I found a PSS-470 for sale at a yard sale today for 20 bucks. I saw it and couldnt remember whether or not it was one of the keyboards you had talked about, but I bought it and its awesome. All of this old technology is so interesting.
I still have my old PSS-580. I used to use it with my Atari STFM to try to produce music (I was not, am still not very good at it!) but my fondest memories was having games like Leisure Suit Larry use MIDI out to produce much better sounding game music through my Yamaha keyboard :)
Wowsers, I have a PSS-570 and PSS-270 sitting beside me as I watch this. They were my first two keyboards from back in the 80's when I was learning to play.
These keyboards sound great. So much better than the sample-based Casios I grew up with in the 90s. I would love something like this with a Commodore 64 SID chip in it. I converted an old Casio keyboard into a MIDI keyboard with a breadboard and a Teensy, and I have a SID chip lying around. I might just have to try and make that happen.
+jordanzish That would be cool. It should be possible to do using Arduino or something like that to substitute as a brain for the keyboard. You could turn any keyboard into a SID station.
3:13 "I also wanna show you that it definitely has nine voices. It's actually kind of hard to do, but ill hold down nine keys." *plays nine keys with 5 fingers when he has 10 fingers*
I think it's more fair to say modern PCs still support the general MIDI standard rather than Yamaha FM synth chips specifically. Sound Blaster cards only included Yamaha's FM synth chips through the Sound Blaster 16 days. Starting with the AWE32, Creative Labs dumped Yamaha's chips in favor of the e-Mu line of MIDI synthesizers/DSPs. They kept support for Yamaha FM synth in their cards only until DOS gaming was dead & gone, and that level of hardware backwards-compatibility was no longer needed. These days, Windows provides MIDI playback via a rather crappy software-based wavetable synthesizer.
What an outstanding piece of research you have done here... This is what youtube should stand for! And you are quite capable musician too... It would be cool to see the capabilities of this platforms with a little composition These have been 10 minutes well spent... Greetings form Colombia!!
Fun facts for you: 64-bit Windows computers can't emulate DOS games, so sound chip emulators for those aren't bundled with those 64-bit editions. You'll need something else, like DOSBox. On a side note, many versions of Windows, both 64 and 32-bit, emulate a GS Wavetable Synthesizer, with samples from Roland's Sound Canvas GM/GS Sound Set from 1996, for when you ask your music player app to play a MIDI file. These samples were licensed to Microsoft and are bundled with Windows to this day.
Also, since Windows Vista, new models for graphics controllers were made, WDDM controllers. These can't jump into text mode or send DOS graphics data. So proper DOS emulation was broken in the newest editions of Windows.
Doddo MultiGamer One word: *EMULATION.* Windows x64 itself may not be able to run DOS games due to a processor layer being unavailable, but if the processor itself is told to run 32-bit Windows or 16-bit DOS, that layer will be emulated and run just fine! DOSBox emulates this layer too, all the time. That's why it can run on a 64-bit Windows PC too. As for exactly what that layer... instruction thing is... I don't remember. Windows WDDM controllers may be unable to jump to text mode, but your computer's BIOS or EFI CSM module are still capable of it. But in EFI machines, their CSM module is also an emulator. EFI PCs have another set of protocols for console text and graphics display. In other words: GODDAMIT MS EMULATE THAT SUBSYSTEM ALREADY AND GIMME MY DOS APPS BACK!! If WDDM controllers can't run in text mode, then don't. Just pop a window in fullscreen exclusive mode (the kind videogames use) and emulate textmode instead of trying to pipe it to the system directly. That's what DOSBox does, and it works.
WDDM is merely a Windows interface to the graphics driver, it says nothing about capabilities of the hardware. It was intoduced in Windows Vista, where some things like GDI acceleration and text mode were no longer needed and thus are no longer accessible from within Windows. But other operating systems, Linux, older versions of Windows, etc., can still support text mode, it's not gone from the hardware. Other peculiarity is that once a x86-64 processor has been reinitialized in long mode (64-bit support), vm86 mode is no longer available by spec. Vm86 is the mode that allows a protected-mode program to span a real-mode compatible environment inside of itself. DOS support in Windows 2000, XP was completely based around vm86 mode. So it made sense for Microsoft to start removing things that were needed for vm86 support. I don't know why Microsoft should concern themselves with emulation of older subsystems necessary for DOS games? They were never particularly thorough at that, in theory third parties can do a better job. But it's not a very commercially viable field, so that limits the effort put into that.
Cool. I love FM synthesis. Yamaha developed many FM sound chips throughout the 80s and 90s. Pretty much anything you heard was yamaha until the later half of the 90s when sample based sound was becoming common. Yamaha changed the world with its professional keyboard DX-7 in 1983.
Not quite, the market was pretty full of choice but yep FM was the 80's sound of choice, although I stuck with my Yammy Analogue synth for depth FM didn't have. There was a distinct difference between the big hitters in the 80's - I could hear whether a band used Yamaha, Roland, Korg & Casio etc. But really the kings of FM in the 80s imo was Roland; you can't beat a Juno ;)
2:18 "It's a Sound Blaster with keys!" Funny because the AdLib and Sound Blaster were basically Yamaha DX-series synths _without_ keys. (Well, stripped-down DX series synths.)
I've never understood how Yamaha's FM synthesis took over the synth universe in the 80s. It was terribly difficult to program, and when you did, it sounded rubbish. All that tinkly bonk 80s stereotype comes from the DX series (to oversimplify a bit). Thank God analogue (at least soundwise, if digitally emulated) made a comeback when everybody sobered up from the DX-7 party. I really don't understand how anyone could like the sounds the DXes produced.
Well yes, but "outlandish" doesn't get used much in music. All the DX stuff sounded terribly thin, which is why nobody but the retro community use it any more. It just felt at the time, for me, like synthesizer music "died" when the DX7 came out, and didn't rise from the grave again until the rave community got hold of the TB303, heh. People had stopped using synths as a unique instrument. Why bother when you can just pull out the same 5 presets over and over again? I love the sound of a real Fender Rhodes. But that DX7 monstrosity of a patch brings me out in hives.
