I've been a diamond top laner for 5 seasons, and have recently started jg. New to the role but your entire video is low elo plays. There positioning is awful, using non-cc abilities in mobile characters. Claiming the difference between master and challenger is bigger than iron and diamond is comical. Iron / bronze people are still learning their own champs, csing properly, understanding other peoples champs. In Master to challenger, challengers are able to exploit small weaknesses due to a complete understanding of all game mechanics. The knowledge gap is slight, but still increased, giving them an advantage.
I'm a master jungler, and yes I agree that the gap between masters - challenger is higher than bronze - masters, the few times that I've played against challenger players I was destroyed in a way that I could'nt destroy a bronze player.
i watch alot of high challenger streamers and everytime they do any sort of climb challenge, they all say the same thing, that under high master-low gm the game quality is completely uncomparable from what they're used to. even players that are known for never tilting in their games completely lose their shit in master games and pointing out their teammate's mistakes as if they were bronze and just didnt know what theyre doing
I don't deny the truth of what you're saying, but do you think it's helpful for lower-ranked players to think too hard about that? The healthy viewpoint is, "people are making lots of mistakes all the way up the ladder, so if I practice well then I can do this." But I could also see people getting frustrated and saying, "wow, I must really just suck if it's actually so easy." The truth is, going from Bronze to Master takes a huge amount of work for pretty much everyone.
@@kcStranger What is easy? He (and the vid) says it's a simple question: "does this play that I'm about to do have a high probability of succeeding?" But the amount of factors you need to take is not so small. The "easier part" is when it's under 6 min - but you still need to know enemies' abilities, think about how they can use them to outplay you, who is where on the map and what are abilities of enemies' that are close (do they have CC, how fast they move). This simple question tho, gets more complicated when people start getting items (when I am able to kill this person? Who I don't see on the map and what abilities/items they can use to kill me before I can kill this one target of mine) Btw. I'm not high elo, just cause I know what I should do doesn't mean I do it :O For me, it would feel like work, and I would get tired of thinking so much on a conscious level, constantly questioning what can be done. I just want to have fun and click buttons automatically :P (probably also "roll the dice" like in a casino - the thrilling excitement of not knowing the outcome) - and I imagine many players feel the same. I don't think it's bad to say that the basic rules are simple. Fundamentals always are simple, doesn't mean they are easy to consistently execute.
I've played lanes into masters rated players before and like maybe 2 times into challenger level players, you can tell the difference. You can play safe enough as a gold player and get enough xp and still come back into the game vs masters, you get completely and utterly dicked by the challenger player.
Well as someone who is Diamond, the difference between gold and diamond is just minimizing mistakes. 80% rule + playing safe unless you know more often than not a play works out. Part of the answer is something he doesn't mention tho. You have to know and roughly know champions cooldowns. If you know based on your CDs or their CDs how likely a kill will be is your deciding factor on whether or not to go in. I obviously am not a pro and have my own problems cause I've been hard stuck D3-4 for 3 years. But those things will help.
@@TmBeast17 I'm here stuck in iron 2 elo hell, I'm lvl 100. I understand that I'm better and others say that too (not much but atleast not iron 2), someone said I deserved bronze 3 but I thought that was too high and said bronze 5 is my estimate on myself. I don't really play too much ranked tho
i used to rotate with ryze, but they nerfed his waveclear, so now it is harder as i have to spend more mana, so if i try to push i end with no mana and resources, now i have to save mana by not pushing and pray to god the jungler wants to gank me so i can have prior.
Not just mid man. NO ONE rotates! Now forget rotating to objectives. What about when you gank bot lane and it should be 3v2 on a half health target AND YOUR FREAKING BOT LANE BACKS. Leaving you to die 2v1 and reverse the situation. I don't know how to jungle low elo because you can't count on anyone for anything!!! You have to gigaChad and solo objectives AND solo kills. If your laners help that's just icing on the cake, but expect to do everything yourself!
@@andy6302 omg this... low elo people ignore all pings. Its unreal. You can be fighting right in front of their tower 2 v 1 and still watch them complete a full recall rather than help you.
thats what I hate about high elos coaching. They assume your team will listen to you and move accordingly, that they will not force fights themselves, when it's the complete opposite
The real difference between low and high elo junglers, and it's something a lot of challenger players/coaches don't seem to realize because it's so second-nature to them, is that lower elo players are way less accurate when they're coming up with the percent chance a play will work out is. Sure, there's a lot of times where players just don't think about it, but I bet if you showed a bunch of clips like these to a random low-elo jungler and asked them what the chances are that each play would work out, he would be way off from what a challenger jungler would say for most of them. And that's if you did like what we had in this video, where you showed the clip, gave him a few seconds to think, while not having to do anything else. In a real game scenario where you're trying to collect all the info in real time and also play the game, the difference is even more pronounced.
yeah, like maybe kain even didn't knew what skills does Fiora have. I think you should play for each champ at least to the mastery of 4, for you to be able to tell this percentage even remotely close.
Shit half the time I’m like “this probably won’t work but let’s do it anyways” then I dash in and die for 15th time on yasuo while being down 5 levels but up by 100 cs lmao
Also you have to factor in will my teammate join in or watch. Had a game where me and Leona dived a Caitlynn and brand. Their abilities were down. Vayne freshly back from base sat there and farmed a 3 minion wave then decided to join in only afterwards. But they got away with 1 hit each had Vayne joined for one auto we would have killed both. It had a 75% chance of working. No flash in either. Abilities down. Over extended by a wall and recalling. Leona locks em down Vaynerchuk condemns and I was yi so damage. And boom... nope. Got hit with a net gun after we landed on them. Got a snap trap and then hit with a brand stun. They got away with each 10 health. We didn't die either. But wasted time sigh
As always, the problem with jungling "the right way" is that it's often not "the right way" in the particular ELO that you are in. It's great that in Challenger or whereever people know about win conditions, about how to play the lane, about what your jungler wants to do with a certain pick and which lanes are worth ganking for and which aren't, and so on. But in lower ELO none of this matters, because when you just farm your way up when no absolutely clear chance to gank presents itself, but your opponent's jungler ganks several times then your team will absolutely mental boom and lose the game solely off of that alone.
if your opponent jungler ganks several times and you're not in position to counter or gank another lane, that's an opportunity to steal camps on the other side of the map or solo an early dragon or rift herald. I just play with chat off so I have no idea what my team's mental is and play like everything's fine. eventually a lot of games can be turned around. I role swapped to jungle this year and I've got a 70% win rate on my main so far so it seems to be working.
I completely agree. For example, the antithesis to the video above is a gold master Yi player (not to mention any names), who farms the whole game and has little game impact. Imagine him watching this video, laughing loudly at the idiotic gank-plays of diamond players, and reflecting about how HE never wastes his time like that! In reality - he does not much gank at all - but is blind to his faults. Thus, advice is a very dangerous thing. While it can be extremely valuable, it can also be a crutch that holds you back.
@@TheAKD56 If you think for a second that "playing right" from a Challenger stand point of view nets you anything in lower ELO then you got a lot to learn. Just watch people like Hector from SC when he jungles and how he always plays for the lanes because he KNOWS how important it is for the laner to feel like the jungler has a proper presence. Also, I am not a jungler anymore, I stopped jungling in early S10. There is a reason why jungle is by far the least popular role these days - because of people like you. The way you are talking you are someone who has never really jungled and has no clue what it's like to be a jungler. Long story short: you are the delusional one.
If jungling "the right" as you said would get you different results in low elo THEN no challenger jungler would be able to jungle "the right way" in low elo which in fact is false. Put a challenger jungle in iron, within a day he'll be close to high diamond. A SINGLE DAY. And this fact has been proven countless times.
@@alan-sama7665 no dude, if you measure information in bytes, then 3 min would contain less. Other means to determine the amount of information are arbitrary, and we can't use them in the discussion. In my arbitrary opinion, there was nothing meaningless in the video. There was a thorough overlook. And btw, 10 minutes isn't that long anyway.
@@alan-sama7665 if all you can criticize is someones formal language yk you’ve already lost and are kind of a dick, he could’ve easily come at you while being toxic asf and youre complaining that his speech was too formal
Overall good video, 2 critiques: --I think it undersells the amount of experience required to make these sort of judgments in-game --I think it really hyperbolizes about how "easy" the game is below challenger Just because the mistakes are obvious when reviewing a vod doesn't mean the game is easy.
I think something people forget to do a lot is checking the games leaderboard. Checking this window and quickly reviewing every lane's CS diff, level diff, ITEMS even! This is all info you can get yourself and help you make more informed decisions :) I often get free kills because junglers will tower dive me thinking it's free kill for them but they have no idea I have stopwatch.
@@katattack707 u forgot to mention armor/mr, cause this tells u if you should start building some penetration or not. but yes, heavily agree. i saw a lot of times players rushing into, for example, samira on asasins, dying to her, realising that she is 8 0 160cs and start pinging their botlane and blaming for feeding her. if u want to climb, you MUST be aware of fed enemies
Dude context, understand that war is literally a race to the most resources and wasting 11% of productivity that early is insane. No lie before this video I knew this was a case I just didn't understand the practical application or I couldn't do the practical application myself. imo I think you just need to lose ez games with the mindset of a race and you'll understand how fundamentally ez league is from a team game view point. What I do is channel my inner texan and hide in bushes on a pink, works every-time cause the league community is Mexico and they like to stand in a straight line and shoot each other aka stare at each other in lane for 30 mins.
But those play are obvious even when playing if you are focus. The videos dosnt tell us the whole story tho. The diamond could have been tilted, tired from a long streak, first game of the day... Laners should be able to see the lv5 vs lv6 in most of their game as an obvious mistake. Jungle below plat are best offender of this btw. There more to the game than the one listed here obviously.
Honestly, jungle is the role that dictates the most in solo que. As an ADC main, I feel like I impact so much less the map its ridiculous. They can win or lose matches singlehandedly.
That's kind of the point of ADC. You don't impact the map. Your job is to get swole and dps while the team protects you, like a literal glass canon. If you want more map pressure, try ranged top like Quinn or Gnar, or play Ashe sup for a while and get the hang of making plays/ warding objectives/ roaming/ tracking other players/ etc.
I agree. But unfortunately, It is also one of the hardest roles to master. ADCs have it tough in solo queue, as their supports ability/style is a bit of a coin flip. Perhaps if you want to have more impact you should try pairing up in a duo?
@@aquamentai top lane has a huge impact on the map. Maybe you haven't had the joy of the opponent using hull breaker to take care of a couple turrets and inhibitor while your team dances around at dragon or baron. Also, have you heard of inting sion?
As a young kid I remember being really demotivated grinding in Runescape because the same amount of XP required to get from lvl 1-91 is the same amount of XP it takes to get from 92-99 (the old skill cap when I played). As I grow up and apparently hate myself with the hobbies I've chosen (league and golf) I couldn't ever anticipate how realistic that Runescape XP division was.
I got really tired of supports feeding on bot and decided to go back to jungling recently. I had an epiphany similar to the concept you went over in this video, realizing how much gold I was throwing away by overreaching for nearly impossible ganks and giving away my position for almost no reason. I jumped four divisions in one day after correcting myself every single time I went to do this. From B4 to S5 and sitting at an 80% WR with Udyr.
