This is the reason that Jamie Lannister was so interested in seeing Ned Stark fight. He had allegedly beaten the best swordsman in the world & one of Jamie's heroes. The Kingslayer couldn't claim to be the best until he had crossed blades with Ned.
@@EerieChroniclesTV there were many strong contenders. Ned stark would never be able to beat sir Arthur dayne. If another man didn't stabbed him from behind. At that time also the hound, sthe mountain, sir barrister salmy all were contender for the best swordsman.
And just a little reminder, the stunt double for Arthur Dayne was the guy who portrayed the Night King. Just imagine what he could've done had they given him an actual fight scene.
maybe there was a scene in which jon finally fights night king But those dumb and dumber dudes scrapped it Imagine a scene in which night king reaches close to bran and jon is last line of defence Everything is falling apart, winterfell is in ruins, almost all jon's allies are dead and he barely wins against night king but tht too after losing part of his humanity bcz night king managed to stab jon before getting stabbed in the heart
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that this swordfighting taking place was done by the actor who played Dayne, himself, as he is also an accomplished Swordsman.
After watching anime attack on titan , no spoilers, they delivered on the ending it still had some that didn't like it but they landed the story. They foreshadowed the night king for seasons and didn't deliver. It was the darkest night in that fight scene but it was hard to see. Could have worked a way of illuminating it better and the night king fights weren't there when they could have been. Still a great show up to season 5 were sersie blew them all up.
Whatever people may have against The Mad King, he had some of the absolute best Kingsguard ever. Ser Gerold Hightower, Ser Arthur Dayne, Ser Barristan Selmy, Ser Jaime Lannister, Prince Lewin Martell. Absolute beasts!
@@tacoblude8208 I have actually read the books, I meant that this combo of 7 Kingsguard were probably the best and most popular among any Kingsguard any King ever got. Another King that had even come close to such a level was probably Jaeherys!
@@patrickbird7625 Prince Lewyn Martell was slain by Ser Lyn Corbray at the Trident! He was badly wounded before the fight, probably why Ser Lyn was able to kill him!
A nice detail is you can see Ned's conflict after Dayne is stabbed, he CLEARLY doesn't like that the fight was won in a dishonorable manner and all he can do is give Dayne a swift end. He even returned Dayne's sword to his family after.
I think this is the wrong read (lol) about Ned Stark here. Later Ned Stark clearly stated to Jamie that he doesn't fight in tourneys so when he fights for real, he doesn't want a man to know what he can do. In that sense, Ned knows that a real fight, where both fighters intend on killing each other isn't about honorable tactics but a must win. Maybe it was a transformation on what he thought was honorable since that fight and the following war/rebellion. Even Brandon's reaction "he stabbed him in the back" is kind of eye-roll. In the same time you find out what really happened, you also find out that your honorable father lied about it, and soon after we know the even bigger lie (or secret?) he was keeping. I feel like the details around Ned Stark's honor is something that can be (maybe is, I've only read the first book) explored considerably more deep even though he's dead.
@@EbonySeraphim Ned never lied about it, though. He's never given a full accounting of it. All we ever really hear him say is that he "he would have died if not for Howland Reed". He certainly doesn't go around boasting that he slew Arthur Dayne in single combat. Ned behaves for the most part with impeccable honor, and the handful of times we do see him lie, it's for good reason and to preserve more lives and make peace (e.g. when he agrees to plead guilty to treason and take the black, or when he lies about Jon Snow's parentage in order to save the child's life, assuming that is how it will play out in the novels). More interesting to examine is someone like Selmy, who is also renowned for his honor, but served the Mad King and even Joffrey for a time.
Yeah it's an incredibly unrealistic-Hollywood esque-fight, no explainable reason why they had him like this and paid zero focus to his MAGICAL fucking sword that was forged from a damn fallen star ffs
I feel the implication of Dayne’s line is underrated, he’s saying “I wish you good fortune in the wars to come” because he knows that the birth of Jon is going to lead to a lot of problems for everyone in the future
@@supermanjp83I think he knew it was unlikely. Yes, it’s the best of the best against really…nobody of note when it comes to skill but at the same time still out numbered by a lot. So, really the answer is who knows and it’s whatever you believe his intentions were because there is no definitive
@@supermanjp83I think he was just being polite. If Ned dies, he doesnt have to worry about the future anymore, so it doesnt matter what he says. If he lives, he will need that good fortune endeed. Arthur seems like a polite enough guy, he recognizes he could die there, so any good will that he wants to communicate, he says before the battle.
I love how many parallels there were between Ned and Dayne's death. Both were injured by a foe from behind, both were performing their duties to the king, both were killed by the neck and were both honorable swordsmen who only lost because of circumstances beyond their skills
sorry but this is not a great comparison and almost seems like you're forcing an answer to an essay prompt. one "from behind" is figurative, the other is not. one was stabbed in the neck during combat, the other had his head chopped off in front of a crowd. dayne most certainly could have prevented being killed either by finishing howland reed while he was down or just killing ned sooner, and so could Ned because everyone character knows he was being an idiot, and you could say the same for any character in GOT who died
@anonymus3703 he means that ned stark was speared in the knee from behind during his fight with Jaime lannister. And the final blow was to the neck from his own sword
Roberts Rebellion is too damn good of a story, just the premise that Robert went against targayreans falsely thinking that Lyana loved him and even beat Rheagar targayrean in a duel,it’s just mind blowing. Shows how even a rebellion built on hoax where either party is not in the wrong is designed so well.
The rebellion was not a hoax and the Targaryens were in the wrong from the start. The Lyana/Rheagar question isn't even that relevant when you think about it, because what really started the war was the execution of Ned's father and brother and the order given to Jon Arryn to turn in both Robert and Ned. Rheagar was incompetent and irresponsible to say the least, he fled with Lyana without thinking about the repercussions of what he was doing, knowing that both Rickard and Robert for sure would question the crown about what happened to Lyana and knowing that his father was already a unstable men who burned people alive for fun, he ignored all that, didn't take any precautions and got himself and his family killed because of it.
What started the war was the torture and execution of Rickard and Brandon Stark, Ned's father and older brother, followed by the Mad King demanding Jon Arryn put to death Ned and Robert and bring their heads to King's Landing. That's was what started the war, and it was definitely no "hoax".
@@robervalhaha You are 100% correct. Rhaegar was definitely very irresponsible, and very reckless. And it started way before he ran off with Lyanna Stark. It started at the tourney at Harrenhal when he managed to very publicly disrespect his own wife and 3 great houses - Starks, Martells, and Baratheons - all in one fell swoop when he won the tourney and then crowned Lyanna the Queen Of Love & Beauty instead of his own wife, in front of THOUSANDS of people, and both every great and lesser Lord in Westeros lol. Talk about reckless smh lol. Rhaegar was just like, "Fuck it, I'm goin for it!"
I don’t know how it would’ve ever happened, but watching Ser Arthur Dayne fight Syrio Forel (both in their prime) would’ve been the fight of the century. Even a sparring match between the two would’ve been better than any other fights in the show.
@@heathermillsphantomlimb9314 Would have loved to have seen Jaime in his prime, Ser Barristan in a flash back, yes Syrio of course and more of Arthur Dayne in more flashbacks
@@Honmatres Everyone forgets about Young Robert Baratheon ! The man was a beast ! Prince Rhegar was a lethal fighter in his own right & RB caved his chest in .
If Arthur had won imagine the different story we would’ve gotten. An outlaw Kingsguard from the lost regime raising Aegon (Jon) as the secret prince who was promised and chosen one, preparing him to take the throne and fulfill his destiny and making him the next greatest swordsman
If you think about it, Ser Arthur and Ser Gerold fought against Ned Stark and his bannermen to protect Jon (Aegon), fearing that Robert/Ned would kill the infant if they ever came to know. But eventually, Ned ended up doing the same by saving Jon by himself. Ser Arthur fought for honour and died a dishonourable death for nothing. :(
They kind of gave us a red herring (so many)as Reed was still alive and he was the only living person who knew Jon's true identity....and we never met his older version.
There are men who fought honorably. They lie in the ground. The only way to fight is to win by any means necessary. Winning is the only true form of honor in war.
“He stabbed him in the back.” It’s Arthur Dayne. Stabbing him in the front is basically impossible. When your opponent is that damn good, you’ve got to fight without honor.
To be fair, the man who did it was a Reed, and they mostly stick in the Neck between the North and everything else. The only fixed emplacement they have and the only formal defenders they have are at Moat Cailin; the rest of them melt into the marsh and use guerilla tactics, so sneak attacks are basically what they're known for.
No doubt a sword expert will be able to pick holes in the fighting - these are actors that have probably trained for just a few months after all, not lifelong masters - but it's a great scene and I think the actor playing Dayne absolutely nails it. It's not simply the charisma and growly voice, but an interesting ambiguity in his performance: he's clearly a badass but there's something else here. Despite his fearsome skill, he does not advance to battle with enthusiasm or arrogance (compare with Jamie or Gregor), but in stoic adherence to his duty and the acceptance that his own blood may be spilled today.
Even the basics of sword fighting are glaring here. The best swordsman in this world uses two? Lol. He lost that fight based purely on what his enemies had. But they had to make it flashy.
@@elimgarak1127 Dude when he is fighting 1v4 with the both swords, accurate or not that is simply one of the most BADASS scenes in the entire show If they wanted to make Arthur Dayne impressive, they succeeded massively in this clip
@@dekuuchiha9990 Really? Sh*t I was a f*cking huge fan of the show back in the day and I didn’t know that somehow. Good for him, wish we’d seen him more in either role tbh
@@dekuuchiha9990@Maclain I think Dekuuchiha meant the actor playing Dayne and the actor playing the Night King were both highly trained, not that they were the same person 😉. The Night King was portrayed by Richard Brake in seasons 4 and 5, and Vladimir Furdik from season 6 onwards. Ser Arthur Dayne was played by Luke Roberts.
One thing you must realize is that Arthur Dayne is almost super strong. The way he kept swinging two full sized swords at a faster rate than the Stark men who tired from using one, while wearing more armor than they all were
@@tire26 In the books, it wasn't even two swords. Dawn was a giant greatsword. And it wasn't Valyrian steel, it was made from a meteorite. Either way, that sword and Arthur Dayne have become two of my favorite things in the series. The man was an absolute beast.
@@tire26 valerian steel is not made in China, it’s expensive and rare af, Lannister don’t even have one, Arthur has it own sword but it wasn’t valerian.
@@tire26no. His house’s sword, Dawn, according to books, was a massive two handed sword made from the metal of a fallen star. It’s not Valyrian steel, but it’s lasted 10,000 years and is pretty damn close to it. His other sword here is probably regular steel, though in the books I don’t think he used a second sword
I don't know if you watched the show but that's not a very Stark thing to do. If you're a Lannister then sure fuck it, kill em all. Ultimately Dayne was protecting Ned's nephew and the heir to the kingdoms so in retrospect he's obviously going to feel guilt. A self righteous person who realizes he was in the wrong and committed a crime against someone on the same side.
@@rayzala1393 Except a Stark didn't do it. Ned was almost as surprised as Dayne was. Once it was done, what was Ned supposed to do? Berate his friend for saving his life? He Mercy-Killed Dayne, and moved on with his life. Any embellished stories probably came from the backstabber and not Ned himself. And Ned wouldn't want to destroy the reputation of the friend who saved him by branding him a backstabber so he probably didn't protest too hard.
