ACES Astronaut Helmet Visor for Adam Savage - Vacuum Forming Tutorial
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- When a Mythbuster issues you a challenge, you rise to the occasion! Adam Savage needed a pair of visors for his ACES space suit costume for his NYCC 2018 incognito costume. Bill and Britt got to work using their brand new vacuum forming machine.
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Push the petg in with compressed air?
another material option is polycarbonate, also sold as makrolon
That fake laugh. D:
Remember to put in the link for Adams one day build using these visors. :) ua-cam.com/video/8Td-YSEEKEM/v-deo.html&t
also you mention that video at 22:03 in this video. you could add popup link there.
Happy new year Bill and Britt, and thanks for sharing all that you do!
I think I might know why vacuum-forming the acrylic didn't exactly go according to plan.
It's possible you looked up TAP Plastic's datasheet for Acrylite FF extruded acrylic (which does say 290° to 320°F) but ended up using the Acrylite GP cell-cast acrylic (requiring 340° to 380°F) instead.
Extruded and cast acrylic are the first two categories listed on TAP's website under "Plastic Sheets" and even use identical images in their links: www.tapplastics.com/product/plastics/plastic_sheets_rolls
The temperature ranges for both can be found under Thermoforming Conditions on Page 4 of this PDF:
www.tapplastics.com/uploads/pdf/Tech%20Data-Thermo.pdf
Such a mixup could also explain other problems you faced, as cast acrylic suffers shrinkage to a greater degree and absorbs moisture more readily than does extruded acrylic.
Hope that helps!
Man, what an adventure!! So awesome to see how many different types of making goes into this one project. 3D printing, woodworking, metal working, power tools, hand tools, tinting, etc. They turned out great!
Thanks you guys!
Every guy I know that has a joint account with their significant other was caught sending inappropriate messages to other ladies. You must have really messed up for her to want to make UA-cam videos together.
True!
Man, y'all go all-out! I appreciate the work you put into your projects AND your videos.
Thanks so much CrafsMan!
WOW didn't expect to see you here
"We're happy with that, and hopefully so is our favorite Mythbuster."
*Jamie will remember that*
Yes, We never had any luck trying to vac-u-form acrylic plastic. It always bubbled. After watching you video now I know why. Thanks Bill.
You got it Ted! =)
I’ve been working in a plastic shop for a few years now. I’ve been the main vacuum former for all of our products. A few things I’d do for single parts like this to make it a bit easier.
While the baby powder seemed to work pretty well, another longer term solution is to put a compressed air system inline with your vacuum channels, when you switch your vac off, let the plastic harden (not too much depending on the plastic you are working with to prevent cracking, ex. Polystyrene) then engage the air system which works to release the plastic from the mould using the same channels the vacuum uses. Obviously just don’t use them both at the same time.
Also, a big component of vacuum forming is managing the heat distribution across the surface of the plastic.
So for such a deep negative ideally you would want different parts of the plastic sheet to be heated at different temperatures. (Usually far less in the middle to prevent thinning of the final product).
It’s a little tricky because you have such a relatively small heating solution, but a common solution is to have the different elements on their own thermostat and control system, so you can set each element to its own temp. Heating the plastic sheet proportionately to keep the best result as far as thickness.
But the main thing is thermoforming isn’t an exact science by any means. It’s all about dialing it in through practice.
Just watched Adam's vid with it before this. The final product looks really good guys 🙂
Thanks so much!
Me too. It was a trip to see the project crossing from one of my subscribed channels to another. This looks SICK.
Great job guys. Fascinating video as usual. Remember, “I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.” - Thomas A. Edison. Or as Adam, himself, likes to say; "Failure is always an option!"
Oh, obviously you're joking about the "slave driver" bit with your colleagues/staff; but I've worked for people who wouldn't think twice about treating employees like that. Not every employer is a decent human like you.
