So, Those "Mystery" Speakers... And Can They Beat The Encores?!
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- Опубліковано 18 лис 2023
- So, Those "Mystery" Speakers... And Can They Beat The Encores?!
In this intriguing comparison video, we delve into the world of speakers as we question whether the beloved Encores can hold their ground against a mystery contender. Having established the Encores as our go-to reference for bookshelf speakers, we explore their exceptional transparency and image projection, highlighting their ability to compete with and often surpass speakers across various price points. Enter the LGK 2.4, a small footprint tower speaker with a unique design featuring wideband drivers and aluminum cone woofers. We meticulously compare the two, from treble to midrange and bass, uncovering nuances that audiophiles will appreciate. As the battle unfolds, We provide detailed insights into each speaker's strengths and characteristics, offering a comprehensive analysis that goes beyond mere technical specifications. Tune in to discover whether the Mystery LGK 2.4 can dethrone the Encores and become the new reference in my audiophile journey. The stage is set, the speakers unveiled, and the sonic showdown awaits audiophiles eager to discern the subtle differences that make each speaker a unique contender in the world of high-fidelity audio.
gr-research.com/
2.4 kit: gr-research.com/product/lgk-2...
2.4 Complete: gr-research.com/product/lgk2-...
Encore Kit: gr-research.com/product/x-ls-...
Encore Complete: gr-research.com/product/xls-e...
Cables: gr-research.com/cables/
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I just finished my Encore's a week ago. And they sound so good that they just make you want to listen to music.
Thanks Ron. You are very good at reviews and comparisons and I enjoy the clips. I'll share a story for anyone interested. I told a buddy to build a set of CSS 1TDX. He did and brought them over so we could A-B them on my old system (Sansui AU9500 and PSB P500s). At first, we both had trouble distinguishing sound volume from the differences in the speakers. After 30 min or so of listening, we both agreed the CSS 1TDX were better. He took his speakers home and we both continued to enjoy music from our own systems. My point, if I have one, is that the difference is really pretty small even with this mismatch and it doesn't affect my enjoyment of music. Just a personal opinion.
Nice review. It's good to see a review on some of GRR's other stuff. I would like to see more reviews on other DIY stereo items in fact, so Ron, keep them coming. Thanks. BTY are you ever going to review the "Nx-Streams" and/or other DIY items like subwoofers, Amps and DACs?.
The issue with paper cone is that it doesnt last in humid climates, youll need a new one every years or so. Found Magnepans last even in this environments. Had kevlar cones ie B&W and they do last but the sound is not the same. Heard carbon fiber based speakers and they sound as good as paper cones maybe better but the pricce is on the high end. Nice review, something not sounding natural is a deal breaker for many.
Im glad you told me to get these ! I love them !
Another fantastic review! Thanks for sharing. I bought the LGK 2.0 kit as soon as it hit. Was looking for a tiny speaker for the bedroom and really respect everything Danny says/teaches in his vids. With that being said I just finished them 8 days ago. I waited so long to build them because I was happy enough with my previous speakers, scared to build them and Amir’s radical review which I didn’t believe.
Holy Cow! Are they good! Pretty unbelievable for how small, light and unassuming the woofer is. It gets louder than my room needs and sounds great. I did do a Sonic Cap upgrade and also swapped out all the resistors w/ 12w Mills(only thing Parts Express had and honestly I have no idea if this was a good thing or bad? I didn’t A-B them). My bedroom isn’t treated and I have yet to dial in my giant sub so I’m not getting it’s full effect. My HT room is treated and I run PSB Synchrony Ones, Kef LS50 for surrounds and a SB Ultra16 sub along with Pioneer Elite running Dirac Live and powered by a Rotel amp. I hate to say it but these little speakers have more finesse and accuracy. My only real gripe about the LGK is how sensitive they are to my head placement. Not sure if this is because of my untreated room or it’s ability to be so clear? Anyways, sorry for the ramble. I can’t help imagine how good a small room HT would sound with all LGK 2.0 or better yet, mixed with LGK 2.4’s.
I have spent hundreds on drivers for DIY purposes. I can tell you the M165 just sounds fantastic. And the little LGK is no slouch in the midrange and treble regions. Plenty of sparkle.
I chose the X-SLS Encore's (in kit form) for 2 main reasons: 1) wider dispersion and 2) greater dynamic range, with slightly higher efficiency as a bonus. Bass fans will still need a sub with either SLS's or LGK 2.4's but the X-SLS's 45 Hz port tuning goes low enough for me.