It's very conflicting as eastern traditions teach you "means to an end don't matter, only the end matters" And in the west youre taught that your "means to an end" will "mean to end you" if you're not careful. Game of thrones is a beautiful intersection of those two paradigms and how the gods honor it
@@TheCrimsonRevenger backstabbing in this sequence would not have brought shame upon someone This was for all intents and purposes, a battlefield, and there's absolutely no rules on the battlefield. Sure there's rules of engagement, but "no backstabbing" is not one of those rules, RoE more entail how you're supposed to handle prisoners and to do stuff like have a meeting of generals before a battle. This move would have brought zero shame, as it's not a duel. In fact, daggers are the reason why most people die on a battlefield, or at least the dagger was one of the deadliest weapons. It stabs and its small, and therefore is one of the only weapons maneuverable enough to get around a full plate of armor This was pretty common back in the day- I feel the only reason why bran is even disgusted is because he finally realized that "history is written by its victors" more than he's upset with the move itself
I'm not sure. The story is pretty limited in scope. I think Robert's Rebellion would make a perfect movie (possibly a mini series?), but there just isn't enough material for a full show. There are only a small handful of major plot points whereas in the Targaryan war in HOTD, there are a massive number as the story spans decades
Always bothered me in this scene that they don’t acknowledge that Ned was never boastful about killing Dayne. He said specifically Dayne would have killed him “if not for Howland Reed” Ned always gave credit to Reed for saving his life. There is no dishonor in how Dayne died. It was war and a fight to the death. The “he stabbed him the back” line is spoken like someone that has never been in a battle or a fight for their life. Bad dialogue in an otherwise pretty good scene.
@@fightingmedialounge519 No, the scene frames it as Ned used to brag to Bran about how he defeated Dayne. That is not how the books frame it; Ned specifically told Bran he would be dead if not for Reed. These are in the POV chapters of Bran; so you are hearing his internal thoughts about it. It is very clear Bran had no delusions about what took place. The show's version of it has it totally opposite of how Bran thinks about it in the books. And it hurts the character of Ned in the process. Ned was not boastful, need wanted to honor Dayne and the fact that Reed saved his life. Ned's biggest fault was he was honorable to a fault; which made him make really bad decisions.
@@patrickthomas2119 not really. The framing of scene suggests that bran heard the story several times(hence, you know, him saying it). That by itself could and very likely means he was simply told about it by other people. Except that line by itself doesn't specifically indicate Howland stabbed Dayne in the back; which is what he was surprised about. Even in the show itself bran mentions how he heard Howland saved ned back in season four, so that's not what he's shocked about here. It's only the "opposite" of how the books depicts it if you deliberately ignore what's said in the show simply isn't word for word what's written in the books. He wasn't boastful in the show either. Also Ned's flaw wasn't honor but instead him being merciful at the wrong moments. Keep in mind he lied about jon being his , in the show and likely on the book, and changed robberts will so he's perfectly willing deceitful when it suits him.
@@fightingmedialounge519 "he's better than my father" "much better" "but my father beat him" "did he?" "I know he did, I heard the story a thousand times" Come on, you are giving this dialogue and this scene's framing of what was described in the book the most forgiving interpretation possible. and your point about season 4, I agree; season 4 framed it more accurately; season 7 did not. Which is a sign of the decreased quality in the last couple of seasons.
It's one of those moments where I was rooting for both characters. Both Ned and Arthur. Especially Arthur considering he's not arrogant or evil natured or anything. He was honorable and respectful and definitely a skilled and cunning warrior. He never insulted Ned or disrespected him in any shape or form he was just a knight honoring his oath and obeying his orders without question. And Ned because this is when we get to witness his skill in swordsmanship when he was in his prime. Of course Ned isn't as skilled as Arthur but he was able to hold his ground until Arthur disarmed him. But then he got stabbed from behind and Ned being an honorable natured man really did not want it to end like that as you saw it in his face afterwards. Plus I absolutely love the actor that plays as Lord Stark in his younger years.
@@fridericusrex6289 I never said they weren't. My point was that "obeying" is not an intrinsically honorable thing. It depends on what is being obeyed.
My only critique about this fight is that I wish they made the sword dawn just a little whiter and a little more distinctive For the book fans otherwise perfection
If I'm not mistaken, Dawn was a two handed great sword in the novels, so it's gone pretty far off the mark already. But I may have misinterpreted Martin's description.
@@SequentiallyCompact You are correct. And I don't really understand why they had him dual wield here instead of using Dawn. It would've made the fight a lot less Hollywoodesque to have him cleave right through a puny steel longsword with his huge but light meteorite blade. We know canonically Dawn HAS to have been at this fight because Ned brings it to House Dayne personally afterwards.
Well yeah. There’s a saying that people who “reverse grip”/“ice pick” grip weapons are either complete amateurs or ferocious experts in their craft. Given the reputation Dayne had, they probably both knew that he wasn’t gonna go easy.
In the show we don’t get to see too much fighting from Ned but in his prime he was absolutely awesome. "You’re too modest. I’ve seen you cut down a dozen of great knights." Ser Barristan Selmy
The sword shoved into the ground was Dayne’s sword Dawn, not the sword we saw being sharpened. Like Valyrian Steel, Dawn never needs to be sharpened, because it never dulls.
@@ravikkar A) Valyrian steel holds an edge like nothing else, but it does require maintenance to keep it at its best; hence characters possessing these blades are often described doing so. B) Dayne's sword Dawn was *not* Valyrian steel but something else never fully described or explained. Who knows how much care it may have required? For the record, treating a fine sword of any kind abusively is not something a fine swordsperson would be doing. Shoving Dawn into the ground made a strong dramatic statement but in the real world the owner of a legendary sword would never treat it that way. ***Unless that owner was more than half-convinced that this was going to be it, in which case they may not want to preserve its condition. Who knows whose hands it might fall into next? If I were Dayne and thinking it was possible that sword could be lost to his house, I wouldn't be keen on passing it on as pristine as I've always kept it. He had no way of knowing that Ned Stark's sense of honor would extend to returning it to Starfall if he, Dayne, fell.
@@MG-js8bnno they do not need maintenance. They're sharp all the time and no they don't describe it needing so. It's literally described as from a meteorite and can hold its edge like a Valyrian steel one so you clearly know nothing. Dayne can abuse it all he wants and it won't dull.
They weren't letting him past to get to his sister. Plus, if they told him that Rhaegar got her pregnant, he wouldn't think it was due to a union of love. It was pretty much bound to play out as it did.
@@kayladugger7042 Ned is widely known as an honorable and respectable guy. Plus, his sister was still alive at this point ...she would of explained everything, with Sir Dayne not having to die. It's not like Ned would of killed the baby. I don't think anyone would believe that. Robert on the other hand, sure lol.
I was thinking about this too. Likely bc they didn’t want everyone in Ned’s entourage to know of a surviving Targaryen. Perhaps they didn’t think Arthur Dayne would lose or that Ned would come there versus someone else.
@@mayne1 Rhaegar probably had given a strict orders if ever they found out, he was probably thinking that the child will be executed to save her sister's life. Rhaegar thought wrong though
He dreamt an old dream, of three knights in white cloaks, and a tower long fallen, and Lyanna in her bed of blood. In the dream his friends rode with him, as they had in life. Proud Martyn Cassel, Jory’s father; faithful Theo Wull; Ethan Glover, who had been Brandon’s squire; Ser Mark Ryswell, soft of speech and gentle of heart; the crannogman, Howland Reed; Lord Dustin on his great red stallion. Ned had known their faces as well as he knew his own once, but the years leech at a man’s memories, even those he has vowed never to forget. In the dream they were only shadows, grey wraiths on horses made of mist. They were seven, facing three. In the dream as it had been in life. Yet these were no ordinary three. They waited before the round tower, the red mountains of Dorne at their backs, their white cloaks blowing in the wind. And these were no shadows; their faces burned clear, even now. Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning, had a sad smile on his lips. The hilt of the greatsword Dawn poked up over his right shoulder. Ser Oswell Whent was on one knee, sharpening his blade with a whetstone. Across his white-enameled helm, the black bat of his House spread its wings. Between them stood fierce old Ser Gerold Hightower, the White Bull, Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. "I looked for you on the Trident," Ned said to them. "We were not there," Ser Gerold answered. "Woe to the Usurper if we had been," said Ser Oswell. "When King’s Landing fell, Ser Jaime slew your king with a golden sword, and I wondered where you were." "Far away," Ser Gerold said, "or Aerys would yet sit the Iron Throne, and our false brother would burn in seven hells." "I came down on Storm’s End to lift the siege," Ned told them... "and the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne dipped their banners, and all their knights bent the knee to pledge us fealty. I was certain you would be among them." "Our knees do not bend easily," said Ser Arthur Dayne. "Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys. I thought you might have sailed with him." "Ser Willem is a good man and true," said Ser Oswell. "But not of the Kingsguard," Ser Gerold pointed out. "The Kingsguard does not flee." "Then or now," said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm. "We swore a vow," explained old Ser Gerold. Ned’s wraiths moved up beside him, with shadow swords in hand. They were seven against three. “And now it begins,” said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light. "No," Ned said with sadness in his voice. "Now it ends."
@@uhtred7860 Comparing a novel and a film of the same story is like comparing a painting and a song of the same woman...there's no point. They're different artistic mediums, and the comparison itself shows you lack understanding of why there are different kinds of art in the first place.
@@rikk319 I wasn’t comparing anything, I was stating a fact, the novels are brilliantly written, if you weren’t so quick to be a condescending know it all you would have realised what I meant.
love the fact that even after Ser Arthur Dayne lost unfairly, he looks up to Ned and shows him his neck, admitting defeat, knowing that Ned is honorable enough to quickly end his suffering
I disagree. The look he gives Ned is that of betrayal. Ser Arthur expected and deserved die an honorable death, like in battle or to someone that was just better than him. The knife in the back robbed him of that honor. I think Ned knew that and killed him quick out of shame for what his friend did.
In the words of Jamie Lannister "i was trained by Ser Arthur Dayne who could have killed all of you with his left hand whilst taking a piss with his right"
I like how young Ned is disgusted by the fact his opponent was stabbed in the back and that feeling is stronger than the relief that he was saved, but still goes on because there's a job to do. Underrated piece of acting.
I hope we get to see Robert's Rebellion in full one day on the screen. House of the Dragon proves that audiences haven't lost interest in GOT (in spite of D&D's best efforts to ruin it) and would love to see a prequel series so long as it's done right.
@@victorconway444 you're right but at the same time they somehow just forgot about the sword that Dayne puts in the ground. Unless I just missed it, there's no visual nor audio of him removing it from the ground, it's just gone as he pulls out two more swords from their sheaths
Howland Reed was honestly such a chad. If all the theories are true he seduced Arthur Dayne's sister Ashara, the most beautiful woman in the land; had a child with her; killed Arthur, the greatest swordsman in the land and then convinced Ashara to pretend to kill herself and go with him to his Swamp to raise their daughter Meera together. All that while being canonically one of the weakest fighters in the book, getting beaten up by some random squires and saved by a 14 year old girl. There are hints supporting this in the books. People believe Ashara is Jon's mother because she was seen in Ned's tent during the tournament at Harrrenhall, a tent that Ned was sharing with Howland Reed, which was randomly mentioned once. Howland told his children a story about a tournament at Harenhall that has himself and Ashara as the main characters many times, sure sounds like how I met your mother story. Timing suggests that Ashara indeed got impregnated at the Harrrenhall, the kid was said to be stillborn, but if it was alive it would be the exact same afe Meera is now. Lastly Reeds follow Dornish succession law with Meera being the heir. There are also vague allusions to Ashara maybe being alive.
people who read the books know this scene better. Ned's fever dream. "Our knees don't bend so easily" "The kingsguard does not flee, not then , NOT NOW" He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands ,it was pale as milk glass and came alive with light
One of my favorite scenes in GoT. For only appearing this once, Ser Arthur Dayne really made an impression. One of my favorite characters in ASOIAF universe.