I used to run a huge vac forming machine putting vinyl on plastic seat backs. It was cool for the first few hours than 6 years went by and now anything vacuum form related I want to go crawl into my dark hole, six feet below the ground. Good video though. Lol
Having only done a small amount of vacuum forming, I can totally understand how one can feel that way.
What type of material was the vinyl? I do upholstery and would love to learn about upholstery vacuum forming
looks like you are not being very careful with the dust etc, not to mention fumes from all those chemicals epoxies resins etc, you should have a sanding cabinet with positive airflow out of the building , that stuff builds up in both your lungs and nervous systems, take it from a experienced maker who can no longer make , your whole shop will be contaminated if you dont as well from the dust.
I had a thought while watching the video regarding the tinting bath. Have you checked into a sous vide immersion circulator used in cooking? You can dial in the exact temperature you were looking for and maintain that temperature as long as needed. For less than 100.00 US, it might be worth giving a try.
@IQzminus A way around any issues with high/low PH would be to have a secondarey container inside the main container. Outer container would house the heater and the inner would house the die bath. This would keep the heater coil from contacting the die yet allow heat through to the inner container. If needed, both containers can be plastic with the temp only needing to be at 140° or so for the die bath.
We actually had considered it, but we already had our $10 electric burner and it works great, so we ran with that. I would be interested to see someone try an immersion circulator, but I don't think we're gonna try it.
@@punishedprops Totally understandable. :)
@IQzminus most likely the pH will not have an effect the device. I would be more concerned with dye pigments collecting on the heating element, although that may not be an issue either if properly cared for. Remember, a lot of high/low pH products are stored in plastic. It's the concentrations that you need to worry about, not the actually pH... think Coca-Cola, it has pH of 3.They also make stainless versions, but still the heating element is where the issues would lie.
I told myself i can live in a tiny house. As long as my second building is a Mythbuster warehouse size “craft” room.
Hmmm. A few questions come up: like
If you wanted the clear visor more rigid, could you have piled two sheets into the frame, so they melt together as well as vacuform down?
Did you use the refuse petg to test out your tint before dunking your first piece?
And could you have let that sheet of petg sag much lower or is there a limit to the sagging?
From my experience the two sheet method unfortunately doesn’t join like you mentioned you’d just end up with two layers that wouldn’t hold together.
And there is a limit to the sag! Get it too hot and your PETG will actually burn causing it to blister and change colour and risk getting too thin and tearing before even vac forming! :)
Hope this helped!
I don't think the plastic gets hot enough to laminate together, but I've never tried it. We've done lots of PETG tinting, so we didn't need to test for this one. We could have probably let it sag lower. There is probably a point of diminishing returns though. There's a real knack to vacuum forming and I don't quite have it yet.
Thicker pet g may be a better solution. Even if two sheets would laminate together my guess is you’d end up with a lot of air-pockets between the two sheets.
Thank you everyone for your replies. I was asking in pure curiosity
Using a vacuform to laminate doesn't get enough pull to accurately mould the second layer to the first. Better just using thicker material. But could be a very cool experiment none the less!
I really enjoy vids like this when you show failures and explain why they fail! It helps others from making the same mistakes. I do have a suggestion that might save some time. Instead of using a hot plate on the galvanized basin, use a Sous Vide immersion cooker! You could set the temperature and walk away and when it gets to temp it will alarm and it will maintain the exact temperature you need indefinitely AND it will be circulating the water/dye mix which may help with the coating process.
this great, thank for the guidance/ video. we will try to do something thx again
Thanks for watching!
Anyone else here from HexCorp?
Hi Bill, You can vacuum form over Silicone or into silicone , believe it or not , it doesn't distort the Silicone . Give it a try. Great Video BTW
That's great! Thanks for sharing Franco. Miss you buddy! =D
I really do love your style bill you can tell a true maker by the fact that if you don’t have something you make it or find away around it also never lose you wit and humour
Awe, thank you so much! =)
Very true. this is the life I need
Your mold didn't release well because of the lip of the visor on your plug. You need to make unmoldable shapes when dealing with ridgid molds. Also you can use compressed air to release the mold. Blow between the plug and the mold.
