I have a much simpler way of getting this done in my factories that works for fluids too. All of the first stations are designed to fully fill their buffers and storage. Once that's done, everything will only fill at the exact rate the stations manufacturing consumes whether it's for fluids or items. The last station is an overflow station. Once it's buffers are full, everything else sinks so the train always leaves empty. Another option I use for shared lines is a dedicated sink station. Everything outputs with Max belts or pipes directly into sinks to ensure trains are empty and everything at every location is running at 100%. Either use a fluid sink mod for fluid stations or packager if you want to sink most non water fluids
An additional tip, Example from fluid lines for instance. I have 6 stations that fill oil haulers and 3 that consume. I hit all of the fill stations first, and the last, #6 in this case, is set to fill the train fully before leaving. It has a buffer for 1 additional train to wait before entering the station without blocking the main line since it's a spur. When configured this way, you add trains until there is always one and only one waiting in the buffer and you'll guarantee every train going through is 100% filled and that the rate for each station is identical. No backups no shenanigans. Plus you never have too many or too few trains
@@pauljacobi340 that's more or less exactly what it is. I have 4 oil facilities. One does crude to turbo fuel. One plastic. One rubber. And something else don't remember. By dropping to each facility it doesn't really matter what it goes to, it's always rate limited once all buffers are full to exactly what each location needs, then it dumps perfectly to the sink station
It may be useful for very little factories, but, even without going the whole min/max route, i find myself using whole trains for a single resource and transporting in huge quantities, sometimes having multiple trains for the same item. For higher tier items it can be useful though. But i wouldn't use overflow with smart splitters. They always let the odd unselected item pass by and block everything unless that has been fixed. Where i have to use that technique i always chain two smart splitters. One to do what you explained, and a second on the exit belt to filter a second time the rare hiccups.
Or simply the option for a train to only unload a specific amount of an item. Or some kind of conveyor that limits the throughput of items to a specific amount
interesting but for multiple factories i just let the incoming buffers saturate and do not have an issue with just using the existing mechanic where it just unloads the whole container because the container from the train will only deposit enough to fill the buffer so once everything is saturated then then the remainder will continue to the next factory and every factory in the chain is able to use as much as it needs. actually I like this method better because if the train arrives back to a distribution center completely empty then that means the factories are pulling more then it can provide so I either need another train on that line or build more factories providing that particular resource to the distribution. your method moves this issue to the individual factories and requires more micromanaging to catch. the simple way that I use is a nice indicator of how well the system as a whole is working as it keeps all the debugging at the distribution centers where supply chain issues are easier to catch as you can monitor many things at one or two locations.
I like the first tip. We need to do it like that, because we don't have a set of how many stacks we want the train to fill. Hope they add so we can say to the train, how many stacks we want the train to fill. Like we can in Factorio. I can't program but I have an idea, of where this could be in the UI. (
There are a few tutorials on trains throughout youtube but for some reason, none of them cover how to integrate everything together. It would be really nice to see a video showing the actual usage of them and how they benefit linking everything together. I have almost 800 hours on this game and never really used them to this point because I always seem to get super confused as to how to link everything together via the trains. Every now and then I will setup a train to bring raw ore to a factory to smelt and process but then I get all twisted up as to how to extend the train line to bring those components somewhere else without stuff getting all mixed up in the train stations. I have seen a couple somewhat informative videos on some of the functions but still havent really seen anything showing how to start expanding it and using it for more than just 1 production facility. I just started a new playthrough and I am currently grinding through the 2nd tier of the elevator to get to the trains but once I get there, I want to completely tear everything down and start anew with trains for everything and just figure it out as I go. I would like to get 1 hub in each zone that has trucks or train lines that do nothing but gather ore and bring it to the hub, then 1 rail line going through each zone bringing it all to my main factory that I will build somewhere in the center of the map. I think my biggest confusion is should you have 1 train for each production line and 1 car per train designated to each type of ore/ product or is it best to just mix it all together and use sorters on the other end to get it where it needs to go? Every time I have decided to try building trains, it just turns into a mess and I go back to trucks or long belts but it just looks like a disaster...
The way I do it is 1 train per production factory, and 1 car per product, with a timetable for that train to deliver to each other factory that needs those items. I tend to have 2 stations per factory, each 2-3 platforms long, with one station for incoming required components, and one station for outgoing. I'm not doing any massive production yet, so 1 car per product has been fine so far. If you deliver more than required to the destination and DON'T sink the excess, then the train will drop off just what's required, and you can go to multiple destinations in a row - otherwise you can go back and forth between the source station for a top-up before going to each destination for delivery. eg; My Quartz factory has a 3-car train carrying Silica, Quartz and Crystal Oscillators, which goes to each other factory station that requires any of those and unloads. A train from my Plastics factory drops off Rubber, and another train from a Quickwire/AI factory drops off AI Limiters, as input to make the Crystal Oscillators. I also have a "Home Delivery" train which is mostly full of junk (eg; biofuel), which goes to each production station and grabs a few stacks of everything, to drop off at my home hub, which sorts everything into containers and sinks the rest.
@@dortamur2634 ty for that, ive been thinking too big and couldnt let go. One train per factory, one car per item, pass those trains onto wherever any of those items are needed, and let all the items stack up so the train has enough to feed multiple factories
@@dortamur2634 but like for example, if you have 1 train with 4 different cars, the delivery platforms have to be the same setup essentially for every stop unless you are using smart splitter to sort it where its going right? That has been one of my bigger hurdles is trying to figure out how to setup all the platforms so everything is mirrored across all the production lines. So if car 1 has iron plates and car 2 has screws, the platforms need to match anywhere the train goes correct?
