old games as well. The boost button was always a hold function though, rather than a toggle switch. You had way more precise control as well than 5.
Also,I HAVE BEEN THINKING THE SAME THING ABOUT CIRCLE STRAFING BEING SUPERIOR. I've been labbing it out to see, but so far, I don't see any reason not to circle strafe. It makes it so mindless from the perspective of someone who has been heavily focused on the maneuvers in all the games to date.
On the subject of boosting. The flying is very floaty, but flying has ALWAYS been part of the series, to one extent or other, with the exception of 5. The older gens had limited flying, and AC4 you could fly forever, but once you used quick boost you would run out of EN fast. In For Answer you could fly a lot more than 4, so the most flying was in For Answer. The floaty style is new. You could always "fast fall" in ALL older games, simply by letting go of the boost button.
I don't think the weapon cool down was a bad idea. First, its there because they let you fire four weapons as once. It's to keep it from being too broken. The cooldown actually makes EN weapons more fun because in older games (even going back to the first game) EN weapons would drain your energy when you fired, limiting your mobility. The tradeoff was the EN muzzle velocity was FAST, and they were so accurate. But now, they are less accurate and slower, but now you can fire. Also, the concept is to 'combo' so, you have to manage your shooting according to a clip. They want you to do combos in this game. Lastly, AC4 had weapon reloads, so this is not new. I do agree though, 100% agree how it goes with the stagger system. I find myself sometimes staggering the enemy, only to be reloading while they are staggered. I 100% prefer the old way. Personally, I'd just have the reload times be applied to EN weapons, and have everything else the same. Same for blades and such.
I have the same experience that this RPG shit being injected into shooter sucks!
Agree about melee weapons. Blades in the older games used to be good and usable to 'some' extent (not in 4). Also, melee attacks ARE built into the game in the kick and the bunch.
100% agree that this game was designed around the 1p boss fights, not around the technical stuff Armored Core has always sported, which makes the game so good. It's lazy design.
Yes the circle strafing meta is something I wonder if Fromsoft are aware of or not. I assume they must be aware of it to some degree, but this game is definitely custom built to make circle strafing the go to strategy ha. A lot of it has to do with the unlocked 3rd person camera + the lock on mechanic. As soon as you combine those two design choices, the player doesn't really need to worry about manually aiming or positioning to inflict damage, so you are then completely free to focus on moving in a circle around the opponent to evade their attacks while still using yours. It comes up in a lot of modern games sadly. FPS also encourage circle strafing in a lot of ways, but in an fps you literally can't see around you so it's a bit more limited there because of the camera angle. Funny enough another genre that really struggles with circle strafing are twin stick shooters. So if you are having trouble in a twin stick, usually you can just circle strafe for the win ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground The thing is, circle strafing has always been a dominant part of movement in the meta for Armored Core games. But here was the catch. Given that turning speeds are slower or faster relative to weight class and leg type, and the fact that the camera is coupled with that turning speed, a HUGE part of the game is aiming and managing your turning, plus other movements in 3D. This games destroys all that in the worst way, making it like Gundam vs. or ZOE, or Virtual On. For those games, that style works. For here, it just ruins integral skills that make the series so unique and fun. The circle straffing meta NOW, is mindless. What was once a skillful dance is now a mindless pattern.
Good review, however it seems like you completely missed the kick mechanic, you can always do kicks while your weapons are on a cooldown. Also there's a semi-advanced move that lets you do melee cancels if you press dodge at the last moment before the hit.
Oh no i didn't' miss the kick mechanic, that thing is pretty lame and is far from the answer to the issues with weapon cooldown. Because lets say you get an enemy in stagger, sure you can kick them, but it's pretty slow and doesn't do much damage, and it sends the enemies flying across the screen, completely forfeiting your position on them. Honestly it would be better if the game gave you some kind of pummel or something, because the last thing you want when you have an enemy in stagger is to give them a position reset while taking a little bit of damage on them. Honestly what I started to do when I was waiting for reloads while the enemy was in stagger was to reposition myself behind the enemy, so that when I finally reloaded my weapon I would at least be in a good position against them.
@@TheElectricUnderground I see, but also you can use Assault Armor while enemies are stunned, it deals quite a lot of damage and can be an extremely good addition to your stagger combo, also big bosses don't fly away after you hit them, so you can kick them multiple times while they're stunned. And you can fall faster in this game if you don't hold any direction on your left stick, you fall about two times faster then if you were holding forward for example, but I can totally see why they didn't add the fast fall button, it would be too OP especially in PVP, since it would basically be a vertical dodge that would fuck up lock on systems of the enemies really bad and everyone would spam it (especcially the reverse jointed leg guys).
Have you try (armored core 4 for answer) yet
I might go and give this game a go. My only experience with any Armored Core is the PSP version of Silent Line.
One of the inspirations to play this game is the fact that Kazutaka Miyatake and Shoji Kawamori are the mecha designers here, two big names of the Macross series.
oh yeah the game is still really solid and I do recommend it, I just think it falls short of the MUST PLAY type of recommend, due to the restrictive design choices that I discuss in the vid.
What is your opinion on Sekiro, anyway? Do you find it Simon says-ee?
25:00 32:10 THIS ! I love AC6 but I strongly agree with these whole section.
I hope dev team remember when they introduced the "magazine" in ACNX(2004) , players were confused and disgust the mechanic , but AC4 and AC5 series did pretty well feeling about firing weapons.
Nice video. I agree completely here - AC6 is a really great game that manages to keep the core identity and feel of the franchise, but some of the decisions made to gain the wider audience lost just a bit of the secret sauce of the older games. Reminds me a lot of Monster Hunter World in that way. But like you, I'm hopeful that now that we have this baseline, AC7 will build on it and add some more complexity back in.
Although I will say that overall, this may actually be my favorite AC purely because of the presentation. It reeks BUDGET in a way that older ACs couldn't. All the little sound effects of the joint movements are just perfect, and get my Mecha Nerd brain all hyped haha
I'm glad you're optimistic, but the recent development trends of from software haven't really been too encouraging on the "add complexity back in" front. this is coming from someone that despised and was disappointed by Elden ring but loved Sekiro despite it being a bit of a mainstreamified Tenchu in some ways, but i digress
@@florida_sucks
Elden Ring was fantastic... In what ways was it worse then say Dark Souls 1 ?
I beat and enjoyed Sekiro for what it was and even had the demon bell on for the last few bosses - but its playstyle was very limited and I have no desire to go back...