I got a PSS 570 for my birthday in 1986. I loved it and made hours of cassette tapes of recording music with it. I thought I recognised the similarity between the FM sounds of the soundblaster cards in the early 90s and my old keyboard!!
I found a PSS 470 at a thrift store a few years ago. 20 bucks in the box, adapter included. I had no idea about the history of it's sounds! Such a cool little synthesizer.
My first keyboard ever was the Yamaha PSR-16 that uses the YM3420AD and YM3420BF chipset. It also has the "digital synthesizer" FM operator controls, which I loved as a kid.
I saw this video of a live performance from 1987, where the (extremely skilled) keyboardist was able to rock his fingers side to side in order to produce a fluttering sound - similar to one you'd hear if you were to do the same on strings. It must have been an extremely advanced keyboard for its time, and it definitely was a nice performance. It seemed to have plenty of synths as well. It would be cool to identify.
Okay, in the last four hours you've not only convinced me to get back into game dev as a hobby, but also get a PSS-470 because that Ultima 4 intro was sick. I guess thanks; I've subbed and so have my friends. Great videos man! Annnnnd all your Futurama shirts kick ass.
In retrospect this video was so important in the lore of David's UA-cam content. It announced the launch of the much-loved "8-Bit Keys" channel #anewera #yuge
I found a Casio CTK-611. It had been sitting on the side of the road in the rain for 2 weeks. I finally stopped and picked it up. When I got home and let it dry out for about 2 weeks, I took the back off cleaned and oiled everything. Upgraded it with some 18650 batteries. It's not a bad keyboard. Has plenty of sounds with midi inputs.
The new 2020 google algorithm suggested I rewatch this. After 4 years you can see how much the production has improved with new videos but quality content is still the same. Glad to be a patreon and nice to have a reminder how much the production has improved!
Oh man, I’m so glad I didn’t grow up in the eras where soundcards were necessary. That would be awful! I’d be stuck with PC Speaker as I’m an idiot and wouldn’t know how to install a better card.
Hi @The 8-Bit Guy, the top of the range Yamaha home keyboard at the time was the PSR 36. It is a PSR 32 with the 470 sliders added back in, AND ALSO MIDI!
I still have my Yamaha PSS 470 around and keep it for my nephew to learn playing. I admit I had a fun go at it recently. But I didn’t know that it was basically a sound blaster with keys. Thank you for the info Mr 8bit guy
+SilverShrimp TX I don't consider myself a concert pianist, I'm more a synthesizer guy... been playing [practicing] for years and make beats, too. Concert pianists are too structured in my opinion, people expect perfection in that area of music, don't get me wrong when I say I love classical music, I'd listen to ANYTHING.... I don't like to read sheet music.
+Raptor I'm aware of that channel, I meant review a vintage synthesizer marketed as a professional instrument instead of a kids toy. like a Juno 106 or something
I have a PSS-470(partly bent) and a PSS-570 in the box. I initally thought a 570 was a "470 with all the bits in" but I quickly realized they were wired totally different in spite of looking much the same! I like them-the colored panel really stands out!
Thanks to this video, I got my own! Now I love my PSS-570 soundblaster keyboard :) It is difficult to exactly match the sounds I remember from my favorite DOS game Soundblaster soundtracks though.
@@Geo-wc7jc You get some very cool glitchy sounds with some of the presets when you quickly slide the Attack/Decay and other vertical faders up and down. It would be cool to see if a rotary controller would expand this effect at all.
Holy crap I had a PSS460, got it for Christmas that year! I loved it, used it in a teenage band with some spliced 1/4 inch cables to run through a Crate G60 amp with a Celestion speaker. A year later I ended up buying an Ensoniq ESQ1 and retired it. I had a lot of fun with that 460. For what it was, it sounded pretty decent, especially being able to mildly tweak the sounds with the sliders. Thanks for the video and trip down memory lane!
Oddly enough, the SNES was actually using more "modern" PCM music, the Genesis would be a closer comparison as it used FM synthesis and a very similar chip to the YM3812 (specifically, the YM2612)
Also it would be the PC-98 that actually used the YM2608 most commonly known as OPNA, and that chip is basically the so-called "complete version of the 2612 that the Genesis/MD uses :3
Music from the Sound Blaster board will always hold a special place in my heart. I remember playing those old DOS games with my brothers when I was a kid...
Ahh... that 8-bit keyboard sounds is hitting me right at my nostalgia hahaha. The only keyboard I ever played was an actual virtual keyboard that came with my old "Soundblaster Live! Value" soundcard software, it was a good piece of software, it allowed you to do a lot all sort of things. The good old days when MIDI music was the rage!!
Very nice video! I also loved the one you made explaining the synth sound on each one of the consoles and old computers. It is really illustrative to learn how to compose that kind of music from the bases.
Bit disappointed there's no actual Sound Blaster involved. And technically I think the chip would be more accurately called an Adlib chip, since the SB contained it for Adlib compatibility. As well as a way of having synth sounds. The Adlib was an earlier "standard" as much as there was one back then, still most PCs didn't have sound cards at all til the early 90s. I remember playing Doom with my SB16. Doom is 50% of the reason I bought a PC, and that's true for a lot of people. It had the same chip, I think, or a compatible one. Nowadays sound is all synthesised on your CPU, the PC's built-in sound chip is just a DAC, it can only play back samples, generated on the fly in software. Some more expensive cards have DSPs to generate those, cheap or built-in ones use the CPU. Still nice to see some of the cool old keyboards though. I managed to find the old demo tune from my old Casio keyboard and used it for a ringtone. Wake Me Up Before You Go-Go! Used nearly every instrument the little keyboard could do, and there were like a hundred!
in yer phase out char null gen timex root no swing quiz 0 THE way stars bluey stage com pass map 8bit mug off yankee slap kuddy toy chap iff tree hang hitlaa key C black white racey car boo tup shop clised wits food eh?
07:17 just a fun fact, the synth used by Van Halen on "Jump" was the Oberheim OB-X, which was analog. Still, sounds fine if a little tinny on this Soundblaster chip.
