@@peacepham7838 he was my very first wall, first monster that killed me in 1 hit in High Rank, and I've never laughed so hard or wanted to get stronger to refight him more than that moment
Tbh even before this video i didn't like the fight, its just a lot of this community will attack people who disagree with them. I made a tierlist for sunbreak where i put valstrax in the bottom tier and the amount of vitriol i got from it was phenomenal.
my main problem isn't just with val but with what they did to monsters with mode changes because even if you prevent our knock a monster out of the state they tend to just go back into it with in a few seconds
Yeah it's a problem with sunbreak in world you could clearly see when monster was enraged or passive in sunbreak I personally can never tell the enrage effect just doesn't change the fight much ( not using any agitator build or anything )
@@konradkowalski1681 I will say Iceborne had bad floating enrage states where like tigrex and bazel can be enraged outside of their glowing modes. But the eyecon wad way better at tracking it. Vs Rise where its ALWAYS RED
It sounds like yall didn't like Valstrax because he was.. harder? I'm confused lol. Took me 2 tries my first couple of attempts, and I quite enjoy the battle. However; I did not face him in older games, so my opinion may not be as valid to some.
What constitutes harder, being annoying as fuck? And the point wasn't that they didn't clear Valstrax, they're literally speedrunners, they've done the fight way more than you have, they know the flaws of the fight. Of course, youtube commenter, of course you're confused, you watched the video in the background. Also clearing monsters to clear is literally not hard in Monster Hunter Rise, it's when you're trying to actually do shit is when the game gets either hard or annoying because some monsters just do not have interactive or intuitive movesets.
If you enjoy it in one game, it being better in another game couldn’t make it bad. I would say they’re roughly equal in how fun they are for each games’ combat.
Some of these points baffle me as a non-speedrunner. But then again I just appreciate monsters with generous openings and good tells and SB Strax really hasn't changed much in that department, he just uses his new moves way more than his old ones.
Thing is. in theory for a speedrunner Crimson Val is kinda...perfect? Like. its got obvious points where if you don't down it. you knkw the runs scrubbed and try again. But the thing is you shouldnt be able to read the entire hunt in 2 seconds like that. Valstrax has way to much coverage.
This was an L take. They said he’s a mostly hated nuisance, this couldn’t be further from the truth. Cera and Phem seem to be the only ones who think this, most people think the fight is awesome.
I’m really weirded out by this one. Because I think his moveset is great! I don’t know why you think the mines on wingslams for example “prevent you from hitting his openings”. He double slams and then taunts every time, so I just move my punish to aim for his head when he returns to neutral just before the taunt instead of hitting his head whilst the wing is down. Similarly, big slams when he’s in “big arm” mode are dodged by moving to the side of them, so that you don’t have to even deal with the mines in the first place. In fact, most of Valstrax’s moveset can actually be walked to dodge, which is not something I can say for most of Sunbreak. You pointed out the double wing stab (both air and ground version) as killing counters but you can just strafe the move and react to if he does the spin. You tried to option select out of the skill issue, but this really does feel like a skill issue! The only move with really high tracking is the beam drop but I think the intended way to dodge it without spending resources it is to get behind the beam into the deadzone where it can’t hit you. Granted, I admit this is the one move in the fight with the Sunbreak “tracking better than your roll”. But I feel like most weapons have ways to deal with it, so unless Bow exclusively doesn’t (in which fair, that kinda sucks), I don’t really mind it, especially because the time for when he does the beam is semi-scripted to a timer. I do find it strange that he does the beam twice back to back though. You tried to say “don’t say skill issue”, but it really feels like “skill issue” here! I’ve never disagreed more on a fight. He taunts properly on his attacks, he doesn’t overly track to the point of invalidating smart walking, he’s got a unique moveset. I love the fight. The main problems I have with the fight is that it’s super predictable in terms of his pace (first charge break it, enrage, second charge break it, he gets up, third charge with threshold too high to break, fight the full moveset for a bit, does the beam twice, final charge break it and he dies after is the most efficient clear time I got on him). He doesn’t chain 4+ attacks back to back with high tracking (*coughs* Malzeno *coughs*) or waste much time either. And I guess I can sympathise with elemental shit zones.
@@blackestyang7528 No, I can definitely understand some of sentiments these two have. I don’t like the extreme tracking on Sunbreak monsters, but Valstrax actually has less tracking.
The fact that this video was made after the latest patch shows how little they've played the game recently, the devs literally reduced tracking frames and now you can even walk around attacks and don't even need to evade.
Fighting this guy with IG is one of the most exhilirating boss fights I've had in ANY game, and it's definitely up with my alltime favs in the series. I understand removing important downtime might hurt from a speedrunners perspective, but as a non-speedrunner, this guy is one of my fav monsters.
This is pretty weird to hear, Valstrax was one of the best fights in sunbreak, and tbh one of the few challenging monsters in the game. I usually get bored of farming the same monster in a row but I can hunt 10 valstrax back to back and want to fight him more because the fight keeps you on your toes, and I say this as db main the most elemental reliant weapon.
Valstrax kicked my absolute shit in trying to farm for his hunting horn, and I had a fun time farming for him. I think he gets a little annoying in multiplayer cause he just flies all over the place but I loved learning his move-set when playing solo. Even after tracking was nerfed this guy is still tough. I had this for Shagaru trying to complete his armor set, it felt really rewarding. Learning what moves to counter (I used swaxe), the timing to dodge his attacks, and knowing what moves to counter. I love both of these fights, they’re incredible in Sunbreak.
@@ab-jg1ji most of the comment section states otherwise, including myself. also, it depended on the platform. The tracking was way less harsh on switch than pc, due to switch have lower frame rates
You just need to not dodge in the same direction for both beams, dodge one to the left and then dodge to the right, hell you don't need to dodge, you can now even walk it
@@Dinendal01 Yea it's clear that they don't even know about the latest patch reducing tracking frames, you can walk and reposition around so many monster attacks now.
I feel like Val was the hardest monster (of the 10-100 MR) . I never got deep into the fight but i found it enjoyable. I like using everything I had to even the playing field, it made it feel way stronger then everything else. I feel not every fight needs to be a counter heavy fight (like if you stand here you cannot get hit and have a big window to attack.) and having a fight be unfair and having to make very little work shows that you are not the most powerful thing in this world.
Again, I REALLY hate your opinion that Capcom should just bench all returning fights. Doesn’t make any sense to me. I think Phem said this in a video about Glavenus as well. Capcom should work on doing better with these hunts, not just shelve them for good. Makes no sense to me.
8:25 Didn't you say that GU Valstrax was only manageable due to that game's gimmicks like the evasive hunter arts and hunting styles? I don't really understand why that's fine, but Sunbreak Valstrax being designed to make you use the full array of tools the game offers is a bad thing.
As a traditional style CB user, I think his Sunbreak moveset is brilliantly designed. One of the few monsters that goes well with it. The aerial double forward stab is a great UED opening. The shockwaves after the grounded triple stab leave enough time for an AED. Anything that ends with the ground stab with explosions is a prime chance for another AED to the head. The huge laser, if you're close enough, is another chance at a UED. GP twice and then either Ready Stance or CPP. Should be close enough to land it. If you're quick, you could get some Air Dash bursts on him when he's in the air, but that's more risky. The only thing I don't like is they reduced the tracking and speed of the foreleg step into fanned wing slam from GU to Risebreak.
Nah I love the new val. Love his agression and his attacks that try force you into a spot where his next attack will land. He really tests all your mobility and defensive options. Hes got a bit of everything in grounded attacks, aerial, true combos, spins, beams, fast weak attacks, slow strong attacks, one of the best ultimate attacks from a spectacle perspective, etc.... I think IG is incredibly fun against him. Beating on his wings and mid air dodging his stabs or having an in air battle is fun. I also like using LBG with the side step dodge
Sunbreak in general just really wants all of the base Rise monsters with aura/enrage mechanics to quickly power up and stay powered up. I've noticed it mostly fighting Zinogre, Magnamalo, and Rajang. Rajang in particular is really annoying because of his arms turning solid: you'll hit his tail to knock him out of it, then 10 seconds later he's powered up again.
Rather than this being an issue with Valstrax specifically, I believe that this is a good example of something that I, personally, have thought about quite a lot since base Rise came out. Essentially, this is what happens when you give the players too much power. I don't just necessarily mean the mobility and wirebug skills in Rise either, I mean other changes regarding how the game is made. Maps are open now, because of this the developers allow you to move while you consume items. However, because you can move while you consume items, now monsters have less of a reason to give you long openings during combat that, previously, would have been perfect opportunities to pop a potion or whatever. You can restock items infinitely at base camp, so now there's less incentive to care about using up all of your potions because all you have to do is hop on your dog and run back to restock, as a result monsters now have to be more relentless in their attacks and damage in order to even put up a fight. There are also more game specific examples such as the different mantles in World and obviously wirebug mobility in Rise. It's stuff like this that ends up snowballing into these kinds of situations. The players now have far too much power at their disposal thanks primarily to gameplay changes and gimmicks that came with 5th gen, and as a result the developers have to create more and more insane challenges in order to compensate. Now let me be clear, this isn't meant to be a comment from a "MH Boomer" talking about how the older games are better because they're more clunky or whatever (I've got at least 1000 hours in World on PS4 + PC and about 500 in Rise on PC alone). I also think that some of this issue will be mitigated once we get to MH6 because the core numbered series games tend to have less flashy, anime-esque combat and abilities, but that also didn't exactly stop Fatalis in Iceborne from being one of, if not _the_ , hardest fights in the entire non-frontier series. Gameplay and design changes are inevitable for a game series, especially if it's been running for as long as Monster Hunter has. However, I don't think people realize what something relatively small that _seems_ like nothing but a positive thing, can end up doing for the game in the long run. I don't think MH should have remained as stagnant as Pokemon, stuck on a near 20 year old engine with little to no changes to the overall gameplay, but I _do_ think that the developers gave us too much of a good thing all at once, and now they're struggling to deal with the consequences of that choice.
idk man y'all trippin, this fight is really fun especially with duals or switch axe. I didn't even have to spam counter. Legit only took two hunts to get used to his sunbreak version
A perspective from someone who enjoys SB valstrax. I really like that you cant just counter away until he dies, unlike most sunbreak monsters. And if you play lance, you can still just counter away until he dies, but it's actually kidda hard this time. I also like that his chest charge is extremely predictable (After 1 or 2 moves after the fight starts, or right away if you manage to stop a charge). And considering that some weapon can chain the chest explosion topple 3-4 times in a row, it's a high reward with a trade off that he's almost permanently charged if you failed. Even then you get a very very juicy wingblades hitzone, and he still gives you a free chest charge sometime later in the fight where he just charges for a year with like 500 dmg threshold, which you can chain 1-2 more after it happened very easily for massive damage. Tip for anyone struggling with valstrax, treat him like a fast iceborne fatalis. Keep very close to him, alot of his moves are easier to roll if you roll into his under belly, and if you're mindful of the explosion afterward, you also get a nice opening to hit the head as your reward. He only has a few moves that punish you for doing so, which you can just dip out or counter it instead. I guess I just like gimmick fights or something.
That's kind of a childish point considering normal isn't in this game. Like, it's fair enough to assume that the variant is just "the Valstrax" of this gen.