But in Elden Ring, you can do so much with the variety of character builds that its very fun... You can arguably make the game too easy between leveling up too much and some things being "OP" but pretty much every Souls Game with a level up system is like that at least on the first New Game.
I wouldn't hold my breath. This game was designed to bring in Souls players. What I hate is that FROM promised that this game wasn't going to be Souls meets AC and ended up lying about it. What I hate is that Souls players have no problem saying "get good" but most of those fans couldn't comprehend the classic controls the series was revered for. I'd be pissed if every major publisher made all their games play like their flagships.
@@MrRawnch How is it any more souls than the rest? Stagger bar? Sure. But otherwise it's nothing like souls lol
@@hachikuji_mayoi I literally just posted the Souls bits in my first rant. The repair health, dodge button, and the over powered bosses that can kill you in a few hits and only take chip damage.
23:15 There absolutely is a fast fall in the game. Just don't hold any direction/movement related input at all when you're in the air and your boosters will turn off and you'll fast fall. Seriously, you say you tried, but how hard did you try? You just had to do... Nothing
This is not fast fall, this is just falling at the fastest speed the game allows, which is not fast. That's like saying there is fast fall in mario when you let go of the jump button ha. Fast fall is a specific state when you can increase your fall speed beyond the default fall speed. All you are describing here is the default fall speed. So every game has fast fall essentially by this view.
@@TheElectricUnderground what are you looking for, then? Your boosters all shut off and you plop down like a rock, what else do you want in a fast fall to consider it a "real" one? I'm genuinely curious, I don't see the distinction you're trying to make. In my mind, in this game, there is a slow fall and a fast fall. Falling while holding a directional input is slow, and falling while not holding one is fast.
very late here, but you really hit everything on the head with this. No other videos really resonated with mine or other longtime players observations about the game as clearly as this, it felt like i was going crazy being one of the only few people who thought literally all of this stuff while also being an active ac player. Things like the booster toggle being useless/badly implemented, the camera difference, circle strafing trivializing the boss encounters, etc were almost never talked about by people much. Still insane they really had to remove snipers from the game to promote the forced close range melee epicness. Alot of people dont see how good the older ac games were and still are in alot of aspects, 5thgen was overhated and overlooked, but it did so much as a game, 4thgen as well, ac6 following up with what it did feels underwhelming or unexpected to say the least. Great video!
oof just disagree with you. game is amazing but seeing your other game reviews seems like you just don't like the games I love.
That's ok, we all don't have the same tastes and values in terms of game design. I hope you can see what issues I am explaining though, because you never know, maybe some of the changes I propose you might actually enjoy if they were implemented into future updates. Rather than just sitting and saying why every game is great, I think it's more interesting to critique what elements of the gameplay work and what elements I think fall short. That is the point of a review, I would hope ha.
As a first time player I’m loving AC6 but the way you describe the boost mode and camera in AC5 makes me wish the system was more like 5. 5 sounds like you get the immersion of operating a machine, and 6 is a little more gamey and just feels like you’re controlling a character. I wish there was ever a good reason to just be walking the mech. Boost in a tank tread seems really silly in 6 as well.
Yes and I don't think they had to 1 to 1 keep the AC5 camera system, but I think if they kept some of it's more technical elements preserved in the new camera system, it would have given the game a tighter and more interesting feel in terms of controls. Perhaps they could have found a middle ground between the two, rather than just chucking the ac5 system all together and going elden ring style free aim.
The more I watch this video, the more I see alot of problems with this, and it come across as GEN V bias.
1. Cutting boost to execute quick turns as you mentioned around 12:20 was an
advanced technique you did not need for the campaign at all and was never explained in game. Cutting boots midflight to do a spin out amongst the ground was moreso necessary as a pvp mechanic and was obscure enough you probably would not come across it naturally. Cutting booster main use was to dodge by rapidly losing altitude... which also is an important strategy in armored core 6 you can do. It just kinda hidden, much like spin outs. You are selling the game short here.
2. Your argument around 17:40 onwards talk about difficulty. V and VD damage system alone mean you can pretty much make yourself immune to the enemy damage, while doing maximum damage to them. I do not get how you can think it is harder unless you are willfully ignoring the game imbalances like sazanami missles always doing full damage due to the super high KE damage meaning to resist them the enemy has to gimp their mech, or kicks having true damage so they just oneshot most things. In AC6, most enemies got big AOE attacks and big sweeping attacks to completely prevent circle strategies, which ironically works on VD final boss. What they do not prevent is abusing ACS stagger, which pretty much you seem to be abusing the whole video, as that is a balance issue in the game you fail to touch upon.
3. Around 23:00 you talk about how AC6 does not have fast fall... but it does. Like spins in AC 5 and VD, it is a hidden mechanic. You have to stop pressing buttons completely to initiate it. This whole segment bothers me because it pretty much you comparing a decade of learned tech and skill to two weeks of learning AC6. While I do like the wall kick system in V, it was a symptom of the game taking advantage of cover so much, a feature that really encouraged a lame peak a boo play style that made the game more akin to a TPS, then a mech game. Returning vertical flight is more in line with old armored core, and is actually more what a mech game should be.
4. Cool down been in most AC games. I do not understand this complaint, especially since ready position weapons in gen V are FAR more restrictive. Is the only AC game you play was GEN V? Did you utilize kicks to take advantage of weapon reload periods? This is not a design issue at all, but a personal taste issue, and a severe misunderstanding of the game itself. Your comment at 30:00 seem to be borne from wanting to play this like gen V. You are not jumping with a reverse joint leg that are designed to be vertical and has exceptionally strong kicks compared to bipeds and are instead staying on the ground where they are the weakest. If this was to show off how OP ACS stagger is, why not mention that here, instead of showing you are not playing to your build strengths then saying this make the game sluggish.
5. Melee is an extremely strong punish option that can often 1-3 shot mechs. This was true even in GEN V, where it was slow, hard to land, but incredibly strong. Honestly, this was true in ALL Armored core games. 34:20 is a remark about melee that I do not understand and make little sense in the context of the series.
These was my biggest issues as the rest is agree to disagree. I liked the video and subscribed, but the script here seems indicative to me of someone that didn't play the game for what it was, and instead bemoaned it not like ACV, and considering your footage, specifically verdict day.