No matter how you do, try or perform if you have, trolls, inting teammates or smurfs in the enemy team stomping your bad teammates there’s no way you can carry a game, Riot needs to fix the Matchmaking somehow to balance games between low, mid and high skilled players, also about their behavior history.
This game has 12 years. They are never ever going to “fix” anything. They only care money and “balanced gameplay” doesn’t equal gain and popularity like toxic one does
@@ЛазарЙорданов-й7щ Its amazing how people fail to realize this simple fact. If its happening to YOU, then guess what? It's happening to the ENEMY. Be the difference lol. Tada > You've now climbed.
@@skylerfreeman1173 And it's unfair when we earn elo because of trolls, afks and such. Who wants to climb with lucked stolen LP instead of earning their rank? Yesterday I played 8 matches, sup main. 4w, 4l. Each of the losses had something crazy going on. In one I was in river bush, saw the enemy go in for an invade, so we all went to their blue. 10 sec before spawn our Kayn decided to 1v5 for his red and my idiot team trickled after him. I went bot and last hit until my adc showed up. Got him a double kill before third wave. How was that match a me problem, how would me having a higher skill have improved the team when they made calls like that all match? When I'd ping objectives or danger and they'd do the opposite? Another had an inting mid, constantly overextended and fed the Samira/Yuumi left 0/6 by laning phase, Sam ended 34/8 insult to my injury, only two of those from me defending base 1v5. We had up to inhib bot side and took up to tier two on the other lanes. How can I improve when the team doesn't step up too and I'm not a carry? Matches where all 10 of us are playing to win, I have an 80+% wr. Matches where it's a 4v5 for whatever reason? I'm the sup fam, and yes I'll swap to extra mage on Swain for chunking and W/Liandry's to keep lanes where I want them and snipe, but there's only so much you as an individual can do in a team game. A high schooler on a basketball team with 2nd graders will still be defeated by an opponent team of 7th/8th graders. It's made worse when temper tantrums/ mental booms happen. Look at Neace's "why I'm having trouble in Bronze" video, then watch his sup Ez and tell me he wasn't trolling the whole match, not with his pick but how he played, stole cs from a noob adc instead of setting up kills, choosing goredrinker onstead of mandate, etc. I genuinely would love for matchmaking to pair us all unequally and see just how good a Master is on a team of Iron vs a Gold/Silver team. I would also love to understand why I placed Silver last year and climbed but this year with a higher w/l they placed me in Iron... But what do I know in low elo, certainly not enough to climb in matches with two AI bots on my team that Riot told me they will stop responding to all my reports after I sent them timestamps of the robot behavior. It's almost like this is designed to be a team game, not a 1v9 game smh.
@@Undomaranel it's been proven time and again that if you deserve a rank, you will get it. Whether it's easy or hard or however many games it takes doesn't matter. It's based on You. If that weren't the case, people wouldn't be able to make multiple accounts and climb consistently. I've done it myself. Booster websites exist somehow right? Just how something "feels" does not in fact dictate how something is. I'm not justifying trolls in games or saying some matches arent literally unwinnable, but if you're consistently playing and actually trying to improve and climb, you should or you just aren't good enough.
12:57 this Jarvan 100% flamed Viktor for not coming to help this play. Junglers like these seem to always think their mid lane should always forfeit all their minions for a coinflip
I just want to say, immediately after watching this video I went and watched one of my favourite jungle mains, he appeared to do just this. Didn’t risk fights that were very hit or miss and just farmed. Even just watched for a minute as suggested and it turned out there was an opportunity and he secured his mid laner a kill
I've started implementing this as rammus early this season and I've climb from iron 4 to bronze 1 with a wr of about 70% without being much better mechanically, games have become soooo much easier to win, great info I'll definitely be sticking around for more info like this
You guys really deserve all your paid services twofold. Very inspiring and informing. When you are jungle basically you are moving to your minions, unlike laning. So you have to consider every second of the action, see&seize the possibilities then make the right choice.
5:30 he actually wpuld improve his early game bymore than 11%, because he was 89% effective and 89% * 1.11= 98.79% :) so hewould be 12.36% more effective if he omitted ganking top
Tbh I would avoid ganking top (as this kayn) and try to snowball bot or mid since most of the teams damage will come from vayne and fizz. That way it'll be easier to take objs. Plus, garen is better as a split pusher, so he Excells when the whole team contests obj so garen can take turrets. Its just like morde top. Morde rarely needs ganks because his kit naturally counters ganks with his isolated q procc and ult. Picking out which lanes to prioritize can help win games as jg.
i watched the "inside out" rule video and quite literally i think after 10 years of playing this game on and off it made me 2 tiers better a player in 10 minutes, my farm has gone up significantly and my map awareness and overall map control is in a different universe (when i remember to stick to it), really good vids here
Fantastically Presented! The metaphor of the ice cream cone was my favorite bit - honey catches more flies than vinegar after all. The reality of improvement is that it becomes exponentially harder the higher you go. Most people know this, but choose not to think about it as it is highly demoralizing... Yet through clever use of humor, promises and visuals, Skillcapped was able to convey this point - but without making anyone too insecure!
As someone whos hard stuck master for 2 season cuz im a boosted support player i got 2 things to say 1- I agree that the gap between masters and higher rank player is insanely bigger than whats lower than us . The rotation and decision making of those people is on another level. While mechanic wise we are on par and can match them aka i barely ever lose my bot lane, the transition into mid and late game is where we lack a lot. 2-The kaynn gank wasnt as bad as per say and youll see it even in high elo play challenger and such. By showing yourself top you give your top laner some pressure relieft and you force the enemy top laner to either play safer or to use a ward. Either way you are doing some work. Not all ganks need to have a flash or kill used to be succesful. League is way deeper than what this video is trying to teach you
Yeah my first thought when I saw the first "gank" was that it was less a gank and more a warning shot. "I'm watching you, back off". The garen isn't pressured, won't be forced into an early back, and if you get lucky, you get enough damage in to force an early back, which can be the difference between snowballing and losing the lane. I agree with the premise of the video, but that particular gank seemed fine to me.
@@Drianikaben on kayn it was bad. your early really has 0 pressure, and that fiora with any more confidence would just 1v2. achieving nothing is really bad for kayn as his power spikes come from items primarily, and then form. with how mobile fiora is the warning shot is more like a slap on the wrist vs if he just took gromp and waited for fiora to keep pushing. that way you take the guaranteed xp and gold, dont risk losing bot side camps, and still be in a place to apply pressure. if she say dived garen mid gromp, you can just e and join and the dive is a higher chance gank. also him not showing on the map is a warning sign in higher elos as kayns pathing is fairly predicatable if you know his first clear. idk how else to put it but that warning benefitted his team very little as that garen gained very little relief given in that situation kayn did jackshit yet kayn puts himself behind for that. just better to farm and when theres nothing to farm/enemies cross the river when you're in position then you go for a gank for form
Altough definitely true, there is one thing which may result in lose despite this improvement in low elo. When you choose no not waste time, your laner will do, die and then ragetroll.
Great video. I have one really big critique though! The way you calculate the lost gold. You say by spending that time not farming, they're losing gold. You are correct, however. You are *greatly* overstating how much gold they lose. Something you HAVE TO take into account when calculating the amount of gold they have the potential of losing is: 1. What they have already farmed And most importantly 2. How long until the camps they have farmed respawn. If the Kayne there had gotten a full clear of their jungle. I actually think that initial gank on Garen wouldn't be nearly as bad. It's still a bad play because of all the other factors (revealing yourself, and the chance of it going wrong and you getting nothing/dying). But, in purely a gold standpoint, it would have been fine. If all your camps still haven't respawned, then that time you're waiting for them to respawn (if you're not ganking, setting up vision, etc...) is also wasted time. Which... If we use your calculation for lost gold, that doesn't take into account respawn timers, it loses you so much gold! But in reality, that "Lost gold" is impossible to get, because it doesn't actually exist. There is nothing to farm at that point to get you gold. Other than that though, I agree with all the points made in the video.
If 11% of your time (25 secs) is worth 200 gold, that means you would have 2000 golds in 4 minutes (250 secs). But even though the math is wrong (because you are not always in combat with jungle monsters), the concept remains true, so whatever... I still appreciate 😅
Dude that 25 secs are supposed to be used at CAMPS u haven’t cleared yet. In that case the gromp was still there for Kayn. You don’t always have ur camps up but when u do u have a window of 25 secs to invest on them, and the reward is fixed as 200 gold. Every choice u make is a kind of investment.
Yeah, I thought same. Like it's true in concept, but math should have been calculated based on time to kill next camp. Including walking to camp and which camp was next. Then he could have calculated avg camp gold and time to walk to camp based on normal clearing routes and came up with a lesser but more true number. Either way, the concept is true.
All the advice in the world about league can only be applied about 40% of the time. Sometimes you get players that wanna grief and there's nothing you can do about it. One the best and truthful statement from a pro was this, "league is 90% mental and 10% skill".
I like this video a lot... One criticism though - while the overall idea is great, the math is not entirely accurate, because you also need to factor in the time it takes you to move from one camp to another, from base to camp etc. In case you're getting counter-jungled, the forced time loss can be even worse. The gold value is a bit lower than stated in the video in my opinion.
I didn't expect this video to be solely about junglers and i literally never jungle, but I found just in general with league (at least since I'm in low elo) that patience is key. I try to stop myself from making plays that feel like i'm overextending/chasing too much because usually if I just wait a moment and choose a smarter path that doesn't waste my time, often times I can eventually secure the kill because either 1. the enemy makes a mistake on their end 2. the smarter path i chose helps in the long run to securing the kill. Lmao I still struggle with this but it's something I try to remind myself while playing.
I'm not a jungle main, but I watch a lot of stuff about jungling so I know how play around my junglers better or if I'm autofilled. Even as an autofilled ADC main, I'll end up out jungling actual JG players because I play for a specific win condition and not try to over force coin flip fights. Unless your laners are getting stomped, staying patient and playing for good tempo instead of random skirmishes over nothing will make your games a bit more consistent. For example, going for gank top with both players just farming at full health while rift harold is still up. You might get the kill top and the harold, but you could also both die in a counter gank and lose harold. So you just take the uncontested harold to take a bunch of plates mid. It isn't the flashiest play style, but your play will be more impractical when you have a reason to make an impact
I‘m learning Jungler and I‘m already very cautious when deciding to gank. Ends up I powerfarm with Yi or Diana and not ganking pre lvl 6, but also too rarely afrer that -> my lanes loose because I dont impact and so does the game…
Honestly, I think a big danger with taking the advice of this video too far while you're still learning is that if you don't take a shot and fail repeatedly, you'll never learn what an 80% gank looks like. It takes a lot of practice and review to make those decisions well, and becoming a timid perma-farmer isn't the answer.
Jugar al Homero Simpson es algo absurdamente bueno pero si el enemigo está aplicando esa es mejor contar con un buen asesino para romper esa forma de juego y es encontrar un buen momento para cuándo hacer un gank por qué se centran demasiado en hacer un countergank así que pasar desapercibido es algo difícil
I think I agree, when my friend taught me how to power farm in jg I hit s1 from bronze in 2 weeks. This was like season 7 so it made an even bigger difference
What you wrote here shows only that this graph stroked your ego making you believe silver/gold players are remotely close to diamond players though, especially high diamond players.
