Started reading through The Beast and loving it so far. Really appreciate the effort Dane puts in every year. Related question - how does a report in The Beast compare to what NFL scouts share with their respective teams?
I finished the bulk of my evaluation on McCormick yesterday. I know what Dane’s talking about with some of struggles he has, especially at the 2nd level (but not just the 2nd level). There’s definitely some tightness moving laterally but to me it was less a case of some extremely stiff athlete being asked to do stuff he’s not capable of doing than a guy who plays a little too fast and out of control and consequently took a ton of bad angles. He’s also a guy that has an extremely annoying habit of dipping his head really early and not being able to see what he’s supposed to be hitting. And I think that’s where the discrepancy between what you saw on tape and what you saw at the Shrine Bowl and the Combine really is. He didn’t suddenly go from a super stiff athlete to a historically great athlete in the month between the season’s end and the Shrine Bowl. That’s literally not a thing that’s possible. And there are reps where, when he’s dialed in with his angles and he keeps his eyes up (you can’t hit what you can’t see, young man) that it looks really good, e.g. some of the stuff vs 2023 NDSU. But yeah, I don’t think the tape is particularly good overall. And he especially struggled against Logan Lee and Iowa, which was definitely the best competition he faced in college. People talk a lot about his nasty and he does have some of that in him. But way too often he’s content to just try to shove guys out of the way instead of really using his hands to lock on and drive guys off the ball. I haven’t decided on a final grade but some of the day 2 stuff I’m hearing I think is really rich. Basically it comes down to do you ever think this guy becomes a capable starter and I just don’t see it based on his college tape. Maybe if you’re really patient and you have a really good O line coach but for me it’s later in day 3 I’d be willing to take that chance
Good segment. yay draft soon...Darius Robinson would be a great 3rd round pick for DeMeco if he's there. He's got that rotational multiple position thing going on...DeMeco uses a heavy DL rotation.
By far the best show I’ve seen. Especially learning how rare it is to get a rookie OT to be an impact day one. Crazy that these guys are going so high and won’t even be starting day one. I’d rather wait later and develop a guy like Goncalves. Unless it’s Joe Alt or JC Latham.
What do you see in JC Latham? I see elite anchor with his size and strength to neutralize a bull rush, but slow get-off and subpar feet, awareness, and athleticism to hold up at OT. At the end of the day I see him as a pass blocking G. For me lower upside like the discussion of Fuaga in the podcast.
@kylebrandt8344 You didn't ask me, but I see a giant who will be one of the 2 or 3 biggest guys on the field in every game. Huge hands and long arms. He has an amazing base and lower half strength, similar to Olu imo. Neither is necessarily quick or "light on their feet" but they move properly, end up in the right spots, and rarely get beat. Both easy 1st round grades for me.
@@FantasySportsZen I agree with everything you said. People need to realize that this is still the draft. There is NO sure thing ever. You have to go on tape, measurables, character, upside, and gut feeling.
Top 7 backs for me are all clustered very closely: Lloyd, Corrum if he’s the guy from 2022, Benson, Allen, Estime, Brooks, Corrum if he’s the guy we saw last year, Wright. I can’t rate Allen higher because of the speed and agility concerns - I was wrong on AJ Dillon. But I love that kid’s game and I don’t think he’s being properly evaluated. I see a player with borderline elite power, good make-you-miss feet, good vision and feel, violence in short yardage, surprisingly good hands, and upside in pass protection. The issue is that he is def a build-up speed guy. Zero concerns with his physicality. Iowa, Illinois, Purdue games solidified that. And honestly, even the Buffalo game has value - what does it look like when he’s running free into the second level? The answer is he breaks a ton of tackles and can surprise guys if they take bad angles. We will see. 3rd/4th round player to me.
@@Joeypots I thought he was just okay as an LT in college. I'd encourage you to watch him vs. FSU. Don't get me wrong, it's not a disaster, he's too technically sound for that, but he had a hard time with Verse's speed-to-power. And it's not just that game. He was a solid college tackle playing mostly against middling competition, but he has some warts on tape, he doesn't have great length or an elite anchor. To me his best position is probably center, but he also can thrive as a guard in a zone scheme where his movement skills can shine. I love Barton, but I don't see him playing tackle in the league. But hey, one never knows!
