Thinking is a very good tool for learning and doing mechanical things. Eg: driving a car, learning to write a computer program, learning a new language etc. If we then use thinking to ask ourselves "why am I not happy", or "how can I attain enlightenment", or "how can I get rid of anger" etc, then, these are not areas where thinking can help. In fact, it complicates the whole thing. By employing thinking, we then set out on a long journey that may take years for us to realize that we really didn't solve the problem that we set out to solve. In other words, do not use thought for solving "personal" issues. Use it only for solving practical problems that actually have a solution. When you apply it to "personal" issues, thought just keeps spinning and one gets caught in it. This is what one calls suffering when the spinning becomes very fast and you can't seem to get out of it. We fall prey to our own thinking that keeps fooling us. Just because a particular thought shows up doesn't mean we need to act on it or believe it instantly. In fact, its acting (and reacting) to almost all our thoughts that's responsible for all the suffering and dissatisfaction in our life.
Why the 'personal' issues should not be handed over to the thought? This is because the 'me' itself is not different from thought. It is the whole past, memories put together. Therefore trying to solve personal issues with rumination, philosophy, brooding is like a dog trying to chase its tail and moving in circles. Clarty happens when the 'me' - an illusory entity is absent.
Putting everything on their place brings clarity. Listening, Seeing and Learning without the judgments pushed by past conditioning of memory unfolds ability to experience the whole. In the experience of the whole clarity is automatically visible.
Skill with clarity and compassion to listen, to see and to learn holistically and have each and every thing at its proper place is Clarity .. Only intelligence of clarity can bring love and peace in the life..
An extraordinarily important material. Walk with great care and as J.K. said: "The word is not the thing, the description is not the action." Approach with great caution the words in this material: "the art of listening, the art of seeing, and learning". As once thinking takes over these words it can lead us into great error.
Is it? The essence is to observe all this in oneself. The trouble is that we are conditioned to interfere with observation. And that interference comes under the form of thoughts. So to come to clarity we must observe how thoughts interfere with clarity. Talking about such thinking may appear intellectual, as it seems to be only about thoughts, and not about sensations and feelings. In the larger video which is mentioned in the comments, he goes into the process of desire, as perception, contact, sensation, thinking about it, desire for repetition and possession, image making...
I don't know why still nowdays I didn't encounter krishamurti. I don't like his sembiance but perfectly in line with his words. I appreciated his pronounce that has easy comprehention for me. Thanks.
Without clarity skills becomes destructive. Immagine two or more firms where, in one of these, an individual is more skilled of other individuals working in other firms. Because of his/her skills, the best working capacity will going to lead his/her company to be more productive compared to the other firms. In a competition world, if one firm will have more success in business, inevitably the other ones will collapse economically. Business is like a big cake, if one takes a big one slice, the other ones can only take the smallest ones.
The connection between whole and parts. If the whole is not grasped a knowledge of the parts leads to a thousand conflicts. The whole is never visible, therefore not logic, logic is simpler, the whole is not sum of parts here, it is independent of all parts. We want logic to explain truth, a truth hidden to a specific logic. The position of clarity is a position of wisdom, each object in our world has to have a clarity. A rock on earth is important, it is there to offer a meaning, it is only in the whole it has meaning. It loses meaning as an independent, it is illogical to a logical mind.
Some of the things he tells us can be found in methods of LEAN management, mainly but not only 5S, some in actual indications of quality management. All of these are typical for companies but also can be successfully used in personal private context. May be it was revolutionary at the time the video was recorded in original but basically we should have developed ourselfs a bit since that time.
In the larger video where this one is an excerpt from, mentioned in the comments, he goes into the delight and joy of the perception of beauty, and how it is different from pleasure and desire (wanting to repeat and possess). So the art of feeling would be to feel without thought interfering with feeling?
Become a zero , to become a hero. An empty glass can be filled. On a clean slate , one can write. Become an empty glass or a clean slate , when you observe, listen, read .