Great video! Space Quest 3 and Ultima 6 were some of my favorite games to play as a kid, so I highly approve of the example songs. =] I have a few comments: At 8:10, you mention all voices on the YM2413 / OPLL have to use the same instrument, but that's not actually true. It's just that you can only define one instrument. Each channel can play that instrument or one of 15 other instruments that are not definable. The other instruments are generic stuff like "Trumpet" or "Vibraphone", and on keyboards that contain a YM2413 (I believe the PSR-6 has one?), the instrument chooser doesn't have to do any real "logic" to choose an instrument. A button can just send "switch to instrument 7" or whatever. For reference, here's a track that uses a YM2413: inversephase.bandcamp.com/track/token-ringfinger Anyone mentioning they have a different keyboard with potentially a different chip that "sounds the same" might be interested in knowing that they're probably still Yamaha keyboards with Yamaha OP-series chips, which means they're still built around FM. The underlying process with building music with FM is mostly the same regardless of the chip, which is why. Lastly, as for "having a keyboard with a Soundblaster in it"....you know that the gameport (that 15-pin thing) can double as a MIDI port, right? So you can connect any dumb MIDI controller with no output of its own to that and "play the soundblaster" if you like. Extra bonus, if you have some outboard gear like a Roland MT-32, you can use that soundcard selection to send music data from the same port.
i love old tech and keyboards is one of them love how you record keyboards at high quality really shows how great thay still sound after all them years now you are making me want Soundblaster now :)
I had that same keyboard he introduces at 1:44. My parents probably have it in their attic somewhere. I did notice my keyboard sounded a lot like some of the computer games I had, and now I know why.
@@guts2048 Next time I talk to my mom I'll ask her if she has it somewhere. I know she's held onto a lot of my childhood stuff so I wouldn't be surprised.
Psuado Nym Ye. I bough a like 2000$ dollar pentium 75 mhz pc. It didnt had a soundcard NOR a cd-rom. So I had to buy that later and it was my first time installing it in my pc. I was so scared to break something haha. It took me maybe 4 hours to install a card in its isa/pci slot lol. ( now its takes me like 5 sec ofcourse) AH good old days.
Psuado Nym I remember doing the same to play Doom. First PC upgrade was for a 486 SX 25, 4meg to 12meg RAM as well as the Sound Blaster. Having to manually set jumpers for the port and irq, wow, times have changed.
That reminds me of a story. A friends dad had 4 Mb ram and I had 1 mb ram total. So we couldn't play doom. My friend advised to switched my ram with his dad so we could play sneaky. What a hell that was. Those fast page ram/edo ram was anoyingly stuck. Took us hours and pain in our finger nails ( on the first try haha)
Keyboards that use square wave tone generators can also sound very similar to 1980s computer sound chips, such as the C64, Tandy 1000/IBM PCjr, ColecoVision, Atari ST, etc.: ua-cam.com/video/_TkYTt6AYr4/v-deo.html
I'm not musically talented, I don't even find keyboards interesting - but for some reason i find your videos really interesting and entertaining. I think it's your presentation style that keeps me engaged. Love your other channel too - keep up the good work!
The PSS-470 was my first keyboard, got it for xmas back in '86 and still have it. Also managed to pick up a PSS-460 on the way too, pretty much the same thing.
the extreme closeup of your face makes me a bit uncomfortable since it is literally life sized on my 34" UltraWide screen:) Move back a bit guy! P.S. Still glad i found your channel since i also appreciate and interested in old computer tech. Wish you had more videos though - keep up a good work!
The PSS-460 without those hideous orange, green and violet buttons, was my first keyboard, then I upgraded to the PSS-560 with PCM drums. Got me to program serious FM sounds on my DX100 and DX11. Really inspired me to delve deep into FM!
I love that you feature the Ultima games....First game i ever purchased was ultima 3 and they were a highlight of my computer life growing up. Thanks for the memories.
as spy to sink1 bi pass hiz store 'e'[realutues]av encrypted cipher steams ling scrambled rotors keyed screamer zombie giv opz2non notty az 123 mugs fings az aloha bet geass hiss sez but byte bool2war spec abstract mal level alex unknown slang new killer vites fir homo quil meglo buikd a bill grope bark no moss buy key rye ed4 quanta chaotic outward bounds red biro ghost writes 'reasons'if yer 'read'buy 'whoke book'of suzuki art of zen motorcycles where 'all media'enigma 'reproduced mass medias'singkung synchro shit iff if any kooky look primal nonexistances az cant attempt too know mass tech directky relating exactly thy entire whole oublushed wirks an build udols too scream nit a that kill its these actir impersonate soy rig osyco cabinets act2calm you4vat farm mill you2ace1&CLAIM cooywrite,authority isnt a tune,sound,or note,hard china hym awe lazers!YAM
Boy, I didn’t realise how many memories this video would bring back. We used to have the Yamaha keyboards at my high school. If you asked nicely they’d let you take one home to practice on #happytimes
What video cards (even in 2015) are still emulating CGA / EGA modes for compatibility? I don't think the pixel clock goes low enough to drive those signals...
sbc,besides,mac,raspi...billions of mainframe terminal busses of supercomp data centers,stalleites round mars, trains,busses,kiosks,etc etc,puggy cell,eh...yes pixel yuh say
This is great information 8-Bit Guy. One day I'll track down the right keyboard with the mentioned sound blaster chip so that I have the tools to create the original sounds.
A bit off-topic, but are you the Liberty Basic/FreeBasic guy? If you are, I've been using FreeBasic for some years, just for various small hobby projects, and i think it's great.
oh yes, sorry, i got my wires crossed, i DID actually mean JustBasic. I hope i didn't offend you, i certainly didn't mean to. One of my projects was an emulator for the Texas Instruments TI Programmable 57, which progressed quite nicely until i started on the calculating engine, at which point i realised that i didn't have enough information about the inner workings of the calculator chip. Oh well, it was fun while it lasted, and hopefully one day i'll be able to continue :) Thanks for your reply, and greetings from Denmark.
Lovely video. Back in the 80's, I owned a Yamaha keyboard with a custom made flightcase. It was from the Yamaha PSS series. Also had a Casio with built-in sampler which was great fun to mess and play around with friends!
@ The iBookGuy The Yamaha PSS-360, PSS-370, VSS-30, VSS-100, and VSS-200 seem to be based on the Yamaha YM-3812, because they are based on similar FM synthesis.