Of course it is not working. That is a sink plunger. Use a toilet plunger.
My caveman brain couldn't handle all the different substances used in this vacuum forming tutorial.
Now make another one out of Aluminum Oxynitride. :-P
It'll be very Star Trek-esque.
That moment when all the pieces come together. Why does bill need such a big ass vacuum former? Oh that’s why!
Oh yeahhhhh! =)
This just sparked something inside of me. Like I want to make props now.
Thanks for sharing!
That's wonderful! Here's a great place to start: punishedprops.com/new-maker/
Thanks, I shall digest this!
Who else is hear that wants to make a among us costume
I swear listening to you building props is just like listening to Mr. Rogers. I don't know if it's the voice or your cadence, but it's just so soothing
Won't you be my prop-neighbor? =D
This is the most informative comments section I have ever seen !
you made a too deep negative mold.. if you did a positive mold the tickness would be excelent.
I made a positive mold and is just easyer (less material need)
great video tho
you get better control over the final thickness as well.
Does anyone know why they didn't?
Maybe hindsight, but it seems there obvious choice.
An idea about the center getting thin:
As the material sags the lowest area is closest to the heating element. Thus it should be hotter than the edges and will always deform faster in the vacuum form than the rest. Try using some angle aluminium to create a diffuser across the heating elements to evenly disperse the heat while protecting the piece from direct radiation. Ideally, some airflow would help distribute heat via convection.
You can see this evidenced in high end electric grills.
Smart people don't work in inches, we went metric in 76, be smart
hi bill! great work! next time however, try using water clay instead of foam to splay the part out, it'll make demold so much easier, also, that is fibreglass tissue that you're using, that is mainly used to finish off as a final layer to make it nice and smooth. next time, try using some glass matting, 3 layers then that tissue to finish it off, will make your moulds so much stronger! :D
Great tips, thanks for sharing!
5:07 Need a tool make a tool, Alec Steele would be proud.
Just found you of 3dprintingNerd Joel’s channel. Think I saw you were at MERF? Anyway new sub. FYI stay away from small crack fillers. Use high build primer. So many times the crack spot filler fails
I never had a problem free-blowing near optically perfect hemispheres out of brand-name Plexiglas. An old hand that blew bubbles for Brantly Helicopters told me to use 325 F. I worked fine on 35-year-old Plexiglas. Brantley blew the bubbles for their helicopter in an oven that had a very low vacuum on one side of the Plexiglas sheet with a few psi above ambient on the other side. Three or four people who understood how the bubble responded to heat, pressure, time, and cooling air jets made four out of five $450 dollar sheets of 1/4-inch plexiglass into a good helicopter canopy. Until the scrap rate acceded three out of ten, at no time in Brantly's history was it worth building a polished die for vacuum-formed canopies? Free-blowing them wasn't that hard to do.
OUTSTANDING JOB !!! Very Informative
are these visors available to purchase?
Sorry
I wasn’t able to find them on your website
I’m a new subscriber ,Thank u so much
Not enough draft angle on the side .. prob why it didn’t release..🤷🏻♂️
I tried my hand at dying this polycarbonate sheet yesterday and cleaned it well before putting it into the pot of ink. It came out all blotchy. I don't know what I did wrong. I did accidentally leave the ink mixture on high for about 10 minutes after mixing it in. So it was boiling for about 10 min on accident. When I poured the ink out I saw chunks of it settled at the bottom.
Hi, friend. I have my Visor for my motorcycle Helmet. very scratchy. this model already from my Viewer. Is not found. I asked them if they would make me one and I would pay for all the shipping and labor. The Viewfinder is not broken. It is only Scraped and is not seen outside Asia. Tell me if it is possible and if. Tell me how to contact you. Thanks and great job.
