I’m so happy to see a video like this being made. I once bought a pack of Estrella that was brewed in the UK as I’d drank it in Barcelona and really enjoyed it. The UK version was more or less undrinkable. Complained directly and they sent me some from Spain. Why we have all these nasty beers brewed in the UK but badges up as something European is beyond me. It’s incredibly misleading and should be illegal, actually. You can’t distill Glenmorangie in Poland and badge it as Glenmorangie. And you’re totally correct, the UK accepts the most awful shit. Not just beer, everything. There needs to be a drastic change to the British mindset, but I fear that’ll never happen.
I don't know mate. the last time Britain were left to make a "drastic" change hasn't seemed to work out all too well. I should think we'd be better off not consulting the people on anything important. They are clearly not capable of making logical decisions 🤣
I remember Stella in the UK going downhill when they brought out Stella 4 to fleece the public into thinking they had a new brew rather than a watered down tax fiddle. Becks did the same at the same time. Pretty sure it was something to do with higher tax on 5% beer. As for your excellent summaries on the UK public acceptance of shite is spot on. We as a nation are convinced that paying less tax is good but in turn we get human shit released into our rivers. Could be an analogy for UK Stella
We pay plenty of tax. The problem is the top few percent are creaming off more than they should. Water companies should've been forced to re-invest a set amount of money into upgrades and maintenance. Instead the money goes elsewhere. The worst people you can give your money to, are Governments.
@@IamBATMAN2024 any Scandinavian would think we were cheap skates who get what we pay for. We don't have a high living standard compared to many northern European countries.
No contest, the UK brewed is a low abv tasteless atrocity and has never matched up to the imported 5.2% which I used to drink regularly for years before my corner shop stopped stocking it.
Hi Simon, back in the 80's all the pubs in my area were Brakspears ( when they were a proper brewery). The only draught lagers they had were Stella and Heineken. The Stella was the full monty, 5.2% and the original Belgian taste. Well, as you know Stella did not earn the title of "wife beater" by accident. We tried an experiment in our local, mixing 1/2 pint stella with 1/2 pint heineken in a pint glass. The heineken took the sting off the stella and the stella gave the heineken some flavour. It proved so popular that the landlord added it to his chalkboard behind the bar! It was there under the stella and heineken as 1/2 & 1/2. So many people asked what is 1/2 & 1/2, when they tried it they were hooked. If you tried it now you would end up with a pint of p***water. 1988, 1/2 & 1/2 94p per pint, oh how I wish I could turn the clock back.
@@Welshhomie Yup but £5+ in the pubs which is taking the piss (and I don't blame the pubs who have been through hell with energy costs and covid). I can remember the "shock" when a pint of decent beer hit £1 a pint. Like you, I wish it was still that cheap lol. Or even £2.50 would be reasonable but... Welcome to Britain 2023 eh?
When it was 5.2 % in Britain....it really stood out from the crowd. At 4.6% it is a poor version of itself and now i rarely drink it. It's a shame because it was a legendary beer.
100% agree it used to have such depth and flavour and tasted like no other lager. The modern version is like any old tasteless fizz and is a shadow of its former glory. I stopped buying it.
Couldn't agree with you more, Stella now is awful and leaves a bitter taste in your mouth it lost its sweetness. It was my drink of choice in the 90s early 00s but when the design of the can changed that embossed logo was probably the same time it was brewed in the UK. Stella needs to get a grip, I'd pay the extra to have it as brewed in Belgium.
A classic! I remember buying imported Stella near where I lived as a young man and refusing the UK stuff. I've not seen the import for so many years. This is a great vid. You just popped up on my feed, never seen a channel like this before!
Ab InBev have a lot to answer for. Budweiser abv 5.0 - 4.8 (2012) - 4.5 (2017) Stella abv 5.2 - 5.0 (2007) - 4.8 (2012) - 4.6 (2020) Becks abv 5.0 - 4.8 (2012) - 4.0 (2020) Introduced Bud Light to the UK market at abv 3.5 when in the USA it is 4.2. All to do with tax savings. They also bought the Rolling Rock brand around 2006 and then promptly withdrew it from the UK market.
I remember when Stella first came to the UK. It was so strong they only sold it half pints (that was the story anyway). It was light years better than the pond water they sell now.
Bought 4 cans yesterday, haven't drank Stella for years. I could tell the difference immediately. It tastes like cheap, supermarket own brand lager now.
I remember when they reduced the strength below 5% to avoid higher tax.. at the time I remember thinking that in reality, it cannot be Stella Artois because the recipe had been changed to produce a weaker beer. And should no longer be allowed to be called Stella Artois if it's made using a different recipe
I was a mid-late teen when we were based in Belgium. Stella was the local tipple and when I experienced a UK version several years later the difference was massive.
I was in Brussels about a week ago and I was flabbergasted how good the Stella was compared to back home. I was well happy sitting in the sunshine, drinking a few pints of it with a few mates. But to be honest I really shouldn't have been so surprised.
Agree Stella is dreadful nowadays, I remember back in 80’s when Stella was introduced next to XXXX and it showed up all the UK and Aussie beers. Now it’s a pale shadow of itself. I was over in Dubai recently and they had the 5.2% on draught, perfect.
Excellent review Simon was looking forward to hearing your opinion and knowledge on that. I really enjoyed the Belgium Stella its a taste of its own👌. Growing up Stella was the premier lager drink and was known as quality and the best it had an excellent brand. Then they started to mess with it.. 20 years later i seriously dont no any body who would dream of buying Stella in UK it might as well be carling.
Sorry if you've already picked up on this, but Leffe have recently reduced the ABV of their Blonde from 6.6% to 6.0%. I can taste a difference. Would love to see you do a comparison between the two and hear your opinion... if you can still find a bottle of the 6.6%.
You can find proper Stella in some ethnic corner shops and off licenses, in cans, usually around only £1 each. The can is different and has multiple languages and embossed lettering. Lorry drivers smuggle or bring it in without duty and sell it to the shops. There is no comparison between the UK version and the real article. I can find it in several places in south Birmingham, when I find some I telephone a few friends and usually buy the lot and get a decent discount.
I've been saying this to my mates for years, the British brewed versions of a lot of lagers are rubbish! Corona used to be a decent drop on a hot day but the brewed in the UK version they sell nowadays is awful 🤢 Heineken is another good example!
Juplier in Belgium is better again brewed by inbev Belgium Stella is still very good can be hard on the stomach though! The UK stuff is really bad great vblog
I’m very surprised a company would accept an inferior product being produced under their brand name. I doubt it’s the water, as with chemicals and filters you can reproduce the same water purity. Perhaps it’s just what the public want?
@@fanfeck2844 or the English brewers don’t know what they’re doing. I bought 4 cans of the unfiltered Stella yesterday and can’t see what’s wrong with it. Maybe I’m use to shit lager idk or maybe I have bad taste. Probably the latter 😅
@@IamBATMAN2024 doubt it’s the brewers. Englands been making beers longer than Belgium has existed. It’s more likely something to do with cost and protecting their margins.
I totally agree with you. And everything you said goes double for European beers brewed here in the USA. I grew up in Brooklyn, NY and started drinking beer at a far too young age. But with that said in the early 1970"s when Löwenbräu was imported from Germany it was my favorite beer. But after Miller Brewing company attained the rights to brew it in America it went totally to shit. Like you said the difference was day and night, and not a good night at that. It cuts into the profit margin when you brew a beer elsewhere like it's was originally brewed in its place of origin. This is why the companies do this in the first place. It's all about maximizing profits. And the quality of the beer (and the consumer) be damned. I really like the content on your channel. I especially liked your review of Fuller's ESB. I agree with you that it's a definite 10/10 beer. It's been near or at the top of my best of list for decades. Cheers!!
I remember back in the late seventies we used to drink Stella before a gig in the same pub in St Albans, the beer was brewed in Belgium. One weekend we were there for a gig and it was brewed in Luton. Lots of rushing to the toilet to throw up including myself. Never drank Stella again.
Cool idea! When I visited London, as a Belgian I got offered a lot of drinks with: "Oh you're Belgian, you must know this!" All kinds of Stella Artois I had never seen before and lager I didn't like at all :D
Back in 1975 when I was19, I went to Amsterdam for the first time, and remember drinking Heineken and thinking, why does this taste so much better than the Heineken piss water we get back home. Around the same time, you could get Australian brewed Fosters in cans only, and not everywhere. It tasted so much better than the British brewed lagers, although my favourite (Australian) canned lager was Swan Lager. Then Fosters started being brewed under licence in the UK. It was different and worse, even the cans, than the original.
Thank you so much for your comparison. You are right. Sella in the 90's was a great taste, I really enjoyed it. Same with 1664 Kronenberg, loved it in the 1990's. Things changed. Now those are my last choices. Sam Miguel, I had it in Madrid in 2023. Tried it in 2023 London and it was different. Perhaps it's UK brewers trying to cut costs with concentrates. The upset is now I focus local craft beers and ales.
Your review mirrors exactly what I’ve thought for ages. That horrible watery, astringent taste of the U.K. muck. My first taste of Belgian Stella was a revelation!