@@xarhs6514 I'm guessing the channel is playing to the delusions of low elo players that climbing is more about luck. The real skill you need to be in each elo is an inverted pyramid not a small channel until challenger that's absurd. Challengers are just a cut above everything else and can be outside of this pyramid but there are massive differences between silver/gold, gold/plat players from my climb experience. For example by mid gold you are in the top 10% of your server. By mid plat you're in top 5% of the server. Might not sound like big numbers but the bottleneck is quite profound.
@@janu2997 It's true that the gap between a master player and a challenger player is quite big as they say in the video since there is a 600-700 LP difference between the ranks, but the same goes for all the other ranks. Just like master to challenger is 600-700 LP , gold 4 to platinum 4 is 400 LP so you need to improve a lot to consistantly win games. Also when you get to diamond the difference between diamond 4 players and diamond 2 players is so much bigger than a gold 4 to a gold 2 or a platinum 4 to a platinum 2 player it's laughable. Coming from a multi season diamond player peaking grandmaster. I think these videos give solid information to lower elo players and sometimes even to higher elo players that can be used to improve your game but by no means will a single change in your playstyle shoot you up the ladder when you do simple pre-game mistakes like having bad bindings and such.
The jarvan top play was fine until he massively overextended thirsting for the kill. It he had just stopped before that the lee would have been chunked leading to a free scuttle.
@@samprinter7960 The scuttle isn't free - lee is stronger than jarvan at level 3 and unless jarvan gets the jump like the video suggests (which is also a risky time commitment sitting in brush hoping lee doesn't get the instant smite+q) he doesn't get the free scuttle.
IF you say YES, and still lose. Then record the match, and rewatch it and analyze it. 1. Was it because of level or gold diff? 2. Positioning? 3. Mechanically Better? // Outplayed? - And if so why, did you not know their kit, did you use wrong ability order? Did ally fail in something? 4. Something else? Oftentimes you don't know WHY you lost a gank that looked good to begin with. SO try to learn and ask friends. Was it a win but you lost harder by the enemy jungle getting a bigger victory like dragon? or a double kill bot? Was there any move you could have done that would have been better? Sometimes enemy wins out in a trade on other side of map but you still did best play you could do. But double check. Maybe you should not have been top when drag was up or could have snuck herald.
I aim for 200 cs by 20 minutes every game and am sitting on a 70% win rate in silver 4, been working out well. Moving from Viego to a less mechanically demanding champion as well.
I've been thinking of getting into jungle some more, but I'm looking for a good farm jungler. I've been playing trundle a bit but not sure if I'll keep him. I've considered udyr. Who do you play when it's not viego?
I love the advice, especially the 80% guide. One question I do have though is specifically if we don't rotate to lane (which I agree is a waste of time in these examples), how do we respond to our laners without triggering them? If we ignore then they will ? us. If we respond to them about how it would have been a waste of time to rotate up, they will get pissed off and triggered. I can't see a win when you factor in the human/team aspect.
It's a great tutorial, however, I wonder how to consider every situation to make sure the chance is more than 80%, then make decision in such short time. Is it just about experience or are there ways to improve critical and quick thinking?
stuff like: level advantage, hp advantage, vision, how fed enemy is, how fed you are, is it an outnumbered fight, what cooldowns do they have - in the first example, kayn had no chance of closing the distance and no chance of doing the damage necessary to kill fiora - in the bot lane example his support was in base and enemy bot was pushing with big wave, so that's low % because cait has to walk past enemy wave to do anything and she's unlikely to contribute much, ganking there means u die more often than not cuz it's actually a 1v2 vs enemy bot + their wave. - in the j4 example i actually think that gank was high% because kennen will want to crash the wave and there was a window to sneak into the first lane brush and kill him as he tries to crash. if he bases without crashing, it's in a bad wavestate so the odds that he tries to push after te kill are quite high, and he is low enough to die to the EQ directly.
1- feel from playing alot of games 2-levels There are other factors but these are the most important ones ,levels matter alot even if it's just one level, lv6 vs lv7 means that lv7 will win 1v1 70% of the time
will, u say (Not Clickbait) and indeed it is Lytle i dropped from g3 to s4 and i was convincing my self that my team is bad but in realty i was forcing my self to lose after watching this i got back to my main and started to do the 80% rule and even punish the enemy jungler for reveling him self by taking his camps, it really worked!!!! now i got from s4 to s2 in 2 days, 70% win rate out of 20 games and every single game iam carrying and always 2 to 4 lvls ahead of the enemy jangler even the games i lost for real thanks a lot for that tip and deep clarification
i am plat and the diamond mistakes seemed very silly and obvious. id like better examples that can actually make plat and diamond players relate. regardless i liked the point of view you gave, ive always had this plays where i knew i fucked up right where it was to late to turn back, ill pay more atention to those mistakes now.
Mistakes always seem silly and obvious when you're 1) Not playing yourself 2) Having it pointed out You and the people around you make these and a ton of other egregious mistakes all the time. Don't be blind to them.
@@Thaiax The problem isn't the point about mistakes, but the frequency and severity of them. Even challengers can make noob mistakes like face checking bushes, no one is exempt from them. It's just that the likelihood of a challenger player making that mistake is a lot less than even a diamond one. Of course, the better you become the less likely you are to make really bad and obvious mistakes as well, but in general no one is exempt from making even the most noob mistakes. It's just that the likelihood shrinks with skill level.
I managed to get a powerleash early one game, got to head a few seconds over my record clear speed, revealed myself in midlane because of what they were doing wrong only to retreat immediately back in the jungle. Right after that, vi comes in and destroys me at my first red and for the rest of the game over a single reveal at 2 minutes and 18 seconds. Got hard flamed, hard camped. Top stole what they could. Bot invaded nonstop. All over revealing myself 2 minutes 18 seconds in. FF @ 15. Got all of the disrespectful flame from the team. I had to compliment that Vi. Good hustle, considering I was about to set a personal best for speed clearing until mid cucked itself.
I've known my problem for the longest time was forcing ganks. It was from playing junglers like Hecarim. It was feast or famine. So I started playing Shyvana, which is a different mindset. Switching the playstyle had me go from Silver 4 to gold 2- with a 70% winrate.
youtubes new "most replayed" bar is pretty dumb. everyone clicks to the "most replayed" part and it gets more and more replayed yet its just a random place that someone skipped back shortly after the video was released.
Skill Capped "you don't need brains to win games as jungle", also Skill Capped" isn't it obvious that you have a 10% chance of killing the top, 20% chance of them killing you, and, a 70% chance of them escaping? Duhh"
8:04 It's not JUST that... It's all those 3 you mention and on top of that neither Kayn nor Garen have any means to slow down or stun bunny hopping Fiora. She has to REALLY overcommit in order for that gank to be successful. It's the problem with playing Kayn in general. He can only gank if someone overcommits and he can be much more successful if he just steals camps whenever their jungler is present (which he excels at).
When you say "not clickbait" it means one of two things; it actually IS clickbait, or so many of your videos ARE clickbait that you have to announce when it isn't. either look is not good for you lmao.
I think this video highlights why people feel like they're losing even when they win in league. It's about mental. When you make rash decisions because you think your teammates will tilt you make poor choices to make them happy at the expense of your own performance. You're no different from someone that lets others control their emotions - you're offloading the responsibility and thereby control of the situation onto what you think the team wants. If you dont take control other people will, be that your teammates poor decision making, or the other teams pressure. Without any control people become frustrated and hopeless. The end result is a bad mental for you which obviously impacts your own performance. You're best off doing your own thing to increase your personal chances at winning. Any teammate would rather have an 0-0-0 jungler with 5 items than a 5-3-0 jungler with 3.
so here is why those 25 seconds being 200 gold is wrong. #1. jungle camps arnt constantly up and they will be there afterwards. while having the camps on cooldown today respawn creates more value for you, if you were to take the camps off cooldown each time, then it would only have your blue side be delayed by 25 seconds, which is 1/5 of the time it takes for non-buff camps to respawn. so only 1/5 of the camps’ gold is lost. and that’s if buffs spawned every 2 minutes, which they don’t. so, if we are being generous, these 25 seconds only cost kayn 1/5 of the (93x3) gold he could have had. so only 56 gold. so the gold isn’t really much if kayn thought foods wasn’t going to turn around. it would have been the correct play then, as if dior’s had stayed, it would have been a garunteed kill 90% of the time. HOWEVER, showing yourself on the map is a valid hinderance for your game plan and a massive help to the enemy jungler, but in this case, but wasn’t present so they couldn’t be ganked, his bottom camps were not up and couldn’t be stolen, and his thresh was in between viego and his pushed up mid laner so no gambling would be done. this play didn’t cause more than 50 gold to be lost.
That Gwen gank did not cost her 200+ gold because she had already finished her clear, and it did not take 30 seconds, more like 20. Bad example. Jungle needs to back after clearing anyway so using your hp to relieve lane pressure is good
In the Kayne example, the kayne needed to come from the other side of the lane, that is, tri-brush. He was in a bad position to gank and take advantage of the overextended fiora. Also getting help from the laner, by baiting in to a fight first, like Garen being more aggressive would also increase the kill chance. Now in those examples the fiora was being SUPER cautious and probably had wards in the bush, as one should when pushing up that far. Crossing the river and coming in from the tri-bush side would show if she had a ward there, as she would start to back off. If she didn't, then you can come in at a much better angle and cut her off from her tower. Either way that side of the map is much harder to gank top because of where tri sits, its much easier to sneak into botlane from blue side then it is from red, regardless of who you are playing.
catch your farm. exploit weaknesses in lane. factor in mobility champions on the enemy team compared to your teams counterpart. punish enemies with teamate leads. punish positioning. prioritize scuttle crab and objectives. easy jungling.
So from these guides i learn i should not go for risky plays, but this results most games in either my team or the enemy snowballing of chaotic happenings and me having a gold disadvantage with only 'safe' farm.
