Fun fact: according to AvHerald, this was a brand new jet on literally its first ever commercial flight when this happened. Its previous flight was the delivery from Brazil to Amsterdam.
@@UnshavenStatue Indeed. It was obviously some kind of "child desease" at this aircraft. But due to Flighradar24 PH-NXD is meanwhile serving regularly its routes.
Amazing number of planes and instructions for the air traffic controllers to handle. High-paced clearly audible English to and from people who are not native speakers. Hat's off to all of you!
I am dutch and we start lerning english at school at an age of 10 years till we graturate . That is one of the reasons that dutch people are good in english. But to be honest. I often need google translate for the correct translation😅
I remember approach for ORD being that busy just constantly barking out a steady stream commands almost non stop. Pilots were all on their toes as well. Was quite amazing to listen to
I’m Dutch and while most first translate what they hear or want to say from Dutch to English and VV, for me I’ve never experienced that. Same with Swedish. I hear the language as if it’s my native one and can’t imagine what it’s like having to translate it first all the time.
If the gear doesn’t come up you cannot continue the flight. Maximum speed and altitude is limited and fuel burn is much higher. They advised ATC about their problem which is the correct thing to do. By following some sort of procedure the gear could be retracted. Problem solved for this flight. The question becomes whether or not the aircraft would need maintenance at Rome. If it does it might be stuck there for a few days until it is repaired. This takes some time to figure out because it involves a conversation with the maintenance department on the ground. During this time you’ll want to continue on route to your destination because of the limited amount of fuel you have: fuel burned holding near Amsterdam is fuel you don’t have to fly to Rome. In the end the crew was likely advised to return to Amsterdam because maintenance would be required in Rome. So I understand that it looks a bit as if this crew couldn’t make up their mind, but in reality they did the logical thing.
KLM pilots in their home base - switching between English and Dutch and ATC and pilots are precise and relaxed and it shows they know what to expect of each other. This would have sounded different if the KLM flight had the problem in Rome or New York. They sort of all have home court advantage.
love watching your videos. June 5th I was on Delta flt 892 JFK to Anchorage it had to do an emergency landing in Buffalo New York and stay the night to get fixed. Are you able to find that so we can hear what was going on with the plane? Thanks
First thing to do when the all gear don't come up: Lower the gear. If they all show down and locked, return to base. If they don't all come down, return to base, anyway and run the check list for "some gear missing". Second thing to do: Land. Third thing: Turn the aircraft over to Mx.
On these modern airliners there are some reasons why the gear might not want to come up, which have nothing to do with the gear itself. For example a solenoid which prevents the landing gear lever from being moved up while on the ground might be broken or stuck. In this case the landing gear system itself is not affected, just the lever lock, and the lever cannot be moved out of the down position. With a procedure you can override this lock in certain situations (some error messages are not allowed to be displayed) and be back in normal operation. I suspect that they were not in a situation where a landing gear retraction (partially) failed, because then the sensible thing to do would be exactly as you say.
1:29 Can someone tell me, what does "request from Amsterdam radar" mean? 4:08 What does he mean by "Approach, goede dag"? 4:56 Is "Orange 26W" a callsign? 6:58 What is "RENDI1S"? What does he mean at 7:06?
First question, after ATC told the pilots to request from Amsterdam Radar means changing frequency to Amsterdam Radar. The ATC gave the m the frequency a few seconds later. 2nd question already answered. 3rd question. Yes, it is a callsign
Hello Sachin Kumar, Amsterdam radar requested to the departure controller that KLM57N needs to fly heading 120. Approach goede dag means, he greets the approach controller with Good day, and KLM57N let's know that they are on the controllers frequency. Orange26W is indeed a callsign, it is for TuiFly the Netherlands. Greets, Marius Vlaar
Maintenance forgot to remove the clogs and they came off on climb out. .... Clogs,... KLM.... Amsterdam.... I... 'm here all w.... OK I'm going .... :(
One of the hidden risks associated with the gear not coming up is that the aircraft may not pressurise, so climbing about 10,000ft becomes a risk. Not really an issue at Amsterdam but more of a risk at airports with elevations over 5000ft and MSA’s over 10,000ft.