@@smyers9052 I’ll check out some more games. Great points. This is why you guys are the best. And I agree, he’s best at center. I’m praying the Dolphins get him. Hoping we can trade down for a pick but stay close enough to grab him.
@@Joeypots Well to be clear I’m just a guy who does this for fun, don’t want you to think I speak for the channel. I love discussing this stuff though, having an opinion is what makes it fun. Just glad most of these tape cut ups are available on YT
Darius Robinson. Elite 5-tech/4i prospect. Might be a great 3 in the right scheme. Absolutely outstanding run game player. To me this is a 1st round player. Watch him vs Georgia. Outstanding tape all year. Base end in a 4-3, but regardless put him at 3 or 4 in nickel and let him go. I saw plenty of quick wins on tape. Not an elite pass rusher but he has some outstanding reps, not just a cleanup player. As for tweeners, I mean he isn’t a tweener. He’s built like a classic big end/5-tech. Arik Armstead, Calais Campbell, Stephon Tuitt…the idea that there isn’t a track record of power players with great length and nearly 300 pounds of mass succeeding at a high rate in the NFL Is just incorrect. If Robinson were a guy who didn’t test well, constantly tried to win with finesse and were playing in the 275-280 range, okay. But he played heavier than he weighed in for combine, carries that weight easily, and has the length, mass, and play style to thrive in today’s hybrid environment. Versatility is not a knock.
I love Braelon Allen. I think the physicality is shockingly underrated. I strongly disagree that he doesn’t run with power. This is one of those, “I’d love to watch this film with you and understand” situations. Does he dance at times? Sure, but that’s often effective, and he will make people miss. I honestly think that people see him use finesse and then just miss the violent finishes that are all over the tape. Go watch that Iowa game and tell me he isn’t running with power, go ask the Buffalo defense how they felt after that game. Hell, they rode him against the Illini and a ton of that was grinding out tough yards. He and Estime are the best short yardage players in the class. As for scheme, he was best in a gap scheme prior to this year. I
Chop is Third Down pass Rusher to me. Ohio State crumpled him in run game. Crazy fast against pass. But what you do on run downs ????????????? Could be another Micah great vs pass Rush bad vs run
Conner as a comp for Allen is good. I think Conner was more refined coming out, but the body type and tools are similar. I do think Allen has higher upside and a lower floor. Again though- disagree on physicality
I would love to hear what you guys think of Patrick Paul. Watching the tape he looks great. He’s huge and athletic. I don’t understand why the value in him going mid to late 2nd round. As a Dolphins fan, I love the idea of taking Haynes somewhere around 35-40, Paul at 55 and Roman Wilson or Rickey Pearsall in the 3rd with a pick we get from trading down from 21.
Patrick Paul is raw. Elite upside with bottomless floor. He doesnt play to the ceiling of his length at the moment. Him going as high as he is going is with the assumption you can tap into his ability to use his length
Remember this name Zack Zinter was my Guard 1 Michigan but broke 2 bones 🦴 late in year vs Ohio State. You grab him in round 3 great value !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even if he needs a redshirt year.
Cedric Gray is good in coverage, but man...he isn't just okay in the run game, he is a liability. But I can understand overdrafting based on coverage potential. I just remember him throwing his hands in the air, missing tackles, and generally looking confused and angry in that UVA game. Lack of physicality is not sustainable at LB, even in today's game. But size is there, and he will flash some violence at times. Just depends on what he wants to be I guess.
@@dangilbert9678there’s a little bit of stiffness in the stop-start. Also, only average length for the position despite being a bigger body corner. I still think he’ll be able to hold up outside in a zone heavy scheme with his combination of instincts, physicality and ball skills. Just not the guy you want to leave on an island to play press against the Jamaar Chases of the world.
I don't have a lot of pet peeves, but have a completely irrational hate for when people say a RB with a lot of career carries "they have a lot of TREAD on their tires". NO! They have a lot of "wear". They have a lot tread on their tires when they DON'T have a lot of career carries. Unless the RB is Frank Gore or Derrick Henry...then I guess they can have both.