@@Tacomaguy458 Yes, that's correct. You do need a little thought and planning although I've managed to get lucky with minimal clashes with mostly 2-3 car trains. If you're retrofitting existing factories you could plan it all out on paper. I do have one factory that had 2x3 platform delivery stations to receive 3 items due to a clash that I was too lazy to shuffle around - but I then expanded the factory to build more things and extra deliverables matched up to the unused platforms - lucky again. 😅 You could use smart-splitters to accept different things on one platform and reshuffle things into separate buffer containers, but you'd need a Sink to get rid of any overflow, otherwise one item could block delivery of another. You need to be more careful with production, consumption and route times then if you're delivering one item to two stations, so one station doesn't soak up and sink product the next one needs - although if one has a dedicated platform, you could deliver to that first, then the excess to the one with the buffer and sink. You could also make a Shuffle Depot anywhere with some space with 2 stations, where you dump into one delivery platform, shuffle it across to a different pickup platform, and time the train stop at the drop-off long enough for everything to be moved across, then pick up. I've not tried this though, and it could be a bottleneck if multiple trains use it. Hmmm. I might give this a go next time I have a platform clash. 🤔 The other possible thing to do to fix a delivery platform clash if you have space is just add another platform at each and and make your train longer. However, you'd have to update all delivery stations to use the new additional platform too. if you split generated items into 2 platforms at the source station the timetable doesn't differentiate between platforms when you say to Load, so it would load from both platforms and unload both at the destination.
If you use the "only load certain items" and "only unload certain items" you can get far. Keep in mind that trains and train stations have to be in the same order for items matching up. I use an excel spreadsheet like this: Train Iron Train Locomotive 1st car = Iron Plates 2nd car = Iron Rods 3rd car = Screws 4th car = Reinforced Iron Plates 5th car = Rotor Locomotive 2 Station 1: Train Station Freight Station 1= Iron Plates Freight Station 2 = Iron Rods Freight Station 3 = Screws Freight Station 4 = Reinforced Iron Plates Freight Station 5 = Rotor Empty Platform (not necessary) So, if you want a train to only unload the 3rd car with screws, you can build a destination station like this Train Station Empty Platform Empty Platform Freight Station 3 = Screws Empty Platform (not necessary) Empty Platform (not necessary) Empty Platform (not necessary) By using the filter settings you can however also commend a train to only unload screws which it will do at the right station, assuming you have followed the excel sheet and have made sure that the 3rd car contains screws. @TotalXclipse You really should do a video about train filtering and train loading and unloading logic (one load/unload has been completed / wait for X seconds, only when train is fully loaded /empty. :-)
To add to the second one, if you have multiple freight platforms at the station you can add additional Mk 5 belt inputs. For example, if you have 2 platforms you could have 3 Mk 3 belts going in, with the third split between the two platforms (as inputs to the storage bins). The capacity limit is determined by how much time the train spends loading, so if you have trains visiting more regularly (like if the route is short or you have multiple trains on the route), you have less time to load the station. However, as long as the station is clear at least 3/4 of the time (which it usually would be) you can have 3 belts going in. If you have 3 platforms it could accommodate 5 Mk5 belts. And of course, if you want to really maximise the throughput you could use some lower tier belts, as long as you've got enough time to load it. Materials with larger stacks don't need servicing with trains as often, so you could capitalise on this to get the throughput pretty close to 2 Mk 5 belts per platform.
Mixed on this, I prefer to have a dedicated train per destination that just stays there off the main track until unloaded, that provides more consistent output and reduces tension on the train network. Essentially only full trains ever run.
If you set it up like this, you will always have a consistent output and you'll be using less trains as one train can feed multiple stations depending on the amount of resources needed. Dedicated lines are a safe bet though and much easier to setup if you're concerned 😊
@@TotalXclipse This looks like a really clunky solution for a problem that Factorio solved by simply allowing stations to shut down on condition. CS could simply add a "close station when full"-slider to the ui. I know that wouldn't necessarily solve this particular issue and I really love Satisfactory, but the train logistics system in the game is lacking so many comfort features in it's current iteration, that you kinda have to either built 1 train per route or do weird work-arounds like this. But we'll have to wait for an overhaul, I is in early access after all.
You can supply multiple stops if you know the trains max storage per container and its output/input, so if you have a train fully fill with iron at its start then offload you can set the wait time as (Maxstorage/Number of Stops)/throughput = time needed at each stop. where fillup is the same without number of stops unless you have multiple pickup locations. you dont need to fill it with quartz
I have a much simpler way of getting this done in my factories that works for fluids too. All of the first stations are designed to fully fill their buffers and storage. Once that's done, everything will only fill at the exact rate the stations manufacturing consumes whether it's for fluids or items. The last station is an overflow station. Once it's buffers are full, everything else sinks so the train always leaves empty. Another option I use for shared lines is a dedicated sink station. Everything outputs with Max belts or pipes directly into sinks to ensure trains are empty and everything at every location is running at 100%. Either use a fluid sink mod for fluid stations or packager if you want to sink most non water fluids
@@MrFaerine How would this system work for different items? unless you have some impressive way of forcing an exact load order into your station, things are gonna get mixed up, and as soon as you unload a stack of the wrong item, your system is broken.
@@Nevir202 the load order is the same as the order in the station when picking up and you can force any item ratio with mergers, they work round robin. I always use terminating sinks in my mixed belt setups (usually after my storage room with sorters) so it is not possible that it clogs permanently. It will fix itself and sink the excess of wrong items, but some machines might temporarily not receive enough input. You are right however that this setup is likely unstable and prone to disturbance by different train round trip times if you want to drop of multiple different items. The more reliable solution I am actually using is receiving all mixed items, resorting them in single item containers and limiting each containers output to the needed rate before mixing again. Any overflow can be send forth with a second mixed car, or any other means of logistics at the other end of the factory. This is still way smaller than using one platform per item.