The problem you are describing when comparing the Belgian and the British brewed Stellas is partly due to international ownership of what used to be local brewers and partly due to legislation. C&C group plc now owns Tennent Caledonian Breweries, having purchased it from Belgian brewing company Anheuser-Busch InBev, who owned the Stella Artois Brand. The Stella sold in Scotland (and possibly the rest of the UK) is brewed at the Tennent's brewery in Glasgow and used to be 5.2% until the introduction of a Scotland wide law that set a minimum price for alcoholic drinks, based on alcohol content. (50 pence per unit). Following introduction of this law most brewers reduced the alcohol content of their brews to try to off-set the price increases the law created, hence the lower alcohol content of the British brewed version. If the Stella brand had been retained by the original Belgian owners, I am certain that they would have insisted that products using their brand elsewhere in the world should have maintained the same characteristics of the original in order to not undermine their reputation for a quality product. Now that the brand is owned by an international conglomerate they can do with it as they wish and use the brand name for inferior products to trade on the reputation of the original product that they bought out. This includes varying the alcohol content, which is a major part of the flavour profile of any beer. A friend of mine, who is a Chemistry graduate, used to work for Tennents back in the 1970s in their quality control labs. I remember him telling me that while different flavours can result from slight variations in the brewing process these were anathema to the production of lager where they wanted a consistent product that tasted no different from batch to batch. Alas, it seems to me that we are now seeing that mind-set applied across brands as well.
Good review. Accountants know the price of everything and the value of nothing. Marketing think they can sell rubbish to the council tip. Put them together and you get Eurolager and it is ubiquitous.
As a Brit who lives in South America, the Stella here is brewed in Argentina. I must say, it's pleasantly surprising how good it is. It tastes more like the Stella of old. Plus they actively seem to add more beers to their arsenal, just last week I got a "Stella Noire" which was a decent'ish black lager.
I'm normally a Guinness drinker, but a few weeks back a visitor came over with a few different beers to share - Morretti lager and Cobra were among them. I swear, if you drink them side by side there's no difference what so ever. I wouldn't have believed it unless I tried it.
I like stella more now 🤣 i was drinking San Miguel all the time but i honestly don't mind the Stella UK brewed stuff. I find myself buying it more, maybe because its cheaper, but to me it still tastes fine.
@@MrJamessmith90 These brewers don't want a choice available. Now I firmly believe that we have the best beers in the world brewed in England. One only has to check out independent and craft beer breweries throughout England to taste phenomenal beers. If I want foreign beer I want the best foreign beers, not degraded imitations. I understand Stella Artois in Belgium is a good beer and so is Staropramen in Czechia. They're brewed here to an inferior standard and why do people tolerate it. I'm wondering if the same degradation of standards is happening with Brooklyn Lager. I always drank this beer going back years. Since its being brewed here I don't trust the quality. I need to try out US brewed Brooklyn Lager and compare to UK brewed version. You know even such dismal beers as Budweiser, Coors and Corona piss poor as they are in their home countries are brewed here in the UK and made even worse. That's hard to believe, but it's true.
There seemed to be a time in the 00s when they tied turned and we started getting decent Continental lager. Heineken went export only for a while, we had decent grolsch, decent Stella and carlsberg export was genuinely export. Then the breweries realised they could save a few pennies on tax by slowly dropping the abv to the mess we have now. Even brewdog doing the same by dropping punk ipa from 5.6 to 5.2
I like the pint cans 4.6%, nice and cold, good long drink for £1.50 a chug. When in Saigon in the 247 mini markets they sell becks export 5% in the green can 500ml, £0.70 a go, this is a really nice drink too.
I remember thinking they had screwed the flavour up when the strength of Stella dropped from 5.2 to 5 or less, I didn't realise that the weaker brew was made in the UK. This explains a lot! I used to like the occasional Stella but stopped drinking it once I couldn't get the 5.2% which is really nice. Still, I would rather have a decent real ale to be honest.
Good video, Simon - you have another convert! An old story on my part: in 1988 I went to work on Cairo for the Foreign Office and, in setting up home, I used the embassy commissariat for beer. The only one I fancied was Fosters, so I bought a case. The guy managing the comm ( a great guy called Tom Rae) apologised, saying that the usual British supplies were late, and that he had had had to 'borrow' some from the Australian embassy to tide over. Knowing the uninspiring British reputation of Fosters, I wasn't expecting a brilliant beer, but was very pleasantly surprised by this one's excellence. A week or so later, the British resupply arrived and I happily bought more. I couldn't believe it was the same beer, it was so awful. That's where I learned that you had to look closely at the labels of foreign beers in the UK to check where it was brewed - the statement 'Brewed in the UK under licence' then became highly significant. And the only reason for the difference is: it saves money! However, even the British Fosters soon tasted excellent as, whenever I drunk beer in Cairo bars, the only one I could afford was the local Stella (no connection there!) - it was very much an acquired taste, in which my taste buds learned to appreciate the truly awful. But keep up the good work - I look forward to more of these comparisons.
I only found out there was an inferior British Fosters a couple of weeks ago. When I was younger in the 80s I'm sure it was always Aussie Fosters here.
@@simonh6371 I remember back in the mid-to-late 1980s that there was a debate, possibly involving Camra, on the UK brewing foreign beers under licence. Perhaps that was the time it all started.
same as real mexican corona compared to what we get or in eu. spain etc. also noticed the red peroni compared to the uk blue one is lovely . italian made red peroni.
I've just stumbled upon this presentation, and am utterly amazed. Way, way back in the mid 1950s, I used to spend a weekend every month during the summer season, enjoying the delights of the Belgian coastal resorts (particularly Blankenbergh). I have never been much of a lager drinker, and I know now why that might be. I drank Stella Artois in Belgium and always enjoyed it: coming back home to London full of enthusiasm, I could never understand why the same brand had absolutely nothing to commen it. It seems that nearly 70 years has seen little or no improvent. Bloody hell!
My grandfather knew a group of fellas who went to Belgium and went to a pub and tried a beer they had never had before really enjoyed it. Went to go back to the pub and “what was the name of the pub” “Stella Artois”
Price? Maybe they found that they needed to offer Stella in the UK at a lower price so they brew it more cheaply (less ingredients) and hence does not taste as good?
it is always the same. I remember back around 1980 when Fosters arrived in the UK. It was the real McCoy, brewed in Australia. It was really nice, a change from what we had on offer from UK breweries. After it got a foothold they switched to brewing in the UK .... it was crap. Castlemaine soon followed and it went the same way. So its no surprise the Stella is the same. Belgian Stella is superb btw
The imported stella in the green bottle with the white paper import label that goes over the top of the bottle top!? That was the best Stella! I haven’t seen it for many many years. It came in a 660ml bottle. Don’t think it made it through the tax duties those years ago and so they stopped.
Before Guinness became popular in pubs.Long before it became available on pulls Dad enjoyed a bottle,not sold in cans at that time so you can tell how long ago.He would only buy if the bottle had a Irish label on not London label.
Guess it was true back then. My great grandfather loved bottled Guinness off the shelf and preferably past the best before then in 2000 it became filtered. Guinness foreign extra brewed in St James Gate is your best bet.
I remember in the early 80s the brewing of Stella by Whitbread was stopped for retraining because it had deviated so much from the Belgian version. The managed houses were supplied with Stella draught from Belgium and it was a totally different experience , the head was dense and creamy and stayed to the bottom of the glass similar to a good Guinness. Nowadays the accountants rule in the big breweries so cheap and nasty wins. I notice Leffe has taken a dive from 6.6 to 6.0 so that’s another step down a slippery slope.
I totally agree with you and I drink lots of UK Stella, when it was 5.2% in the UK it was sweeter and maybe deserved the nickname of Wife beater but the taste has totally changed with every drop in ABV they sucked out of it. I still drink it and find that it tastes better in the big 660ml bottles, the smaller bottles we get in the UK tastes different again, when it changed from 4.8 to 4.6 any flavour disappeared but I suppose I’ve gotten used to it now. The stuff they sell in bottles with the green label which is 5% is quite good though and you notice the difference in the alcohol increase but again they are crafty as it comes in a slightly smaller bottle to keep the price lower.
Gotta agree, the 660 bottles taste so much better, but the drop to 4.6 seemed to be the straw that broke the camels back for me. I no longer enjoy the taste at 4.6 whereas at 4.8 i absolutely loved it.
Anybody know how come Egypt's main brand beer is called Stella? I don't know is why I'm asking. Looked it up. 2 separate Belgian breweries founded in Alexandria and Cairo in 1897. The two breweries later united and Egyptian Stella was born in 1920. My Dad drank it while on National Service 1946-48 and I drank it 1981-2 while practicing Egyptian Arabic in the bar of the Cecil Hotel after university.
Easiest way to tell is the first two digits on the barcode of any item, if it starts wiith 50 then its UK produced. I have not found a decentt UK brewed lager. Home bargains often have Turkish made Effe draught for 99p a tin and its well worth considering compared Uk produced lager.
Right I’ve been working constantly the last week and got loads of reviews ti catch up on, just opened a beer and going to get through them all. As the old Grandfather used to say “A Pint of Beer is the working man’s Pat On The Back” this video I know is going to be glorious. Cheers Si!
All the british brewed lagers taste exactly the same to me, doesn't matter if it's bud, stella, moretti, heineken etc, anything brewed in this country just tastes really foul and utter rubbish in comparison with the stuff brewed at the actual brewery on the continent. Must be the water, or cheaper production, storage conditions, or a little bit of all of that.
I'm glad other people are finally talking about this. You can find the continental brewed stuff in UK super markets sometimes but it's in small packs (usually 4 bottles) and it costs considerably more. Like wise restaurants often serve things like Italian brewed Peroni not the UK brewed stuff (in bottles not keg of course). Honestly I don't think this should be allowed. They're completely different products but presented as the same thing!