I don't know if i fully buy this. To quote detective marty hart: "you got any chapter in those books on 'jumping to conclusions'? You're attaching assumption to a piece of evidence... start... to bend the narrative to support it, prejudicing yourself". Let's see: you are accounting time and money without deflating their combined effect, which you should do by taking an analogy to the rent-substitution effect teached in economics. Also, by calculating "our" jungler's stats in terms of time and money, you are not considering that showing up on the map in lower elos can not only have zero effect on the other junglers' map pressure, but, and this cannot be discarded until proven wrong, you are not considering that perhaps in lower elos showing up on the map can ultimately result in higher winrates. This could be achieved by some weird interaction unclear to those who sell the idea the they "know the game". After all, if some coach discovered that the opposite is true, and if this resulted in trully remarkable winrates, I really doubt they would share this "trade secret" so willingly, no mentioning "for free". The problem i find with this type of lesson is that it takes a systemic problem, that is, the combination of an action and its effects on the entirety of the map, isolates a few aspects, and then generalizes this to something as complex as winrates. But if, as you say, knowledge is basically a rare commodity until master is reached, and if still some players climb and others don't, it could be some right measure of logical and "illogical" action that help people to climb, or, ideally, climb faster. This is the thing that is trully difficult to grasp: why more knowledge and "logical" decision making can be detrimental to overall achievement. Everybody knows being akf, or ganking badly, or not going for 'cheater recalls' is, in principle, wrong, but not knowing and applying this are not, in my humble opinion, the reasons for not being able to climb. The only thing we know is that climbing depends, not on winrates per se, but mostly on mmr. For this reason, if by playing normal and bot games with high elo friends and having high winrates really do affect one's mmr, as it has been suggested multiple times, then climbing is a function of normal game mmr and, perhaps, dodging promos at the start of the season. Ultimately, it doesn't matter if you incorporate this kind of knowledge until you reach masters, so long as you "manipulate" your account lp gains to obtain 4 times more lp for winning than for loosing. By doing this, you can climb EVEN WITH A NEGATIVE WINRATE. Of course, I could be wrong too, and this is most of the problem. Since the important factor for climbing is mmr, and since no one knows fully how it is calculated, people who read this message will never know for shure if the best thing to study for climbing is watch these kinds of videos, or simply find statistical evidence for things outside rank that influence your mmr and lp gains, permitting you to climb without the frustration that normally go hand in hand with this kind of effort. Before doing claims like those made in these videos, coaches should really have "sort of" controlled experiments with their "pupils", to see if this kind of logic really applies given a large enough sample. They also should take note not only on people who climb under their advice, but on those that climb AND don't climb after leaving those services. Finally, they should spend more time evaluating weird and non-llogical behaviour that still somehow function, like it seems to happen with thebaussffs, for example. Before ending, I just want to say that I don't disapprove of any kind of video like this. On the contrary, I congratulate the author for his inniciative, and only wish to speak my mind for debating purposes. Peace!
i've been iron since i started lol (1year) i've tried it all but whenever i get a 20 kill game my team can't help ganks. And every team i face has atleast 2 smurfers that are just insane for iron...
tried this in bronze. after 6 games of using the superior strategy to farm when the ganks were bad I routinely get huge leads. and then lost when the enemy jungler is 12-0 and my entire team flames me. 10/10 advice.
in counter-strike its the same! from silver to faceit level 10 low elo would be bronze to master, then level 10 high elo would be challenger. game gets crazy up there. as a low global i can see just how much there is left to learn and the ridiculous amount of mistakes i make on an average match.
My coach in hots told me same basically “fan pro hots player isnt doing Anything mechanically different than u…. He’s just playing the game the correct way……. And thats what the ranks kind of say. If your at the very bottom its cause you are competely playing the game wrong. When u get up to masters there a few thing you need to polish up that make a huge different in that rank”
i feel like you missed another reason to the gank being bad is the timing. the lane is pushing toward garen, his passive is almost up and he could have finished gromp waiting for the wave to crash in and then ganked a long lane, letting garen get 6
the 9:20 there is something else bad , garen had 2 waves under his wave , he also loss that , giving 300 gold to fiora on kayn kill + arround 250 g loss on creeps + xp
Man, before even watching this video, i always tried to focus on worthwhile ganks and optimizing my time spent doing things. Just like you said, if it's not going to result in success 80% of the time, do something else. The unfortunate truth that I found is that I really don't get that many good opportunities to gank if the enemy lanes are playing smart. Unfortunately this usually results in your team flaming you for doing "nothing", where "nothing" is me farming my camps.
And LPL... Take the advice from this video with a grain of salt. The 80 20 rule basically means full clear unless you know for a fact the gank is going to work. That might be ok if you're playing a slower paced game that allows you to scale and farm your camps freely. But say you have 1-2 lanes hard losing, and the enemy jg is aggressive, ganking and invading, you'll have no prio to protect against invades and contest objectives. Chinese solo queue junglers are hyper aggressive and are trying to impact the map from as early a lead as possible because in this meta an early lead can easily snowball the game out of control. But it takes a lot of trial and error with bad ganks, etc, to get to a point where you're skilled and creative enough to make tough ganks work. This is why China and Korea has the best Junglers in the world. It's like if Michael Jordan went to a random high school, he'd be forcing every single play despite getting double/triple teamed. It's the same thing in League. If you're good enough, you're going to want to force the issue and to do it early. Don't fall into the lazy perma farming unimpactful attitude of NA Junglers. They are high school players who aren't good enough to create plays, so they only take high percentage, uncontested open shots. Don't be like that. Be aggressive, be a killer, be Jordan, play like a Chinese Junglers, and while you might suffer a bit in the short term, once you adjust to a more forceful, imposing and creative playstyle, you will not only climb very fast, but notice a huge difference in the effect you have on controlling the game.
nice video but i still think theres a key point behind all of this that is missing, and that is that the jungler needs to project the teams draft and understand what needs to happen to win fights, objectives and eventually the game. jungler needs to help the team achieve the win condition, you can camp and execute good ganks, with 80% success and all on the "wrong lane" while enemy jg is executing the right ganks on the right lane and making sure his hyper-carry gets fed securing his team's win condition
9:15 I completely disagree with what you said. It looks to me like the problem here was a mechanical misplay: kayn dashing towards the alcove instead of towards the garen after ulting cost his life, then garen ulting fiora without waiting for the w caused garen to not get the kill on fiora. Is this wrong?
The problem I have with this video is that these 80% plays don't come out of nothing. If you just clear your jungle and never go for any gangs or plays unless it seems 80% sure to be a kill on Jarvan or Elise or Lee Sin, you'll most likely spend most games just clearing your camps doing nothing until you are outscaled and either win or lose with nigh zero impact on the outcome. To win and climb you have to actively tilt the flow of the game in your favour. You can't just sit back and do nothing but farm. This is doubly true for junglers, since they are the principal playmakers of the early game. I think at least for diamond and above jungling requires the additional step of thinking about how to *set up* oppurtunities that are 80% sure to win. The first decision to possibly gank top isn't made when you are sitting on gromp, it's done when you buy items at base and see that your toplaner is crashing a big wave into a Jayce so you expect Jayce to push back and be overextended. And in the end, that's really all farming is too - farming is not a goal in itself, it is setup that gives you the means (gold, xp) to make other plays in the future higher percentage plays. In short, if you walk around never seeing good oppurtinities and just farm you just don't impact your games and lose more often than not. You won't turn losses into victories with that strategy.
Many times i knew gank isn't good to do, i main fiddle in gold/silver and teammates always perma ping me until i gank then blame me for losing in gank... Ugh man...
this is true. if you a low elo player, queue up with a friend that is in D2 or below and you'll see how not much better these gold/plat/low diamond players are than you.
For the first question, I would say, High elo junglers don't do bad ganks (dying ganking is really bad unless they counterganked), meanwhile is really common in low elo that a 3v2 ends losing because forcing too much or whatever
i do think of the 80% rule when jungling but i can't never get right estimate in soloq but when i am in 5 man premade it is like night and day. probably because communication but it probably also cause i can ask my support friend to do menial task on the other side of the map as to get more information for my next move.
Not just for junglers, literally this rule works for laners too. So many laners force 1v1 plays, lose and then force them again, again lose and then wow, our mid, top or adc is 0/3 blaming jg for not ganking even when it was his/her fault for going for risky 1v1 and losing it multiple times.
i will say, a lot of this "do i have an 80% chance to win" theory is definitely impacted by your knowledge of champions. you could have the health advantage in a 1v1 and still lose just because their champ has life steal, shield and overpowered abilities. i'm not saying that's accurate but knowledge is impactful. Furthermore, jungle is a hard role to play. Let's say a good gank opportunity never shows itself because your laner is shit - always over extending into their turret and feeding them free kills. This means they now have the gold advantage. If a gank never shows itself you're basically useless and you're only there for farm.
The thing is as a jungler you get yelled at to gank even if it’s not the right time or 80% successful , man junglers have it rough. I always tell my buddy mute the chat , keep the pings .
Not everything can be measured by gold u need to also consider lane pressure against strong early champs. Also jg needs to help clear wave or push sometimes after teams death or gank
As a diamond main support i had to go mid for the first time so i chose lux and i went up vs a challenger jayce mid. i went 0/3/2 and won the game because my bot lane was just steam rolling and my one of my deaths i lured enemy bot lane to over extend on me and just plow through everyone. I still think we won based on comp because if that challenger player just went with an assassin or an ap carry they could have taken out bot but he went a top laner. I’ve never laughed so hard after a game.
Unlock 8 SITE EXCLUSIVE GUIDES teaching exactly how to execute this strategy to rank up at: www.skill-capped.com/lol/pricing/plans#80rule 👈👈👈
I got a one year membership. I know this Video 😉
I've been a diamond top laner for 5 seasons, and have recently started jg. New to the role but your entire video is low elo plays. There positioning is awful, using non-cc abilities in mobile characters. Claiming the difference between master and challenger is bigger than iron and diamond is comical. Iron / bronze people are still learning their own champs, csing properly, understanding other peoples champs. In Master to challenger, challengers are able to exploit small weaknesses due to a complete understanding of all game mechanics. The knowledge gap is slight, but still increased, giving them an advantage.
@@darksalarian7106 Challenger streamers(baus for example) says that too that difference is huge between best challengers and just masters
Jungler role is the easiest
-Dekar 173
I'm a master jungler, and yes I agree that the gap between masters - challenger is higher than bronze - masters, the few times that I've played against challenger players I was destroyed in a way that I could'nt destroy a bronze player.
Same also master, jg/support peaked GM but couldn't stay
i watch alot of high challenger streamers and everytime they do any sort of climb challenge, they all say the same thing, that under high master-low gm the game quality is completely uncomparable from what they're used to.
even players that are known for never tilting in their games completely lose their shit in master games and pointing out their teammate's mistakes as if they were bronze and just didnt know what theyre doing
I don't deny the truth of what you're saying, but do you think it's helpful for lower-ranked players to think too hard about that? The healthy viewpoint is, "people are making lots of mistakes all the way up the ladder, so if I practice well then I can do this." But I could also see people getting frustrated and saying, "wow, I must really just suck if it's actually so easy."
The truth is, going from Bronze to Master takes a huge amount of work for pretty much everyone.
@@kcStranger What is easy?
He (and the vid) says it's a simple question: "does this play that I'm about to do have a high probability of succeeding?"
But the amount of factors you need to take is not so small. The "easier part" is when it's under 6 min - but you still need to know enemies' abilities, think about how they can use them to outplay you, who is where on the map and what are abilities of enemies' that are close (do they have CC, how fast they move).
This simple question tho, gets more complicated when people start getting items (when I am able to kill this person? Who I don't see on the map and what abilities/items they can use to kill me before I can kill this one target of mine)
Btw. I'm not high elo, just cause I know what I should do doesn't mean I do it :O For me, it would feel like work, and I would get tired of thinking so much on a conscious level, constantly questioning what can be done. I just want to have fun and click buttons automatically :P (probably also "roll the dice" like in a casino - the thrilling excitement of not knowing the outcome) - and I imagine many players feel the same.
I don't think it's bad to say that the basic rules are simple. Fundamentals always are simple, doesn't mean they are easy to consistently execute.
I've played lanes into masters rated players before and like maybe 2 times into challenger level players, you can tell the difference. You can play safe enough as a gold player and get enough xp and still come back into the game vs masters, you get completely and utterly dicked by the challenger player.
That j4 example was definitely an eye opener for me. I’ll likely still be gold hardstyck but I appreciate y’all’s effort
Dude facts, I been tryna climb out of gold since the season started 😭
Well as someone who is Diamond, the difference between gold and diamond is just minimizing mistakes. 80% rule + playing safe unless you know more often than not a play works out.