@@MrFaerine Ratio? Sure, but you need to control EXACTLY what items are in which slot in the train's inventory, I don't see any way to do that. Unless, like you say, you're just fine with getting a random mess, and hashing it out after the fact and dumping the excess. Funny seeing this, as I spent all night getting machine failures because I would once in a while get rubber on my plastic line and start clogging machines. It was so rare that I kept thinking it was a random stack that got in the mix somewhere, and just kept draining the line and going back to building, only to look back to broken machines. Finally I grabbed the train, all the way back to the far side of the map, and found that in my super petrol factory, 2 of the 44 machines making plastic, were actually making rubber. But as I was sinking excess before the station, nothing even happened for hours, till I got unlucky enough that rubber was on the belt at the right moment to avoid the sink, AND get into a position in the inventory where it was picked up by the train. Kinda made me wish I was doing what you're saying and running mixed cargo, as the filters would automatically un-hose the issue. But on the other hand, if I were, doing, that I'd have never found out that my factory was set up wrong lol.
Appreciate all the train videos! I understand the basic usage, but am struggling on how to time them, I guess? Like, if I want to take a product from one spot to another, how much of the product actually needs to get moved to keep the factory at the end working? Do I need to get out a stopwatch, or is there something simpler that I've missed?
Thanks. This is why I never really messed with trains (when it comes to logistics). Because I feel I have to time out throughput + train speed/distance to keep machines happy with a steady input. And that's not fun to do at all. That's why I feel long belts are more reliable, as they'll always provide the same throughput at all times, then hoping the train will deliver what they need in time. But please correct me if I'm wrong. It just seems to me you have to make double (or triple) than what the machine wants, to ensure this (instead of what you set the machines to). Yet this isn't always possible. Causes unnecessary stress.
It's clever for sure, but one thing I do not understand. Once the system is saturated, each station will only take as much as was used. However, that will require patience until saturation. Is this time difference the only gain?
Cool idea on how to force deliveries of limited stacks... I think I'll just stick with dumping everything in, till the buffer has filled up and it overflows to the next one. 😛
A few comments: 1. fluids cannot flow out of pipe inputs, the valves are unnecessary. 2. There is no need to build a pipe overflow, just connect a buffered pipe to both inputs. Use 2 pipes and a large buffer higher than the platform for max throughput, about 600 m3 per min is possible per car. 3. instead of limiting the number of stacks dropped off (no fine throughput control with varying round trip times) I can recommend limiting the output belt from the train station ISC buffer to the exact amount the factory is consuming. Much easier to calculate and the only way to get 100% efficiency, just might need a few splitters and mergers for wierd input numbers off from belt tier speeds. Sometimes its just easier to route back overflow to the train station in a full loop to send it along the line after production.
Fluid slops back and fourth in pipes, not so much about it flowing out of an input but going back along the pipe once the input is filled. - if you use valves you control the directional flow. As for limiting the output belt of the train station you can do that as well, but if you don't fill a station with stacks the train will fill up that station first, then the next one's. So by filling it with different stacks all your factories will be able to receive items from the get go, but as you mention you could use an overflow to another train station, but for that you'd need an extra freight station, which will use a lot more space for no reason. 😊
@@TotalXclipse no i meant the overflow can go back to the same train station. The overflow will fill it faster and compensate the difference between the real needed amount and the next higher belt speed on the output for easier setup. So your setup is only meant for slowing down the total fill and not needed in steady state, right? I use the limiting for my mixed belts factories, because overflow will be sinked otherwise to keep belts moving. So I have to control output rates. I thought it was a different approach for that problem. Regarding the fluid: there is not much room for sloshing in the tiny pipe behind the valve. Elevation works much better for that because fluids will never slosh vertically. So I always put the fluid buffer higher than the fluid platform for export and lower for import. I'm usually using 1 platform per MK2 pipe and get consistent 1200m3 pm fill rates with this, zero sloshing. Btw I love your content and your designs, altough I not always agree with your tutorials. I guess they are usually not for someone like me with 1500h in game, who has seen it all :-).
Why would you even do all that? Just keep shipping in resources, eventually everything will be full and the train will only be capable of delivering at the exact rate it was consumed by the factory. If you're worried about sinking excess, do that with smart splitters after production and before the export stations.
Sushi Train! I like the idea, somewhat. Perhaps in early to mid train stage, where you may not have enough factories to justify a single full train of 1-4 materials. It may also help manage energy consumption later in game as you have fractional train needs distributed among multiple modular factories on different sides of the map. Quicker for regional loops vs everything making a full map tour. This reminds me a lit of Stin Archi's remote control storage, which uses a more advanced technique...
Ah clever. Thought that might be the case. Prefilling a drop off with junk. I have a use case of two factories that supply just 1 product to 4 freight loaders. I want only some of them to be offloaded and/or only some to fill up. Not sure how to do that unless I keep some train cars with junk in them that never unloads. Can't do that with the fluid ones, though. Would be nice if we had a blank train car.
@@aresivrc1800 No. in this use case the supply stations have 4 platforms to provide the same product. So Load only will happily load all 4. There is no way to say just load 1 or 2 platforms. Its worked out by having two trains. One for the coal (which also provides 4 platforms) and one for aluminum solution. I simply don't ever unload the back half of the aluminum train and don't unload the front half of the coal train. The pickup station has 2 for coal and 2 for solution.
The station slot limiting trick is about as hacky as it gets, and is also a testament to how things have to change. Of course what we really need is a system akin to the LTN mod for Factorio, but I don't really see that happening.
This is my main gripe with Satisfactory. No end game logistics. Why can't they implement a system where I have multiple sending and receiving stations, train wait at a buffer stations and either wait for sending station to have enough materials to fully fill the train or wait for receiving station to fully empty a train? Or any kind of logic. Right now the train just goes in a loop. Basic logic should be way higher priority than all the aesthetics they have implemented as of late... I hope it will be the main theme of Update 8...