Great review, would be great to see the following: UK Carlsberg vs Danish Carlsberg UK Kronenbourg vs French Kronenbourg UK Starapramen vs Czech Starapramen UK Heineken vs Dutch Heineken
Staropramen is a good shout. Due to the deliberate "misguidance" on the label, most people in the UK still think it's Czech brewed? Got a sneaky feeling I heard that Heineken is now brewed back in the Netherlands again, at a newish "Mega Brewery"?
There's a staropramen video already. Carlsberg is a good shout as when I was growing up it was a byword for dreadful lager. Cut to me in Copenhagen shocked that it's actually pretty decent over there.
I think a lot of people in the UK have settled for the bare minimum for generations. Not just for beer, but for all aspects of food and drink. Think about it... Beans on toast, for example. It is a very simple "meal", but Brits seem to love it. I think if people in the UK ventured further afield and explored more flavours, they would be surprised at how dull UK food and drink really is. So, perhaps these companies/corporations understand that British people are easy to please when it comes to flavour. As a footnote; spice. People in the UK tend to be very inexperienced when it comes to spicy food. Foods that are considered "extremely hot" in terms of spice in the UK are considered very mild in other countries.
It's all due to profiteering from the major breweries. They slowly swap out the ingredients for cheaper stuff, lowering the quality and quantity used, but doing it gradually so people don't notice while their margins improve. Eventually you have a terrible product but the brand is established so people keep buying it out of habbit. Same has happened with chocolate since Cadbury were bought out, it's horrible now but people keep buying because of the brand.
I'm an American who just got a six-pack of bottled STELLA ARTOIS, like it. But ours seems to be brewed here in ST. Louis, MO. The USA.and is 5% ABV. I LIKE YOUR REVIEW AND YOUR HONESTY, GOOD JOB.
This has been going on for years since we've gone from Original Gravity to ABV, as the strength has been lowered because of the UK tax scheme on alcohol the taste has been affected, try finding British beers that have a nose where you can smell the hops (like Flower's bitter) virtually nonexistent these days!
Just bought 18 x 440ml tins of it on line as it worked out as 78p a tin, of probably the Wrexham or Northampton brewed version at 4.6%. It's not the best or worst British brewed lager I've had but I have to drink it ice cold to make it palatable? Had a similar experience with 1664. Had it in Strasbourg, totally superior to here. Think I'll just stick to the safe Czech stuff in future. Obviously that doesn't include Staropramen as that's mostly all brewed here too, if you read the lable carefully enough?
I'm Welsh but I now live in Normandy, so your speaking to the converted, I drink Kronenbourg 1664 or Pelforth blonde, Kronenbourg is 5.5 abv over here and like the Stella in the UK it's below 5, in France it's got a floral smell unlike the UK which bears no resemblance, usaualy smells like sweaty socks, dont think you get Pelforth in the UK other than supermarkets. I agree Stella was the go to beer but since they've messed about with it it's had it
I am British but live in France I drink French / Belgium beer bought from supermarkets the normal beers are about 6 t0 6.7 % but you can buy triple brewed beers that are between 9 to 9.9 %and the taste is fantastic and lasts on you palate
It's not just UK, it's everywhere, producers switching to inferior ingredients to cut costs and transfer the profits to the owners/shareholders. The stealtflation is universal, the sad part is they get away with it because they can. :( I bet Stella tasted better in Belgium 10-20 years ago too but there they done it slower.
@@nigelwatson2750 We make good beer and ale, the lager brewed here by these big companies however is just a concentrated beer syrup mixed with chemicals and water and will have you feeling as sick as a dog the next day
Simon, have been loving your videos. Keep up the great work. It would be fascinating to see a blindfolded version of the same beers, brewed in different countries, and ideally + one freshly drafted. I would love to see if you are able to tell the difference and which is what version of the beer.
Great analysis, many thanks! Good info. For a while, I've been amused at chaps drinking Stella as though it was a sophisticated, premium lager (which it might have been, once upon a time); and I've been thinking "geez mate, might as well be drinking Fosters". But from my naive, uninformed position I couldn't quite put me finger on the exact problem; you've explained it very clearly, here. Great work!
You need to pluck up the courage to do a blind tasting. Doesn't mean you have to be blindfolded, just means what you are drinking is unknown to you. I've done the same test with a group of three, blind. The British Stella came above the Belgian. Surprised the hell out of me. You have to make sure they're as fresh as each other and preferably bought from similar locations, how a beer is transported and stored makes a difference. Also good to throw in a ringer to mix things up. That said, I seem to remember the British Stella being 4.8% when we did the test. I wish they'd stop effin' about with it.
5.4/5.2 Stella was my go-to in the early 00s, was pretty much the only lager I drank in my 20s- switched to craft and real ale only in my mid 20s then had a pint in the pub one day and I couldn't believe I used to drink it, it was so cheap and fowl. Was only later I realised the abv had changed and was now brewed here. It used to be "reassuringly expensive" which I know was a gimmick but even for the off the shelf "premium" lagers, nowadays it's way way worse than what it was up against when I was younger - a shockingly bad beer
New Zealand brewed Stella is one of my favourite beers. I was appalled at how different it tasted in the UK when I went there in 2001. I don't know what they do differently, but it's literally a different beer.
No idea why we tolerate this rubbish. But looking around my local Sainsbury's it is very difficult to find a quality, continental lager not brewed in the UK. Why can't they sell imported Stella / 1664? I would buy it! As others have said, uk government now incentivises brewers to produce lower strength beers hence that's what they sell us. But why do we put up with it!
They can't sell it for legal reasons and because most people wouldn't buy it because it would be expensive. My local offie used to do Spaten for 2.39. I was pretty much the only person buying it.
Sainsbury's have always had a poor lager/beer selection try Krombacher, Warsteiner, Veltins, Paulaner all top German lagers available in Tesco, Asda and Morrisons.
Had the privilege of picking some up yesterday and the day before for 6 or 7 quid for 4 pints at 5% at the Romanian shop. Also stumbled upon a short date mystery box full of foreign beers including a 25cl 5.2% ABV Stella, 2 glasses and a bottle opener and some leffe chutney believe it or not.
I worked for Whitbread in the 80s and Stella packaged supply was often switched from Salmesbury to Belgium and vice versa, we could always tell the difference but customers didn’t notice. It seems like things have gotten much worse. Can’t say I’ve drunk it for 30 years now, it’s a damaged product and brand.
Hi, I worked for Whitbreads (Whitbread Coaching Inns) between 1986 and 1992. I remember when we got the Belgian Brewed Beer (in barrels), as opposed to the Stella that was brewed here in the UK. At the time, we had the Whitbread Fremlins Head Brewer staying with us and he explained that because of anticipated Strike Action at Magor Brewery (Wales), Home to all the “top pressure” beers, Whitbread had bought in a large volume of the Belgian Brew “just in case”! As it was, the strike action didn’t go ahead and we only had the Belgian stuff on two deliveries, before resuming to UK produced. The difference was very noticeable. I’d describe the Belgian Brew as “soft on the pallet”, which is possibly down to the lower Co2 content (gasification)....the knock on benefit being to the taste of it, which was fuller, richer almost bisquity, if you get my drift? The UK stuff was quite thin by comparison....it couldn’t hold a candle to its “Dad”! One other thing: Brewers talk about “reconstituting the water”! This means “designer water” for each beer. As the brewing became a centralised process, Stella, Heineken, Murphy’s, etc (top pressure beers) located to Magor and all the “Real Ale” products went to Salmsbury, so the brewing “water” had to be “mixed” by the chemists, so that each product could be said to retain its traditional qualities.....Pigs Might Fly....
I haven’t drunk Stella in years and I can’t remember the last time I saw it on draft in a pub in Britain. Most of the off licenses where I lived at the time stocked the Belgium brewed Stella and it was only the supermarkets near me that stocked the British brewed Stella. Even back then there was a noticeable difference.
Ruined under licence in the UK. A little story...many years ago, I would occasionally drink Stella (the company I worked for would do a Friday lunch fish and chips run, with an optional can of Stella). I started to get a taste for it. One day it tasted different, not as good. It took another couple of Fridays before I realised it was 4.9%ABV instead of the 5.2% of the Stella I had been drinking. On further examination, I realised it wasn't Belgium Stella. It then fell a further .1%. I ceased to work for that company so stopped drinking the Stella. Shocked to find it's now 4.6%. IT'S JUST NOT THE SAME BEER. Similar happened to Brugge Tripel. I first drank that in Bruges in the 2000s. 9.2% and utterly sublime. Beautiful deep caramel and baked apples. The company was bought out and first the % went down to 8.9 (I think) and then dropped further. IT'S NOT THE SAME BEER. It's getting increasingly difficult to get genuine continental beers "off the shelf". First it was Stella, then Backs, then Staropramen an probably many more I have missed. The only one I can now find is Warsteiner which is a decent beer and still brewed in Germany...at the moment. 🤦♂
Over the past year I've been looking closely to see where continental lagers are brewed and its nearly always in the UK. Once upon a time the stuff in cans was UK brewed, but you could find the Belgian beer in small bottles. Zywiec as far as I can tell is not UK brewed, do you know if that is the case?
Wenn I studied in the UK many years ago, a Belgian classmate wondered why at the time, Stella was quite an upmarket beer in the UK as it wasn't considered anything special at all in his native Belgium. Probably everything in the recipe and marketing of Stella has morphed several times since then.
I've got Belgian friends and been there many times. Nobody drinks stella. It purely an export Beer with heavy marketing that tricked the Brits into thinking it was a good beer. It never was and never will be. Brits just have no fucking taste.