Part of the answer is something he doesn't mention tho. You have to know and roughly know champions cooldowns. If you know based on your CDs or their CDs how likely a kill will be is your deciding factor on whether or not to go in.
I obviously am not a pro and have my own problems cause I've been hard stuck D3-4 for 3 years. But those things will help.
@@BobJason1 I know this may sound kinda dumb but I'd love to have your problem of being hardstuck in diamond rather than being hardstuck g4 🤣
play one, easy to pilot champion every game and work on the fundamentals my guy
@@TmBeast17 I'm here stuck in iron 2 elo hell, I'm lvl 100. I understand that I'm better and others say that too (not much but atleast not iron 2), someone said I deserved bronze 3 but I thought that was too high and said bronze 5 is my estimate on myself. I don't really play too much ranked tho
11:55 you forgot to mention that no matter how much you ping, in gold or lower, there's a 90% chance that mid lane will NOT rotate
i used to rotate with ryze, but they nerfed his waveclear, so now it is harder as i have to spend more mana, so if i try to push i end with no mana and resources, now i have to save mana by not pushing and pray to god the jungler wants to gank me so i can have prior.
Not just mid man. NO ONE rotates! Now forget rotating to objectives. What about when you gank bot lane and it should be 3v2 on a half health target AND YOUR FREAKING BOT LANE BACKS. Leaving you to die 2v1 and reverse the situation. I don't know how to jungle low elo because you can't count on anyone for anything!!! You have to gigaChad and solo objectives AND solo kills. If your laners help that's just icing on the cake, but expect to do everything yourself!
@@andy6302 omg this... low elo people ignore all pings. Its unreal. You can be fighting right in front of their tower 2 v 1 and still watch them complete a full recall rather than help you.
thats what I hate about high elos coaching. They assume your team will listen to you and move accordingly, that they will not force fights themselves, when it's the complete opposite
@@ferst262 IKR
The real difference between low and high elo junglers, and it's something a lot of challenger players/coaches don't seem to realize because it's so second-nature to them, is that lower elo players are way less accurate when they're coming up with the percent chance a play will work out is. Sure, there's a lot of times where players just don't think about it, but I bet if you showed a bunch of clips like these to a random low-elo jungler and asked them what the chances are that each play would work out, he would be way off from what a challenger jungler would say for most of them. And that's if you did like what we had in this video, where you showed the clip, gave him a few seconds to think, while not having to do anything else. In a real game scenario where you're trying to collect all the info in real time and also play the game, the difference is even more pronounced.
yeah, like maybe kain even didn't knew what skills does Fiora have. I think you should play for each champ at least to the mastery of 4, for you to be able to tell this percentage even remotely close.
Shit half the time I’m like “this probably won’t work but let’s do it anyways” then I dash in and die for 15th time on yasuo while being down 5 levels but up by 100 cs lmao
Exactly what i tought!
@@KahmannMan thats ok for an aram player
Also you have to factor in will my teammate join in or watch. Had a game where me and Leona dived a Caitlynn and brand. Their abilities were down. Vayne freshly back from base sat there and farmed a 3 minion wave then decided to join in only afterwards. But they got away with 1 hit each had Vayne joined for one auto we would have killed both. It had a 75% chance of working. No flash in either. Abilities down. Over extended by a wall and recalling. Leona locks em down Vaynerchuk condemns and I was yi so damage. And boom... nope. Got hit with a net gun after we landed on them. Got a snap trap and then hit with a brand stun. They got away with each 10 health. We didn't die either. But wasted time sigh
As always, the problem with jungling "the right way" is that it's often not "the right way" in the particular ELO that you are in. It's great that in Challenger or whereever people know about win conditions, about how to play the lane, about what your jungler wants to do with a certain pick and which lanes are worth ganking for and which aren't, and so on. But in lower ELO none of this matters, because when you just farm your way up when no absolutely clear chance to gank presents itself, but your opponent's jungler ganks several times then your team will absolutely mental boom and lose the game solely off of that alone.
if your opponent jungler ganks several times and you're not in position to counter or gank another lane, that's an opportunity to steal camps on the other side of the map or solo an early dragon or rift herald. I just play with chat off so I have no idea what my team's mental is and play like everything's fine. eventually a lot of games can be turned around. I role swapped to jungle this year and I've got a 70% win rate on my main so far so it seems to be working.
I completely agree.
For example, the antithesis to the video above is a gold master Yi player (not to mention any names), who farms the whole game and has little game impact. Imagine him watching this video, laughing loudly at the idiotic gank-plays of diamond players, and reflecting about how HE never wastes his time like that! In reality - he does not much gank at all - but is blind to his faults. Thus, advice is a very dangerous thing.
While it can be extremely valuable, it can also be a crutch that holds you back.
I think you are delusionnal, no offense, like most junglers tbh.
You problem is your inability to see opportunities from both side.
@@TheAKD56 If you think for a second that "playing right" from a Challenger stand point of view nets you anything in lower ELO then you got a lot to learn. Just watch people like Hector from SC when he jungles and how he always plays for the lanes because he KNOWS how important it is for the laner to feel like the jungler has a proper presence. Also, I am not a jungler anymore, I stopped jungling in early S10.
There is a reason why jungle is by far the least popular role these days - because of people like you. The way you are talking you are someone who has never really jungled and has no clue what it's like to be a jungler. Long story short: you are the delusional one.
If jungling "the right" as you said would get you different results in low elo THEN no challenger jungler would be able to jungle "the right way" in low elo which in fact is false. Put a challenger jungle in iron, within a day he'll be close to high diamond. A SINGLE DAY. And this fact has been proven countless times.
the fact that this really isn't a clickbait is terrifying
He could make the same amount of information in 3 min
@@alan-sama7665 no dude, if you measure information in bytes, then 3 min would contain less. Other means to determine the amount of information are arbitrary, and we can't use them in the discussion.
In my arbitrary opinion, there was nothing meaningless in the video. There was a thorough overlook. And btw, 10 minutes isn't that long anyway.
@@ВасилийБлаженов-ж9е dude do you always talk like that? I get what you mean but whats that formal language lol
@@alan-sama7665 def not so, it's just i'm not native speaker, so I kinda suck at adjusting
@@alan-sama7665 if all you can criticize is someones formal language yk you’ve already lost and are kind of a dick, he could’ve easily come at you while being toxic asf and youre complaining that his speech was too formal
Overall good video, 2 critiques:
--I think it undersells the amount of experience required to make these sort of judgments in-game
--I think it really hyperbolizes about how "easy" the game is below challenger
Just because the mistakes are obvious when reviewing a vod doesn't mean the game is easy.
I think something people forget to do a lot is checking the games leaderboard. Checking this window and quickly reviewing every lane's CS diff, level diff, ITEMS even! This is all info you can get yourself and help you make more informed decisions :) I often get free kills because junglers will tower dive me thinking it's free kill for them but they have no idea I have stopwatch.
Also in low elo working with your laners for what should be an easy 80% chance turns into coin flips.
@@katattack707 u forgot to mention armor/mr, cause this tells u if you should start building some penetration or not. but yes, heavily agree. i saw a lot of times players rushing into, for example, samira on asasins, dying to her, realising that she is 8 0 160cs and start pinging their botlane and blaming for feeding her. if u want to climb, you MUST be aware of fed enemies
Dude context, understand that war is literally a race to the most resources and wasting 11% of productivity that early is insane. No lie before this video I knew this was a case I just didn't understand the practical application or I couldn't do the practical application myself. imo I think you just need to lose ez games with the mindset of a race and you'll understand how fundamentally ez league is from a team game view point. What I do is channel my inner texan and hide in bushes on a pink, works every-time cause the league community is Mexico and they like to stand in a straight line and shoot each other aka stare at each other in lane for 30 mins.
But those play are obvious even when playing if you are focus. The videos dosnt tell us the whole story tho. The diamond could have been tilted, tired from a long streak, first game of the day...
Laners should be able to see the lv5 vs lv6 in most of their game as an obvious mistake.
Jungle below plat are best offender of this btw.
There more to the game than the one listed here obviously.
Honestly, jungle is the role that dictates the most in solo que. As an ADC main, I feel like I impact so much less the map its ridiculous. They can win or lose matches singlehandedly.
If you want to impact the Mao more then why play adc litterally any other role except from top is a better choice for map impact
@@aquamentai Because i've been playing it for years, itll take me awhile to learn a role as efficiently.
That's kind of the point of ADC. You don't impact the map. Your job is to get swole and dps while the team protects you, like a literal glass canon. If you want more map pressure, try ranged top like Quinn or Gnar, or play Ashe sup for a while and get the hang of making plays/ warding objectives/ roaming/ tracking other players/ etc.
I agree.
But unfortunately, It is also one of the hardest roles to master. ADCs have it tough in solo queue, as their supports ability/style is a bit of a coin flip. Perhaps if you want to have more impact you should try pairing up in a duo?
@@aquamentai top lane has a huge impact on the map. Maybe you haven't had the joy of the opponent using hull breaker to take care of a couple turrets and inhibitor while your team dances around at dragon or baron. Also, have you heard of inting sion?
As a young kid I remember being really demotivated grinding in Runescape because the same amount of XP required to get from lvl 1-91 is the same amount of XP it takes to get from 92-99 (the old skill cap when I played). As I grow up and apparently hate myself with the hobbies I've chosen (league and golf) I couldn't ever anticipate how realistic that Runescape XP division was.
I got really tired of supports feeding on bot and decided to go back to jungling recently. I had an epiphany similar to the concept you went over in this video, realizing how much gold I was throwing away by overreaching for nearly impossible ganks and giving away my position for almost no reason. I jumped four divisions in one day after correcting myself every single time I went to do this. From B4 to S5 and sitting at an 80% WR with Udyr.
Acctualy therers lot of stats that show its the adc who feed most of all rolls.😂
No matter how you do, try or perform if you have, trolls, inting teammates or smurfs in the enemy team stomping your bad teammates there’s no way you can carry a game, Riot needs to fix the Matchmaking somehow to balance games between low, mid and high skilled players, also about their behavior history.
This game has 12 years. They are never ever going to “fix” anything. They only care money and “balanced gameplay” doesn’t equal gain and popularity like toxic one does
Well what more do you want? You play versus players with the same rank, isn't that enough?. It means, if they are bad you are also bad at the game.
@@ЛазарЙорданов-й7щ Its amazing how people fail to realize this simple fact. If its happening to YOU, then guess what? It's happening to the ENEMY. Be the difference lol. Tada > You've now climbed.
@@skylerfreeman1173 And it's unfair when we earn elo because of trolls, afks and such. Who wants to climb with lucked stolen LP instead of earning their rank?
Yesterday I played 8 matches, sup main. 4w, 4l. Each of the losses had something crazy going on. In one I was in river bush, saw the enemy go in for an invade, so we all went to their blue. 10 sec before spawn our Kayn decided to 1v5 for his red and my idiot team trickled after him. I went bot and last hit until my adc showed up. Got him a double kill before third wave. How was that match a me problem, how would me having a higher skill have improved the team when they made calls like that all match? When I'd ping objectives or danger and they'd do the opposite? Another had an inting mid, constantly overextended and fed the Samira/Yuumi left 0/6 by laning phase, Sam ended 34/8 insult to my injury, only two of those from me defending base 1v5. We had up to inhib bot side and took up to tier two on the other lanes. How can I improve when the team doesn't step up too and I'm not a carry?