Wonder what made them change their mind to return to Schiphol after all. First they said to radar control that they would continue to Rome. Anyway better be save than sorry.
Because there is a problem and this isn't a normal flight - different phases of flight and different responsibilities - remember that they are also running checklists and talking to their company. Depending on what needs to be done at any particular time they will switch flying and communications responsibilities between them as needed.
They were probably reminded by their colleagues on the ground that they won't find engineers in Rome (for cheap). I know we turned back from the middle of Germany once which was more than halfway through our destination, as they said they would rather have the engineers in Amsterdam look at the plane.
Well, as it happens, Amsterdam *is* their main hub and I suspect that their maintenance department didn't want to risk the aircraft getting stuck in Rome.
Where did the comment and following discussion about it being illegal to publish Dutch ATC comms disappear to?? Is someone censoring comments here? Why would someone delete comments like that which are in no way inappropriate??
Belated reply. Sometimes even regular comments disappear. Probably YT AI admin culling the posts. If the word 'illegal' is in a reply, probably it has more chance to be deleted.
Runway 27 is normally used with heavy west winds, which means it is the only runway available in that direction. So, busy yes and sequencing for close separation. Also many other factors like noise limits can play a factor.
Flight level is the altitude the aircraft is at or assigned to be at in 100s of feet. For example FL280 is 28000 feet. The altitude is above sea level. The altimeter setting, 29.92 is the calibration of the altimeter based in the local barometric pressure. That's how altimeters work based on the air pressure. Since the local pressure changes with the weather, everyone needs to have the local barometric pressure. Above 18000 ft. everyone uses standard pressure, 29.92.
Flight level is referenced to standard barometric pressure (QNH 1013, or 29.92in). Altitude in feet is referenced to local pressure at sea level. Above a certain altitude (18'000 in the US but as low as 3'000 around AMS) ATC will switch from feet to FL so pilots don't need to keep calibrating their altimeter to local pressure.
@@randybirkelbach801 hello thanks for you elegant comments. Notice the controller called as low as FL 60 . That is below 18000 MSL or class A . Sansiches explain that in the region 29.92 is set as low as 3000 MSL. I learned something new. Saludos Bro
The actor playing Goldmember is Dutch. These pilots and ATC are all Dutch and have this accent. Very few Dutch people have a non-Dutch accent when speaking English, though pretty much everyone between 10 and 70 years old speaks at least a little English
There's a couple of things. I think that generally if something goes wrng you're going to weant to get it sorted asap in case something else goes wrong and the two issues together put you in a far worse situation. For example, flying with landing gear down means that you're going to have extra drag meaning you're using more fuel. Obviously they have extra fuel on board in case of problems, and persumably they could still reach the destination since the pilot initially indicated that they wanted to continue to Rome. However, perhaps they would not have been able to reach their alternates in case there was an issue that prevented landing at Rome.
I suppose KLM prefers to repair their aircraft at home base rather than flying out stuff and people to another airport, or pay someone there to fix it.
Also, this was a fairly short route so there wouldn't be too much fuel on board. If there were, they would probably spend some time burning it before landing.
@@bando404 They do. Especially if they don't have certified technicians at the outstations. They also have a better chance to replace it with another aircraft. Being stuck at an outstation without certified technicians is very expensive and much more demanding on logistics, crew roster change, rebookings, ground transportation, hotel etc.
Why do they call it "landing gear"? The gear is used for taxiing, takeoff and landing. But of these three, landing is the only one that you can do without the gear-- albeit that's not desirable. Seems like "land gear" or "ground gear" or "terrain gear" or "rolling gear" would all be better names.