@@bladechild2449 then why make the variant in the first place? There would be no point in making a variant if it was identical to the original, regardless if the original isnt in the game.
@@magnabueno5360 they specifically added a Variant of Valstrax because of his ecology; outside of flying through airships and attacking intruders, Valstrax is docile and usually avoids conflict, adding him in as another hyper-aggressive killing machine would have made little sense ecology-wise Crimson Glow Valstrax is to Valstrax what Savage Deviljho is to Deviljho, an individual driven insane with power and that's how they justify his extreme aggression
I really like most of these monster moveset analyses but this one just sounds like "they made him more difficult to keep up with player speed" to me honestly, I do agree the EHz stuff sucks but otherwise I generally find the new moveset a really fun challenge in a mostly too-easy game
Gu valstrax’s hitboxes were not that tight lol. Also, i feel like the mh community is running out of things to complain about with how good sunbreak is, so now we’re getting videos like this.
I mean most of their "gen 5 Monster" videos are like this. They cry about the monsters being worse to speedrun because you cant abuse their dumb gen 4 AI anymore (just watch their Glavenus video lmao).
Eh. I kinda just completely disagree with basically everything, I think it’s a good fight, I don’t have any moveset complaints. I think the only issue with CG is that normal Valstrax isn’t there to compare it to, so it feels like “he’s always enraged” which… would be perfectly fine if normal Valstrax was there to differentiate from. Honestly I don’t care anyway, I can just imagine the difference.
I mean that’s pretty much what all variants are. Furious Rajang, savage deviljho, seething bazelguese. They’re just always enraged and then have a second enraged state
@@Faint366 Except all the Monsters you named have fights more separated from their original counterpart then CG, CG is almost identical to master rank GenU Valstrax in every way possible
@@Depressosaur they are? I’ve noticed very little difference aside from one or two signature attacks. Seems just like CG, he has one or two unique attacks and his enraged state is just more mad than normal valstrax
@@Faint366 Savage Deviljho Seething Bazelgeuse and Furious Rajang were all massively different from their originals (Especially Savage), they have a lot of different unique moves that splice into their main mechanic/gimmick. CG as you said, only has two things different about it which is its laser cannon and dragon blasts leaving an area of effect. I hunted G-Rank Valstrax in mhgu quite a few times, and there isn't much different about it at all to represent a mad Valstrax.
@@Depressosaur umm what exactly is different about them? They’re similar enough that the console team doesn’t even include both versions in G rank. Savage just replaces deviljho, seething just replaces bazel. If Rise’s valstrax has the g rank normal valstrax move set, that’s already a big difference. You’re comparing high rank to g rank. Then there the different charging mechanic, different elemental weakness, laser beams. Seems like a page right out of savage deviljho, they even both get a laser beam attack as a variant move Isn’t that already typically how it works? Lots of monsters with high rank variations (not just variants, some subspecies do this too) get some of those moves in their g rank form. Compare high rank to high rank, and g rank to g rank. They’re both out now
I don't really agree with any of this. Don't agree that GU valstrax was so amazing. Don't agree that Sunbreak val is so bad or even all that different than Rise valstrax. As for the tracking, I play on switch, but I feel like the answer is evade extender 3. I have EE1 on all my builds but for val I always go to 3. lets you easily dodge anything, as well as chase him down faster. Valstrax has always had attacks with annoyingly large hitboxes, so EE (or adept style in GU) has always been super helpful. I definitely think that valstrax's gunner hitzones in Rise/SB are cancer and that's probably the worst part of the fight. But in general, SB valstrax is fine. Not my favorite monster by any means but its not especially bad. I don't mind the powered up states though. Yeach you cant punish the wingstabs as well anymore but its not a big deal. I just hit it in the face with my hammer or switchaxe and it dies in about 10 minutes. When it tries to attack me I dodge out of the way. Never realized people had such a problem with this monster.
And honestly you can mitigate a lot of his attacks by simply staying close to his head and dodge rolling attacks towards his head. You don’t even need evade extender. It’s one of the first fights that taught me how important positioning is.
I remember fighting G Rank GU Valstrax with Adept LS (my main in MHGU) and I could instantly tell that it was a more recent addition to the series, it didn't turn 45 degrees twice to face you, it didn't stay in the air for 30 minutes and it's moves were all well telegraphed... in Rise (and Sunbreak) I found him WAY harder than in MHGU; it's moveset was the same but there were several extra moves added on, it was a High Rank monster with a more advanced moveset than a G Rank monster also fun fact; I didn't know that it's charged state nullified elemental damage until Sunbreak... which made hunting him with Element Phial CB a bit problematic lol
Valstrax in this game is a Bow killer, this is the only fight in all of Rise/Sunbreak where I deliberately have to change my playstyle. Everything else I can just counter and shoot. This guy I need to play patiently against and wait for openings.
Sunbreak valstrax is honestly the best he's been. His hitboxes are just as good as they were in gu, if not better because some of his more eh hitboxes are improved a good bit. And as a casual player, his charged states honestly just feel the same with the normal state but you have to keep in mind of the dragon explosions which I find quite enjoyable. As for the ele hitzones I just found it fine, the most annoying thing was just how the notes don't even tell you about it and thats a nitpick and a half. Beam is just the beam but having to keep moving before going back in the attack his head before backing off and getting ready for the next move. And even when solo, no wyvern ride, and using like one of the endemic life I still found him a blast to fight. And I'm gonna be honest. While I feel the whole skill issue statement is over used and not properly used. This whole video just screams skill issue
Even greatsword has a hard time with the chest topples I find since there's too short of a time to actually be in the right position and have a strong attack lined up for it.
I don't mind Val's new moveset in Sunbreak, but I do mind it CONSTANTLY trying to enter its enraged state. Even now, its a jaring disparity between its MR and HR versions. In HR, if you got the chest topple, you could expect to fight it for a bit without it becoming enraged again. But in Sunbreak, not only is the window massively reduced, but it will want to go into this state constantly and will literally refuse to do anything else until it does. (I remember watching a 4 LS speedrun that was literally just nonstop chest topples. The Valstrax didn't even so much as consider any other option, it ONLY tried to enter its enraged state and repeated failed to do so until it died.) Further adding fuel to this fire though is that every time you do successfully get the chest topple, the window becomes smaller and the damage threshold becomes higher. It will scale to the point where a full power TCS from GS will still not be enough to meet the damage threshold and anything else will not have enough burst damage to come even close. As a result, if you are playing solo, it is literally impossible to prevent Valstrax from becoming enraged. And just as a cherry on top, the chest topple also denies you the satisfaction of getting it because every time you miss it, it gets longer with a smaller damage threshold to the point where a single hit from almost any weapon will cause the topple. So either you have to hit an ungodly amount of damage in an impossibly small window or wait for the devs to pity your soul enough to basically give you the topple for free. Overall, it just doesn't feel good in any way.
The follow-up laser is honestly the most obnoxious part of his kit. If they didn't make the tracking so aggressive on it (potentially so it actually becomes another opening), and made it so the lingering dragon explosions came out in a more predictable pattern (so you could reposition around them more), I think the fight would be fine. Not as good as it was, cause he'd still be charge happy, but at the very least his more obnoxious elements would have a bit more counterplay.
@@alexanderjames3538 I don’t know if it was clear or not but I was asking if the ele zones go to 0 when he enrages OR charges as those are two distinct states he can be in (and can be both at once)
One major thing that make Sunbreak Val so annoying is like most Sunbreak monsters, it has bs tracking that you have to either counter it, or perfectly time your dodge 2-3 times in a row, combine that with it's speed, massive hitbox, and can potentially combo you to death if you get hit even once, you get a recipe for disaster. And good luck hitting that chest when it's charging, especially if you're using short melee weps like sns
The chest charge is shorter in SB but gotta make the monster harder somehow. I actually prefer the charged wings after the chest charge, the wings are softer and breaking them are almost impossible without it.
To be honest, I like the new Val fight. The only monster I have a problem with it's change state is Rajang for obvious reasons. Val takes more damage for more threat, rather than less damage. It makes sense for it being more threatening at Master rank.
Maybe it's because I play bow, but Crimson Glow Vastrax is one of the most enjoyable monster to hunt in Sunbreak. I fought him so much I must have gotten 25 of his G-rank sphere. Spamming high elements on his legs while dancing around him scores me average sub 7 and that's enough for an enjoyable hunt for me. Playing a wex build is like shooting yourself in the foot. I don't reccomend it. I wish more monsters works outside of "meta" to freshen up Monster Hunter. I've been playing Monster Hunter for 18 years, killed my first Rathalos in 2004. And at this point, nothing feels more brain dead than having wex builds and playstyles.
As someone who has enjoyed both GU and Rise Valstrax, I feel he is a better fight in Rise/Sunbreak. After fighting him a while, I don’t have problems with the chest break or dodging the double beam. I don’t even have evade extender. The beam is telegraphed so blatantly.
Wow. I know the comment section is generally disagreeing with you guys, but I now see why. I need to timestamp some points of yours. 5:39 The caption highlights lack of AoE on the wing slams for GU Valstrax, but what it actually highlighted is that you seemed to miss the fact that the wing slam AoE added on Crimson Glow is in the front of the wing, not the sides, so you could dodge the wing slam in the exact same manner you showed in the GU sample for Crimson Glow. 5:53 So are you actually mad that in a game built partially around counters, that monsters will counter your counters? And remember that, by your own admission earlier in the video, GU Valstrax worked around the counters and evasions of Valor mode, Absolute Evasion/Readiness, but I guess since he didn't counter those tools the hunter had, he's better? But now that the fight keeps those tools in mind, it's terrible? 6:45 The moveset barely changed. The only new moves I counted are the wing stabs in the air (and the combos from that), and the laser coming downward. 6:51 Forces him to be airborne a significant amount of time? Am I not noticing something, or does Valstrax stay airborne purely for certain attack combos, then comes back down quickly like Rise Rathalos? I'm never not in striking distance of Valstrax for too long, so this point is either factually incorrect and a massive exaggeration, or I'm missing the experience of Valstrax in Sunbreak being like World Kushala where he's basically never on the ground. 7:15 Yeah, you mention this short vent check multiple times, when I'm fairly certain the shorter ones are literally unable to be popped. If you can find someone popping the short ones consistently, let me know. He does have the traditional long vent check like in GU if he does the chest vent while in Crimson Glow mode, so that would be your ticket to remove the mode from him. The fact Cera posited that Greatsword could *maybe* pop it implies that you have never actually seen it happen, which might be because it can't. 8:17 "Forced" to use all these things, but again, as you admitted with the GU Valstrax introduction, he's too fast for older games' movesets like Guild or Striker styles to deal with (at least without Evasion Arts), so wouldn't this be a problem for GU Valstrax too? Now I'm not saying it actually is for either, because I've beaten both of these monsters numerous times, in GU without using evasive arts or easy counters like with Adept or Valor, and in Sunbreak without spamming counters or using Marionette Spiders, or forcing Turf Wars, or any of the things you say are now "required". 8:20 "And if the monster needs the gimmicks of the game to prop it up and make it bearable". Again, you already said the same about GU Valstrax, so this is an admonishment of both monsters by your standard. Even though the statement is just false. 8:51 I'm surprised people have such a hard time with the laser slam down. I've literally only gotten hit by it twice on my first 2 fights with Sunbreak CGV, and ever since I've NEVER countered them, because I don't need to. This was before the tracking nerf patch too, so there is actually no excuse guys. 9:36 Your reward is the same as other big moves... a huge opening of a taunt he does every time. 10:25 According to who? You guys? I feel like I've made enough points to show that your assessment is not agreeable enough to be that widespread. And this whole "it's a skill issue" thing. Yes, it's not constructive, but you guys mentioned so many factually incorrect things here, that I think someone could have some ground to say it, in fact, IS a skill issue thing. Now I personally won't, but... you're both still incorrect on many of these assessments.
it's a bit jarring to hear you list disliking having to use marionette spiders wyvern riding because it *checks notes* forces you to engage with all of monster hunter rise sunbreaks mechanics..