Lol, Now I see the solution to feeding trains efficient with fluid buffers. I thought it wouldn‘t be possible because even the industrial fluid buffer has only one input and one output. But obviously I was too fixed to the solution with solid items and the double output method of the industrial container. It looks like out of the box thinking is more viable :P thx for the vid.
Dont know when this was posted, but saving what a freight car picks up takes two save clicks. one in the menu and one on the time table... not the X it wont save if you use the X
Interesting. I'm not sure if i'll ever use the 1rst tip. Since i'm someone that likes well compartimented things but that's clever. For the second tip, i was already aware of that. But it's nice to tell it so people not aware of it are.
can you do this with trucks? i would love to have fuel truck set up that goes be each vehicle station to fill up the fuel with out taking all the cargo fuel out of the truck?
If only the developers just built this logic into the game. *mind blown*. You shouldn't have to play games like this. Just allow us to program trains to drop 2 stacks off here, and 4 stacks there, and 6 stacks there.
I've been having a similar problem to the train station unloading selection not saving, but with programmable splitters. They only save the list you make part of the time, and even if the list saves the splitter ignores most of the items you tell it to split out and sends them on down the line anyway. Frustrating.
1 smart splitter per trainstation won't affect much. If you have a huge storage facility, those may have 100 smart splitters to sort all your items into the proper containers when you feed the items mixed up on multiple MK5 conveyors. Even such a sorter doesn't affect the game much.
i have an issue with trains going through red signals. any idea? i was thinking spacing but i tried to balance that out by making the signal spacing as long as the train my train has 3 engines front and back and 8 cars.
@@TotalXclipse yes red and it was a block signal i have a massive track that goes around the map but one station is very busy there are only 4 trains active the rest i put in sidings since this update, they just slow down and proceed into the next train at the station. oh one of the other stations which was designed after watching your videos has two by pass tracks in the middle and the stations on the side platform 1 allows the train to dock and unload then the train gets stuck in dock loop where i have to get in and press F but it will dock and not go any further till i manually drive the train off the platform the other station does not do it and there identical so i swapping the station and will test that, strangeness. maybe i need to do a fresh map as i not done that in so many updates. Just fixed the chaos lol.
Why making fluid buffer this complicated when you can use two fluid buffers for each output/imput of train station and just split one pipe into two ? im doing it this way.
You can fill your train carts with mostly something else (eg; Biofuel) and leave a few empty slots. Then loading the train only grabs a few stacks to fill those slots. You can still only carry the one limited item though. I use this for a "Home Delivery" train that goes around and grabs a bit of everything to top up my home storage hub.
@@Ruby_Mochii When you edit a Train's timetable, you can specify which goods to Unload at the destination, and it leaves everything else in there. So if you fill it with something you'll never deliver (Biofuel), and always specify what to Unload, the filler will stay there. Note: I'm still on Update 5 - from TotalXclipse's video, it looks like the Timetable settings are bugged in Update 6.
1. Take a chill pill Leapin. You are wording this like TotalXclipse has any control over this. 2. This is still Early Access and trains are probably going to get another update before the game goes 1.0. 3. Go recommend feedback to the devs.
@@StellarisIgnis None of my words mention TotalXclipse or him having anything to do with this game deficiency. It's simply two statements of fact; Early Access or not they are both true. 1. He did find a cleaver solution. 2. This should already be a game feature.
sorry but yet again here we are in a very complicated way trying to circumvent a very poorly designed train logistics system by coffee stain....i mean kudos for ideas bud love your videos and content its second to none as always. But that said i think your energy on the trains logistics would be better spent lobbying Coffee Stain to just overhaul the logistics and give more granular control over movement of goods. there are countless things you can do to instantly make trains better without the silly load/unload pause which just causes diminishing returns the more and more you use trains....its completely pointless and actually game breaking for me. i think we should push for a train overhaul. im tired of taking an already tedious numbers game and making it worse with trains......
The goods are loaded/unloaded into the container, which is lifted out of the input/output section of the station while loading/unloading the train. How could you load/unload something that's hanging in mid-air via a conveyor that's dozens of meters away and not even connected to the container at that time? I think the pause is justified.
So what do you think? Will you be using this technique for future factories?
I have a much simpler way of getting this done in my factories that works for fluids too.
All of the first stations are designed to fully fill their buffers and storage. Once that's done, everything will only fill at the exact rate the stations manufacturing consumes whether it's for fluids or items. The last station is an overflow station. Once it's buffers are full, everything else sinks so the train always leaves empty. Another option I use for shared lines is a dedicated sink station. Everything outputs with Max belts or pipes directly into sinks to ensure trains are empty and everything at every location is running at 100%. Either use a fluid sink mod for fluid stations or packager if you want to sink most non water fluids
An additional tip,
Example from fluid lines for instance.
I have 6 stations that fill oil haulers and 3 that consume.
I hit all of the fill stations first, and the last, #6 in this case, is set to fill the train fully before leaving. It has a buffer for 1 additional train to wait before entering the station without blocking the main line since it's a spur. When configured this way, you add trains until there is always one and only one waiting in the buffer and you'll guarantee every train going through is 100% filled and that the rate for each station is identical. No backups no shenanigans. Plus you never have too many or too few trains
I see that first tip being useful if one is using a central smelting or bulk manufacturing of more basic parts setup(s).
@@pauljacobi340 that's more or less exactly what it is.
I have 4 oil facilities. One does crude to turbo fuel. One plastic. One rubber. And something else don't remember. By dropping to each facility it doesn't really matter what it goes to, it's always rate limited once all buffers are full to exactly what each location needs, then it dumps perfectly to the sink station
It may be useful for very little factories, but, even without going the whole min/max route, i find myself using whole trains for a single resource and transporting in huge quantities, sometimes having multiple trains for the same item.