Landing is the part where it experiences maximum load. In other words, landing is the limiting factor on the design. Landing gear can be used for taxi and takeoff, but gear designed only for taxi and takeoff would immediately collapse upon landing.
Fun fact: according to AvHerald, this was a brand new jet on literally its first ever commercial flight when this happened. Its previous flight was the delivery from Brazil to Amsterdam.
PH-NXD is the 4th E2 so it isn't the first commercial flight of the KLM e-2
@@lucadevries5790 It was NXD's first revenue flight.
@@UnshavenStatue Indeed. It was obviously some kind of "child desease" at this aircraft. But due to Flighradar24 PH-NXD is meanwhile serving regularly its routes.
Bamboojets problems
Embraers can fly between Brazil and the Netherlands?!
Amazing number of planes and instructions for the air traffic controllers to handle. High-paced clearly audible English to and from people who are not native speakers. Hat's off to all of you!
Like many Europeans, the Dutch often speak better English than some native speakers.
many Dutch speak English fluently.
I am dutch and we start lerning english at school at an age of 10 years till we graturate . That is one of the reasons that dutch people are good in english. But to be honest. I often need google translate for the correct translation😅
I remember approach for ORD being that busy just constantly barking out a steady stream commands almost non stop. Pilots were all on their toes as well. Was quite amazing to listen to
I’m Dutch and while most first translate what they hear or want to say from Dutch to English and VV, for me I’ve never experienced that. Same with Swedish. I hear the language as if it’s my native one and can’t imagine what it’s like having to translate it first all the time.
Love how the Dutch pilots just switch between Dutch and English without even realising they're doing it.
Yep Tower said between the rest of de landing clearance for KLM57N "nummer twee" (number two). But all atc is in english here in the Netherlands.
Taking off for Rome. Now we need to go back to Amsterdam. We would like to go to Rome again. No wait... returning to Amsterdam.
If the gear doesn’t come up you cannot continue the flight. Maximum speed and altitude is limited and fuel burn is much higher. They advised ATC about their problem which is the correct thing to do.
By following some sort of procedure the gear could be retracted. Problem solved for this flight.
The question becomes whether or not the aircraft would need maintenance at Rome. If it does it might be stuck there for a few days until it is repaired. This takes some time to figure out because it involves a conversation with the maintenance department on the ground. During this time you’ll want to continue on route to your destination because of the limited amount of fuel you have: fuel burned holding near Amsterdam is fuel you don’t have to fly to Rome.
In the end the crew was likely advised to return to Amsterdam because maintenance would be required in Rome.
So I understand that it looks a bit as if this crew couldn’t make up their mind, but in reality they did the logical thing.
KLM pilots in their home base - switching between English and Dutch and ATC and pilots are precise and relaxed and it shows they know what to expect of each other. This would have sounded different if the KLM flight had the problem in Rome or New York. They sort of all have home court advantage.
love watching your videos. June 5th I was on Delta flt 892 JFK to Anchorage it had to do an emergency landing in Buffalo New York and stay the night to get fixed. Are you able to find that so we can hear what was going on with the plane? Thanks
avherald.com/h?article=4e8850ee&opt=0 AvHerald has little detail on this one unfortunately
Damn, these guys are on point !
THIS is how ATC is all about. Not the chitchat and bad terminology that is going on in the US.
First thing to do when the all gear don't come up: Lower the gear. If they all show down and locked, return to base. If they don't all come down, return to base, anyway and run the check list for "some gear missing".
Second thing to do: Land.
Third thing: Turn the aircraft over to Mx.
On these modern airliners there are some reasons why the gear might not want to come up, which have nothing to do with the gear itself. For example a solenoid which prevents the landing gear lever from being moved up while on the ground might be broken or stuck. In this case the landing gear system itself is not affected, just the lever lock, and the lever cannot be moved out of the down position. With a procedure you can override this lock in certain situations (some error messages are not allowed to be displayed) and be back in normal operation.