+Cheryl Matthiesen It's possible. I can't find any information on them that definitely answers that question. I think somebody would have to attain one and disassemble it to be sure. Lots of Yamaha keyboards used FM synthesis, but not all of them used the YM-3812.
just in case anyone here is interested in circuit bending or modding: The Yamaha YM chips found in these keyboards have an 8-bit parallel data bus that runs to other chips on the PCB. One really effective modification is to cut the circuit traces on the PCB and install switches to allow you turn off each line in the data bus. Or if you really want to get nuts, you can cut all 8 traces and install a socket/jack to each side of each cut trace (total of 16 jacks) and then freely scramble the 8 data lines however you want. I did this to a PSS-170 and it's wicked! It gets pretty gnarly sometimes, but often results in very playable and pleasant alien timbres. If you're interested in trying it on your YM-chipped Yamaha keyboard, just look for the data sheet for your particular YM chip and find the pin-outs for the 8 data lines.
I found a PSS-470 for sale at a yard sale today for 20 bucks. I saw it and couldnt remember whether or not it was one of the keyboards you had talked about, but I bought it and its awesome. All of this old technology is so interesting.
+collin m Great deal! I had to pay 3 times that much for mine and the PSS-470 is my favorite of all of my keyboards.
I just found one at my local thrift store for $9.99 and I couldn't convince my mom to buy it for me... so sad :(
+Caudex I know what you mean.
I still have my old PSS-580. I used to use it with my Atari STFM to try to produce music (I was not, am still not very good at it!) but my fondest memories was having games like Leisure Suit Larry use MIDI out to produce much better sounding game music through my Yamaha keyboard :)
I have Fruity DX10... is that good enough? xD
This inspired 9yo me to get a PSS-470 for ~$50, and years later I still love it :D
Love this channel. The nostalgia trip is heart warming. Amazing how technology has come a long way , still these devices are very useful.
Wowsers, I have a PSS-570 and PSS-270 sitting beside me as I watch this. They were my first two keyboards from back in the 80's when I was learning to play.
These keyboards sound great. So much better than the sample-based Casios I grew up with in the 90s. I would love something like this with a Commodore 64 SID chip in it. I converted an old Casio keyboard into a MIDI keyboard with a breadboard and a Teensy, and I have a SID chip lying around. I might just have to try and make that happen.
+jordanzish That would be cool. It should be possible to do using Arduino or something like that to substitute as a brain for the keyboard. You could turn any keyboard into a SID station.
3:13 "I also wanna show you that it definitely has nine voices. It's actually kind of hard to do, but ill hold down nine keys."
*plays nine keys with 5 fingers when he has 10 fingers*
nigh en nine -mozart
What a chad
With a mini-sized keyboard, assigning 1 white key (played side-by-side) for each finger is quite a challenge.
Waaaaa
LMAO
I think it's more fair to say modern PCs still support the general MIDI standard rather than Yamaha FM synth chips specifically. Sound Blaster cards only included Yamaha's FM synth chips through the Sound Blaster 16 days. Starting with the AWE32, Creative Labs dumped Yamaha's chips in favor of the e-Mu line of MIDI synthesizers/DSPs. They kept support for Yamaha FM synth in their cards only until DOS gaming was dead & gone, and that level of hardware backwards-compatibility was no longer needed. These days, Windows provides MIDI playback via a rather crappy software-based wavetable synthesizer.
As a child born in the 70’s, that grew up in the 80’s and 90’s, I absolutely love your channel 👍
What an outstanding piece of research you have done here... This is what youtube should stand for!
And you are quite capable musician too... It would be cool to see the capabilities of this platforms with a little composition
These have been 10 minutes well spent... Greetings form Colombia!!
Fun facts for you: 64-bit Windows computers can't emulate DOS games, so sound chip emulators for those aren't bundled with those 64-bit editions. You'll need something else, like DOSBox. On a side note, many versions of Windows, both 64 and 32-bit, emulate a GS Wavetable Synthesizer, with samples from Roland's Sound Canvas GM/GS Sound Set from 1996, for when you ask your music player app to play a MIDI file. These samples were licensed to Microsoft and are bundled with Windows to this day.
Also, since Windows Vista, new models for graphics controllers were made, WDDM controllers. These can't jump into text mode or send DOS graphics data. So proper DOS emulation was broken in the newest editions of Windows.
Doddo MultiGamer One word: *EMULATION.*
Windows x64 itself may not be able to run DOS games due to a processor layer being unavailable, but if the processor itself is told to run 32-bit Windows or 16-bit DOS, that layer will be emulated and run just fine!
DOSBox emulates this layer too, all the time. That's why it can run on a 64-bit Windows PC too.
As for exactly what that layer... instruction thing is... I don't remember.
Windows WDDM controllers may be unable to jump to text mode, but your computer's BIOS or EFI CSM module are still capable of it. But in EFI machines, their CSM module is also an emulator. EFI PCs have another set of protocols for console text and graphics display.
In other words: GODDAMIT MS EMULATE THAT SUBSYSTEM ALREADY AND GIMME MY DOS APPS BACK!!
If WDDM controllers can't run in text mode, then don't. Just pop a window in fullscreen exclusive mode (the kind videogames use) and emulate textmode instead of trying to pipe it to the system directly. That's what DOSBox does, and it works.
WDDM is merely a Windows interface to the graphics driver, it says nothing about capabilities of the hardware. It was intoduced in Windows Vista, where some things like GDI acceleration and text mode were no longer needed and thus are no longer accessible from within Windows. But other operating systems, Linux, older versions of Windows, etc., can still support text mode, it's not gone from the hardware.
Other peculiarity is that once a x86-64 processor has been reinitialized in long mode (64-bit support), vm86 mode is no longer available by spec. Vm86 is the mode that allows a protected-mode program to span a real-mode compatible environment inside of itself. DOS support in Windows 2000, XP was completely based around vm86 mode. So it made sense for Microsoft to start removing things that were needed for vm86 support.
I don't know why Microsoft should concern themselves with emulation of older subsystems necessary for DOS games? They were never particularly thorough at that, in theory third parties can do a better job. But it's not a very commercially viable field, so that limits the effort put into that.
