A lot to digest here. I will need to re-read this from time to time when I reach a relevant passage in my MS. I have looked at dozens, maybe over 200, writing advice videos on UA-cam. Most of them regurgitate the same old stuff, but I have not seen this topic discussed before. I would welcome any further videos you create delving deeper into this topic. Visual, rather than spoken examples, are always helpful, much as I appreciate your manly baritone.
For a second I thought you said "and chekhov all of my other writing advice related videos" at the end and I thought that your jokes were hitting a whole new level of complexity. Great video, hi cat!
Sad that UA-cam unsubscribed me from your channel. I’m more than thankful that I didn’t lose you. Thank you for all you do! This video was a great help.
'Well-formatted hate mail" 🤣 "structural integrity of a wood beam" - see, you really do want to have a woodworking channel. I lean to free indirect... but I'm not consistent. And I have a hard time keeping the tense of the thoughts correct. My critique partner generally insists that present tense is wrong (my narrative overall is third person past tense) but especially when going Direct, it feels like it must be present tense. Sometimes I think it would be *so much easier* to just write "cinematically," only writing what a camera in the room would see and hear… However, I overall agree with the agents on the podcast "The Shit No One Tells You," who heavily emphasize the necessity for fiction to have lots of "interiority" as that is the primary distinction of a novel, the advantage it has over movies and television and other forms of fiction. I think I overdo the character thoughts. But I was surprised to hear you hardly do any! I can't imagine writing that way.
I think your videos are helpful for writers and I think your urual ending humor helps solidify your topic in our heads. However, this time was hard to pay attention throughout and could have benefitted from much more on screen printing, perhaps directly comparing the three types of character thinking. That's what I think.
This was really helpful. Now, I know it is called free indirect speech what I'm trying to achieve. What I'm struggling with is, as you also mentioned, to write non-concious actions and movements in first person. In other words to make the scenes more dynamic. Especially, since my POV character is the [unreliable] narrator, so my whole book is basically a dialoge. Either internal or external, often both at the same time [I play a lot with "what is said vs what is thought"]. Even the descriptions are written in free indirect speech in a reactive way, but the actions, damn.... It is really tricky to achive the effect in this way and I don't want to just write "I picked my nose" or whatever, it sounds so out of the place to me. I couldn't really get a good grasp on it, yet It would be nice, if you could dive deeper in this topic as well...
Just like every writing tool/technique, you just need to find a way that works for yourself. That's why reading is so important if you want to write, we can learn a lot from people who did it before us.
Great topic, but I'm too medicated right now to process all that direct speech etc. stuff that i might have learned once, and promptly forgot (English and writing classes were decades ago). Bookmarked and will revisit.
I always struggle with a character's internal direct thoughts because I don't have an internal monologue myself. I didn't know people thought in words, much less full sentences; I thought it was something books did as a creative choice but didn't understand where it came from. I'm never quite sure what sounds natural so I tend to avoid it when I can.
Would you expand on character thoughts with an unreliable narrator? That strikes me as a particularly tricky situation. For example, imagine a strongly-voiced unreliable narrator who wants to incriminate the protagonist. Writing in, say, a close third person perspective, how should you best convey the character's thoughts filtered through the unreliable narrator versus the narrator's own thoughts? I've been considering using unitalicized free direct speech for the protagonist and italicized free direct speech for the narrator.
I can't think of how the unreliable narrator trope could work in third-person. No matter how strong the third-person narrator's voice, they are still not "a character", per se, just a disembodied commentator, and need to remain truthful. Doing otherwise is essentially cheating the reader. First person is different because they are a character in the narrative and therefore have their own point of view, flaws and motives.
My wife would strongly disagree with you :D I mean, she was like, dear, there is too much description, you should cut out some [note: we are talking about 3 lines at most, here].
A lot to digest here. I will need to re-read this from time to time when I reach a relevant passage in my MS. I have looked at dozens, maybe over 200, writing advice videos on UA-cam. Most of them regurgitate the same old stuff, but I have not seen this topic discussed before. I would welcome any further videos you create delving deeper into this topic. Visual, rather than spoken examples, are always helpful, much as I appreciate your manly baritone.
I think you should do that deeper dive on thoughts.
Its definitely on the list
For a second I thought you said "and chekhov all of my other writing advice related videos" at the end and I thought that your jokes were hitting a whole new level of complexity.