Arthur Dayne was a monster and the fight choreography shows that very well, each of his killing blows comes immediately after he blocks and he sets himself up predicting the attack so his follow up attack lands. I cant see a line between his defense and his offence since they overlap each other so well. such a good fight
The flexibility and unpredictability that two blades gives you (a lesson from Lord Kas’im). Of course, the skill it takes to use two blades effectively makes doing so a completely impractical option for 99% of bladed fighters. What incredible mastery and athleticism on display here (even when acting, that looks pretty exhausting).
Watching this back and the simplification of the entire thing from the source material is just so evident. "We were not there", "Woe to the Usurper if we had been" is a perfect line. "Your friend, the Usurper, would lie beneath the ground if we had been." just doesnt hit the same, it doesn't have the same quick wit to show how calm the Kingsguard are.
What would also be cool is when Jon inevitably confronts his cousin Daenerys, the dragons refuse Daenerys order to kill him. Showing that the dragons instinctively know who the true King is of the House of Dragons. Jon being the honorable man he is, gives Dany one last chance to pledge loyalty to him which she stubbornly denies. Jon then kills Daenerys.
God no! No more Jon worship! He's dead! The show was ruined by bringing him back and giving him too many stupid slo-mo hero shots. In the show he's a boring plank of wood, and in the books, he's a child. Game of Thrones was a great show. The Jon And Dany Show was not.
I mean with everyone complaining that he died because he was stabbed in the back, this dude wasnt the kind of guy that could be beaten head to head...OBVIOUSLY. Ned Stark couldnt even get a blade across without instantly being parried and having to dodge another one flying at his head. You CANT stab guys like this in the front, you CANT beat them in an "honorable" fashion. But since he HAD to be beaten or Ned would die, someone had to take him out from behind, and Howland Reed saved Neds life and Ned never pretended otherwise. Howland Reed did what needed to be done in the situation, and the only reason he was successful was that Dayne has thought him completely out of the fight after that first blow. But the point remains, no one was beating this dude straight up so they did what they had to and apparently never saw any glory in it and never boasted of it.
Ned met a similar fate as Ser Arthur Dayne in his dual against Jaime Lannister, at least in the show versions. Granted, Ned only got stabbed in the leg, whereas Ser Arthur got stabbed in the throat.
"Why to fight when we can negotiate?" I wish Ser Arthur Daywne , the greatest swordsman in Westoroes, listened this qoute from CaptainJack Sparrow, we would have seen a lot of skills like this.
I agree, Ned's a man who lives by honour and duty. I think he was just being direct when asking those questions. He wasn't taunting them so much as holding them in contempt for failing as kingsguards when their king and heir needed them most.
The dialogue in the book is waay better, and its the Lord Commander Ser Gerold Hightower Ned speaks with, not Dayne. He's not taunting him, he's curious to know why the the best of the Kingsguard wasn't with the Prince on the Trident, or with why they weren't protecting the King at Kings landing, when Jamie killed him, He also tells them Ser Willem Darry has taken Queen Rhaella Targaryen and Prince Viserys and fled to Dragonstone, and says he thought they would have been with them, to which Ser Oswell Whent says "Ser Willem is a good man and true" "But NOT of the Kingsguard" says Hightower, Arthur Dayne then adds "The Kingsguard does not flee.......Then or now."
@@carlosxevon9498 what ... The greatest swordsman North ever created. Did you even know about these top 5 . If i want to explain it. I will explain it in more than 1000 words pr maybe more..... These top 5 we're exceptional. The other 5 was. The mountain The hound Brienne Loras tyrell And his brother ( which is not in the series) i forget bame And also elder brother of euron Greyjoy and younger of balon Greyjoy (which is also not part of the show) was also exceptional . If I'm not wrong jon snow was good but he did not even deserve to be in top 10 ....
@@Noone91875 still the best swordsman in the north, all of them that you said were not from the north, plus we can’t really compare them just by the fights that they have 1v1 combat they didn’t have direct fights but I am pretty sure that jon owns brienne loras and the hound, and mostly cuz it’s plot armor but still he is one of the greatest. He wasn’t schooled by best teachers he wasn’t a knighht, but the fights and wars that he fought and played his part made many consider him one of the best fighters in the entire series I think he is top 5 by far imo.
I don't give a shit what all you "Ned Stark wasn't a great swordsman" haters have to say. Being one of two people to walk away from a fight agains the greatest swordsman in the history of Westerose, unscathed = Really good fighter.
Well yeah it’s easier if the best fighter is outnumbered and gets stabbed in the back…Ned was a good sowodsman Ser Arthur Dayne was a god hadn’t he been stabbed in the back he would have finished Ned for sure.
@@PhilL30tard0 lmao don't let the TV show fool you..... 7 northerners vs 3 of the most elite fighters in Westerose (including the GOAT in Dayne) is not some overwhelming amount
@@dcanngieter well he ain't wrong, those weren't just any "7 northerners", Ned took his best men at the tower.. and yeah, if Reed didn't interfere and stabbed in the back, results would've been differenr And I'm pretty sure that Gerold hightower and oswell weren't as elite as Arthur and selmy, they were good swordsmen, and Ned took em out... Arthur later faced 4 northmen including Ned later, not just 4 normal northmen, trained great swordsmen who Ned trusted a lot
I went 5 hours out of my way on foot and by car to get to this castle in Spain. Absolutely worth it. It was built by the Moors, the North African / Arab civilization when they ruled in Spain, guarding the boundary of the Christian civilizations of the Iberian peninsula.
I love the hardwork Arthur dayne character put in for this scene.....real swordfight looks kinda awkward like this, there is never enough room to strike like in most movies...you rely on simple straight short and quick thrusts....and the way he handles the sword... 😍😍😍😍
Maybe so I still appreciate the actor work in this scene especially if he had to learn to use two swords at once not to mention the time he put in for only a scene that wasn't more than 5min. Tip my hat to hard work
Those swords aren't meant to be dual wielded, and ned should probably use both hands to fight and deflect, instead of 1, and as a guy who has recently started learning swordfighting, it's not nearly awkward enough
Not to mention the fact that while the rest of the group was busy with Dayne he quickly handled Ser Gerold Hightower, Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. Hightower was no slouch as he himself had quickly handled one of Ned's men a few seconds earlier. So we know that Ned was exceptionally good as a swordsman... just not as good as Dayne. We'll never know how Ned would've stacked up against Jaime. Neither man could hold a candle to Dayne, but how they compared to each other? That will forever remain a mystery.
@@ulosttomedesigns518 Yeah it is Whent, they just left the Lord Commander out for some weird reason, they also left out the awesome dialogue Ned has with him.
@@uhtred7860it's recorded as Gerald Hightower in the show. however his actions and words reflect Oswell in the books. Really weird change made by the showrunners
While beating anyone on that Kingsguard is a real accomplishment, Ned was not up to fighting Jaime. Ned was a good swordsman and a hell of a soldier but Jaime was a true prodigy. Probably the only two people in the show that could have beaten a healthy and whole Jaime were Dayne and Selmy. Not only was Jaime just flat out better than Ned, he was also bigger, broader and faster.
Ser Arthur took up against 4 men at once, not one by one, all at once, only lost from an dishonorable death. Its safe to say he is the best swordsman ever
Dishonorable? Bullshit. The guy who killed him was one of the guys he faced. How is it dishonorable? Because he had to live while the rest must die? It was a fight to the death, man.
This isnt a bad depiction of how a real 4v1 would go down if the 1 was a superior skill to the 4, because coordinating an attack is a lot easier said than done, especially when the guy you're going up against is the most feared and renowned swordsman in the western world.
I mean, Ned wasn’t the type to boast about his accolades that was what people assumed that he was the best since he “killed” one of the greatest swordsman
Ned still isn't a slouch regardless. He fought the other Kingsguard by himself and killed the knight solo. Then Ned held himself well against the greatest swordsman of Westeross.
@@yoshikami7625 It is worth mentioning that him singlehanded taking down a kings guard only happens in the tv show so far. Ned may have not been a slouch but he wasn’t top tier either. The man didn’t practice as regularly as someone like Jaime, didn’t participate in much fighting in the wars, and doesn’t do tourneys. My entire point is that the reason Jaime is interested in Ned has entirely to do with rumors and stories, and not the man himself. If you think of Ned and Jaime’s early interactions, it’s pretty clear Jaime is talking to the slayer of Arthur Dane, not Ned stark.
@@albdamned577 the tv show is done from start to finish even if the ending sucks ass. I respect that we still want to discuss the books but the books are far and away from getting completed. Besides, there's a good chance that Martin might want to dance in the same tune as the show. My point is that the books aren't worth discussing on the matter as of now.
@@yoshikami7625 lol then your point irrelevant to my point, which related to Jaime’s interest in Ned. In the show (apparently the only thing that matters lol), Jaime challenged Ned a couple of times and Ned politely (and somewhat confusingly) refused. Everything from the OP still makes sense there, and all my reasonings hold up except for what will likely be an action scene meant to play up Arthur’s importance in 5 seconds (instead of multiple pages of a book). But yep go ahead and think that is more important than the books, just do it elsewhere.
I love it when Dayne is surrounded by 4 men and very conveniently only 2 attack at any given time lol. There’s a whole 10 seconds Dayne is pushing 2 guys back and there’s just a dude staring at his back
If you are facing someone with two weapons and you only have one, fight at maximum range. The dual wielder must stand more square to use both weapons at once. If you are the single wielder, take a narrow elongated stance and manage the distance so only the opponent's front weapon is in range
That wont work if the dual wielder footwork is faster than yours and are able to close their distance, rather take advantage of the strength difference you have with two hand on your sword and try disarm/redirect/pin his sword down. Causing him to briefly exposed/out of balance.
If Ned had any sense, he would have arrived with a couple of crossbow men and finished it clinically when it was obviously going to kick off. All he did was get his buddies killed. Honour is for the dead.
Sometimes you want to hear stories about great kings and emperors, but there is an allure to the warriors and guardsmen who defend, and are bound to their oath and word. It's giving me the same vibes as Dune when Duncan Idaho battles the Sardaukar.
History could have been different is Rhaegar had kept his best knight at his side. I doubt Robert’s brute strength could have beat Arthur Dayne’s skill
The most unrealistic part was where a number of minor and major lords were sent in a small party to enemy held lands with no military force to confront some of the greatest knights ever known in a defensive location with a unknown force of their own. Granted it was 2 knights but 10 basic infantry would of had them buggered and roberts closest ally and warden of the north dead.
Most realistic answer is that they did not expect any resistance and also that this was really delicate matter. You also have to remember that Ned did not know in what condition his sister was so he just wanted to get there as soon as possible which requires small force.
If this expedition had been planned by a proper strategist with proper scouting information, you would be right. But the reality of this scene is that man desperate to find his kidnapped sister decided to travel as fast as he could with a a handful of trusted friends to find her, and discovered that the skeleton crew guarding the tower were actually elite knights. There are many things historically inaccurate about GoT (even ignoring the magic), but the way that smart but flawed people make mistakes due to emotions and limited information is not one of them. This sort of shit happened all the time.