I honestly think Phemeto dislikes Rise on a fundamental level, to the point where even if they do the same things they did in older games like GU (heavy emphasis on evasions and counters), for some reason Rise/Sunbreak are at fault while GU is unassailable.
Forget the lasers, the midair double wing poke breaks my brain. The way it moves is really weird and doesn't register as an attack to me, I had to consciously break my immersion and train myself to react to it properly because it would always hit me. The first poke trips you and sets you up to get hit by the second one, which is death for a gunner. It's really annoying and he does it constantly
Many monster moves have low startup to knock you down into a combo. Not sure why this is an exception that's so egregious. And I've never gotten comboed by the first stab into the second stab or the wing slam except the first couple of times when I was learning his Master Rank moveset.
Crimson Glow doesn't need to be a thing. It could've just been normal valstrax and we wouldn't have lost anything important. Valstrax imo is THE best designed fights in all of classic MH. CGValstrax just doesn't do it justice in Rise when you can straight up fly away - or toward it after getting hit. There is no risk-reward in rise because there is no risk. You can outheal nearly everything with a single point in Recov Up
He seems pretty widely considered one of the best monsters in the game. His fight is one of the best examples of arise taking full advantage of the hunters increased mobility This is very much a minority opinion yes
It sounds like they are saying that they don't like the rise valstrax because he doesn't give as many windows to attack or telegraph his attacks as often in addition to dragon explosions and beams being too hard hitting. Well, I never played GU so I don't know what he's "supposed" to play like so I just fight him the way he is. It's a fun fight. Not as much fun as Lunagaron or gore/shagaru magala. But id MUCH RATHER fight valstrax over magmudron or aurora somncanth
Great sword main ( not a strong arm stance user) , Took me 30 to 35 mins to solo it , my first monster hunter game is rise , so i dk much abt it to compare but i can say he's waaay dangerous than he was in rise , way faster , smarter and much more deadlier .
Tbh I do have issues with SB Val, but for slightly different reasons being a Shieldbro (Gunlance mainly, but been loving SB Lance too so have been rocking that). Outside of his ambush Val's attacks don't really phase me since I just block or parry them. But G/Master Rank Val takes longer to fight than he did in High Rank because he spends so much time in the air. Now as Lance I can time a Shield Bash and get some chip damage in from the wing stabs, but GL is kinda SOL until he lands outside of getting some free sharpness in from Guard's Edge. And he does it often enough alongside other moves that take him out of reasonable range or keep me at a distance (yeah I can tank the lazer sweep and just take some chip damage, but the knockback even with max Guard is enough that I'm kept at a distance, setting him up for more ranged moves). So I don't actually get to engage with Val that much, especially as a GL. With Lance I could probably yeet towards him with the Wirebug sheathing skill if I time it right and am clever with my angle, but GL doesn't really have that option as Bullet Barrage only has super armor while you're cooling the Wyvern Fire and not while you hurl towards the monster, and Blast Dash has no s. Maybe Reverse Dash could, but I pretty much refuse to give up Guard's Edge so...that's on me. Either way, I spend more time waiting for him to come down in range for an opening to start smacking than I do actually smacking or trading blows with him. At least with critters like Rathalos they hover close enough that I can get some good upward pokes/shells in if I position right, but Val? Nah, autoposition just out of reach specifically to hit with the wing blades and high enough that only IG and Gunners can feasibly hit him even if you maneuver close. And yeah, the Chest opening is kinda...weird. The more he does it before a pop the longer it lasts, only resetting if you get the burst. The first one is dummy short and the wind pressure doesn't let it be as big of an opening unless you can negate it (at least Defiance is a thing now). I'm kinda used to it as it provides SOME kind of consistent opening for me to smack him if I'm playing GL (my Lance set is pretty good at racking up KOs, so I get a few of those in which helps shorten the fight, but at most I could get maybe 3 a hunt, and that's if I go nuts with the shield bash), but I definitely agree that the first one is too short for any weapon to reasonably take advantage of (well, aside from GS like you said). I wouldn't mind leg topples for him as I could use those alongside the KOs I net with Lance to lock him down, or if I'm using GL give me a good target to shell for some openings. So overall as a Shieldbro, yeah Sunbreak Valstrax is more annoying to fight than fun, which sucks because he was hella fun in base Rise as GL since I could Guard's Edge various attacks and had more openings to blast dash at him to keep engagement time up. SB Val takes that away and thus makes the fight feel more like a slog. Shame.
Agreed, Lance main here and I really don't find his fight very fun. He flies super far away, has an unreasonably small hitbox for his main weakpoint, and overall his moves just don't seem to gel all that well with Lance gameplay. The beam and dive are also just really unsatisfying to deal with, it's either sheathing retreat or superman for both, which sucks for a weapon that's supposed to be the "bastion of defense".
@@prawn1717 Yeah. Dive is nope city, even with Guard 5 and Guard Up (though now that Embolden is a thing and stacks...?), but the Beam is 50/50. I can block it, but there's still knockback and the chip damage adds up, so I feel ya on that one. Maybe with Embolden stacking I can nope it with the right skill combo now so that the Beam isn't an issue.
In my PC playthrough, my first faint was to MR Narwa and my 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th etc were to MR Valstrax. I got pretty frustrated and dedicated several play sessions to improving against him. I tried all fourteen weapons several times over and carted occasionally with most of them. Eventually I landed on SnS as the most cohesive with his Tempo. I practiced a lot and he's now my third favourite fight in MR (behind Lucy and Malzeno)... One caveat though. I have to be using SnS. His moveset, enraged or not, is almost completely punishable with metsu or back hops. The only move I'm yet to consistently abuse is his downward dragon explosion. Even his double laser can be punished by a slightly off-center metsu followed by plunging thrust into back-hop. I've also started practicing SA and GS against him with some success. Your points are very valid though. For most weapons I've tried, his lethality and persistence get overwhelming fast and not having a convenient topple is rough. In terms of mechanics, they might've been altered to a point that they detract from the fight rather than enhance it and the elemental nullification certainly is pretty limiting. Despite that, Valstrax can be a great fight with SnS. I've found a way to make him fun but I can see why he's a grating experience for most.
Evade extender + evade window made the battle fun, and I really like it for it. Making a monster that requires a build thats not only based around “big number” made the battle super enjoyable, and the sacrifice to damage was barely noticeable.
Glad someone else is saying this because I hate new Valstrax. It doesn't help that after fighting him you fight Scorned and after fighting him you go "That was it?" Yeah kinda sad when Valstrax had to have bullshit levels of difficulty to be "Challenging". More importantly, I don't get why people think this but: Monster Hunter was never about bullshit monster difficulty, it was about almost a methodical dance and once you mastered it you could bully monsters into the ground. Instead, now we have monsters that tracking that was so unfun, they had to mega nerf it recently. I'm starting to believe that the game testers in Nintendo in total are just ass at their job as this issue is happening across the board in any Nintendo game that is suppose to be "challenging". Look at Splatoon 3, most the maps have no alleys to hide in and thus snipers absolutely dominate the game. Some weapons: Splatana Wiper, Undercover Brella, etc. have not gotten the buffs they needed before the game launch. Who does their playtesting at Nintendo and why do they suck so bad?
@@JiggyNegus He's definitely slower. In G rank version he hover in the air A LOT. Gives you enough time to react to his attack. P.S. I play bow and lance.
@@chianliu8352 To be fair most monster are supposed to be fast are much slower than any gen before. Like rise/sunbreak rajang much slower than gu rajang but tracking wise it is nuts
not to mention Strax got a new toy in his dual aerial stab all nice and dandy. Yeah no like a 5 year old toddler he will show it around to everyone all the time shoving it into your face almost 24/7 and its annoying since it for once doesnt knock you back which leaves you wide open for getting combod if you dont know of this interaction
The stab is not too much damage to begin with, and since it only knocks down, it makes the second stab, or his wing slam followup easy to dodge. Not to mention, both followups make him taunt for a little bit. Not sure why his new move is hard to deal with. The only real difficulty is the lack of startup for the first stab, but old Monster Hunter fans love moves with low or no startup. And if you're not an older fan, the first stab isn't much damage.
Man, if you guys are crying this hard already I can't wait to see what happens when they throw Risen Crimson Glow Valstrax at you. 😂 Which is good, tbh, I can always use a bit more salt.
Idk I really enjoyed this fight! I think it is a good challenge and really tests your skills on the weapon you play. I soloed with dual blades and it was fun to be honest. I want to see Risen Valstrax, that would be a lot of fun.
I watched this whole vid waiting for a point that made sense... it didn't happen the rise version was one of my favorite all time monster hunter fights. Val is so fast and unbelievably punishing and I loved grinding out its armor and weapon. Val was one of the most entertaining grinds.
"If the monster needs the gimmick of the game to make it bearable, is it really a good fight?" You just touted Val for catering to the mechanics of GU??? Some points are valid but the difficulty of this game has to be brought in in other ways, wirebug management, set builds, using different switch skills. This installment gives so much power to the hunter, to without the mechanics I get how this fight would be annoying, but there's so much customization to the experience that I think you aren't addressing to make this fight more enjoyable. And before you say, "why should the player have to make a boss fight enjoyable," that's just how the adjustment period is. It's the core way of prepping in this game. Certain skills make this fight much more bearable and the moveset KEEPS you tense yeah, but this is the only fight that has that kind of feel? You gripe about tracking but Malzeno has WAY MORE AGGRESSIVE TRACKING with his wing slams. Malzeno is way more smothering on the player solo than Valstrax. I know you said not to say it but this honestly really does feel like a skill issue.
I’m not even a fan of rise in general but this really just seems like “I can’t dodge the move so it’s bad.” Like, you really need them to lower the leg topple values because you can’t fight him unless you have an easy way to pin him to the ground over and over? You think the chest burst is a necessity because he’s impossible to fight in his enraged state? Come on.