Why the Global Defense Initiative will have an Acceleration and Text Mode? Man that is why NOD kicks it ass all the time.
You could just build a retro PC and use it for DOS. Parts are fairly cheap.
Cool. I love FM synthesis. Yamaha developed many FM sound chips throughout the 80s and 90s. Pretty much anything you heard was yamaha until the later half of the 90s when sample based sound was becoming common. Yamaha changed the world with its professional keyboard DX-7 in 1983.
Ryan Hurshman
I used to own a DX7. Classic sounds.
Ryan Hurshman impossible to program. TERRIBLE interface.
Not quite, the market was pretty full of choice but yep FM was the 80's sound of choice, although I stuck with my Yammy Analogue synth for depth FM didn't have. There was a distinct difference between the big hitters in the 80's - I could hear whether a band used Yamaha, Roland, Korg & Casio etc. But really the kings of FM in the 80s imo was Roland; you can't beat a Juno ;)
I just bought one of these (PSS-470) for $60 after watching your video. Super cool addition to my gear!
2:18 "It's a Sound Blaster with keys!"
Funny because the AdLib and Sound Blaster were basically Yamaha DX-series synths _without_ keys. (Well, stripped-down DX series synths.)
tohopes true
Than you could say, that those keyboards were basically DX-series synths rebranded to PS-series? :)
I've never understood how Yamaha's FM synthesis took over the synth universe in the 80s. It was terribly difficult to program, and when you did, it sounded rubbish. All that tinkly bonk 80s stereotype comes from the DX series (to oversimplify a bit). Thank God analogue (at least soundwise, if digitally emulated) made a comeback when everybody sobered up from the DX-7 party. I really don't understand how anyone could like the sounds the DXes produced.
Well yes, but "outlandish" doesn't get used much in music. All the DX stuff sounded terribly thin, which is why nobody but the retro community use it any more. It just felt at the time, for me, like synthesizer music "died" when the DX7 came out, and didn't rise from the grave again until the rave community got hold of the TB303, heh. People had stopped using synths as a unique instrument. Why bother when you can just pull out the same 5 presets over and over again?
I love the sound of a real Fender Rhodes. But that DX7 monstrosity of a patch brings me out in hives.
That's like, your opinion man.
I can't believe it, but I found a PSR-11 at a Goodwill thrift store...with the green half-off sticker
I got a PSS 570 for my birthday in 1986. I loved it and made hours of cassette tapes of recording music with it. I thought I recognised the similarity between the FM sounds of the soundblaster cards in the early 90s and my old keyboard!!
I found a PSS 470 at a thrift store a few years ago. 20 bucks in the box, adapter included. I had no idea about the history of it's sounds! Such a cool little synthesizer.
That's a good find. The 470 gets quite a lot of love on YT.
So excited to hear the new music channel. This is just the material I would wish to produce. Looking forward to some create sounds from the past.
PSS-470 was my first keyboard as a kid, it was great for a beginner, had so much fun with that little keyboard
Oh my god, that Ultima 6 intro sounded so MAJESTIC on this keyboard .... so nostalgic. I am shedding a tear :)
Indeed! I was always impressed by that intro tune.
My first keyboard ever was the Yamaha PSR-16 that uses the YM3420AD and YM3420BF chipset. It also has the "digital synthesizer" FM operator controls, which I loved as a kid.
I saw this video of a live performance from 1987, where the (extremely skilled) keyboardist was able to rock his fingers side to side in order to produce a fluttering sound - similar to one you'd hear if you were to do the same on strings. It must have been an extremely advanced keyboard for its time, and it definitely was a nice performance. It seemed to have plenty of synths as well. It would be cool to identify.
Great video, thanks! I really appreciate the time and effort you've put into documenting these YM3812 devices.
Okay, in the last four hours you've not only convinced me to get back into game dev as a hobby, but also get a PSS-470 because that Ultima 4 intro was sick.
I guess thanks; I've subbed and so have my friends. Great videos man!
Annnnnd all your Futurama shirts kick ass.
Craig Grey same
In retrospect this video was so important in the lore of David's UA-cam content. It announced the launch of the much-loved "8-Bit Keys" channel #anewera #yuge
Those keyboards sound deliciously retro. If I could play I would definitely buy one just so I could recreate old-school video game music.
+APPLBL00M You can do that via software nowadays.... but I guess it doesn't "Sound" the same.
+TinchoX That pun was bad.
Blowtorch the Robot Lol!! Haha no it was not a pun but I just realized it made it sound that way xD.
+Elvis S Same. Sega Genesis-like music here I come! Also I think the YM2612 is a cost reduced version of the YM3812. Both even end in 12!
That depends on how accurate the YM FM emulation is.
I found a Casio CTK-611. It had been sitting on the side of the road in the rain for 2 weeks. I finally stopped and picked it up. When I got home and let it dry out for about 2 weeks, I took the back off cleaned and oiled everything. Upgraded it with some 18650 batteries. It's not a bad keyboard. Has plenty of sounds with midi inputs.
This and your other videos helped me to understand how the music from the games of my childhood worked. Thanks for all your hard work!
The new 2020 google algorithm suggested I rewatch this. After 4 years you can see how much the production has improved with new videos but quality content is still the same. Glad to be a patreon and nice to have a reminder how much the production has improved!
Oh man, I’m so glad I didn’t grow up in the eras where soundcards were necessary. That would be awful! I’d be stuck with PC Speaker as I’m an idiot and wouldn’t know how to install a better card.
Hi @The 8-Bit Guy, the top of the range Yamaha home keyboard at the time was the PSR 36. It is a PSR 32 with the 470 sliders added back in, AND ALSO MIDI!
The PSR-41 is actually one small step above the 36, adding a melody sequencer and a transpose function. Otherwise identical.
I had the Yamaha PSS-470 back in the day. Had no idea it was an FM synth. Guess it was a poor kid's DX7 :)
Gideon Waxfarb
Love that DX7
I still have my Yamaha PSS 470 around and keep it for my nephew to learn playing. I admit I had a fun go at it recently. But I didn’t know that it was basically a sound blaster with keys. Thank you for the info Mr 8bit guy
Hearing those sounds made me roll back my eyes with joy! I thought I'd never hear anything like that again!