Everyone says about Arthur Dayne But i also see Ned Stark who defeated Ser Garold Hightower The White Bull Lord Commander of kingsguard in a single combat
@@matheussantiago4572 I don't think any viewers/readers disagree that Jaimie did the right thing. My point still stands. There is a big difference between the circumstances of how an enemy is killed on the battlefield, and killing the king you are sworn to protect. Ned had very consistent principles, for better or worse
I looked for you on the Trident,” Ned said to them. “We were not there,” Ser Gerold answered. “Woe to the Usurper if we had been,” said Ser Oswell. “When King's Landing fell, Ser Jaime slew your king with a golden sword, and I wondered where you were.” “Far away,” Ser Gerold said, “or Aerys would yet sit the Iron Throne, and our false brother would burn in seven hells.” “I came down on Storm's End to lift the siege,” Ned told them, and the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne dipped their banners, and all their knights bent the knee to pledge us fealty. I was certain you would be among them.” “Our knees do not bend easily,” said Ser Arthur Dayne. “Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys. I thought you might have sailed with him.” “Ser Willem is a good man and true,” said Ser Oswell. “But not of the Kingsguard,” Ser Gerold pointed out. “The Kingsguard does not flee.” “Then or now,” said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm. “We swore a vow,” explained old Ser Gerold. Ned’s wraiths moved up beside him, with shadow swords in hand. They were seven against three. “And now it begins,” said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light. “No,” Ned said with sadness in his voice. “Now it ends.” As they came together in a rush of steel and shadow, he could hear Lyanna screaming. "Eddard!" she called. A storm of rose petals blew across a blood-streaked sky, as blue as the eyes of death.
Well, this has to be the dumbest way two Kingsguard have ever died. The war was over and there was no way Ned would ever harm Lyanna. Also, Ned has already earned himself the reputation of being very honourable, so Dayne could have played up to that. Such a dumb way for probably the best warrior in Westeros to die.
Obviously ser Arthur dayne was the greatest there ever was no doubt but let’s appreciate Ned’s skill in his prime, we didn’t get to see to much of Ned fighting throughout the game of thrones series for the obvious reasons. But here he easily killed Gerald Hightower the lord commander of the kingsguard with little effort and he was able to hold his own against ser Arthur dayne being fast not only with his offense but with his defense dodging ser Arthur attacks and using his arm bracers to protect himself. Ned was a great warrior and I wish we got see more of it
Wait, was that Gerold ? Are we sure it wasn't Oswell ? Cuz in the books it was Oswell that was sharpening his sword and said the line about the usurper
We NEVER get to see Ned Stark wield Ice and we never got to see The Sword of The Morning wield his family's sword. Absolutely insane how the people that worked on this show absolutely not care about the IP. Imagine if Aragorn NEVER wielded Narsil//Anduril in the movies? Imagine if they left out Glamdring and Sting? So crazy.
I don't think it would have been particularly practical to attempt to introduce the special sword of a side character who only appears in a five minute flashback scene - the average viewer has enough to keep straight as it is. Andúril is important to the plot because it represents Aragorn's claim to the throne, and he uses it to goad Sauron in the palantír. Sting alerts Frodo to the presence of orcs, and connects his legacy to Bilbo and Gollum. Gandalfs sword is never explained to be Glamdring in any of the Lord of the rings films despite being a main character in all three - I think it's more than justified to skip over the sword lore for a tiny bit player
@@Umbrellagasm I'm talking about including a prop that would have lead to people going down the inevitable "what is that rabbit hole' or at least throwing die hard fans a bone. Just two props
@@DillsyYourDaddy67 I agree that it is a very cool sword, and makes for a great wiki entry, but unfortunately does not tie in any significant way to the plot as we know it (whatever secret half formed ideas GRRM has turning around in his brain unfortunately do not exist on the page). If it had been portrayed as a luminous +5 vorpal greatsword, I think it would have just confused and misdirected the audience in a scene that really needed to be about arguably the most significant reveal in the entire series.
Bran seeming disappointed in how it turned out. Theres no real honor in fighting to survive. You do what you have to. Bron has figured that out. At least Reed had as well. Saved Ned's life.
Ser Arthur Dayne was the greatest swordsman ever lived because he never forgot to put his helmet on. Unlike so many others.
Cough Oberyn
@@EerieChroniclesTV The mountain still would’ve crushed his head, he was too strong. Oberyn died because he left his self unguarded
@@Trabsol yeah i was joking 🙃 oberyn died the moment he stood too close to the mountains arms 😬
2:30 what happened to Helmet Guy?
Barristen was confirmed to be his equal according to the creator
This is the reason that Jamie Lannister was so interested in seeing Ned Stark fight. He had allegedly beaten the best swordsman in the world & one of Jamie's heroes. The Kingslayer couldn't claim to be the best until he had crossed blades with Ned.
I love shows with massive casts like GoT for this reason, every scene has implications for how a dozen other characters interact.
He also was mad when his henchman intervened and ruined the duel, it was his opportunity to become the best swordsman after beating Ned
Huh. Hadn't considered that. Good point.
And then one of his own petty soldiers soiled that aspiration forever
@@EerieChroniclesTV there were many strong contenders. Ned stark would never be able to beat sir Arthur dayne. If another man didn't stabbed him from behind.
At that time also the hound, sthe mountain, sir barrister salmy all were contender for the best swordsman.
And just a little reminder, the stunt double for Arthur Dayne was the guy who portrayed the Night King. Just imagine what he could've done had they given him an actual fight scene.
maybe there was a scene in which jon finally fights night king
But those dumb and dumber dudes scrapped it
Imagine a scene in which night king reaches close to bran and jon is last line of defence
Everything is falling apart, winterfell is in ruins, almost all jon's allies are dead and he barely wins against night king but tht too after losing part of his humanity bcz night king managed to stab jon before getting stabbed in the heart
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that this swordfighting taking place was done by the actor who played Dayne, himself, as he is also an accomplished Swordsman.
It would have been very funny if it turned out the Night King *was* Arthur Dayne. Probably would have made as much sense as Arya killing him.
@@rebeccaliar9873 its sad that you're right.
After watching anime attack on titan , no spoilers, they delivered on the ending it still had some that didn't like it but they landed the story. They foreshadowed the night king for seasons and didn't deliver. It was the darkest night in that fight scene but it was hard to see. Could have worked a way of illuminating it better and the night king fights weren't there when they could have been. Still a great show up to season 5 were sersie blew them all up.
Whatever people may have against The Mad King, he had some of the absolute best Kingsguard ever. Ser Gerold Hightower, Ser Arthur Dayne, Ser Barristan Selmy, Ser Jaime Lannister, Prince Lewin Martell. Absolute beasts!
I would’ve also loved to see the first Kingsguard of Jaeherys the Concillator in action, because they were the best Kingsguard ever to serve
Someone hasn’t read the books , or you missed the part where most of those guys were already kingsguard before Aerys
@@tacoblude8208 I have actually read the books, I meant that this combo of 7 Kingsguard were probably the best and most popular among any Kingsguard any King ever got. Another King that had even come close to such a level was probably Jaeherys!
What happened to the Prince Kingsguard?!?!
@@patrickbird7625 Prince Lewyn Martell was slain by Ser Lyn Corbray at the Trident! He was badly wounded before the fight, probably why Ser Lyn was able to kill him!
A nice detail is you can see Ned's conflict after Dayne is stabbed, he CLEARLY doesn't like that the fight was won in a dishonorable manner and all he can do is give Dayne a swift end. He even returned Dayne's sword to his family after.
I think this is the wrong read (lol) about Ned Stark here. Later Ned Stark clearly stated to Jamie that he doesn't fight in tourneys so when he fights for real, he doesn't want a man to know what he can do. In that sense, Ned knows that a real fight, where both fighters intend on killing each other isn't about honorable tactics but a must win. Maybe it was a transformation on what he thought was honorable since that fight and the following war/rebellion.
Even Brandon's reaction "he stabbed him in the back" is kind of eye-roll. In the same time you find out what really happened, you also find out that your honorable father lied about it, and soon after we know the even bigger lie (or secret?) he was keeping. I feel like the details around Ned Stark's honor is something that can be (maybe is, I've only read the first book) explored considerably more deep even though he's dead.
And then lied to protect Dayne's legacy. Dying bravely and honorably obeying his Prince's last command.
@@EbonySeraphim Ned never lied about it, though. He's never given a full accounting of it. All we ever really hear him say is that he "he would have died if not for Howland Reed".
He certainly doesn't go around boasting that he slew Arthur Dayne in single combat. Ned behaves for the most part with impeccable honor, and the handful of times we do see him lie, it's for good reason and to preserve more lives and make peace (e.g. when he agrees to plead guilty to treason and take the black, or when he lies about Jon Snow's parentage in order to save the child's life, assuming that is how it will play out in the novels).
More interesting to examine is someone like Selmy, who is also renowned for his honor, but served the Mad King and even Joffrey for a time.
He's a biggest hypocrite and lier of all, he killed an unarmed man and never revealed how he was stabbed in the back. War is fought with dignity too
@@EbonySeraphim time flies people change bro
Being able to parry a two handed sword with one hand and deflecting a guy using a whole shield with the other. House Dayne producing demigods
Tyyyyyyyytyyyyytttttttttiyttttttttttttttttttttttt
Yeah it's an incredibly unrealistic-Hollywood esque-fight, no explainable reason why they had him like this and paid zero focus to his MAGICAL fucking sword that was forged from a damn fallen star ffs
In English please??
“Two handle sword with one hand”?
I didn’t see anything like that on this video. Maybe you aren’t writing English.
Gerold Hightower was the guy who deflected the shield
@@enixword2637 he saying that the swords Dayne was using is a two handed sword and he is using one hand
I can only imagine what Ned felt when he went from a 4v1 to a very sudden 1v1 with the greatest swordsman ever. Probably terrifying
Yeah the actor did a great job of portraying that look in his face
I feel the implication of Dayne’s line is underrated, he’s saying “I wish you good fortune in the wars to come” because he knows that the birth of Jon is going to lead to a lot of problems for everyone in the future
Yea he didn’t mean cleaning up after Robert. I agree with you.
Wouldn’t that be implying that Dayne didn’t think he was going to make it out of this fight alive?
@@supermanjp83I think he knew it was unlikely. Yes, it’s the best of the best against really…nobody of note when it comes to skill but at the same time still out numbered by a lot.
So, really the answer is who knows and it’s whatever you believe his intentions were because there is no definitive
@@supermanjp83I think he was just being polite. If Ned dies, he doesnt have to worry about the future anymore, so it doesnt matter what he says. If he lives, he will need that good fortune endeed. Arthur seems like a polite enough guy, he recognizes he could die there, so any good will that he wants to communicate, he says before the battle.
"i wish you good fortune in the wars to come" is a common game of thrones line, as far as i'm aware
I love how many parallels there were between Ned and Dayne's death. Both were injured by a foe from behind, both were performing their duties to the king, both were killed by the neck and were both honorable swordsmen who only lost because of circumstances beyond their skills
Was just about to post the same
Also both killed by their own swords
The whole GOT is "you reap what you sow" kinda thing!!
sorry but this is not a great comparison and almost seems like you're forcing an answer to an essay prompt. one "from behind" is figurative, the other is not. one was stabbed in the neck during combat, the other had his head chopped off in front of a crowd. dayne most certainly could have prevented being killed either by finishing howland reed while he was down or just killing ned sooner, and so could Ned because everyone character knows he was being an idiot, and you could say the same for any character in GOT who died
@anonymus3703 he means that ned stark was speared in the knee from behind during his fight with Jaime lannister. And the final blow was to the neck from his own sword
Roberts Rebellion is too damn good of a story, just the premise that Robert went against targayreans falsely thinking that Lyana loved him and even beat Rheagar targayrean in a duel,it’s just mind blowing.
