Based on my experience, one week after roasting is the best period, it will stay very consistent about 3 weeks. Begin from the 4th week, it starts to deteriorated, we will need to grind finer in order to achieve the brew ratio of 1:2. My storage condition is in the airtight canister under a cool place.
This is a useful and nice to see it wrapped up in a short video. However, the title could be misleading because this is about the first cup that you have from a bag that was previously sealed. For most people the first cup from a sealed bag is fairly rare. They have far more cups hours, days, weeks or months after a bag is opened and store the open beans using a variety of methods. It would be great to see some testing on this topic.
You said what I wanted to say. He didn't mention that the nitrogen flushing effects are gone by opening the bag and aging accelerates. The information is good when buying fresh coffee beans so you know how long to wait.
Great video as always. The Nitrogen packing makes sense and is very interesting. I presume the coffee was used immediately after a bag was opened. Any comment on how long the coffee performs once a bag is opened?
Yes, we did some tests on storage of open bags of coffee which might help answer this: www.sevenmiles.com.au/editorial/how-to-store-coffee-beans-at-home/
Great informative video guys. Thank you. Do you bag your coffee beans and ground after 5-7 days after roasting to allow the coffee to degas before bagging and flushing with nitrogen?
Any idea what effects vacuum sealing the coffee beans would have on them? Would it be more similar to Nitrogen flushing since you remove the majority of the oxygen?
You will never pull a fill vacuum due to space voids between the beans retaining air with packaging. If you used strong enough packaging air pressure will literally crush the beans. In a lab vacuum possible but might suck your co2 out too meaning no crema and dead latte art.
Great info. So if a medium roasted & hand packed bag lasts for around 4 weeks, am I right to assume that usually a light roasted (filter) coffee lasts for at least 4-5 weeks without significant impact in flavor? I‘m keeping my bags at room temperature (about 22°C / 72°F).
That was a very informative video and nice and clearly explained, thank you Adam. A couple quick questions: 1. For the flushed beans were they just nitrogen flushed at the begining and once the bag was opened after resting you just closed the bag and put it back in storage, or did you keep flushing with nitrogen every time the bag was opened (forgive me, I have no idea if the latter is even practical)? 2. In a warmer more humid climate (such as in Singapore) would I be right to think it would degrade the beans faster compared to cooler less humid climates (or places with seasonal changes)?
Hi, good questions. 1) So for the nitrogen-flush samples, we stored 8 bags of the same (nitrogen-flushed) coffee at the start of the test. Each week we opened a new bag to perform the tasting. so we didn't need to reseal the bags - although it is possible to reseal & flush the bags...2) We didn't specifically test temperature & humidity in this test, we know from other tests that they don't help...we recommend freezing coffee is it is to kept for more than a few weeks
@@SevenMilesCoffeeRoasters so for nitrogen flushed if left unopened would stay fresh till week 8 right? But what would be the case if it has already been opened from the first week?
I usually buy coffee in 2.2 pounds bags. Once opened, I make four cappuccinos each day. Based on this, is it better purchasing in smaller bags - something around 14 oz?
Hi guys, great video. Quick question, are you supposed to grind coarser or finer as the coffee beans age? Also, is it possible that as the coffee beans get affected by humidity and become sticky when you grind too fine? I used the same grind setting after one month and I couldn’t push the arms down on my manual espresso machine (ROK), thanks
This was very helpful. Thank you! Under what temperature and humidity conditions did you get your results on ageing? Does exposure to sunlight play a role in the process?
Our pleasure 🙏 The samples weren't controlled for temperature or humidity, just kept our storeroom (Sydney in Autumn, not extreme ~ ave. 22degC at 60% rel humidity). We didn't test for sunlight, although UV light is generally not good for food storage.