I'll respond to your comment in the same list format ha:
1. The changing boost mechanic seems really fundamental to the design of the game. It's clearly intentionally designed. I'm not sure how you can argue that knowing how to do it is irrelevant, when the game is very demanding movement wise and understanding how the boost system works is clearly beneficial. I think you are jumping too far off the main point, which is that in 5, there is depth and areas to explore with the boost system of 5, whereas in 6 the boost system has been so streamlined that it may as well not exist. I think it's a huge stretch to say that the boost system of 5 is some kind of niche mechanic, when the game is so heavily balanced around movement.
2. Even Dunkey thinks Core 6 is too easy. This is actually a really easy point to refute because in the course of my review I played both 5 VD and 6 at the same time for roughly the same amount of time. I did the pepsi challenge lol. With 6, I had no issues with difficulty at any point. I didn't get stuck, i didn't need to look things up, I didn't have to even tweak my build all that much. It was a fun, but very comfortable gameplay experience. With 5 VD, I ran up against difficulty wall after difficulty wall and you know what I had to do ... I had to research the game. i had to figure out which builds to use in which levels and what weapons worked and why. And on top of that also needed to figure out the game's movement system and core combat (plus you actually have to aim in 5 VD, whereas in 6 the generous lock on mechanic handles most of that for you). Again your pushing past the main point by saying, well if I understand 5 perfectly then it's actually easier than 6 ... but is that true. I highly doubt that. Part of gameplay difficulty is how much the game tests your knowledge of its systems and how much you have to adjust that knowledge. Because 6 is so streamlined, you only need to have a basic understanding of how the system works and your set to go. Whereas in 5, there is a lot more you have to dig into both mechanically and with all the mech parts and all that.
3. I've addressed this point in other comments, AC6 does not have a fast fall. A fast fall is a specific technique where you can increase your fall speed on the fly beyond the default fall speed. In 5 you have your booster fall speed and then you can manually, at any moment, turn off the booster to plummet at a fast rate. In 6, Fromsoft have specifically removed this mechanic. You cannot manually turn off your boosters in the air to drop. What you are describing is not a fast fall, because notice what needs to happen, you need to stop moving, right? So you literally cannot use this technique to quickly move down through the air, because the game forces you to sit and wait like a giant turkey. Fromsoft are deliberately taking away the fast fall option from you, but since it would be absurd to have you be stuck in the air all the time, they have this state where your boosters eventually turn off ... after you have stopped moving. This is a concession for the general movement of the game so you don't get stuck in the air, but it's clearly intentionally designed to not be too good or too useful in combat situations. This is like me saying that a game has removed a run mechanic and your saying, no run is still there, because you can walk.
4. No it isn't. This point I have triple checked since posting the review and I had Boghog, an associate of the channel, also check it across the older games. This is not true or you don't understand what i mean by weapon cool down. Very easy test, get the combat rifle in AC5 and use it in AC6, what's different? In 5 you have a constant rate of fire that does not get interrupted. In 6, you rate of fire is interrupted by needing to reload. This happens across most weapons. Use the gatling in 5, and then use it in 6, what's the difference? You already conceded that there is a difference by saying i should use kicks in 6 during the cooldown ha. The kick is lame, and again another example of the game really wanting to force melee combat situations by taking away my rifle fire rate and positioning. The kick does not fix the issue at all ha. Also it's lame that the kick forces a position reset, if it isn't lame enough. At least give me a pummel or something, so I don't have to completely chase down the enemy again.
5. You're missing my point on the melee. I say in the video that melee is strong directly. That's not the critique. I'm critiquing the design of the melee. In the vid, I discuss the concept of natural balance vs statistical balance. Natural balance are the attributes of a move that are fundamental, its frame data (startup, cooldown, hitbox size, speed, etc). Statistical balance are the numbered stats of an attack, basically how much damage and stun it does. So in fighting games, lets compare a mid poking kick to a roudhouse kick. A mid poking kick has strong natural balance, in that it has great frame data and hitboxes and all that, so it's a move you naturally use to control space and engage in the core combat. A roundhouse, on the other hand, is a naturally weak move because it is slow, takes forever to start up, and is very punishable, it's a move you don't want to use naturally, except is has strong statistical balance in that it does a bunch of damage and creates a knockdown. In AC6, the melee is massive roundhouses all day. That's how the game balances the melee. You need to do these huge high commitment attacks all the time. Which I find tedious and honestly under designed. So yes the melee is strong statistically, but it's not strong naturally. I explained in the video that the natural combat of the game is semi close range circle strafing (like you do with the long shotguns and riffles). That is the meta of the game naturally. The melee does not fit this meta at all, and fromsoft know that. So rather than designing the melee to have better natural qualities (faster startup, faster recovery, but would do less damage) From decided no let's just balance the melee to be better by nerfing the ranged combat and imposing weapon cooldowns. So now the flow of the game is much clunkier because your constantly going to be locked into the huge melee animations over and over. It's lame. What From should have done is made the melee faster and more naturally integrated into the ranged combat, and tamped down on it's damage to compensate. Also the fact that the melee has this built in dash animation that you have to do is extra clunky. In terms of older AC games and their melee combat, that actually doesn't matter at all. AC6 is unique in how much it really really wants to make the melee happen and how much it pushes the player to use melee in terms of it's overall design (do the older AC games have enemy stagger?). The game goes so far as to nerf ranged options with weapon cooldowns. Whereas in older AC games, yeah the melee is funky in those too, but they aren't so heavily designed around the melee anyway, so it's just sort of a side line weapon option. Also they don't have the built in tracking boost animation at the very least. Basically, if you are going to make a game mechanic central to your game design, there is a higher need to make it good ha. Whereas in the older games you can ignore melee combat much more and just focus on ranged combat.
Overall, I'm glad you engaged with my video so much and ended up subscribing, that's really great :-) Sometimes my tastes and preferences aren't gonna line up with other players, but one trend that I think you should also consider, and i have noticed this trend on this channel, is to literally wait and give my critiques some time to ferment. Because in the new release glow where everyone is claiming that month's game is masterpiece, my reviews stick out as more critical. But just wait, in a few months time we are going to get a second wave of vids where people do start to re examine the game after the honeymoon is over, it's a really funny pattern. And then my reviews tend to sink in with everyone else more ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground Appreciate the quick and friendly response. I wasn't sure what the reaction was gonna be, but I like that it is a positive and constructive one. The list format help me with keeping ideas together, so I don't meander too much.