Shows how even a rebellion built on hoax where either party is not in the wrong is designed so well.
The rebellion was not a hoax and the Targaryens were in the wrong from the start. The Lyana/Rheagar question isn't even that relevant when you think about it, because what really started the war was the execution of Ned's father and brother and the order given to Jon Arryn to turn in both Robert and Ned. Rheagar was incompetent and irresponsible to say the least, he fled with Lyana without thinking about the repercussions of what he was doing, knowing that both Rickard and Robert for sure would question the crown about what happened to Lyana and knowing that his father was already a unstable men who burned people alive for fun, he ignored all that, didn't take any precautions and got himself and his family killed because of it.
@@robervalhaha Facts and oh my god 48 minutes ago, didn't expect someone to still be viewing this or commenting here
What started the war was the torture and execution of Rickard and Brandon Stark, Ned's father and older brother, followed by the Mad King demanding Jon Arryn put to death Ned and Robert and bring their heads to King's Landing. That's was what started the war, and it was definitely no "hoax".
@@robervalhaha You are 100% correct. Rhaegar was definitely very irresponsible, and very reckless. And it started way before he ran off with Lyanna Stark. It started at the tourney at Harrenhal when he managed to very publicly disrespect his own wife and 3 great houses - Starks, Martells, and Baratheons - all in one fell swoop when he won the tourney and then crowned Lyanna the Queen Of Love & Beauty instead of his own wife, in front of THOUSANDS of people, and both every great and lesser Lord in Westeros lol. Talk about reckless smh lol. Rhaegar was just like, "Fuck it, I'm goin for it!"
@@robervalhaha Thank you for this comment. It made my day
The best swordsman of all the kingdoms and we only saw him for 5 mins in the entire show. But man what an appearance!
I don’t know how it would’ve ever happened, but watching Ser Arthur Dayne fight Syrio Forel (both in their prime) would’ve been the fight of the century. Even a sparring match between the two would’ve been better than any other fights in the show.
@@heathermillsphantomlimb9314 Would have loved to have seen Jaime in his prime, Ser Barristan in a flash back, yes Syrio of course and more of Arthur Dayne in more flashbacks
@@heathermillsphantomlimb9314Dayne would've obliterated him especially if they had given him his actual sword in the show
@@Honmatres Everyone forgets about Young Robert Baratheon !
The man was a beast ! Prince Rhegar was a lethal fighter in his own right & RB caved his chest in .
@@michaelcalland801yes,but Robert was not a swordman because he fight using a warhammer.
If Arthur had won imagine the different story we would’ve gotten. An outlaw Kingsguard from the lost regime raising Aegon (Jon) as the secret prince who was promised and chosen one, preparing him to take the throne and fulfill his destiny and making him the next greatest swordsman
Lmao so just Young Griff then
I mean Jon did actually end up being a pretty good fighter.
I think Arthur would have taken Jon to Essos and meet up with Viserys and Daenerys.
Arthur was never going to kill Ned his intent was to disarm him
@@terrancehylton-lyons1776 lol nah
If you think about it, Ser Arthur and Ser Gerold fought against Ned Stark and his bannermen to protect Jon (Aegon), fearing that Robert/Ned would kill the infant if they ever came to know. But eventually, Ned ended up doing the same by saving Jon by himself. Ser Arthur fought for honour and died a dishonourable death for nothing. :(
nah, in the books lyanna was likely held there without her consent
Starks would never do that.
They kind of gave us a red herring (so many)as Reed was still alive and he was the only living person who knew Jon's true identity....and we never met his older version.
@@AGboiii There's no way to know that yet since it hasn't been addressed in the books yet.
There are men who fought honorably. They lie in the ground. The only way to fight is to win by any means necessary. Winning is the only true form of honor in war.
“He stabbed him in the back.” It’s Arthur Dayne. Stabbing him in the front is basically impossible. When your opponent is that damn good, you’ve got to fight without honor.
“You don’t fight with honor”
“No, but he did”
its war what are you talking about 🤣
To be fair, the man who did it was a Reed, and they mostly stick in the Neck between the North and everything else. The only fixed emplacement they have and the only formal defenders they have are at Moat Cailin; the rest of them melt into the marsh and use guerilla tactics, so sneak attacks are basically what they're known for.
To borrow from Shakespeare, Honour hath no skill in surgery.
Howlond reed saved his boy there is no lack in honour there what the hell 😂
No doubt a sword expert will be able to pick holes in the fighting - these are actors that have probably trained for just a few months after all, not lifelong masters - but it's a great scene and I think the actor playing Dayne absolutely nails it.
It's not simply the charisma and growly voice, but an interesting ambiguity in his performance: he's clearly a badass but there's something else here. Despite his fearsome skill, he does not advance to battle with enthusiasm or arrogance (compare with Jamie or Gregor), but in stoic adherence to his duty and the acceptance that his own blood may be spilled today.
Even the basics of sword fighting are glaring here. The best swordsman in this world uses two? Lol. He lost that fight based purely on what his enemies had. But they had to make it flashy.
@@elimgarak1127 Dude when he is fighting 1v4 with the both swords, accurate or not that is simply one of the most BADASS scenes in the entire show
If they wanted to make Arthur Dayne impressive, they succeeded massively in this clip
The man wielding 2 blades is a real pro also is the actor for Night King.
@@dekuuchiha9990 Really? Sh*t I was a f*cking huge fan of the show back in the day and I didn’t know that somehow. Good for him, wish we’d seen him more in either role tbh
@@dekuuchiha9990@Maclain I think Dekuuchiha meant the actor playing Dayne and the actor playing the Night King were both highly trained, not that they were the same person 😉. The Night King was portrayed by Richard Brake in seasons 4 and 5, and Vladimir Furdik from season 6 onwards. Ser Arthur Dayne was played by Luke Roberts.
One thing you must realize is that Arthur Dayne is almost super strong. The way he kept swinging two full sized swords at a faster rate than the Stark men who tired from using one, while wearing more armor than they all were
Dorky thought, but maybe they were Valarian steel which is a bit lighter.
@@tire26 Or maybe the producers just didnt think too miuch about it and just wanted it too long nice.. like fighting with 2 lightsabers looks cooler.
@@tire26 In the books, it wasn't even two swords. Dawn was a giant greatsword. And it wasn't Valyrian steel, it was made from a meteorite. Either way, that sword and Arthur Dayne have become two of my favorite things in the series. The man was an absolute beast.
@@tire26 valerian steel is not made in China, it’s expensive and rare af, Lannister don’t even have one, Arthur has it own sword but it wasn’t valerian.
@@tire26no. His house’s sword, Dawn, according to books, was a massive two handed sword made from the metal of a fallen star. It’s not Valyrian steel, but it’s lasted 10,000 years and is pretty damn close to it. His other sword here is probably regular steel, though in the books I don’t think he used a second sword
"He stabbed him in the back." So what? Ned lived. Arthur Dayne died. Ser Bronn of the fucking Black Water should teach Bran a few things.
I don't know if you watched the show but that's not a very Stark thing to do. If you're a Lannister then sure fuck it, kill em all. Ultimately Dayne was protecting Ned's nephew and the heir to the kingdoms so in retrospect he's obviously going to feel guilt. A self righteous person who realizes he was in the wrong and committed a crime against someone on the same side.
@@rayzala1393 Except a Stark didn't do it. Ned was almost as surprised as Dayne was. Once it was done, what was Ned supposed to do? Berate his friend for saving his life? He Mercy-Killed Dayne, and moved on with his life. Any embellished stories probably came from the backstabber and not Ned himself. And Ned wouldn't want to destroy the reputation of the friend who saved him by branding him a backstabber so he probably didn't protest too hard.
He is lord of the reach and actually very very practical with money and investment
It's very conflicting as eastern traditions teach you "means to an end don't matter, only the end matters"
And in the west youre taught that your "means to an end" will "mean to end you" if you're not careful.
Game of thrones is a beautiful intersection of those two paradigms and how the gods honor it
@@TheCrimsonRevenger backstabbing in this sequence would not have brought shame upon someone
This was for all intents and purposes, a battlefield, and there's absolutely no rules on the battlefield.
Sure there's rules of engagement, but "no backstabbing" is not one of those rules, RoE more entail how you're supposed to handle prisoners and to do stuff like have a meeting of generals before a battle.
This move would have brought zero shame, as it's not a duel. In fact, daggers are the reason why most people die on a battlefield, or at least the dagger was one of the deadliest weapons. It stabs and its small, and therefore is one of the only weapons maneuverable enough to get around a full plate of armor
This was pretty common back in the day- I feel the only reason why bran is even disgusted is because he finally realized that "history is written by its victors" more than he's upset with the move itself
Would love to see this time period of Roberts Rebellion prequel series. And to see the huge battle on the trident!
This and Aegon’s conquest
yeah without woke shit and great writing, robert rebellion gonna be lit
@@Nuttyyana without right wing nut jobs
@@WillieSlackmer Aegon's conquest is appealing, but not as much as robert's rebellion.
I'm not sure. The story is pretty limited in scope. I think Robert's Rebellion would make a perfect movie (possibly a mini series?), but there just isn't enough material for a full show. There are only a small handful of major plot points whereas in the Targaryan war in HOTD, there are a massive number as the story spans decades
Always bothered me in this scene that they don’t acknowledge that Ned was never boastful about killing Dayne. He said specifically Dayne would have killed him “if not for Howland Reed” Ned always gave credit to Reed for saving his life. There is no dishonor in how Dayne died. It was war and a fight to the death. The “he stabbed him the back” line is spoken like someone that has never been in a battle or a fight for their life. Bad dialogue in an otherwise pretty good scene.
Young Ned's actor didn't seem to understand the gravitas of what was happening, I agree. Just D&D bs.
There really isn't any reason bran or blood raven would acknowledge what you mentioned. Also bran hasn't seen many sword fights at this point.
@@fightingmedialounge519 No, the scene frames it as Ned used to brag to Bran about how he defeated Dayne. That is not how the books frame it; Ned specifically told Bran he would be dead if not for Reed. These are in the POV chapters of Bran; so you are hearing his internal thoughts about it. It is very clear Bran had no delusions about what took place. The show's version of it has it totally opposite of how Bran thinks about it in the books. And it hurts the character of Ned in the process. Ned was not boastful, need wanted to honor Dayne and the fact that Reed saved his life. Ned's biggest fault was he was honorable to a fault; which made him make really bad decisions.
@@patrickthomas2119 not really. The framing of scene suggests that bran heard the story several times(hence, you know, him saying it). That by itself could and very likely means he was simply told about it by other people. Except that line by itself doesn't specifically indicate Howland stabbed Dayne in the back; which is what he was surprised about. Even in the show itself bran mentions how he heard Howland saved ned back in season four, so that's not what he's shocked about here. It's only the "opposite" of how the books depicts it if you deliberately ignore what's said in the show simply isn't word for word what's written in the books. He wasn't boastful in the show either. Also Ned's flaw wasn't honor but instead him being merciful at the wrong moments. Keep in mind he lied about jon being his , in the show and likely on the book, and changed robberts will so he's perfectly willing deceitful when it suits him.
@@fightingmedialounge519 "he's better than my father"
"much better"
"but my father beat him"
"did he?"