As a fellow Pianist,..you sir,...are a very good piano player :)
Also, I live in HOUSTON....the best city in TEXAS!!!!
+SilverShrimp TX I don't consider myself a concert pianist, I'm more a synthesizer guy... been playing [practicing] for years and make beats, too.
Concert pianists are too structured in my opinion, people expect perfection in that area of music, don't get me wrong when I say I love classical music, I'd listen to ANYTHING.... I don't like to read sheet music.
Yep!
I live in 2010 texas avenue
@@Khyree_Holmes "I'd listen to ANYTHING" would you REALLY listen to Canon in D?!
I've decided yours is the best channel on youtube No matter the subject, you make it very interesting! Thank you for your efforts.
You should get out more.
Dude, you are great at playing the synthesizer !
I want him to review a fully fledged synthesizer at some point
+MrTrollinglol Go to his other channel! 8 - Bit Keys.
+Raptor I'm aware of that channel, I meant review a vintage synthesizer marketed as a professional instrument instead of a kids toy. like a Juno 106 or something
+MrTrollinglol Oh, I see. Sorry, I just misunderstood your comment.
If you can play the piano you can play anything with keys, lol
I have a PSS-470(partly bent) and a PSS-570 in the box. I initally thought a 570 was a "470 with all the bits in" but I quickly realized they were wired totally different in spite of looking much the same! I like them-the colored panel really stands out!
It's always worth watching your videos. Thanks!
Thanks to your video I bought a splendid PSS-560! Sounds, looks and feels terrific, thx 8-bit Guy! And kudos for the new channel, 8-bit Keys! ^^
Thanks to this video, I got my own! Now I love my PSS-570 soundblaster keyboard :)
It is difficult to exactly match the sounds I remember from my favorite DOS game Soundblaster soundtracks though.
I had a PSS-560 back in the day. May have to get another one! And I use a SoundBlaster ZxR today. Thamks for taking me back 😊
I totally remember the "Sound Blaster" sound card ! I still am using my late cousin's "Creative (Labs)" small speakers (for a laptop).
after seeing this video YEARS ago, I finally have one of these from ebay. it's so fun
BRING BACK THE FM SYNTH CHIPS
Knobs and sliders and switches, for us physical guys.
Has anyone been able to convert the sliders to rotary pots?
@@danalog76 you could probably just bypass the connections
@@Geo-wc7jc You get some very cool glitchy sounds with some of the presets when you quickly slide the Attack/Decay and other vertical faders up and down. It would be cool to see if a rotary controller would expand this effect at all.
@@BrunoidGames make a video of you using your mega drive as a keyboard. 👍
Holy crap I had a PSS460, got it for Christmas that year! I loved it, used it in a teenage band with some spliced 1/4 inch cables to run through a Crate G60 amp with a Celestion speaker. A year later I ended up buying an Ensoniq ESQ1 and retired it. I had a lot of fun with that 460. For what it was, it sounded pretty decent, especially being able to mildly tweak the sounds with the sliders. Thanks for the video and trip down memory lane!
Damn man...all this AND the Slurm tee? Instant sub!!!!
RIP Sim Wong Hoo, the father of Sound Blaster.
That "piano" music is so very SNES. That is the sound of a town in a 16-bit JRPG.
Oddly enough, the SNES was actually using more "modern" PCM music, the Genesis would be a closer comparison as it used FM synthesis and a very similar chip to the YM3812 (specifically, the YM2612)
Also it would be the PC-98 that actually used the YM2608 most commonly known as OPNA, and that chip is basically the so-called "complete version of the 2612 that the Genesis/MD uses :3
The SNES was soundfont-based fart sound.
Music from the Sound Blaster board will always hold a special place in my heart. I remember playing those old DOS games with my brothers when I was a kid...
Ahh... that 8-bit keyboard sounds is hitting me right at my nostalgia hahaha.
The only keyboard I ever played was an actual virtual keyboard that came with my old "Soundblaster Live! Value" soundcard software, it was a good piece of software, it allowed you to do a lot all sort of things.
The good old days when MIDI music was the rage!!
Very nice video! I also loved the one you made explaining the synth sound on each one of the consoles and old computers. It is really illustrative to learn how to compose that kind of music from the bases.
Wow the iBook Guy plays the piano!
NiceChord (好和弦) ！看舊片也能發現好和弦！
I guess he had not made 8-Bit Keys yet...
nvm I just read the discription
This aged well
@@kurotoro_official How?
Getting a PSS-570 tonight ! Excited. This is perfect for old school pc / console music.
glad you can still get the YM3812 chips on ebay! for cheap too. I will definitely do some projects with them
Arent those the same ( or similar) to the ones found in the sega genesis?
Awesome video man!!! Really brings me back!
Bit disappointed there's no actual Sound Blaster involved. And technically I think the chip would be more accurately called an Adlib chip, since the SB contained it for Adlib compatibility. As well as a way of having synth sounds. The Adlib was an earlier "standard" as much as there was one back then, still most PCs didn't have sound cards at all til the early 90s.
I remember playing Doom with my SB16. Doom is 50% of the reason I bought a PC, and that's true for a lot of people. It had the same chip, I think, or a compatible one. Nowadays sound is all synthesised on your CPU, the PC's built-in sound chip is just a DAC, it can only play back samples, generated on the fly in software. Some more expensive cards have DSPs to generate those, cheap or built-in ones use the CPU.
Still nice to see some of the cool old keyboards though. I managed to find the old demo tune from my old Casio keyboard and used it for a ringtone. Wake Me Up Before You Go-Go! Used nearly every instrument the little keyboard could do, and there were like a hundred!
in yer phase out char null gen timex root no swing quiz 0 THE way stars bluey stage com pass map 8bit mug off yankee slap kuddy toy chap iff tree hang hitlaa key C black white racey car boo tup shop clised wits food eh?
It's literally the core of the sound blaster lmao
I had a PSS-470 and a PSS-780... both are now collectable. I had hours and hours of fun with those as a teenager...
07:17 just a fun fact, the synth used by Van Halen on "Jump" was the Oberheim OB-X, which was analog. Still, sounds fine if a little tinny on this Soundblaster chip.
Fun fact 2: Modern Yamaha keyboards have a voice called "Jump Brass" which imitates the sound exactly.