Matches where all 10 of us are playing to win, I have an 80+% wr. Matches where it's a 4v5 for whatever reason? I'm the sup fam, and yes I'll swap to extra mage on Swain for chunking and W/Liandry's to keep lanes where I want them and snipe, but there's only so much you as an individual can do in a team game.
A high schooler on a basketball team with 2nd graders will still be defeated by an opponent team of 7th/8th graders. It's made worse when temper tantrums/ mental booms happen. Look at Neace's "why I'm having trouble in Bronze" video, then watch his sup Ez and tell me he wasn't trolling the whole match, not with his pick but how he played, stole cs from a noob adc instead of setting up kills, choosing goredrinker onstead of mandate, etc. I genuinely would love for matchmaking to pair us all unequally and see just how good a Master is on a team of Iron vs a Gold/Silver team. I would also love to understand why I placed Silver last year and climbed but this year with a higher w/l they placed me in Iron... But what do I know in low elo, certainly not enough to climb in matches with two AI bots on my team that Riot told me they will stop responding to all my reports after I sent them timestamps of the robot behavior. It's almost like this is designed to be a team game, not a 1v9 game smh.
@@Undomaranel it's been proven time and again that if you deserve a rank, you will get it. Whether it's easy or hard or however many games it takes doesn't matter. It's based on You. If that weren't the case, people wouldn't be able to make multiple accounts and climb consistently. I've done it myself. Booster websites exist somehow right?
Just how something "feels" does not in fact dictate how something is. I'm not justifying trolls in games or saying some matches arent literally unwinnable, but if you're consistently playing and actually trying to improve and climb, you should or you just aren't good enough.
actually really appreciate all your videos- especially this one. Thank you so much for making climbing that much more clearer
well the videos are pretty shit. Some things they say are simply wrong. Sure its good for iron-emerald but if you are dia+ the videos are just comedy
12:57 this Jarvan 100% flamed Viktor for not coming to help this play. Junglers like these seem to always think their mid lane should always forfeit all their minions for a coinflip
I just want to say, immediately after watching this video I went and watched one of my favourite jungle mains, he appeared to do just this. Didn’t risk fights that were very hit or miss and just farmed. Even just watched for a minute as suggested and it turned out there was an opportunity and he secured his mid laner a kill
Can I ask you what's his name?
"Based on mid matchup, FLY will win LCS"
I've started implementing this as rammus early this season and I've climb from iron 4 to bronze 1 with a wr of about 70% without being much better mechanically, games have become soooo much easier to win, great info I'll definitely be sticking around for more info like this
i'd suggest you to look their othe vids about jungle tempo and other mechanics, got to plat kinda easy with that knowledge
You guys really deserve all your paid services twofold. Very inspiring and informing.
When you are jungle basically you are moving to your minions, unlike laning. So you have to consider every second of the action, see&seize the possibilities then make the right choice.
Fantastic video. Loved the math to articulate why a bad play (gank) is bad. Good job!
Too bad you can never trust probability, guess even challengers are silly
5:30 he actually wpuld improve his early game bymore than 11%, because he was 89% effective and 89% * 1.11= 98.79% :) so hewould be 12.36% more effective if he omitted ganking top
You must be fun at parties. Have my reluctant upvote.
@@Uthael_Kileanea haha
Tbh I would avoid ganking top (as this kayn) and try to snowball bot or mid since most of the teams damage will come from vayne and fizz. That way it'll be easier to take objs. Plus, garen is better as a split pusher, so he Excells when the whole team contests obj so garen can take turrets. Its just like morde top. Morde rarely needs ganks because his kit naturally counters ganks with his isolated q procc and ult. Picking out which lanes to prioritize can help win games as jg.
i watched the "inside out" rule video and quite literally i think after 10 years of playing this game on and off it made me 2 tiers better a player in 10 minutes, my farm has gone up significantly and my map awareness and overall map control is in a different universe (when i remember to stick to it), really good vids here
Fantastically Presented! The metaphor of the ice cream cone was my favorite bit - honey catches more flies than vinegar after all. The reality of improvement is that it becomes exponentially harder the higher you go. Most people know this, but choose not to think about it as it is highly demoralizing... Yet through clever use of humor, promises and visuals, Skillcapped was able to convey this point - but without making anyone too insecure!
As someone whos hard stuck master for 2 season cuz im a boosted support player i got 2 things to say
1- I agree that the gap between masters and higher rank player is insanely bigger than whats lower than us . The rotation and decision making of those people is on another level. While mechanic wise we are on par and can match them aka i barely ever lose my bot lane, the transition into mid and late game is where we lack a lot.
2-The kaynn gank wasnt as bad as per say and youll see it even in high elo play challenger and such. By showing yourself top you give your top laner some pressure relieft and you force the enemy top laner to either play safer or to use a ward. Either way you are doing some work. Not all ganks need to have a flash or kill used to be succesful. League is way deeper than what this video is trying to teach you
Yeah my first thought when I saw the first "gank" was that it was less a gank and more a warning shot. "I'm watching you, back off". The garen isn't pressured, won't be forced into an early back, and if you get lucky, you get enough damage in to force an early back, which can be the difference between snowballing and losing the lane. I agree with the premise of the video, but that particular gank seemed fine to me.
@@Drianikaben on kayn it was bad. your early really has 0 pressure, and that fiora with any more confidence would just 1v2. achieving nothing is really bad for kayn as his power spikes come from items primarily, and then form. with how mobile fiora is the warning shot is more like a slap on the wrist vs if he just took gromp and waited for fiora to keep pushing. that way you take the guaranteed xp and gold, dont risk losing bot side camps, and still be in a place to apply pressure. if she say dived garen mid gromp, you can just e and join and the dive is a higher chance gank. also him not showing on the map is a warning sign in higher elos as kayns pathing is fairly predicatable if you know his first clear. idk how else to put it but that warning benefitted his team very little as that garen gained very little relief given in that situation kayn did jackshit yet kayn puts himself behind for that. just better to farm and when theres nothing to farm/enemies cross the river when you're in position then you go for a gank for form
IT IS CLICKBAIT THIS VIDEO SHOULD BE TITLED The 1 RULE to ESCAPING LOW ELO for Junglers
Altough definitely true, there is one thing which may result in lose despite this improvement in low elo. When you choose no not waste time, your laner will do, die and then ragetroll.
Great video. I have one really big critique though!
The way you calculate the lost gold. You say by spending that time not farming, they're losing gold. You are correct, however. You are *greatly* overstating how much gold they lose. Something you HAVE TO take into account when calculating the amount of gold they have the potential of losing is:
1. What they have already farmed
And most importantly
2. How long until the camps they have farmed respawn. If the Kayne there had gotten a full clear of their jungle. I actually think that initial gank on Garen wouldn't be nearly as bad. It's still a bad play because of all the other factors (revealing yourself, and the chance of it going wrong and you getting nothing/dying). But, in purely a gold standpoint, it would have been fine.
If all your camps still haven't respawned, then that time you're waiting for them to respawn (if you're not ganking, setting up vision, etc...) is also wasted time. Which... If we use your calculation for lost gold, that doesn't take into account respawn timers, it loses you so much gold! But in reality, that "Lost gold" is impossible to get, because it doesn't actually exist. There is nothing to farm at that point to get you gold.
Other than that though, I agree with all the points made in the video.
remember guys camps are healthy food and ganks are oreo
If 11% of your time (25 secs) is worth 200 gold, that means you would have 2000 golds in 4 minutes (250 secs). But even though the math is wrong (because you are not always in combat with jungle monsters), the concept remains true, so whatever... I still appreciate 😅
yea but i have to walk to the camps too
Dude that 25 secs are supposed to be used at CAMPS u haven’t cleared yet. In that case the gromp was still there for Kayn. You don’t always have ur camps up but when u do u have a window of 25 secs to invest on them, and the reward is fixed as 200 gold. Every choice u make is a kind of investment.
Yeah, I thought same. Like it's true in concept, but math should have been calculated based on time to kill next camp. Including walking to camp and which camp was next. Then he could have calculated avg camp gold and time to walk to camp based on normal clearing routes and came up with a lesser but more true number. Either way, the concept is true.
All the advice in the world about league can only be applied about 40% of the time. Sometimes you get players that wanna grief and there's nothing you can do about it. One the best and truthful statement from a pro was this, "league is 90% mental and 10% skill".
I like this video a lot...
One criticism though - while the overall idea is great, the math is not entirely accurate, because you also need to factor in the time it takes you to move from one camp to another, from base to camp etc. In case you're getting counter-jungled, the forced time loss can be even worse. The gold value is a bit lower than stated in the video in my opinion.
I agree
I didn't expect this video to be solely about junglers and i literally never jungle, but I found just in general with league (at least since I'm in low elo) that patience is key. I try to stop myself from making plays that feel like i'm overextending/chasing too much because usually if I just wait a moment and choose a smarter path that doesn't waste my time, often times I can eventually secure the kill because either 1. the enemy makes a mistake on their end 2. the smarter path i chose helps in the long run to securing the kill. Lmao I still struggle with this but it's something I try to remind myself while playing.
learning jg will make you a better laner, in general.
@@rodmus makes you feel sympathy and stop flaming jg for your deaths, kekw
2:07 man's forgot about grandmaster 💀
I'm not a jungle main, but I watch a lot of stuff about jungling so I know how play around my junglers better or if I'm autofilled. Even as an autofilled ADC main, I'll end up out jungling actual JG players because I play for a specific win condition and not try to over force coin flip fights. Unless your laners are getting stomped, staying patient and playing for good tempo instead of random skirmishes over nothing will make your games a bit more consistent. For example, going for gank top with both players just farming at full health while rift harold is still up. You might get the kill top and the harold, but you could also both die in a counter gank and lose harold. So you just take the uncontested harold to take a bunch of plates mid. It isn't the flashiest play style, but your play will be more impractical when you have a reason to make an impact
I‘m learning Jungler and I‘m already very cautious when deciding to gank. Ends up I powerfarm with Yi or Diana and not ganking pre lvl 6, but also too rarely afrer that -> my lanes loose because I dont impact and so does the game…
Honestly, I think a big danger with taking the advice of this video too far while you're still learning is that if you don't take a shot and fail repeatedly, you'll never learn what an 80% gank looks like. It takes a lot of practice and review to make those decisions well, and becoming a timid perma-farmer isn't the answer.
Jugar al Homero Simpson es algo absurdamente bueno pero si el enemigo está aplicando esa es mejor contar con un buen asesino para romper esa forma de juego y es encontrar un buen momento para cuándo hacer un gank por qué se centran demasiado en hacer un countergank así que pasar desapercibido es algo difícil
@@kcStranger wooo well said.
@@viciuspossumalvesto9368 Homero simpson
I think I agree, when my friend taught me how to power farm in jg I hit s1 from bronze in 2 weeks. This was like season 7 so it made an even bigger difference
1:45 great representation of the ego players have based on elo. just make diamond a bit bigger than lower rannks : )
and make gold big as well
What you wrote here shows only that this graph stroked your ego making you believe silver/gold players are remotely close to diamond players though, especially high diamond players.