When you get the opportunity I would certainly enjoy a tutorial on all that encompassed proper Room Treatment in the Sound Shed. Keep up the Great Work!
5 part video series is being produced. I got your back.
Thank you , I know that I certainly feel knowledge deficient in this area despite years of Audiophile aspirations! @@Newrecordday2013
I would describe my Purifi-6R by Troels Gravesen the same way. Their clarity, transparency and soundstaging soundly beats the $10000 and above speakers that I've heard. The benefit of DIY kits is that you cut out the middlemen, the distributors, suppliers and dealers, all of whom the big speaker manufacturers have to bake into the total price. So a mass-produced/distributed speaker that costs $2000 to the consumer costs much less than that to the manufacturer. Anything from 2x-10x less. This means that with a bit of elbow grease, a $2000 DIY speaker kit with a well designed crossover and high quality crossover components, can compete with some $20000 speakers.
Have the Viawave tweeters, but haven’t pulled the trigger on the rest of the 6r kit. Did you fabricate your own cabinet or use a woodworker?
@@cornstalk9367 I commissioned my cabinets to a woodworker. If you go that route, make sure to have the drivers beforehand so that you can make stencils for them. There can be millimetre variance to spec with the driver diameters.
For under a grand I designed and built my own speakers that sound like nothing I have heard and I have had some $10000 and my diy just blows my mind
Great review Ron! But I am getting the speakers mixed up while you are talking about them. An arrow or some kind of visual indicator pointing at the speaker in question while you are talking might have been helpful. Encores, LGK and 2.5s are which speakers again? lol
Great feedback - I can see why that was confusing
Very interesting, I want to get a pair of gr research speakers one day soon, as I appreciate all the knowledge he’s given me. It will be one of these two. I don’t have more than 2 feet from my rear wall though, so I’m thinking lgk 2.4 is my way to go, as good as the encores are
May be an apples v oranges question, but how do these compare vs the Caladan open baffles? And vs GR bully speakers? Which would work best for complex music like dense orchestras and rock and roll? For medium to large rooms?
Waiting for GR new center speaker coming to complete my LCR
Awesome
Is the sonicap upgrade worth it on the encores? Do the encores sound much better than the emotiva Xb2 ?
Hi Ron. What is the title and artist playing that drum intro at the 2:02 min mark? It sounds wide open! Thanks for another excellent review.
I have been using my Encore since 2018,one of the best big bookshelves speakers I hear ,sound good near field or 6 ft away.I love that is easy to drive,i only use Harmon Kardon A500 tube integrate amp to drive mine.which is plenty of power.
Fantastic video, love tuning in when Danny’s products are on stage!
Very nice to hear the truth about diy speakers that is affordable to all budget conscious audiophile listeners..thanks Ron for your valueble comments
Hi Ron. I have the X-voice center channel speaker and encores for my side surround and rear surround, with a svs pro 2000 sub for my home theater. I use for movies only. My two channel is with the m-3 sapphires. My question is trying to decide for the left and right front speakers for my home theater. encores or the 2.4 . I don't have room for the brutes. Should I mix or match---that is the question. Love your reviews, Ted
Hey Ted, in this example, I would stick with encores for a cohesive sound.
Any of our X Series models all match really well.
I am currently looking to upgrade my bookshelves and have been comparing the Encores and the Zu Audio DWX's, both of which have upgrade paths. I assume that the Encore's you are testing here have the capacitor upgrade and you have heard the stock speakers as well? I am wondering if I should save a bit more and do the upgrade ... and, really, I also wonder if my somewhat older ears will even notice the difference anyway. :D
Yes - mine have all the cap upgrades.
Danny rocks!!
I find the comment (below?) about finding GR Research UA-cam videos depressing, unfortunately tragic. The hobby/pursuit and community isn’t and should not be about “there can be only one, to rule them all”, it’s about the journey and discovery and yes sometimes even “love lost” but it’s certainly also a choice.
I determined sometime into my own journey, it’s MUCH more enjoyable for ME to embrace and welcome differing opinions, preferences and experiences, since doing so I have had SOOO much more fun, learned so much more and have been just all around happier than trying to figure out the one, singular “best” of anything.
Just one fool’s experience so far. 😬🤷♂️
I appreciate that perspective!