1. I specifically referenced spin outs which is cutting the boosters, so that your AC does a turn against the ground when it hits, leaving a burning trail in the dirt. I argued this was not necessary to learn because I beat all of verdict day not using it, it was never explained in game, and no enemy (asides from blue magnolia arguably) is adept enough getting behind you that it will tempt you to experiment enough to discover its existence. Verdict day was balanced around wall kicking to get altitude, but the intricates of boost is never used more than that unless in a pvp context.
2. Dunkey look sup builds to break the game, as he did in elden ring, dark souls 3, sekiro, blood borne, etc. In the same review, he showed clips of him breaking Elden ring while saying you have to respect the bosses in elden ring while not in AC6. This leads me to think he was being sarcastic and criticizing fromsoftware overall design, while being tongue in cheek to avoid fromsoftware fanboys in general. He done this on multiple ocassions with other fanbases, as seen with his latest starfield video, and seen in his harry potter video. In regard to the rest of your point, I guess this is agree to disagree as I had the opposite experience here, as I built a heavy biped and just crushed the whole game because they have the best defensive spread, and I occassionally switched to pulse guns to obliterate certain Armored cores, or switched to tetrapods because CE damage was a problem.
3. This just sounds like to me you didn't experiment with fastfall and dislike its implementation. It serves the same function.
4. Four answer had weapon reloading... I do not get this point other than you have not played other armored core games and want the game to be more like VD. You not liking the kick is a preference, not a design flaw... and even verdict day has innate balancing where if you tuned to much toward power you made the weapon shoot slower.
5. Alot of this is repeating concepts I understood but did not find relevant to mention in my criticism as your issue was disliking melee because it "feels" bad because you find it to be committal. Plasma thrower can move while meleeing on quads and tanks, and the mine thrower can as well, and only occupy the melee slot. I think this require more experimentation on your part. Also yes, even verdict day had stagger, seen with the stability stat where a weapon hit you that did more impact than you had stability, you hard stagger, and took extra damage (This was the likely foundation for the ACS stagger).
This existed in 4th gen, 3rd gen, 2nd gen and 1st gen, but instead of taking instability damage, you just couldn't move when hit with a heavy weapon or a melee.
I appreciate this last bit, but truth be told in this instance, I already have issues with how the game handle innate weapon balancing due to being stagger centric, assault boost having no downsides invalidating other movement options, the lackluster pvp options compared to something like verdict day, low leg parts, removal of important information like weapon velocity, and the game removing long range play in favor of a mid-range burst to close gameplay that encourage heavy builds. My issue here was directed at what I perceived to be preference-based issues shown as objective and incomplete information, so it did not move the needle in my mind, but I always appreciate other perspectives.
Keep up the good work though. Regardless of critics like me, the site is better with people willing to analyze games.
I miss something like Otogi or Kuon.. Just hope that they will revive any of these franchises
Me too! i think the fromsoft backlog is really cool and full of interesting ideas! I hope the dev does do more mech stuff and non souls stuff, Fromsoft are absolutely one of the only current studios that I respect in terms of game design ha.
Some of the stuff you disliked (such as jumping and weapon reload) are the fundamental gameplay elements of all previous AC games before ACV.
You can definitely still fast fall in AC4, I checked that. But I don't base what I value in my reviews on series tradition, rather on fundamental design concepts. This is sort of an older topic in my vids, but just because a mechanic is an an older game, doesn't make it any more valid because of tradition. So in the case of armored core as a series, let's say that there are older armored core games with weapon cooldown, and then AC5 removes the weapon cooldown, and then AC6 puts the weapon cooldown back. To me ,the game that did it correct would then be AC5, because I do not think weapon cooldowns is a good mechanic within the genre as a whole. So I would say that if AC5 was the game that was making all these innovations, and then AC6 is sort of ignoring the new mechanics and ideas, that just means that AC5 was under appreciated for its design. This happens in games series all the time actually. So when I go through and play older armored core games, if I come across ones with weapon cooldowns, I'll critique that mechanic in that context just like I would for AC6.
I haven't played previous AC games, they were way before the time I really got into mecha genre hardcore, and I'm enjoying AC6 quite a lot so far.
My biggest gripe with the game so far is the bosses and the build balance.
As far as I undarstand, the old AC games were about trying, failing and trying again with a different build, suited for the particular situations in a particular mission.
So far that's not what I'm getting from AC6. Not all builds are created equal, sure, but they're all on a single universal scale from useless to auto-win.
I'm fine with some of my "cosplay" builds being best case suboptimal, worst case useless against bosses, or even other ACs. But when there are builds that can just autopilot you through the game without breaking a sweat, the discrepancy is not even funny.
It's not about "in this mission fast and long range build would be benefitial, in that mission tankier close range build would be advantageous", it's about "you can take a build and try to juuuust barely git gud through a mission, or you can take the build and automatically steamroll through the entire game".
Once you've found THE build (and it can happen pretty early in the game), it kinda kills the joy of experimentation and trying out different things.
Yea what's worse is that one of the OP builds is something I genuinely just gravitated towards naturally (dual shotguns) because I found it cool but now I'm expected to play other builds if I want the game to be challenging just cause FROM couldn't find a way to balance their game. The whole "find your own fun" atittude is very frustrating to deal with cuz it feels like people just don't want to understand the countless reasons for why you wouldn't wanna gimp your own mech.
Yeah i'm not deep into the game enough to know for sure, but I get the feeling that the game is going to have basically more universal builds that will get the job done in almost all cases ha.
Please point me to a single build, with a single unchanging set of weapons, possible to make in Chapter 1, that can beat every boss in the game without exceptions and without several tries. I haven't found one so far. If you've found one, I suspect you've been paying more attention to forums and reddit than the game itself.
@@boghogSTG So you beat Balteus with the starter shotguns? Is that what you're saying? That's very impressive if true. I personally found those shotguns to be useless. If you're talking about the Zimmermans you don't even get until Chapter 3, I'd still like you to confirm that you managed to beat Ibis in under 5 attempts.
Personally, I have no idea what any of you people are talking about. The game is plenty hard for the average player, no matter which build you choose. Some people will struggle more than others, and some bosses will be more challenging for some players than others, but I'm not going to sit here for even a second and believe that all of you just happened to beat every boss in the game without several attempts and a build you came up with on your own.
"But 5 attempts isn't hard" most games won't have you retrying a bossfight even once, let's not confuse Dark Souls difficulty with what's actually normal in modern gaming.