Yes, that part was not fully expressed at the moment he first mentioned it, but later on it is further developed. It means a different way of learning which is not accumulating information or acquiring skills, as in the psychological field, i.e. in the field of learning about oneself, this is destructive. Learning in the practical field is always with the goal of doing something with what is learned, driving a car, speaking a language, etc. Learning about oneself has no motive, has no goal, is not about improving oneself, fitting oneself for a certain way of living, etc. It is out of pure interest. And as such it must be understood together with the art of listening and seeing. Essentially it is an action in which thought is not interfering. Thought being the response of memory which finds something pleasant or unpleasant.
His words are very much ahead of his time... not only that... you have to be somewhat experienced in meditation or something like that to fully grasp his word.. otherwise it makes no sense to you and you may feel like he deceived others with words.
I really dont know whats the purpose of commenting here unnecessarily, speaker's words are enough and at the purest level, dont to say it in your own words please.
Sometimes speakers words are too sophisticated. For example - conditioned mind. The beginner might not know what it is. It helps when u find something confusing
it comes naturally indeed when there is no sense of possession or power over the other in whom one is interested. So one has to inquire into the ways thought interferes with relationship, so that compassion cannot have its natural flowering.
I usually understand most of JK says and try to listen him as much...but from this talk am not following even a word what he is trying to say... Can anyone please summarise or provide more insights?
He says that from compassion which can flower in clarity, there comes skill in action. But if we cultivate skills, we will want to deploy those skills, no matter whether they are appropriate or not (like when all you have is a hammer, everything becomes a nail, as the saying goes). We get attached to skill and need to be confirmed in it for our self-worth. And since everybody has a different sense of skill, there is chaos, conflict in society. So the question is, can we lead a full or holistic life, not being attached to skills for validation of meaning in life? So, instead of starting from skill and trying to come to clarity and compassionate action, we must start from compassion over clarity to skill in action. In this clip he comes to clarity and ends with saying that clarity by itself is not very meaningful, but necessary for compassion to flower. The full video for which the link is mentioned in the description goes into what compassion is, which comes naturally if thought does not interfere with perception and sensation, does not turn it into pleasure and desire ...
He is trying to convey that...since our minds are already conditiond by various historical facticities, if one wants to see things clearly without any baises first one must have a mind which is full of clarity,this clarity comes from 3 things..1 suspend your life at all levels..which means deattach to everything. 2 suspend your becoming position at all levels,which means no future in your journey.3 rd one once you have done above two you can Position yourself (where are you now in this cosmic live) by observing your exact position of yourself..after this now your are able to position yourself where are you and what are you in this life..
Probably a number of reasons, but one is because they bring systems, exercises which people blindly follow. Following any leader stops people thinking for themselves, they rely on the guru to do the work for them.
Because it means nothing, same as following any Western religious leader, you get hooked on what they say is the "way", what is the "True" path, rather than U finding it out for yourself... You can listen to the teachings, but ultimately they have no meaning.
He was so careful. The fact that that level of care existed, even once, is enough for me to be happy. I know there is something good in the world.
Thinking is a very good tool for learning and doing mechanical things. Eg: driving a car, learning to write a computer program, learning a new language etc.
If we then use thinking to ask ourselves "why am I not happy", or "how can I attain enlightenment", or "how can I get rid of anger" etc, then, these are not areas where thinking can help. In fact, it complicates the whole thing.
By employing thinking, we then set out on a long journey that may take years for us to realize that we really didn't solve the problem that we set out to solve. In other words, do not use thought for solving "personal" issues. Use it only for solving practical problems that actually have a solution.
When you apply it to "personal" issues, thought just keeps spinning and one gets caught in it. This is what one calls suffering when the spinning becomes very fast and you can't seem to get out of it.
We fall prey to our own thinking that keeps fooling us. Just because a particular thought shows up doesn't mean we need to act on it or believe it instantly. In fact, its acting (and reacting) to almost all our thoughts that's responsible for all the suffering and dissatisfaction in our life.
Why the 'personal' issues should not be handed over to the thought?