For higher tier items it can be useful though. But i wouldn't use overflow with smart splitters. They always let the odd unselected item pass by and block everything unless that has been fixed.
Where i have to use that technique i always chain two smart splitters. One to do what you explained, and a second on the exit belt to filter a second time the rare hiccups.
man i wish the trains were more intuitive to use because they're very cool and powerful. this sort of functionality should be built in
If they would just implement a configurable storage box limit we wouldn't need to resort to such CPU-cycle-eating workarounds.
Or simply the option for a train to only unload a specific amount of an item. Or some kind of conveyor that limits the throughput of items to a specific amount
use mk1 conveyor to decrease the speed at which the last stacks number flickers to help w cpu
interesting but for multiple factories i just let the incoming buffers saturate and do not have an issue with just using the existing mechanic where it just unloads the whole container because the container from the train will only deposit enough to fill the buffer so once everything is saturated then then the remainder will continue to the next factory and every factory in the chain is able to use as much as it needs. actually I like this method better because if the train arrives back to a distribution center completely empty then that means the factories are pulling more then it can provide so I either need another train on that line or build more factories providing that particular resource to the distribution. your method moves this issue to the individual factories and requires more micromanaging to catch. the simple way that I use is a nice indicator of how well the system as a whole is working as it keeps all the debugging at the distribution centers where supply chain issues are easier to catch as you can monitor many things at one or two locations.
I like the first tip. We need to do it like that, because we don't have a set of how many stacks we want the train to fill. Hope they add so we can say to the train, how many stacks we want the train to fill. Like we can in Factorio.
I can't program but I have an idea, of where this could be in the UI. (
This is such a huge revelation for me. This answers so many issues I have been facing
There are a few tutorials on trains throughout youtube but for some reason, none of them cover how to integrate everything together. It would be really nice to see a video showing the actual usage of them and how they benefit linking everything together. I have almost 800 hours on this game and never really used them to this point because I always seem to get super confused as to how to link everything together via the trains. Every now and then I will setup a train to bring raw ore to a factory to smelt and process but then I get all twisted up as to how to extend the train line to bring those components somewhere else without stuff getting all mixed up in the train stations. I have seen a couple somewhat informative videos on some of the functions but still havent really seen anything showing how to start expanding it and using it for more than just 1 production facility. I just started a new playthrough and I am currently grinding through the 2nd tier of the elevator to get to the trains but once I get there, I want to completely tear everything down and start anew with trains for everything and just figure it out as I go. I would like to get 1 hub in each zone that has trucks or train lines that do nothing but gather ore and bring it to the hub, then 1 rail line going through each zone bringing it all to my main factory that I will build somewhere in the center of the map. I think my biggest confusion is should you have 1 train for each production line and 1 car per train designated to each type of ore/ product or is it best to just mix it all together and use sorters on the other end to get it where it needs to go? Every time I have decided to try building trains, it just turns into a mess and I go back to trucks or long belts but it just looks like a disaster...
The way I do it is 1 train per production factory, and 1 car per product, with a timetable for that train to deliver to each other factory that needs those items. I tend to have 2 stations per factory, each 2-3 platforms long, with one station for incoming required components, and one station for outgoing. I'm not doing any massive production yet, so 1 car per product has been fine so far.
If you deliver more than required to the destination and DON'T sink the excess, then the train will drop off just what's required, and you can go to multiple destinations in a row - otherwise you can go back and forth between the source station for a top-up before going to each destination for delivery.
eg; My Quartz factory has a 3-car train carrying Silica, Quartz and Crystal Oscillators, which goes to each other factory station that requires any of those and unloads. A train from my Plastics factory drops off Rubber, and another train from a Quickwire/AI factory drops off AI Limiters, as input to make the Crystal Oscillators.
I also have a "Home Delivery" train which is mostly full of junk (eg; biofuel), which goes to each production station and grabs a few stacks of everything, to drop off at my home hub, which sorts everything into containers and sinks the rest.
@@dortamur2634 ty for that, ive been thinking too big and couldnt let go. One train per factory, one car per item, pass those trains onto wherever any of those items are needed, and let all the items stack up so the train has enough to feed multiple factories
@@dortamur2634 but like for example, if you have 1 train with 4 different cars, the delivery platforms have to be the same setup essentially for every stop unless you are using smart splitter to sort it where its going right? That has been one of my bigger hurdles is trying to figure out how to setup all the platforms so everything is mirrored across all the production lines. So if car 1 has iron plates and car 2 has screws, the platforms need to match anywhere the train goes correct?
@@Tacomaguy458 Yes, that's correct. You do need a little thought and planning although I've managed to get lucky with minimal clashes with mostly 2-3 car trains. If you're retrofitting existing factories you could plan it all out on paper. I do have one factory that had 2x3 platform delivery stations to receive 3 items due to a clash that I was too lazy to shuffle around - but I then expanded the factory to build more things and extra deliverables matched up to the unused platforms - lucky again. 😅
You could use smart-splitters to accept different things on one platform and reshuffle things into separate buffer containers, but you'd need a Sink to get rid of any overflow, otherwise one item could block delivery of another. You need to be more careful with production, consumption and route times then if you're delivering one item to two stations, so one station doesn't soak up and sink product the next one needs - although if one has a dedicated platform, you could deliver to that first, then the excess to the one with the buffer and sink.
You could also make a Shuffle Depot anywhere with some space with 2 stations, where you dump into one delivery platform, shuffle it across to a different pickup platform, and time the train stop at the drop-off long enough for everything to be moved across, then pick up. I've not tried this though, and it could be a bottleneck if multiple trains use it. Hmmm. I might give this a go next time I have a platform clash. 🤔
The other possible thing to do to fix a delivery platform clash if you have space is just add another platform at each and and make your train longer. However, you'd have to update all delivery stations to use the new additional platform too. if you split generated items into 2 platforms at the source station the timetable doesn't differentiate between platforms when you say to Load, so it would load from both platforms and unload both at the destination.