@@GeorgePerakis Yup, I used the default shotguns until right before the worm, didnt even switch to zimmermans right away. They arent particularly worse than double zimmermans in terms of stamina breaks, you just need some decent high damage shoulder/melee weapons to capitalize on them
Ibis took 4-6 attempts yeah, I would not call that hard in the slightest but even if you want to theres still a problem cuz the core issue is that I didnt need to learn bosses thoroughly to beat them, regardless of attempt number. For Balteus, Ibis and Ayre I had to pick some stuff up (hug Balteus during slashes, dont be greedy with Ibis, dodge into Ayre doing her slash) but it was hardly comprehensive and other non major boss fights might as well not have movesets cuz its so easy to tank them. If I had to switch my build to trivialize each one at least thatd make some sense but no, double shotguns + straight missile launchers/cannons owned everything. Even if it took 20 attempts this kind of thing is unacceptable in a "hardcore" action game IMO
Combines the best of euroshmups & bullethells all in one awesome package. AC6 checks all boxes & is a must play.
yeah it's funny how many euroshmup concepts mech games tend to use actually ha. i think the reason why mech games get away with having movement inertia and that sort of thing though is that they function in 3D space, rather than being locked into 2d. Still, I do like games like AC5 which reduce the amount of movement inertia and have a slightly more arcade feel ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground Yeah, uhhh?/? I think I may watch your avoid euroshmup vid again lol
otogi 2 still the best game from ever made
Im hoping the new AC will create a solid audience for mech games so we can get a new high quality MechWarrior game, mostly because I dig the battletech universe.
Yes i'm super curious how AC will affect the other mech games in terms of interest. I could see it creating a bubble for other mech games to get more notice, which would be really cool.
YES!! Totally agree. I played ACVI and it felt like Fromsoft was afraid of losing the audience that got to know them thanks to Dark souls, so they included a lot of mechanics to attract that audience. don't get me wrong, I also like Dark souls a lot, but I played AC first. ACVI feels totally different, what brought them popularity was DS and I guess now they have no incentive to change the formula so ACVI ends up being a Souls-like. But if all their games are more Souls-like eventually people will get tired.
So ac1 and 2 were really about resource management and melee was required to conserve ammo.
IMO FromSoft's masterpiece is Bloodborne and they haven't quite recreated anything as special/unique/creative since, but the games they make are still really solid
Yes i agree completely.
I am definitely over stamina bars and parries in too many games, but that is better than ubisoft copycat influence, eww
Your melee criticism lines up exactly with my feelings on it. Maybe you could do something where spending a slot drastically modifies or enhances your default melee weapon, but with how basic the slash is I don't think it deserves to take away from your other armaments.
Exactly master, and I think if this was suggested to Fromsoft (they won't see my humble little review), but if this was general fan feedback, they would pick up on this being a change they want ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground Do you think there was some intentional gimping of the melee to avoid comparisons to Dark Souls?
Camera didn't bother me at all on mouse and keyboard. Game really shined on that input system. But everything from cooldowns to god damn slow falling I 100% agree with.
Yeah i don't hate the new camera system by any means, but I think what Fromsoft should have done is added a bit more limitation to it, so that your mech movement is still more meaningful, like maybe have it where you can peak left and right but still need to turn using the face of the character, like Resi4 or something. I think an in-between of the fully free camera of 6 and the restricted camera of 5 would have been perfect.
I've never played the Armored Core games, so I know little about them, but . . . the gameplay looks very reminiscent of the old Virtual On games, albeit less focused on 1v1 and more of a progressive level design. (Kind of like comparing a fighting game to a brawler.) Am I correct in my assumption?
Virtual On was my jam back in the day. I was totally that a-hole in the arcades that kept wasting everyone else's quarters in 1v1. I am unapologetic.
Also, im a Gundam EXVS player. That is the pinnacle of mech control and combat. It is a multiplayer game but all of the weapons and subwepons that have cool downs / reload periods. It is a pure arcade action game in every sense of the word (EXVS) and it has weapon reloads and cool downs on sub weapons and power up modes.
I did some reading on the evolution of the series since I have such large gaps in between my series experience. Interestingly enough it seems like Armored Core 6 is kind of the reverse Armored Core 5 so it makes total sense.
Apparently some fans of the earlier game games in the series were unhappy with how the more fast paced reflex based combat had become the series style so they deliberately went to lengths to make AC5 feel like a more tactical game.
You're the best video game channel on UA-cam. Hands down, I'm a huge fan... You have all the right takes, you're verbalizing stuff I've been saying for years. Thanks for content.
oh what an awesome comment!!!! Thank you so much! I do try to really dig into aspects of game design that I don't feel are talked about, so I'm glad what I'm talking about is making sense to you :-)
Just 1cc’d Galaxy Force 2. Incredibly underrated. Have you played it?
One issue with many older games such as older From games is that they are not available on modern platforms. Makes it harder to play them now.
It's weird how people get turned off from mecha, being a giant murder mech seems like something people would universally think is kickass. Maybe it's the self-insert crowd not getting their 'immersion'.
Also, I feel Armored Core VI proves that Fromsoft has spent too much time on Souls, they can't make something that feels like Armored Core V anymore because after verdict day everyone there has been focused on Souls action for a decade straight.
sick logo :)
Ha a very talented musician made it actually ;-)
I’m so confused by this game. It is borderline not even a game IMO, just a tech demo for the movement system. It has the weirdest pacing of any major release I have ever played. The part balance is terrible. The big dramatic boss fights take less than a minute, sometimes on your first try if you’ve done the littlest bit of min/maxing. Going full aggro gorilla mode is always the correct choice in combat. Maybe NG+ is different, and maybe the true genius of the game only reveals itself when you start hunting for s-ranks, but I’m good with my one playthrough for now. However, kudos to From on the multiplayer, because it works really well…
"I'm good with my one playthrough for now."
Anyway.
@@BebehCookieIcecream OK then, guy who owns Diablo 4 👍 Are you just a slop of the month enjoyer? Or do you actually have some wisdom to dispense that will make me reinstall Armored Core 6/10?
@@tydavis1795 I just think starting your weird take with "It's borderline not even a game IMO" shows your opinions are flippant at best. You just, like, don't get it, man.....
The parts are not meant to be totally balanced. Some parts are easier/more straight forward, some are more obscure and nuanced. FROM games are so fulfilling to replay because within them lies a bounty of different playstyles and challenges to refine and overcome. These are not multiplayer-first games.