I been designing my own speakers and I have been very happy with all of them. But one pair is exceptional with everything. I set out to design a speaker that hit all the boxes for me. I took my time designing them, and the cabinets are multiple layers and I just put so much love into them. I used all good crossover components, wires , silver solder everything. But in the end I spent under $1000 and they are the best speakers I have ever had or even heard tbh
I'm not saying that because I designed them because I have designed other really nice speakers that still sound amazing but these are special. I could never afford to buy anything like that if I didn't build them myself
I would love to see a head to head betweenh the Encores and the CSS 1TDX with upgraded crossovers.
They're close, the Citrons will be richer and dig lower, the Encores will be more transparent and and stage better.
Jay did a comparison of those two speakers. I talk about that comparison in this follow up and include some video footage from Jay's video. ua-cam.com/video/TH05KQGLLEQ/v-deo.htmlsi=_Rwk2Ig1ugTsEKQH
Was it Jay that did the a/b demo on those two?
Same conclusion I believe.
@13:00 wow!
Check out the room's dominant influence below the transition;
Around 300hz on down, over a dozen points of commonality in FR behavior ... essentially matching if not for overall level.
Dramatic example of how the room owns the response below the transition.
It also illuminates Ron's tight control of consistent methodology wrt placement and capture.
The room matters the most my friend!
I've seen few examples as well illustrated as this.
~15 coincidental points over ~3 octaves!
Two independent, entirely different LF sections;
- one vented, one sealed
- single driver vs 4 drivers
- paper vs aluminum
... still, ... machts nichts
Schroeder laughs
Great storytelling.
Glad you enjoyed it!
The only potential issue I could see with the 2.4s, is the proximity to the front wall. Having that rear-facing driver, is going to require you to do something with the front wall... If not pull them way out into the room. Which means, they are not going to be ideal for small rooms I don't think.
Thanks for the review as usual.
That’s been my experience Mike! While I had good luck within a foot from the wall, I just didn’t love them so close.
Hey Mike, Actually, these were specifically designed for small rooms. Since the rear firing driver is only adding top octave information they can be placed within about a foot of the front wall without issues and they will give a sense of space and depth not otherwise not possible with traditional speakers. However, some diffusion on the front wall will help make them more transparent.
Ah, which is the one reason I'll probably never get to have the Caladan speakers (or Magnepan). My living room is 13' x 25' with 8' ceilings, but of the 25' only about 20' is useable due to space left more or less as a hallway to the door. I can't be bringing speakers 6' out into the room. Rats.
@@rosswarren436 So long as you can bring them 3' or more out into the room then you're fine. Treating the front wall also really helps.
I'm new to audio and own a pair of Dali Rubicon 2 which hit all the bits I wanted in the demo. Any idea how they compare?
For the last couple of years I’ve been running X-SLS, you know, the tower version of the X-LS. With better gear they are ridiculously good performers for the money. I recommend the bigger box.
Another step up would be a pair of X-CS on stands. That second woofer brings the men back into the room. Put them in towers and you get the X-MTM and even more barbells get thrown around.
Finally, there’s the king of the X-Series, X-Statiks. It’s hard to describe the air and soundstaging these put out. They’re like a 2-channel home theater. With a sealed woofer cabinet you don’t get the lowest bass but it rolls off smoothly and in the right size room you may not even need a sub.
Spoiler alert, I’ve been a fan of Danny’s work for 16 years.
If I’m not mistaken, you can hit the 40s in that larger box! Very cool.
@@Newrecordday2013read it again.
Got it! Thanks!
In a recent video Danny said that steel nuts on loudspeaker binding posts and solder tags are poor even if they are gold plated. Well maybe. However, I have used strong neodymium magnets to test the electronic components in many Hi Fi power amplifiers. I found all the resistors and capacitors had tin plated steel wire leads. I found the large smoothing capacitors in the power supplies had tin plated steel solder tags. Now here is the big issue, I found all the TO3 power output transistors had steel cases. Food for thought I think.
100% agree! No wire, no lugs nuts or binding post will overcome the short comings of transister legs or IC chips.
Seems the 2.4’s are ideal for small spaces, even adding a sub. I almost got a pair (dammit). But found a deal on some sealed Spendors. That I now really love. But man…
Not going to argue given I grasp Danny Aesthetics. However, whats that Tower over shoulder? Ok, I thought I recognized that speaker. Doesn't Danny make a smalker version of this unit?