Did you use extruded or cast acrylic? I've read that cast acrylic is no good for vacuum forming.
Also, would anyone know what kind of vacuum former would be necessary to make Jason Voorhees hockey masks in acrylic, that being what the original masks were apparently made of?
Wana contact you personally....I.m from Bangladesh and an Architect in profession 🙂😷 want to build some material like transparent doors from plastic! Can you help....? 🙂 thanks
The problem with your heater box is that the top of the plastic is cold, needs heating from both sides for 1/8 3mm acrylic. Also positive buck moulds work better for deep items as you stretch the plastic over them and they come out a more even thickness.
Great feedback, thanks!
same. All the HALO visors I do are pos bucks
. I print the buck . then glass the inside to reenforce it . then Exp foam and dunnage. .
On the print I use ABS and acetone smooth . Pull PETG and its not too bad! .
Would this process and PETG be appropriate to make replacement automotive headlight covers?
I just wanted to point out that the link for PET-G in the description actually leads you to an amazon link thats for PET rather than PET-G. They aren’t the same thing and what you want is PET-G.
That's not acrylic (Plexiglas) that has the bubbles, it's Lexan. Actual acrylic would have worked fine.
Do you guys have any process for one-way mirror metalization of cosplay visors? Currently I'm at airbrushing them with a thin layer of silver paint from the back, but this process is far from perfect and Im searching for something better...
When we did vacu-forming in art school, our teacher who was a self-taught guy with decades of experience (in various fields) taught us a few tricks he'd accumulated in his career as an artist.
One, never over-exert. The proportion between wastage and good part (in the same piece) should be heavily skewed towards what's usable. It means more complicated molds, but it does end up in a better product.
Two,which pertains to this particular pickle, either use thicker material that you absolutely have to bake, i remember that one of our projects required vacu-forming a 8 mm thick piece of perspex, it sat in the make-shift electric oven for almost a week, which we moved in the guard's room so he can look over at night.
OR, you make your own sheet of acrylic with more mass in the center. This is beyond conventional, we've done it maybe 9 times with decent success in our attempt to "replicate" the amazing rabbits of Yamada Sobi, in acrylic. Yes, nuts. You cast the acrylic in a plaster mold which can be made by rotating the mold as you form it, thus creating a gentle slope, and thus give you more mass in the center of the acrylic finite piece.
These were all done in the 2000s, so our technology and materials were far more rudimentary and crude than what you get today. Certainly, cast acrylic quality has improved immensely.
Thanks for sharing all the info!
YOU (aserta) could title as a tutorial, this was more an "Experiment", although it was successful. It irritates me when watching experiments by "experts" that should be teaching not guessing.
@@billl7551 Life is an experiment!
Dear Punished Props Academy.
I 've ever vacuum forming hdpe on iron shield boss, with great result.
Do you think vacuum forming a shell of bump helmet made of abs into a more resistant hdpe... shell will work without damaging the original with high temperature?
Regards
How did you cut a straight line by eye? That's impressive. Or did you cut out the long sanding down procedure?
Maybe this was suggested but... Couldn't you have made a wider AND more shallow mold?... This would require the substrate of choice to stretch far less, further limiting the issue with thinning in the center.
I'm buying a classic car with faded headlight covers. I'm hoping this will get me moving in the correct direction.
It's killing me to watch you brush all that baby powder around and breathe in the cloud without a mask on. Hopefully it won't kill you. Bad stuff.😢
I would like to make a bubble helmet with filter breathing and air circulating fan so it does not fog up. This is 4/26/2020 while the kung flu virus is going on around the world. My wife could sew me a space suit or rather a earth suit. I wonder how people in space suits scratch their face, i guess they do not.
11:45 but there was a trash can right behind you!