No Troll because that was how Lager was marketed in Ireland and the UK a fancy, upscale, bright, sophistication a world away from the flat cap image of bitter,mild and porter
I used do work for the marketing company that set up the Stella Artois Tennis Tournament and drinking it for the first time was a revelation compared with the British lagers. They used to market it as if it was sophisticated French product with Jean de Florette styled television adverts.
@@scottgraham1143 I was on internships with an ad agency and a food producer long ago and I've read how there are now industrial breweries intermittently producing different beer brands with the same machinery, so I'm a bit cynical about how much quality a beer brand can really stand for. My current favourite is a local craft beer exclusively poured and sold in a pub and beer garden next to the microbrewery... but the old cynic inside me sometimes wonders if that stuff is really brewed there or if it's all just a big laugh. What do we know, really? 🍻
Bubbles appear larger because your glassware is dirty. Grease allowing Co to form bubbles and escape the liquid. Can also explain the skunk but it's more likely that it's been stored improperly. Sunlight hitting a bottle can kill it in a matter of minutes.
Great idea and very interesting 👍 why can't we just have the good stuff. All this lowering the abv is bull. Was all good stuff back in my day. What went wrong?
Hello Simon, I am a new person to your website. I am so glad I subscribed. All your reviews are so professional. You have got it set just right for beer lovers. Keep it up and I hope this site grows and grows. Jon
British Stella has a lower ABV than the Belgian Stella because the alcohol strength decides the amount of tax on the beer. Inbrew have cut the strength of British Stella several times over the years to keep the price down.... which as Simon has stated has made the beer undrinkable..... R.I P Stell Artois.
@@underneonloneliness2 The UK brewed Kronenbourg is atrocious since Carlsberg bought them out, they've ruined the recipe by adding glucose syrup and Heineken isn't much better.
@@andrewcarr5923 It is a shame these big Brewers are buying everyone out. It means certain lagers are losing their uniqueness. It’s like that everywhere though. From beer to motor vehicles. It would be nice if all companies were independent again.
Before 2020 all the Stella bottles in Belgium were brown bottles but they changed them to green ones to stand out more from the other Belgian pilsners. As a Belgian i feel like it affected the taste a little bit and i liked it more in the brown bottles, could be just me.
When I first tried it in Australia during the 70s it was over 6%ABV, but didn't stay that way for long as the beer became more popular here. Cider has always been expensive as it attracts a wine tax. Guinness b&b here has always been my preference as it seems fuller bodied with lots going on, but their cans are rubbish.
What got me was when Staropramen used to be imported here back in the day it was incredible when compared to the other drivel you get on the supermaraket shelves, however they started brewing it here and it's absolutely disgusting now.
The Belgian version is usually in a brown bottle. I done a comparison on my beer blog a few years ago, but that's when Belgium in a Box webshop was open. Maybe they changed to a green bottle.
As I have often said here, I can't stand the disparity between the original foreign brew and the UK brew. Nothing to stop Stella from brewing a decent "Stella Artois British Lager" but what I hate is UK lager pretending to be the same as the Belgian version and not having the choice to buy the import. (Even the Belgian version has deteriorated - it now has corn and is 5% no longer consistent with the German Beer Purity Law and 5.2%). I stopped buying the UK version in the 1990s. It was just about OK in the 1980s when Whitbread brewed it at 5.2% but even then I looked for the Belgian import. I drank Stella in Brussels when I was working there in the early 2000's. Its on another planet from the UK version. Better to find good UK breweries that make good lager. Camden Hells is one good example. Buy British craft lager when at home!
I find the problem with British craft lagers is the horrible pale cloudy colour and far-too-hoppy taste. Can’t they make a nice clear golden one that doesn’t look and taste like a bad pint of bitter?
I remember Stella in UK back in the late sixties early seventies, it was great, but i emigrated to Australia and the made here under license stuff is "orrible, but then so is the guiness and a few others, so these days i drink IPA as we get a lot good ones. Cheers
The two best quality lagers that aren't brewed in the UK and are still at a good price are Budvar and Pilsner Urquell. Can't go wrong with these. Belgium Stella is hard to get hold of.
I have found this with most, if not all, continental bears brewed under licence in the UK. Have you ever tasted Czechoslovakian Budweiser, I remember it back in the 80s, it was great?
Stella replaced my favourite drink of all time ‘Tennants Extra’ which for me had it all , the transition though was not too bad and I got used to and enjoyed drinking it but when they reduced it from 5.2 to first 4.8 then 4.6 it became undrinkable and unrecognisable. There is not a premium lager I enjoy now and the Spanish and Italian beers are awful . I did visit the highlands of Scotland recently and in lochinver I found Tennants on tap which had the similar taste to Extra but at 4 it was effectively the old pilsner version and lacked the extra taste the 0.8 % gave it . I am at such a loss now because I cannot find a lager on tap or in bottles or cans that I enjoy . I have only just found your channel and have subbed and hope you can steer me to a new premium beer they haven’t ruined .
Kronenbourg 1664 is my best suggestion. I grieve the loss of the old style Stella and KB 1664 is the only substitute I’ve found with a remotely similar depth of flavour (still not a patch though)
*This is my biggest beer pet peeve* I live in New Zealand, where we have an amazing amount of top quality breweries and brewing history. Yet we 'brew under license' and make SHIT versions of all the beers I want to drink. Can't get genuine Heineken or Stella or Sapporo here at all anymore, and the importers must be taking a bribe because we can't get ANY of the imported genuine versions anymore. It sucks!
The thing people are missing about Stella is that both the imported version and the locally brewed version are generic unremarkable beers. Same goes for all the pilsner style stuff.
I used to be in a Belgian bike club back in the 90's and Belgian Stella was so much better than the Luton version. We could still get Belgian Stella from certain off-licences, but not any more. I lived on Stella and Jupiler.
Great video Simon . The uk version is awful and your knowledge and expertise really explains the reasons why . Looking forward to your other videos 👍🏻🍺😊
I’m so happy to see a video like this being made. I once bought a pack of Estrella that was brewed in the UK as I’d drank it in Barcelona and really enjoyed it. The UK version was more or less undrinkable. Complained directly and they sent me some from Spain.
Why we have all these nasty beers brewed in the UK but badges up as something European is beyond me. It’s incredibly misleading and should be illegal, actually. You can’t distill Glenmorangie in Poland and badge it as Glenmorangie.
And you’re totally correct, the UK accepts the most awful shit. Not just beer, everything. There needs to be a drastic change to the British mindset, but I fear that’ll never happen.
Problem is most British have awful taste, but loudly disagree that they do. Companies, of course, know they can exploit this for profit.
I don't know mate. the last time Britain were left to make a "drastic" change hasn't seemed to work out all too well.
I should think we'd be better off not consulting the people on anything important. They are clearly not capable of making logical decisions
🤣
@@DAGATHire Intentionally scuppered, as you well know.
@@Rozmic scuppered by self harm, as you should well know.
Its about selling cheaply brewed beer at a rip off price.
I remember Stella in the UK going downhill when they brought out Stella 4 to fleece the public into thinking they had a new brew rather than a watered down tax fiddle. Becks did the same at the same time. Pretty sure it was something to do with higher tax on 5% beer.
As for your excellent summaries on the UK public acceptance of shite is spot on. We as a nation are convinced that paying less tax is good but in turn we get human shit released into our rivers. Could be an analogy for UK Stella
its exactly what happened, they all just dropped their % content
The uk has managed to turn a great lager into piss!!!
We pay plenty of tax. The problem is the top few percent are creaming off more than they should.
Water companies should've been forced to re-invest a set amount of money into upgrades and maintenance. Instead the money goes elsewhere.
The worst people you can give your money to, are Governments.
We don’t pay less tax do we? Less tax than who? We are up there with one of the highest taxed nations on earth! We get taxed to breath!
@@IamBATMAN2024 any Scandinavian would think we were cheap skates who get what we pay for. We don't have a high living standard compared to many northern European countries.
No contest, the UK brewed is a low abv tasteless atrocity and has never matched up to the imported 5.2% which I used to drink regularly for years before my corner shop stopped stocking it.
It was 5.2% when I last drank it 20 years ago
I basically just said the same thing. Would love to get some import
It went from 5.2% 5.0% 4.8% and now it's 4.5% in UK
@@leehenry57644.6
@@leehenry5764 4.6% now.... but yeah the decrease in strength and quality has been a shit show.
Spot on mate I feel the same, it's not been the same since they lowered it to the weaker version in UK, if its not broke don't try to fix it
Hi Simon, back in the 80's all the pubs in my area were Brakspears ( when they were a proper brewery). The only draught lagers they had were Stella and Heineken. The Stella was the full monty, 5.2% and the original Belgian taste. Well, as you know Stella did not earn the title of "wife beater" by accident. We tried an experiment in our local, mixing 1/2 pint stella with 1/2 pint heineken in a pint glass. The heineken took the sting off the stella and the stella gave the heineken some flavour. It proved so popular that the landlord added it to his chalkboard behind the bar! It was there under the stella and heineken as 1/2 & 1/2. So many people asked what is 1/2 & 1/2, when they tried it they were hooked. If you tried it now you would end up with a pint of p***water.
1988, 1/2 & 1/2 94p per pint, oh how I wish I could turn the clock back.
I thought I was the only one who mixed beer.
Where I grew up, Snakebite qualified as a Cocktail.
Amazing. That's 2.44 in today's money.