Overlooking/skipping the system's intricacies just opens you up for an unfulfilling time. NG+ is indeed different, and NG++ for that matter, because you're actually forced to use more refined tactics due to the reworked difficulty and setup of missions, which leads to being forced to engage with said systems on a deeper level. Trying to ape mode duels/bosses in the harder difficulties often leads to getting clowned (though it's often because of being outnumbered or because the boss is, obviously, much more dangerous than you and has upgraded moves). Try it out with a different build if you ever do play again, like a light build. Smgs, maybe a sword, bipedal, 1200km/h+ 👍.
P.S. D4 is indeed shit, I quit pre-50.
Souls Core 6
I hope one day they take another crack at Otogi. That game was my shit back in the day.
I hope so, would be nice to see how Fromsoft approaches character action genre again. I would like to see return of Kuon(survival horror) or Tenchu(stealth) from them too.
Oh yeah I really want to start digging through some older from soft games, maybe beginning with core 4
You should play more AC games because a lot of what you don't like has existed in previous AC games
Very important point that I've talked about in previous reviews, but I don't do series/traditional based reviews of game mechanics. I look at the mechanics of a game more in terms of design overall. So this point you are bringing up here is a common example of a mentality I try to avoid. So looking at AC5, let's say AC5 is the only game in the series that removes weapon cooldown and has this walljump based movement system and camera system. I know that AC4 does have fast fall without boost, but let's say these mechanics are unique to just AC5. These choices that AC5 has made were smart game design decisions. So that if AC6 decides to go back to a simpler movement system and then adds in weapon cooldowns, just because these mechanics were used in older games doesn't make them good, it just means that the game design has regressed backwards. If there is one lesson I def want to communicate on this channel, it's that tradition does not make game design good. But a lot of gamers have this mentality that if a series just keeps repeating bad design over and over, at some point that bad design becomes good, and then funny enough when it is then altered (like you are saying happened in AC5) then it's AC5 making the bad choice ha. So I do plan on going back and playing the older Armored Core games, and I promise that if I come across weapon cooldown and other complaints that I made in AC6, I will critique them as well. Just because a game design decision is old, doesn't make it good.
@@TheElectricUnderground well because people like gen 1-4 than v
Personally i like them all
Try to play gen 4 and gen 5
Yes, the wall jump that was in 5 was to compensate for the lack of true flight in the game. I didn't have a problem with it but a lot of people seemed to hate it. So it's smart game design to you and horrible game design to a majority of players.
Ultimately, this is a case of 'to each his own'. I was just saying play the other games for a broader spectrum of the evolution or devolution of game mechanics.
Great video btw man, I love to hear other's experiences with this game
I was hoping that the addition of checkpoints and the ability to change parts mid-mission would proportionately lead to more challenging boss fights, but the game is weirdly easy. Every arena fight after the first few I beat in one try, and the final boss took only two attempts. I kept wondering if I just happened to make an OP build, but I'm less inclined to believe that seeing how different your go-to build was. Also, did anyone else notice how big of a deadzone there is for the camera movement?
100% agree, it's an ok game.
What's your opinion on Titanfall?
AC feels like I'm in a metal mosquito on drugs flying around, Titanfall feels like a real mech.
I mean a mech is 100T or heavier 🤷♂️
I've never actually played titanfall, I'll have to take a look at it when I go through other mech games :-)
To each their own, I love how the game was handled
The Ammo limits were really puzzling to me, especially when they give you a a full refill after restarting a checkpoint or right before a boss fight anyway. Just seems odd to put in a limitation without any real obstacle that really tests it.
The obstacle is the parts of the levels before the bosses. It’s not a test of keeping enough for a boss obviously. The levels with resupplies are the bigger ones where it’s entirely possible to run out of ammo and not be able to get to the resupply if you’re not careful.
S-ranks, probably. If you're hardcore and want to S-rank the missions, the ammo limit matters. But if you're struggling with the game and dying a lot, the ammo system is forgiving.
PvP
Like someone else have said, this isn't a game for dark souls enjoyers. It's not a souls-like. The intention is for you to play the game multiple times over; and try to S-rank missions. That's when those seemingly useless limits really start to matter.
Sekiro still has like 10% of the dna from tenchu tho, I want a proper new tenchu with missions and no deep combat mechanics, just pure stealth.
AC6 at least has most of the core mechanics from the old ac games.
Also, i dont think its a good idea to compare 6 to 5, knowing the 5th gen has litttle to do with previous titles on the series, and borrows movement and attack mechanics from other mech games made by fromsoft. 6 has a lot more in common with the ps1/2 games and the 4th gen imo.
Regarding Tenchu, have you looked into Aragami? The first one is considered more authentic than the sequel.
sekiro isnt a tenchu reboot, its a completely different game.
This is what Ubisoft did with Ass Creed..... to death.
oh yeah, and poor splinter cell.
The only time you want to use boost off is to essentially quick turn why? Its due to the fact AC6 is built from the ashes of ACV precisely ACV not VD
I was hoping you’d do a review of Core 6.
In-depth, critical, and fair. Nice job. I’m headed out now to pick it up.
I'm happy you were looking forward to my review! This one ended up being a lot of homework ha because I didn't just play AC6, I also played a ton of AC5 and researched a bunch of the older games. Overall though, this review was actually a ton of fun as mech genre is a genre that I enjoy playing and talking about :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground we appreciate the hard work! Keep it up!
It's so weird to me that you're comparing AC 6 to 5. My frame of reference for AC is always 4A, which I think is the pinnacle of what Armored Core is, even though in retrospect it is the most different to the rest. Basically 3, 4, 5 and now 6 each have a totally different feel to them and each reinvents the formula in some way. You mentioned that you can fly too easily in AC6, well to me AC6 is way too slow and grounded compared to 4A! In 4A, you can *really* fly. In fact, fights in 4A are very similar to some kind of dogfight between semi-grounded fighter jets. Turning in 6 is too easy? Turning in 4 is automatic! You just lock on to the enemy and let your mech automatically track it.
The thing that makes all of this mad flying around work is the FCS targeting system - it automatically compensates for the enemy's movement. Once it locks on, firing your weapon is a guaranteed hit as long as the enemy doesn't change the direction it's headed in. This more than anything else is what makes it feel like an incredibly fun dogfight - you're not just avoiding the enemy's hitboxes, you are actively trying to trick the enemy by switching your movement pattern. Circle strafing doesn't work, the system accounts for that. In AC6 all enemies just fire at you rather than at where you're going to be.