Don’t Sleeper on Oklahoma LT Walter Rouse played 3 years at Stanford then Transferred to Oklahoma why didn’t Guyton play LT ?????????????????????? Great Day 3 value LT Walter Rouse
Fascinating. I don’t think Barton can play tackle. FSU tape is damning to me. Fuaga has similarities with Iupati but he doesn’t have the same pass pro issues that Mike did. I think there’s a chance he can play tackle, but I strongly believe he’s best at guard. Reminds me of Tevin Jenkins.
Man I just can’t disagree more on Fuaga. I think he’s going to be a quality RT. I even understand what these guys see as his negatives, but I don’t think it’s anywhere near enough of a detriment they make it out to be. I won’t even argue he might make for an even better guard, but I’m confident he can be a quality RT in this league. Fuaga and Fautanu both getting over scouted and nit picked to death. I know without question Fuaga could come in and be the best RT the Steelers have had in a decade, even if he’s isn’t an all pro
What was B.Allen in January y'all I actually watched another show you had an 1 of you had Maye at his qb #1 which that guy is actually a very smart person... if Maye was on any top 20 college team... with nfl players on the offensive side with him... anyways Allen is clearly the best NFL rb prospect we've seen in year's..... sry King Henry ran a what at his 40 in the combine... an at Allen age he wasn't even this good. This kid is so special... an in the last 3 seasons what pros on Wisconsin where being drafted an how many he saw in the box... my last thing is which rb had the 2nd most 100 games the last 3 seasons... I'll wait an keep getting Allen in every damn league...also Maye is so damn good... 1 last tip. Spencer is the 3rd best qb but jj could be good too
Darius Robinson Missouri is a DT in my eyes 👀 he made my top 10 DT list. It’s on UA-cam put 30 pounds on him he Arilk Armstead 2.0 and I put that in my break down 8 days ago. Watch Kentucky game single handily took game over !!!!!!!!!!!
Corum is old, overworked, and has a major injury. If he was 20 and didn't have the ACL I'd be fine with drafting him. Although I don't trust that school with RBs at all.
Payton Wilson is interesting. Solid instincts and incredible athleticism, but man…he gets smoked in a phone booth. The Notre Dame tape is BRUTAL. Trotter scares me with his lack of athleticism. The sleeper in this class for me is Muasau from UCLA. Cooper is an easy one, Colson an easy two.
Dude a cross fitter. Irish ☘️ tape they abused him !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He not even on my draft board top 10 LB on my channel let alone his 12 surgeries in college na I’m Good
He might be in the NFL. Depends on scheme and team fit. He has moves and plays very fluid. I could definitely see him causing problems in space with a head of steam. Not sure his legs and lower-body strength "do damage" inside either, especially outside of obvious pass downs. Undecided at this point. Good player though.
Started reading through The Beast and loving it so far. Really appreciate the effort Dane puts in every year.
Related question - how does a report in The Beast compare to what NFL scouts share with their respective teams?
I view my Athletic subscription for the year as buying The Beast and then reading free articles.
I finished the bulk of my evaluation on McCormick yesterday. I know what Dane’s talking about with some of struggles he has, especially at the 2nd level (but not just the 2nd level). There’s definitely some tightness moving laterally but to me it was less a case of some extremely stiff athlete being asked to do stuff he’s not capable of doing than a guy who plays a little too fast and out of control and consequently took a ton of bad angles. He’s also a guy that has an extremely annoying habit of dipping his head really early and not being able to see what he’s supposed to be hitting. And I think that’s where the discrepancy between what you saw on tape and what you saw at the Shrine Bowl and the Combine really is. He didn’t suddenly go from a super stiff athlete to a historically great athlete in the month between the season’s end and the Shrine Bowl. That’s literally not a thing that’s possible. And there are reps where, when he’s dialed in with his angles and he keeps his eyes up (you can’t hit what you can’t see, young man) that it looks really good, e.g. some of the stuff vs 2023 NDSU.
But yeah, I don’t think the tape is particularly good overall. And he especially struggled against Logan Lee and Iowa, which was definitely the best competition he faced in college.
People talk a lot about his nasty and he does have some of that in him. But way too often he’s content to just try to shove guys out of the way instead of really using his hands to lock on and drive guys off the ball.