@@Welshhomie Yup but £5+ in the pubs which is taking the piss (and I don't blame the pubs who have been through hell with energy costs and covid). I can remember the "shock" when a pint of decent beer hit £1 a pint. Like you, I wish it was still that cheap lol. Or even £2.50 would be reasonable but... Welcome to Britain 2023 eh?
@@martin-1965I'm all right jack i can afford £10 pound a pint .🥴🤪😝😋😃😛😜😂😆🤣😭😭not fucking rip off .
@@paulholland5270 "Your round mate" - "No worries, let me call my mortgage broker" 😂😂😂😂😂😂
When it was 5.2 % in Britain....it really stood out from the crowd.
At 4.6% it is a poor version of itself and now i rarely drink it.
It's a shame because it was a legendary beer.
Was my fave beer but haven't bought it since it went to 4.6%
100% agree it used to have such depth and flavour and tasted like no other lager. The modern version is like any old tasteless fizz and is a shadow of its former glory. I stopped buying it.
Can't you get the proper one brewed in Leuven in the UK any more?
Many a good time on stella actatwat
Couldn't agree with you more, Stella now is awful and leaves a bitter taste in your mouth it lost its sweetness. It was my drink of choice in the 90s early 00s but when the design of the can changed that embossed logo was probably the same time it was brewed in the UK. Stella needs to get a grip, I'd pay the extra to have it as brewed in Belgium.
A classic! I remember buying imported Stella near where I lived as a young man and refusing the UK stuff. I've not seen the import for so many years. This is a great vid. You just popped up on my feed, never seen a channel like this before!
Ab InBev have a lot to answer for.
Budweiser abv 5.0 - 4.8 (2012) - 4.5 (2017)
Stella abv 5.2 - 5.0 (2007) - 4.8 (2012) - 4.6 (2020)
Becks abv 5.0 - 4.8 (2012) - 4.0 (2020)
Introduced Bud Light to the UK market at abv 3.5 when in the USA it is 4.2.
All to do with tax savings. They also bought the Rolling Rock brand around 2006 and then promptly withdrew it from the UK market.
I seen Rolling rock a few yrs ago somewhere, maybe online...it was 2.8%...total joke!
My local off license used to stock the proper stuff, was 5.1% gold top can with a silver ring-pull.. Miss them days
I remember when Stella first came to the UK. It was so strong they only sold it half pints (that was the story anyway). It was light years better than the pond water they sell now.
Bought 4 cans yesterday, haven't drank Stella for years. I could tell the difference immediately. It tastes like cheap, supermarket own brand lager now.
I remember when they reduced the strength below 5% to avoid higher tax.. at the time I remember thinking that in reality, it cannot be Stella Artois because the recipe had been changed to produce a weaker beer. And should no longer be allowed to be called Stella Artois if it's made using a different recipe
no its worse than that, its brewed at high strength and then watered down. All lagers in UK are watered down from high ABV brews.
I was a mid-late teen when we were based in Belgium. Stella was the local tipple and when I experienced a UK version several years later the difference was massive.
It also has a poor image the nickname is wife beater
I was in Brussels about a week ago and I was flabbergasted how good the Stella was compared to back home. I was well happy sitting in the sunshine, drinking a few pints of it with a few mates. But to be honest I really shouldn't have been so surprised.
I was in Brussel 3 weeks ago and found a nice little bottled Pilsner, Manneken Pis by name but actually rather moreish
Stella was 5.2% in the UK as well for many years. It changed to 5% relatively recently and has gone down since.
Changed to 4.6 not 5. Unfiltered is 5
@super ted that's shite as well...
Agree Stella is dreadful nowadays, I remember back in 80’s when Stella was introduced next to XXXX and it showed up all the UK and Aussie beers. Now it’s a pale shadow of itself. I was over in Dubai recently and they had the 5.2% on draught, perfect.
I very rarely drink Stella now, and it used to be my go to drink inbev have ruined it
@@itsinthetreesitscoming7431 stella unfiltered is nice
Excellent review Simon was looking forward to hearing your opinion and knowledge on that. I really enjoyed the Belgium Stella its a taste of its own👌. Growing up Stella was the premier lager drink and was known as quality and the best it had an excellent brand. Then they started to mess with it.. 20 years later i seriously dont no any body who would dream of buying Stella in UK it might as well be carling.
I used to love Stella years back. It's been ruined by In-bev. Hope their execs watch this vid and go back to the original strength.
Sorry if you've already picked up on this, but Leffe have recently reduced the ABV of their Blonde from 6.6% to 6.0%. I can taste a difference. Would love to see you do a comparison between the two and hear your opinion... if you can still find a bottle of the 6.6%.
I brought a 6.6% in Tescos today . Must be old stock
St Pierre in Aldi is a great alternative 👍🏻
You can find proper Stella in some ethnic corner shops and off licenses, in cans, usually around only £1 each. The can is different and has multiple languages and embossed lettering. Lorry drivers smuggle or bring it in without duty and sell it to the shops. There is no comparison between the UK version and the real article. I can find it in several places in south Birmingham, when I find some I telephone a few friends and usually buy the lot and get a decent discount.
Yeah I used to buy slabs of 24 in London. 500ml. £20 cash. This was the early 00's though.
Man you're lucky, nothing like that where I live sadly lol
I've been saying this to my mates for years, the British brewed versions of a lot of lagers are rubbish! Corona used to be a decent drop on a hot day but the brewed in the UK version they sell nowadays is awful 🤢 Heineken is another good example!
It’s probably the shitty water being used or not very good ingredient’s.
Juplier in Belgium is better again brewed by inbev Belgium Stella is still very good can be hard on the stomach though! The UK stuff is really bad great vblog
I’m very surprised a company would accept an inferior product being produced under their brand name. I doubt it’s the water, as with chemicals and filters you can reproduce the same water purity. Perhaps it’s just what the public want?
@@fanfeck2844 or the English brewers don’t know what they’re doing. I bought 4 cans of the unfiltered Stella yesterday and can’t see what’s wrong with it. Maybe I’m use to shit lager idk or maybe I have bad taste. Probably the latter 😅
@@IamBATMAN2024 doubt it’s the brewers. Englands been making beers longer than Belgium has existed. It’s more likely something to do with cost and protecting their margins.
I totally agree with you. And everything you said goes double for European beers brewed here in the USA. I grew up in Brooklyn, NY and started drinking beer at a far too young age. But with that said in the early 1970"s when Löwenbräu was imported from Germany it was my favorite beer. But after Miller Brewing company attained the rights to brew it in America it went totally to shit. Like you said the difference was day and night, and not a good night at that. It cuts into the profit margin when you brew a beer elsewhere like it's was originally brewed in its place of origin. This is why the companies do this in the first place. It's all about maximizing profits. And the quality of the beer (and the consumer) be damned. I really like the content on your channel. I especially liked your review of Fuller's ESB. I agree with you that it's a definite 10/10 beer. It's been near or at the top of my best of list for decades. Cheers!!
I remember back in the late seventies we used to drink Stella before a gig in the same pub in St Albans, the beer was brewed in Belgium. One weekend we were there for a gig and it was brewed in Luton. Lots of rushing to the toilet to throw up including myself. Never drank Stella again.
Cool idea!
When I visited London, as a Belgian I got offered a lot of drinks with: "Oh you're Belgian, you must know this!"
All kinds of Stella Artois I had never seen before and lager I didn't like at all :D
Back in 1975 when I was19, I went to Amsterdam for the first time, and remember drinking Heineken and thinking, why does this taste so much better than the Heineken piss water we get back home. Around the same time, you could get Australian brewed Fosters in cans only, and not everywhere. It tasted so much better than the British brewed lagers, although my favourite (Australian) canned lager was Swan Lager. Then Fosters started being brewed under licence in the UK. It was different and worse, even the cans, than the original.
Thank you so much for your comparison. You are right. Sella in the 90's was a great taste, I really enjoyed it. Same with 1664 Kronenberg, loved it in the 1990's. Things changed. Now those are my last choices. Sam Miguel, I had it in Madrid in 2023. Tried it in 2023 London and it was different. Perhaps it's UK brewers trying to cut costs with concentrates. The upset is now I focus local craft beers and ales.
Your review mirrors exactly what I’ve thought for ages. That horrible watery, astringent taste of the U.K. muck. My first taste of Belgian Stella was a revelation!
The problem you are describing when comparing the Belgian and the British brewed Stellas is partly due to international ownership of what used to be local brewers and partly due to legislation. C&C group plc now owns Tennent Caledonian Breweries, having purchased it from Belgian brewing company Anheuser-Busch InBev, who owned the Stella Artois Brand. The Stella sold in Scotland (and possibly the rest of the UK) is brewed at the Tennent's brewery in Glasgow and used to be 5.2% until the introduction of a Scotland wide law that set a minimum price for alcoholic drinks, based on alcohol content. (50 pence per unit). Following introduction of this law most brewers reduced the alcohol content of their brews to try to off-set the price increases the law created, hence the lower alcohol content of the British brewed version. If the Stella brand had been retained by the original Belgian owners, I am certain that they would have insisted that products using their brand elsewhere in the world should have maintained the same characteristics of the original in order to not undermine their reputation for a quality product. Now that the brand is owned by an international conglomerate they can do with it as they wish and use the brand name for inferior products to trade on the reputation of the original product that they bought out. This includes varying the alcohol content, which is a major part of the flavour profile of any beer.