Trust me I know EXACTLY how you guys feel! Coming from someone who solo’s this guy enough to make his armor and 12 weapons, it just feels like a slog when you can’t personally engage with the monster fight and have all damage opportunities made unnecessarily difficult due to constant aoes flying and after affects. I’d say he’s the more annoying monsters than outright difficult like Scorned. Cuz with scorned you can learn the fight and get better plus the hitzones are better . Valstrax is spamming aoes and tracking moves and im just like “sit still”
I... Don't get most of these criticisms? The residual dragon energy on the wing slams gives you more than enough time to get out of there unless you use a non-stationary counter with a long ass recovery time, and Valstrax stands still after that for a good hit anyway. It's doesn't spend THAT long in the air, and he ALWAYS comes down at most after the second attack, giving you time to position under the head for a hit. The double laser can be rendered not only useless, but a BIG opening if you just walk towards Valstrax after the first laser is fired. Most of what I'm hearing is that you don't like how Valstrax makes you work instead of spamming counters on all he does. He doesn't work well with elemental weapons? Use a raw option, there IS one for every weapon. His attack with about 6 seconds of buildup can't be countered? It has *six seconds of buildup* , sheathe your weapon and dive. Some weapons like the Hammer can pop it first time if they don't spam other shit around beforehand, it's really predictable since it always happens near the start of the fight.
His wingarm still take elements damage when charge. also with the tracking nerf, when facing the double wing stab, u can literally walk to avoid the 1 st stab then u dodge or counter the 2nd stab, With evade extender u can dodge his leser attack twice easily even before tracking nerf If you want to fight Valstrax and manage to evade all his move bow with dodge bolt will solve problem -.-
I think the underlying issue is that valstrax has a very specific unique toppled which we player should be able to take advantage of and that is now become more like a bait almost... much like when you spend the entire fight trying to cut a tail you know can be cut but has an impossible threshold... just become frustrating (although people are obviously free to enjoy the challenge, it's not well designed) that's all... I don't understand why bringing up the "git gud" argument if you have seen anything on this channel
I'm like 95% sure that first "chest charge" is supposed to be near-impossible to pop. It's not a design oversight or anything, but a way to convey the power and challenge of the monster. Of course, you can take issue with this approach, anyway, but I'm pretty sure it's deliberate. Anyway, I like the fight. He's hard, he isn't fair, and he pisses me off, and it makes it more satisfying to beat him.
He's literal bs when you're close to him, even if you dodge early with a close gap attack or the laser cannon, with the laser cannon he'll track on you despite perfectly dodging thus you're forced to put away your weapon then superman dive (when you're very close to him) that's IF you can if not then you're pretty much fucked but if you're far away you can definitely dodge roll it while sprinting a hard left or right, this isn't from a casual player by the way, I sweat and play hard doing quick runs with my try hard bois (the no lifes who 100% and HR/MR 999 in every game, no ego intended just showing it isn't from someone who haves terrible reflexes), this Valstrax is pure cancer in this game. GU was tolerable because of the styles which I loved Adept. Also can we talk about his ridiculous range with his spin the win attack in this game?
Off topic but I really miss how big positioning was. It felt great in past games to just, well for lack of a better term, "play by ear" a monster. I won't lie; when you farmed a monster like 20 times you get the gist of the fight. It starts to feel scripted as you get efficient at it. I was just glad at times I could break the pace by trying something different. In Sunbreak I feel like all my tools are specifically for this type of move and this type of move ONLY. I'm sad that Sunbreak doesn't have that jazz-like feel I got from other MHs.
I'm not sure what you're talking about honestly. I have to think about positioning plenty of times in Sunbreak, usually while a move is happening or beforehand while thinking about what the options are for the monster at a certain range/combo or something. I have yet to find a move in this game that both involves only one way to deal with it, and it being a commonly used move.
@@norsehorse84 I dunno how to properly put it either. It's like the tracking on monsters are fucking with me and positioning. Before i can kinda trust a Monster's attack would have a certain range and stop. Not it feels uncertain if they hit me or if they just stop sometimes.
All i hear is complaining, as an hh main who doesnt even have a counter at all hes one of the best fights in the game. I just compansate for his harder attacks with evade extender 2 which now has a lv4 deco.
To be fair, in his amped state the wings are really squishy, so if you have good positioning you can punish his wing slams, or you can hit the lower parts when he's front facing them. Depends on the weapon a little but there's a lot of options in SB. Don't like his new hovering wings pokes though, that shits harder to dodge than his residual dragon pools.
Tbh i think i would be much happier with MR valstrax if the charge up was 2-4 seconds longer(or a longer tell befpre charge up begins to allow for a bit more time to reposition), or the threshold was ~15-20% lower
I just assumed they removed the chest pop in MR. Never got it to pop. But then, I didn't really enjoy the fight so I fought Val a handful of times to get the gear and I haven't thought about it since. I doubt we'll see a Risen Valstrax but if they do make that happen it could be an opportunity to fix the jank.
@@peacepham7838 You don't need to do it in 5 seconds, you just have to reach the threshold while it's charging. Any damage done before it starts the charge still counts, so if you are hitting the chest before it starts it's much easier. I've popped it with a single sticky ammo before.
I'm not a fan of the blueish tint he has now. The silver and black just looked so cool and the ruggedness of the old Gen graphics really sells its jet plane appearance.
Pretty sure the “blue” you’re seeing is just rise’s improved lighting. Everything looks blue at night in rise. During the day, there’s still a tinge of blue due to the sky’s atmospheric light
I do like how you presented your points here, very clear. I do wish it was made clear that these critisms are from the perspective of a speedrunner. It very obvious the critisms and annoyances you two have with Valstrax are from a speed runners perspective. At least that's how I interpret these crisitsms. From a casual playstyle all these cristisms aside from the game being designed around counters don't really matter. Not everyone is trying to lock a monster down, keep good elemental hit zones active, and prevent an enraged state. Only a speedrunner would find these things annoying enough to make a video lol. I don't say this with malice because from a speedrunning perspective I totally get it as a speedrunner myself, I just still enjoy a casual experince
Yeah, was watching it and I think it is a fair point you brought up. A lot of the points felt too specific on topples & his enraged/amped up state changes. Even with him charging up, he takes longer to do it when his cycle completes so the next time he does it it’ll take longer giving more time to attempt a chest backfire; not gonna do it on the first try everytime! And Val’s wings become soft when amped up, so it’s more of a trade-off, so weapons are way less likely to bounce off, least from my experience. Even a lot of Valstrax’s attacks from my experience he stands still (I.E. his aerial attacks once he lands) or is simple enough to dodge (the wing stab is more tricky & may require a bit of training, but it could be done without Evade Extender, but the wing jabs, even with the Dragonmines, are pretty damn easy to dodge without Evade Extender; again, may require some practice to see when and what direction to dodge.) I’ve seen plenty of openings from a bunch of Val’s attacks that allowed me a few hits in; & yeah, slower weapons won’t be able to utilize it all the time, that’s a given for MANY monsters, not exclusive to Valstrax at all. I still understand Speedrun struggles with this, but it’s hard to take stuff like this seriously & accept it as if it was facts.
![[MHR:S] Bowgun FAQ and Q&A | Random Gunner Tips](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/sXWQwklWJHA/mqdefault.jpg)
![[MHR:S] Bowgun FAQ and Q&A | Random Gunner Tips](/img/tr.png)
This video and comments section is the only time I've ever heard anybody say they hate Valstrax or CGV in Rise or Sunbreak...
This kind of "echo chamber" effect, where content creator make a point and other just follow. Some do disagree thou.
@@peacepham7838 he was my very first wall, first monster that killed me in 1 hit in High Rank, and I've never laughed so hard or wanted to get stronger to refight him more than that moment
@@Bluemansonic right?
a lot of the comments I've been seeing so fat disagree with the video lol
Tbh even before this video i didn't like the fight, its just a lot of this community will attack people who disagree with them. I made a tierlist for sunbreak where i put valstrax in the bottom tier and the amount of vitriol i got from it was phenomenal.
my main problem isn't just with val but with what they did to monsters with mode changes because even if you prevent our knock a monster out of the state they tend to just go back into it with in a few seconds
I don't even bother going for rajangs tail anymore because of this. I'd rather just go for horn breaks if he's only knocked out of rage for 20 seconds
Yeah, it’s so stupid. Why am I even knocking a monster out of a power mode any more? It just seems like a waste of time.
It’s even worse with Valstrax, since your elemental damage literally disappears whether you play well or not.
Yeah it's a problem with sunbreak in world you could clearly see when monster was enraged or passive in sunbreak I personally can never tell the enrage effect just doesn't change the fight much ( not using any agitator build or anything )
@@konradkowalski1681 I will say Iceborne had bad floating enrage states where like tigrex and bazel can be enraged outside of their glowing modes.
But the eyecon wad way better at tracking it. Vs Rise where its ALWAYS RED
It sounds like yall didn't like Valstrax because he was.. harder? I'm confused lol.
Took me 2 tries my first couple of attempts, and I quite enjoy the battle.
However; I did not face him in older games, so my opinion may not be as valid to some.
What constitutes harder, being annoying as fuck? And the point wasn't that they didn't clear Valstrax, they're literally speedrunners, they've done the fight way more than you have, they know the flaws of the fight. Of course, youtube commenter, of course you're confused, you watched the video in the background.
Also clearing monsters to clear is literally not hard in Monster Hunter Rise, it's when you're trying to actually do shit is when the game gets either hard or annoying because some monsters just do not have interactive or intuitive movesets.
If you enjoy it in one game, it being better in another game couldn’t make it bad. I would say they’re roughly equal in how fun they are for each games’ combat.
I've beaten every monster in rise first try so far if anything i think we need harder monsters
Yea
Some of these points baffle me as a non-speedrunner. But then again I just appreciate monsters with generous openings and good tells and SB Strax really hasn't changed much in that department, he just uses his new moves way more than his old ones.
Thing is. in theory for a speedrunner Crimson Val is kinda...perfect?
Like. its got obvious points where if you don't down it. you knkw the runs scrubbed and try again. But the thing is you shouldnt be able to read the entire hunt in 2 seconds like that.
Valstrax has way to much coverage.
This was an L take. They said he’s a mostly hated nuisance, this couldn’t be further from the truth. Cera and Phem seem to be the only ones who think this, most people think the fight is awesome.
I’m really weirded out by this one. Because I think his moveset is great! I don’t know why you think the mines on wingslams for example “prevent you from hitting his openings”. He double slams and then taunts every time, so I just move my punish to aim for his head when he returns to neutral just before the taunt instead of hitting his head whilst the wing is down. Similarly, big slams when he’s in “big arm” mode are dodged by moving to the side of them, so that you don’t have to even deal with the mines in the first place.
In fact, most of Valstrax’s moveset can actually be walked to dodge, which is not something I can say for most of Sunbreak. You pointed out the double wing stab (both air and ground version) as killing counters but you can just strafe the move and react to if he does the spin.
You tried to option select out of the skill issue, but this really does feel like a skill issue! The only move with really high tracking is the beam drop but I think the intended way to dodge it without spending resources it is to get behind the beam into the deadzone where it can’t hit you. Granted, I admit this is the one move in the fight with the Sunbreak “tracking better than your roll”. But I feel like most weapons have ways to deal with it, so unless Bow exclusively doesn’t (in which fair, that kinda sucks), I don’t really mind it, especially because the time for when he does the beam is semi-scripted to a timer. I do find it strange that he does the beam twice back to back though.
You tried to say “don’t say skill issue”, but it really feels like “skill issue” here! I’ve never disagreed more on a fight. He taunts properly on his attacks, he doesn’t overly track to the point of invalidating smart walking, he’s got a unique moveset. I love the fight.