Enemies' movements are also a lot different in 4A. In 6 it's all input reading and instant dodges. The enemy circle-strafes you and instantly boosts in the opposite direction when you fire a bullet. In contrast, in 4A all enemies have very intricate movement patterns based on the type of mech they have, but all of them are designed to confuse your FCS and make it actually hard to hit them. There is an entire class of mechs made to be extremely fast when on ground as opposed to in the air - the four-legged ones, ironically enough. Those were always hard for me since they can just change their trajectory instantly on ground. It makes a lot more sense than the permanently flying hovercraft design of 6 - in 4A they look like water striders and they move like water striders. Enemy movement in 6 is truly a band-aid design - they wanted the enemies to be harder to hit, so they made them instantly dodge on reading your inputs, rather than give them actual tactical movement like in 4A.
The stagger system is also very meh. It basically transforms the game into a race who can stagger the other one first and deliver massive damage. There is no space for fun builds - it's either close range stagger with the shotguns or long-range stagger with homing missiles. Nothing else really works in this game - rifles are useless because enemies instantly dodge those with input reading; laser weapons are useless because they don't stagger and don't do enough damage to staggered enemies, plus they take forever to cool down; melee is only useful as a stagger punish...
4A had a ton of viable builds - you could make anything from super long range tanky mechs to extremely light dual-saber builds that zip around and shred enemies before they can react. It still had something similar to a stagger system where if your Primal Armor got depleted you'd take a lot more damage and there were builds specifically made to deplete the enemy's PA and then punish them, but importantly getting your PA depleted never slowed you down, and hitting an enemy with PA up still did good damage to them.
So to me AC6 is far from being too quick. It is way too slow if anything. AC5 was already a very big disappointment when it came out (I didn't buy it), but I was hopeful 6 would be a return to form in a way. Instead, we got something like Sekiro with no parry where you and the enemy hit each other at point blank range hoping to stagger the other one first. I give it 6/10, but only because the characters are kind of cool, even if the plot is nonsense.
Weapon reload/cooldown is not an uncommon mechanic in Armored Core titles, the way it's handled does change between generations of the franchise, but in most cases it isn't really hard to get used to.
Personally I tought it made logical sense in the majority of weapons, mostly the solid ammo ones, for rifles having a magazine that needed to be reloaded between bursts and for grenade launchers having a chamber that needed time to be loaded with a big shell between shots felt realistically natural. I do concur that in some cases it takes a bit too much time, but it worked together with everything else in giving the feeling of having to manage a somewhat realistic mecha simulator. The fixed camera also played a part in that feeling, altough it also made the movements of the mech feel a bit too clunky and stiff in many occasions.
I do think focusing on ACV is misplaced, even armored core fans didn't like it very much. The 3rd and 4th gen, that came out before demon's souls and actualler were were myasaki got his start, are regarded as the cream of the crop mecha games
I think the mechanics of AC5 are very cool though, and the examples that I pointed out about the mobility options and lack of cool down on weapons is the right direction for mech combat I think. As to which AC game is the best overall I'm not familiar with the series to be sure about at this point, but I think the mechanics of AC5 have a lot more going on than the mechanics of AC6 and since AC5 was the last installment before AC6, it is a strong point of comparison.
@@TheElectricUnderground as someone who is familiar, AC6 is more like the ps2 era with AC3 than AC5, by a long shot
The floating falling is to prevent mech damage from 10000 tonnes of steel plummeting to the earth jk its the reason you said.
I was afraid Armored Core 6 would take a lot more from Souls game, so as to not displeased a particularly inflexible audience, borderline idiot savant, and was actually very happy with the final product. I've never played V though. The only other AC I've done in the past was For Answer, and AC6 felt quite like For Answer (but slower). I would even go as far as to say it's the best From Software I've ever played! But it was really interesting to listen to the points you raise. As always, you have a gift for explaining in a very articulate manner why very specific mechanics feel off or right to you.
AC6 is a really solid game and I enjoyed playing it and talking about it, and I agree that it is actually one of my more liked Fromsoft games ha (dark souls gets boring for me pretty quickly). But the thing about AC6 that nagged at me is that I could feel myself being restrained by design choices that I know From did for accessibility reasons. So I had fun and actually cruised through the game without too much difficulty, but I didn't feel that X factor that pushed me to keep coming back. I think it's solid, but too safe. I really hope the follow up is more technical and challenging, that would be a fun review.
Your point about the more contained level design of earlier games making the terrain actually matter reminds me a lot of the Dark Souls series and Elden Ring. The earlier games had such great attention to detail in their level designs, and then ER just barfs out copy-pasta open fields and haphazardly placed ruins assets ad nauseum. And because everything is so open the terrain doesn't matter at all.
I may have a chip on my shoulder.
Oh yes exactly! Elden ring has a pretty solid open world (in terms of open world games) but it's still not as tightly put together as the older souls games. And then in AC6 it's pretty fairly condensed by modern game standards, but there are still plenty of sections of just boosting over empty ground waiting to get where you need to go.
Wasn't familiar with the AC series so far, so I was wondering why you'd even need to turn off boost. In light of how it worked in AC5, now it does make sense! That kind of technical movement is a great fit for a mech game, and what I'd like to see more of. So it's a bit of a shame AC6 didn't keep it, but I can also see why mainstreamification was a big priority for this entry. At least making a high-budget AC game is something that could make sense financially as well.
Cool downs were the death of me in this game. Weapons, boosters, and then stagger man that every 10 seconds all of my buttons just stop working.
Now that's what I call action!
I really did enjoy the game and thought it was a lot of fun, but I think you're exactly right that done if the fundamental design elements could be thought through better.
I like your idea of natural vs statistical balance. Basically anytime a game says "this is too good, so you're just not allowed to do it", that's a design bandaid, not solution. Another example of this is how status effects don't work on bosses in RPGs.