A friend of mine, who is a Chemistry graduate, used to work for Tennents back in the 1970s in their quality control labs. I remember him telling me that while different flavours can result from slight variations in the brewing process these were anathema to the production of lager where they wanted a consistent product that tasted no different from batch to batch. Alas, it seems to me that we are now seeing that mind-set applied across brands as well.
Good review. Accountants know the price of everything and the value of nothing. Marketing think they can sell rubbish to the council tip. Put them together and you get Eurolager and it is ubiquitous.
As a Brit who lives in South America, the Stella here is brewed in Argentina. I must say, it's pleasantly surprising how good it is. It tastes more like the Stella of old. Plus they actively seem to add more beers to their arsenal, just last week I got a "Stella Noire" which was a decent'ish black lager.
For some odd reason in the Calais duty free, there selling Stella cans destined for the US market, there alcohol percentage was 5%
I'm normally a Guinness drinker, but a few weeks back a visitor came over with a few different beers to share - Morretti lager and Cobra were among them. I swear, if you drink them side by side there's no difference what so ever. I wouldn't have believed it unless I tried it.
I still remember the nectar that was Stella on drought in a Brussels hotel about 30 years ago. Nothing like it sold here in UK.
I like stella more now 🤣 i was drinking San Miguel all the time but i honestly don't mind the Stella UK brewed stuff. I find myself buying it more, maybe because its cheaper, but to me it still tastes fine.
Never get attached to an imported lager.
It’s inevitable they start brewing it here and that’s the end of it.
Brooklyn is the latest one.
Try getting Brooklyn lager made in USA now in the UK. I wouldn't mind if there were a choice.
@@heiltd1286exactly. I’m sure the proper stuff would sell well.
@@MrJamessmith90 These brewers don't want a choice available. Now I firmly believe that we have the best beers in the world brewed in England. One only has to check out independent and craft beer breweries throughout England to taste phenomenal beers. If I want foreign beer I want the best foreign beers, not degraded imitations. I understand Stella Artois in Belgium is a good beer and so is Staropramen in Czechia. They're brewed here to an inferior standard and why do people tolerate it. I'm wondering if the same degradation of standards is happening with Brooklyn Lager. I always drank this beer going back years. Since its being brewed here I don't trust the quality. I need to try out US brewed Brooklyn Lager and compare to UK brewed version. You know even such dismal beers as Budweiser, Coors and Corona piss poor as they are in their home countries are brewed here in the UK and made even worse. That's hard to believe, but it's true.
There seemed to be a time in the 00s when they tied turned and we started getting decent Continental lager. Heineken went export only for a while, we had decent grolsch, decent Stella and carlsberg export was genuinely export. Then the breweries realised they could save a few pennies on tax by slowly dropping the abv to the mess we have now. Even brewdog doing the same by dropping punk ipa from 5.6 to 5.2
PUNK IPA tasted amazing when it was new; now it literally tastes like all other lager made in the same factory.
Ringwood’s strong bitter 5.6 to 5.1 is brutal
I like the pint cans 4.6%, nice and cold, good long drink for £1.50 a chug. When in Saigon in the 247 mini markets they sell becks export 5% in the green can 500ml, £0.70 a go, this is a really nice drink too.
I remember thinking they had screwed the flavour up when the strength of Stella dropped from 5.2 to 5 or less, I didn't realise that the weaker brew was made in the UK. This explains a lot! I used to like the occasional Stella but stopped drinking it once I couldn't get the 5.2% which is really nice. Still, I would rather have a decent real ale to be honest.
Good video, Simon - you have another convert! An old story on my part: in 1988 I went to work on Cairo for the Foreign Office and, in setting up home, I used the embassy commissariat for beer. The only one I fancied was Fosters, so I bought a case. The guy managing the comm ( a great guy called Tom Rae) apologised, saying that the usual British supplies were late, and that he had had had to 'borrow' some from the Australian embassy to tide over. Knowing the uninspiring British reputation of Fosters, I wasn't expecting a brilliant beer, but was very pleasantly surprised by this one's excellence. A week or so later, the British resupply arrived and I happily bought more. I couldn't believe it was the same beer, it was so awful. That's where I learned that you had to look closely at the labels of foreign beers in the UK to check where it was brewed - the statement 'Brewed in the UK under licence' then became highly significant. And the only reason for the difference is: it saves money!
However, even the British Fosters soon tasted excellent as, whenever I drunk beer in Cairo bars, the only one I could afford was the local Stella (no connection there!) - it was very much an acquired taste, in which my taste buds learned to appreciate the truly awful.
But keep up the good work - I look forward to more of these comparisons.
I only found out there was an inferior British Fosters a couple of weeks ago. When I was younger in the 80s I'm sure it was always Aussie Fosters here.
@@simonh6371 I remember back in the mid-to-late 1980s that there was a debate, possibly involving Camra, on the UK brewing foreign beers under licence. Perhaps that was the time it all started.
I would get bottles of Guinness original and Irish brewed foreign extra
same as real mexican corona compared to what we get or in eu. spain etc. also noticed the red peroni compared to the uk blue one is lovely . italian made red peroni.
I've just stumbled upon this presentation, and am utterly amazed. Way, way back in the mid 1950s, I used to spend a weekend every month during the summer season, enjoying the delights of the Belgian coastal resorts (particularly Blankenbergh). I have never been much of a lager drinker, and I know now why that might be. I drank Stella Artois in Belgium and always enjoyed it: coming back home to London full of enthusiasm, I could never understand why the same brand had absolutely nothing to commen it. It seems that nearly 70 years has seen little or no improvent. Bloody hell!
My grandfather knew a group of fellas who went to Belgium and went to a pub and tried a beer they had never had before really enjoyed it. Went to go back to the pub and “what was the name of the pub” “Stella Artois”
Price? Maybe they found that they needed to offer Stella in the UK at a lower price so they brew it more cheaply (less ingredients) and hence does not taste as good?
Definitely.
Ok Einstein !
@@AllyRobson Ha ha. I'm not sure that Simon mentioned that did he??
it is always the same. I remember back around 1980 when Fosters arrived in the UK. It was the real McCoy, brewed in Australia. It was really nice, a change from what we had on offer from UK breweries. After it got a foothold they switched to brewing in the UK .... it was crap. Castlemaine soon followed and it went the same way. So its no surprise the Stella is the same. Belgian Stella is superb btw
The imported stella in the green bottle with the white paper import label that goes over the top of the bottle top!? That was the best Stella! I haven’t seen it for many many years. It came in a 660ml bottle. Don’t think it made it through the tax duties those years ago and so they stopped.
I'm so glad someone made this video. I've been saying this for the last 20 years now.
Before Guinness became popular in pubs.Long before it became available on pulls Dad enjoyed a bottle,not sold in cans at that time so you can tell how long ago.He would only buy if the bottle had a Irish label on not London label.
Guess it was true back then. My great grandfather loved bottled Guinness off the shelf and preferably past the best before then in 2000 it became filtered. Guinness foreign extra brewed in St James Gate is your best bet.
I remember in the early 80s the brewing of Stella by Whitbread was stopped for retraining because it had deviated so much from the Belgian version. The managed houses were supplied with Stella draught from Belgium and it was a totally different experience , the head was dense and creamy and stayed to the bottom of the glass similar to a good Guinness. Nowadays the accountants rule in the big breweries so cheap and nasty wins. I notice Leffe has taken a dive from 6.6 to 6.0 so that’s another step down a slippery slope.
I totally agree with you and I drink lots of UK Stella, when it was 5.2% in the UK it was sweeter and maybe deserved the nickname of Wife beater but the taste has totally changed with every drop in ABV they sucked out of it.
I still drink it and find that it tastes better in the big 660ml bottles, the smaller bottles we get in the UK tastes different again, when it changed from 4.8 to 4.6 any flavour disappeared but I suppose I’ve gotten used to it now.
The stuff they sell in bottles with the green label which is 5% is quite good though and you notice the difference in the alcohol increase but again they are crafty as it comes in a slightly smaller bottle to keep the price lower.
I remember when Stella got me well sozzled but I drink it like pop now
You can get stella unfiltered in a big 660ml bottle, thats 5% and tastes more like the old stella
Gotta agree, the 660 bottles taste so much better, but the drop to 4.6 seemed to be the straw that broke the camels back for me. I no longer enjoy the taste at 4.6 whereas at 4.8 i absolutely loved it.
Irish and British tends to be lower abv because of taxation
Anybody know how come Egypt's main brand beer is called Stella? I don't know is why I'm asking. Looked it up. 2 separate Belgian breweries founded in Alexandria and Cairo in 1897. The two breweries later united and Egyptian Stella was born in 1920.
My Dad drank it while on National Service 1946-48 and I drank it 1981-2 while practicing Egyptian Arabic in the bar of the Cecil Hotel after university.
It's the drinking culture in the UK. "Lads" can drink way more pints of low strength tasteless lager.
Easiest way to tell is the first two digits on the barcode of any item, if it starts wiith 50 then its UK produced. I have not found a decentt UK brewed lager. Home bargains often have Turkish made Effe draught for 99p a tin and its well worth considering compared Uk produced lager.
I'd genuinely choose the new Unfiltered Stella over the Belgian brewed Stella
Right I’ve been working constantly the last week and got loads of reviews ti catch up on, just opened a beer and going to get through them all. As the old Grandfather used to say “A Pint of Beer is the working man’s Pat On The Back” this video I know is going to be glorious. Cheers Si!