I remeber my dad getting our IBM PS/1 upgraded with a soundcard & a CD drive. was amazing back then.
Great video! Space Quest 3 and Ultima 6 were some of my favorite games to play as a kid, so I highly approve of the example songs. =] I have a few comments:
At 8:10, you mention all voices on the YM2413 / OPLL have to use the same instrument, but that's not actually true. It's just that you can only define one instrument. Each channel can play that instrument or one of 15 other instruments that are not definable. The other instruments are generic stuff like "Trumpet" or "Vibraphone", and on keyboards that contain a YM2413 (I believe the PSR-6 has one?), the instrument chooser doesn't have to do any real "logic" to choose an instrument. A button can just send "switch to instrument 7" or whatever. For reference, here's a track that uses a YM2413: inversephase.bandcamp.com/track/token-ringfinger
Anyone mentioning they have a different keyboard with potentially a different chip that "sounds the same" might be interested in knowing that they're probably still Yamaha keyboards with Yamaha OP-series chips, which means they're still built around FM. The underlying process with building music with FM is mostly the same regardless of the chip, which is why.
Lastly, as for "having a keyboard with a Soundblaster in it"....you know that the gameport (that 15-pin thing) can double as a MIDI port, right? So you can connect any dumb MIDI controller with no output of its own to that and "play the soundblaster" if you like. Extra bonus, if you have some outboard gear like a Roland MT-32, you can use that soundcard selection to send music data from the same port.
:wave:
So this was the beginning of 8 Bit Keys... cool. Gonna binge watch them all.
Who's here in 2019 and remarking at how EMPTY HIS WALLS ARE?!?
You beat me to it
Holy shit, didnt even notice till I read this!
the "iBook Guy" thing was odd, then boom, empty walls.
all his old videos are going to look empty now that he has that gigantic 1 million subscriber plaque. lol
Me
i love old tech and keyboards is one of them love how you record keyboards at high quality really shows how great thay still sound after all them years now you are making me want Soundblaster now :)
oh my god the soundboard looks like the soundcard I tore up last week for an art project
I had that same keyboard he introduces at 1:44. My parents probably have it in their attic somewhere. I did notice my keyboard sounded a lot like some of the computer games I had, and now I know why.
Keep it it's getting more expensive and rare
@@guts2048 Next time I talk to my mom I'll ask her if she has it somewhere. I know she's held onto a lot of my childhood stuff so I wouldn't be surprised.
@@party4keeps28 best of luck
damn i remember back in the day i had to buy a sound card for warcraft 2 to have sound.
Psuado Nym Ye. I bough a like 2000$ dollar pentium 75 mhz pc. It didnt had a soundcard NOR a cd-rom. So I had to buy that later and it was my first time installing it in my pc. I was so scared to break something haha. It took me maybe 4 hours to install a card in its isa/pci slot lol. ( now its takes me like 5 sec ofcourse)
AH good old days.
trancelistic yeah bro, I remember the first time i had to install ram, i was shook i was gonna break the desktop lol
Psuado Nym I remember doing the same to play Doom. First PC upgrade was for a 486 SX 25, 4meg to 12meg RAM as well as the Sound Blaster. Having to manually set jumpers for the port and irq, wow, times have changed.
That reminds me of a story. A friends dad had 4 Mb ram and I had 1 mb ram total. So we couldn't play doom. My friend advised to switched my ram with his dad so we could play sneaky. What a hell that was. Those fast page ram/edo ram was anoyingly stuck. Took us hours and pain in our finger nails ( on the first try haha)
+Psuado Nym "Your soundcard works PERFECTLY! It doesn't get any better than this!"
still one of my favorite videos from this channel
Keyboards that use square wave tone generators can also sound very similar to 1980s computer sound chips, such as the C64, Tandy 1000/IBM PCjr, ColecoVision, Atari ST, etc.: ua-cam.com/video/_TkYTt6AYr4/v-deo.html
Hi vwestlife
hey vwest!
hi VWestlife!
but C64 doest use square wave, it has a sort of hybrid analogic output
The C=64 had a sound of its own.
FYI VanHalen used the Oberheim OB-8 61 key keyboard
When Creative Labs were creative.
I'm not musically talented, I don't even find keyboards interesting - but for some reason i find your videos really interesting and entertaining. I think it's your presentation style that keeps me engaged. Love your other channel too - keep up the good work!
Add some guitar effects pedals and the possibilities are nearly endless
The PSS-470 was my first keyboard, got it for xmas back in '86 and still have it. Also managed to pick up a PSS-460 on the way too, pretty much the same thing.
Me too! I got my first keyboard, a PSS-460, in 1986 and still have it. Good little keyboards
the extreme closeup of your face makes me a bit uncomfortable since it is literally life sized on my 34" UltraWide screen:) Move back a bit guy!
P.S. Still glad i found your channel since i also appreciate and interested in old computer tech. Wish you had more videos though - keep up a good work!
Pesok lol
He would look like Zordon on my 144" projection screen.
he has another channel, 8-bit keys. it's all about old keyboards
he has another channel, 8-bit keys. it's all about old keyboards
Louis Move back a bit? Maybe he should move back 8 bits? :D
The PSS-460 without those hideous orange, green and violet buttons, was my first keyboard, then I upgraded to the PSS-560 with PCM drums. Got me to program serious FM sounds on my DX100 and DX11. Really inspired me to delve deep into FM!
YO if you like controlling OPL2 you should check out adlib tracker and control OPL3!
Diode Milliampere yo
I love that you feature the Ultima games....First game i ever purchased was ultima 3 and they were a highlight of my computer life growing up. Thanks for the memories.