G.R. Research is great, but while they post the sensitivity of the speakers, they never specify a power range suitable for them (or maybe I have missed it on their website). What power ranges of amps are recommended for the Encores or the LGK2.4?
I’ve driven the X-series speakers with as little as 18watts and as much as 200 watts. They all worked but lower power has its limits and they shine with more power. I would recommend 30-200 watts depending on which speaker, how loud you like to listen, size of your room, quality of your amps.
@@Corndog642thank you! Using an appropriate amp to get all we can from any speaker is important to know - while not risking frying the drivers or the crossovers.
@grizzly6699 Hey Grizzly, while I appreciate the sentiment this review comparison isn’t about the XVoce center channel speaker. Thanks!
Imagine now my NX-Treme sound lol
For most people, there are going to be 2 deciding factors. Placement: the Encores will likely have greater placement flexibility. The LGK with the rear firing tweeter will probably need to be further away from the front wall. Bass: the LGK’s need for a sub with most music is a big deal. This is not what you would expect with most tower speakers. Add to that the better integration with a sub offered with the Encores and I know my clear winner.
This LGK model needs to be at least 1 foot from the front wall. A non flat surfaced front wall will also really help.
cant wait for Brute or Bully review. this year i hope?
Yup
It’s funny, I just finished a x-cs center channel the same color as your x-ls
Have you listened to any of the GR open baffle offerings?
Have you checked out the NX studio?
I own a pair, and the NX-Studio requires a Subwoofer.
thanks for the information. Do like them with the subwoofer added?@@joenovak6393
I would consider GR research stuff if he built with SEAS , Scanspeak or SB Acoustics drivers.
There aren’t any real reviews on Danny’s drivers.
Why would I use lesser quality drivers?
@@dannyrichie9743 I’m your age. Do you really want me to answer that? I don’t mean any offense.
I’m just being real.
Peace ☮️
@@Nightjar726 I have done design work with all of those companies best drivers. I have even worked with some of them to develop custom drivers. Our drivers give up nothing to any of theirs and have many advantages over them too. Models like our NQ's exceed the performance of the best of all of them.
I recently used the top SB drivers in some designs for Tyler Acoustics:
ua-cam.com/video/ojxu3QY8o9s/v-deo.htmlsi=thPaZg2adLzXvmaD
And: ua-cam.com/video/YckmpzQX37U/v-deo.htmlsi=Oq0mnNKbSAkVCaP2
Damn, I saw Encore and thought Salk Sound Song 3 Encores. My bad.
So.. I originally guessed that you were comparing to an open baffle, mystery speakers turns out to be a multi-pole that does the same type of thing engaging more room reflections and reverb... It's a neat trick, but is going to vary in likability dramatically depending on the room and listener preference. Make sure to point out that your preference for a bit of reverb from room reflections could also be added with DSP, and won't work the same in every room (some rooms will just sound terrible with such a speaker, especially with more practical placements).
Actually, the LGK model is very room friendly, and designed for smaller sized rooms that are not loaded with room treatment.
@@dannyrichie9743 I would say it is designed for smaller rooms in terms of the low frequency response, which would roll off the inverse of room gain very nicely in smaller spaces. Having a speaker pointed rearward could be facing a bare wall, a window, a curtain, sound absorbing panel.... There's a lot of variability there including distance from wall that will make that particular "trick" sound a lot different in different spaces. It's not always going to be a good or useful trick. All I'm asking is for everyone to be honest about what's going on here. Speakers that play to the rear will produce different effects in different spaces, and the effect can be replicated on any clean playing "single-pole" speaker that acts as a point source relative to the listening position using DSP.
@@mdocod What you are saying would be true if the rear facing driver played down very low. However, it doesn't. It is only adding that top octave air and spatial cues back to the mix. Those top octave ranges are pretty fragile and are easily broken up and softened by everything. The effect can NOT be replicated with DSP control.
@@dannyrichie9743 "The Effect" - That's all we need to know here folks... ;)
@@dannyrichie9743Does the rear speaker turn on for the chorus and turn off for the Verse? I don't meant to be difficult here but what this channel is doing, is trying to find a way to characterize multi-pole and open baffle speakers as "lifting vails" without actually saying the 1990s audiophile magazine words. If the speakers are adding more reverb and room interactions and echo and space and air than the original recording, then you're all just getting hard over "more cool effect" but somehow rationalizing it as something that isn't a coloration of the original recording by churching it up with a lot of old audiophile marketing wankery. Just ask the recording studio to punch up the reverb a little more for the chorus and then we can all enjoy the same effect, and then those multi-pole and open baffles will sound like there's too much of it.