It would be interesting to know, how fast would coffee age after the different aged bags are open. Open a fresh/aged bag and leave it for 3 days, 7 days, 14 days and 28 days in freezer, on a shelf and so one. Like in your open bag storage test. 1. Bag = Fresh roast 2. Bag = 14 days without nitro 3. Bag = 14 days nitro 4. Bag = 28 days without nitro 5. Bag = 28 days nitro Theoretically the fresh roast should be perfect after a few days opened storage. The worst should be the oldest bag. So the bag that was sealed for only 14 days should age slower when open then an old bag that was sealed and open
Very interesting! Does the conclusion that too-fresh coffee tastes harsh also apply to manual brewing methods? I would expect dissolved carbon dioxide to be less of an issue with unpressurised brewing methods. When is peak flavour reached for e.g. cupping or pour-overs? Do you have any data for coffee that is left open? Some roasters use unsealed paper bags and I've found these to go stale very quickly. Also, I think a very important issue that was not covered is how long the coffee remains fresh after opening, since many people won't finish a bag of coffee in a day. Maintaining peak flavour for more than 8 weeks is great, but doesn't help much if that isn't maintained for as long as it takes to finish the bag.
Yes, it's more of a problem with espresso due to the flow issues excessive CO2 causes with pressurised extraction. However, we still rest coffee for at least a few days even for other brew methods (cupping, filter, etc) due to the way the extra CO2 colours the flavour. In terms of open bags, we did a separate piece of work on that - although it was more focussed on storage conditions: ua-cam.com/video/PcQIIeaYmRE/v-deo.html
When roasting myself and out of aged coffee I found grinding and letting it stand for awhile speeds up the ageing. It’s still going to be rough but if your out of coffee it’s better than nothing.
Hi Adam, great video! Out of interest, what temperature did you store your coffee samples at (presume it was the same for N2 flushed & standard)? Thanks
Both sets of samples were stored together at room temperature (approx 22C) to represent typical cafe/home storage conditions, however temperature wasn't the focus of this particular test. More details here: www.sevenmiles.com.au/editorial/coffee-freshness/
It would have been nice if you had said whether the nitrogen flushed bags were opened prior to that 8 weeks testing. So, did you take a flushed bag and leave it sealed and then open and test it? Or was it open for 5 or 6 weeks, taking a sample taste every day, until that 8 week last test? Does the coffee age just as quick as the non-flushed bags once it has been opened? If it only lasts 8 weeks at peak flavor if never opened, this is fairly useless to real world usage, IMO.
Thank you very much for these explanations. May I ask you one question about the peak? You talk about the peak for flavours. Did you find that this peak for flavours was also in line with the peak of taste and the tactile? Again, thanks a lot for your great video, it is very interesting.
Yes, correct! We find the 'peak' to best represent all these parts of flavour. Being flavour itself, the tactile and the body. It's the representation of the very best it can offer.
has the roasted bean an closed cell or open cell structure? = open cell because it "exploded" in FC how comes. that people believe, co2 would sit there end degas? binding C to O2 is the natural way of decomposing the sun-energy. afterstarting pyrolizing the sugars (above 157°C) the process is starded. if there is no O2 to bind a C on, there will be also no "degasing" try it your self: directly after roasting and cooling, fill the beans i a O2-safe Vaccum container (no valve! no plastic! only glas or metal or a aluminium-foil-coffeebag) - add argon and let it flow to the ground - than vaccum it (best possible like 99,9%) = after 3 weeks, there will be no sign of "degasing" - because of the absence of O2 to bind the C.
Based on my experience, one week after roasting is the best period, it will stay very consistent about 3 weeks. Begin from the 4th week, it starts to deteriorated, we will need to grind finer in order to achieve the brew ratio of 1:2. My storage condition is in the airtight canister under a cool place.
This is a useful and nice to see it wrapped up in a short video. However, the title could be misleading because this is about the first cup that you have from a bag that was previously sealed. For most people the first cup from a sealed bag is fairly rare. They have far more cups hours, days, weeks or months after a bag is opened and store the open beans using a variety of methods. It would be great to see some testing on this topic.
You said what I wanted to say. He didn't mention that the nitrogen flushing effects are gone by opening the bag and aging accelerates.
The information is good when buying fresh coffee beans so you know how long to wait.
I found this useful. Great, engaging presentation too. Thanks.
Consistently a channel that has easy to use information. Refreshing to have in coffee media
I never heard the effect of CO2 turning into carbonic acid in the coffee brew, but it makes perfect sense. Thanks!