"I know he did, I heard the story a thousand times"
Come on, you are giving this dialogue and this scene's framing of what was described in the book the most forgiving interpretation possible.
and your point about season 4, I agree; season 4 framed it more accurately; season 7 did not. Which is a sign of the decreased quality in the last couple of seasons.
It's one of those moments where I was rooting for both characters. Both Ned and Arthur. Especially Arthur considering he's not arrogant or evil natured or anything. He was honorable and respectful and definitely a skilled and cunning warrior. He never insulted Ned or disrespected him in any shape or form he was just a knight honoring his oath and obeying his orders without question. And Ned because this is when we get to witness his skill in swordsmanship when he was in his prime. Of course Ned isn't as skilled as Arthur but he was able to hold his ground until Arthur disarmed him. But then he got stabbed from behind and Ned being an honorable natured man really did not want it to end like that as you saw it in his face afterwards. Plus I absolutely love the actor that plays as Lord Stark in his younger years.
Obeying orders without question isn't by itself honorable. The orders themselves must be honorable.
@@rikk319 true. For example, Jamie Lannister killed the king he swore to protect, but given the circumstances, that was the honourable thing to do.
@@rikk319I get that yes.
@@rikk319 The prince tasked them to protect his lady and her unborn child. How is that not honorable?
@@fridericusrex6289 I never said they weren't. My point was that "obeying" is not an intrinsically honorable thing. It depends on what is being obeyed.
My only critique about this fight is that I wish they made the sword dawn just a little whiter and a little more distinctive For the book fans otherwise perfection
The sward dawn was a milky white sward said to have held powers made from a fallin star an was as sharp as valerian steel maybe even a bit better
If I'm not mistaken, Dawn was a two handed great sword in the novels, so it's gone pretty far off the mark already. But I may have misinterpreted Martin's description.
@@SequentiallyCompact could just be a way to show that dayne is so skilled he can dual wield swords, even a greatsword
For the book fans, a completely different fighting style. Dayne used a greatsword.
@@SequentiallyCompact You are correct. And I don't really understand why they had him dual wield here instead of using Dawn. It would've made the fight a lot less Hollywoodesque to have him cleave right through a puny steel longsword with his huge but light meteorite blade.
We know canonically Dawn HAS to have been at this fight because Ned brings it to House Dayne personally afterwards.
Levi and Dayne: “reverse grips sword”
Titans and Ned: “sweats profusely”
Well yeah. There’s a saying that people who “reverse grip”/“ice pick” grip weapons are either complete amateurs or ferocious experts in their craft. Given the reputation Dayne had, they probably both knew that he wasn’t gonna go easy.
The way he says “lord stark” nothing but respect and character from this guy. A class act, truly.
In the show we don’t get to see too much fighting from Ned but in his prime he was absolutely awesome.
"You’re too modest. I’ve seen you cut down a dozen of great knights." Ser Barristan Selmy
Spends days meticulously maintaining sword - violently shoves it into the gravel at the first opportunity.
I know right! Like sticking the business end of your rifle down in the mud
The sword shoved into the ground was Dayne’s sword Dawn, not the sword we saw being sharpened. Like Valyrian Steel, Dawn never needs to be sharpened, because it never dulls.
@@ravikkar A) Valyrian steel holds an edge like nothing else, but it does require maintenance to keep it at its best; hence characters possessing these blades are often described doing so. B) Dayne's sword Dawn was *not* Valyrian steel but something else never fully described or explained. Who knows how much care it may have required? For the record, treating a fine sword of any kind abusively is not something a fine swordsperson would be doing. Shoving Dawn into the ground made a strong dramatic statement but in the real world the owner of a legendary sword would never treat it that way. ***Unless that owner was more than half-convinced that this was going to be it, in which case they may not want to preserve its condition. Who knows whose hands it might fall into next? If I were Dayne and thinking it was possible that sword could be lost to his house, I wouldn't be keen on passing it on as pristine as I've always kept it. He had no way of knowing that Ned Stark's sense of honor would extend to returning it to Starfall if he, Dayne, fell.
@@MG-js8bnno they do not need maintenance. They're sharp all the time and no they don't describe it needing so.
It's literally described as from a meteorite and can hold its edge like a Valyrian steel one so you clearly know nothing.
Dayne can abuse it all he wants and it won't dull.
Why didn't Sir Dayne just explain to Ned that he has a nephew? Surely Ned would have done everything to protect him, just like he already did...
They weren't letting him past to get to his sister. Plus, if they told him that Rhaegar got her pregnant, he wouldn't think it was due to a union of love. It was pretty much bound to play out as it did.
@@kayladugger7042 Ned is widely known as an honorable and respectable guy. Plus, his sister was still alive at this point ...she would of explained everything, with Sir Dayne not having to die. It's not like Ned would of killed the baby. I don't think anyone would believe that. Robert on the other hand, sure lol.
Because the showrunners wanted a sword fight.
I was thinking about this too. Likely bc they didn’t want everyone in Ned’s entourage to know of a surviving Targaryen. Perhaps they didn’t think Arthur Dayne would lose or that Ned would come there versus someone else.
@@mayne1 Rhaegar probably had given a strict orders if ever they found out, he was probably thinking that the child will be executed to save her sister's life. Rhaegar thought wrong though
3:23 When you realize you have to 1v1 the guy who just brought it down from a 1v4
He dreamt an old dream,
of three knights in white cloaks, and a tower long fallen,
and Lyanna in her bed of blood.
In the dream his friends rode with him, as they had in life.
Proud Martyn Cassel, Jory’s father;
faithful Theo Wull;
Ethan Glover, who had been Brandon’s squire;
Ser Mark Ryswell, soft of speech and gentle of heart;
the crannogman, Howland Reed;
Lord Dustin on his great red stallion.
Ned had known their faces as well as he knew his own once,
but the years leech at a man’s memories, even those he has vowed never to forget.
In the dream they were only shadows, grey wraiths on horses made of mist.
They were seven, facing three. In the dream as it had been in life.
Yet these were no ordinary three.
They waited before the round tower,
the red mountains of Dorne at their backs, their white cloaks blowing in the wind.
And these were no shadows; their faces burned clear, even now.
Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning, had a sad smile on his lips.
The hilt of the greatsword Dawn poked up over his right shoulder.
Ser Oswell Whent was on one knee, sharpening his blade with a whetstone.
Across his white-enameled helm, the black bat of his House spread its wings.
Between them stood fierce old Ser Gerold Hightower,
the White Bull, Lord Commander of the Kingsguard.
"I looked for you on the Trident," Ned said to them.
"We were not there," Ser Gerold answered.
"Woe to the Usurper if we had been," said Ser Oswell.
"When King’s Landing fell, Ser Jaime slew your king with a golden sword,
and I wondered where you were."
"Far away," Ser Gerold said,
"or Aerys would yet sit the Iron Throne, and our false brother would burn in seven hells."
"I came down on Storm’s End to lift the siege," Ned told them...
"and the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne dipped their banners,
and all their knights bent the knee to pledge us fealty.
I was certain you would be among them."
"Our knees do not bend easily," said Ser Arthur Dayne.
"Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys.
I thought you might have sailed with him."
"Ser Willem is a good man and true," said Ser Oswell.
"But not of the Kingsguard," Ser Gerold pointed out.
"The Kingsguard does not flee."
"Then or now," said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm.
"We swore a vow," explained old Ser Gerold.
Ned’s wraiths moved up beside him, with shadow swords in hand.
They were seven against three.
“And now it begins,” said Ser Arthur Dayne,
the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands.
The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light.
"No," Ned said with sadness in his voice.
"Now it ends."
And that right there, is why the books are so much better than the show, i hope he finishes the books, but i'm preparing myself for disappointment.
this is canon then? which book is this, must have miss it when listening to the audiobook
@@uhtred7860 Comparing a novel and a film of the same story is like comparing a painting and a song of the same woman...there's no point. They're different artistic mediums, and the comparison itself shows you lack understanding of why there are different kinds of art in the first place.
@@aidilr.2809 Its from the first book A game of thrones.
@@rikk319 I wasn’t comparing anything, I was stating a fact, the novels are brilliantly written, if you weren’t so quick to be a condescending know it all you would have realised what I meant.
he stabbed him in the back
ah yes, a spy moment, a critical hit
All good in war
"Did you forget about me?!"
@@PPerviz right behind you
love the fact that even after Ser Arthur Dayne lost unfairly, he looks up to Ned and shows him his neck, admitting defeat, knowing that Ned is honorable enough to quickly end his suffering
He was just looking up
@@The_indigochildpeople just be saying 😂😂😂
Yes because if he didn't look up his chin would have surely deflected the sword. You mong
I disagree. The look he gives Ned is that of betrayal. Ser Arthur expected and deserved die an honorable death, like in battle or to someone that was just better than him. The knife in the back robbed him of that honor. I think Ned knew that and killed him quick out of shame for what his friend did.
In the words of Jamie Lannister "i was trained by Ser Arthur Dayne who could have killed all of you with his left hand whilst taking a piss with his right"
I like how young Ned is disgusted by the fact his opponent was stabbed in the back and that feeling is stronger than the relief that he was saved, but still goes on because there's a job to do. Underrated piece of acting.
I hope we get to see Robert's Rebellion in full one day on the screen. House of the Dragon proves that audiences haven't lost interest in GOT (in spite of D&D's best efforts to ruin it) and would love to see a prequel series so long as it's done right.
was house of the dragon any good? Worth seeing?
@@mattc9598 I’m only three episodes in, but I’m loving it so far.
@@victorconway444 i've been skeptical due to how horrible spinoffs seem to end up, especially in the past 10 years
@@mattc9598 This one doesn’t have Dumb & Dumber writing for it and George R R Martin is an executive producer. So rest assured, it’s in good hands.
@@victorconway444 you're right but at the same time they somehow just forgot about the sword that Dayne puts in the ground. Unless I just missed it, there's no visual nor audio of him removing it from the ground, it's just gone as he pulls out two more swords from their sheaths
2:14 this guy was so clever! Just acted to be a complete fool and play dead after to stab him in the back💪🏻
Howlen reed..meera reeds father
Howland Reed was honestly such a chad. If all the theories are true he seduced Arthur Dayne's sister Ashara, the most beautiful woman in the land; had a child with her; killed Arthur, the greatest swordsman in the land and then convinced Ashara to pretend to kill herself and go with him to his Swamp to raise their daughter Meera together. All that while being canonically one of the weakest fighters in the book, getting beaten up by some random squires and saved by a 14 year old girl.
There are hints supporting this in the books. People believe Ashara is Jon's mother because she was seen in Ned's tent during the tournament at Harrrenhall, a tent that Ned was sharing with Howland Reed, which was randomly mentioned once. Howland told his children a story about a tournament at Harenhall that has himself and Ashara as the main characters many times, sure sounds like how I met your mother story. Timing suggests that Ashara indeed got impregnated at the Harrrenhall, the kid was said to be stillborn, but if it was alive it would be the exact same afe Meera is now. Lastly Reeds follow Dornish succession law with Meera being the heir. There are also vague allusions to Ashara maybe being alive.
Lordy, this looks like dog crap in 60 fps. Powerful soap opera energy.
people who read the books know this scene better. Ned's fever dream. "Our knees don't bend so easily" "The kingsguard does not flee, not then , NOT NOW"
He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands ,it was pale as milk glass and came alive with light
One of my favorite scenes in GoT. For only appearing this once, Ser Arthur Dayne really made an impression. One of my favorite characters in ASOIAF universe.