Bill I need advise I have 2 alien xenomorph busts casted from the original and I need to have a replacement dome made would you know when I can have one vacuum formed I have one that can be duplicated from ide appreciate if you can guide me to some one who can
Thank you
Why wouldn't a car wind screen and window tinted film do the job more precisely and faster and with every possible effect - like the original gold mirror NASA finish of those incredible pictures on the moon ? Wouldn't it save big on time and cost ???
I want to vacuum form a pair of sunglass lenses in polycarbonate, i plan to use a negative buck so that i can get creases in the fronts of the lenses. Is there any info you can offer on that? Also you mentioned baby powder; talc or corn starch? and would graphite dust work any better?
Working in a plastic packaging manufacturing factory, this was both fun and a bit painful.
Temperature are tricky because they are dependent on the width of your plastic.
The temperature of the core is more critical than the surface temperature,that's why even though the surface temperature is correct, you have problems forming.
PET is the easiest to form and is mostly at least partly recycled plastic. If it becomes opaque and brittle, it's because it's too hot so lower the temperature or heat for a shorter time and you'll be golden. Some variations of temperature can be because of different additives in the plastic so some leeway is best
PVC is a pain to form, Polystyrene and acrylic are finnicky as well.
Smooth moulds will generally be harder to take the formed piece out of because the two surfaces will stick together, so try blowing air through the same hole where the vacuum is. hollow moulds are easier to form because when the plastic cools it detaches itself off of the mould so if possible keep to hollow moulds.
Consider turning on the vacuum before or at the same time that you put the sheet of heated plastic, depending on the mould it could help with forming and decrease the likelihood of wrinkles.
The science behind heat forming plastic, and how it behaves can seem simple but can get really complex depending on what you want out of your final product.
Any way good job with the semi-improvised setup and if any want to try please take the proper precautions because it can be very dangerous and hazardous ( gases emitted, burns, etc)
Wow, I noticed that if the video has more views and subscribers the faster a UA-cam video downloads.
This is not a vacuum mold project. Research how these visors are made for real. Prosthetic sockets for rather long stumps are sag molded. The important takeaway from this is that prosthetic sockets are quite rigid as they are very much a structural part, as are space and flight helmets!
Çok güzel video var neden alt yazı Türkçe yok
Why didn't you just buy a can of VHT night shade and spray them to tint them it's for car tail lights and head lights but your using car polish and it would if been faster and better I'm thinking if you never Hurd of it check it out I've used it in a lot of things I want to tint
21:23 no good making area is complete without a pair of red harbor freight earmuffs on the wall:)
Truth!
This is one of the most fascinating videos I've seen in a while. Great job Bill & Brit!
Thank you!
why not heat it again once formed then vaccume to pull more of the access down and make a thicker finished product ?, after a few tries the center should be the thickest part and the outsides your going to trim off would be the thinnest.
Instructions unclear, dog now enjoying black water bath.
Does anyone find the beginning "teaser clip" annoying? It just makes me want to skip to the end and finish when they cut it off like that
So why not use 1/4 petg sheets to make the helmets a nice thick plastic??? Home depot's 5hp vacuum can pull it
Great build! I wonder if you could do it with an Apollo bubble helmet.
What do you think, Bill?
Why not vacuum form a buck to use as a negative? seems an easier option.
eehm why do you do this ? adam owns such a vacuum machine :-D he shows it in some tested videos ! :-DDDDD
Is there a reason why you formed it "into" the required shape rather than the reverse? If it had been pushed over the outside a thin top would not happen.
If the plastic were clear purple, would the effect still turn it into a clear black or a dark purple?
Try pmtg it is what 2 letter bottles....typing and watching ....
What is a good thickness of polycarbonate plastic for rc body?
Excuse me but what is the material that you used in the video to make the plastic "molding"?
errrr mehhh, you could have done a better mold for the visor. so it won't stretch that far. Good try though.
Can I do this over a metal bowl and just heat the bowl and let the sheet soften into the shape of the bowl slowly?