The main problems I have with the fight is that it’s super predictable in terms of his pace (first charge break it, enrage, second charge break it, he gets up, third charge with threshold too high to break, fight the full moveset for a bit, does the beam twice, final charge break it and he dies after is the most efficient clear time I got on him). He doesn’t chain 4+ attacks back to back with high tracking (*coughs* Malzeno *coughs*) or waste much time either. And I guess I can sympathise with elemental shit zones.
You can dogde the second beam with the wirebug you just need ro move to the side and he will allways miss the second beam
@@bartoszoskar8836 I mean either way you spend a resource
He's probably just salty that he couldn't memorise all it's moves
pre-5th gen MonHun vets saying they want the games to be more difficult is the definition of "you think you do, but you don't" :P
@@blackestyang7528 No, I can definitely understand some of sentiments these two have. I don’t like the extreme tracking on Sunbreak monsters, but Valstrax actually has less tracking.
Isn’t the laser attack literally countered by 1 level of evade extender?
Or 0, just get the timing.
You can literally just keep moving then roll without any levels of evade extender
You can also just roll into the laser for a good damage opportunity
@@pauleynon96 good damage on you or the monster?
The fact that this video was made after the latest patch shows how little they've played the game recently, the devs literally reduced tracking frames and now you can even walk around attacks and don't even need to evade.
Fighting this guy with IG is one of the most exhilirating boss fights I've had in ANY game, and it's definitely up with my alltime favs in the series. I understand removing important downtime might hurt from a speedrunners perspective, but as a non-speedrunner, this guy is one of my fav monsters.
SAME! Fighting Crimson Glow with IG is so much fun!
Brooooooo as a glaive main I couldn’t agree more!😁
So its not just me who find that chest charging stupidly fast compared to MHGU
Glad i wasn't the only one thinking the time window was too short
I mean, the whole game is faster in general and it is a variant monster so it makes sense.
dont forget it's a variant, it's meant to be rougher
I felt the same way
@@holydiver4988 THANK YOU! I WAS THINKING THE SAME THING WHILE WATCHING THIS!
This is pretty weird to hear, Valstrax was one of the best fights in sunbreak, and tbh one of the few challenging monsters in the game. I usually get bored of farming the same monster in a row but I can hunt 10 valstrax back to back and want to fight him more because the fight keeps you on your toes, and I say this as db main the most elemental reliant weapon.
I hard agree, and I actually don’t really use counters. I use full evasion extender switch axe as my main weapon
@@successfulfailure1298 dude same
Valstrax kicked my absolute shit in trying to farm for his hunting horn, and I had a fun time farming for him. I think he gets a little annoying in multiplayer cause he just flies all over the place but I loved learning his move-set when playing solo. Even after tracking was nerfed this guy is still tough.
I had this for Shagaru trying to complete his armor set, it felt really rewarding. Learning what moves to counter (I used swaxe), the timing to dodge his attacks, and knowing what moves to counter.
I love both of these fights, they’re incredible in Sunbreak.
no way anyone had fun fighting him the tracking is too much valstrax had guaranteed hits if u did not use a counter
@@ab-jg1ji most of the comment section states otherwise, including myself. also, it depended on the platform. The tracking was way less harsh on switch than pc, due to switch have lower frame rates
You can't just say "don't call it a skill issue" when your argument boils down to it requiring more skill to fight than it's previous iteration.
This guy is exceptionally whiny for his type of sub count
It's so weird because I hate the new valstrax for being easier and slower than in Gen, this entire video is weird af
Idk about needing counters for the double beam, I've just dodged them in succession once I got the timing
You just need to not dodge in the same direction for both beams, dodge one to the left and then dodge to the right, hell you don't need to dodge, you can now even walk it
@@Dinendal01 Yea it's clear that they don't even know about the latest patch reducing tracking frames, you can walk and reposition around so many monster attacks now.
Vals is a nice challenge to improve skills
I feel like Val was the hardest monster (of the 10-100 MR) . I never got deep into the fight but i found it enjoyable. I like using everything I had to even the playing field, it made it feel way stronger then everything else. I feel not every fight needs to be a counter heavy fight (like if you stand here you cannot get hit and have a big window to attack.) and having a fight be unfair and having to make very little work shows that you are not the most powerful thing in this world.
Again, I REALLY hate your opinion that Capcom should just bench all returning fights. Doesn’t make any sense to me. I think Phem said this in a video about Glavenus as well. Capcom should work on doing better with these hunts, not just shelve them for good. Makes no sense to me.
It’s fucking bizarre lmfao
I think he meant that if they continue to "butcher" returning monsters; than adding brand new monsters would be preferable
@@deinonychus1948 but that's not what they're doing.
Dude should just give up monster hunter together if that's the case cuz Capcom will always bring monsters back.
8:25 Didn't you say that GU Valstrax was only manageable due to that game's gimmicks like the evasive hunter arts and hunting styles? I don't really understand why that's fine, but Sunbreak Valstrax being designed to make you use the full array of tools the game offers is a bad thing.
As a traditional style CB user, I think his Sunbreak moveset is brilliantly designed. One of the few monsters that goes well with it.
The aerial double forward stab is a great UED opening.
The shockwaves after the grounded triple stab leave enough time for an AED.
Anything that ends with the ground stab with explosions is a prime chance for another AED to the head.
The huge laser, if you're close enough, is another chance at a UED. GP twice and then either Ready Stance or CPP. Should be close enough to land it.
If you're quick, you could get some Air Dash bursts on him when he's in the air, but that's more risky.
The only thing I don't like is they reduced the tracking and speed of the foreleg step into fanned wing slam from GU to Risebreak.
Nah I love the new val. Love his agression and his attacks that try force you into a spot where his next attack will land. He really tests all your mobility and defensive options. Hes got a bit of everything in grounded attacks, aerial, true combos, spins, beams, fast weak attacks, slow strong attacks, one of the best ultimate attacks from a spectacle perspective, etc....
I think IG is incredibly fun against him. Beating on his wings and mid air dodging his stabs or having an in air battle is fun. I also like using LBG with the side step dodge
Sunbreak in general just really wants all of the base Rise monsters with aura/enrage mechanics to quickly power up and stay powered up. I've noticed it mostly fighting Zinogre, Magnamalo, and Rajang. Rajang in particular is really annoying because of his arms turning solid: you'll hit his tail to knock him out of it, then 10 seconds later he's powered up again.
that's rajang in iceborne as well, however zinogre can enrage outside of aura in iceborne resulting in a better fight
just do less damage 4head
I notice it the most on Zinogre, it takes him soo much less to charge now and I really just want to avoid him. 😐
TFW as the SnS main SB Valstrax is one of the best match up in the game :sweating:
Rather than this being an issue with Valstrax specifically, I believe that this is a good example of something that I, personally, have thought about quite a lot since base Rise came out.
Essentially, this is what happens when you give the players too much power. I don't just necessarily mean the mobility and wirebug skills in Rise either, I mean other changes regarding how the game is made. Maps are open now, because of this the developers allow you to move while you consume items. However, because you can move while you consume items, now monsters have less of a reason to give you long openings during combat that, previously, would have been perfect opportunities to pop a potion or whatever. You can restock items infinitely at base camp, so now there's less incentive to care about using up all of your potions because all you have to do is hop on your dog and run back to restock, as a result monsters now have to be more relentless in their attacks and damage in order to even put up a fight. There are also more game specific examples such as the different mantles in World and obviously wirebug mobility in Rise.
It's stuff like this that ends up snowballing into these kinds of situations. The players now have far too much power at their disposal thanks primarily to gameplay changes and gimmicks that came with 5th gen, and as a result the developers have to create more and more insane challenges in order to compensate.
Now let me be clear, this isn't meant to be a comment from a "MH Boomer" talking about how the older games are better because they're more clunky or whatever (I've got at least 1000 hours in World on PS4 + PC and about 500 in Rise on PC alone). I also think that some of this issue will be mitigated once we get to MH6 because the core numbered series games tend to have less flashy, anime-esque combat and abilities, but that also didn't exactly stop Fatalis in Iceborne from being one of, if not _the_ , hardest fights in the entire non-frontier series.
Gameplay and design changes are inevitable for a game series, especially if it's been running for as long as Monster Hunter has. However, I don't think people realize what something relatively small that _seems_ like nothing but a positive thing, can end up doing for the game in the long run. I don't think MH should have remained as stagnant as Pokemon, stuck on a near 20 year old engine with little to no changes to the overall gameplay, but I _do_ think that the developers gave us too much of a good thing all at once, and now they're struggling to deal with the consequences of that choice.
idk man y'all trippin, this fight is really fun especially with duals or switch axe. I didn't even have to spam counter. Legit only took two hunts to get used to his sunbreak version
A perspective from someone who enjoys SB valstrax.
I really like that you cant just counter away until he dies, unlike most sunbreak monsters. And if you play lance, you can still just counter away until he dies, but it's actually kidda hard this time.
I also like that his chest charge is extremely predictable (After 1 or 2 moves after the fight starts, or right away if you manage to stop a charge). And considering that some weapon can chain the chest explosion topple 3-4 times in a row, it's a high reward with a trade off that he's almost permanently charged if you failed. Even then you get a very very juicy wingblades hitzone, and he still gives you a free chest charge sometime later in the fight where he just charges for a year with like 500 dmg threshold, which you can chain 1-2 more after it happened very easily for massive damage.
Tip for anyone struggling with valstrax, treat him like a fast iceborne fatalis. Keep very close to him, alot of his moves are easier to roll if you roll into his under belly, and if you're mindful of the explosion afterward, you also get a nice opening to hit the head as your reward. He only has a few moves that punish you for doing so, which you can just dip out or counter it instead.
I guess I just like gimmick fights or something.
Hes not a gimmick. Hes just complaining that SB Valstrax isnt perfectly identical to GU Valstrax.
@@mastercharizardx14 yeah ,kinda silly to think that a diffrent game with diffrent mechanics would keep the monster the same.
@@Paradox1012 right?
I never really had much of an issue with Valstrax when it came his tracking, even before Capcom nerfed the tracking recently.
Wow the crimson glow valstrax is different from regular valstrax!?!? That sucks man, how dare they make this variant different from the regular.
That's kind of a childish point considering normal isn't in this game. Like, it's fair enough to assume that the variant is just "the Valstrax" of this gen.
@@bladechild2449 then why make the variant in the first place? There would be no point in making a variant if it was identical to the original, regardless if the original isnt in the game.
@@mastercharizardx14 ^This.
@@bladechild2449 then they would have brought back the original valstrax.
@@magnabueno5360 they specifically added a Variant of Valstrax because of his ecology; outside of flying through airships and attacking intruders, Valstrax is docile and usually avoids conflict, adding him in as another hyper-aggressive killing machine would have made little sense ecology-wise
Crimson Glow Valstrax is to Valstrax what Savage Deviljho is to Deviljho, an individual driven insane with power and that's how they justify his extreme aggression
I really like most of these monster moveset analyses but this one just sounds like "they made him more difficult to keep up with player speed" to me honestly, I do agree the EHz stuff sucks but otherwise I generally find the new moveset a really fun challenge in a mostly too-easy game
Gu valstrax’s hitboxes were not that tight lol. Also, i feel like the mh community is running out of things to complain about with how good sunbreak is, so now we’re getting videos like this.