I haven’t decided on a final grade but some of the day 2 stuff I’m hearing I think is really rich. Basically it comes down to do you ever think this guy becomes a capable starter and I just don’t see it based on his college tape. Maybe if you’re really patient and you have a really good O line coach but for me it’s later in day 3 I’d be willing to take that chance
Good segment. yay draft soon...Darius Robinson would be a great 3rd round pick for DeMeco if he's there. He's got that rotational multiple position thing going on...DeMeco uses a heavy DL rotation.
Years ago for draft Fanatics it was Joel BushBaum. But the Beast hands 🙌 down the best .
Keep up the good work Dane
By far the best show I’ve seen. Especially learning how rare it is to get a rookie OT to be an impact day one. Crazy that these guys are going so high and won’t even be starting day one. I’d rather wait later and develop a guy like Goncalves. Unless it’s Joe Alt or JC Latham.
What do you see in JC Latham? I see elite anchor with his size and strength to neutralize a bull rush, but slow get-off and subpar feet, awareness, and athleticism to hold up at OT. At the end of the day I see him as a pass blocking G. For me lower upside like the discussion of Fuaga in the podcast.
@kylebrandt8344 You didn't ask me, but I see a giant who will be one of the 2 or 3 biggest guys on the field in every game. Huge hands and long arms. He has an amazing base and lower half strength, similar to Olu imo.
Neither is necessarily quick or "light on their feet" but they move properly, end up in the right spots, and rarely get beat. Both easy 1st round grades for me.
@@FantasySportsZen I agree with everything you said. People need to realize that this is still the draft. There is NO sure thing ever. You have to go on tape, measurables, character, upside, and gut feeling.
Top 7 backs for me are all clustered very closely: Lloyd, Corrum if he’s the guy from 2022, Benson, Allen, Estime, Brooks, Corrum if he’s the guy we saw last year, Wright. I can’t rate Allen higher because of the speed and agility concerns - I was wrong on AJ Dillon. But I love that kid’s game and I don’t think he’s being properly evaluated. I see a player with borderline elite power, good make-you-miss feet, good vision and feel, violence in short yardage, surprisingly good hands, and upside in pass protection. The issue is that he is def a build-up speed guy. Zero concerns with his physicality. Iowa, Illinois, Purdue games solidified that. And honestly, even the Buffalo game has value - what does it look like when he’s running free into the second level? The answer is he breaks a ton of tackles and can surprise guys if they take bad angles. We will see. 3rd/4th round player to me.
Nate consistently will say "idk I was just expecting more." Nate that's how many of us feel about Drake Maye 😂
Sweat is such unique player with great traits... If not for "character concerns" he would been first rounder
I agree.
Also, I think Barton is the best. Not only can he play tackle, guard and center, but he can absolutely excel at all three.
Love him at guard and center. Don’t think he can survive at tackle
@@smyers9052 True. He has those short arms. But from all the stats and tape, he player LT great in college.
@@Joeypots I thought he was just okay as an LT in college. I'd encourage you to watch him vs. FSU. Don't get me wrong, it's not a disaster, he's too technically sound for that, but he had a hard time with Verse's speed-to-power. And it's not just that game. He was a solid college tackle playing mostly against middling competition, but he has some warts on tape, he doesn't have great length or an elite anchor. To me his best position is probably center, but he also can thrive as a guard in a zone scheme where his movement skills can shine. I love Barton, but I don't see him playing tackle in the league. But hey, one never knows!
@@smyers9052 I’ll check out some more games. Great points. This is why you guys are the best. And I agree, he’s best at center. I’m praying the Dolphins get him. Hoping we can trade down for a pick but stay close enough to grab him.
@@Joeypots Well to be clear I’m just a guy who does this for fun, don’t want you to think I speak for the channel. I love discussing this stuff though, having an opinion is what makes it fun. Just glad most of these tape cut ups are available on YT
Darius Robinson. Elite 5-tech/4i prospect. Might be a great 3 in the right scheme. Absolutely outstanding run game player. To me this is a 1st round player. Watch him vs Georgia. Outstanding tape all year. Base end in a 4-3, but regardless put him at 3 or 4 in nickel and let him go. I saw plenty of quick wins on tape. Not an elite pass rusher but he has some outstanding reps, not just a cleanup player. As for tweeners, I mean he isn’t a tweener. He’s built like a classic big end/5-tech. Arik Armstead, Calais Campbell, Stephon Tuitt…the idea that there isn’t a track record of power players with great length and nearly 300 pounds of mass succeeding at a high rate in the NFL
Is just incorrect. If Robinson were a guy who didn’t test well, constantly tried to win with finesse and were playing in the 275-280 range, okay. But he played heavier than he weighed in for combine, carries that weight easily, and has the length, mass, and play style to thrive in today’s hybrid environment. Versatility is not a knock.