How funny that Yamaha used Yamaha chips for its own keyboards...
as spy to sink1 bi pass hiz store 'e'[realutues]av encrypted cipher steams ling scrambled rotors keyed screamer zombie giv opz2non notty az 123 mugs fings az aloha bet geass hiss sez but byte bool2war spec abstract mal level alex unknown slang new killer vites fir homo quil meglo buikd a bill grope bark no moss buy key rye ed4 quanta chaotic outward bounds red biro ghost writes 'reasons'if yer 'read'buy 'whoke book'of suzuki art of zen motorcycles where 'all media'enigma 'reproduced mass medias'singkung synchro shit iff if any kooky look primal nonexistances az cant attempt too know mass tech directky relating exactly thy entire whole oublushed wirks an build udols too scream nit a that kill its these actir impersonate soy rig osyco cabinets act2calm you4vat farm mill you2ace1&CLAIM cooywrite,authority isnt a tune,sound,or note,hard china hym awe lazers!YAM
Boy, I didn’t realise how many memories this video would bring back. We used to have the Yamaha keyboards at my high school. If you asked nicely they’d let you take one home to practice on #happytimes
LOL @ 7:20, yeah I'm pretty sure it was an OB-8 or OB-Xa or something... :D
Yes, the OB-Xa!
OB-X on recording, OB-Xa in video
This channel is awesome! It really gets me fascinated about how that good old technology from the 80s and 90s worked. Amazing!
What video cards (even in 2015) are still emulating CGA / EGA modes for compatibility? I don't think the pixel clock goes low enough to drive those signals...
sbc,besides,mac,raspi...billions of mainframe terminal busses of supercomp data centers,stalleites round mars, trains,busses,kiosks,etc etc,puggy cell,eh...yes pixel yuh say
I still have my Yamaha PSS-470 from 1988. It was my first keyboard. So interesting to learn the tech behind it.
Hey man, i love your videos.
You should do a review of Windows 1.0
Hope you reply
You trying to get the sound right for the test gave me mad Myst IV PTSD of the first puzzle with frequency, modulation, pitch, etc.
I wonder if my Samsung Galaxy S4 emulates that Yamaha chip.
Love your music videos now and always, cool that you have a Soundblaster in a Keyboard. Honestly though I could listen to you play music all day.
Van Halen most likely used an Oberheim synth for Jump.
OB-X on the record, OB-Xa on tour, IIRC.
Ian Schmidt Rush used it, also. "Subdivisions" has that synth all over it. Queen used it, too. "I Want to Break Free" has a solo with it.
I'm very aware of Rush's usage - it's all over Moving Pictures and Signals. And most of Styx's hits were Oberheim-powered as well.
This is great information 8-Bit Guy. One day I'll track down the right keyboard with the mentioned sound blaster chip so that I have the tools to create the original sounds.
Cool video, but wouldn't it be more accurate to call them Adlib keyboards? The SoundBlaster was more than a music card.
A bit off-topic, but are you the Liberty Basic/FreeBasic guy? If you are, I've been using FreeBasic for some years, just for various small hobby projects, and i think it's great.
Hi, yeah I'm the Liberty BASIC guy (also Just BASIC and Run BASIC), but not FreeBasic. :-)
oh yes, sorry, i got my wires crossed, i DID actually mean JustBasic. I hope i didn't offend you, i certainly didn't mean to.
One of my projects was an emulator for the Texas Instruments TI Programmable 57, which progressed quite nicely until i started on the calculating engine, at which point i realised that i didn't have enough information about the inner workings of the calculator chip.
Oh well, it was fun while it lasted, and hopefully one day i'll be able to continue :)
Thanks for your reply, and greetings from Denmark.
Hi, no offense taken at all. :-) Have you had a look at Run BASIC? It's a super easy web programming system.
Yes i did take a look at it a year ago or so, but to be honest, i'm kind of an old school guy who perfers programming in the old-fashioned way ;)
Lovely video. Back in the 80's, I owned a Yamaha keyboard with a custom made flightcase. It was from the Yamaha PSS series. Also had a Casio with built-in sampler which was great fun to mess and play around with friends!
The captions are very screwed up. It says English, but it's either Spanish or French!
I love the sound of these!
Sees the empty walls.
"Holy $#!+, this is an old video!"
Checks description.
"Yep... 2015"
Oh man, hearing the SQ3 theme took me way back!
Like how you make this informative even for people who are that not much into hardware.
@ The iBookGuy The Yamaha PSS-360, PSS-370, VSS-30, VSS-100, and VSS-200 seem to be based on the Yamaha YM-3812, because they are based on similar FM synthesis.
+Cheryl Matthiesen It's possible. I can't find any information on them that definitely answers that question. I think somebody would have to attain one and disassemble it to be sure. Lots of Yamaha keyboards used FM synthesis, but not all of them used the YM-3812.
+The 8-Bit Guy Why did you rename your channel?
+SutorippuDotCom The PSS-100 is already documented as having a YM3427 synth chip.
+The 8-Bit Guy Hey, You know what's cool? You have the same glasses as me XD.
+Mitch Matthiesen read here:
www.dtech.lv/techarticles_yamaha_chips.html
Mindblown! I remember those late 80s early 90s sound blaster adlib days PSS-470 is dope
1:21 COMIC SANSSS
I can't see that font without thinking of Sans from Undertale. XD
ddd a a# g f dfg ccd a a# g f dfg bbd a a# g f dfg a#a#d a a# g f dfg
What is wrong with comic sans (if it's readable, that makes up for the ugliness).
Thank you! Got pss 570 today! Had to travel to another city to get one! These are super rare in my country.
Yamaha is the greatest music instrument maker! I have Yamaha Clavinova and Pacifica guitar. I feel obliged to tell everybody: Yamaha is the best.
k
wow that's a huge statement... I'm not so sure about that.
maybe in keyboards but for guitars. i think gibson and ibanez are the best
Oddball gamer Of course gibson, ibanez, fender etc. are the best about guitars but Yamaha is still in the bussiness.
ibanez? Not martin or something?
just in case anyone here is interested in circuit bending or modding:
The Yamaha YM chips found in these keyboards have an 8-bit parallel data bus that runs to other chips on the PCB. One really effective modification is to cut the circuit traces on the PCB and install switches to allow you turn off each line in the data bus. Or if you really want to get nuts, you can cut all 8 traces and install a socket/jack to each side of each cut trace (total of 16 jacks) and then freely scramble the 8 data lines however you want. I did this to a PSS-170 and it's wicked! It gets pretty gnarly sometimes, but often results in very playable and pleasant alien timbres.
If you're interested in trying it on your YM-chipped Yamaha keyboard, just look for the data sheet for your particular YM chip and find the pin-outs for the 8 data lines.