I mean most of their "gen 5 Monster" videos are like this. They cry about the monsters being worse to speedrun because you cant abuse their dumb gen 4 AI anymore (just watch their Glavenus video lmao).
Eh. I kinda just completely disagree with basically everything, I think it’s a good fight, I don’t have any moveset complaints. I think the only issue with CG is that normal Valstrax isn’t there to compare it to, so it feels like “he’s always enraged” which… would be perfectly fine if normal Valstrax was there to differentiate from. Honestly I don’t care anyway, I can just imagine the difference.
I mean that’s pretty much what all variants are. Furious Rajang, savage deviljho, seething bazelguese. They’re just always enraged and then have a second enraged state
@@Faint366 Except all the Monsters you named have fights more separated from their original counterpart then CG, CG is almost identical to master rank GenU Valstrax in every way possible
@@Depressosaur they are? I’ve noticed very little difference aside from one or two signature attacks. Seems just like CG, he has one or two unique attacks and his enraged state is just more mad than normal valstrax
@@Faint366 Savage Deviljho Seething Bazelgeuse and Furious Rajang were all massively different from their originals (Especially Savage), they have a lot of different unique moves that splice into their main mechanic/gimmick. CG as you said, only has two things different about it which is its laser cannon and dragon blasts leaving an area of effect. I hunted G-Rank Valstrax in mhgu quite a few times, and there isn't much different about it at all to represent a mad Valstrax.
@@Depressosaur umm what exactly is different about them? They’re similar enough that the console team doesn’t even include both versions in G rank. Savage just replaces deviljho, seething just replaces bazel. If Rise’s valstrax has the g rank normal valstrax move set, that’s already a big difference. You’re comparing high rank to g rank. Then there the different charging mechanic, different elemental weakness, laser beams. Seems like a page right out of savage deviljho, they even both get a laser beam attack as a variant move
Isn’t that already typically how it works? Lots of monsters with high rank variations (not just variants, some subspecies do this too) get some of those moves in their g rank form. Compare high rank to high rank, and g rank to g rank. They’re both out now
I don't really agree with any of this. Don't agree that GU valstrax was so amazing. Don't agree that Sunbreak val is so bad or even all that different than Rise valstrax. As for the tracking, I play on switch, but I feel like the answer is evade extender 3. I have EE1 on all my builds but for val I always go to 3. lets you easily dodge anything, as well as chase him down faster. Valstrax has always had attacks with annoyingly large hitboxes, so EE (or adept style in GU) has always been super helpful. I definitely think that valstrax's gunner hitzones in Rise/SB are cancer and that's probably the worst part of the fight. But in general, SB valstrax is fine. Not my favorite monster by any means but its not especially bad. I don't mind the powered up states though. Yeach you cant punish the wingstabs as well anymore but its not a big deal. I just hit it in the face with my hammer or switchaxe and it dies in about 10 minutes. When it tries to attack me I dodge out of the way. Never realized people had such a problem with this monster.
literally feel the exact same way.
And honestly you can mitigate a lot of his attacks by simply staying close to his head and dodge rolling attacks towards his head. You don’t even need evade extender. It’s one of the first fights that taught me how important positioning is.
I remember fighting G Rank GU Valstrax with Adept LS (my main in MHGU) and I could instantly tell that it was a more recent addition to the series, it didn't turn 45 degrees twice to face you, it didn't stay in the air for 30 minutes and it's moves were all well telegraphed... in Rise (and Sunbreak) I found him WAY harder than in MHGU; it's moveset was the same but there were several extra moves added on, it was a High Rank monster with a more advanced moveset than a G Rank monster
also fun fact; I didn't know that it's charged state nullified elemental damage until Sunbreak... which made hunting him with Element Phial CB a bit problematic lol
@@deinonychus1948 you just summed up my feelings so well.
Valstrax in this game is a Bow killer, this is the only fight in all of Rise/Sunbreak where I deliberately have to change my playstyle. Everything else I can just counter and shoot. This guy I need to play patiently against and wait for openings.
Yes Vals one-shot me if I play 🏹 hehehehe
Bow can annihilate Val, mostly because it has the most option to « uncharge » him, thanks to coatings. You can just topple him over and over
@@LyonOlivier69 You can annihilate Val... 😁
@@LyonOlivier69 hy, do you have a build I can destroys Val with a bow?
Cause Val Always difficulty when I use bow weapon
@@brolybacksideclan4879 Yea i even made a video about it specifically on my channel
Sunbreak valstrax is honestly the best he's been. His hitboxes are just as good as they were in gu, if not better because some of his more eh hitboxes are improved a good bit. And as a casual player, his charged states honestly just feel the same with the normal state but you have to keep in mind of the dragon explosions which I find quite enjoyable. As for the ele hitzones I just found it fine, the most annoying thing was just how the notes don't even tell you about it and thats a nitpick and a half. Beam is just the beam but having to keep moving before going back in the attack his head before backing off and getting ready for the next move. And even when solo, no wyvern ride, and using like one of the endemic life I still found him a blast to fight. And I'm gonna be honest. While I feel the whole skill issue statement is over used and not properly used. This whole video just screams skill issue
they didn't add the death sound from GU into Rise/SB, i still can't get over that to begin with.
Even greatsword has a hard time with the chest topples I find since there's too short of a time to actually be in the right position and have a strong attack lined up for it.
As a GS user, I agree. It's not like you can shortcut to TCS is 3 seconds.
I don't mind Val's new moveset in Sunbreak, but I do mind it CONSTANTLY trying to enter its enraged state. Even now, its a jaring disparity between its MR and HR versions.
In HR, if you got the chest topple, you could expect to fight it for a bit without it becoming enraged again. But in Sunbreak, not only is the window massively reduced, but it will want to go into this state constantly and will literally refuse to do anything else until it does. (I remember watching a 4 LS speedrun that was literally just nonstop chest topples. The Valstrax didn't even so much as consider any other option, it ONLY tried to enter its enraged state and repeated failed to do so until it died.)
Further adding fuel to this fire though is that every time you do successfully get the chest topple, the window becomes smaller and the damage threshold becomes higher. It will scale to the point where a full power TCS from GS will still not be enough to meet the damage threshold and anything else will not have enough burst damage to come even close. As a result, if you are playing solo, it is literally impossible to prevent Valstrax from becoming enraged.
And just as a cherry on top, the chest topple also denies you the satisfaction of getting it because every time you miss it, it gets longer with a smaller damage threshold to the point where a single hit from almost any weapon will cause the topple. So either you have to hit an ungodly amount of damage in an impossibly small window or wait for the devs to pity your soul enough to basically give you the topple for free. Overall, it just doesn't feel good in any way.
This video lost all credibility when they said the Rise version of his theme is worse 💀
there are literally 2 versions of his theme 💀 (not counting the special rock version or orchestras)
The follow-up laser is honestly the most obnoxious part of his kit. If they didn't make the tracking so aggressive on it (potentially so it actually becomes another opening), and made it so the lingering dragon explosions came out in a more predictable pattern (so you could reposition around them more), I think the fight would be fine. Not as good as it was, cause he'd still be charge happy, but at the very least his more obnoxious elements would have a bit more counterplay.
people saying new MonHun is too easy is the definition of "you think you do, but you don't"
Not sure if the aerial hit boxes are especially worse or it is just the usual jank?
I struggled fighting him as a range, but after switching to DB, everything was so much easier. Can dodge through pretty much all his attacks.
10:23 bro stop acting like everyone agrees with you, most people clearly don’t
Do CG Valstrax's ele zones change when he is enraged or charged up?
Yes, they drop to zero except for the arms
@@alexanderjames3538 I don’t know if it was clear or not but I was asking if the ele zones go to 0 when he enrages OR charges as those are two distinct states he can be in (and can be both at once)
@@mintyfreshgum8710 ohhh I gotcha. I don't know that answer, but I hope someone can answer it cuz I'm curious, as well
One major thing that make Sunbreak Val so annoying is like most Sunbreak monsters, it has bs tracking that you have to either counter it, or perfectly time your dodge 2-3 times in a row, combine that with it's speed, massive hitbox, and can potentially combo you to death if you get hit even once, you get a recipe for disaster.
And good luck hitting that chest when it's charging, especially if you're using short melee weps like sns
Apparently there was a recent bug fix, so now monster tracking is less BS
That's not an issue anymore, the tracking was toned down.
Me trying to hit the chest with Insect glaive but my weapon Hitzone says im hitting the legs
Never had that issue. Evade Window still OP
@@manuelgarciajr5308 Funny thing is, these tracking bs are the whole reason I must run at least evade extender 2 in all of my builds
The chest charge is shorter in SB but gotta make the monster harder somehow. I actually prefer the charged wings after the chest charge, the wings are softer and breaking them are almost impossible without it.
To be honest, I like the new Val fight. The only monster I have a problem with it's change state is Rajang for obvious reasons. Val takes more damage for more threat, rather than less damage. It makes sense for it being more threatening at Master rank.
I main hunting horn and the chest threshold is ridiculous, basically won't get it unless you luckily have a sonic bloom set up preemptively :/
Maybe it's because I play bow, but Crimson Glow Vastrax is one of the most enjoyable monster to hunt in Sunbreak. I fought him so much I must have gotten 25 of his G-rank sphere.
Spamming high elements on his legs while dancing around him scores me average sub 7 and that's enough for an enjoyable hunt for me. Playing a wex build is like shooting yourself in the foot. I don't reccomend it.
I wish more monsters works outside of "meta" to freshen up Monster Hunter.
I've been playing Monster Hunter for 18 years, killed my first Rathalos in 2004. And at this point, nothing feels more brain dead than having wex builds and playstyles.
idk never had an issue with Valstrax
As someone who has enjoyed both GU and Rise Valstrax, I feel he is a better fight in Rise/Sunbreak. After fighting him a while, I don’t have problems with the chest break or dodging the double beam. I don’t even have evade extender. The beam is telegraphed so blatantly.
Wow. I know the comment section is generally disagreeing with you guys, but I now see why. I need to timestamp some points of yours.
5:39 The caption highlights lack of AoE on the wing slams for GU Valstrax, but what it actually highlighted is that you seemed to miss the fact that the wing slam AoE added on Crimson Glow is in the front of the wing, not the sides, so you could dodge the wing slam in the exact same manner you showed in the GU sample for Crimson Glow.
5:53 So are you actually mad that in a game built partially around counters, that monsters will counter your counters? And remember that, by your own admission earlier in the video, GU Valstrax worked around the counters and evasions of Valor mode, Absolute Evasion/Readiness, but I guess since he didn't counter those tools the hunter had, he's better? But now that the fight keeps those tools in mind, it's terrible?
6:45 The moveset barely changed. The only new moves I counted are the wing stabs in the air (and the combos from that), and the laser coming downward.
6:51 Forces him to be airborne a significant amount of time? Am I not noticing something, or does Valstrax stay airborne purely for certain attack combos, then comes back down quickly like Rise Rathalos? I'm never not in striking distance of Valstrax for too long, so this point is either factually incorrect and a massive exaggeration, or I'm missing the experience of Valstrax in Sunbreak being like World Kushala where he's basically never on the ground.