If you use the "only load certain items" and "only unload certain items" you can get far. Keep in mind that trains and train stations have to be in the same order for items matching up.
I use an excel spreadsheet like this:
Train Iron Train
Locomotive
1st car = Iron Plates
2nd car = Iron Rods
3rd car = Screws
4th car = Reinforced Iron Plates
5th car = Rotor
Locomotive 2
Station 1:
Train Station
Freight Station 1= Iron Plates
Freight Station 2 = Iron Rods
Freight Station 3 = Screws
Freight Station 4 = Reinforced Iron Plates
Freight Station 5 = Rotor
Empty Platform (not necessary)
So, if you want a train to only unload the 3rd car with screws, you can build a destination station like this
Train Station
Empty Platform
Empty Platform
Freight Station 3 = Screws
Empty Platform (not necessary)
Empty Platform (not necessary)
Empty Platform (not necessary)
By using the filter settings you can however also commend a train to only unload screws which it will do at the right station, assuming you have followed the excel sheet and have made sure that the 3rd car contains screws.
@TotalXclipse You really should do a video about train filtering and train loading and unloading logic (one load/unload has been completed / wait for X seconds, only when train is fully loaded /empty. :-)
To add to the second one, if you have multiple freight platforms at the station you can add additional Mk 5 belt inputs. For example, if you have 2 platforms you could have 3 Mk 3 belts going in, with the third split between the two platforms (as inputs to the storage bins). The capacity limit is determined by how much time the train spends loading, so if you have trains visiting more regularly (like if the route is short or you have multiple trains on the route), you have less time to load the station. However, as long as the station is clear at least 3/4 of the time (which it usually would be) you can have 3 belts going in. If you have 3 platforms it could accommodate 5 Mk5 belts. And of course, if you want to really maximise the throughput you could use some lower tier belts, as long as you've got enough time to load it.
Materials with larger stacks don't need servicing with trains as often, so you could capitalise on this to get the throughput pretty close to 2 Mk 5 belts per platform.
Mixed on this, I prefer to have a dedicated train per destination that just stays there off the main track until unloaded, that provides more consistent output and reduces tension on the train network. Essentially only full trains ever run.
If you set it up like this, you will always have a consistent output and you'll be using less trains as one train can feed multiple stations depending on the amount of resources needed. Dedicated lines are a safe bet though and much easier to setup if you're concerned 😊
@@TotalXclipse This looks like a really clunky solution for a problem that Factorio solved by simply allowing stations to shut down on condition. CS could simply add a "close station when full"-slider to the ui.
I know that wouldn't necessarily solve this particular issue and I really love Satisfactory, but the train logistics system in the game is lacking so many comfort features in it's current iteration, that you kinda have to either built 1 train per route or do weird work-arounds like this.
But we'll have to wait for an overhaul, I is in early access after all.
@@esprit101 Doesn't seem to be much better even in 1.0 release tbh...
150 hours in and I love trains, still haven't messed with them lol. This is definitely inspiring. Thanks for sharing the content.
Got the tracks and got the smarts. All aboard!!
It would be cool if you could use the stickers on the trains, or signs also would be cool
Thanks for this!! I was wondering how to limit things at a station, and didn't see a way in the stations themselves.. Brilliant! 😎😎
You can supply multiple stops if you know the trains max storage per container and its output/input, so if you have a train fully fill with iron at its start then offload you can set the wait time as (Maxstorage/Number of Stops)/throughput = time needed at each stop. where fillup is the same without number of stops unless you have multiple pickup locations. you dont need to fill it with quartz
I have a much simpler way of getting this done in my factories that works for fluids too.
All of the first stations are designed to fully fill their buffers and storage. Once that's done, everything will only fill at the exact rate the stations manufacturing consumes whether it's for fluids or items. The last station is an overflow station. Once it's buffers are full, everything else sinks so the train always leaves empty. Another option I use for shared lines is a dedicated sink station. Everything outputs with Max belts or pipes directly into sinks to ensure trains are empty and everything at every location is running at 100%. Either use a fluid sink mod for fluid stations or packager if you want to sink most non water fluids
That only works for single item type cars. The system shown is useful for mixed cars, which save a lot of trains and platforms and belts.
@@MrFaerine not anymore. You can set specific items for delivery or loading on every train to boot
@@MrFaerine How would this system work for different items? unless you have some impressive way of forcing an exact load order into your station, things are gonna get mixed up, and as soon as you unload a stack of the wrong item, your system is broken.
@@Nevir202 the load order is the same as the order in the station when picking up and you can force any item ratio with mergers, they work round robin.
I always use terminating sinks in my mixed belt setups (usually after my storage room with sorters) so it is not possible that it clogs permanently. It will fix itself and sink the excess of wrong items, but some machines might temporarily not receive enough input.
You are right however that this setup is likely unstable and prone to disturbance by different train round trip times if you want to drop of multiple different items. The more reliable solution I am actually using is receiving all mixed items, resorting them in single item containers and limiting each containers output to the needed rate before mixing again. Any overflow can be send forth with a second mixed car, or any other means of logistics at the other end of the factory. This is still way smaller than using one platform per item.
@@MrFaerine Ratio? Sure, but you need to control EXACTLY what items are in which slot in the train's inventory, I don't see any way to do that.
Unless, like you say, you're just fine with getting a random mess, and hashing it out after the fact and dumping the excess.
Funny seeing this, as I spent all night getting machine failures because I would once in a while get rubber on my plastic line and start clogging machines.
It was so rare that I kept thinking it was a random stack that got in the mix somewhere, and just kept draining the line and going back to building, only to look back to broken machines.
Finally I grabbed the train, all the way back to the far side of the map, and found that in my super petrol factory, 2 of the 44 machines making plastic, were actually making rubber.