This is because the 'me' itself is not different from thought. It is the whole past, memories put together.
Therefore trying to solve personal issues with rumination, philosophy, brooding is like a dog trying to chase its tail and moving in circles.
Clarty happens when the 'me' - an illusory entity is absent.
Thanks for this beautiful explanation!
This is beautiful, thanks a lot i did the same
This is easy to say hard to do
Clarity is putting everything in its right place.
Listening, seeing and learning without thinking. Direct line to the whole. Empty.
Modern men thinks if he cleverly learns a skill then he can escape being in reality with his shivering legs.
Putting everything on their place brings clarity. Listening, Seeing and Learning without the judgments pushed by past conditioning of memory unfolds ability to experience the whole.
In the experience of the whole clarity is automatically visible.
Thanks
Thank you for your support
Skill with clarity and compassion to listen, to see and to learn holistically and have each and every thing at its proper place is Clarity ..
Only intelligence of clarity can bring love and peace in the life..
An extraordinarily important material. Walk with great care and as J.K. said: "The word is not the thing, the description is not the action." Approach with great caution the words in this material: "the art of listening, the art of seeing, and learning". As once thinking takes over these words it can lead us into great error.
Thank you.
Love you Krishnamurthy
I am grateful for this teaching,may l act from clarity more.
1:27 Without clarity, skill becomes destructive.
Bless you amazing human
Thank you sir 🙏🙏
Clarity is the ability of a mind to view what is within and outside of oneself
Superb J K
insightful
Clarity is clarity.
This is called pure intellectual way. For almost all expect few it is very complicated and difficult .
Is it? The essence is to observe all this in oneself. The trouble is that we are conditioned to interfere with observation. And that interference comes under the form of thoughts. So to come to clarity we must observe how thoughts interfere with clarity. Talking about such thinking may appear intellectual, as it seems to be only about thoughts, and not about sensations and feelings. In the larger video which is mentioned in the comments, he goes into the process of desire, as perception, contact, sensation, thinking about it, desire for repetition and possession, image making...
@@filip5 clarity happens only when the observer is absent.
I don't know why still nowdays I didn't encounter krishamurti. I don't like his sembiance but perfectly in line with his words. I appreciated his pronounce that has easy comprehention for me. Thanks.
Gold
Without clarity skills becomes destructive. Immagine two or more firms where, in one of these, an individual is more skilled of other individuals working in other firms. Because of his/her skills, the best working capacity will going to lead his/her company to be more productive compared to the other firms. In a competition world, if one firm will have more success in business, inevitably the other ones will collapse economically. Business is like a big cake, if one takes a big one slice, the other ones can only take the smallest ones.
The connection between whole and parts. If the whole is not grasped a knowledge of the parts leads to a thousand conflicts.
The whole is never visible, therefore not logic, logic is simpler, the whole is not sum of parts here, it is independent of all parts. We want logic to explain truth, a truth hidden to a specific logic.
The position of clarity is a position of wisdom, each object in our world has to have a clarity. A rock on earth is important, it is there to offer a meaning, it is only in the whole it has meaning. It loses meaning as an independent, it is illogical to a logical mind.
you tube must introduce love tab , just like ... to great teaching can't be just put only like tab.... infinite gratitude.
Reading books and doing after the words. without developing a center. And so, everyone is miserable.
❤️❤️
Some of the things he tells us can be found in methods of LEAN management, mainly but not only 5S, some in actual indications of quality management. All of these are typical for companies but also can be successfully used in personal private context.
May be it was revolutionary at the time the video was recorded in original but basically we should have developed ourselfs a bit since that time.
Thank you how about art of feelings?
In the larger video where this one is an excerpt from, mentioned in the comments, he goes into the delight and joy of the perception of beauty, and how it is different from pleasure and desire (wanting to repeat and possess). So the art of feeling would be to feel without thought interfering with feeling?
Feelings are thoughts too if I am not wrong? You feel sad. You feel happy. These are all temporary. Caused by external things.
Become a zero , to become a hero.
An empty glass can be filled.