I think after seeing this fight everyone can agree with me that arthur Dayne deserves a spin off series
Ned owned him
@@P4PmmaFan many would disagree with u there ned only killed Dayne because that reed guy stabbed him in back otherwise ned would have been killed
@@michaelclark4062 It was brilliantly struck. Ser Bronn of the fooking black water would approve
No.
Not even interesting .. no
Arthur Dayne was a monster and the fight choreography shows that very well, each of his killing blows comes immediately after he blocks and he sets himself up predicting the attack so his follow up attack lands. I cant see a line between his defense and his offence since they overlap each other so well.
such a good fight
The flexibility and unpredictability that two blades gives you (a lesson from Lord Kas’im). Of course, the skill it takes to use two blades effectively makes doing so a completely impractical option for 99% of bladed fighters. What incredible mastery and athleticism on display here (even when acting, that looks pretty exhausting).
Watching this back and the simplification of the entire thing from the source material is just so evident. "We were not there", "Woe to the Usurper if we had been" is a perfect line. "Your friend, the Usurper, would lie beneath the ground if we had been." just doesnt hit the same, it doesn't have the same quick wit to show how calm the Kingsguard are.
it's baffling to change a line like that to convey the exact same message but in a less concise, clumsier-sounding way
I wouldn't say the book like is an example of quick wit. The more appropriate term would gravitas.
Would have been a cool story if Ned lost and Jon was raised by ser Arthur Dayne as a remarkable swordsman and heir to the 7 kingdoms in secret
What would also be cool is when Jon inevitably confronts his cousin Daenerys, the dragons refuse Daenerys order to kill him. Showing that the dragons instinctively know who the true King is of the House of Dragons. Jon being the honorable man he is, gives Dany one last chance to pledge loyalty to him which she stubbornly denies. Jon then kills Daenerys.
Not cool, short.
And a john' twin enters the room 😮
God no! No more Jon worship! He's dead! The show was ruined by bringing him back and giving him too many stupid slo-mo hero shots. In the show he's a boring plank of wood, and in the books, he's a child. Game of Thrones was a great show. The Jon And Dany Show was not.
Raccoon well he still became a remarkable swordsman and was heir to the Kingdom is secret so I mean....🤷🏽♂️
And yet this scene means absolutely nothing in the long run
indeed, the fucking show up here to watch an action scene then leave. There is no reason behind any of it.
I mean with everyone complaining that he died because he was stabbed in the back, this dude wasnt the kind of guy that could be beaten head to head...OBVIOUSLY. Ned Stark couldnt even get a blade across without instantly being parried and having to dodge another one flying at his head. You CANT stab guys like this in the front, you CANT beat them in an "honorable" fashion. But since he HAD to be beaten or Ned would die, someone had to take him out from behind, and Howland Reed saved Neds life and Ned never pretended otherwise. Howland Reed did what needed to be done in the situation, and the only reason he was successful was that Dayne has thought him completely out of the fight after that first blow. But the point remains, no one was beating this dude straight up so they did what they had to and apparently never saw any glory in it and never boasted of it.
Ned met a similar fate as Ser Arthur Dayne in his dual against Jaime Lannister, at least in the show versions. Granted, Ned only got stabbed in the leg, whereas Ser Arthur got stabbed in the throat.
2:09 lowkey imagined Ned pulling out a gloc
Clear example of how history is written by him. His story.
Yah but it was more honorable for Sir Arthur Dayne ending story to go down in battle, instead of getting stabbed from behind.
@@shadowbandit3975eh not really if it was told he was stabbed in the back then evreyone would know he was undefeated and killed by a coward
@@Max-jp6jb one can expect people say that....but in reality they would have made fun that dude got killed from behind.
@@SriramVenkatesanWell that's what she said... ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
@@Max-jp6jb Cowards run away. Smart men stab their superior-skilled enemy in the back of the neck, because to do otherwise would mean death and loss.
"Why to fight when we can negotiate?"
I wish Ser Arthur Daywne , the greatest swordsman in Westoroes, listened this qoute from CaptainJack Sparrow, we would have seen a lot of skills like this.
My favorite from Jack is “keep telling yourself that darling”… lmao 🤣 it’s a meme everywhere now
The respect they have for arthur dayne is great…stark taunts him and he just shuts it down with, “our prince wanted us here”
He wasn't actually taunting him, he was doing something a bit more subtle. In the books its slightly more clear to me.
I agree, Ned's a man who lives by honour and duty. I think he was just being direct when asking those questions. He wasn't taunting them so much as holding them in contempt for failing as kingsguards when their king and heir needed them most.
I think he also genuinely wanted to know why some of the best kingsguard were defending the tower
The dialogue in the book is waay better, and its the Lord Commander Ser Gerold Hightower Ned speaks with, not Dayne. He's not taunting him, he's curious to know why the the best of the Kingsguard wasn't with the Prince on the Trident, or with why they weren't protecting the King at Kings landing, when Jamie killed him, He also tells them Ser Willem Darry has taken Queen Rhaella Targaryen and Prince Viserys and fled to Dragonstone, and says he thought they would have been with them, to which Ser Oswell Whent says "Ser Willem is a good man and true" "But NOT of the Kingsguard" says Hightower, Arthur Dayne then adds "The Kingsguard does not flee.......Then or now."
There are many opinions. Bur for me, Arthur Dayne is the best swordsman in the whole series
He is.
1.ser aurthur dwane
2.ser barrister selby
3.prime Robert baratheon
4.ser jaime Lannister
5.red viper
These are top for me.
@@Noone91875 I can't disagree.
@@Noone91875 John Snow should be on the list also cuz he was pretty good maybe the best swordsman that north ever produced, as ramsey also said.
@@carlosxevon9498 what ... The greatest swordsman North ever created.
Did you even know about these top 5 .
If i want to explain it. I will explain it in more than 1000 words pr maybe more.....
These top 5 we're exceptional.
The other 5 was.
The mountain
The hound
Brienne
Loras tyrell
And his brother ( which is not in the series) i forget bame
And also elder brother of euron Greyjoy and younger of balon Greyjoy (which is also not part of the show) was also exceptional .
If I'm not wrong jon snow was good but he did not even deserve to be in top 10 ....
@@Noone91875 still the best swordsman in the north, all of them that you said were not from the north, plus we can’t really compare them just by the fights that they have 1v1 combat they didn’t have direct fights but I am pretty sure that jon owns brienne loras and the hound, and mostly cuz it’s plot armor but still he is one of the greatest. He wasn’t schooled by best teachers he wasn’t a knighht, but the fights and wars that he fought and played his part made many consider him one of the best fighters in the entire series I think he is top 5 by far imo.
I don't give a shit what all you "Ned Stark wasn't a great swordsman" haters have to say. Being one of two people to walk away from a fight agains the greatest swordsman in the history of Westerose, unscathed = Really good fighter.
That's all matters, you fight, you fight to win
He was young here, of course he got better as he got older, its called practice
Well yeah it’s easier if the best fighter is outnumbered and gets stabbed in the back…Ned was a good sowodsman Ser Arthur Dayne was a god hadn’t he been stabbed in the back he would have finished Ned for sure.
@@PhilL30tard0 lmao don't let the TV show fool you..... 7 northerners vs 3 of the most elite fighters in Westerose (including the GOAT in Dayne) is not some overwhelming amount
@@dcanngieter well he ain't wrong, those weren't just any "7 northerners", Ned took his best men at the tower.. and yeah, if Reed didn't interfere and stabbed in the back, results would've been differenr
And I'm pretty sure that Gerold hightower and oswell weren't as elite as Arthur and selmy, they were good swordsmen, and Ned took em out... Arthur later faced 4 northmen including Ned later, not just 4 normal northmen, trained great swordsmen who Ned trusted a lot
I went 5 hours out of my way on foot and by car to get to this castle in Spain. Absolutely worth it. It was built by the Moors, the North African / Arab civilization when they ruled in Spain, guarding the boundary of the Christian civilizations of the Iberian peninsula.
Guarding it from what exactly
@@nirekin2760 From the christians i believe. There was a time when the entire iberian peninsula was muslim. Called Al-Andalus
@@SomewhatSwedishnot all of thepeninsula mate. They never reach Asturias, Cantabria and far beyond the high mountains
fun fact: Ser Arthyr Dayne was the one who knighted Jaime.
I love the hardwork Arthur dayne character put in for this scene.....real swordfight looks kinda awkward like this, there is never enough room to strike like in most movies...you rely on simple straight short and quick thrusts....and the way he handles the sword... 😍😍😍😍
Many fema experts broke down this fight and it is very unrealistic.
Maybe so I still appreciate the actor work in this scene especially if he had to learn to use two swords at once not to mention the time he put in for only a scene that wasn't more than 5min. Tip my hat to hard work
Those swords aren't meant to be dual wielded, and ned should probably use both hands to fight and deflect, instead of 1, and as a guy who has recently started learning swordfighting, it's not nearly awkward enough
No real swordsman goes twirly twirly, much less near opponents
@@nunooliveira1628 had they shown real sword fight, not many people would love it, people (majority) wants the twirl, the aggression, the fancy move
Not to mention the fact that while the rest of the group was busy with Dayne he quickly handled Ser Gerold Hightower, Lord Commander of the Kingsguard. Hightower was no slouch as he himself had quickly handled one of Ned's men a few seconds earlier. So we know that Ned was exceptionally good as a swordsman... just not as good as Dayne. We'll never know how Ned would've stacked up against Jaime. Neither man could hold a candle to Dayne, but how they compared to each other? That will forever remain a mystery.
Is that meant to be Hightower? I thought it was Oswell Whent
@@Mick0296 It has to have been Whent. The knight is way to young to be Gerold Hightower.
@@ulosttomedesigns518 Yeah it is Whent, they just left the Lord Commander out for some weird reason, they also left out the awesome dialogue Ned has with him.
@@uhtred7860it's recorded as Gerald Hightower in the show. however his actions and words reflect Oswell in the books. Really weird change made by the showrunners
While beating anyone on that Kingsguard is a real accomplishment, Ned was not up to fighting Jaime. Ned was a good swordsman and a hell of a soldier but Jaime was a true prodigy. Probably the only two people in the show that could have beaten a healthy and whole Jaime were Dayne and Selmy. Not only was Jaime just flat out better than Ned, he was also bigger, broader and faster.
Ser Arthur took up against 4 men at once, not one by one, all at once, only lost from an dishonorable death. Its safe to say he is the best swordsman ever
Dishonorable? Bullshit. The guy who killed him was one of the guys he faced. How is it dishonorable? Because he had to live while the rest must die? It was a fight to the death, man.
There were 3 Kingsguard there.
Ser Arthur, Ser Gerald, and Ser Oswell.
This isnt a bad depiction of how a real 4v1 would go down if the 1 was a superior skill to the 4, because coordinating an attack is a lot easier said than done, especially when the guy you're going up against is the most feared and renowned swordsman in the western world.
In the books it’s a 3 v 7
@@joshuawatts1924 But eventually its whittled down to Dayne versus most of Stark's men.
@@joritech357 the white bull was an old man so I guess it evens it out some
@@joritech357we don't know that I wouldn't be surprised if each kingsguard put down one at least
@@joshuawatts1924so was bariston and he still took down some good ones
All of Jaime’s cockiness around Ned is because he wants to fight someone who he thought was undefeatable. Lol if only he knew…
I mean, Ned wasn’t the type to boast about his accolades that was what people assumed that he was the best since he “killed” one of the greatest swordsman
Ned still isn't a slouch regardless. He fought the other Kingsguard by himself and killed the knight solo. Then Ned held himself well against the greatest swordsman of Westeross.