But as I was sinking excess before the station, nothing even happened for hours, till I got unlucky enough that rubber was on the belt at the right moment to avoid the sink, AND get into a position in the inventory where it was picked up by the train.
Kinda made me wish I was doing what you're saying and running mixed cargo, as the filters would automatically un-hose the issue. But on the other hand, if I were, doing, that I'd have never found out that my factory was set up wrong lol.
@7:32 What is a cubic litre? Litre is already a volume. So why are we cubing a volume?
He should have said cubic meters instead of cubic litres.
Appreciate all the train videos! I understand the basic usage, but am struggling on how to time them, I guess? Like, if I want to take a product from one spot to another, how much of the product actually needs to get moved to keep the factory at the end working? Do I need to get out a stopwatch, or is there something simpler that I've missed?
Thanks. This is why I never really messed with trains (when it comes to logistics). Because I feel I have to time out throughput + train speed/distance to keep machines happy with a steady input. And that's not fun to do at all.
That's why I feel long belts are more reliable, as they'll always provide the same throughput at all times, then hoping the train will deliver what they need in time. But please correct me if I'm wrong.
It just seems to me you have to make double (or triple) than what the machine wants, to ensure this (instead of what you set the machines to). Yet this isn't always possible.
Causes unnecessary stress.
none of this would be necessary if they made train logic actually good
It's clever for sure, but one thing I do not understand.
Once the system is saturated, each station will only take as much as was used.
However, that will require patience until saturation.
Is this time difference the only gain?
Cool idea on how to force deliveries of limited stacks... I think I'll just stick with dumping everything in, till the buffer has filled up and it overflows to the next one. 😛
A few comments:
1. fluids cannot flow out of pipe inputs, the valves are unnecessary.
2. There is no need to build a pipe overflow, just connect a buffered pipe to both inputs. Use 2 pipes and a large buffer higher than the platform for max throughput, about 600 m3 per min is possible per car.
3. instead of limiting the number of stacks dropped off (no fine throughput control with varying round trip times) I can recommend limiting the output belt from the train station ISC buffer to the exact amount the factory is consuming. Much easier to calculate and the only way to get 100% efficiency, just might need a few splitters and mergers for wierd input numbers off from belt tier speeds. Sometimes its just easier to route back overflow to the train station in a full loop to send it along the line after production.
Fluid slops back and fourth in pipes, not so much about it flowing out of an input but going back along the pipe once the input is filled. - if you use valves you control the directional flow.
As for limiting the output belt of the train station you can do that as well, but if you don't fill a station with stacks the train will fill up that station first, then the next one's. So by filling it with different stacks all your factories will be able to receive items from the get go, but as you mention you could use an overflow to another train station, but for that you'd need an extra freight station, which will use a lot more space for no reason. 😊
@@TotalXclipse no i meant the overflow can go back to the same train station. The overflow will fill it faster and compensate the difference between the real needed amount and the next higher belt speed on the output for easier setup. So your setup is only meant for slowing down the total fill and not needed in steady state, right? I use the limiting for my mixed belts factories, because overflow will be sinked otherwise to keep belts moving. So I have to control output rates. I thought it was a different approach for that problem.
Regarding the fluid: there is not much room for sloshing in the tiny pipe behind the valve. Elevation works much better for that because fluids will never slosh vertically. So I always put the fluid buffer higher than the fluid platform for export and lower for import. I'm usually using 1 platform per MK2 pipe and get consistent 1200m3 pm fill rates with this, zero sloshing.
Btw I love your content and your designs, altough I not always agree with your tutorials. I guess they are usually not for someone like me with 1500h in game, who has seen it all :-).
Why would you even do all that? Just keep shipping in resources, eventually everything will be full and the train will only be capable of delivering at the exact rate it was consumed by the factory.
If you're worried about sinking excess, do that with smart splitters after production and before the export stations.
Sushi Train! I like the idea, somewhat. Perhaps in early to mid train stage, where you may not have enough factories to justify a single full train of 1-4 materials. It may also help manage energy consumption later in game as you have fractional train needs distributed among multiple modular factories on different sides of the map. Quicker for regional loops vs everything making a full map tour. This reminds me a lit of Stin Archi's remote control storage, which uses a more advanced technique...
Ah clever. Thought that might be the case. Prefilling a drop off with junk.
I have a use case of two factories that supply just 1 product to 4 freight loaders. I want only some of them to be offloaded and/or only some to fill up. Not sure how to do that unless I keep some train cars with junk in them that never unloads.
Can't do that with the fluid ones, though.
Would be nice if we had a blank train car.
Using filters "Load only" and "unload only" does not work for your problem?
@@aresivrc1800 No. in this use case the supply stations have 4 platforms to provide the same product. So Load only will happily load all 4. There is no way to say just load 1 or 2 platforms.
Its worked out by having two trains. One for the coal (which also provides 4 platforms) and one for aluminum solution. I simply don't ever unload the back half of the aluminum train and don't unload the front half of the coal train. The pickup station has 2 for coal and 2 for solution.
The station slot limiting trick is about as hacky as it gets, and is also a testament to how things have to change.
Of course what we really need is a system akin to the LTN mod for Factorio, but I don't really see that happening.
YE$$$ Give me the LTN Mod in Satisfactory!!! Whoever makes that happen will have my gratitude for all of time!
Nice explanation of the train logistic systems.
is truck station is more efficient or the conveyors for far distances? (ores or material)
I find trucks to be a hassle to setup properly, and even then, they have a few quicks. I don't use them anymore, only conveyors, belts and drones.
This is my main gripe with Satisfactory. No end game logistics. Why can't they implement a system where I have multiple sending and receiving stations, train wait at a buffer stations and either wait for sending station to have enough materials to fully fill the train or wait for receiving station to fully empty a train? Or any kind of logic. Right now the train just goes in a loop. Basic logic should be way higher priority than all the aesthetics they have implemented as of late... I hope it will be the main theme of Update 8...
you, sir, are a genius!