CO2 (carbon dioxide) + H2O (water) = H2CO3 which is carbonic acid. There you go :)
Great video as always. The Nitrogen packing makes sense and is very interesting. I presume the coffee was used immediately after a bag was opened. Any comment on how long the coffee performs once a bag is opened?
Yes, we did some tests on storage of open bags of coffee which might help answer this: www.sevenmiles.com.au/editorial/how-to-store-coffee-beans-at-home/
Great informative video guys. Thank you. Do you bag your coffee beans and ground after 5-7 days after roasting to allow the coffee to degas before bagging and flushing with nitrogen?
Any idea what effects vacuum sealing the coffee beans would have on them? Would it be more similar to Nitrogen flushing since you remove the majority of the oxygen?
You will never pull a fill vacuum due to space voids between the beans retaining air with packaging. If you used strong enough packaging air pressure will literally crush the beans. In a lab vacuum possible but might suck your co2 out too meaning no crema and dead latte art.
One might deduce a vacuum would be pretty close to the 2->8 week range since vacuums do a decent job.
What about a nitrogen flushed coffee packet which is opened after 2 weeks of roasting? will its peak also go down earlier?
Great info. So if a medium roasted & hand packed bag lasts for around 4 weeks, am I right to assume that usually a light roasted (filter) coffee lasts for at least 4-5 weeks without significant impact in flavor? I‘m keeping my bags at room temperature (about 22°C / 72°F).
Is there a way to find out if the coffee you buy is nitrogen flushed or not?
That was a very informative video and nice and clearly explained, thank you Adam. A couple quick questions: 1. For the flushed beans were they just nitrogen flushed at the begining and once the bag was opened after resting you just closed the bag and put it back in storage, or did you keep flushing with nitrogen every time the bag was opened (forgive me, I have no idea if the latter is even practical)? 2. In a warmer more humid climate (such as in Singapore) would I be right to think it would degrade the beans faster compared to cooler less humid climates (or places with seasonal changes)?
Hi, good questions. 1) So for the nitrogen-flush samples, we stored 8 bags of the same (nitrogen-flushed) coffee at the start of the test. Each week we opened a new bag to perform the tasting. so we didn't need to reseal the bags - although it is possible to reseal & flush the bags...2) We didn't specifically test temperature & humidity in this test, we know from other tests that they don't help...we recommend freezing coffee is it is to kept for more than a few weeks
@@SevenMilesCoffeeRoasters so for nitrogen flushed if left unopened would stay fresh till week 8 right? But what would be the case if it has already been opened from the first week?
How do you know if the coffee Bean has been nitrogen flushed or not?
Is there some way to tell if the coffee is nitrogen flushed by looking at the bag?
I usually buy coffee in 2.2 pounds bags. Once opened, I make four cappuccinos each day. Based on this, is it better purchasing in smaller bags - something around 14 oz?
Great video, thank you!
My pleasure!
Hi guys, great video. Quick question, are you supposed to grind coarser or finer as the coffee beans age? Also, is it possible that as the coffee beans get affected by humidity and become sticky when you grind too fine? I used the same grind setting after one month and I couldn’t push the arms down on my manual espresso machine (ROK), thanks
This was very helpful. Thank you! Under what temperature and humidity conditions did you get your results on ageing? Does exposure to sunlight play a role in the process?
Our pleasure 🙏 The samples weren't controlled for temperature or humidity, just kept our storeroom (Sydney in Autumn, not extreme ~ ave. 22degC at 60% rel humidity). We didn't test for sunlight, although UV light is generally not good for food storage.
@@SevenMilesCoffeeRoasters Thanks! 🙏🏽
It would be interesting to know, how fast would coffee age after the different aged bags are open.
Open a fresh/aged bag and leave it for 3 days, 7 days, 14 days and 28 days in freezer, on a shelf and so one. Like in your open bag storage test.