Watch Kentucky Game he literally took game !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
47:44 Got that right 😎 #MizzouMade
Love the show wondering why Hunter Nourzad isn't ranked higher on big boards he's a beast
Tommy Echenberg ,
Payton Wilson, Tervin Wallace
2-3 ain’t Bad Peyton Wilson. Had build of a safety / crossfitter. He going to get killed stopping the run let alone the 12 surgeries he had.
If I don't get Darius Robinson at pick 28, Ruke Ohrohroro is on my radar at pick 60
I love Braelon Allen. I think the physicality is shockingly underrated. I strongly disagree that he doesn’t run with power. This is one of those, “I’d love to watch this film with you and understand” situations. Does he dance at times? Sure, but that’s often effective, and he will make people miss. I honestly think that people see him use finesse and then just miss the violent finishes that are all over the tape. Go watch that Iowa game and tell me he isn’t running with power, go ask the Buffalo defense how they felt after that game. Hell, they rode him against the Illini and a ton of that was grinding out tough yards. He and Estime are the best short yardage players in the class. As for scheme, he was best in a gap scheme prior to this year. I
Chop is Third Down pass Rusher to me. Ohio State crumpled him in run game.
Crazy fast against pass. But what you do on run downs ????????????? Could be another Micah great vs pass Rush bad vs run
Conner as a comp for Allen is good. I think Conner was more refined coming out, but the body type and tools are similar. I do think Allen has higher upside and a lower floor. Again though- disagree on physicality
4:22 shoutout Kegwood
I would love to hear what you guys think of Patrick Paul. Watching the tape he looks great. He’s huge and athletic. I don’t understand why the value in him going mid to late 2nd round. As a Dolphins fan, I love the idea of taking Haynes somewhere around 35-40, Paul at 55 and Roman Wilson or Rickey Pearsall in the 3rd with a pick we get from trading down from 21.
Patrick Paul is raw. Elite upside with bottomless floor. He doesnt play to the ceiling of his length at the moment. Him going as high as he is going is with the assumption you can tap into his ability to use his length
@@iurunner34 thank you! That’s exactly what I was looking for.
Paul had some issues with speed. Doesn’t move the way you want him to. Had some issues in the Texas gane
He only ranked 8 cause we have this crazy OT class any other year he a round 1 OT.
Remember this name Zack Zinter was my Guard 1 Michigan but broke 2 bones 🦴 late in year vs Ohio State. You grab him in round 3 great value !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Even if he needs a redshirt year.
I was really high on Kamari Lassiter before hearing your breakdown. Now I’m concerned
Cedric Gray is good in coverage, but man...he isn't just okay in the run game, he is a liability. But I can understand overdrafting based on coverage potential. I just remember him throwing his hands in the air, missing tackles, and generally looking confused and angry in that UVA game. Lack of physicality is not sustainable at LB, even in today's game. But size is there, and he will flash some violence at times. Just depends on what he wants to be I guess.
Cooper de Jean is a safety in the nfl
What makes him a safety? He has all the skills and ability to be a boundary corner wtf 😂
@@dangilbert9678there’s a little bit of stiffness in the stop-start. Also, only average length for the position despite being a bigger body corner. I still think he’ll be able to hold up outside in a zone heavy scheme with his combination of instincts, physicality and ball skills. Just not the guy you want to leave on an island to play press against the Jamaar Chases of the world.
@@dangilbert9678 Mmmm there's just something about him. Reminds me a lot of Harrison Smith or Eric Weddle tbh, hard to say exactly why
Thank you 🙏 he made my top 10 Safety list on my channel
@@dangilbert9678he did play safety in Iowa defense some.
I don't have a lot of pet peeves, but have a completely irrational hate for when people say a RB with a lot of career carries "they have a lot of TREAD on their tires".