Lol, Now I see the solution to feeding trains efficient with fluid buffers.
I thought it wouldn‘t be possible because even the industrial fluid buffer has only one input and one output.
But obviously I was too fixed to the solution with solid items and the double output method of the industrial container.
It looks like out of the box thinking is more viable :P
thx for the vid.
Dont know when this was posted, but saving what a freight car picks up takes two save clicks. one in the menu and one on the time table... not the X it wont save if you use the X
Idk if its only this video or what but rhe only video quality is 360p or 1080 enhanced but you need youtube premium
Man I hope 1.0 has a "leave just 2 stacks" function on trucks and trains...
Interesting.
I'm not sure if i'll ever use the 1rst tip. Since i'm someone that likes well compartimented things but that's clever.
For the second tip, i was already aware of that. But it's nice to tell it so people not aware of it are.
thats smart. we use this in mincraft to make item sorters
can you do this with trucks? i would love to have fuel truck set up that goes be each vehicle station to fill up the fuel with out taking all the cargo fuel out of the truck?
If only the developers just built this logic into the game. *mind blown*. You shouldn't have to play games like this. Just allow us to program trains to drop 2 stacks off here, and 4 stacks there, and 6 stacks there.
I've been having a similar problem to the train station unloading selection not saving, but with programmable splitters. They only save the list you make part of the time, and even if the list saves the splitter ignores most of the items you tell it to split out and sends them on down the line anyway. Frustrating.
I wonder whether that smart splitter loop at the unload station kills the performance of the game.
1 smart splitter per trainstation won't affect much. If you have a huge storage facility, those may have 100 smart splitters to sort all your items into the proper containers when you feed the items mixed up on multiple MK5 conveyors. Even such a sorter doesn't affect the game much.
I had NO IDEA you could click on the "OR" to make it an "AND"...
Can experimental update 6 applicable to ficsit mods?
i have an issue with trains going through red signals. any idea? i was thinking spacing but i tried to balance that out by making the signal spacing as long as the train my train has 3 engines front and back and 8 cars.
Are the red lights on block signals or path signals
@@TotalXclipse yes red and it was a block signal i have a massive track that goes around the map but one station is very busy there are only 4 trains active the rest i put in sidings since this update, they just slow down and proceed into the next train at the station. oh one of the other stations which was designed after watching your videos has two by pass tracks in the middle and the stations on the side platform 1 allows the train to dock and unload then the train gets stuck in dock loop where i have to get in and press F but it will dock and not go any further till i manually drive the train off the platform the other station does not do it and there identical so i swapping the station and will test that, strangeness. maybe i need to do a fresh map as i not done that in so many updates. Just fixed the chaos lol.
Why making fluid buffer this complicated when you can use two fluid buffers for each output/imput of train station and just split one pipe into two ? im doing it this way.
OK BUT WHAT ABOUT THE CRATES?!?! :P
🤣
this should be built in to the station them self
Like let's just unload half of the cart or something
Ive still not found any use for trains, trucks, drone, etc. Conveyor belts are just better lol
Wait.. so this is how it's done for the receiving factory but how about limiting the one leaving the factory?
Hmm you might be able to pick just one item in the train station sending items, but really we need to wait until the system is patched on u6
@@TotalXclipse I'm currently waiting for U6 to release on EA 😭 I still encounter some minor bugs even.
You can fill your train carts with mostly something else (eg; Biofuel) and leave a few empty slots. Then loading the train only grabs a few stacks to fill those slots. You can still only carry the one limited item though.
I use this for a "Home Delivery" train that goes around and grabs a bit of everything to top up my home storage hub.
@@dortamur2634 would you have to manually fill the train with fillers every time it delivers everything? Or how do you prevent the filler from that?
@@Ruby_Mochii When you edit a Train's timetable, you can specify which goods to Unload at the destination, and it leaves everything else in there. So if you fill it with something you'll never deliver (Biofuel), and always specify what to Unload, the filler will stay there.
Note: I'm still on Update 5 - from TotalXclipse's video, it looks like the Timetable settings are bugged in Update 6.
Yeah OK you are ALL Math chads ... but hey can you make it less choppy?
Cubic litres lol.
Sorry, but you have found a clever solution to a game deficiency; the game should already have this feature...
1. Take a chill pill Leapin. You are wording this like TotalXclipse has any control over this.
2. This is still Early Access and trains are probably going to get another update before the game goes 1.0.
3. Go recommend feedback to the devs.
@@StellarisIgnis None of my words mention TotalXclipse or him having anything to do with this game deficiency. It's simply two statements of fact; Early Access or not they are both true.
1. He did find a cleaver solution.
2. This should already be a game feature.
Is update 6 out?
It is to experimental. Not yet to early access
@@TotalXclipse aw man :(
Definitely 2nd
Meh, used that for tracks on u5
sorry but yet again here we are in a very complicated way trying to circumvent a very poorly designed train logistics system by coffee stain....i mean kudos for ideas bud love your videos and content its second to none as always.
But that said i think your energy on the trains logistics would be better spent lobbying Coffee Stain to just overhaul the logistics and give more granular control over movement of goods. there are countless things you can do to instantly make trains better without the silly load/unload pause which just causes diminishing returns the more and more you use trains....its completely pointless and actually game breaking for me.
i think we should push for a train overhaul. im tired of taking an already tedious numbers game and making it worse with trains......
The goods are loaded/unloaded into the container, which is lifted out of the input/output section of the station while loading/unloading the train. How could you load/unload something that's hanging in mid-air via a conveyor that's dozens of meters away and not even connected to the container at that time? I think the pause is justified.
Maybe first