1. Bag = Fresh roast
2. Bag = 14 days without nitro
3. Bag = 14 days nitro
4. Bag = 28 days without nitro
5. Bag = 28 days nitro
Theoretically the fresh roast should be perfect after a few days opened storage. The worst should be the oldest bag. So the bag that was sealed for only 14 days should age slower when open then an old bag that was sealed and open
Very interesting! Does the conclusion that too-fresh coffee tastes harsh also apply to manual brewing methods? I would expect dissolved carbon dioxide to be less of an issue with unpressurised brewing methods. When is peak flavour reached for e.g. cupping or pour-overs? Do you have any data for coffee that is left open? Some roasters use unsealed paper bags and I've found these to go stale very quickly. Also, I think a very important issue that was not covered is how long the coffee remains fresh after opening, since many people won't finish a bag of coffee in a day. Maintaining peak flavour for more than 8 weeks is great, but doesn't help much if that isn't maintained for as long as it takes to finish the bag.
Yes, it's more of a problem with espresso due to the flow issues excessive CO2 causes with pressurised extraction. However, we still rest coffee for at least a few days even for other brew methods (cupping, filter, etc) due to the way the extra CO2 colours the flavour. In terms of open bags, we did a separate piece of work on that - although it was more focussed on storage conditions: ua-cam.com/video/PcQIIeaYmRE/v-deo.html
@@SevenMilesCoffeeRoasters Thank you!
When roasting myself and out of aged coffee I found grinding and letting it stand for awhile speeds up the ageing. It’s still going to be rough but if your out of coffee it’s better than nothing.
Hi Adam, Did the gas flush bags still have a one way valve in them?
Yes, same bags. The nitrogen is used to displace the oxygen. There's no easy way to tell the difference without asking the roaster.
Hi Adam, great video! Out of interest, what temperature did you store your coffee samples at (presume it was the same for N2 flushed & standard)? Thanks
Both sets of samples were stored together at room temperature (approx 22C) to represent typical cafe/home storage conditions, however temperature wasn't the focus of this particular test. More details here: www.sevenmiles.com.au/editorial/coffee-freshness/
Seven Miles Coffee Roasters Thanks Adam.
I say for filter 4/5days-1.5 weeks upto 2 weeks are the best then you can tell the aromatics just not being the same
It would have been nice if you had said whether the nitrogen flushed bags were opened prior to that 8 weeks testing. So, did you take a flushed bag and leave it sealed and then open and test it? Or was it open for 5 or 6 weeks, taking a sample taste every day, until that 8 week last test? Does the coffee age just as quick as the non-flushed bags once it has been opened? If it only lasts 8 weeks at peak flavor if never opened, this is fairly useless to real world usage, IMO.
Thank you very much for these explanations. May I ask you one question about the peak? You talk about the peak for flavours. Did you find that this peak for flavours was also in line with the peak of taste and the tactile? Again, thanks a lot for your great video, it is very interesting.
Yes, correct!
We find the 'peak' to best represent all these parts of flavour. Being flavour itself, the tactile and the body. It's the representation of the very best it can offer.
Thanks for the video. I would be interested in a study on the most ideal time for coffee with regards to its value nutritionally.
Is there anyway to tell from the package itself that it has been nitrogen flushed?
Not unless it's written on the label. The only way to be sure is to ask the roaster.
Is this why some people "bloom" coffee before they brew?
This is OK, thanks.
Im interested in buying nitrogen infused coffee from your company. Which brands are nitrogen infused?
Hey Michele, maybe this article might be interesting to you - www.sevenmiles.com.au/editorial/review-nitro-cold-brew-coffee-system/
has the roasted bean an closed cell or open cell structure? = open cell because it "exploded" in FC
how comes. that people believe, co2 would sit there end degas?
binding C to O2 is the natural way of decomposing the sun-energy.
afterstarting pyrolizing the sugars (above 157°C) the process is starded.
if there is no O2 to bind a C on, there will be also no "degasing"
try it your self:
directly after roasting and cooling, fill the beans i a O2-safe Vaccum container (no valve! no plastic! only glas or metal or a aluminium-foil-coffeebag) - add argon and let it flow to the ground - than vaccum it (best possible like 99,9%) = after 3 weeks, there will be no sign of "degasing" - because of the absence of O2 to bind the C.
I REALLY wanted to give this a thumbs down but actually very good info. Thanks
Weeks after roasting? What a load of hubba. Going for taste over effect i see