Is the sonicap upgrade worth it ?
Absolutely
@@Newrecordday2013Okay, that's all I needed to hear :)
Wanna see a review of brutes or bullies
I can do that
Bully - Kit Hardware: $2,675.00 with Subwoofer jumper, Flatpack: $900 Unfinished or $2100 Finished (Maple, Oak, etc), No Rez: 2 at $118 for a Total of: $3693 Unfinished cabinet, $4893 Finished cabinet.
What about the Encore 2 feet into the room. Most people can't put the speaker 9' into the room. That where I want to know which one is better.
Hi Ron. I have learned so much from you in a really cool way. So thanks for that. 😀 GRR speakers could be the end-game stand-mount speaker I'm looking for, and the Encores are a good contender. BUT, would it be worth going the extra mile for the NX-Studios with the open baffle tweeter? Does your video with the NX-Oticas give a good representation of what it's little brother would sound like? Using subwoofers with both stand-mounts, it would be interesting to hear a sound clip comparison.
The Studios are great but you must use a subwoofer to match the bandwidth of the encores.
I had both at the same time and sold the NX studios,my crossovers in xls are the same as the ones on Jay's iyagi samples
@@stevieg2755 I'm planning on using subs with either one I choose. Was the it the limitation on bottom end of the NX-Studios that made you sell them? It's just that the open baffle tweeter has got me salivating with it's holographic deliciousness. What was your impression of it?
@@roynusser5246 after trying berrilium, aluminum,planar etc,I don't care for the metallics versus a silk dome ,that's just me and a friend who builds xovers professionally
@@stevieg2755 Thanks, I'll take that into consideration when it's time for me to choose.
I prefer CSS Audio kits for DIY.
Good to hear, which kits did you buy and compare?
@@Newrecordday2013 I can't afford to buy everything and build all the kits I wanted to try out. I relied on data and A/B test that's on youtube to come to my conclusion, currently I'm running the 1TDX for mains and the Torii's for desktop. I'm 100% satisfied with my decision.
Something else about the 2.4s is that they have bass drivers in 16ohm configuration. So even though they are more efficient, that bass is probably a bit more restricted just due to resistance.
Really good review and comparison, thanks!
Gr research brute speaker review please.
encores or nx studio?
I actually prefer the encores. Both are very good!
Oh boy, I had both.
Nx-studio on another level!
@@Knhifi I had both and sold NX they were fatiguing
hmm, according to danny the NX-STUDIO"S are a notch above the encores but to each his own i guess! thanks alot ron!!@@Newrecordday2013
@frankvanhelvert6231 no problem! They are very nice but I prefer the encores for a few reasons.
Sorry Ron, you did not mail it. You opened good, but after 'compa' you failed totally.
Hahah! I’m the worst.
I can't watch gr research. Too depressing. Everything is crap according to him and always has a brilliant kit to sell
I liked watching him more when he had a mullet.
The thing that bothers me, is he essentially has made a business off of criticising all companies near enough other than his own to make money, at this point even if he thought something was ‘good’ would he say it? But then he wouldn’t sell as many products….
Just a fact check: Danny doesn’t criticize “all” companies. Sure, he rinses and repeats about the same issues he sees in budget gear but he also adds the disclaimer “they are built to a price point”. I have no issue with this and believe people should have the right to upgrade or make improvements to speakers they aren’t happy with it they want. Of course he makes money doing it - GR is not a charity.
What do you expect? People send him problem speakers to fix. If he was sent speakers that were designed correctly from the get go, his channel would be completely different.
@@Brett1334Klipsch fan?
No offense man, but you’ve become an ad for Danny. I’d like to see less of this in the future.
The last review I did for any of GR’s products was a year ago. How long do you think I should wait before reviewing anything else of Danny’s?
Let me look over the last year’s worth of your videos and see how many have to do with Danny and then I will respond
Ok, sounds good man.
I see 3 GR videos and 4 Clayton videos.
I haven’t looked you up for a while, but apparently you have cut your Danny diet down.
Honestly, I quit watching because I felt you were promoting your friends too much and I wasn’t seeing enough other products being reviewed.
Maybe I’ll watch again…but I really don’t like the Danny stuff.
Ok. I have a lot of subscribers who do like updates on GR products. I strive to be as fair as possible when organizing reviews.