7:15 Yeah, you mention this short vent check multiple times, when I'm fairly certain the shorter ones are literally unable to be popped. If you can find someone popping the short ones consistently, let me know. He does have the traditional long vent check like in GU if he does the chest vent while in Crimson Glow mode, so that would be your ticket to remove the mode from him. The fact Cera posited that Greatsword could *maybe* pop it implies that you have never actually seen it happen, which might be because it can't.
8:17 "Forced" to use all these things, but again, as you admitted with the GU Valstrax introduction, he's too fast for older games' movesets like Guild or Striker styles to deal with (at least without Evasion Arts), so wouldn't this be a problem for GU Valstrax too? Now I'm not saying it actually is for either, because I've beaten both of these monsters numerous times, in GU without using evasive arts or easy counters like with Adept or Valor, and in Sunbreak without spamming counters or using Marionette Spiders, or forcing Turf Wars, or any of the things you say are now "required".
8:20 "And if the monster needs the gimmicks of the game to prop it up and make it bearable". Again, you already said the same about GU Valstrax, so this is an admonishment of both monsters by your standard. Even though the statement is just false.
8:51 I'm surprised people have such a hard time with the laser slam down. I've literally only gotten hit by it twice on my first 2 fights with Sunbreak CGV, and ever since I've NEVER countered them, because I don't need to. This was before the tracking nerf patch too, so there is actually no excuse guys.
9:36 Your reward is the same as other big moves... a huge opening of a taunt he does every time.
10:25 According to who? You guys? I feel like I've made enough points to show that your assessment is not agreeable enough to be that widespread.
And this whole "it's a skill issue" thing. Yes, it's not constructive, but you guys mentioned so many factually incorrect things here, that I think someone could have some ground to say it, in fact, IS a skill issue thing. Now I personally won't, but... you're both still incorrect on many of these assessments.
it's a bit jarring to hear you list disliking having to use marionette spiders wyvern riding because it *checks notes* forces you to engage with all of monster hunter rise sunbreaks mechanics..
Y'all complimented GU valstrax for complimenting GUs gimmicks
Then complained that using Rise's gimmicks is important for fighting valstrax?
I honestly think Phemeto dislikes Rise on a fundamental level, to the point where even if they do the same things they did in older games like GU (heavy emphasis on evasions and counters), for some reason Rise/Sunbreak are at fault while GU is unassailable.
Forget the lasers, the midair double wing poke breaks my brain. The way it moves is really weird and doesn't register as an attack to me, I had to consciously break my immersion and train myself to react to it properly because it would always hit me. The first poke trips you and sets you up to get hit by the second one, which is death for a gunner. It's really annoying and he does it constantly
Run to the side to avoid the air wing stab.
Many monster moves have low startup to knock you down into a combo. Not sure why this is an exception that's so egregious. And I've never gotten comboed by the first stab into the second stab or the wing slam except the first couple of times when I was learning his Master Rank moveset.
Crimson Glow doesn't need to be a thing. It could've just been normal valstrax and we wouldn't have lost anything important.
Valstrax imo is THE best designed fights in all of classic MH. CGValstrax just doesn't do it justice in Rise when you can straight up fly away - or toward it after getting hit. There is no risk-reward in rise because there is no risk. You can outheal nearly everything with a single point in Recov Up
He seems pretty widely considered one of the best monsters in the game. His fight is one of the best examples of arise taking full advantage of the hunters increased mobility
This is very much a minority opinion yes
It sounds like they are saying that they don't like the rise valstrax because he doesn't give as many windows to attack or telegraph his attacks as often in addition to dragon explosions and beams being too hard hitting.
Well, I never played GU so I don't know what he's "supposed" to play like so I just fight him the way he is. It's a fun fight. Not as much fun as Lunagaron or gore/shagaru magala. But id MUCH RATHER fight valstrax over magmudron or aurora somncanth
Great sword main ( not a strong arm stance user) , Took me 30 to 35 mins to solo it , my first monster hunter game is rise , so i dk much abt it to compare but i can say he's waaay dangerous than he was in rise , way faster , smarter and much more deadlier .
This is just a bad take. I think this monster is fantastic
Tbh I do have issues with SB Val, but for slightly different reasons being a Shieldbro (Gunlance mainly, but been loving SB Lance too so have been rocking that). Outside of his ambush Val's attacks don't really phase me since I just block or parry them. But G/Master Rank Val takes longer to fight than he did in High Rank because he spends so much time in the air. Now as Lance I can time a Shield Bash and get some chip damage in from the wing stabs, but GL is kinda SOL until he lands outside of getting some free sharpness in from Guard's Edge. And he does it often enough alongside other moves that take him out of reasonable range or keep me at a distance (yeah I can tank the lazer sweep and just take some chip damage, but the knockback even with max Guard is enough that I'm kept at a distance, setting him up for more ranged moves). So I don't actually get to engage with Val that much, especially as a GL. With Lance I could probably yeet towards him with the Wirebug sheathing skill if I time it right and am clever with my angle, but GL doesn't really have that option as Bullet Barrage only has super armor while you're cooling the Wyvern Fire and not while you hurl towards the monster, and Blast Dash has no s. Maybe Reverse Dash could, but I pretty much refuse to give up Guard's Edge so...that's on me.
Either way, I spend more time waiting for him to come down in range for an opening to start smacking than I do actually smacking or trading blows with him. At least with critters like Rathalos they hover close enough that I can get some good upward pokes/shells in if I position right, but Val? Nah, autoposition just out of reach specifically to hit with the wing blades and high enough that only IG and Gunners can feasibly hit him even if you maneuver close.
And yeah, the Chest opening is kinda...weird. The more he does it before a pop the longer it lasts, only resetting if you get the burst. The first one is dummy short and the wind pressure doesn't let it be as big of an opening unless you can negate it (at least Defiance is a thing now). I'm kinda used to it as it provides SOME kind of consistent opening for me to smack him if I'm playing GL (my Lance set is pretty good at racking up KOs, so I get a few of those in which helps shorten the fight, but at most I could get maybe 3 a hunt, and that's if I go nuts with the shield bash), but I definitely agree that the first one is too short for any weapon to reasonably take advantage of (well, aside from GS like you said). I wouldn't mind leg topples for him as I could use those alongside the KOs I net with Lance to lock him down, or if I'm using GL give me a good target to shell for some openings.
So overall as a Shieldbro, yeah Sunbreak Valstrax is more annoying to fight than fun, which sucks because he was hella fun in base Rise as GL since I could Guard's Edge various attacks and had more openings to blast dash at him to keep engagement time up. SB Val takes that away and thus makes the fight feel more like a slog. Shame.
can't you blast dash at him and shell him in the air?
Agreed, Lance main here and I really don't find his fight very fun. He flies super far away, has an unreasonably small hitbox for his main weakpoint, and overall his moves just don't seem to gel all that well with Lance gameplay. The beam and dive are also just really unsatisfying to deal with, it's either sheathing retreat or superman for both, which sucks for a weapon that's supposed to be the "bastion of defense".
@@prawn1717 Yeah. Dive is nope city, even with Guard 5 and Guard Up (though now that Embolden is a thing and stacks...?), but the Beam is 50/50. I can block it, but there's still knockback and the chip damage adds up, so I feel ya on that one. Maybe with Embolden stacking I can nope it with the right skill combo now so that the Beam isn't an issue.
In my PC playthrough, my first faint was to MR Narwa and my 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th etc were to MR Valstrax. I got pretty frustrated and dedicated several play sessions to improving against him. I tried all fourteen weapons several times over and carted occasionally with most of them. Eventually I landed on SnS as the most cohesive with his Tempo.
I practiced a lot and he's now my third favourite fight in MR (behind Lucy and Malzeno)... One caveat though. I have to be using SnS. His moveset, enraged or not, is almost completely punishable with metsu or back hops. The only move I'm yet to consistently abuse is his downward dragon explosion. Even his double laser can be punished by a slightly off-center metsu followed by plunging thrust into back-hop. I've also started practicing SA and GS against him with some success.
Your points are very valid though. For most weapons I've tried, his lethality and persistence get overwhelming fast and not having a convenient topple is rough. In terms of mechanics, they might've been altered to a point that they detract from the fight rather than enhance it and the elemental nullification certainly is pretty limiting. Despite that, Valstrax can be a great fight with SnS. I've found a way to make him fun but I can see why he's a grating experience for most.
Evade extender + evade window made the battle fun, and I really like it for it. Making a monster that requires a build thats not only based around “big number” made the battle super enjoyable, and the sacrifice to damage was barely noticeable.
May primary set is narga switch axe with evade ext 1 and window 5, very fun fight with such
When Speedrunners are complaining then the Monsters are designed in a good way :D
Glad someone else is saying this because I hate new Valstrax. It doesn't help that after fighting him you fight Scorned and after fighting him you go "That was it?"
Yeah kinda sad when Valstrax had to have bullshit levels of difficulty to be "Challenging". More importantly, I don't get why people think this but: Monster Hunter was never about bullshit monster difficulty, it was about almost a methodical dance and once you mastered it you could bully monsters into the ground.
Instead, now we have monsters that tracking that was so unfun, they had to mega nerf it recently. I'm starting to believe that the game testers in Nintendo in total are just ass at their job as this issue is happening across the board in any Nintendo game that is suppose to be "challenging".
Look at Splatoon 3, most the maps have no alleys to hide in and thus snipers absolutely dominate the game. Some weapons: Splatana Wiper, Undercover Brella, etc. have not gotten the buffs they needed before the game launch.
Who does their playtesting at Nintendo and why do they suck so bad?
I didn't have any issue evading the laser. And in the air insect glaive is fine as long as you know how to dodge and counter.
My only complaint is that he is not fast enough. Scorned magnamalo or malzeno somehow feel faster than the super sonic dragon.
Fast enough? He is TOO FAST 🤣 i beat mal and mag first try solo. Took me 7 times to beat Val and i had to cheese him
@@JiggyNegus
He's definitely slower. In G rank version he hover in the air A LOT. Gives you enough time to react to his attack.
P.S. I play bow and lance.
@@chianliu8352 To be fair most monster are supposed to be fast are much slower than any gen before. Like rise/sunbreak rajang much slower than gu rajang but tracking wise it is nuts
Not really, it’s just a bit too hard too break his chest when he charges up
not to mention
Strax got a new toy in his dual aerial stab
all nice and dandy.
Yeah no
like a 5 year old toddler he will show it around to everyone all the time shoving it into your face almost 24/7 and its annoying since it for once doesnt knock you back which leaves you wide open for getting combod if you dont know of this interaction
The stab is not too much damage to begin with, and since it only knocks down, it makes the second stab, or his wing slam followup easy to dodge. Not to mention, both followups make him taunt for a little bit. Not sure why his new move is hard to deal with. The only real difficulty is the lack of startup for the first stab, but old Monster Hunter fans love moves with low or no startup. And if you're not an older fan, the first stab isn't much damage.
Yeah this one is a weird video. Valstrax is probably the best its ever been and its moves are great, easy to read and it has great openings.
yep, his fight feels like a dance, it's great.
Man, if you guys are crying this hard already I can't wait to see what happens when they throw Risen Crimson Glow Valstrax at you. 😂
Which is good, tbh, I can always use a bit more salt.