@@yoshikami7625 It is worth mentioning that him singlehanded taking down a kings guard only happens in the tv show so far. Ned may have not been a slouch but he wasn’t top tier either. The man didn’t practice as regularly as someone like Jaime, didn’t participate in much fighting in the wars, and doesn’t do tourneys. My entire point is that the reason Jaime is interested in Ned has entirely to do with rumors and stories, and not the man himself. If you think of Ned and Jaime’s early interactions, it’s pretty clear Jaime is talking to the slayer of Arthur Dane, not Ned stark.
@@albdamned577 the tv show is done from start to finish even if the ending sucks ass. I respect that we still want to discuss the books but the books are far and away from getting completed. Besides, there's a good chance that Martin might want to dance in the same tune as the show. My point is that the books aren't worth discussing on the matter as of now.
@@yoshikami7625 lol then your point irrelevant to my point, which related to Jaime’s interest in Ned. In the show (apparently the only thing that matters lol), Jaime challenged Ned a couple of times and Ned politely (and somewhat confusingly) refused. Everything from the OP still makes sense there, and all my reasonings hold up except for what will likely be an action scene meant to play up Arthur’s importance in 5 seconds (instead of multiple pages of a book). But yep go ahead and think that is more important than the books, just do it elsewhere.
I see Arthur Dayne studied in the Geralt of Rivia school of twirling your swords around to scare your enemies.
The fight wasn’t really that good, but Arthur Dayne’s intro and lead up to the fight was perfect. The actors are brilliant
Love how you can see in Neds face when it comes down to just him and Dayne that he's thinking "Fuck, I'm about to get sliced the fuck up here.." 🤣
Arthur Dayne: "I wish you good fortune in the shows to come. And now it begins."
Ned: "No. Now it ends."
Wish they did more flashback scenes like seeing Robert and Rhaeger fight. Massive missed opportunity.
Should be a whole series, would have been so cool
This is like in Assassins Creed, one attack at a time
And he got assassinated just like AC
LMAO 🤣
Robert’s Rebellion is definitely deserving of a prequel series once House of the Dragon wraps up.
and until its proven otherwise in the books, i really dont see these THREE kingsguard losing to the 7 that came there
I love it when Dayne is surrounded by 4 men and very conveniently only 2 attack at any given time lol. There’s a whole 10 seconds Dayne is pushing 2 guys back and there’s just a dude staring at his back
We needed more of sir arthur dayne
We did
If you are facing someone with two weapons and you only have one, fight at maximum range. The dual wielder must stand more square to use both weapons at once. If you are the single wielder, take a narrow elongated stance and manage the distance so only the opponent's front weapon is in range
That wont work if the dual wielder footwork is faster than yours and are able to close their distance, rather take advantage of the strength difference you have with two hand on your sword and try disarm/redirect/pin his sword down. Causing him to briefly exposed/out of balance.
If Ned had any sense, he would have arrived with a couple of crossbow men and finished it clinically when it was obviously going to kick off. All he did was get his buddies killed. Honour is for the dead.
Why is Bran Stark so butthurt that Daddy Ned's henchman stabbed the Sword of the Morning in the back?! A win is a win son...
“I wish you good fortune in the wars to come” colddddddd
never get bored of watching this scene
Sometimes you want to hear stories about great kings and emperors, but there is an allure to the warriors and guardsmen who defend, and are bound to their oath and word. It's giving me the same vibes as Dune when Duncan Idaho battles the Sardaukar.
This actor is 100% convincing as a young Sean Bean. He did a great job.
well, he lasted as long as he did against arthur dayne in his prime, thats more than enough recognition to ned's skills.
History could have been different is Rhaegar had kept his best knight at his side. I doubt Robert’s brute strength could have beat Arthur Dayne’s skill
Awesome scene. Arthur Dayne is the greates of all time. We need a spinoff.
Smh cant believe D&D cut Howland’s Valyrian steel shotgun
The most unrealistic part was where a number of minor and major lords were sent in a small party to enemy held lands with no military force to confront some of the greatest knights ever known in a defensive location with a unknown force of their own. Granted it was 2 knights but 10 basic infantry would of had them buggered and roberts closest ally and warden of the north dead.
Dumb and dumber
Don't think they expected two knights of such calibre protecting there.
Most realistic answer is that they did not expect any resistance and also that this was really delicate matter.
You also have to remember that Ned did not know in what condition his sister was so he just wanted to get there as soon as possible which requires small force.
If this expedition had been planned by a proper strategist with proper scouting information, you would be right. But the reality of this scene is that man desperate to find his kidnapped sister decided to travel as fast as he could with a a handful of trusted friends to find her, and discovered that the skeleton crew guarding the tower were actually elite knights.
There are many things historically inaccurate about GoT (even ignoring the magic), but the way that smart but flawed people make mistakes due to emotions and limited information is not one of them. This sort of shit happened all the time.
Yeah just imagine a single bowman on top of the tower... Whoops, there go the lords of several houses!
Shout out to Howland Reed for keeping the secrets of that day a secret.
2:36
Ned: give up you’re outnumbered
Arthur: yes and you are clearly outmatched
Everyone says about Arthur Dayne But i also see Ned Stark who defeated Ser Garold Hightower The White Bull Lord Commander of kingsguard in a single combat
Who has a better story than bran the broken 🤣🤣
Literally anyone else
Lmao 🤣
despite the continuity error, this is one of Game of Thrones's best scenes.
He puts a sword in the ground at 1:05 and at 1:58 seems to draw that same sword from its sheath (double draw).
Maybe I'm missing something.
Ser Arthur is one of the coolest characters in the show even if you only see him doing his thing for one scene
Benching Arthur Dayne, Gerold Hightower and a third Kingsguard during the war was one of the worst decision the Targaryens made
ned talks about jaime stabbing aerys in the back but had no problem when the person being stabbed was arthur dayne
the point is Ned would never do it or look favorably upon it while jamie would 10 times out of 10.
Ned wasn't sworn to protect Arthur Dayne
@@haydeng3541 the mad king was supposed to be the protector of the realm, he broke his vow long before jaime broke his
@@matheussantiago4572 I don't think any viewers/readers disagree that Jaimie did the right thing. My point still stands. There is a big difference between the circumstances of how an enemy is killed on the battlefield, and killing the king you are sworn to protect. Ned had very consistent principles, for better or worse
well jaime was a sworn protector of the king, the guy who stabbed dayne was literally stabbed by dayne a few seconds earlier
I looked for you on the Trident,” Ned said to them.
“We were not there,” Ser Gerold answered.
“Woe to the Usurper if we had been,” said Ser Oswell.
“When King's Landing fell, Ser Jaime slew your king with a golden sword, and I wondered where you were.”
“Far away,” Ser Gerold said, “or Aerys would yet sit the Iron Throne, and our false brother would burn in seven hells.”
“I came down on Storm's End to lift the siege,” Ned told them, and the Lords Tyrell and Redwyne dipped their banners, and all their knights bent the knee to pledge us fealty. I was certain you would be among them.”
“Our knees do not bend easily,” said Ser Arthur Dayne.
“Ser Willem Darry is fled to Dragonstone, with your queen and Prince Viserys. I thought you might have sailed with him.”
“Ser Willem is a good man and true,” said Ser Oswell.
“But not of the Kingsguard,” Ser Gerold pointed out. “The Kingsguard does not flee.”
“Then or now,” said Ser Arthur. He donned his helm.
“We swore a vow,” explained old Ser Gerold.
Ned’s wraiths moved up beside him, with shadow swords in hand. They were seven against three.
“And now it begins,” said Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning. He unsheathed Dawn and held it with both hands. The blade was pale as milkglass, alive with light.
“No,” Ned said with sadness in his voice. “Now it ends.”
As they came together in a rush of steel and shadow, he could hear Lyanna screaming. "Eddard!" she called. A storm of rose petals blew across a blood-streaked sky, as blue as the eyes of death.
It's almost seems as if Arthur knew he was going to die when he said "i wish you good fortune in the wars to come."
I mean yeah, but he could have been saying that because he knew there were going to be casualties on both sides.
Well, this has to be the dumbest way two Kingsguard have ever died. The war was over and there was no way Ned would ever harm Lyanna. Also, Ned has already earned himself the reputation of being very honourable, so Dayne could have played up to that. Such a dumb way for probably the best warrior in Westeros to die.
It’s always an honor to watch Max Von Sydow. Played Jesus and the Devil and was convincing as each.
Obviously ser Arthur dayne was the greatest there ever was no doubt but let’s appreciate Ned’s skill in his prime, we didn’t get to see to much of Ned fighting throughout the game of thrones series for the obvious reasons. But here he easily killed Gerald Hightower the lord commander of the kingsguard with little effort and he was able to hold his own against ser Arthur dayne being fast not only with his offense but with his defense dodging ser Arthur attacks and using his arm bracers to protect himself. Ned was a great warrior and I wish we got see more of it
Wait, was that Gerold ? Are we sure it wasn't Oswell ? Cuz in the books it was Oswell that was sharpening his sword and said the line about the usurper
This guy absolutely nailed the portrayal of a young Sean Bean. The way he says, "No. Now it ends," could be the final o2 advert.
I agree, brilliant casting and performace. He even fights and sounds like Ned.
Man just casually 1v4 only to get stabbed in the back , it ain't right man
Honourable men, more often than not, do not live long enough to share their victories. Those that do never share their own stories.
We NEVER get to see Ned Stark wield Ice and we never got to see The Sword of The Morning wield his family's sword. Absolutely insane how the people that worked on this show absolutely not care about the IP. Imagine if Aragorn NEVER wielded Narsil//Anduril in the movies? Imagine if they left out Glamdring and Sting? So crazy.
Ned cut off the deserter from the wall's head with Ice in the very first episode.
@@johnsmith9716 lol. OKAY, totally missed that first episode thanks dude.
I don't think it would have been particularly practical to attempt to introduce the special sword of a side character who only appears in a five minute flashback scene - the average viewer has enough to keep straight as it is. Andúril is important to the plot because it represents Aragorn's claim to the throne, and he uses it to goad Sauron in the palantír. Sting alerts Frodo to the presence of orcs, and connects his legacy to Bilbo and Gollum. Gandalfs sword is never explained to be Glamdring in any of the Lord of the rings films despite being a main character in all three - I think it's more than justified to skip over the sword lore for a tiny bit player
@@Umbrellagasm I'm talking about including a prop that would have lead to people going down the inevitable "what is that rabbit hole' or at least throwing die hard fans a bone. Just two props
@@DillsyYourDaddy67 I agree that it is a very cool sword, and makes for a great wiki entry, but unfortunately does not tie in any significant way to the plot as we know it (whatever secret half formed ideas GRRM has turning around in his brain unfortunately do not exist on the page). If it had been portrayed as a luminous +5 vorpal greatsword, I think it would have just confused and misdirected the audience in a scene that really needed to be about arguably the most significant reveal in the entire series.
"Best swordsman" stabs the tip of his sword mainly meant for stabbing into the dry, rocky ground before a fight. Showrunners dropped the ball.
Bran seeming disappointed in how it turned out. Theres no real honor in fighting to survive. You do what you have to. Bron has figured that out. At least Reed had as well. Saved Ned's life.
Needed more dual wielders in this show.
Problem is dual weirding is very difficult
No
After watching this, can't shake the feeling that Jaime Lannister was underutilised
Lmao no. It’s very silly nobody would ever dual wield two long swords
Arthur Dayne wasn't even supposed to dual wield, Dawn was a greatsword meant to be wielded with two hands.