I suspect that they were not in a situation where a landing gear retraction (partially) failed, because then the sensible thing to do would be exactly as you say.
Another excellent video and graphics.
1:29 Can someone tell me, what does "request from Amsterdam radar" mean?
4:08 What does he mean by "Approach, goede dag"?
4:56 Is "Orange 26W" a callsign?
6:58 What is "RENDI1S"?
What does he mean at 7:06?
I can answer your second question: goede dag means „good day“ in dutch. The Pilot is greeting the man on the approach frequency.
First question, after ATC told the pilots to request from Amsterdam Radar means changing frequency to Amsterdam Radar. The ATC gave the m the frequency a few seconds later.
2nd question already answered.
3rd question. Yes, it is a callsign
Hello Sachin Kumar,
Amsterdam radar requested to the departure controller that KLM57N needs to fly heading 120.
Approach goede dag means, he greets the approach controller with Good day, and KLM57N let's know that they are on the controllers frequency.
Orange26W is indeed a callsign, it is for TuiFly the Netherlands.
Greets,
Marius Vlaar
Kukkī, Danish, Marius Vlaar.
Thanks Understood.
Can you also tell me, what is "RENDI1S" at 6:58 and what does he mean at 7:06?
RENDI1S is a SID
I must have clicked on the wrong link. Because there was no " Emergency Return ". Just some minor operational return.
Thank you very much! :-)
ATC asks if the landing will be Ops normal, not abnormal.
It’s better to have it not come up than not come down!
Maintenance forgot to remove the clogs and they came off on climb out. .... Clogs,... KLM.... Amsterdam.... I... 'm here all w.... OK I'm going .... :(
heading north??? - normaly heading 360?
Correct. An AMS controller "quirk"
I'm less worried about controllers saying North, than i am about pilots not knowing what North means.
Radar map looks great
One of the hidden risks associated with the gear not coming up is that the aircraft may not pressurise, so climbing about 10,000ft becomes a risk. Not really an issue at Amsterdam but more of a risk at airports with elevations over 5000ft and MSA’s over 10,000ft.
Wonder what made them change their mind to return to Schiphol after all. First they said to radar control that they would continue to Rome. Anyway better be save than sorry.
Most likely company decision, they were just continuing their flight whilst waiting for their operations to give a final answer
@@manatee82140 That is what I also figured out. Tnx.
Usually one pilot flies and the other is responsible for the radio. why are both pilots constantly alternating on this flight?
Because there is a problem and this isn't a normal flight - different phases of flight and different responsibilities - remember that they are also running checklists and talking to their company. Depending on what needs to be done at any particular time they will switch flying and communications responsibilities between them as needed.
usually Pilot Flying takes the radios while Pilot Not Flying starts running the checklists
Why do return if everything is okay unless it's their main hub there and got their maintenance there?
Klm is located at Schiphol so this makes sense
They were probably reminded by their colleagues on the ground that they won't find engineers in Rome (for cheap). I know we turned back from the middle of Germany once which was more than halfway through our destination, as they said they would rather have the engineers in Amsterdam look at the plane.
Well, as it happens, Amsterdam *is* their main hub and I suspect that their maintenance department didn't want to risk the aircraft getting stuck in Rome.
Schiphol is the main an only hub of KLM.
Where did the comment and following discussion about it being illegal to publish Dutch ATC comms disappear to?? Is someone censoring comments here? Why would someone delete comments like that which are in no way inappropriate??
Censor anything you don't like is the new thing
idk. What was the discussion about? How did it get started?
Belated reply. Sometimes even regular comments disappear. Probably YT AI admin culling the posts.
If the word 'illegal' is in a reply, probably it has more chance to be deleted.
So many instructions for so few aircraft, was the controller bored?
Better safe than sorry, or dead.
AMS is VERY busy. Normal there
Runway 27 is normally used with heavy west winds, which means it is the only runway available in that direction. So, busy yes and sequencing for close separation. Also many other factors like noise limits can play a factor.