On a clean slate , one can write.
Become an empty glass or a clean slate , when you observe, listen, read .
❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
Can someone help me understand what he meant by art of learning? And the link to the other video he mentioned
Yes, that part was not fully expressed at the moment he first mentioned it, but later on it is further developed. It means a different way of learning which is not accumulating information or acquiring skills, as in the psychological field, i.e. in the field of learning about oneself, this is destructive. Learning in the practical field is always with the goal of doing something with what is learned, driving a car, speaking a language, etc. Learning about oneself has no motive, has no goal, is not about improving oneself, fitting oneself for a certain way of living, etc. It is out of pure interest. And as such it must be understood together with the art of listening and seeing. Essentially it is an action in which thought is not interfering. Thought being the response of memory which finds something pleasant or unpleasant.
Can someone plz help - I am not able to decipher the ending of the last sentence, where J.K. says: Without compassion clarity ………. meaning.
Clarity in itself has very little meaning, you can open subtitles
@@mikuprincess9107
Oh yes, I should have opened subtitles 😀 Thank you for reminding!
💐
Where can we find the rest of this session
His words are very much ahead of his time... not only that... you have to be somewhat experienced in meditation or something like that to fully grasp his word.. otherwise it makes no sense to you and you may feel like he deceived others with words.
🙏🙏🙏
I really dont know whats the purpose of commenting here unnecessarily, speaker's words are enough and at the purest level, dont to say it in your own words please.
Sometimes speakers words are too sophisticated. For example - conditioned mind. The beginner might not know what it is. It helps when u find something confusing
🧚🏻♂️🌌🦅🤗
So, how the compassion come into the oneself.??
its natural, u just feel it. when u feel happy doing something, that leads to compassion for it.
it comes naturally indeed when there is no sense of possession or power over the other in whom one is interested. So one has to inquire into the ways thought interferes with relationship, so that compassion cannot have its natural flowering.
🙏❤️🌏🕊🎵🎶🌿
If you want a clear mind, get rid of all the crap…✨
I usually understand most of JK says and try to listen him as much...but from this talk am not following even a word what he is trying to say...
Can anyone please summarise or provide more insights?
He says that from compassion which can flower in clarity, there comes skill in action. But if we cultivate skills, we will want to deploy those skills, no matter whether they are appropriate or not (like when all you have is a hammer, everything becomes a nail, as the saying goes). We get attached to skill and need to be confirmed in it for our self-worth. And since everybody has a different sense of skill, there is chaos, conflict in society. So the question is, can we lead a full or holistic life, not being attached to skills for validation of meaning in life? So, instead of starting from skill and trying to come to clarity and compassionate action, we must start from compassion over clarity to skill in action. In this clip he comes to clarity and ends with saying that clarity by itself is not very meaningful, but necessary for compassion to flower. The full video for which the link is mentioned in the description goes into what compassion is, which comes naturally if thought does not interfere with perception and sensation, does not turn it into pleasure and desire ...
He is trying to convey that...since our minds are already conditiond by various historical facticities, if one wants to see things clearly without any baises first one must have a mind which is full of clarity,this clarity comes from 3 things..1 suspend your life at all levels..which means deattach to everything. 2 suspend your becoming position at all levels,which means no future in your journey.3 rd one once you have done above two you can Position yourself (where are you now in this cosmic live) by observing your exact position of yourself..after this now your are able to position yourself where are you and what are you in this life..
Results of forms. Many. Specific. Clarity from intelligence not intelect.
From my nassance I don't like skills. Every social environement demand.
Why does he says "unfortunately" what the yogis all the gurus are bringing to Europe?
Probably a number of reasons, but one is because they bring systems, exercises which people blindly follow. Following any leader stops people thinking for themselves, they rely on the guru to do the work for them.
Because it means nothing, same as following any Western religious leader, you get hooked on what they say is the "way", what is the "True" path, rather than U finding it out for yourself... You can listen to the teachings, but ultimately they have no meaning.
@@chetom700 their meaning may be an invitation to inquire.
❤️