Idk I really enjoyed this fight! I think it is a good challenge and really tests your skills on the weapon you play. I soloed with dual blades and it was fun to be honest. I want to see Risen Valstrax, that would be a lot of fun.
I think there is a little bit of exaggeration in here
Valstrax is downright easy with the insect glaive in sunbreak
I actually disagree. Now to state my reasons:
Man he’s really cool
I watched this whole vid waiting for a point that made sense... it didn't happen the rise version was one of my favorite all time monster hunter fights. Val is so fast and unbelievably punishing and I loved grinding out its armor and weapon. Val was one of the most entertaining grinds.
I dont remember ever breaking master rank valstrax arms and i always thought it just felt odd when in GU atleast one of his arm would usually break
"If the monster needs the gimmick of the game to make it bearable, is it really a good fight?"
You just touted Val for catering to the mechanics of GU???
Some points are valid but the difficulty of this game has to be brought in in other ways, wirebug management, set builds, using different switch skills. This installment gives so much power to the hunter, to without the mechanics I get how this fight would be annoying, but there's so much customization to the experience that I think you aren't addressing to make this fight more enjoyable. And before you say, "why should the player have to make a boss fight enjoyable," that's just how the adjustment period is. It's the core way of prepping in this game. Certain skills make this fight much more bearable and the moveset KEEPS you tense yeah, but this is the only fight that has that kind of feel?
You gripe about tracking but Malzeno has WAY MORE AGGRESSIVE TRACKING with his wing slams. Malzeno is way more smothering on the player solo than Valstrax.
I know you said not to say it but this honestly really does feel like a skill issue.
kinda seems like you guys are, in fact, the only ones that dislike Sunbreak's Valstrax
I’m not even a fan of rise in general but this really just seems like “I can’t dodge the move so it’s bad.” Like, you really need them to lower the leg topple values because you can’t fight him unless you have an easy way to pin him to the ground over and over? You think the chest burst is a necessity because he’s impossible to fight in his enraged state? Come on.
He hates the new monster hunters
Trust me I know EXACTLY how you guys feel! Coming from someone who solo’s this guy enough to make his armor and 12 weapons, it just feels like a slog when you can’t personally engage with the monster fight and have all damage opportunities made unnecessarily difficult due to constant aoes flying and after affects. I’d say he’s the more annoying monsters than outright difficult like Scorned. Cuz with scorned you can learn the fight and get better plus the hitzones are better . Valstrax is spamming aoes and tracking moves and im just like “sit still”
I... Don't get most of these criticisms? The residual dragon energy on the wing slams gives you more than enough time to get out of there unless you use a non-stationary counter with a long ass recovery time, and Valstrax stands still after that for a good hit anyway. It's doesn't spend THAT long in the air, and he ALWAYS comes down at most after the second attack, giving you time to position under the head for a hit. The double laser can be rendered not only useless, but a BIG opening if you just walk towards Valstrax after the first laser is fired.
Most of what I'm hearing is that you don't like how Valstrax makes you work instead of spamming counters on all he does. He doesn't work well with elemental weapons? Use a raw option, there IS one for every weapon. His attack with about 6 seconds of buildup can't be countered? It has *six seconds of buildup* , sheathe your weapon and dive. Some weapons like the Hammer can pop it first time if they don't spam other shit around beforehand, it's really predictable since it always happens near the start of the fight.
Nah, hes fine. The flying moves last for like, 2 seconds , I dont know what the problem is.
as someone who fought both versions i saw no issue seemd like the same fight to me only with some more attacks
His wingarm still take elements damage when charge.
also with the tracking nerf, when facing the double wing stab, u can literally walk to avoid the 1 st stab then u dodge or counter the 2nd stab,
With evade extender u can dodge his leser attack twice easily even before tracking nerf
If you want to fight Valstrax and manage to evade all his move bow with dodge bolt will solve problem -.-
I hate the high rank Emergency Climson glow fight; still the hardest fight for me due to extreme annoyance.
Have you meet the MR Valstrax? Hooo boy. They amped it up to 12 like phem/cera said in video.
Lmao, the MR version just trashed me around.
That one is horrible because he's too big for his attacks to work properly. Some of them go over my head or behind me.
As a non speed runner, and switch axe enjoyer, I thought this fight was hella fun.
mh speedrunner have good opinion challenge (impossible)
Valstrax is my favorite monster, he’s better in GU yes, but I still enjoyed him in Rise/SB
Finally, someone who likes GU Val, and doesnt bash SB Val.
Valtrax made me go from having 0 ballistics to 3 ballistics on LBG in HR. I still have trauma from those days.
Never use ballistics 3, go for ballistics 2 and sniper 3 to get ballistics 3 for free and being able to abuse the temper bonus
@@MrCharly780 Too bad steadiness 3 didn't exist in HR back then :p
I think the underlying issue is that valstrax has a very specific unique toppled which we player should be able to take advantage of and that is now become more like a bait almost...
much like when you spend the entire fight trying to cut a tail you know can be cut but has an impossible threshold... just become frustrating (although people are obviously free to enjoy the challenge, it's not well designed) that's all... I don't understand why bringing up the "git gud" argument if you have seen anything on this channel
I'm like 95% sure that first "chest charge" is supposed to be near-impossible to pop. It's not a design oversight or anything, but a way to convey the power and challenge of the monster. Of course, you can take issue with this approach, anyway, but I'm pretty sure it's deliberate.
Anyway, I like the fight. He's hard, he isn't fair, and he pisses me off, and it makes it more satisfying to beat him.
He's literal bs when you're close to him, even if you dodge early with a close gap attack or the laser cannon, with the laser cannon he'll track on you despite perfectly dodging thus you're forced to put away your weapon then superman dive (when you're very close to him) that's IF you can if not then you're pretty much fucked but if you're far away you can definitely dodge roll it while sprinting a hard left or right, this isn't from a casual player by the way, I sweat and play hard doing quick runs with my try hard bois (the no lifes who 100% and HR/MR 999 in every game, no ego intended just showing it isn't from someone who haves terrible reflexes), this Valstrax is pure cancer in this game. GU was tolerable because of the styles which I loved Adept. Also can we talk about his ridiculous range with his spin the win attack in this game?
Off topic but I really miss how big positioning was. It felt great in past games to just, well for lack of a better term, "play by ear" a monster. I won't lie; when you farmed a monster like 20 times you get the gist of the fight. It starts to feel scripted as you get efficient at it. I was just glad at times I could break the pace by trying something different. In Sunbreak I feel like all my tools are specifically for this type of move and this type of move ONLY. I'm sad that Sunbreak doesn't have that jazz-like feel I got from other MHs.
I'm not sure what you're talking about honestly. I have to think about positioning plenty of times in Sunbreak, usually while a move is happening or beforehand while thinking about what the options are for the monster at a certain range/combo or something. I have yet to find a move in this game that both involves only one way to deal with it, and it being a commonly used move.
@@norsehorse84 I dunno how to properly put it either. It's like the tracking on monsters are fucking with me and positioning. Before i can kinda trust a Monster's attack would have a certain range and stop. Not it feels uncertain if they hit me or if they just stop sometimes.
All i hear is complaining, as an hh main who doesnt even have a counter at all hes one of the best fights in the game. I just compansate for his harder attacks with evade extender 2 which now has a lv4 deco.
To be fair, in his amped state the wings are really squishy, so if you have good positioning you can punish his wing slams, or you can hit the lower parts when he's front facing them. Depends on the weapon a little but there's a lot of options in SB. Don't like his new hovering wings pokes though, that shits harder to dodge than his residual dragon pools.
It's easier it to dodge if you run to the side. That's what I've always done.
Tbh i think i would be much happier with MR valstrax if the charge up was 2-4 seconds longer(or a longer tell befpre charge up begins to allow for a bit more time to reposition), or the threshold was ~15-20% lower
14:22 Uh yeah, it's a Variant; it wouldn't be much of a Variant if it wasn't different
I just assumed they removed the chest pop in MR. Never got it to pop.
But then, I didn't really enjoy the fight so I fought Val a handful of times to get the gear and I haven't thought about it since.
I doubt we'll see a Risen Valstrax but if they do make that happen it could be an opportunity to fix the jank.
It can be pop, but you need something like 3k dmg in 5s, so yeah, not really doable with single player.
I actually expect Risen CG Valstrax down the line lol.
@@peacepham7838 You don't need to do it in 5 seconds, you just have to reach the threshold while it's charging. Any damage done before it starts the charge still counts, so if you are hitting the chest before it starts it's much easier. I've popped it with a single sticky ammo before.
Valstrax was my favorite fight in base rise and I've only fought him like twice in SB
I've fought him 11 times and still no mantle 😭
@@Rathadude you can always buy the mantle
@@MrCharly780 I know Goji I've been saving coins but I still have a ways to go. Still trying to farm other gear.
I'm not a fan of the blueish tint he has now. The silver and black just looked so cool and the ruggedness of the old Gen graphics really sells its jet plane appearance.
I never noticed he was different color wise until now.
Pretty sure the “blue” you’re seeing is just rise’s improved lighting. Everything looks blue at night in rise. During the day, there’s still a tinge of blue due to the sky’s atmospheric light
Excuse me it's 2022
Jaded by nostalgia. They need to realize that it's a different game. Capcom kinda has change some things to keep it interesting.
Na ah I'm offended. 🤣
This is the weirdest analysis of any monster I think I've ever seen.
It is weirdly impossible to burst his chest vent though yeah.
I do like how you presented your points here, very clear. I do wish it was made clear that these critisms are from the perspective of a speedrunner. It very obvious the critisms and annoyances you two have with Valstrax are from a speed runners perspective. At least that's how I interpret these crisitsms. From a casual playstyle all these cristisms aside from the game being designed around counters don't really matter. Not everyone is trying to lock a monster down, keep good elemental hit zones active, and prevent an enraged state. Only a speedrunner would find these things annoying enough to make a video lol. I don't say this with malice because from a speedrunning perspective I totally get it as a speedrunner myself, I just still enjoy a casual experince
Yeah, was watching it and I think it is a fair point you brought up. A lot of the points felt too specific on topples & his enraged/amped up state changes. Even with him charging up, he takes longer to do it when his cycle completes so the next time he does it it’ll take longer giving more time to attempt a chest backfire; not gonna do it on the first try everytime! And Val’s wings become soft when amped up, so it’s more of a trade-off, so weapons are way less likely to bounce off, least from my experience. Even a lot of Valstrax’s attacks from my experience he stands still (I.E. his aerial attacks once he lands) or is simple enough to dodge (the wing stab is more tricky & may require a bit of training, but it could be done without Evade Extender, but the wing jabs, even with the Dragonmines, are pretty damn easy to dodge without Evade Extender; again, may require some practice to see when and what direction to dodge.) I’ve seen plenty of openings from a bunch of Val’s attacks that allowed me a few hits in; & yeah, slower weapons won’t be able to utilize it all the time, that’s a given for MANY monsters, not exclusive to Valstrax at all. I still understand Speedrun struggles with this, but it’s hard to take stuff like this seriously & accept it as if it was facts.
I completely disagree TBH. I don't understand the problem. All I experience is fun.
Saw the video title & was like *"What???? Really??????"*
I thought this video was a joke initially. Then I watched it.