@@xarhs6514 I'm guessing the channel is playing to the delusions of low elo players that climbing is more about luck. The real skill you need to be in each elo is an inverted pyramid not a small channel until challenger that's absurd. Challengers are just a cut above everything else and can be outside of this pyramid but there are massive differences between silver/gold, gold/plat players from my climb experience.
For example by mid gold you are in the top 10% of your server. By mid plat you're in top 5% of the server. Might not sound like big numbers but the bottleneck is quite profound.
@@janu2997 It's true that the gap between a master player and a challenger player is quite big as they say in the video since there is a 600-700 LP difference between the ranks, but the same goes for all the other ranks. Just like master to challenger is 600-700 LP , gold 4 to platinum 4 is 400 LP so you need to improve a lot to consistantly win games. Also when you get to diamond the difference between diamond 4 players and diamond 2 players is so much bigger than a gold 4 to a gold 2 or a platinum 4 to a platinum 2 player it's laughable. Coming from a multi season diamond player peaking grandmaster. I think these videos give solid information to lower elo players and sometimes even to higher elo players that can be used to improve your game but by no means will a single change in your playstyle shoot you up the ladder when you do simple pre-game mistakes like having bad bindings and such.
@@xarhs6514 yeah I understand. Especially difference between low and high diamond. The bottleneck is a lot tighter than low to high gold/plat
It’s actually a pyramid and a funnel connected to each other in terms of learning. The last 20% improvement takes 80% of your time and vice versa.
The jarvan top play was fine until he massively overextended thirsting for the kill. It he had just stopped before that the lee would have been chunked leading to a free scuttle.
Yeah but hes also making a time comitment to that when he could be doing scuttle, scuttle is free regardless so Chungking lee is pointless.
@@samprinter7960 The scuttle isn't free - lee is stronger than jarvan at level 3 and unless jarvan gets the jump like the video suggests (which is also a risky time commitment sitting in brush hoping lee doesn't get the instant smite+q) he doesn't get the free scuttle.
@@ZZZ-vb2kl Viktor has mid prio.
IF you say YES, and still lose. Then record the match, and rewatch it and analyze it.
1. Was it because of level or gold diff?
2. Positioning?
3. Mechanically Better? // Outplayed? - And if so why, did you not know their kit, did you use wrong ability order? Did ally fail in something?
4. Something else?
Oftentimes you don't know WHY you lost a gank that looked good to begin with. SO try to learn and ask friends.
Was it a win but you lost harder by the enemy jungle getting a bigger victory like dragon? or a double kill bot? Was there any move you could have done that would have been better? Sometimes enemy wins out in a trade on other side of map but you still did best play you could do. But double check. Maybe you should not have been top when drag was up or could have snuck herald.
I aim for 200 cs by 20 minutes every game and am sitting on a 70% win rate in silver 4, been working out well.
Moving from Viego to a less mechanically demanding champion as well.
I believe that requires you to take a lot of enemy camps and/or lane minions, no?
@@dadarknezz Yeah I invade as often as possible when it is free, which is usually often after 8 minutes.
I've been thinking of getting into jungle some more, but I'm looking for a good farm jungler. I've been playing trundle a bit but not sure if I'll keep him. I've considered udyr.
Who do you play when it's not viego?
@@dadarknezz Morde, Rammus and Mundo at the moment!
@@LlibertarianGalt Ohh, that's quite interesting. Often teams need a tank as well, so those options is pretty good for the team :o
I love the advice, especially the 80% guide. One question I do have though is specifically if we don't rotate to lane (which I agree is a waste of time in these examples), how do we respond to our laners without triggering them? If we ignore then they will ? us. If we respond to them about how it would have been a waste of time to rotate up, they will get pissed off and triggered. I can't see a win when you factor in the human/team aspect.
It's a great tutorial, however, I wonder how to consider every situation to make sure the chance is more than 80%, then make decision in such short time. Is it just about experience or are there ways to improve critical and quick thinking?
Play 1000 games thats the best tip i can give u lol
This is why jungle is the hardest role AHHA
stuff like: level advantage, hp advantage, vision, how fed enemy is, how fed you are, is it an outnumbered fight, what cooldowns do they have
- in the first example, kayn had no chance of closing the distance and no chance of doing the damage necessary to kill fiora
- in the bot lane example his support was in base and enemy bot was pushing with big wave, so that's low % because cait has to walk past enemy wave to do anything and she's unlikely to contribute much, ganking there means u die more often than not cuz it's actually a 1v2 vs enemy bot + their wave.
- in the j4 example i actually think that gank was high% because kennen will want to crash the wave and there was a window to sneak into the first lane brush and kill him as he tries to crash. if he bases without crashing, it's in a bad wavestate so the odds that he tries to push after te kill are quite high, and he is low enough to die to the EQ directly.
If you aren't sure just go on and make the play then when you don't get anything from it you will know the limits and next time you will be better
1- feel from playing alot of games
2-levels
There are other factors but these are the most important ones ,levels matter alot even if it's just one level, lv6 vs lv7 means that lv7 will win 1v1 70% of the time
will, u say (Not Clickbait) and indeed it is
Lytle i dropped from g3 to s4 and i was convincing my self that my team is bad but in realty i was forcing my self to lose
after watching this i got back to my main and started to do the 80% rule and even punish the enemy jungler for reveling him self by taking his camps, it really worked!!!!
now i got from s4 to s2 in 2 days, 70% win rate out of 20 games and every single game iam carrying and always 2 to 4 lvls ahead of the enemy jangler even the games i lost
for real thanks a lot for that tip and deep clarification
i am plat and the diamond mistakes seemed very silly and obvious. id like better examples that can actually make plat and diamond players relate.
regardless i liked the point of view you gave, ive always had this plays where i knew i fucked up right where it was to late to turn back, ill pay more atention to those mistakes now.
Mistakes always seem silly and obvious when you're
1) Not playing yourself
2) Having it pointed out
You and the people around you make these and a ton of other egregious mistakes all the time. Don't be blind to them.
You do x10 more mistakes than them lol
@@Thaiax The problem isn't the point about mistakes, but the frequency and severity of them. Even challengers can make noob mistakes like face checking bushes, no one is exempt from them. It's just that the likelihood of a challenger player making that mistake is a lot less than even a diamond one. Of course, the better you become the less likely you are to make really bad and obvious mistakes as well, but in general no one is exempt from making even the most noob mistakes. It's just that the likelihood shrinks with skill level.
SC: "The answer is B"
And here I am thinking "all of the above!!!"
Not a problem for me, I PvE in Jungle and get flamed for no ganks :)
Yeah, top goes 0/8 but its my fault he ran it down
Relatable xD
Shilling in S2
I managed to get a powerleash early one game, got to head a few seconds over my record clear speed, revealed myself in midlane because of what they were doing wrong only to retreat immediately back in the jungle.
Right after that, vi comes in and destroys me at my first red and for the rest of the game over a single reveal at 2 minutes and 18 seconds.
Got hard flamed, hard camped. Top stole what they could. Bot invaded nonstop.
All over revealing myself 2 minutes 18 seconds in.
FF @ 15. Got all of the disrespectful flame from the team.
I had to compliment that Vi. Good hustle, considering I was about to set a personal best for speed clearing until mid cucked itself.
I've known my problem for the longest time was forcing ganks. It was from playing junglers like Hecarim. It was feast or famine.
So I started playing Shyvana, which is a different mindset. Switching the playstyle had me go from Silver 4 to gold 2- with a 70% winrate.
You can feast on jungle camps tho.
To be fair, Hecarim is more of a farming jungler too.
youtubes new "most replayed" bar is pretty dumb. everyone clicks to the "most replayed" part and it gets more and more replayed yet its just a random place that someone skipped back shortly after the video was released.
Skill Capped "you don't need brains to win games as jungle", also Skill Capped" isn't it obvious that you have a 10% chance of killing the top, 20% chance of them killing you, and, a 70% chance of them escaping? Duhh"
AHAHA hes saying like everyone played this game for years
8:04 It's not JUST that... It's all those 3 you mention and on top of that neither Kayn nor Garen have any means to slow down or stun bunny hopping Fiora. She has to REALLY overcommit in order for that gank to be successful. It's the problem with playing Kayn in general. He can only gank if someone overcommits and he can be much more successful if he just steals camps whenever their jungler is present (which he excels at).
When you say "not clickbait" it means one of two things; it actually IS clickbait, or so many of your videos ARE clickbait that you have to announce when it isn't. either look is not good for you lmao.
I think this video highlights why people feel like they're losing even when they win in league.
It's about mental.
When you make rash decisions because you think your teammates will tilt you make poor choices to make them happy at the expense of your own performance.
You're no different from someone that lets others control their emotions - you're offloading the responsibility and thereby control of the situation onto what you think the team wants.
If you dont take control other people will, be that your teammates poor decision making, or the other teams pressure.
Without any control people become frustrated and hopeless. The end result is a bad mental for you which obviously impacts your own performance.
You're best off doing your own thing to increase your personal chances at winning.
Any teammate would rather have an 0-0-0 jungler with 5 items than a 5-3-0 jungler with 3.
I think the one thing holding back like 80% of players is theyr EGO. I learned that for myself and being aware of that REALLY helps.
so here is why those 25 seconds being 200 gold is wrong. #1. jungle camps arnt constantly up and they will be there afterwards. while having the camps on cooldown today respawn creates more value for you, if you were to take the camps off cooldown each time, then it would only have your blue side be delayed by 25 seconds, which is 1/5 of the time it takes for non-buff camps to respawn. so only 1/5 of the camps’ gold is lost. and that’s if buffs spawned every 2 minutes, which they don’t. so, if we are being generous, these 25 seconds only cost kayn 1/5 of the (93x3) gold he could have had. so only 56 gold. so the gold isn’t really much if kayn thought foods wasn’t going to turn around. it would have been the correct play then, as if dior’s had stayed, it would have been a garunteed kill 90% of the time. HOWEVER, showing yourself on the map is a valid hinderance for your game plan and a massive help to the enemy jungler, but in this case, but wasn’t present so they couldn’t be ganked, his bottom camps were not up and couldn’t be stolen, and his thresh was in between viego and his pushed up mid laner so no gambling would be done. this play didn’t cause more than 50 gold to be lost.
That Gwen gank did not cost her 200+ gold because she had already finished her clear, and it did not take 30 seconds, more like 20. Bad example. Jungle needs to back after clearing anyway so using your hp to relieve lane pressure is good
Shall I go alone to a drake a minute after it spawned and without vision? My jungler: let's goooo!!!
shyvana jungler? :D
In the Kayne example, the kayne needed to come from the other side of the lane, that is, tri-brush. He was in a bad position to gank and take advantage of the overextended fiora. Also getting help from the laner, by baiting in to a fight first, like Garen being more aggressive would also increase the kill chance. Now in those examples the fiora was being SUPER cautious and probably had wards in the bush, as one should when pushing up that far. Crossing the river and coming in from the tri-bush side would show if she had a ward there, as she would start to back off. If she didn't, then you can come in at a much better angle and cut her off from her tower. Either way that side of the map is much harder to gank top because of where tri sits, its much easier to sneak into botlane from blue side then it is from red, regardless of who you are playing.
Yeah, if he'd knew viego was bot, steal His raptors/kruggs and gank
catch your farm. exploit weaknesses in lane. factor in mobility champions on the enemy team compared to your teams counterpart. punish enemies with teamate leads. punish positioning. prioritize scuttle crab and objectives. easy jungling.