Great video, hi cat!
Sad that UA-cam unsubscribed me from your channel. I’m more than thankful that I didn’t lose you.
Thank you for all you do! This video was a great help.
Thanks, I'm glad it was helpful
Nah man, I was thinking about writing explosions. But I'll subscribe.
'Well-formatted hate mail" 🤣
"structural integrity of a wood beam" - see, you really do want to have a woodworking channel.
I lean to free indirect... but I'm not consistent. And I have a hard time keeping the tense of the thoughts correct. My critique partner generally insists that present tense is wrong (my narrative overall is third person past tense) but especially when going Direct, it feels like it must be present tense.
Sometimes I think it would be *so much easier* to just write "cinematically," only writing what a camera in the room would see and hear…
However, I overall agree with the agents on the podcast "The Shit No One Tells You," who heavily emphasize the necessity for fiction to have lots of "interiority" as that is the primary distinction of a novel, the advantage it has over movies and television and other forms of fiction.
I think I overdo the character thoughts. But I was surprised to hear you hardly do any! I can't imagine writing that way.
I think your videos are helpful for writers and I think your urual ending humor helps solidify your topic in our heads.
However, this time was hard to pay attention throughout and could have benefitted from much more on screen printing,
perhaps directly comparing the three types of character thinking. That's what I think.
Golly-gee, gosh darn it, this is my fifth video of yours that I've watched. I guess I'll subscribe.
good topic
I am writing a novelette currently and thought about characters’ thoughts and how to convey them just a couple of days ago. Great timing for me.
This was really helpful. Now, I know it is called free indirect speech what I'm trying to achieve.
What I'm struggling with is, as you also mentioned, to write non-concious actions and movements in first person. In other words to make the scenes more dynamic. Especially, since my POV character is the [unreliable] narrator, so my whole book is basically a dialoge. Either internal or external, often both at the same time [I play a lot with "what is said vs what is thought"]. Even the descriptions are written in free indirect speech in a reactive way, but the actions, damn.... It is really tricky to achive the effect in this way and I don't want to just write "I picked my nose" or whatever, it sounds so out of the place to me. I couldn't really get a good grasp on it, yet
It would be nice, if you could dive deeper in this topic as well...
*Jeepers, this is good,* I thought as I tapped my android's screen to tell him so.
What is that SNL skit called again, the one with Christopher Walken? More Cat Butt!
Well, crap! Now that's all I'll hear when I see that again. Way to go, momo!!
carl: i know for a fact that you say gee whiz to yourself in your head all the time
me: caught in 4k
Just like every writing tool/technique, you just need to find a way that works for yourself. That's why reading is so important if you want to write, we can learn a lot from people who did it before us.
Great topic, but I'm too medicated right now to process all that direct speech etc. stuff that i might have learned once, and promptly forgot (English and writing classes were decades ago). Bookmarked and will revisit.
I always struggle with a character's internal direct thoughts because I don't have an internal monologue myself. I didn't know people thought in words, much less full sentences; I thought it was something books did as a creative choice but didn't understand where it came from. I'm never quite sure what sounds natural so I tend to avoid it when I can.
I use the narrator stating my MC's thoughts too often. More than my MC's direct thoughts. It's part of my writing style I guess
Oh golly. I'm not subscribed to Carl's channel yet. Gee whiz. I better do that right now
Would you expand on character thoughts with an unreliable narrator? That strikes me as a particularly tricky situation. For example, imagine a strongly-voiced unreliable narrator who wants to incriminate the protagonist. Writing in, say, a close third person perspective, how should you best convey the character's thoughts filtered through the unreliable narrator versus the narrator's own thoughts? I've been considering using unitalicized free direct speech for the protagonist and italicized free direct speech for the narrator.
I can't think of how the unreliable narrator trope could work in third-person. No matter how strong the third-person narrator's voice, they are still not "a character", per se, just a disembodied commentator, and need to remain truthful. Doing otherwise is essentially cheating the reader. First person is different because they are a character in the narrative and therefore have their own point of view, flaws and motives.
Oh golly. I just realized I wasn't subscribed. All fixed
character thoughts are usually just boring. should be limited. action, dialogue, description is more important
My wife would strongly disagree with you :D I mean, she was like, dear, there is too much description, you should cut out some [note: we are talking about 3 lines at most, here].
Explosives
Still confused about First Person