All the british brewed lagers taste exactly the same to me, doesn't matter if it's bud, stella, moretti, heineken etc, anything brewed in this country just tastes really foul and utter rubbish in comparison with the stuff brewed at the actual brewery on the continent. Must be the water, or cheaper production, storage conditions, or a little bit of all of that.
I'm glad other people are finally talking about this. You can find the continental brewed stuff in UK super markets sometimes but it's in small packs (usually 4 bottles) and it costs considerably more. Like wise restaurants often serve things like Italian brewed Peroni not the UK brewed stuff (in bottles not keg of course).
Honestly I don't think this should be allowed. They're completely different products but presented as the same thing!
Great review, would be great to see the following:
UK Carlsberg vs Danish Carlsberg
UK Kronenbourg vs French Kronenbourg
UK Starapramen vs Czech Starapramen
UK Heineken vs Dutch Heineken
Staropramen is a good shout. Due to the deliberate "misguidance" on the label, most people in the UK still think it's Czech brewed? Got a sneaky feeling I heard that Heineken is now brewed back in the Netherlands again, at a newish "Mega Brewery"?
There's a staropramen video already.
Carlsberg is a good shout as when I was growing up it was a byword for dreadful lager. Cut to me in Copenhagen shocked that it's actually pretty decent over there.
I think a lot of people in the UK have settled for the bare minimum for generations. Not just for beer, but for all aspects of food and drink. Think about it... Beans on toast, for example. It is a very simple "meal", but Brits seem to love it. I think if people in the UK ventured further afield and explored more flavours, they would be surprised at how dull UK food and drink really is. So, perhaps these companies/corporations understand that British people are easy to please when it comes to flavour. As a footnote; spice. People in the UK tend to be very inexperienced when it comes to spicy food. Foods that are considered "extremely hot" in terms of spice in the UK are considered very mild in other countries.
It's all due to profiteering from the major breweries. They slowly swap out the ingredients for cheaper stuff, lowering the quality and quantity used, but doing it gradually so people don't notice while their margins improve. Eventually you have a terrible product but the brand is established so people keep buying it out of habbit. Same has happened with chocolate since Cadbury were bought out, it's horrible now but people keep buying because of the brand.
Same with anything Diageo Ireland or before that Guinness Ireland
I'm an American who just got a six-pack of bottled STELLA ARTOIS, like it. But ours seems to be brewed here in ST. Louis, MO. The USA.and is 5% ABV. I LIKE YOUR REVIEW AND YOUR HONESTY, GOOD JOB.
This has been going on for years since we've gone from Original Gravity to ABV, as the strength has been lowered because of the UK tax scheme on alcohol the taste has been affected, try finding British beers that have a nose where you can smell the hops (like Flower's bitter) virtually nonexistent these days!
The Irish tax scheme is stupid as well Sullivans red costs more in tax than brehon brewhouse red because it is 5 percent vs 4.5 percent
Just bought 18 x 440ml tins of it on line as it worked out as 78p a tin, of probably the Wrexham or Northampton brewed version at 4.6%. It's not the best or worst British brewed lager I've had but I have to drink it ice cold to make it palatable? Had a similar experience with 1664. Had it in Strasbourg, totally superior to here. Think I'll just stick to the safe Czech stuff in future. Obviously that doesn't include Staropramen as that's mostly all brewed here too, if you read the lable carefully enough?
I'm Welsh but I now live in Normandy, so your speaking to the converted, I drink Kronenbourg 1664 or Pelforth blonde, Kronenbourg is 5.5 abv over here and like the Stella in the UK it's below 5, in France it's got a floral smell unlike the UK which bears no resemblance, usaualy smells like sweaty socks, dont think you get Pelforth in the UK other than supermarkets. I agree Stella was the go to beer but since they've messed about with it it's had it
I had some Kronenberg Blanc recently in France and that is 👌
Wish we could get it in the UK
I am British but live in France I drink French / Belgium beer bought from supermarkets the normal beers are about 6 t0 6.7 % but you can buy triple brewed beers that are between 9 to 9.9 %and the taste is fantastic and lasts on you palate
Read into the work of Ron Pattinson as to why Irish and British beers got to the low strength of today
It's not just UK, it's everywhere, producers switching to inferior ingredients to cut costs and transfer the profits to the owners/shareholders. The stealtflation is universal, the sad part is they get away with it because they can. :( I bet Stella tasted better in Belgium 10-20 years ago too but there they done it slower.
The Brits just water their beers down.
@@nigelwatson2750 We make good beer and ale, the lager brewed here by these big companies however is just a concentrated beer syrup mixed with chemicals and water and will have you feeling as sick as a dog the next day
@@nigelwatson2750we make good ales in Britain
I first drank Stella Artois in the 80s, It used to be 5.2vol or 5.4 vol, Same with Kronemberg in France 6.6vol in UK 5.0vol
Simon, have been loving your videos. Keep up the great work. It would be fascinating to see a blindfolded version of the same beers, brewed in different countries, and ideally + one freshly drafted. I would love to see if you are able to tell the difference and which is what version of the beer.
Agreed. It’s surprising just how strong your cognitive biases really are. I’ve done it myself, and totally surprised myself with a blind tasting.
Great analysis, many thanks! Good info. For a while, I've been amused at chaps drinking Stella as though it was a sophisticated, premium lager (which it might have been, once upon a time); and I've been thinking "geez mate, might as well be drinking Fosters". But from my naive, uninformed position I couldn't quite put me finger on the exact problem; you've explained it very clearly, here. Great work!
You need to pluck up the courage to do a blind tasting. Doesn't mean you have to be blindfolded, just means what you are drinking is unknown to you. I've done the same test with a group of three, blind. The British Stella came above the Belgian. Surprised the hell out of me. You have to make sure they're as fresh as each other and preferably bought from similar locations, how a beer is transported and stored makes a difference. Also good to throw in a ringer to mix things up. That said, I seem to remember the British Stella being 4.8% when we did the test. I wish they'd stop effin' about with it.
Funny thing...I'm not really a beer drinker. However, I've always enjoyed beer more over seas than in the UK. Now I know why! Great video - thanks.
5.4/5.2 Stella was my go-to in the early 00s, was pretty much the only lager I drank in my 20s- switched to craft and real ale only in my mid 20s then had a pint in the pub one day and I couldn't believe I used to drink it, it was so cheap and fowl. Was only later I realised the abv had changed and was now brewed here. It used to be "reassuringly expensive" which I know was a gimmick but even for the off the shelf "premium" lagers, nowadays it's way way worse than what it was up against when I was younger - a shockingly bad beer
Ironically, even when it used the "reassuringly expensive" strapline, it wasn't expensive at all - it was often one of the cheapest cans on the shelf.
When it was 5.4 it was called Stella acta twat
New Zealand brewed Stella is one of my favourite beers. I was appalled at how different it tasted in the UK when I went there in 2001. I don't know what they do differently, but it's literally a different beer.
No idea why we tolerate this rubbish. But looking around my local Sainsbury's it is very difficult to find a quality, continental lager not brewed in the UK. Why can't they sell imported Stella / 1664? I would buy it!
As others have said, uk government now incentivises brewers to produce lower strength beers hence that's what they sell us. But why do we put up with it!
They can't sell it for legal reasons and because most people wouldn't buy it because it would be expensive. My local offie used to do Spaten for 2.39. I was pretty much the only person buying it.
Sainsbury's have always had a poor lager/beer selection try Krombacher, Warsteiner, Veltins, Paulaner all top German lagers available in Tesco, Asda and Morrisons.
Remember the ad slogan "Reassuringly expensive"? It was a lovely beer, although it made me fall off a bar stool in Antwerp.
Also the Perfect draft version is the Belgium brewed version it’s a lot better than the British one
The perfect draft is 5.0 not 5.2 tho, dunno why that’s different again?
It’s rebadged for Tax purposes there is a great explanation on the thread about PD kegging a tax
@@TheJimmyboy38 Explain the Pokish beers over 5% percent and Kronenburg 5% being cheaper.
Agree
The Perfect Draught (That's the correct spelling in British English) of Stella served in a Small bar in a village in the Belgian countryside.
Had the privilege of picking some up yesterday and the day before for 6 or 7 quid for 4 pints at 5% at the Romanian shop. Also stumbled upon a short date mystery box full of foreign beers including a 25cl 5.2% ABV Stella, 2 glasses and a bottle opener and some leffe chutney believe it or not.
I worked for Whitbread in the 80s and Stella packaged supply was often switched from Salmesbury to Belgium and vice versa, we could always tell the difference but customers didn’t notice. It seems like things have gotten much worse. Can’t say I’ve drunk it for 30 years now, it’s a damaged product and brand.
Hi, I worked for Whitbreads (Whitbread Coaching Inns) between 1986 and 1992. I remember when we got the Belgian Brewed Beer (in barrels), as opposed to the Stella that was brewed here in the UK. At the time, we had the Whitbread Fremlins Head Brewer staying with us and he explained that because of anticipated Strike Action at Magor Brewery (Wales), Home to all the “top pressure” beers, Whitbread had bought in a large volume of the Belgian Brew “just in case”! As it was, the strike action didn’t go ahead and we only had the Belgian stuff on two deliveries, before resuming to UK produced.
The difference was very noticeable. I’d describe the Belgian Brew as “soft on the pallet”, which is possibly down to the lower Co2 content (gasification)....the knock on benefit being to the taste of it, which was fuller, richer almost bisquity, if you get my drift? The UK stuff was quite thin by comparison....it couldn’t hold a candle to its “Dad”!