AMS has a total of 118 approach and departure paths, so ATC has to keep all aircraft on 1 of those 118 approach paths
i think it's the European micro-management.
Better than gear won’t come down.
Hola desde, La Herradura, Costa Oriental, Spain
Shmoke and a pancake?
Hello can you please give explanation of FLIGHT LEVEL and the altimeter settings 29.92 , tremendas gracias en avance. Saludos Iberian
Flight level is the altitude the aircraft is at or assigned to be at in 100s of feet. For example FL280 is 28000 feet. The altitude is above sea level. The altimeter setting, 29.92 is the calibration of the altimeter based in the local barometric pressure. That's how altimeters work based on the air pressure. Since the local pressure changes with the weather, everyone needs to have the local barometric pressure. Above 18000 ft. everyone uses standard pressure, 29.92.
Flight level is referenced to standard barometric pressure (QNH 1013, or 29.92in). Altitude in feet is referenced to local pressure at sea level. Above a certain altitude (18'000 in the US but as low as 3'000 around AMS) ATC will switch from feet to FL so pilots don't need to keep calibrating their altimeter to local pressure.
@@sanchises hello 👋 tremendous thanks for you explanation 👍. Saludos
@@randybirkelbach801 hello thanks for you elegant comments. Notice the controller called as low as FL 60 . That is below 18000 MSL or class A . Sansiches explain that in the region 29.92 is set as low as 3000 MSL. I learned something new. Saludos Bro
I live very close to there and someone told me about this
Why do they all sound like Goldmember?
The actor playing Goldmember is Dutch. These pilots and ATC are all Dutch and have this accent. Very few Dutch people have a non-Dutch accent when speaking English, though pretty much everyone between 10 and 70 years old speaks at least a little English
Wouldn't the plane be overweight? If yes, was it really worth to land if all was under control?
There's a couple of things. I think that generally if something goes wrng you're going to weant to get it sorted asap in case something else goes wrong and the two issues together put you in a far worse situation. For example, flying with landing gear down means that you're going to have extra drag meaning you're using more fuel. Obviously they have extra fuel on board in case of problems, and persumably they could still reach the destination since the pilot initially indicated that they wanted to continue to Rome. However, perhaps they would not have been able to reach their alternates in case there was an issue that prevented landing at Rome.
I suppose KLM prefers to repair their aircraft at home base rather than flying out stuff and people to another airport, or pay someone there to fix it.
No, it's not an American airline.
Also, this was a fairly short route so there wouldn't be too much fuel on board. If there were, they would probably spend some time burning it before landing.
@@bando404 They do. Especially if they don't have certified technicians at the outstations. They also have a better chance to replace it with another aircraft. Being stuck at an outstation without certified technicians is very expensive and much more demanding on logistics, crew roster change, rebookings, ground transportation, hotel etc.
OOPS someone left the pins in again!!!!!!!!
They got the gear up eventually so i guess it where not the pins.....
👍🏻
Is this a three stooges episode?
Why do they call it "landing gear"? The gear is used for taxiing, takeoff and landing. But of these three, landing is the only one that you can do without the gear-- albeit that's not desirable. Seems like "land gear" or "ground gear" or "terrain gear" or "rolling gear" would all be better names.
Landing is the part where it experiences maximum load. In other words, landing is the limiting factor on the design. Landing gear can be used for taxi and takeoff, but gear designed only for taxi and takeoff would immediately collapse upon landing.
@@UnshavenStatue that makes a lot of sense.
That's why the British call it an "Undercarriage". But technically you are correct. Language doesn't always make sense.
No.
That suggests there can also be an uppercarriage for the brave landing it inverted.
Imagine using E190 :-
🤔
Those Dutch guys are really used to handling gear
Fly heading north doesn't sounds like correct phraseology to me.
It isn’t and it’s a surprise from a European controller.
Heading North is fine.
Heading north is just heading 360