Another issue for me, which dovetails with what you said, the levels are so big and beautiful with awesome geometry, verticality, layers, etc. And then there's just nothing. In a game series known for having a billion mech parts, there are very very few to find out in the world. So much potential for awesome secrets and exploring books and crannies, and there are just not that many. Barely worth it to explore the big beautiful levels, because 9/10 times there's no reward, so why even look when I'm probably getting nothing.
yeah I think it's a really lame and kind of 2010's direction to take the combat system. Especially because, like a said, western games are finally figuring out (slowly) that cooldowns are lame thanks to doom 2016
you can fast fall if you stop moving mid-air
that's not a fast fall, that's the default fall speed. A fast fall is a specific technique that allows you to accelerate more quickly than the default fall speed. In super mario bros, if you let go of B, your not fast falling. In 5, the game has the default fall speed with boosters (that automatically kick on) and you can, at any moment, manually kick off those boosters to plummet - that's a fast fall. In 6, the game does not allow you to kick off the boosters to fast fall, you can press the booster button all you want, it doesn't allow that to happen. Instead, the game forces the player to do nothing (as if the apm isn't low enough) and your boosters will eventually turn off by themselves and you'll gently drift to the ground. There is nothing fast or strategic about this process ha. Basically what From have done is remove the fast fall option, but since it would be insane to have no way to get back to the ground, they have this cooldown period where if you do nothing, eventually the boosters will turn off and you'll drift to the ground. To call this a fast fall is just completely wrong. The whole point of this mechanic is to prevent a fast fall from existing while still not forcing the player to be stuck in the air. It's like basically me saying "hey, the game removed run from the movement," and your saying: "No, run is still present because you can walk."
@@TheElectricUnderground ok
As a hardcore 2009- fromsoft fan (AC6 was my first AC and as usual loved it for many reasons you didn't cover, nevertheless) I went into this review just waiting to eye-roll your takes. Many of your gripes... I had to concur with must concede. Brilliantly executed review, and well thought out thoughts.
I'm just waiting on Frame Gride HD
yes and I really want to see a current console/pc port of AC5! it's crazy it's still stuck on xbox 360 and ps3
and you can interrupt melee with dodge.
But you can't skip the wind up animation, that s a big issue, nor can you cancel the massive after swing animation, you can only cancel the tracking animation, which shouldn't be there in the first place. Overall the melee should come out faster, have less recovery lag, but do less damage. More of a utility move than this big full commitment swing
@@TheElectricUnderground there’s no stakes to the combat if you can just opt out of your move at any time. Same with overheating. If you could just spam the entire time with no consequences.
@@Shabeast "there’s no stakes to the combat if you can just opt out of your move at any time"
Bayonetta says hi.
@@mariodoccia6129 not sure what that has to do with ACs combat but ok.
You know, personally, i would love them to remaster the 4th gen AC
Its THE Armored Core that a LOT of Ravens/Lynx'es remembered. That and maybe Verdict Day.
Whatever it takes to warm them up for AC6.5 and maybe AC7
AC6 is my first AC game and I'm really loving it (not finished yet, far from it) but I can also agree with many of your points in the video. I think the technicality of the turning speed and the decision to use booster or not is definitely a more interesting option, but I don't think I would like it personally. maybe I need to try the older AC games. But I do agree on the useless button for toggling on boost in AC6, even in platforming I really don't see any heavy value in turning off boost in the game so far. And while I do like just having a simpler ability to go upwards in the air like in AC6, I would have liked more air mobility in general, like the fast fall you mentioned, and those wall jumps looked dope asl. I think adding wall jumps, fast fall, and a less sluggish feeling assault boost, maybe even an instantaneous assault boost for an omnidirectional sprint/dash would be my ideal mix of movement. Melee being just a separate slot/s on its own is also an idea I think that would be a benefit to the game, since I just like having more weapons at any given moment lol
Lastly, I think your part on weapon cooldowns would have been an aspect that would change game feel completely. the constant attacking without weapon cooldowns and reloads would have resulted in an overall more faster paced and unrelenting gameplay style that I also think would have preferred. Like I said, while I'm having a blast with AC6 so far, not all but many of the aspects you included and suggested in this video would have resulted in a game that would have appealed even more to me, even when AC6 is already live af for me at its current state. Great video man
I'm glad my critiques have resonated with you :-) yes absolutely I think the base product of AC6 is solid and I do recommend it, but I think if Fromsoft added a bit more technical options and increased the pace more, then they will absolutely have something special on their hands. Who knows, it's entirely possible that they may make some changes in line with my critiques in newer entries or updates on the series :-)
Yo, solid takes yet again. About the boost... From leaving pointless mechanics in their games wouldn't be a first.
Need that natural vs statistical balance video yesterday
I've been playing Armored Core before most of the "fan base" was an itch in their daddy's jock. The main reason why casual players hated it was because they were too dumb to read stats sheets or learn how to pilot/control the game. Now From is trying to convert the Souls fan base to revive the series by basically reskinning the game. Now the game has stupid stuff like repair packs, stagger bars, no radar, a dodge button, and retarded bosses that can kill you in a few hits. One of the main points of the game was leveraging your armored points to finish a mission and now that feature is meaningless with health packs. I guarantee that most of the fans praising this game for its "toughness" would 100% struggle with the earlier installments. Despite the reviews of brain-dead gaming journalists, the series always had a strong cult following and was well-known and respected in Japan.
Yes it really is the classic tale of taking a hardcore series and streamlining it to a wider audience, like a said some of the secret sauce of the original series is going to be lost in translation. One thing that I am hopeful about is that, because of the popularity of AC6, maybe more players will start to check out the older games in the series, because it is insane how overlooked they are. While working on this review it was really difficult to find much material on the older AC4 games, even like gameplay footage and stuff. I'm definitely going to try to cover AC4 and 5 here on the channel soon :-)
Was really excited for the game but the more I play the game the less I like it overall & the more tedious it becomes.
The stamina system + cooldowns turns the boss fights into very samey exercises in waiting for a moment in between attacks to dump all your firepower into them & encourages exploiting their limited tracking, it almost feels like a Diablo-like or MMO at times. The missions are a total joke and remind me of lower difficulties of EDF where you're just burning through random forgettable easy missions one after another. There's some exceptions like the NG+ mission where you can turn on 2 of your allies but that just makes it more frustrating cuz it shows they can make fun encounters but chose not to. I'm just hoping some S ranks will be more engaging because so far the S ranks I've tried were just a matter of a few attempts and slight build tweaks.
Arena is horrible, it wasn't great in the older games but at least those had some challenging encounters later on - here destroying every single arena fighter within an attempt or two without thinking about tactics at all or putting any effort in is completely doable.
I do hope that FROM keep going and release another version like they did with previous AC games, vastly improving it. I felt like this would be a complete slam dunk for them cause Souls games despite everything are pretty tight mechanically, and bringing that tightness into AC would be the perfect combo for me personally.
Yes I felt the same way bog, as the game goes on and you start to see the hard limits the combat system puts on you as a player, it does start to feel more tedious. The weapon cooldowns especially hold the game back, and the lack of fast fall just seems odd because of how much the game wants you to jump and boost vertically.