NO! They have a lot of "wear". They have a lot tread on their tires when they DON'T have a lot of career carries.
Unless the RB is Frank Gore or Derrick Henry...then I guess they can have both.
😂😂 go off bro. Tell em
Oh yup. It started as guys having "worn the tread" off their tires as the saying. Modern humans just aren't very smart. Lol.
Don’t Sleeper on Oklahoma LT Walter Rouse played 3 years at Stanford then Transferred to Oklahoma why didn’t Guyton play LT ??????????????????????
Great Day 3 value LT Walter Rouse
Game Tape 1. Medical combine 2. All Star games 3.
Sorry I can’t over look Tape.
Fascinating. I don’t think Barton can play tackle. FSU tape is damning to me. Fuaga has similarities with Iupati but he doesn’t have the same pass pro issues that Mike did. I think there’s a chance he can play tackle, but I strongly believe he’s best at guard. Reminds me of Tevin Jenkins.
I think Fuega will get exposed on island 🏝️ in nfl pass blocking. But slide him RG he all pro next Decade
Brent Grimes ran in 4.6s.
go Pitt State! (pittsburg KS)
Man I just can’t disagree more on Fuaga. I think he’s going to be a quality RT. I even understand what these guys see as his negatives, but I don’t think it’s anywhere near enough of a detriment they make it out to be. I won’t even argue he might make for an even better guard, but I’m confident he can be a quality RT in this league. Fuaga and Fautanu both getting over scouted and nit picked to death. I know without question Fuaga could come in and be the best RT the Steelers have had in a decade, even if he’s isn’t an all pro
Wow I can’t believe ya’lls scouting on Payton Wilson… unless it’s medicals based.
What was B.Allen in January y'all I actually watched another show you had an 1 of you had Maye at his qb #1 which that guy is actually a very smart person... if Maye was on any top 20 college team... with nfl players on the offensive side with him... anyways Allen is clearly the best NFL rb prospect we've seen in year's..... sry King Henry ran a what at his 40 in the combine... an at Allen age he wasn't even this good. This kid is so special... an in the last 3 seasons what pros on Wisconsin where being drafted an how many he saw in the box... my last thing is which rb had the 2nd most 100 games the last 3 seasons... I'll wait an keep getting Allen in every damn league...also Maye is so damn good... 1 last tip. Spencer is the 3rd best qb but jj could be good too
Darius Robinson Missouri is a DT in my eyes 👀 he made my top 10 DT list. It’s on UA-cam
put 30 pounds on him he Arilk Armstead 2.0 and I put that in my break down 8 days ago.
Watch Kentucky game single handily took game over !!!!!!!!!!!
I think Hartman is going to be a good QB,Rattler as well
Nate is Mike Ticeson I would not argue with him unless you want "punched out"
Estime is 220. Come on.
Do any NFL scouts, coaches or GM's ever read or pay any attention to "draft guides" from sites like this? Just wondering...
Corum is old, overworked, and has a major injury. If he was 20 and didn't have the ACL I'd be fine with drafting him. Although I don't trust that school with RBs at all.
Benson is Curtis Enis. Same run style and injury issues. That style doesn't translate to the NFL.
Payton Wilson is interesting. Solid instincts and incredible athleticism, but man…he gets smoked in a phone booth. The Notre Dame tape is BRUTAL. Trotter scares me with his lack of athleticism. The sleeper in this class for me is Muasau from UCLA. Cooper is an easy one, Colson an easy two.
Dude a cross fitter. Irish ☘️ tape they abused him !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
He not even on my draft board top 10 LB on my channel let alone his 12 surgeries in college na I’m
Good
Allen is AJ Dillon. It's an obvious comp.
The Bengals will take mimms if he's there at #18. 100% Trust me
It's because of who they face every year. Garrett, Watt, Madibuke
Source: trust me bro
D Rob is not an edge
He might be in the NFL. Depends on scheme and team fit. He has moves and plays very fluid. I could definitely see him causing problems in space with a head of steam. Not sure his legs and lower-body strength "do damage" inside either, especially outside of obvious pass downs. Undecided at this point. Good player though.
Had his best season at edge. I think he'll be like Denico Autry spending time inside and outside depending on what the DC needs.