Thanks for this one tip that only applies to junglers. Very helpful.
I'm a support main, but i think I'm going to adopt this when I'm deciding whether to roam/rotate or not
So from these guides i learn i should not go for risky plays, but this results most games in either my team or the enemy snowballing of chaotic happenings and me having a gold disadvantage with only 'safe' farm.
As a Nocturne, I normally don't gank until 6 unless they are grossly mispositioned.
well finally the 1% of the usefull and not click bait how to rank up videos
I don't know if i fully buy this. To quote detective marty hart: "you got any chapter in those books on 'jumping to conclusions'? You're attaching assumption to a piece of evidence... start... to bend the narrative to support it, prejudicing yourself". Let's see: you are accounting time and money without deflating their combined effect, which you should do by taking an analogy to the rent-substitution effect teached in economics. Also, by calculating "our" jungler's stats in terms of time and money, you are not considering that showing up on the map in lower elos can not only have zero effect on the other junglers' map pressure, but, and this cannot be discarded until proven wrong, you are not considering that perhaps in lower elos showing up on the map can ultimately result in higher winrates. This could be achieved by some weird interaction unclear to those who sell the idea the they "know the game". After all, if some coach discovered that the opposite is true, and if this resulted in trully remarkable winrates, I really doubt they would share this "trade secret" so willingly, no mentioning "for free". The problem i find with this type of lesson is that it takes a systemic problem, that is, the combination of an action and its effects on the entirety of the map, isolates a few aspects, and then generalizes this to something as complex as winrates. But if, as you say, knowledge is basically a rare commodity until master is reached, and if still some players climb and others don't, it could be some right measure of logical and "illogical" action that help people to climb, or, ideally, climb faster. This is the thing that is trully difficult to grasp: why more knowledge and "logical" decision making can be detrimental to overall achievement. Everybody knows being akf, or ganking badly, or not going for 'cheater recalls' is, in principle, wrong, but not knowing and applying this are not, in my humble opinion, the reasons for not being able to climb. The only thing we know is that climbing depends, not on winrates per se, but mostly on mmr. For this reason, if by playing normal and bot games with high elo friends and having high winrates really do affect one's mmr, as it has been suggested multiple times, then climbing is a function of normal game mmr and, perhaps, dodging promos at the start of the season. Ultimately, it doesn't matter if you incorporate this kind of knowledge until you reach masters, so long as you "manipulate" your account lp gains to obtain 4 times more lp for winning than for loosing. By doing this, you can climb EVEN WITH A NEGATIVE WINRATE. Of course, I could be wrong too, and this is most of the problem. Since the important factor for climbing is mmr, and since no one knows fully how it is calculated, people who read this message will never know for shure if the best thing to study for climbing is watch these kinds of videos, or simply find statistical evidence for things outside rank that influence your mmr and lp gains, permitting you to climb without the frustration that normally go hand in hand with this kind of effort. Before doing claims like those made in these videos, coaches should really have "sort of" controlled experiments with their "pupils", to see if this kind of logic really applies given a large enough sample. They also should take note not only on people who climb under their advice, but on those that climb AND don't climb after leaving those services. Finally, they should spend more time evaluating weird and non-llogical behaviour that still somehow function, like it seems to happen with thebaussffs, for example. Before ending, I just want to say that I don't disapprove of any kind of video like this. On the contrary, I congratulate the author for his inniciative, and only wish to speak my mind for debating purposes. Peace!
i've been iron since i started lol (1year) i've tried it all but whenever i get a 20 kill game my team can't help ganks. And every team i face has atleast 2 smurfers that are just insane for iron...
tried this in bronze. after 6 games of using the superior strategy to farm when the ganks were bad I routinely get huge leads.
and then lost when the enemy jungler is 12-0 and my entire team flames me.
10/10 advice.
in counter-strike its the same! from silver to faceit level 10 low elo would be bronze to master, then level 10 high elo would be challenger. game gets crazy up there. as a low global i can see just how much there is left to learn and the ridiculous amount of mistakes i make on an average match.
I'm a masters vi one trick. I can assure this is true. Climbing from masters is like learning the game all over again.
My coach in hots told me same basically
“fan pro hots player isnt doing Anything mechanically different than u…. He’s just playing the game the correct way……. And thats what the ranks kind of say. If your at the very bottom its cause you are competely playing the game wrong. When u get up to masters there a few thing you need to polish up that make a huge different in that rank”
i feel like you missed another reason to the gank being bad is the timing. the lane is pushing toward garen, his passive is almost up and he could have finished gromp waiting for the wave to crash in and then ganked a long lane, letting garen get 6
Well this video proves what every ranked player has been saying "it's because of my team that I'm hard stuck lol"
daaamn this was a really good guide, wtf Skill Capped! Didnt expect.
7:46 THE THREE OF THEM MY GUY
i love how this video is so true but if i showed it to any non league players, they'd send me to a mental hospital
but the lanes always die before we jungler have time to gank xP
this really helped my thought process. thank you!
Not only Kayn messed up the second gank, he made Garen lose a massive wave
the 9:20 there is something else bad , garen had 2 waves under his wave , he also loss that , giving 300 gold to fiora on kayn kill + arround 250 g loss on creeps + xp
Man, before even watching this video, i always tried to focus on worthwhile ganks and optimizing my time spent doing things. Just like you said, if it's not going to result in success 80% of the time, do something else. The unfortunate truth that I found is that I really don't get that many good opportunities to gank if the enemy lanes are playing smart. Unfortunately this usually results in your team flaming you for doing "nothing", where "nothing" is me farming my camps.
Most games there is no lane to gank. Farm your jungle and try to countergank or counterjungle.
Sadly the j4 top example has some flaws, because if he doesnt go top after Jax died, 2-3 waves get lost to tower + exp get lost too
This was amazing, thank you for this video!
This goes against another video that was posted that showed Korean high elo players moving to fights even when uncertain about the outcome.
And LPL...
Take the advice from this video with a grain of salt. The 80 20 rule basically means full clear unless you know for a fact the gank is going to work.
That might be ok if you're playing a slower paced game that allows you to scale and farm your camps freely. But say you have 1-2 lanes hard losing, and the enemy jg is aggressive, ganking and invading, you'll have no prio to protect against invades and contest objectives.
Chinese solo queue junglers are hyper aggressive and are trying to impact the map from as early a lead as possible because in this meta an early lead can easily snowball the game out of control. But it takes a lot of trial and error with bad ganks, etc, to get to a point where you're skilled and creative enough to make tough ganks work.
This is why China and Korea has the best Junglers in the world. It's like if Michael Jordan went to a random high school, he'd be forcing every single play despite getting double/triple teamed. It's the same thing in League. If you're good enough, you're going to want to force the issue and to do it early. Don't fall into the lazy perma farming unimpactful attitude of NA Junglers.
They are high school players who aren't good enough to create plays, so they only take high percentage, uncontested open shots.
Don't be like that. Be aggressive, be a killer, be Jordan, play like a Chinese Junglers, and while you might suffer a bit in the short term, once you adjust to a more forceful, imposing and creative playstyle, you will not only climb very fast, but notice a huge difference in the effect you have on controlling the game.
nice video but i still think theres a key point behind all of this that is missing, and that is that the jungler needs to project the teams draft and understand what needs to happen to win fights, objectives and eventually the game. jungler needs to help the team achieve the win condition, you can camp and execute good ganks, with 80% success and all on the "wrong lane" while enemy jg is executing the right ganks on the right lane and making sure his hyper-carry gets fed securing his team's win condition
Master/GM peak jg player here. Ppl really don't belive the gap from master to challenger is huge. Let me tell you. It is
9:15 I completely disagree with what you said. It looks to me like the problem here was a mechanical misplay: kayn dashing towards the alcove instead of towards the garen after ulting cost his life, then garen ulting fiora without waiting for the w caused garen to not get the kill on fiora. Is this wrong?
The problem I have with this video is that these 80% plays don't come out of nothing. If you just clear your jungle and never go for any gangs or plays unless it seems 80% sure to be a kill on Jarvan or Elise or Lee Sin, you'll most likely spend most games just clearing your camps doing nothing until you are outscaled and either win or lose with nigh zero impact on the outcome. To win and climb you have to actively tilt the flow of the game in your favour. You can't just sit back and do nothing but farm. This is doubly true for junglers, since they are the principal playmakers of the early game.
I think at least for diamond and above jungling requires the additional step of thinking about how to *set up* oppurtunities that are 80% sure to win. The first decision to possibly gank top isn't made when you are sitting on gromp, it's done when you buy items at base and see that your toplaner is crashing a big wave into a Jayce so you expect Jayce to push back and be overextended.
And in the end, that's really all farming is too - farming is not a goal in itself, it is setup that gives you the means (gold, xp) to make other plays in the future higher percentage plays.
In short, if you walk around never seeing good oppurtinities and just farm you just don't impact your games and lose more often than not. You won't turn losses into victories with that strategy.
Many times i knew gank isn't good to do, i main fiddle in gold/silver and teammates always perma ping me until i gank then blame me for losing in gank... Ugh man...
this is true. if you a low elo player, queue up with a friend that is in D2 or below and you'll see how not much better these gold/plat/low diamond players are than you.
Kayn was probably: “i want to get my red form as long as she is extending”
For the first question, I would say, High elo junglers don't do bad ganks (dying ganking is really bad unless they counterganked), meanwhile is really common in low elo that a 3v2 ends losing because forcing too much or whatever
i do think of the 80% rule when jungling but i can't never get right estimate in soloq but when i am in 5 man premade it is like night and day. probably because communication but it probably also cause i can ask my support friend to do menial task on the other side of the map as to get more information for my next move.
We need to know HOW TO PENTAKILL with teammates that run down games 50% of the time !!!
Yesterday I realized I'm an unstable player and also decided to jungle. Then I run into this video. The stars have aligned
Not just for junglers, literally this rule works for laners too. So many laners force 1v1 plays, lose and then force them again, again lose and then wow, our mid, top or adc is 0/3 blaming jg for not ganking even when it was his/her fault for going for risky 1v1 and losing it multiple times.
i will say, a lot of this "do i have an 80% chance to win" theory is definitely impacted by your knowledge of champions. you could have the health advantage in a 1v1 and still lose just because their champ has life steal, shield and overpowered abilities. i'm not saying that's accurate but knowledge is impactful. Furthermore, jungle is a hard role to play. Let's say a good gank opportunity never shows itself because your laner is shit - always over extending into their turret and feeding them free kills. This means they now have the gold advantage.
If a gank never shows itself you're basically useless and you're only there for farm.
The thing is as a jungler you get yelled at to gank even if it’s not the right time or 80% successful , man junglers have it rough. I always tell my buddy mute the chat , keep the pings .
Not everything can be measured by gold u need to also consider lane pressure against strong early champs. Also jg needs to help clear wave or push sometimes after teams death or gank
As a diamond main support i had to go mid for the first time so i chose lux and i went up vs a challenger jayce mid. i went 0/3/2 and won the game because my bot lane was just steam rolling and my one of my deaths i lured enemy bot lane to over extend on me and just plow through everyone. I still think we won based on comp because if that challenger player just went with an assassin or an ap carry they could have taken out bot but he went a top laner. I’ve never laughed so hard after a game.