One other thing: Brewers talk about “reconstituting the water”! This means “designer water” for each beer. As the brewing became a centralised process, Stella, Heineken, Murphy’s, etc (top pressure beers) located to Magor and all the “Real Ale” products went to Salmsbury, so the brewing “water” had to be “mixed” by the chemists, so that each product could be said to retain its traditional qualities.....Pigs Might Fly....
@@richardbaxter2057 I think Smithwicks took a dive after 2013 when production ended in Kilkenny
I haven’t drunk Stella in years and I can’t remember the last time I saw it on draft in a pub in Britain.
Most of the off licenses where I lived at the time stocked the Belgium brewed Stella and it was only the supermarkets near me that stocked the British brewed Stella. Even back then there was a noticeable difference.
Ruined under licence in the UK.
A little story...many years ago, I would occasionally drink Stella (the company I worked for would do a Friday lunch fish and chips run, with an optional can of Stella). I started to get a taste for it. One day it tasted different, not as good. It took another couple of Fridays before I realised it was 4.9%ABV instead of the 5.2% of the Stella I had been drinking. On further examination, I realised it wasn't Belgium Stella. It then fell a further .1%. I ceased to work for that company so stopped drinking the Stella. Shocked to find it's now 4.6%. IT'S JUST NOT THE SAME BEER.
Similar happened to Brugge Tripel. I first drank that in Bruges in the 2000s. 9.2% and utterly sublime. Beautiful deep caramel and baked apples. The company was bought out and first the % went down to 8.9 (I think) and then dropped further. IT'S NOT THE SAME BEER.
It's getting increasingly difficult to get genuine continental beers "off the shelf". First it was Stella, then Backs, then Staropramen an probably many more I have missed. The only one I can now find is Warsteiner which is a decent beer and still brewed in Germany...at the moment. 🤦♂
Pilsner Urquell. It is on the weaker side but the taste is phenomenal.
Try duval 8.5% belgium and Heineken in the 330 ml cans are imported
@@npche9865nope
Over the past year I've been looking closely to see where continental lagers are brewed and its nearly always in the UK. Once upon a time the stuff in cans was UK brewed, but you could find the Belgian beer in small bottles. Zywiec as far as I can tell is not UK brewed, do you know if that is the case?
Wenn I studied in the UK many years ago, a Belgian classmate wondered why at the time, Stella was quite an upmarket beer in the UK as it wasn't considered anything special at all in his native Belgium.
Probably everything in the recipe and marketing of Stella has morphed several times since then.
Stoke on Trent Recycled sewer water.
I've got Belgian friends and been there many times. Nobody drinks stella. It purely an export Beer with heavy marketing that tricked the Brits into thinking it was a good beer. It never was and never will be. Brits just have no fucking taste.
No Troll because that was how Lager was marketed in Ireland and the UK a fancy, upscale, bright, sophistication a world away from the flat cap image of bitter,mild and porter
I used do work for the marketing company that set up the Stella Artois Tennis Tournament and drinking it for the first time was a revelation compared with the British lagers. They used to market it as if it was sophisticated French product with Jean de Florette styled television adverts.
@@scottgraham1143
I was on internships with an ad agency and a food producer long ago and I've read how there are now industrial breweries intermittently producing different beer brands with the same machinery, so I'm a bit cynical about how much quality a beer brand can really stand for.
My current favourite is a local craft beer exclusively poured and sold in a pub and beer garden next to the microbrewery... but the old cynic inside me sometimes wonders if that stuff is really brewed there or if it's all just a big laugh.
What do we know, really? 🍻
Bubbles appear larger because your glassware is dirty. Grease allowing Co to form bubbles and escape the liquid. Can also explain the skunk but it's more likely that it's been stored improperly. Sunlight hitting a bottle can kill it in a matter of minutes.
Great idea and very interesting 👍 why can't we just have the good stuff. All this lowering the abv is bull. Was all good stuff back in my day. What went wrong?
Hello Simon, I am a new person to your website. I am so glad I subscribed. All your reviews are so professional. You have got it set just right for beer lovers. Keep it up and I hope this site grows and grows. Jon
British Stella has a lower ABV than the Belgian Stella because the alcohol strength decides the amount of tax on the beer. Inbrew have cut the strength of British Stella several times over the years to keep the price down.... which as Simon has stated has made the beer undrinkable..... R.I P Stell Artois.
The newish Stella unfiltered in the UK is much better and closer to the Belgian one, also 5%...so there's hope for Stella!
Heineken and Kronenberg are 5% and their prices are still on par with Stella so that excuse doesn’t really work for Stella.
@@underneonloneliness2 The UK brewed Kronenbourg is atrocious since Carlsberg bought them out, they've ruined the recipe by adding glucose syrup and Heineken isn't much better.
@@andrewcarr5923 It is a shame these big Brewers are buying everyone out. It means certain lagers are losing their uniqueness. It’s like that everywhere though. From beer to motor vehicles. It would be nice if all companies were independent again.
UK brewed Lager is chemical soup and will have you feeling sick as a dog the next day
Before 2020 all the Stella bottles in Belgium were brown bottles but they changed them to green ones to stand out more from the other Belgian pilsners. As a Belgian i feel like it affected the taste a little bit and i liked it more in the brown bottles, could be just me.
Simon please do the same thing with Japanese beer. Asahi , Kirin , Sapporo
When I first tried it in Australia during the 70s it was over 6%ABV, but didn't stay that way for long as the beer became more popular here.
Cider has always been expensive as it attracts a wine tax.
Guinness b&b here has always been my preference as it seems fuller bodied with lots going on, but their cans are rubbish.
What got me was when Staropramen used to be imported here back in the day it was incredible when compared to the other drivel you get on the supermaraket shelves, however they started brewing it here and it's absolutely disgusting now.
Same with Budvar
@@tombutler5489Buudvar slit nice
The Belgian version is usually in a brown bottle. I done a comparison on my beer blog a few years ago, but that's when Belgium in a Box webshop was open. Maybe they changed to a green bottle.
As I have often said here, I can't stand the disparity between the original foreign brew and the UK brew. Nothing to stop Stella from brewing a decent "Stella Artois British Lager" but what I hate is UK lager pretending to be the same as the Belgian version and not having the choice to buy the import. (Even the Belgian version has deteriorated - it now has corn and is 5% no longer consistent with the German Beer Purity Law and 5.2%). I stopped buying the UK version in the 1990s. It was just about OK in the 1980s when Whitbread brewed it at 5.2% but even then I looked for the Belgian import. I drank Stella in Brussels when I was working there in the early 2000's. Its on another planet from the UK version. Better to find good UK breweries that make good lager. Camden Hells is one good example. Buy British craft lager when at home!
I find the problem with British craft lagers is the horrible pale cloudy colour and far-too-hoppy taste. Can’t they make a nice clear golden one that doesn’t look and taste like a bad pint of bitter?
@@longjonwhite That is why Ale brewing is what Ireland and the UK are only good at
Who cares.
Stella is brewed by Anheuser-Busch, Bud Light’s parent company.
Leave it on the shelf instead.
I remember Stella in UK back in the late sixties early seventies, it was great, but i emigrated to Australia and the made here under license stuff is "orrible, but then so is the guiness and a few others, so these days i drink IPA as we get a lot good ones. Cheers
The two best quality lagers that aren't brewed in the UK and are still at a good price are Budvar and Pilsner Urquell. Can't go wrong with these. Belgium Stella is hard to get hold of.
I have found this with most, if not all, continental bears brewed under licence in the UK. Have you ever tasted Czechoslovakian Budweiser, I remember it back in the 80s, it was great?
Budvar?
Stella replaced my favourite drink of all time ‘Tennants Extra’ which for me had it all , the transition though was not too bad and I got used to and enjoyed drinking it but when they reduced it from 5.2 to first 4.8 then 4.6 it became undrinkable and unrecognisable. There is not a premium lager I enjoy now and the Spanish and Italian beers are awful . I did visit the highlands of Scotland recently and in lochinver I found Tennants on tap which had the similar taste to Extra but at 4 it was effectively the old pilsner version and lacked the extra taste the 0.8 % gave it . I am at such a loss now because I cannot find a lager on tap or in bottles or cans that I enjoy . I have only just found your channel and have subbed and hope you can steer me to a new premium beer they haven’t ruined .
Amstel is rubbish, at least the stuff sold in UK is.
Kronenbourg 1664 is my best suggestion. I grieve the loss of the old style Stella and KB 1664 is the only substitute I’ve found with a remotely similar depth of flavour (still not a patch though)
I love a nice cold Stella. Obviously, the proper stuff from Belgium. I haven't had this drink in ages gonna pick some up soon, actually.
*This is my biggest beer pet peeve*
I live in New Zealand, where we have an amazing amount of top quality breweries and brewing history. Yet we 'brew under license' and make SHIT versions of all the beers I want to drink. Can't get genuine Heineken or Stella or Sapporo here at all anymore, and the importers must be taking a bribe because we can't get ANY of the imported genuine versions anymore. It sucks!
The thing people are missing about Stella is that both the imported version and the locally brewed version are generic unremarkable beers. Same goes for all the pilsner style stuff.
Pilsner is Czech for piss
I used to be in a Belgian bike club back in the 90's and Belgian Stella was so much better than the Luton version. We could still get Belgian Stella from certain off-licences, but not any more. I lived on Stella and Jupiler.
Great video Simon . The uk version is awful and your knowledge and expertise really explains the reasons why . Looking forward to your other videos 👍🏻🍺😊
I'm in the Philippines & buy the Belgian Stella in cans. I enjoy it but I agree the bottled is best.