I think you guys should make some fallout raider armor to go with your mechanist and assultron robot costume
Good ol’ petg! Fascinating process here. Thanks as always for showing what didn’t go right as well as the good stuff! So rad you were a part of this project the suit looks amazing!
We wanted to be a part of Team Helmet, like you! =)
Punished Props Academy Woohooo!
Ahhhh i wanna use this to make a protogen head, but my parents suck and hate furries 😤
what a work for just a visor!!...buying a space suite is cheaper!.
I just got overly happy. I use that same blue box cutter for my job 😂
I don’t think I’m here for astronaut visor, nah, I’m here for protogen visors!
Dang!! How much money did you guys throw against this thing?
Dying the resin on each layer of fiberglass is a great idea, I'll have to use that next time
Crazy question. Could window glass be formed like this? (Assuming everything was adjusted to handle higher temps of course)
I have no idea! I don't think glass forms well in a sheet and would likely require a very different setup.
From my experience+research trying to make a custom running lamp/marker light for a chopper using glass, it is -possible-. BUT! it is rediculously hard to pull off & requires building some serious equpment setup & luck (I was not lucky). Glass is as forgiving as an irrate honey badger. It ended up being much easier (and would have saved me a @#$& ton of $$ + time) to just commision a glass blower/sculptor.
Awesome. Great to see all the steps it takes to make something really custom. Can't imagine what the $ cost would be to hire someone to do that.
"ITS NOT WORKING!" bahahaha
Yeah, there’s no way I can do this. I wish I could pay someone to do it for me.
This floor is too disgusting.......
Hold my toothbrush.....
PAPER TOWEL?????? NOOOOOOOOO. I find that using paper towels on plastic lenses and auto body paint leaves micro scratches. Invest in good quality microfiber towels. You will get a better polished surface. Just found your channel, very nice
Thanks for watching!
So, what happens if you leave it in for 15 minutes? Will the tint come out darker if you do, or do you have to keep cooling it every 5 minutes?
You could probably do that if you knew wanted it really dark. I wanted to pinpoint a more specific shade so I did 5-minute stints so I didn't accidentally over do it!
All I can say is....DORK!!!!
and yes I'mma try and make these, not exactly but similar.
Also why can't I use car window tint?
We haven't had luck with window tint sheets on curved surfaces. Also, the headlight spray tint is hard to see through.
next time use a hot knife too cut your visor ..makes know mess and its faster .I think to each his own right ..love your shop . from Michigan USA . September .9 / 10 / 2020 ..7:o4 PM ..
Thanks for the tip!
"Make sure there is no dust on it"
Phoooooo~
Why not hold the tool the other way around so it doesn't fling plastic at your face
Having worked with these tools for many years I can confirm: "turning them around" is a pain in the butt unless the user is ambidextrous.
Love watching a pro do his thing. You’ll forget more than I could ever learn. Your videos are mesmerizing,
Aww thanks so much for watching!
Seems to me like a convex mold would have worked better
Where can you buy those acrylic sheets (PMMA)? , or plexiglass in the market? that are thermoformable. Is there a link or website to buy online? Thank you very much for the help, best regards
We link all the materials used for this video in the description.
22:11 The one dislike is from Jamie Hyneman
I think Bill means 1st and 2nd favourite MB's, 'cos we all love Adam & Jamie - but the job was for Adam so...
@@negotiableaffections do you know why Jamie isn't at tested? I've been a sub for only a year and have wondered where he went
Did I miss a something? In order to pull into a cavity, don't you have to have the vacuum holes pretty evenly spaced? How did you pull the visor surface into the cavity without having to cover the surface of the visor proper with a network of holes? And why vacuum? Why not use air pressure to push the plastic into the mold ? And don't go all pedantic on me, I *know* that's what happens when you pull a vacuum... but ti ain't the same.
Because a vacuum is what I have! The holes in the mold and vacuum former were quite evenly spaced.